Re: Redwood?

I used cheap pine for the chine logs on my AF3 sharpie, but I built
the mast out of redwood because it was the only straight, clear 16'
stock they had (a Lumber Yard in Colorado Springs, CO). It was kind
of expensive, but the end result was good. I chose stock that didn't
have much sapwood and then cut to avoid all sapwood. I had to plug
only one 3/4" knothole. The mast is plenty bendy and doesn't seem
too brittle.

scarfing pictures:
http://www.geocities.com/sanmi/creamcheese/scarf1.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/sanmi/creamcheese/scarf2.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/sanmi/creamcheese/scarf3.jpg

--- In bolger@y..., jonpit@y... wrote:
> It is true that redwood is generally light , soft and easily
splits
> along the grain. But, in many years of working with it I've
noticed a
> great range of variation in the material. "Redwood" refers to
Sequoia
> sempervirens - the coast redwood which is used for lumber. The
Giant
> Sequoia that groes in the Sierras is another material. Old, slow
growth
> Redwood tends to be a completely different material which seems
denser
> across grain and less prone to split. It also has more tannins and
rot
> resistance. It is readily available in large unmolested pieces from
> water and wine tanks, old beams and ext. architectural elements.
>
> , w --- In bolger@y..., boatbuilding@g... wrote:
> > Redwood is never mentioned as an option for boat building. I was
> > just curious as to why that may be. It has reasonable rot
> > resistance, if allowed to dry good and epoxy coated would
stable. I
> > know it may not perfect but for stringers and bilge areas, would
it
> > be a decent option? Epoxy coated, it would last the life a any
wood
> > boat.
> >
> > Curious?
> >
> > Jeff

It is true that redwood is generally light , soft and easily splits
along the grain. But, in many years of working with it I've noticed a
great range of variation in the material. "Redwood" refers to Sequoia
sempervirens - the coast redwood which is used for lumber. The Giant
Sequoia that groes in the Sierras is another material. Old, slow growth
Redwood tends to be a completely different material which seems denser
across grain and less prone to split. It also has more tannins and rot
resistance. It is readily available in large unmolested pieces from
water and wine tanks, old beams and ext. architectural elements.

, w --- In bolger@y..., boatbuilding@g... wrote:

> Redwood is never mentioned as an option for boat building. I was
> just curious as to why that may be. It has reasonable rot
> resistance, if allowed to dry good and epoxy coated would stable. I
> know it may not perfect but for stringers and bilge areas, would it
> be a decent option? Epoxy coated, it would last the life a any wood
> boat.
>
> Curious?
>
> Jeff

>
> Redwood is occasionally used in strippers. However, there's not much
> grain--it's a nice color, but solid. Cedar, on the other hand, cna have a
> very nice grain to it, too.

I've used some redwood in my strippers. The small strips of redwood split
very easily when stapled or nailed - they also don't tolerate much bending
before splitting. But it can make very nice accent strips, which is about
all I have the patience to use it for. Nothing really comes close to western
red cedar for stripping - lightweight, beautiful, easy to work, smells good,
etc..... I agree with Tom Dalzell, and Harry James's posts - I've stood next
to some big red cedars in the Sierras, and they are a sight to behold; it's
a shame to see so much perfect red cedar split into shingles - it oughta be
reserved for musical instruments - and boats!

Paul L

On Mon, 1 Oct 2001boatbuilding@...wrote:

> Redwood is never mentioned as an option for boat building. I was just
> curious as to why that may be. It has reasonable rot resistance, if
> allowed to dry good and epoxy coated would stable. I know it may not
> perfect but for stringers and bilge areas, would it be a decent
> option? Epoxy coated, it would last the life a any wood boat.

It's largely because western red cedar is a better option on almost every
dimension. Cedar is lighter, often cheaper, more plentiful around the
country, less prone to splitting, and more able to take a pounding.

I used red cedar as a butt block that runs athwart my shantyboat's cabin
sole (it was a quickie boat, and the bottoms side of the plywood panels
are completely epoxy/fiberglassed). We walk all over it, scuffing along,
and drop things on it. Very little signs of wear--I've benn quite happily
surprised.

Redwood is occasionally used in strippers. However, there's not much
grain--it's a nice color, but solid. Cedar, on the other hand, cna have a
very nice grain to it, too.

Chris Crandallcrandall@...(785) 864-4131
Department of Psychology University of Kansas Lawrence, KS 66045
I have data convincingly disconfirming the Duhem-Quine hypothesis.

I guess they hadn't invented the deck yet ;0). The
kind of wood I am talking about should probably be
used only for classical guitars, and other high end
stuff. But as long as they keep making shingles out
of it, I don't know what to say.

Your right about splitting. But in composite, its the
way it works as a core that matters, which is a
different issue.

Fascinating history.

--- "Harry W. James" <welshman@...> wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
I didn't know that they were using redwood in modern
composite boat 
building. A red and yellow cedar strip hull with
redwood worked in 
artistically would be pretty spectacular. As far as I
know they did 
not use redwood for boatbuilding in the old days. I
have a dim memory 
of asking my dad about why they didn't use it when it
was readily 
available, and as I remember, he said it split too
easily. 
 
The battles of the Save the Redwoods League, to save
the Sequoia 
Gigantia's up in the Sierra in the late 40's early
50's, was not to 
keep the Redwoods from being logged. Lumber guys have
told me that 
their wood did not have much value. The 3000-4500 ft
level where they 
grow promotes very large Pines and Cedars (12-15 ft
through the trunk, 
200 ft plus tall) which are necessary to hold down the
roots of the 
big boys. These trees were the ones the logging
companies wanted. 
 
You can understand this if you have ever stood under a
Sugar Pine with 
a trunk 12' through and a clear run of 100 ft to the
first branch. You 
can picture that incredibly tight grained, clear
lumber hidden from 
your prying eyes just underneath the bark. It is
enough to inspire 
lust in even an amateur woodworker. 
 
 
 
thomas dalzell wrote:

> 
> Yes sure can, think strip canoes etc... But

it also

> excells for stuff like rudders, centerboards,

and

> paddles, wingspars. The Gougeons are big

promoters

> when encapsulated. They built Adreneline a

race

> winning formula 40 out of cedar/carbon. On

the other

> hand, the good stuff is cheapish, but not in 
> comparison to marine plywood. 
> 
> ---boatbuilding@...wrote: 
> 
> <HR> 
> <html><body> 
> <tt> 
> It doesn't seem to be mentioned here but can

Redwood

> be use in boat 
> building.  It has reasonable rot

resistance, and

> when properly dried, 
> fairly stable.  Epoxy coated, it should

last the

> life of a wood 
> boat.  
> 
> I sent this once already as doesn't seem to be

posted

> so I'll try 
> again.  Hopefully we don't get

two.

> 
> Jeff Blunck 
> 
> 
> 
> </tt> 
> 
>

</tt>

 



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Always keep in mind that any lumber larger than 1x1
can't be counted on to be stable with a coating alone.
Redwood splits very easilly so I wouldn't use it for
things you are nailling to or screwing to. If you are
worried about wood rot, just use epoxy coving, it is
easy to instal, and will not rot etc...
--- Jeff Blunck <boatbuilding@...> wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
I would believe that Redwood would split if used in
high stress areas. When 
it's dried out, it is light and tender like good old
white pine. My 
thoughts where to use it in places hard to get too to
check for moisture. I 
just figured that coated in epoxy, it might be the
ticket for those hard to 
reach places for things like internal chine logs,
bulkhead framing, etc. 
 
Glued next to plywood as on bulkhead frames would help
splitting and might 
be the way to go if there wasn't a real problems using
it. Safer than 
cutting and handling treated lumber. 
 
Some really nice 2 X 2 stuff at the local lumber yard
right now. 
 
Jeff

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Harry W. James"
<welshman@...> 
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com> 
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 2:42 PM 
Subject: Re: [bolger] Redwood? 
 
 
> I didn't know that they were using redwood in
modern composite boat 
> building. A red and yellow cedar strip hull with
redwood worked in 
> artistically would be pretty spectacular. As far
as I know they did 
> not use redwood for boatbuilding in the old days.
I have a dim memory 
> of asking my dad about why they didn't use it
when it was readily 
> available, and as I remember, he said it split
too easily. 
> 
> The battles of the Save the Redwoods League, to
save the Sequoia 
> Gigantia's up in the Sierra in the late 40's
early 50's, was not to 
> keep the Redwoods from being logged. Lumber guys
have told me that 
> their wood did not have much value. The 3000-4500
ft level where they 
> grow promotes very large Pines and Cedars (12-15
ft through the trunk, 
> 200 ft plus tall) which are necessary to hold
down the roots of the 
> big boys. These trees were the ones the logging
companies wanted. 
> 
> You can understand this if you have ever stood
under a Sugar Pine with 
> a trunk 12' through and a clear run of 100 ft to
the first branch. You 
> can picture that incredibly tight grained, clear
lumber hidden from 
> your prying eyes just underneath the bark. It is
enough to inspire 
> lust in even an amateur woodworker. 
> 
> 
> 
> thomas dalzell wrote: 
 
 
</tt>

 



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- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts,
snip all you like 
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
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I would believe that Redwood would split if used in high stress areas. When
it's dried out, it is light and tender like good old white pine. My
thoughts where to use it in places hard to get too to check for moisture. I
just figured that coated in epoxy, it might be the ticket for those hard to
reach places for things like internal chine logs, bulkhead framing, etc.

Glued next to plywood as on bulkhead frames would help splitting and might
be the way to go if there wasn't a real problems using it. Safer than
cutting and handling treated lumber.

Some really nice 2 X 2 stuff at the local lumber yard right now.

Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: "Harry W. James" <welshman@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Redwood?

> I didn't know that they were using redwood in modern composite boat
> building. A red and yellow cedar strip hull with redwood worked in
> artistically would be pretty spectacular. As far as I know they did
> not use redwood for boatbuilding in the old days. I have a dim memory
> of asking my dad about why they didn't use it when it was readily
> available, and as I remember, he said it split too easily.
>
> The battles of the Save the Redwoods League, to save the Sequoia
> Gigantia's up in the Sierra in the late 40's early 50's, was not to
> keep the Redwoods from being logged. Lumber guys have told me that
> their wood did not have much value. The 3000-4500 ft level where they
> grow promotes very large Pines and Cedars (12-15 ft through the trunk,
> 200 ft plus tall) which are necessary to hold down the roots of the
> big boys. These trees were the ones the logging companies wanted.
>
> You can understand this if you have ever stood under a Sugar Pine with
> a trunk 12' through and a clear run of 100 ft to the first branch. You
> can picture that incredibly tight grained, clear lumber hidden from
> your prying eyes just underneath the bark. It is enough to inspire
> lust in even an amateur woodworker.
>
>
>
> thomas dalzell wrote:

I didn't know that they were using redwood in modern composite boat
building. A red and yellow cedar strip hull with redwood worked in
artistically would be pretty spectacular. As far as I know they did
not use redwood for boatbuilding in the old days. I have a dim memory
of asking my dad about why they didn't use it when it was readily
available, and as I remember, he said it split too easily.

The battles of the Save the Redwoods League, to save the Sequoia
Gigantia's up in the Sierra in the late 40's early 50's, was not to
keep the Redwoods from being logged. Lumber guys have told me that
their wood did not have much value. The 3000-4500 ft level where they
grow promotes very large Pines and Cedars (12-15 ft through the trunk,
200 ft plus tall) which are necessary to hold down the roots of the
big boys. These trees were the ones the logging companies wanted.

You can understand this if you have ever stood under a Sugar Pine with
a trunk 12' through and a clear run of 100 ft to the first branch. You
can picture that incredibly tight grained, clear lumber hidden from
your prying eyes just underneath the bark. It is enough to inspire
lust in even an amateur woodworker.

thomas dalzell wrote:

>
> Yes sure can, think strip canoes etc... But it also
> excells for stuff like rudders, centerboards, and
> paddles, wingspars. The Gougeons are big promoters
> when encapsulated. They built Adreneline a race
> winning formula 40 out of cedar/carbon. On the other
> hand, the good stuff is cheapish, but not in
> comparison to marine plywood.
>
> ---boatbuilding@...wrote:
>
> <HR>
> <html><body>
> <tt>
> It doesn't seem to be mentioned here but can Redwood
> be use in boat 
> building. It has reasonable rot resistance, and
> when properly dried, 
> fairly stable. Epoxy coated, it should last the
> life of a wood 
> boat. 
> 
> I sent this once already as doesn't seem to be posted
> so I'll try 
> again. Hopefully we don't get two. 
> 
> Jeff Blunck 
> 
> 
> 
> </tt>
>
>

Yes sure can, think strip canoes etc... But it also
excells for stuff like rudders, centerboards, and
paddles, wingspars. The Gougeons are big promoters
when encapsulated. They built Adreneline a race
winning formula 40 out of cedar/carbon. On the other
hand, the good stuff is cheapish, but not in
comparison to marine plywood.

---boatbuilding@...wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
It doesn't seem to be mentioned here but can Redwood
be use in boat 
building. It has reasonable rot resistance, and
when properly dried, 
fairly stable. Epoxy coated, it should last the
life of a wood 
boat. 
 
I sent this once already as doesn't seem to be posted
so I'll try 
again. Hopefully we don't get two. 
 
Jeff Blunck 
 
 
 
</tt>

 



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Bolger rules!!! 
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dead horses 
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- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts,
snip all you like 
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
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It doesn't seem to be mentioned here but can Redwood be use in boat
building. It has reasonable rot resistance, and when properly dried,
fairly stable. Epoxy coated, it should last the life of a wood
boat.

I sent this once already as doesn't seem to be posted so I'll try
again. Hopefully we don't get two.

Jeff Blunck

Redwood is never mentioned as an option for boat building. I was
just curious as to why that may be. It has reasonable rot
resistance, if allowed to dry good and epoxy coated would stable. I
know it may not perfect but for stringers and bilge areas, would it
be a decent option? Epoxy coated, it would last the life a any wood
boat.

Curious?

Jeff