Re: [bolger] Re: pirogue
If you want to fly, check Beth, Kamakazi canoe yawl, which Tim Fatchen is marketing for the designer,
on his schooner/square boat pages. Clyde
GHC wrote:
on his schooner/square boat pages. Clyde
GHC wrote:
> While I didn't like sailing my Bolger Pirogue, it's a neat enough design in
> other respects and easy to build.
>
> I suppose sailing canoes are all quite tender; there's really no where to
> hike out. In any kind of breeze, it just didn't work for me. Other people
> really like the pirogue, though, so I would guess they either enjoy the
> challenge or sail in lighter breezes than we get. I would have a hard time
> imagining the pirogue sailing with a Sunfish, but then you can't really
> paddle the latter, either. Of course, everything's a compromise.
>
> I don't know if anyone noted, but Bolger's pirogue was published in
> "Messing About..." a few years ago.
>
> Gregg Carlson
>
> At 08:31 AM 5/6/2001 -0400, you wrote:
> >Dave: Since I have considered building the 16' pirogue as a cartopper
> >sailboat to sail singlehanded, your comments were very informational.
> >However, two things still concern me. First, when you say it sails well,
> >how would you compare it to the sailing speed of a Sunfish or similar
> >sailboat. Also, like yourself, I would like the hull weight to stay under
> >70 lbs. Any future comments in this regard are welcome. Concerning your
> >sail problem downwind, last weekend I had the opportunity to sail in a
> >decked sailing canoe with a 44 sq ft ACA lateen sail. With the lateen rig we
> >had no problem downwind. Also, since it seemed to stay pretty close to a
> >sunfish that was sailing on the same tack from time to time, I think I would
> >consider that rig if I built the pirogue. Thanks again for your comments.
> >Ray
> >
> >
> >>From: "david galvin" <porcupine@...>
> >>Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> >>To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> >>Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >>Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 06:00:50 -0000
> >>
> >>Buried somewhere in the depths of Duckworks Magazine is a little
> >>article I did on my 16' Pirogue. Mine is bright finished luan
> >>(meranti) 1/4" plywood, with a daggerboard slot and a few other minor
> >>changes. If I were to build it again (and I might) I would try to make
> >>it as lightweight as possible. As built it weighs more than 90 lbs., a
> >>trifle too heavy for me to lift onto roof racks by myself. Also,
> >>sailing in rocky Catskill and Adirondack lakes with a daggerboard
> >>sticking two feet underwater makes me nervous, so I would fashion a
> >>removable pivoting leeboard.
> >>
> >>It sails very well, except downwind, where the boomless sprit rig
> >>insists on jibing unpredictably. I understand that this is is a common
> >>fault of the rig no matter what boat it is on. I made my sail from a
> >>Sailrite kit in one evening. The spars fit inside the boat for
> >>paddling or rowing. I find the oarlock outriggers function well as
> >>designed, but perhaps I lucky when I built them. The boat tracks dead
> >>straight when paddled or rowed, and turns majestically. Don't expect
> >>quick kayak-like handling unless you leave off the skeg and the keel
> >>shoe (which I suspect is structural). There's room in the cockpit for
> >>one person to sleep, two or three to paddle. My boat has about 2/3's
> >>of the specified flotation and floats fully swamped with 6" of
> >>freeboard. Thanks to the side decks it is very difficult to swamp the
> >>boat anyway, except deliberately.
> >>
> >>The Pirogue uses four sheets of plywood and about 30 board feet of
> >>lumber. The prototype was reportedly built in sixteen hours by a
> >>professional, but mine took a month of part-time work. I included a
> >>lot of details to conceal plywood edges and such, but as drawn, the
> >>construction is skiff simple. The only real challenge, if you can call
> >>it that, is the deck, which can be a little fussy to fit. The steering
> >>system works fine as designed. I didn't like the fixed leeboard, and
> >>didn't build it.
> >>
> >>I am plotting to rebuilt this design out of occume plywood, perhaps
> >>4mm, with cedar framing and sealed flotation chambers in lieu of foam.
> >>That should get its weight down to a reasonable sixtyish pounds, but
> >>may weaken it unacceptably. Perhaps I'll ask Bolger for his thoughts
> >>on such modifications before I jump,
> >>
> >>porky
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
----- Original Message -----
From: "GHC" <ghartc@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 12:27 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: pirogue
| While I didn't like sailing my Bolger Pirogue, it's a neat enough design
in
| other respects and easy to build.
Lest the group get confused, there are at least three pirogues by Bolger:
1) the 16' x 3'3" row/sail/paddle boat, original prototype by Bernie
Wolfard.
2) the "Peero", which Greg mentions above original prototype by John Harris,
plan on CO'D's website.
3) the 12' Payson Pirogue, called "Canoe" in BWAOM. A double chined taped
seam double paddle canoe that was never designed for sail.
Pirogue #1 above is probably the most able of the three, also the heaviest.
JB
Jim,
I will try to get some digital photos next weekend of the pirogue. I
don't have a scanner or I'd use some of my snapshots. Hey Jboatguy,
wanna go play in the Napa River? I can lift one end of the boat onto
the back of the van, then slide it on, but I'm wrecking the paint
above the van's hatch because the factory rack is so low. I'm hoping
my custom rack/rollers will be ready this week. Thanks to the one
that suggested reinforcing the deck and adding a third bolt for the
outriggers. Sigh...anything to make the boat heavier. The pirogue
feels very secure. I once was halfway to Angel Island from Point
Richmond before common sense took over. Four foot swells in a boat
with less than 12" of freeboard is not something I should be doing.
Never had a problem with downwind yawing...but last Summer I was out
in wind that was way too strong and the hull started surfing. Yee-Ha!
Bink.
I will try to get some digital photos next weekend of the pirogue. I
don't have a scanner or I'd use some of my snapshots. Hey Jboatguy,
wanna go play in the Napa River? I can lift one end of the boat onto
the back of the van, then slide it on, but I'm wrecking the paint
above the van's hatch because the factory rack is so low. I'm hoping
my custom rack/rollers will be ready this week. Thanks to the one
that suggested reinforcing the deck and adding a third bolt for the
outriggers. Sigh...anything to make the boat heavier. The pirogue
feels very secure. I once was halfway to Angel Island from Point
Richmond before common sense took over. Four foot swells in a boat
with less than 12" of freeboard is not something I should be doing.
Never had a problem with downwind yawing...but last Summer I was out
in wind that was way too strong and the hull started surfing. Yee-Ha!
Bink.
--- In bolger@y..., "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@r...> wrote:
> Bink,
>
> Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck
topper that I
> can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
>
> Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the
Payson
> web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim C.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: binksboats@y... [mailto:binksboats@y...]
> > Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 3:26 PM
> > To: bolger@y...
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >
> >
> > Rique,
> >
> > I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the
fore
> > and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from
either
> > side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from anywhere
in
> > the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if
you
> > are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion
against
> > the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
> > removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her.
Rowing
> > has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much
with
> > the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
> > I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is
great...for
> > a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
> > seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes
out
> > for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on
the
> > van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm
having a
> > rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle
carrier
> > and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does
the
> > trick.
> >
> > Bink.
> > --- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> > > Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I
am
> > > just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> > > looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
> > most
> > > to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> > > these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> > > hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> > > experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
> > secret.
> > > If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not
sail
> > at
> > > least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the
same
> > > beam? etc.
> > >
> > > I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
> > >
> > > Thanx,
> > > Rique
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> > - no flogging dead horses
> > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> > - stay on topic and punctuate
> > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
Ray,
To reiterate Greg's comments, a pirogue is not really comparable to a
Sunfish. The Sunfish is a minimal *sail boat*. The Pirogue is a flat
bottomed canoe which can be sailed, rowed or paddled (or even
motored, if you care to do such a thing). A Sunfish can be sailed--
that's about it. A Pirogue can be loaded with one man, two school age
kids and a week's worth of camping gear and go somewhere. A Sunfish
can, uh, be sailed. Maybe two people can sail on it, but they better
be wearing bathing suits. It is difficult to paddle, impossible to
row, and a motor would be out of the question. No doubt a Sunfish in
competent hands could sail rings around a Pirogue, point higher, and
outmaneuver it on a course. But that isn't the point. If you want a
match race with a Sunfish there are many more suitable designs.
Still, I thinks my Pirogue is a respectable sailer, given its
limitations.
A lanteen or other low aspect rig would suit the design quite well.
Most rigs have better downwind manners than the sprit, but they
usually have more and longer spars which are difficult to stow. The
boat is small and easily driven, and experimenting with different
rigs would not be expensive. Gather some polytarp or Tyvek and a few
lengths of closet pole and have at it. Report your findings! Btw, a
batwing sail would be weatherly and really really cool looking (hint
hint);o)
If I do build a lighter Pirogue, I will definitely post my findings,
successful or not. I'm still really tempted to start a Micro, however,
porky
(so many boats, so little energy)
To reiterate Greg's comments, a pirogue is not really comparable to a
Sunfish. The Sunfish is a minimal *sail boat*. The Pirogue is a flat
bottomed canoe which can be sailed, rowed or paddled (or even
motored, if you care to do such a thing). A Sunfish can be sailed--
that's about it. A Pirogue can be loaded with one man, two school age
kids and a week's worth of camping gear and go somewhere. A Sunfish
can, uh, be sailed. Maybe two people can sail on it, but they better
be wearing bathing suits. It is difficult to paddle, impossible to
row, and a motor would be out of the question. No doubt a Sunfish in
competent hands could sail rings around a Pirogue, point higher, and
outmaneuver it on a course. But that isn't the point. If you want a
match race with a Sunfish there are many more suitable designs.
Still, I thinks my Pirogue is a respectable sailer, given its
limitations.
A lanteen or other low aspect rig would suit the design quite well.
Most rigs have better downwind manners than the sprit, but they
usually have more and longer spars which are difficult to stow. The
boat is small and easily driven, and experimenting with different
rigs would not be expensive. Gather some polytarp or Tyvek and a few
lengths of closet pole and have at it. Report your findings! Btw, a
batwing sail would be weatherly and really really cool looking (hint
hint);o)
If I do build a lighter Pirogue, I will definitely post my findings,
successful or not. I'm still really tempted to start a Micro, however,
porky
(so many boats, so little energy)
--- In bolger@y..., GHC <ghartc@p...> wrote:
...I would have a hard time
> imagining the pirogue sailing with a Sunfish, but then you can't
really
> paddle the latter, either. Of course, everything's a compromise...
> Gregg Carlson
>
> At 08:31 AM 5/6/2001 -0400, you wrote:
> >Dave: Since I have considered building the 16' pirogue as a
cartopper
> >sailboat to sail singlehanded, your comments were very
informational.
> >However, two things still concern me. First, when you say it
sails well,
> >how would you compare it to the sailing speed of a Sunfish or
similar
> >sailboat. Also, like yourself, I would like the hull weight to
stay under
> >70 lbs. Any future comments in this regard are welcome.
Concerning your
> >sail problem downwind, last weekend I had the opportunity to sail
in a
> >decked sailing canoe with a 44 sq ft ACA lateen sail. With the
lateen rig we
> >had no problem downwind. Also, since it seemed to stay pretty
close to a
> >sunfish that was sailing on the same tack from time to time, I
think I would
> >consider that rig if I built the pirogue. Thanks again for your
comments.
> >Ray
Here's one other mention of the Bolger Pirogue on the web. Not a lot
of detail, but some nice pictures -- and an e-mail address.
http://members.tripod.com/peweasel/
of detail, but some nice pictures -- and an e-mail address.
http://members.tripod.com/peweasel/
While I didn't like sailing my Bolger Pirogue, it's a neat enough design in
other respects and easy to build.
I suppose sailing canoes are all quite tender; there's really no where to
hike out. In any kind of breeze, it just didn't work for me. Other people
really like the pirogue, though, so I would guess they either enjoy the
challenge or sail in lighter breezes than we get. I would have a hard time
imagining the pirogue sailing with a Sunfish, but then you can't really
paddle the latter, either. Of course, everything's a compromise.
I don't know if anyone noted, but Bolger's pirogue was published in
"Messing About..." a few years ago.
Gregg Carlson
At 08:31 AM 5/6/2001 -0400, you wrote:
other respects and easy to build.
I suppose sailing canoes are all quite tender; there's really no where to
hike out. In any kind of breeze, it just didn't work for me. Other people
really like the pirogue, though, so I would guess they either enjoy the
challenge or sail in lighter breezes than we get. I would have a hard time
imagining the pirogue sailing with a Sunfish, but then you can't really
paddle the latter, either. Of course, everything's a compromise.
I don't know if anyone noted, but Bolger's pirogue was published in
"Messing About..." a few years ago.
Gregg Carlson
At 08:31 AM 5/6/2001 -0400, you wrote:
>Dave: Since I have considered building the 16' pirogue as a cartopper
>sailboat to sail singlehanded, your comments were very informational.
>However, two things still concern me. First, when you say it sails well,
>how would you compare it to the sailing speed of a Sunfish or similar
>sailboat. Also, like yourself, I would like the hull weight to stay under
>70 lbs. Any future comments in this regard are welcome. Concerning your
>sail problem downwind, last weekend I had the opportunity to sail in a
>decked sailing canoe with a 44 sq ft ACA lateen sail. With the lateen rig we
>had no problem downwind. Also, since it seemed to stay pretty close to a
>sunfish that was sailing on the same tack from time to time, I think I would
>consider that rig if I built the pirogue. Thanks again for your comments.
>Ray
>
>
>>From: "david galvin" <porcupine@...>
>>Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>>To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>>Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>>Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 06:00:50 -0000
>>
>>Buried somewhere in the depths of Duckworks Magazine is a little
>>article I did on my 16' Pirogue. Mine is bright finished luan
>>(meranti) 1/4" plywood, with a daggerboard slot and a few other minor
>>changes. If I were to build it again (and I might) I would try to make
>>it as lightweight as possible. As built it weighs more than 90 lbs., a
>>trifle too heavy for me to lift onto roof racks by myself. Also,
>>sailing in rocky Catskill and Adirondack lakes with a daggerboard
>>sticking two feet underwater makes me nervous, so I would fashion a
>>removable pivoting leeboard.
>>
>>It sails very well, except downwind, where the boomless sprit rig
>>insists on jibing unpredictably. I understand that this is is a common
>>fault of the rig no matter what boat it is on. I made my sail from a
>>Sailrite kit in one evening. The spars fit inside the boat for
>>paddling or rowing. I find the oarlock outriggers function well as
>>designed, but perhaps I lucky when I built them. The boat tracks dead
>>straight when paddled or rowed, and turns majestically. Don't expect
>>quick kayak-like handling unless you leave off the skeg and the keel
>>shoe (which I suspect is structural). There's room in the cockpit for
>>one person to sleep, two or three to paddle. My boat has about 2/3's
>>of the specified flotation and floats fully swamped with 6" of
>>freeboard. Thanks to the side decks it is very difficult to swamp the
>>boat anyway, except deliberately.
>>
>>The Pirogue uses four sheets of plywood and about 30 board feet of
>>lumber. The prototype was reportedly built in sixteen hours by a
>>professional, but mine took a month of part-time work. I included a
>>lot of details to conceal plywood edges and such, but as drawn, the
>>construction is skiff simple. The only real challenge, if you can call
>>it that, is the deck, which can be a little fussy to fit. The steering
>>system works fine as designed. I didn't like the fixed leeboard, and
>>didn't build it.
>>
>>I am plotting to rebuilt this design out of occume plywood, perhaps
>>4mm, with cedar framing and sealed flotation chambers in lieu of foam.
>>That should get its weight down to a reasonable sixtyish pounds, but
>>may weaken it unacceptably. Perhaps I'll ask Bolger for his thoughts
>>on such modifications before I jump,
>>
>>porky
Jim, Rique & others, I too love my pirogue! It is an easily built, good
looking, all around boat. Mine weighs in at about 95lbs. so is just right
for the wife and I to put up on the truck. Holds the two of us and weekend
camping gear. Paddles like a dream. I made a few minor modifications aimed
at adding strength to certain areas.(bottom,top decks). Only problems I have
had is wear on the bottom of the skeg from the occasional drag up the beach.
I fitted a strip of copper and all has been fine since. Be sure to use
quality materials as this ones a keeper.
Good luck! Phil (piroguemaniac)
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
looking, all around boat. Mine weighs in at about 95lbs. so is just right
for the wife and I to put up on the truck. Holds the two of us and weekend
camping gear. Paddles like a dream. I made a few minor modifications aimed
at adding strength to certain areas.(bottom,top decks). Only problems I have
had is wear on the bottom of the skeg from the occasional drag up the beach.
I fitted a strip of copper and all has been fine since. Be sure to use
quality materials as this ones a keeper.
Good luck! Phil (piroguemaniac)
>From: "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@...>_________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>Date: Sat, 5 May 2001 09:04:05 -0700
>
>Bink,
>
>Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck topper that
>I
>can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
>
>Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the Payson
>web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Jim C.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:binksboats@...[mailto:binksboats@...]
> > Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 3:26 PM
> > To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >
> >
> > Rique,
> >
> > I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the fore
> > and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from either
> > side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from anywhere in
> > the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if you
> > are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion against
> > the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
> > removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her. Rowing
> > has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much with
> > the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
> > I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is great...for
> > a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
> > seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes out
> > for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on the
> > van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm having a
> > rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle carrier
> > and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does the
> > trick.
> >
> > Bink.
> > --- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> > > Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
> > > just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> > > looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
> > most
> > > to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> > > these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> > > hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> > > experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
> > secret.
> > > If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail
> > at
> > > least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
> > > beam? etc.
> > >
> > > I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
> > >
> > > Thanx,
> > > Rique
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> > - no flogging dead horses
> > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> > - stay on topic and punctuate
> > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
http://www.clcboats.com/
Carries plans for an outrigger kit for canoes and kayaks. I emailed
them some time ago and the 12' wide version is supposed to be good
for up to 21' canoes.
I will post pictures of it.
Carries plans for an outrigger kit for canoes and kayaks. I emailed
them some time ago and the 12' wide version is supposed to be good
for up to 21' canoes.
I will post pictures of it.
Bink,
I had the same wobbly problem with my outriggers. I did two things:
A third bolt near the gunwale (this is a piece of threaded rod that I
epoxied into the wedge). With that I still saw some flexing of the
sidedeck. That was solved by fitting a pair of 3/8" ply pieces under
the deck. These are a bit over two feet long and extend from the
middle frame to a ways beyond the outriggers. Now the outriggers are
solid.
My stretched (19.5 ft.)Pirogue weighs about 130 lbs including 3
seats. I never had much trouble getting it on my Subaru's roof racks
and it rode very well that way (including many long trips). In 1995
or thereabouts the Subaru was replaced with a van and there was no
way to get the thing on the roof short of hiring Mr. Atlas. It's been
on a trailer since. However I still use my homebuilt dolly (attaches
to the skeg) to get it to and from the water. Never had to get the
trailer wet.
The only other significant change I made to the boat was to add a
solid bulkhead about 1 ft. forward of the forward frame. I then cut
an opening in the forward frame to give extra leg room for the person
in the front seat.
I do occasionally use a 2 hp Honda for longer trips but the weight
off the side makes the boat a bit tender especially in rough waters.
(No problem with the electric as most of the mass is underwater and
the two batteries make for great ballast.) I am thinking seriously
about adding a pair of outrigger sponsons for stability (glassed
foam, perhaps 5 ft long and 6x8 inches in cross section) only when
using this motor.
Great boat - I'd never part with it.
Steve
I had the same wobbly problem with my outriggers. I did two things:
A third bolt near the gunwale (this is a piece of threaded rod that I
epoxied into the wedge). With that I still saw some flexing of the
sidedeck. That was solved by fitting a pair of 3/8" ply pieces under
the deck. These are a bit over two feet long and extend from the
middle frame to a ways beyond the outriggers. Now the outriggers are
solid.
My stretched (19.5 ft.)Pirogue weighs about 130 lbs including 3
seats. I never had much trouble getting it on my Subaru's roof racks
and it rode very well that way (including many long trips). In 1995
or thereabouts the Subaru was replaced with a van and there was no
way to get the thing on the roof short of hiring Mr. Atlas. It's been
on a trailer since. However I still use my homebuilt dolly (attaches
to the skeg) to get it to and from the water. Never had to get the
trailer wet.
The only other significant change I made to the boat was to add a
solid bulkhead about 1 ft. forward of the forward frame. I then cut
an opening in the forward frame to give extra leg room for the person
in the front seat.
I do occasionally use a 2 hp Honda for longer trips but the weight
off the side makes the boat a bit tender especially in rough waters.
(No problem with the electric as most of the mass is underwater and
the two batteries make for great ballast.) I am thinking seriously
about adding a pair of outrigger sponsons for stability (glassed
foam, perhaps 5 ft long and 6x8 inches in cross section) only when
using this motor.
Great boat - I'd never part with it.
Steve
--- In bolger@y..., binksboats@y... wrote:
> rowing has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too
>much with the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the
>sides. I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is
>great...for a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also
>have two seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe....It's a
>little heavy for one person to get it on the van.
Dave: Since I have considered building the 16' pirogue as a cartopper
sailboat to sail singlehanded, your comments were very informational.
However, two things still concern me. First, when you say it sails well,
how would you compare it to the sailing speed of a Sunfish or similar
sailboat. Also, like yourself, I would like the hull weight to stay under
70 lbs. Any future comments in this regard are welcome. Concerning your
sail problem downwind, last weekend I had the opportunity to sail in a
decked sailing canoe with a 44 sq ft ACA lateen sail. With the lateen rig we
had no problem downwind. Also, since it seemed to stay pretty close to a
sunfish that was sailing on the same tack from time to time, I think I would
consider that rig if I built the pirogue. Thanks again for your comments.
Ray
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
sailboat to sail singlehanded, your comments were very informational.
However, two things still concern me. First, when you say it sails well,
how would you compare it to the sailing speed of a Sunfish or similar
sailboat. Also, like yourself, I would like the hull weight to stay under
70 lbs. Any future comments in this regard are welcome. Concerning your
sail problem downwind, last weekend I had the opportunity to sail in a
decked sailing canoe with a 44 sq ft ACA lateen sail. With the lateen rig we
had no problem downwind. Also, since it seemed to stay pretty close to a
sunfish that was sailing on the same tack from time to time, I think I would
consider that rig if I built the pirogue. Thanks again for your comments.
Ray
>From: "david galvin" <porcupine@...>_________________________________________________________________
>Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 06:00:50 -0000
>
>Buried somewhere in the depths of Duckworks Magazine is a little
>article I did on my 16' Pirogue. Mine is bright finished luan
>(meranti) 1/4" plywood, with a daggerboard slot and a few other minor
>changes. If I were to build it again (and I might) I would try to make
>it as lightweight as possible. As built it weighs more than 90 lbs., a
>trifle too heavy for me to lift onto roof racks by myself. Also,
>sailing in rocky Catskill and Adirondack lakes with a daggerboard
>sticking two feet underwater makes me nervous, so I would fashion a
>removable pivoting leeboard.
>
>It sails very well, except downwind, where the boomless sprit rig
>insists on jibing unpredictably. I understand that this is is a common
>fault of the rig no matter what boat it is on. I made my sail from a
>Sailrite kit in one evening. The spars fit inside the boat for
>paddling or rowing. I find the oarlock outriggers function well as
>designed, but perhaps I lucky when I built them. The boat tracks dead
>straight when paddled or rowed, and turns majestically. Don't expect
>quick kayak-like handling unless you leave off the skeg and the keel
>shoe (which I suspect is structural). There's room in the cockpit for
>one person to sleep, two or three to paddle. My boat has about 2/3's
>of the specified flotation and floats fully swamped with 6" of
>freeboard. Thanks to the side decks it is very difficult to swamp the
>boat anyway, except deliberately.
>
>The Pirogue uses four sheets of plywood and about 30 board feet of
>lumber. The prototype was reportedly built in sixteen hours by a
>professional, but mine took a month of part-time work. I included a
>lot of details to conceal plywood edges and such, but as drawn, the
>construction is skiff simple. The only real challenge, if you can call
>it that, is the deck, which can be a little fussy to fit. The steering
>system works fine as designed. I didn't like the fixed leeboard, and
>didn't build it.
>
>I am plotting to rebuilt this design out of occume plywood, perhaps
>4mm, with cedar framing and sealed flotation chambers in lieu of foam.
>That should get its weight down to a reasonable sixtyish pounds, but
>may weaken it unacceptably. Perhaps I'll ask Bolger for his thoughts
>on such modifications before I jump,
>
>porky
>
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
In a message dated 05/06/2001 12:<BR35:<BR21 AM
Eastern Daylight,jchamberlin@...writes:
the plan is on Craig's pages:
http://www2.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/boat/bolger.html#peero
Cheers/Carron
Eastern Daylight,jchamberlin@...writes:
> Where might I find a drawing or study plan, etc. of the pirogue? I checkedHaven't been following this one, but if you are looking for the Bolger Peero,
> the Payson web site, nothing there. Did I miss something?
the plan is on Craig's pages:
http://www2.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/boat/bolger.html#peero
Cheers/Carron
Buried somewhere in the depths of Duckworks Magazine is a little
article I did on my 16' Pirogue. Mine is bright finished luan
(meranti) 1/4" plywood, with a daggerboard slot and a few other minor
changes. If I were to build it again (and I might) I would try to make
it as lightweight as possible. As built it weighs more than 90 lbs., a
trifle too heavy for me to lift onto roof racks by myself. Also,
sailing in rocky Catskill and Adirondack lakes with a daggerboard
sticking two feet underwater makes me nervous, so I would fashion a
removable pivoting leeboard.
It sails very well, except downwind, where the boomless sprit rig
insists on jibing unpredictably. I understand that this is is a common
fault of the rig no matter what boat it is on. I made my sail from a
Sailrite kit in one evening. The spars fit inside the boat for
paddling or rowing. I find the oarlock outriggers function well as
designed, but perhaps I lucky when I built them. The boat tracks dead
straight when paddled or rowed, and turns majestically. Don't expect
quick kayak-like handling unless you leave off the skeg and the keel
shoe (which I suspect is structural). There's room in the cockpit for
one person to sleep, two or three to paddle. My boat has about 2/3's
of the specified flotation and floats fully swamped with 6" of
freeboard. Thanks to the side decks it is very difficult to swamp the
boat anyway, except deliberately.
The Pirogue uses four sheets of plywood and about 30 board feet of
lumber. The prototype was reportedly built in sixteen hours by a
professional, but mine took a month of part-time work. I included a
lot of details to conceal plywood edges and such, but as drawn, the
construction is skiff simple. The only real challenge, if you can call
it that, is the deck, which can be a little fussy to fit. The steering
system works fine as designed. I didn't like the fixed leeboard, and
didn't build it.
I am plotting to rebuilt this design out of occume plywood, perhaps
4mm, with cedar framing and sealed flotation chambers in lieu of foam.
That should get its weight down to a reasonable sixtyish pounds, but
may weaken it unacceptably. Perhaps I'll ask Bolger for his thoughts
on such modifications before I jump,
porky
article I did on my 16' Pirogue. Mine is bright finished luan
(meranti) 1/4" plywood, with a daggerboard slot and a few other minor
changes. If I were to build it again (and I might) I would try to make
it as lightweight as possible. As built it weighs more than 90 lbs., a
trifle too heavy for me to lift onto roof racks by myself. Also,
sailing in rocky Catskill and Adirondack lakes with a daggerboard
sticking two feet underwater makes me nervous, so I would fashion a
removable pivoting leeboard.
It sails very well, except downwind, where the boomless sprit rig
insists on jibing unpredictably. I understand that this is is a common
fault of the rig no matter what boat it is on. I made my sail from a
Sailrite kit in one evening. The spars fit inside the boat for
paddling or rowing. I find the oarlock outriggers function well as
designed, but perhaps I lucky when I built them. The boat tracks dead
straight when paddled or rowed, and turns majestically. Don't expect
quick kayak-like handling unless you leave off the skeg and the keel
shoe (which I suspect is structural). There's room in the cockpit for
one person to sleep, two or three to paddle. My boat has about 2/3's
of the specified flotation and floats fully swamped with 6" of
freeboard. Thanks to the side decks it is very difficult to swamp the
boat anyway, except deliberately.
The Pirogue uses four sheets of plywood and about 30 board feet of
lumber. The prototype was reportedly built in sixteen hours by a
professional, but mine took a month of part-time work. I included a
lot of details to conceal plywood edges and such, but as drawn, the
construction is skiff simple. The only real challenge, if you can call
it that, is the deck, which can be a little fussy to fit. The steering
system works fine as designed. I didn't like the fixed leeboard, and
didn't build it.
I am plotting to rebuilt this design out of occume plywood, perhaps
4mm, with cedar framing and sealed flotation chambers in lieu of foam.
That should get its weight down to a reasonable sixtyish pounds, but
may weaken it unacceptably. Perhaps I'll ask Bolger for his thoughts
on such modifications before I jump,
porky
>From:garth@...A very good source on sails for canoes (also applicible for pirogues)
>Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 13:03:25 -0000
>Keep us apprised if you come across any other good info � I'm very
>curious, and suspect there may be others on the list who'd like to
>give the Bolger Sailing Pirogue a try.
>
>All best,
>Garth
>
is Canoe Rig by Told Bradshaw. It is informative and the illistrations are
a work of art. I is available at most bookstores (Borders for one) and
Amazon.com. It is also availible from Woodenboat at www.woodenboat.com
Michael Surface
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
Also in Bookmarks try 'Bolger boats on the web' for two different
pirogues. It's the 16footer that we're discussing here.
pirogues. It's the 16footer that we're discussing here.
--- In bolger@y..., "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@r...> wrote:
> Bink,
>
> Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck
topper that I
> can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
>
> Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the
Payson
> web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim C.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: binksboats@y... [mailto:binksboats@y...]
> > Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 3:26 PM
> > To: bolger@y...
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >
> >
> > Rique,
> >
> > I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the
fore
> > and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from
either
> > side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from
anywhere in
> > the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if
you
> > are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion
against
> > the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
> > removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her.
Rowing
> > has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much
with
> > the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
> > I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is
great...for
> > a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
> > seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes
out
> > for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on
the
> > van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm
having a
> > rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle
carrier
> > and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does
the
> > trick.
> >
> > Bink.
> > --- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> > > Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand.
I am
> > > just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> > > looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
> > most
> > > to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> > > these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> > > hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> > > experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
> > secret.
> > > If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not
sail
> > at
> > > least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the
same
> > > beam? etc.
> > >
> > > I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
> > >
> > > Thanx,
> > > Rique
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> > - no flogging dead horses
> > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> > - stay on topic and punctuate
> > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
Try Commonsense Boats in the Bookmarks section of this group for
details of the plans etc. but the latest advice on this group is to
get the plans direct from Bolger. Other posters will give you more
details on personal pages with details of the boat.
details of the plans etc. but the latest advice on this group is to
get the plans direct from Bolger. Other posters will give you more
details on personal pages with details of the boat.
--- In bolger@y..., "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@r...> wrote:
> Bink,
>
> Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck
topper that I
> can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
>
> Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the
Payson
> web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jim C.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: binksboats@y... [mailto:binksboats@y...]
> > Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 3:26 PM
> > To: bolger@y...
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >
> >
> > Rique,
> >
> > I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the
fore
> > and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from
either
> > side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from
anywhere in
> > the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if
you
> > are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion
against
> > the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
> > removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her.
Rowing
> > has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much
with
> > the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
> > I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is
great...for
> > a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
> > seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes
out
> > for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on
the
> > van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm
having a
> > rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle
carrier
> > and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does
the
> > trick.
> >
> > Bink.
> > --- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> > > Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand.
I am
> > > just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> > > looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
> > most
> > > to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> > > these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> > > hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> > > experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
> > secret.
> > > If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not
sail
> > at
> > > least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the
same
> > > beam? etc.
> > >
> > > I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
> > >
> > > Thanx,
> > > Rique
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> > - no flogging dead horses
> > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> > - stay on topic and punctuate
> > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
Jim:
try this link:
http://www.common-sense-boats.com/boats/Canoes_&_kayaks/pirogue.htm
Chuck
Hey, folks.
Where might I find a drawing or study plan, etc. of the pirogue? I checked
the Payson web site, nothing there. Did I miss something?
Jim
try this link:
http://www.common-sense-boats.com/boats/Canoes_&_kayaks/pirogue.htm
Chuck
Hey, folks.
Where might I find a drawing or study plan, etc. of the pirogue? I checked
the Payson web site, nothing there. Did I miss something?
Jim
Bink,
Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck topper that I
can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the Payson
web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
Thanks,
Jim C.
Hi....interested in the pirogue. I need an easily built truck topper that I
can paddle and sail on impulse and that will live on my roof rack.
Pictures, or a source of info would be appreciated. I checked the Payson
web site and couldn't find anything. Web links, too.
Thanks,
Jim C.
> -----Original Message-----
> From:binksboats@...[mailto:binksboats@...]
> Sent: Friday, May 04, 2001 3:26 PM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>
>
> Rique,
>
> I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the fore
> and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from either
> side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from anywhere in
> the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if you
> are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion against
> the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
> removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her. Rowing
> has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much with
> the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
> I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is great...for
> a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
> seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes out
> for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on the
> van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm having a
> rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle carrier
> and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does the
> trick.
>
> Bink.
> --- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> > Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
> > just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> > looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
> most
> > to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> > these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> > hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> > experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
> secret.
> > If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail
> at
> > least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
> > beam? etc.
> >
> > I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
> >
> > Thanx,
> > Rique
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Hey, folks.
Where might I find a drawing or study plan, etc. of the pirogue? I checked
the Payson web site, nothing there. Did I miss something?
Jim
Where might I find a drawing or study plan, etc. of the pirogue? I checked
the Payson web site, nothing there. Did I miss something?
Jim
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Surface [mailto:msurface@...]
> Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2001 5:51 AM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: pirogue
>
>
>
>
>
> >From:garth@...
> >Reply-To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> >To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: [bolger] Re: pirogue
> >Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 13:03:25 -0000
>
> >Keep us apprised if you come across any other good info I'm very
> >curious, and suspect there may be others on the list who'd like to
> >give the Bolger Sailing Pirogue a try.
> >
> >All best,
> >Garth
> >
> A very good source on sails for canoes (also applicible for pirogues)
> is Canoe Rig by Told Bradshaw. It is informative and the
> illistrations are
> a work of art. I is available at most bookstores (Borders for one) and
> Amazon.com. It is also availible from Woodenboat at www.woodenboat.com
>
> Michael Surface
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Rique,
I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the fore
and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from either
side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from anywhere in
the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if you
are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion against
the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her. Rowing
has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much with
the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is great...for
a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes out
for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on the
van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm having a
rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle carrier
and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does the
trick.
Bink.
I LOVE my 16' pirogue. I added hatches to the top of the fore
and aft decks, a pivoting rudder and leeboard and a line from either
side of the rudder clear around the decks to con her from anywhere in
the cockpit. The best way to sail her is facing forward, but if you
are heeled over for a long time its best to wedge a cushion against
the edge of the deck. The rig fits in the bottom and I put a
removable seat just aft of the mid-frame to paddle or row her. Rowing
has been a disapointment because the outriggers wobble too much with
the two bolts shown on the plans that fasten them to the sides.
I'm thinking of a better way to fasten them. Paddling is great...for
a flat-bottomed boat it tracks straight and far. I also have two
seats fore and aft to paddle her like a canoe. Everything comes out
for pure sailing. Its a little heavy for one person to get it on the
van. I keep scraping the paint off the back of the roof. I'm having a
rack built that fits into the trailer receiver like a bicycle carrier
and has rollers on top. I'll post pics when its done if it does the
trick.
Bink.
--- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
> just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
most
> to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
secret.
> If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail
at
> least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
> beam? etc.
>
> I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
>
> Thanx,
> Rique
I made a shortened (12') version of the pirogue but without the
sailing rig. Even short, it's an incredible boat. I went places I
never thought I could. If I were interested in building another
boat, the 16'sailing/rowing/paddling pirogue would be my choice.
Drew
sailing rig. Even short, it's an incredible boat. I went places I
never thought I could. If I were interested in building another
boat, the 16'sailing/rowing/paddling pirogue would be my choice.
Drew
--- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
> just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
most
> to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
secret.
> If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail
at
> least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
> beam? etc.
>
> I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
>
> Thanx,
> Rique
--- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
I've just recently been bitten by the "sailing pirogue" bug myself.
Two weekends ago, I built the Michalak Piragua (14' X 32") purely for
paddling use and as soon as it was 3-D, I found myself wanting to
put a sail on her. So I've stumbled into researching sailing
pirogues. I've got the mast step and partner installed now (stealing
rig geometry details from study plans of the Bolger Pirogue, scaled
to fit the smaller boat), and the pivoting leeboard designed. Still
need to built the mast (birdsmouth) and cut the sail (white polytarp)
-- and in a week or two I hope I'll have a sailing report for you.
I see the Bolger Pirogue has two or three inches of side decking
something I haven't installed just fore and aft 3' flotation
compartments w/hatches -- but if I find a lot of water coming over
when heeled, I may add side decking and a little coaming later.
I love the idea of the pirogue a boat easily cartoppable by one
guy; good for quick after-work sails, or for long family paddles on a
Saturday afternoon; easy to stow a lightweight double-ended paddle to
get home when the wind dies; shallow draft for poking about wherever
you like; the pivoting leeboard allows you not to fret about sailing
out of the channel; sails fast when the wind is up; short spars for
easy stowage, etc. Seems like a dreamy proposition. They're the
easiest boats to build, too.
Andy Farquhar steered me to the Yahoo "sailing_canoes" e-group, which
has been like Alice falling down the rabbit hole there's a
fascinating world of canoe-sailing enthusiasts out there.
Beyond recommending that you do Google searches for "sailing pirogue"
and "Bolger pirogue" and roam through the results, here are a few
good links. Unfortunately none of them give a full report on your
main question: what's the Bolger Pirogue like? But you can
triangulate a lot from what's here.
One man's funny and informative stories of sailing a Mike's Cajun
Pirogue:
http://www.boatkits.com/boat/mike/default.htm
Canoe Sailing Resources page (by Craig O'Donnell):
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/canoe_mirror/canoe_sa
iling.html
A good Jim Michalak article on making a pivoting leeboard:
http: marina.fortunecity.com/breakwater/274/1998/0615
Keep us apprised if you come across any other good info I'm very
curious, and suspect there may be others on the list who'd like to
give the Bolger Sailing Pirogue a try.
All best,
Garth
> The Bolger boat that appeals most to me is his 16'pirogue.Rique
I've just recently been bitten by the "sailing pirogue" bug myself.
Two weekends ago, I built the Michalak Piragua (14' X 32") purely for
paddling use and as soon as it was 3-D, I found myself wanting to
put a sail on her. So I've stumbled into researching sailing
pirogues. I've got the mast step and partner installed now (stealing
rig geometry details from study plans of the Bolger Pirogue, scaled
to fit the smaller boat), and the pivoting leeboard designed. Still
need to built the mast (birdsmouth) and cut the sail (white polytarp)
-- and in a week or two I hope I'll have a sailing report for you.
I see the Bolger Pirogue has two or three inches of side decking
something I haven't installed just fore and aft 3' flotation
compartments w/hatches -- but if I find a lot of water coming over
when heeled, I may add side decking and a little coaming later.
I love the idea of the pirogue a boat easily cartoppable by one
guy; good for quick after-work sails, or for long family paddles on a
Saturday afternoon; easy to stow a lightweight double-ended paddle to
get home when the wind dies; shallow draft for poking about wherever
you like; the pivoting leeboard allows you not to fret about sailing
out of the channel; sails fast when the wind is up; short spars for
easy stowage, etc. Seems like a dreamy proposition. They're the
easiest boats to build, too.
Andy Farquhar steered me to the Yahoo "sailing_canoes" e-group, which
has been like Alice falling down the rabbit hole there's a
fascinating world of canoe-sailing enthusiasts out there.
Beyond recommending that you do Google searches for "sailing pirogue"
and "Bolger pirogue" and roam through the results, here are a few
good links. Unfortunately none of them give a full report on your
main question: what's the Bolger Pirogue like? But you can
triangulate a lot from what's here.
One man's funny and informative stories of sailing a Mike's Cajun
Pirogue:
http://www.boatkits.com/boat/mike/default.htm
Canoe Sailing Resources page (by Craig O'Donnell):
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/canoe_mirror/canoe_sa
iling.html
A good Jim Michalak article on making a pivoting leeboard:
http: marina.fortunecity.com/breakwater/274/1998/0615
Keep us apprised if you come across any other good info I'm very
curious, and suspect there may be others on the list who'd like to
give the Bolger Sailing Pirogue a try.
All best,
Garth
Rique,
If you do an "Archive Search" with the word "Pirogue" you'll
find what's already been posted. Most of it was in 1999. You can also
see a finished "Pirogue" at:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/articles/csdpirogue/index.htm
Like you, I have a high opinion of this design, even though I
haven't been able to build one yet. When you get your plans, buy them
from Bolger himself. You'll get better advice than you'll get from
Common Sense Designs. The new owner is a bit spotty when it comes to
advice.
Cheers,
Bruce
If you do an "Archive Search" with the word "Pirogue" you'll
find what's already been posted. Most of it was in 1999. You can also
see a finished "Pirogue" at:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/articles/csdpirogue/index.htm
Like you, I have a high opinion of this design, even though I
haven't been able to build one yet. When you get your plans, buy them
from Bolger himself. You'll get better advice than you'll get from
Common Sense Designs. The new owner is a bit spotty when it comes to
advice.
Cheers,
Bruce
--- In bolger@y..., Rique@p... wrote:
> Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
> just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
> looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals
most
> to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
> these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
> hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
> experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the
secret.
> If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail
at
> least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
> beam? etc.
>
> I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
>
> Thanx,
> Rique
Hi I'm a new member living on the Hauraki Gulf in New Zealand. I am
just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals most
to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the secret.
If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail at
least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
beam? etc.
I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
Thanx,
Rique
just about to finish building a Wharram outrigger canoe and I am
looking around for my next project. The Bolger boat that appeals most
to me is his 16'pirogue. My question is, with all the entries in
these lists about so many boats, and how they perform, this one
hardly gets a mention! How come? Has anyone out there had any
experiances sailing one? If so how about letting me in on the secret.
If not experiance, how about some theory, ie why would it not sail at
least as well as say june bug which is 2' shorter and with the same
beam? etc.
I would love to hear some opinions on the subject.
Thanx,
Rique