Re: Steel Plating the bottom

--- In bolger@y..., timothy@e... wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> Just curious.. has anyone here built a Bolger design with the

bottom

> steel plated? I've heard of a few designs that use that method to
> make the bottom bullet proof and as extra (or even primary) ballast.
>
> I was curious as to how the plates are attached, how they

performed,

> etc. Thanks! :)
>
> --Timothy

I had a recent conversation with PB&F regarding a boat (31') that is
to use external steel ballast. There would be several plates, each
pre-formed to the bottom curve. Each section would then be installed
on the bottom using 3M 5200 (or equivalent) and through-bolted.

Les Lampman

If that was me there is no way those bolt are going
through the bottom of the hull. maybe a bunch of
small bolts threaded into the plates, and then the
whole thing dropped into an epoxy puddle on the
bottom, as long as it didn't raise the CG.
---pvanderw@...wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
The instructions for installing the ballast in Black
Skimmer read as 
follows: 
 
Ballast: three 3/4" x 12" x 5'6" steel
plates, galvanized or 
enamelled; 1 3/8" bolt each through bottom of
hull; total weight 
about 500 pounds. 
 
Before going too bonkers about the 1 bolt each, take
note the ballast 
plate is INSIDE the bottom. I had mistakenly said it
was outside 
before I looked it up. 
 
Peter 
 
</tt>

 



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The instructions for installing the ballast in Black Skimmer read as
follows:

Ballast: three 3/4" x 12" x 5'6" steel plates, galvanized or
enamelled; 1 3/8" bolt each through bottom of hull; total weight
about 500 pounds.

Before going too bonkers about the 1 bolt each, take note the ballast
plate is INSIDE the bottom. I had mistakenly said it was outside
before I looked it up.

Peter

--- In bolger@y..., thomas dalzell <proaconstrictor@y...> wrote:

> For external attachment, it would give me a queasy
> feeling. It reminds me of some comments made in
> Outside magazine about the irresponsibility of a yard
> that attached a bulb ballast to an extreme fin keel
> by duct tapping it arround a flange with carbon fiber.
> They kept repeating in varioius issues of Outside
> that the builders were at fault because there wasn't
> any metal to metal connection, as if such a thing is
> ever possible with a glass boat. That's the way I
> would feel about the ballast on a wooden boat, at some
> point your going to violate the envelope. If it was
> up to me I would get some sort of recess in the bottom
> and then bolt it through to the inside, and seal
> everything with 5200. All the holes would have to be
> solid glass, to keep the capsule. And we are talking
> about a lot of holes. But then ballast always scares
> me.

Heh. Well, you can't cheat mother nature. Either you have a light
displacement multihull, or a skiff, and in either case you can't carry
much of a load. Sure, you could built a BIG catamaran, but thats
getting to be a bit much.

You can make monohulls unsinkable if you plan it carefully. Using the
combination of insulation foam and perhaps a few watertight bulkheads.

Anyway, you are totally right. I found out how they do this and it
turns out to be just as you describe. Throughbolt with great, honking,
countersunk steel bolts.. seal everything with 5200.

--Timothy

For external attachment, it would give me a queasy
feeling. It reminds me of some comments made in
Outside magazine about the irresponsibility of a yard
that attached a bulb ballast to an extreme fin keel
by duct tapping it arround a flange with carbon fiber.
They kept repeating in varioius issues of Outside
that the builders were at fault because there wasn't
any metal to metal connection, as if such a thing is
ever possible with a glass boat. That's the way I
would feel about the ballast on a wooden boat, at some
point your going to violate the envelope. If it was
up to me I would get some sort of recess in the bottom
and then bolt it through to the inside, and seal
everything with 5200. All the holes would have to be
solid glass, to keep the capsule. And we are talking
about a lot of holes. But then ballast always scares
me.

---pvanderw@...wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
The ballast for Black Skimmer is steel plate fastened
by bolts up 
thru the chine logs, as best as I recall. I know that
boats were 
built with a variety of different types of
ballast. 
 
The two issues would be getting a fair bottom, and
longevity (with 
respect to rot and rust). I can't help you on either
count. 
 
PHV 
 
--- In bolger@y..., timothy@e... wrote:

> Hey all, 
> 
> Just curious.. has anyone here built a Bolger

design with the 
bottom

> steel plated? I've heard of a few designs that

use that method to

> make the bottom bullet proof and as extra (or

even primary) ballast.

> 
> I was curious as to how the plates are attached,

how they 
performed,

> etc. Thanks! :) 
> 
> --Timothy

</tt>

 



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<tt>
Bolger rules!!! 
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging
dead horses 
- pls take "personals" off-list, stay on
topic, and punctuate 
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts,
snip all you like 
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349 
- Unsubscribe:
bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com</tt>
 

 
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href="http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/">Yahoo! Terms
of Service</a>.</tt>


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--- In bolger@y..., pvanderw@o... wrote:

> The ballast for Black Skimmer is steel plate fastened by bolts up
> thru the chine logs, as best as I recall. I know that boats were
> built with a variety of different types of ballast.
>
> The two issues would be getting a fair bottom, and longevity (with
> respect to rot and rust). I can't help you on either count.
>
> PHV

Hmm. Well, since the steel plating is essentially sacrificial, i.e.
non-structural, I wouldn't be concerned about rust so much. And with
steel being so cheap, replacing a plate every so often would not be a
big deal.

As far as a fair bottom is concerned, with a square/rocker bottom,
you could just have the plates made -for- you with the exact radius
in them needed. Hey, I don't feel like bending 1" plate. ;)

I am really interested in how these are attached though.. phosphor
bronze bolts? Through chine logs? Through a false bottom structure?
etc. And opinions as to how they perform.

Thanks again!

--Timothy

The ballast for Black Skimmer is steel plate fastened by bolts up
thru the chine logs, as best as I recall. I know that boats were
built with a variety of different types of ballast.

The two issues would be getting a fair bottom, and longevity (with
respect to rot and rust). I can't help you on either count.

PHV

--- In bolger@y..., timothy@e... wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> Just curious.. has anyone here built a Bolger design with the
bottom
> steel plated? I've heard of a few designs that use that method to
> make the bottom bullet proof and as extra (or even primary) ballast.
>
> I was curious as to how the plates are attached, how they
performed,
> etc. Thanks! :)
>
> --Timothy

Hey all,

Just curious.. has anyone here built a Bolger design with the bottom
steel plated? I've heard of a few designs that use that method to
make the bottom bullet proof and as extra (or even primary) ballast.

I was curious as to how the plates are attached, how they performed,
etc. Thanks! :)

--Timothy