Re: [bolger] Ply epoxy construction . . . high maintenance crap???
Bill, is that your boat in watercraft? Clyde
Samson Family wrote:
Samson Family wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> As you probably know, I'm trying to sell my Chebacco - a ply/glass/epoxy
> boat.
>
> As YOU all know, epoxy sheathed boats are undoubtedly longer-lived than
> GRP - no osmosis problems, for starters. Will any potential customers
> believe this? Will they hell! Here's a typical quote:
>
> >Bill
> >Thank you for giving me the opportunity of reviewing your website - it was
> very interesting.
> >I've decided not to view the boat, not because of a lack of enthusiasm, but
> my business commitments and >young family take up most of my time. I feel
> that your Chebacco will require more maintenance and >nourishment than I can
> give.
> >Best regards - etc
>
> I think we owe it to ourselves as builders of this kind of boat take every
> opportunity to counter the propaganda that has been spread over the years by
> the GRP industry.
>
> Maintenance isn't an issue in a glass-epoxy-sheathed plywood hull.
> Sylvester is STILL (after 5 seasons) on her first paint job. It's getting a
> little chalky in places, and probably a freshen up would be a good thing in
> the next year or two.
>
> My annual maintenance consists of rubbing down the gun'l rubbing strips and
> mast and freshening up the varnish. The real pain in the ass is the
> antifouling - but you need that with any boat.
>
> Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15 years
> experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply needs LESS
> maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before that
> filters down to most boat users.
>
> Now I don't mind somebody rejecting my boat on the basis that it's got too
> big a sail, or is butt-ugly, but it fills me with anger when such
> disinformation dominates the thinking of the 'great unwashed'.
>
> Sorry to sound so snobby, but you know what I mean . . .
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Bill Samson
>
> PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
> - no flogging dead horses
> - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
> - stay on topic and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> From what people tell me the old solid fiberglass boats are best,I believe that the sharp increase in blistering during the 1980's was
> before the mid 70's. Once coring became the norm, blistering
> occurred, as well as delamination.
due to changes in the polyester resin formulations. It did happen
about the same time as a move into core construction.
Whether a cored construction is better or worse than a solid laminate
depends on your scale of values. Much of the increase in sailboat
performance (e.g. Beneteau 30 vs Bristol 30) is due to ligher hull
construction achieved with cores. I think it is beyond dispute that a
cored construction is easier to damage and harder to repair.
Peter
> What makes you say that a ply/epoxy boat requires less maintenancehull
> than a fiberglass boat? It seems to me that if an owner of a
> fiberglass boat performed no maintenance at all to the hull, the
> worst that would happen is the gelcoat would get chalky and the
> might blister. The boat would still be structurally sound.Note that I don't disagree with what you are saying, but as far as I
know, most recreational boats are not solid fiberglass, but foam
cored, in the deck, and sides. And here is where wood performs well.
In reading David Pascoe's surveying articles, he says
many "fiberglass" boats are foam cored. His preference seems to be
solid fiberglass, then wood cored, with foam core last.
He talks of balsa as cores and says that balsa is balsa, and foam may
be any of 100 different things. Foam is soluable, crushes,
crumbles, "burns like crazy". "In virtually every category, balsa out
performs the foam". See his core material article at
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/core_materials.htm
Also see his foam core hull article where it shows three year old
fiberglass boats that have rotten foam cores, due to hydraulic
erosion.
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/cored_hull_bottoms.htm
From what people tell me the old solid fiberglass boats are best,
before the mid 70's. Once coring became the norm, blistering
occurred, as well as delamination.
For Davids article index see:
http://www.yachtsurvey.com/articleslist.htm
Hi Bill,
I too have been exposed to a number of folks who simply do not get
it.Like you,this has caused me to wonder about this situation and why
it should appear the way that it does.
The best I have been able to come up with is that the
word"maintenance" has many meanings to it for many people.In the same
way that"labour" may be expressed either with heavy notions of
something forced,something unpleasent,as something nasty but necessary
or perhaps more positively,as in"a labour of love"etc...,the word
maintenance is burdened similarily.
I suppose that depending on ones own particular disposition just
about any facet of life can be seen as either pure drudgery or an
exquisite joy with most things falling safely in the grey zone.Other
then the wide open expanses of wild nature,I can think of nothing that
does not require some attempts at maintenance.
The one thing that makes all the difference to me is passion.No
matter the task at hand,if I am swept of my feet silly with passion
and the ensuing excitement then nothing is bellow me!
My particular passion happens to be boats.Every aspect of them
titillates me endlessly.It could have been cars,planes,trains or
stamps but it wasn't.It was boats a long time ago and will be for a
long time to come.
The saddness comes from being in a world that is driven to
entertain itself through variety at any cost.Gone is the passion of
exploring an interest until we know it intimately.Instead,we are
encouraged to go through life at the"free samples" counter,driven to
try everything(anything?) at least once.The popular and over-used
lamment of"been there,done that" is nothing more then the tired sigh
of a society void of passion.The heart has been lost.
I do,however,remain hopefull that once enough folks have beaten
their heads against the wall enough for it to really hurt,then they
will turn back their attention to an earlier time.Not eras,epochs or
ancient history times but simply their very own childhood times.I
believe we were once all very much passionate about our physical world
then and the hours upon hours,if not days and weeks,spent pursuing an
interest would perhaps appear a bit obsessional today,in a so called
adult world.But then again,most adults surrendered their passions
years ago.......
In the end Bill,I cannot help you sell your beautiful CHEBACCO nor
you help me sell my MICRO.We must simply wait,like the Great Blue
Heron waits, for our meal ticket to pass by.In the meantime,we still
have our boats to enjoy and many more out there perhaps in need of
further dedicated exploration by folks of passion.
Pleasent passions to you!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan,in dire need of something a wee bit stronger,then the
spring water I've been lapping up,to drive the flames of passion ever
higher,on the shores of the St.Lawrence.........
I too have been exposed to a number of folks who simply do not get
it.Like you,this has caused me to wonder about this situation and why
it should appear the way that it does.
The best I have been able to come up with is that the
word"maintenance" has many meanings to it for many people.In the same
way that"labour" may be expressed either with heavy notions of
something forced,something unpleasent,as something nasty but necessary
or perhaps more positively,as in"a labour of love"etc...,the word
maintenance is burdened similarily.
I suppose that depending on ones own particular disposition just
about any facet of life can be seen as either pure drudgery or an
exquisite joy with most things falling safely in the grey zone.Other
then the wide open expanses of wild nature,I can think of nothing that
does not require some attempts at maintenance.
The one thing that makes all the difference to me is passion.No
matter the task at hand,if I am swept of my feet silly with passion
and the ensuing excitement then nothing is bellow me!
My particular passion happens to be boats.Every aspect of them
titillates me endlessly.It could have been cars,planes,trains or
stamps but it wasn't.It was boats a long time ago and will be for a
long time to come.
The saddness comes from being in a world that is driven to
entertain itself through variety at any cost.Gone is the passion of
exploring an interest until we know it intimately.Instead,we are
encouraged to go through life at the"free samples" counter,driven to
try everything(anything?) at least once.The popular and over-used
lamment of"been there,done that" is nothing more then the tired sigh
of a society void of passion.The heart has been lost.
I do,however,remain hopefull that once enough folks have beaten
their heads against the wall enough for it to really hurt,then they
will turn back their attention to an earlier time.Not eras,epochs or
ancient history times but simply their very own childhood times.I
believe we were once all very much passionate about our physical world
then and the hours upon hours,if not days and weeks,spent pursuing an
interest would perhaps appear a bit obsessional today,in a so called
adult world.But then again,most adults surrendered their passions
years ago.......
In the end Bill,I cannot help you sell your beautiful CHEBACCO nor
you help me sell my MICRO.We must simply wait,like the Great Blue
Heron waits, for our meal ticket to pass by.In the meantime,we still
have our boats to enjoy and many more out there perhaps in need of
further dedicated exploration by folks of passion.
Pleasent passions to you!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan,in dire need of something a wee bit stronger,then the
spring water I've been lapping up,to drive the flames of passion ever
higher,on the shores of the St.Lawrence.........
--- In bolger@y..., "Samson Family" <Bill.Samson@t...> wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> As you probably know, I'm trying to sell my Chebacco - a
ply/glass/epoxy
> boat.
> I think we owe it to ourselves as builders of this kind of boat take
every
> opportunity to counter the propaganda that has been spread over the
years by
> the GRP industry.
>
> Maintenance isn't an issue in a glass-epoxy-sheathed plywood hull.
> Sylvester is STILL (after 5 seasons) on her first paint job. It's
getting a
> little chalky in places, and probably a freshen up would be a good
thing in
> the next year or two.
>
> Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15
years
> experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply needs
LESS
> maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before
that
> filters down to most boat users.
>
> Now I don't mind somebody rejecting my boat on the basis that it's
got too
> big a sail, or is butt-ugly, but it fills me with anger when such
> disinformation dominates the thinking of the 'great unwashed'.
>
> Sorry to sound so snobby, but you know what I mean . . .
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Bill Samson
>
> PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .
likewise, I used to belong to the Enterprise association. This is a
way overcanvased, 13'6" racing dinghy. Lot's of fun! The original
boat as designed by Jack Holt was ply construction with standard
hardwood chine construction. Later, Holt/Allen started making them
out of fiberglass (called glass reinforced plastic) which boasted
them as being low maintenance, etc...
My fiberglass Ent. got to be in very rough shape after 30 years.
All of the wood which was used for the kingpost, cleat backings, and
other backups of structural areas was inaccessable due to the
construction technique used, needless to say, it all rotted despite
being mahogany. I have replaced most of the interior wood through
the installation of inspection ports, but I am not sure it is
absolutely safe.
Most of the wooden boats are still going strong. Since they did
not have inaccessible wooden components, repacement of damaged areas
was very easy. The only wooden boat I ever had a problem with was
the luan Diablo. The AC fir version is going strong!
Check it out at the Champlain messabout.
Happy boating,
David Jost
way overcanvased, 13'6" racing dinghy. Lot's of fun! The original
boat as designed by Jack Holt was ply construction with standard
hardwood chine construction. Later, Holt/Allen started making them
out of fiberglass (called glass reinforced plastic) which boasted
them as being low maintenance, etc...
My fiberglass Ent. got to be in very rough shape after 30 years.
All of the wood which was used for the kingpost, cleat backings, and
other backups of structural areas was inaccessable due to the
construction technique used, needless to say, it all rotted despite
being mahogany. I have replaced most of the interior wood through
the installation of inspection ports, but I am not sure it is
absolutely safe.
Most of the wooden boats are still going strong. Since they did
not have inaccessible wooden components, repacement of damaged areas
was very easy. The only wooden boat I ever had a problem with was
the luan Diablo. The AC fir version is going strong!
Check it out at the Champlain messabout.
Happy boating,
David Jost
> buy wood boats and for a good price. Check out the "Wayfarer"sites.
> Old "Wayfarers", professionally made, go for good prices.
>
> Anyone want to buy a homemade "Hawkeye"?
>
> Bob Chamberland
>
>
>
>
>
>
Think "wood reinforced plastic". A well made "WRP" boat is better than
a badly made "GRP" boat. Either boat, well made, would probably end up
with the same maintenance problems. Unmaintained a "WRP" boat will
probably disolve sooner than a "GRP" boat. Following this website
gives one an insight into the conventional wisdom that wooden boats
require too much maintenance. There seems to be an emphasis here to be
more about building the cheapest boat rather than the best boat. Those
building the "best" boat suffer the consequences when it comes to
selling. For whatever reason few buyers are willing to invest in a
"homemade" boat unless it is being sold for next to nothing. They will
buy wood boats and for a good price. Check out the "Wayfarer" sites.
Old "Wayfarers", professionally made, go for good prices.
Anyone want to buy a homemade "Hawkeye"?
Bob Chamberland
a badly made "GRP" boat. Either boat, well made, would probably end up
with the same maintenance problems. Unmaintained a "WRP" boat will
probably disolve sooner than a "GRP" boat. Following this website
gives one an insight into the conventional wisdom that wooden boats
require too much maintenance. There seems to be an emphasis here to be
more about building the cheapest boat rather than the best boat. Those
building the "best" boat suffer the consequences when it comes to
selling. For whatever reason few buyers are willing to invest in a
"homemade" boat unless it is being sold for next to nothing. They will
buy wood boats and for a good price. Check out the "Wayfarer" sites.
Old "Wayfarers", professionally made, go for good prices.
Anyone want to buy a homemade "Hawkeye"?
Bob Chamberland
--- In bolger@y..., "Samson Family" <Bill.Samson@t...> wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> As you probably know, I'm trying to sell my Chebacco - a
ply/glass/epoxy
> boat.
>
> As YOU all know, epoxy sheathed boats are undoubtedly longer-lived
than
> GRP - no osmosis problems, for starters. Will any potential
customers
> believe this? Will they hell! Here's a typical quote:
>
> >Bill
> >Thank you for giving me the opportunity of reviewing your website -
it was
> very interesting.
> >I've decided not to view the boat, not because of a lack of
enthusiasm, but
> my business commitments and >young family take up most of my time. I
feel
> that your Chebacco will require more maintenance and >nourishment
than I can
> give.
> >Best regards - etc
>
> I think we owe it to ourselves as builders of this kind of boat take
every
> opportunity to counter the propaganda that has been spread over the
years by
> the GRP industry.
>
> Maintenance isn't an issue in a glass-epoxy-sheathed plywood hull.
> Sylvester is STILL (after 5 seasons) on her first paint job. It's
getting a
> little chalky in places, and probably a freshen up would be a good
thing in
> the next year or two.
>
> My annual maintenance consists of rubbing down the gun'l rubbing
strips and
> mast and freshening up the varnish. The real pain in the ass is the
> antifouling - but you need that with any boat.
>
> Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15
years
> experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply needs
LESS
> maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before
that
> filters down to most boat users.
>
> Now I don't mind somebody rejecting my boat on the basis that it's
got too
> big a sail, or is butt-ugly, but it fills me with anger when such
> disinformation dominates the thinking of the 'great unwashed'.
>
> Sorry to sound so snobby, but you know what I mean . . .
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Bill Samson
>
> PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .
Last Saturday I went to a marine salvage yard to scavenge for fittings for
my AF4. It was kind of depressing, really. There were hundreds of boats, all
in various states of advanced decay, most were in the age range of 15-20
years, some less. And every one was fiberglass. What killed them? In most
cases it looked like it was a combination of neglect and faulty
construction. I saw many examples of rotted engine stringers where the
stringer's only protection was a layer of gelcoat. Gelcoat won't protect the
wood from water intrusion and the inevitable rot that follows. The hull to
deck joints looked to be a major problem too. Most were only riveted
together with no backing and sealed only with what appeared to be RTV. You
can't expect fiberglass to hold fastenings like wood. It's just too brittle
and the joint will fail. The failed h-d joints allow water to get into the
bilges and start rotting the unprotected wooden structure inside. Combine
neglect with indifferent construction and you get a boat that dies long
before its time.
I used to think the plans peddler's mantra that "you can build a better boat
than you can buy" was marketer's hyperbole. After looking at a bunch of
"bought" but dead boats, I really believe they have a point.
I just wish I had the means to buy your boat, Bill.
JB in Georgia
my AF4. It was kind of depressing, really. There were hundreds of boats, all
in various states of advanced decay, most were in the age range of 15-20
years, some less. And every one was fiberglass. What killed them? In most
cases it looked like it was a combination of neglect and faulty
construction. I saw many examples of rotted engine stringers where the
stringer's only protection was a layer of gelcoat. Gelcoat won't protect the
wood from water intrusion and the inevitable rot that follows. The hull to
deck joints looked to be a major problem too. Most were only riveted
together with no backing and sealed only with what appeared to be RTV. You
can't expect fiberglass to hold fastenings like wood. It's just too brittle
and the joint will fail. The failed h-d joints allow water to get into the
bilges and start rotting the unprotected wooden structure inside. Combine
neglect with indifferent construction and you get a boat that dies long
before its time.
I used to think the plans peddler's mantra that "you can build a better boat
than you can buy" was marketer's hyperbole. After looking at a bunch of
"bought" but dead boats, I really believe they have a point.
I just wish I had the means to buy your boat, Bill.
JB in Georgia
----- Original Message -----
From: <willsamson@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2001 3:03 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Ply epoxy construction . . . high maintenance crap???
| OK Mike,
|
| We're getting down to individual cases - but I maintain I never heard
| of a ply/glass/epoxy boat getting 'boat pox'or weighing 25% more at
| the end of the season than the start. The RNLI had to scrap its GRP
| Broughty Ferry lifeboat because it got too heavy for the engines to
| get it up on the plane - and this was without any visible signs of
| osmosis!
|
| Be that as it may - I guess we're all agreed that a ply/glass/epoxy
| hull needs no more maintenance than a GRP hull.
|
| Too many guys seem to think that 'GRP = maintenance-free', and
| anything with wood in it will need hundreds of hours maintenance for
| every hour of sailing. This is the myth that must be dispelled.
|
| Nothing is maintenance free, unless you keep it out if the water and
| the sunlight. We all know that boats need maintenance, and there's
| no silver bullet - No; not even GRP!
|
| Come to think of it, even trad construction is light on maintenance
| if the hull isn't neglected. There's a 30 foot carvel hulled boat on
| the Tay that was launched in 1973, and has had nothing more than a
| rub down with wet-or-dry and a fresh coat of paint each season. A
| couple days work most years. She's still as sound and pretty as the
| day she was launched. I can't think of any GRP boats of similar age
| that look as good.
|
| Cheers,
|
| Bill
|
| --- In bolger@y..., mike_vacanti@h... wrote:
| > You are right of course. A wooden boat would have these same
| issues.
| > But getting back to my original point, I don't see how a ply/epoxy
| > boat will require _less_ maintenance than a fiberglass (with some
| > wood components) boat. Both boats require maintenance and the wood
| > boat has greater potential for decay simply because the boat has
| much
| > more wood in its' structure than the fiberglass boat.
| >
| > Mike
| >
| > --- In bolger@y..., pvanderw@o... wrote:
| > > > The boat would still be structurally sound.
| > >
| > > Maybe, maybe not. Most FRP boats have wooden parts that are
| > > vulnerable to rot. Ply cores in deck structures are the most
| > common.
| > > They rot around fittings such as cleats and stanchions.
| > >
| > > In our fleet, a San Juan 28 was dismasted when the chainplates
| > > failed. They were fastened through a ply bulkhead.
| > >
| > > Peter
|
|
| Bolger rules!!!
| - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
| - no flogging dead horses
| - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
| - stay on topic and punctuate
| - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
| - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
|
|
| Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
|
OK Mike,
We're getting down to individual cases - but I maintain I never heard
of a ply/glass/epoxy boat getting 'boat pox'or weighing 25% more at
the end of the season than the start. The RNLI had to scrap its GRP
Broughty Ferry lifeboat because it got too heavy for the engines to
get it up on the plane - and this was without any visible signs of
osmosis!
Be that as it may - I guess we're all agreed that a ply/glass/epoxy
hull needs no more maintenance than a GRP hull.
Too many guys seem to think that 'GRP = maintenance-free', and
anything with wood in it will need hundreds of hours maintenance for
every hour of sailing. This is the myth that must be dispelled.
Nothing is maintenance free, unless you keep it out if the water and
the sunlight. We all know that boats need maintenance, and there's
no silver bullet - No; not even GRP!
Come to think of it, even trad construction is light on maintenance
if the hull isn't neglected. There's a 30 foot carvel hulled boat on
the Tay that was launched in 1973, and has had nothing more than a
rub down with wet-or-dry and a fresh coat of paint each season. A
couple days work most years. She's still as sound and pretty as the
day she was launched. I can't think of any GRP boats of similar age
that look as good.
Cheers,
Bill
We're getting down to individual cases - but I maintain I never heard
of a ply/glass/epoxy boat getting 'boat pox'or weighing 25% more at
the end of the season than the start. The RNLI had to scrap its GRP
Broughty Ferry lifeboat because it got too heavy for the engines to
get it up on the plane - and this was without any visible signs of
osmosis!
Be that as it may - I guess we're all agreed that a ply/glass/epoxy
hull needs no more maintenance than a GRP hull.
Too many guys seem to think that 'GRP = maintenance-free', and
anything with wood in it will need hundreds of hours maintenance for
every hour of sailing. This is the myth that must be dispelled.
Nothing is maintenance free, unless you keep it out if the water and
the sunlight. We all know that boats need maintenance, and there's
no silver bullet - No; not even GRP!
Come to think of it, even trad construction is light on maintenance
if the hull isn't neglected. There's a 30 foot carvel hulled boat on
the Tay that was launched in 1973, and has had nothing more than a
rub down with wet-or-dry and a fresh coat of paint each season. A
couple days work most years. She's still as sound and pretty as the
day she was launched. I can't think of any GRP boats of similar age
that look as good.
Cheers,
Bill
--- In bolger@y..., mike_vacanti@h... wrote:
> You are right of course. A wooden boat would have these same
issues.
> But getting back to my original point, I don't see how a ply/epoxy
> boat will require _less_ maintenance than a fiberglass (with some
> wood components) boat. Both boats require maintenance and the wood
> boat has greater potential for decay simply because the boat has
much
> more wood in its' structure than the fiberglass boat.
>
> Mike
>
> --- In bolger@y..., pvanderw@o... wrote:
> > > The boat would still be structurally sound.
> >
> > Maybe, maybe not. Most FRP boats have wooden parts that are
> > vulnerable to rot. Ply cores in deck structures are the most
> common.
> > They rot around fittings such as cleats and stanchions.
> >
> > In our fleet, a San Juan 28 was dismasted when the chainplates
> > failed. They were fastened through a ply bulkhead.
> >
> > Peter
You are right of course. A wooden boat would have these same issues.
But getting back to my original point, I don't see how a ply/epoxy
boat will require _less_ maintenance than a fiberglass (with some
wood components) boat. Both boats require maintenance and the wood
boat has greater potential for decay simply because the boat has much
more wood in its' structure than the fiberglass boat.
Mike
But getting back to my original point, I don't see how a ply/epoxy
boat will require _less_ maintenance than a fiberglass (with some
wood components) boat. Both boats require maintenance and the wood
boat has greater potential for decay simply because the boat has much
more wood in its' structure than the fiberglass boat.
Mike
--- In bolger@y..., pvanderw@o... wrote:
> > The boat would still be structurally sound.
>
> Maybe, maybe not. Most FRP boats have wooden parts that are
> vulnerable to rot. Ply cores in deck structures are the most
common.
> They rot around fittings such as cleats and stanchions.
>
> In our fleet, a San Juan 28 was dismasted when the chainplates
> failed. They were fastened through a ply bulkhead.
>
> Peter
> The boat would still be structurally sound.Maybe, maybe not. Most FRP boats have wooden parts that are
vulnerable to rot. Ply cores in deck structures are the most common.
They rot around fittings such as cleats and stanchions.
In our fleet, a San Juan 28 was dismasted when the chainplates
failed. They were fastened through a ply bulkhead.
Peter
What makes you say that a ply/epoxy boat requires less maintenance
than a fiberglass boat? It seems to me that if an owner of a
fiberglass boat performed no maintenance at all to the hull, the
worst that would happen is the gelcoat would get chalky and the hull
might blister. The boat would still be structurally sound. If an
owner of a ply/epoxy boat treated his boat the same he might be
allowing rot to start in any unrepaired nicks in the protective
coating. To keep both boats looking sharp would require similar
amounts of elbow grease.
Mike
than a fiberglass boat? It seems to me that if an owner of a
fiberglass boat performed no maintenance at all to the hull, the
worst that would happen is the gelcoat would get chalky and the hull
might blister. The boat would still be structurally sound. If an
owner of a ply/epoxy boat treated his boat the same he might be
allowing rot to start in any unrepaired nicks in the protective
coating. To keep both boats looking sharp would require similar
amounts of elbow grease.
Mike
--- In bolger@y..., "Samson Family" <Bill.Samson@t...> wrote:
<snip>
>
> Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15
years
> experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply
needs LESS
> maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before
that
> filters down to most boat users.
>
<snip>
>
> Bill Samson
>
> PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .
so ask the guy "what maintenance is he talking about?" Might just be
one of those "needs to be educated" issues.....
There was an article in MAIB a while back regarding the long term
maintenance of somebody's micro or something. I can try to dig up
the article if needed...
Mike
one of those "needs to be educated" issues.....
There was an article in MAIB a while back regarding the long term
maintenance of somebody's micro or something. I can try to dig up
the article if needed...
Mike
> As YOU all know, epoxy sheathed boats are undoubtedly longer-livedthan
> GRP - no osmosis problems, for starters. Will any potentialcustomers
> believe this? Will they hell! Here's a typical quote:it was
>
> >Bill
> >Thank you for giving me the opportunity of reviewing your website -
> very interesting.enthusiasm, but
> >I've decided not to view the boat, not because of a lack of
> my business commitments and >young family take up most of my time.I feel
> that your Chebacco will require more maintenance and >nourishmentthan I can
> give.
> >Best regards - etc
Hi guys,
As you probably know, I'm trying to sell my Chebacco - a ply/glass/epoxy
boat.
As YOU all know, epoxy sheathed boats are undoubtedly longer-lived than
GRP - no osmosis problems, for starters. Will any potential customers
believe this? Will they hell! Here's a typical quote:
that your Chebacco will require more maintenance and >nourishment than I can
give.
opportunity to counter the propaganda that has been spread over the years by
the GRP industry.
Maintenance isn't an issue in a glass-epoxy-sheathed plywood hull.
Sylvester is STILL (after 5 seasons) on her first paint job. It's getting a
little chalky in places, and probably a freshen up would be a good thing in
the next year or two.
My annual maintenance consists of rubbing down the gun'l rubbing strips and
mast and freshening up the varnish. The real pain in the ass is the
antifouling - but you need that with any boat.
Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15 years
experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply needs LESS
maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before that
filters down to most boat users.
Now I don't mind somebody rejecting my boat on the basis that it's got too
big a sail, or is butt-ugly, but it fills me with anger when such
disinformation dominates the thinking of the 'great unwashed'.
Sorry to sound so snobby, but you know what I mean . . .
Thoughts?
Bill Samson
PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .
As you probably know, I'm trying to sell my Chebacco - a ply/glass/epoxy
boat.
As YOU all know, epoxy sheathed boats are undoubtedly longer-lived than
GRP - no osmosis problems, for starters. Will any potential customers
believe this? Will they hell! Here's a typical quote:
>Billvery interesting.
>Thank you for giving me the opportunity of reviewing your website - it was
>I've decided not to view the boat, not because of a lack of enthusiasm, butmy business commitments and >young family take up most of my time. I feel
that your Chebacco will require more maintenance and >nourishment than I can
give.
>Best regards - etcI think we owe it to ourselves as builders of this kind of boat take every
opportunity to counter the propaganda that has been spread over the years by
the GRP industry.
Maintenance isn't an issue in a glass-epoxy-sheathed plywood hull.
Sylvester is STILL (after 5 seasons) on her first paint job. It's getting a
little chalky in places, and probably a freshen up would be a good thing in
the next year or two.
My annual maintenance consists of rubbing down the gun'l rubbing strips and
mast and freshening up the varnish. The real pain in the ass is the
antifouling - but you need that with any boat.
Anyway, you'll gather that I'm a firm believer (on the basis of 15 years
experience of epoxy coating ply hulls) that epoxy sheathed ply needs LESS
maintenance than GRP - but I suppose it'll be a long time before that
filters down to most boat users.
Now I don't mind somebody rejecting my boat on the basis that it's got too
big a sail, or is butt-ugly, but it fills me with anger when such
disinformation dominates the thinking of the 'great unwashed'.
Sorry to sound so snobby, but you know what I mean . . .
Thoughts?
Bill Samson
PS - May osmosis descend upon them all . . .