Re: [bolger] Re: Wood flour
That was me. False economy, buy it from Raka, it's a much finer flower.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stew Miller" <junkmail@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2002 5:46 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Wood flour
| I think I read about folks putting sawdust in their blenders to make wood
flour...
|
| Stew
|
|
| > Most waste fiber finds a home. You just have to find someone
| > that grinds it up for another market.
| >
| > Charles
|
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I think I read about folks putting sawdust in their blenders to make wood flour...
Stew
Stew
> Most waste fiber finds a home. You just have to find someone
> that grinds it up for another market.
>
> Charles
> Incidentally, although great as a filler for fairing, this stuff isnot good
> structuraly - it's like glueing ball bearings together - thestrength is in
> the glue.Thanks for those numbers Derek.
You are talking about tension? In fillets, the idea is to use them
where the forces are all compresion. Either because that is whatthey
are, or because you have glass running every which way, as with glass
tape over the fillet. I don't use Q-cell for gluing stuff like
scarphs or butts. Generally I just use regular epoxy, and perhaps a
little cabocil.
I was re-watching some tapes I have of Jim Brown at the WB school.
He likes to say about stuff other than wood flour, "you just don't
need to take it that far". I was totally convinced from working at
the school, that wood flour was the way to go. When I got home, and
was stuck without a gear pump, and "free" epoxy, it hit me that I was
getting about 1/2 the yield, or worse using the wood flour. Just not
economical. I just felt like ultimately the bills don't land on his
desk, when he is building as a pro. But they land on mine, in the
land of the 60 cent dollar more is the pitty. So I care if I have to
mix twice the amount.
I have built trimarans. It gets my attention, when a guy specifies
100 gallons of epoxy for a 35 footer. You could possibly do it with
fifty, certainly 80. That's from a guy who tells you he can feel a
five gallon jug of water placed in a float, due to action in the
seaway. What is more, JB is a guy I have total respect for. I am
just pointing out, that not only does it seem wastefull to me, but I
believe it shows up in the boats too. 800# of epoxy is a real issue,
and about half of it gets mixed a couple of ounces at a time, which
hits you on labor. I don't have the least concern about the strength
of wood flour, however.
> You can look at the list of ingredients of bread to see if wood fiber is"A gourmet blend of specially selected, imported and domestic cellulose."
> in it. It is certainly likely to be euphemized.
Q-cell, aka glass microspheres? Available in 100lb boxes. Possibly by the
train car load :)
Incidentally, although great as a filler for fairing, this stuff is not good
structuraly - it's like glueing ball bearings together - the strength is in
the glue. Although much better, even wood flour (I'm told by folk who should
know) lacks the fibre length for best structural strength. Wood flour is
generated in copious quantities by plywood mills - if you live near one it
may be worth giving them a call...
"Scotchlite"
3M Specialty Materials
3M Center
Building 223-6S-04
St. Paul, MN 55144-1000
800 367 8905
800 810 8514 (FAX)
In Canada, 800 410 6880 ext. 6019
In Puerto Rico, 787 750 3000
cheers
Derek
train car load :)
Incidentally, although great as a filler for fairing, this stuff is not good
structuraly - it's like glueing ball bearings together - the strength is in
the glue. Although much better, even wood flour (I'm told by folk who should
know) lacks the fibre length for best structural strength. Wood flour is
generated in copious quantities by plywood mills - if you live near one it
may be worth giving them a call...
"Scotchlite"
3M Specialty Materials
3M Center
Building 223-6S-04
St. Paul, MN 55144-1000
800 367 8905
800 810 8514 (FAX)
In Canada, 800 410 6880 ext. 6019
In Puerto Rico, 787 750 3000
cheers
Derek
The dust from my (now deceased el-cheapo B&D) RO sander has worked well me
too. The resultant putty is too dark colored for my tastes to use in bright
finish application.
Raka has pretty decent prices on all kinds of epoxy fillers.
I'm fortunate in that I work for a company that both uses and manufactures
colloidal silica. (We've got it by the ton!) It's a great thickener, but boy
is it ever tough to sand! We've also got lots of calcium carbonate laying
around but I've never tried it as others have advised. I found some the
other day that was treated to make it hydrophobic (for use as plastic
filler). I wonder if hydrophobically modified fillers would be stronger than
a hydrophilic filler? It could mean a stronger filler-resin bond leading to
better strength properties. We've got an Instron (a type of tensile strength
tester) in the lab, but its not strong enough to tear more than paper. Maybe
one day I'll set up some empirical tests to find out.
John Bell
Kennesaw, GA
jmbell@...
http://jmbell.home.mindspring.com
too. The resultant putty is too dark colored for my tastes to use in bright
finish application.
Raka has pretty decent prices on all kinds of epoxy fillers.
I'm fortunate in that I work for a company that both uses and manufactures
colloidal silica. (We've got it by the ton!) It's a great thickener, but boy
is it ever tough to sand! We've also got lots of calcium carbonate laying
around but I've never tried it as others have advised. I found some the
other day that was treated to make it hydrophobic (for use as plastic
filler). I wonder if hydrophobically modified fillers would be stronger than
a hydrophilic filler? It could mean a stronger filler-resin bond leading to
better strength properties. We've got an Instron (a type of tensile strength
tester) in the lab, but its not strong enough to tear more than paper. Maybe
one day I'll set up some empirical tests to find out.
John Bell
Kennesaw, GA
jmbell@...
http://jmbell.home.mindspring.com
----- Original Message -----
From: John Blake <john_blake@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 5:04 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Wood flour
> Dito, although a bit coarser than the pro stuff mine has never ever let go
> and is as "hard as nails" and costs zip.
>
> John (keep dreaming) Blake
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Samson family <bill.samson@...>
> To: <bolger@...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 10:06 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Wood flour
>
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > A much cheaper source of wood flour than the stuff you get from epoxy
> > manufacturers is the contents of the dustbag of your sander.
> >
> > Seems to work just as well.
> >
> > Bill
> >
> >
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Dito, although a bit coarser than the pro stuff mine has never ever let go
and is as "hard as nails" and costs zip.
John (keep dreaming) Blake
and is as "hard as nails" and costs zip.
John (keep dreaming) Blake
----- Original Message -----
From: Samson family <bill.samson@...>
To: <bolger@...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 10:06 AM
Subject: [bolger] Wood flour
> Hi,
>
> A much cheaper source of wood flour than the stuff you get from epoxy
> manufacturers is the contents of the dustbag of your sander.
>
> Seems to work just as well.
>
> Bill
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get 75% Off Our Best Selling Health and Wellness Books!
> SelfCare.com has everything you need to take care of you and your family,
> plus spend $40 or more and your shipping is free!
>http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/1824
>
>
>
> -- Create a poll/survey for your group!
> --http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=bolger&m=1
>
>