Re: [bolger] lateen, anyone?
I think I read something in MAIB about the Scuzbums having some Pirate
Racers. I couldn't find anything on their Web page, but it might be worth
asking them:
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lagoon/6151/
Racers. I couldn't find anything on their Web page, but it might be worth
asking them:
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lagoon/6151/
On Tue, 11 Dec 2001 09:04:57 -0800, Derek wrote:
> Thanks Mark - I'd forgotten about the pirate racer. I'll do a bit of
> web-trawling for reports of them on the water.
>
> Derek
--
John <jkohnen@...>
http://www.boat-links.com/
Distrust any enterprise that requires new clothes.
<Henry David Thoreau>
Thanks for the information, folks.
Hannes, Chapelle shows a plumb-bowed double ender just under 19 feet,
looking like almost all of that as LWL, and with a 6 foot four beam. With a
four
foot six bowsprit, she carries (by my ruler) 104 sq.ft. in the main, and a
wee 21 sq.ft. flying jib. No reefing points shown :)
Cheers
Derek
Hannes, Chapelle shows a plumb-bowed double ender just under 19 feet,
looking like almost all of that as LWL, and with a 6 foot four beam. With a
four
foot six bowsprit, she carries (by my ruler) 104 sq.ft. in the main, and a
wee 21 sq.ft. flying jib. No reefing points shown :)
Cheers
Derek
I agree on lowering it fully to reef. My experience says this is the safest though not always the easiest. With the sail down and a good breeze, you have a handfull, at least with it partially up, you can tie the reef points a lot easier. With one person, letting it down all the way is by far the easiest and safest. With two, it can be done safely lowered only to the reef point.
I personally like the boomless lateen sail and was tempted to convert my Frolic2 to run this type of sail.
Jeff
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I personally like the boomless lateen sail and was tempted to convert my Frolic2 to run this type of sail.
Jeff
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
derek,
this summer I buildt a zephyr and a polytarp lateen lateen (the
latter following the excellent instructions on jim michalaks website).
as you say, it is a boomed lateen, the boat really is to narrow for a
boomless sail.
I have never done this underway, but I feel you would have to lower
the sail all the way to reef it.
Otherwise, I cant see why the lateen should be a dangerous rig, it
gybes in a docile way, being party balanced.
It is also possible to let go the sheet and, if need be, gybe the sail
in front of the mast. the addition of a jib would make this
impossible, and, it being set on the short stump of a mast, I
wonder if its worth the trouble.
However, even with no more than 90 sqft the spar&sail can be a bit
of a handful if it blows, so I think for relaxed handling it shouldnt be
much bigger than this.
How much sail does the Chapelle 'felucca' carry?
hannes
this summer I buildt a zephyr and a polytarp lateen lateen (the
latter following the excellent instructions on jim michalaks website).
as you say, it is a boomed lateen, the boat really is to narrow for a
boomless sail.
I have never done this underway, but I feel you would have to lower
the sail all the way to reef it.
Otherwise, I cant see why the lateen should be a dangerous rig, it
gybes in a docile way, being party balanced.
It is also possible to let go the sheet and, if need be, gybe the sail
in front of the mast. the addition of a jib would make this
impossible, and, it being set on the short stump of a mast, I
wonder if its worth the trouble.
However, even with no more than 90 sqft the spar&sail can be a bit
of a handful if it blows, so I think for relaxed handling it shouldnt be
much bigger than this.
How much sail does the Chapelle 'felucca' carry?
hannes
Thanks Mark - I'd forgotten about the pirate racer. I'll do a bit of
web-trawling for reports of them on the water.
Derek
web-trawling for reports of them on the water.
Derek
I was day-dreaming once upon a time about what kind of boat would
make an immediate impression at the Mystic Seaport Small Craft
Workshop, and I had this vision of a lateen schooner, about 20', boom
on the main, boomless on the fore, scooting up the river. The sails
would be bright colors and there should be a huge pennent flying from
the main yard.
It occured to me later that the fore yard would foul the main when
lowering, and there may be any number of other practical problems,
but I think it could be splashy.
Peter
make an immediate impression at the Mystic Seaport Small Craft
Workshop, and I had this vision of a lateen schooner, about 20', boom
on the main, boomless on the fore, scooting up the river. The sails
would be bright colors and there should be a huge pennent flying from
the main yard.
It occured to me later that the fore yard would foul the main when
lowering, and there may be any number of other practical problems,
but I think it could be splashy.
Peter
I think in 103 Rigs he says the boomed sails can just about
as well be flat.
Can you find Bolger's' 14' Pirate Children Racer in either
BWOM or SBJ #71? That has an 81 sq. ft. boomless Lateen. You
might like the drawing of the very fine yard that's in the book.
m
Derek Waters wrote:
I see Zephyr was
as well be flat.
Can you find Bolger's' 14' Pirate Children Racer in either
BWOM or SBJ #71? That has an 81 sq. ft. boomless Lateen. You
might like the drawing of the very fine yard that's in the book.
m
Derek Waters wrote:
I see Zephyr was
> drawn with a boomed lateen - perhaps there's a hint there?
>
> Cheers
> Derek
I put together (very hastily) a boomless lateen (Arabian Lateen actually -
has short luff) for my sailing jonboat experiment, with good results and
not many vices to report. The clew lifts on a run of course but that long
sloping yard helps keep the sail hanging out there. In general, a lifting
clew would contribute to a "death roll" to windward when on a run when
overpowered.....just don't do that I guess. I don't think that tendency is
as bad as it is on a marconi rig because of the geometry. I never had
trouble with it.
The yard can be very light because its "balanced" somewhat in the center -
I was amazed at what I got away with. Not much weight aloft. The lateen
mast can be a bit overweight because its just a short stump (literally - I
used a small green tree trunk!).
Of course there's zillions of boomed lateens out there on Sunfish (and
related classes) which are a lot of fun and sailed successfully by
unskilled hands all the time. There was also a fad for the lateen on
iceboats early in the 20th century, so there is a performance edge there
too. I'm personally inclined to try it some more - especially on projects
where I don't want (or have) a tall mast. Not sure what Chapelle meant
unless it was for larger boats where the long flailing (and heavier in that
case) yard might also be rather dangerous to raise and lower in a breeze?
--Fritz
----------------
Fritz Funk
Juneau, AK
http://www.alaska.net/~fritzf/Boats/Boats.htm
(Bolger power sharpie "Sneakeasy" and other projects)
has short luff) for my sailing jonboat experiment, with good results and
not many vices to report. The clew lifts on a run of course but that long
sloping yard helps keep the sail hanging out there. In general, a lifting
clew would contribute to a "death roll" to windward when on a run when
overpowered.....just don't do that I guess. I don't think that tendency is
as bad as it is on a marconi rig because of the geometry. I never had
trouble with it.
The yard can be very light because its "balanced" somewhat in the center -
I was amazed at what I got away with. Not much weight aloft. The lateen
mast can be a bit overweight because its just a short stump (literally - I
used a small green tree trunk!).
Of course there's zillions of boomed lateens out there on Sunfish (and
related classes) which are a lot of fun and sailed successfully by
unskilled hands all the time. There was also a fad for the lateen on
iceboats early in the 20th century, so there is a performance edge there
too. I'm personally inclined to try it some more - especially on projects
where I don't want (or have) a tall mast. Not sure what Chapelle meant
unless it was for larger boats where the long flailing (and heavier in that
case) yard might also be rather dangerous to raise and lower in a breeze?
--Fritz
----------------
Fritz Funk
Juneau, AK
http://www.alaska.net/~fritzf/Boats/Boats.htm
(Bolger power sharpie "Sneakeasy" and other projects)
Hi Group
In '103 rigs' PCB gives the boomless lateen a generally good character
(notwithstanding the long yard's fight starting potential in tight
moorings). In figure 105 of American Small Sailing Craft, Chapelle shows a
double ender he politely terms a 'felucca'. It carries an attractive (to my
eye at least) rig of boomless lateen and jib. He characterises the lateen as
a 'very dangerous' rig in unskilled hands. That would be hands like mine.
With the snow falling here in the frozen north the season for polytarp
experiments is gone for another year, but I'm curious - do any of you have
any good (or not-so-good) boomless lateen stories to share? I see Zephyr was
drawn with a boomed lateen - perhaps there's a hint there?
Cheers
Derek
In '103 rigs' PCB gives the boomless lateen a generally good character
(notwithstanding the long yard's fight starting potential in tight
moorings). In figure 105 of American Small Sailing Craft, Chapelle shows a
double ender he politely terms a 'felucca'. It carries an attractive (to my
eye at least) rig of boomless lateen and jib. He characterises the lateen as
a 'very dangerous' rig in unskilled hands. That would be hands like mine.
With the snow falling here in the frozen north the season for polytarp
experiments is gone for another year, but I'm curious - do any of you have
any good (or not-so-good) boomless lateen stories to share? I see Zephyr was
drawn with a boomed lateen - perhaps there's a hint there?
Cheers
Derek