Re: kiteboat

--- In bolger@y..., "GarthAB" <garth@b...> wrote:
Hi Garth,
you are so right. Even if I pay more I learned and enjoyed
the time. If someone is making some silk painting it also
costs material (and time) the results often are poore.
I read the postings following this tread an was quite amused.
Why not build a stitch and glue car ?
I don't stop at computers. As I was 16 I made my first homewrewn, it
was my hobby.It depends on someones interrest and skills.
Every time you enter in a new hobby you begin as a baby and try to
become an expert.
Again stich and glue - I think it was here in germany that they
invented a new technique if sewing. Two needles coming from one side
(not upper and lower). In future it might be possible to sew a tube
of carbon farbric and later 'dip' it in epoxy glue.
This might revolutionise car/vehicle building.
We will see!
have a lot of fun in building
axel

Why doesn't it extend to car's and computers? I am replying to this
message on a computer I built, and there is a lot of interest in this
family (the younger male part 15 to 57) in building up a hot kit car to
tow the Bolger boat trailer.

Can't you see one of these babies

http://www.superstepside.com/

rumbling up to the boat ramp, 350 block burbling through glasspaks, with
a micro on the trailer behind. Talk about your all american mixed
message.

HJ

>
> By "Bolger-blooded cheapeskate" I just meant that if it's possible
> to make your own for less, and learn a bit about the heart and soul
> of the thing along the way, that's the way I'd choose to go. This
> doesn't extend to, say, cars or computers -- but for boats and kites,
> the cheapskate way is a lot of fun. It's not really about the money
> saved -- that's just an interesting footnote.
>
> All best,
> Garth
>

Don't forget the Marcos sports cars. Many of those with plywood chassis are
still running and actually winning races.

Paul W. Esterle
Capt'n Pauley Video Productions
423.989.3159
S/V Bryn Awel, Columbia 10.7
Bristol, Tenn. USA
http://www.captnpauley.bigstep.com
http://pages.preferred.com/~pesterle/

----- Original Message -----
From: "billfye" <bfye@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 1:53 PM
Subject: [bolger] Stitch and glue car? Haha... Ohh!

> Actually....
>
> I saw an article on this in one of the Jeep oriented magazines years
> ago. I always wanted it to be successful, but new car ventures
> seldom are.
>
>http://web.ukonline.co.uk/Members/jr.marsh/africar.html
>
>http://web.ukonline.co.uk/Members/jr.marsh/bedouin.htm
>
>http://www.marshmail.freeserve.co.uk/kitcars.html
>
>http://www.oldwoodies.com/feature-africar.htm
>
> A Quote:
>
> "In the early '80's Howarth built three Africars which were used on
> an expedition from the Arctic to the Equator. The chassis and
> bodywork of the Africars were made of epoxy resin-impregnated
> plywood. On these prototypes, Howarth used Citroën 2CV engines,
> gearboxes and suspension as well as components from other
> manufacturers."
>
> The article I read all those years ago planted the seeds for my
> current interest in funny little plywood boats.
>
> I'd love to get my hands on a set of Africar plans. I would love to
> build one someday (though not with a 2CV drivetrain).
>
> Bill Fye
>
> --- In bolger@y..., "Paul Lefebvre" <paul@w...> wrote:
> > I saw a strip-built (OK, rebuilt) Jeep in California about 10 years
> ago,
> > think the guy used redwood. Very nice looking car!
> >
> > Paul L.
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: roger99a [mailto:roger99a@h...]
> > > Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 12:22 PM
> > > To: bolger@y...
> > > Subject: [bolger] Re: kiteboat
> > >
> > >
> > > Does this mean I have to scratch my plans for the stich and glue
> car?
> > >
> > > Roger S
> > >
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Actually....

I saw an article on this in one of the Jeep oriented magazines years
ago. I always wanted it to be successful, but new car ventures
seldom are.

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/Members/jr.marsh/africar.html

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/Members/jr.marsh/bedouin.htm

http://www.marshmail.freeserve.co.uk/kitcars.html

http://www.oldwoodies.com/feature-africar.htm

A Quote:

"In the early '80's Howarth built three Africars which were used on
an expedition from the Arctic to the Equator. The chassis and
bodywork of the Africars were made of epoxy resin-impregnated
plywood. On these prototypes, Howarth used Citroën 2CV engines,
gearboxes and suspension as well as components from other
manufacturers."

The article I read all those years ago planted the seeds for my
current interest in funny little plywood boats.

I'd love to get my hands on a set of Africar plans. I would love to
build one someday (though not with a 2CV drivetrain).

Bill Fye

--- In bolger@y..., "Paul Lefebvre" <paul@w...> wrote:
> I saw a strip-built (OK, rebuilt) Jeep in California about 10 years
ago,
> think the guy used redwood. Very nice looking car!
>
> Paul L.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: roger99a [mailto:roger99a@h...]
> > Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 12:22 PM
> > To: bolger@y...
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: kiteboat
> >
> >
> > Does this mean I have to scratch my plans for the stich and glue
car?
> >
> > Roger S
> >

I saw a strip-built (OK, rebuilt) Jeep in California about 10 years ago,
think the guy used redwood. Very nice looking car!

Paul L.
Paul, I saw a stitch & tape pickup camper once. It was cherry, looking very much like a large, deep, multichine pram, mounted upside down on the back of the truck, with windows and doors installed. I think it even had curtains in the windows.

Chuck

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I saw a strip-built (OK, rebuilt) Jeep in California about 10 years ago,
think the guy used redwood. Very nice looking car!

Paul L.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: roger99a [mailto:roger99a@...]
> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 12:22 PM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: kiteboat
>
>
> Does this mean I have to scratch my plans for the stich and glue car?
>
> Roger S
>

--- In bolger@y..., "roger99a" <roger99a@h...> wrote:

> Does this mean I have to scratch my plans for the stich and glue

car?

>
> Roger S

Hi Roger --

I should have said that *for me* it doesn't extend to cars and
computers. I also indulge in buying pre-built salsa at the grocery
store, and a pair of jeans every now and then. There's never enough
time to do it all yourself. But I believe the Cheapskate Way can and
should be applied wherever it gives you joy. So, build that stitch-
and-glue car and post some pictures in Bolger2!

All best,
Garth

Does this mean I have to scratch my plans for the stich and glue car?

Roger S

> By "Bolger-blooded cheapeskate" I just meant that if it's

possible

> to make your own for less, and learn a bit about the heart and

soul

> of the thing along the way, that's the way I'd choose to go. This
> doesn't extend to, say, cars or computers -- but for boats and

kites,

> the cheapskate way is a lot of fun. It's not really about the

money

> saved -- that's just an interesting footnote.
>
> All best,
> Garth

Hi Axel --

Thanks for the advice. In the few days since I first posted my
question about making traction kites, I have fallen headlong into the
world of parafoils, Flexifoils, and traction kites. The web really
speeds up Hobby Acquisition. It's amazing how much information is out
there on nearly any subject, waiting till we decide to take notice.
Anyone else interested, check out the Yahoo groups
for "foildesign," "kitebuggy," and "kitesurfing." It's a big world.
Also, a page of links at aeolian.co.uk has free traction kite plans,
and much inspiration.

I'm making a beginner parafoil right now, 39" wide by 35" deep
out of plans I found in a book, using Tyvek. This ought to be
sufficient for a bit of fun in my 14' pirogue. I hope to move on to a
5 or 6 meter kite later this year, to use aboard my Gypsy or Mayfly.

By "Bolger-blooded cheapeskate" I just meant that if it's possible
to make your own for less, and learn a bit about the heart and soul
of the thing along the way, that's the way I'd choose to go. This
doesn't extend to, say, cars or computers -- but for boats and kites,
the cheapskate way is a lot of fun. It's not really about the money
saved -- that's just an interesting footnote.

All best,
Garth

Hi garth,

> Do you make airfoil-type kites?

yes

> Can you tell us where we might find info on making our own kites?

loook in the Yahoo Foildesign group

> Can they be sewn out of polytarp, or is that too heavy?

I don't think so, they are sewn of spinnacker nylon, or special
kite fabric. I use chicara
It's not only the weight, I think if you sew polytarp it gets
perforated and will snatch. But I have no experience with polytarp

> Are there patterns available online?

yes, search for kites

> I'm a Bolger-blooded cheapskate, and if I can sew my own traction
> kite for $50 rather than buy it for $150, I'd go that route.

If you can buy a traction kite (above 3 sqm) for $150 it
would not be worth making your own, except for the fun.
I don't understand Bolger-blooded cheapskate please explain me.
Does it mean you are keen on cheap things?

greetings from germany
axel

These kites probably all descend from M. Jalbert's "Parafoil." If you do a
Google search on Parafoil and Plans you will have some luck in finding
information on how to cut the 'ribs.'

Phil Smith

Garth,
I made a kite to tow my kayak, have had it over 10 years now and gotten
alot of 'free' miles out of it. It's a 3 1/2' wide aerofoil kite with 4
scoops, no rigid components, got the design out of a library book on kites.
It folds down into a 4"x 5" sack, with the kite wrapped around a whittled
chunk of cedar shingle that holds about 300' of heavy-duty kite string. It's
so small and light there's no excuse not to toss it into the boat when we're
headed out and may have a downwind leg and strong enough winds, which is
pretty frequent in our regular stomping grounds. Best part is the stares of
passing powerboaters and especially sailors as we cruise along steering with
the hidden footpedals in our double kayak, eating lunch and appearing as
nonchalant as possible - you can really see some jaws drop when they make
the connection between that tiny yellow kite way up there and this boat
ghosting along with no apparent effort, towed by a nearly invisible string.
It's often hard to even spot the kite, since the higher you go, the more
constant and stronger the winds are. And it couldn't be easier to rig! It IS
unfortunate that we're limited to a heading of at most about 25 degrees off
of downwind, but as long as you look upon it as a bonus, it's great fun.
It's literally a pocket sail, with all the rigging included. I made the kite
from an old backpacking tent that didn't owe me anything, turns out nylon
tent fabric is really too heavy for kitemaking - I'd recommend buying some
very lightweight ripstop, it's not that expensive and I've long thought of
making a 50% bigger kite since mine is a little underpowered for a double
kayak in winds light enough to entice my wife to get out there paddling in
the first place. Another option I've seen mentioned in the kite books is
Tyvek, if you're on the cheap or just want to see what kitesailing is like
you might look into it. I think polytarp would be way too heavy in anything
less than 25mph winds - my tent-fabric kite needs at least 15mph winds to
fly well, at 10 it'll fly but takes effort and constant attention, and if
the wind is any weaker or fickle and it goes in the water, it won't launch
again until dry. So while we can launch it from the boat on the water, to
avoid dunking it we launch from the beach whenever possible, get it flying
well, then jump in the boat and go. I think I probably spent less than $5 on
the whole project, it was mostly recycled stuff. Sewed it on a 1920
straight-stitch Singer I inherited, took a couple hours. It's been a very
worthwhile, fun watertoy!!

Paul L.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: GarthAB [mailto:garth@...]

airfoil-type kites? Can you tell us where we might find

> info on making our own kites? Can they be sewn out of polytarp, or is
> that too heavy? Are there patterns available online?
>

> The kites I have, or am able to build, thats ma hobby.
> Thanks again for infos
> Axel

Axel --

Do you make airfoil-type kites? Can you tell us where we might find
info on making our own kites? Can they be sewn out of polytarp, or is
that too heavy? Are there patterns available online?

I'm a Bolger-blooded cheapskate, and if I can sew my own traction
kite for $50 rather than buy it for $150, I'd go that route.

All best,
Garth

> A small katamaran, that I can put on top of my car.

You might look into the SeaClipper 10 athttp://www.boatdesigns.com/.
It's a tri, not a cat, but otherwise about what you might want.

Peter

hi,
thanks to all the answers and infos
I would like to build something similarto this:
http://www.prokites.com/bugboat.htm
A small katamaran, that I can put on top of my car.
smaller than a hoby16. I think of 250cm length.
I don't know the shape of the floats/vats.
I think the outer shape should be straight and
the inner curved. is there a hulldesign file anywhere
(of a beach cat) ?
The kites I have, or am able to build, thats ma hobby.
Thanks again for infos
Axel

--- In bolger@y..., "axel54de" <axel.hiller@n...> wrote:

> hi,
> some time ago I saw a vehicle build of a buggy with some floats on

it.

> A buggy has three wheels. you are steering with your feet, a big

kite

> is pulling. I would like to replace the wheels by three 'boats'
> like cats have. Are there plans for something similar ?
> best regards
> axel

Some interestin links about tracction kites
http://www.xs4all.nl/~pdj/nasaplan.htm
http://www.fsk.enta.net/pages/traction.htm
Pere

>That's a great link -- thanks. Really gets you thinking about the
>power of kites to supplement sail on our regular little Bolger boats.
>What if you kept one of those (smaller) airfoil kites on board

Sea kayakers have been doing this sort of thing for some time now. A
good way to turn your muscle powered boat into a wind powered boat
when the wind's astern.

-D

C.E.P.
134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
New York, New York 10001
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296

--- In bolger@y..., "Harry W. James" <welshman@p...> wrote:

> I had to go looking
>
>http://www.dcss.org/speedsl/
>
> HJ

Harry --

That's a great link -- thanks. Really gets you thinking about the
power of kites to supplement sail on our regular little Bolger boats.
What if you kept one of those (smaller) airfoil kites on board, say,
a Gypsy or a June Bug? They would probably stow to the size of a seat
cushion. It would be a lot of fun -- a bit of extra speed, with all
the kid-like joy of flying a kite, too. Even if you didn't hit 30
knots. . . .

Check out:
http://www.intothewind.com/cgi-bin/detail.cgi?itemnum=7453&sql=all

or go to intothewind.com and do a search for "foil". They have about
12 different sizes.

All best,
Garth

I had to go looking

http://www.dcss.org/speedsl/

HJ

"Harry W. James" wrote:

>
> The Kitesailors and windsurfers are big in the Columbia Gorge, that info
> might help a web search.
>
> HJ
>
> rnlocnil wrote:
> >
> > Not clear you need 3 boats. I have seen photos of this being done with
> > surfboards and even waterskis! As I recall, the waterski guy used such
> > a big kite that he could temporarily loft himself high in the air with
> > it. Also seem to recall a catamaran being used like this. I vaguely
> > recall a wet site called "speedsailing". I also recall a British
> > organisation devoted to research on sailboats and yachts, but I can't
> > recall the name. Good luck.
> > --- In bolger@y..., "axel54de" <axel.hiller@n...> wrote:
> > > hi,
> > > some time ago I saw a vehicle build of a buggy with some floats on
> > it.
> > > A buggy has three wheels. you are steering with your feet, a big
> > kite
> > > is pulling. I would like to replace the wheels by three 'boats'
> > > like cats have. Are there plans for something similar ?
> > > best regards
> > > axel

The Kitesailors and windsurfers are big in the Columbia Gorge, that info
might help a web search.

HJ

rnlocnil wrote:

>
> Not clear you need 3 boats. I have seen photos of this being done with
> surfboards and even waterskis! As I recall, the waterski guy used such
> a big kite that he could temporarily loft himself high in the air with
> it. Also seem to recall a catamaran being used like this. I vaguely
> recall a wet site called "speedsailing". I also recall a British
> organisation devoted to research on sailboats and yachts, but I can't
> recall the name. Good luck.
> --- In bolger@y..., "axel54de" <axel.hiller@n...> wrote:
> > hi,
> > some time ago I saw a vehicle build of a buggy with some floats on
> it.
> > A buggy has three wheels. you are steering with your feet, a big
> kite
> > is pulling. I would like to replace the wheels by three 'boats'
> > like cats have. Are there plans for something similar ?
> > best regards
> > axel

Not clear you need 3 boats. I have seen photos of this being done with
surfboards and even waterskis! As I recall, the waterski guy used such
a big kite that he could temporarily loft himself high in the air with
it. Also seem to recall a catamaran being used like this. I vaguely
recall a wet site called "speedsailing". I also recall a British
organisation devoted to research on sailboats and yachts, but I can't
recall the name. Good luck.

--- In bolger@y..., "axel54de" <axel.hiller@n...> wrote:
> hi,
> some time ago I saw a vehicle build of a buggy with some floats on
it.
> A buggy has three wheels. you are steering with your feet, a big
kite
> is pulling. I would like to replace the wheels by three 'boats'
> like cats have. Are there plans for something similar ?
> best regards
> axel

hi,
some time ago I saw a vehicle build of a buggy with some floats on it.
A buggy has three wheels. you are steering with your feet, a big kite
is pulling. I would like to replace the wheels by three 'boats'
like cats have. Are there plans for something similar ?
best regards
axel