Re: [bolger] Gypsy modifications
Great description, Garth. I am heading up to Mount
Rainier in a few minutes so I'll digest this more
later.
From what part of the country/world do you hail? You
mentioned getting wet in Gypsy. 90% of my sailing in
her will be coastal or large bay (Chesapeake Bay is
where we are moving next).
Tim
--- GarthAB <garth@...> wrote:
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com
Rainier in a few minutes so I'll digest this more
later.
From what part of the country/world do you hail? You
mentioned getting wet in Gypsy. 90% of my sailing in
her will be coastal or large bay (Chesapeake Bay is
where we are moving next).
Tim
--- GarthAB <garth@...> wrote:
> Hi Tim --__________________________________
>
> I found only two useful photos on my old computer
> and threw together
> a web page where you can see them, with a bit of
> commentary. Probably
> more than you want to know . . .
>
> www.breakawaybooks.com/Gypsy_mods.htm
>
> Hope that works.
>
> For what it's worth, after all the time and energy
> put into making
> this boat, it doesn't get nearly as much use as my
> Michalak Mayfly
> 14. Gypsy is great for blasting along solo or with a
> friend who likes
> to sail, doesn't mind getting wet (with spray, not
> necessarily
> capsize), and doesn't mind being a bit athletic
> about it. But as my
> children grew to the age where they wanted to come
> along (they're now
> 3 and 6), I found Mayfly to be the family boat. It's
> more stable,
> roomier, with higher freeboard and a greater sense
> of security.
>
> Of course, when the girls get to be ten or so and
> want to ditch their
> parents and go sail a fast boat by themselves, Gypsy
> will be there
> waiting for them . . .
>
> All best,
> Garth
>
>
>
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com
Hi Tim --
I found only two useful photos on my old computer and threw together
a web page where you can see them, with a bit of commentary. Probably
more than you want to know . . .
www.breakawaybooks.com/Gypsy_mods.htm
Hope that works.
For what it's worth, after all the time and energy put into making
this boat, it doesn't get nearly as much use as my Michalak Mayfly
14. Gypsy is great for blasting along solo or with a friend who likes
to sail, doesn't mind getting wet (with spray, not necessarily
capsize), and doesn't mind being a bit athletic about it. But as my
children grew to the age where they wanted to come along (they're now
3 and 6), I found Mayfly to be the family boat. It's more stable,
roomier, with higher freeboard and a greater sense of security.
Of course, when the girls get to be ten or so and want to ditch their
parents and go sail a fast boat by themselves, Gypsy will be there
waiting for them . . .
All best,
Garth
I found only two useful photos on my old computer and threw together
a web page where you can see them, with a bit of commentary. Probably
more than you want to know . . .
www.breakawaybooks.com/Gypsy_mods.htm
Hope that works.
For what it's worth, after all the time and energy put into making
this boat, it doesn't get nearly as much use as my Michalak Mayfly
14. Gypsy is great for blasting along solo or with a friend who likes
to sail, doesn't mind getting wet (with spray, not necessarily
capsize), and doesn't mind being a bit athletic about it. But as my
children grew to the age where they wanted to come along (they're now
3 and 6), I found Mayfly to be the family boat. It's more stable,
roomier, with higher freeboard and a greater sense of security.
Of course, when the girls get to be ten or so and want to ditch their
parents and go sail a fast boat by themselves, Gypsy will be there
waiting for them . . .
All best,
Garth
Hello group,
I thought I would list the modifications that I made to the Gypsy
design. I think decking the boat was most significant as it makes the
Gypsy so much more seaworthy - I don't want to imagine sailing it on
Casco Bay without a deck. Even decked I've taken water into the
cockpit!
The hull:
I used butt straps at all the panel joints and taped them on the
outside of the hull. The motor board in the transom I reduced to 1
1/2" width. After assembling the hull I removed the molds at stations
#12 and #9 and installed water tight bulkheads at stations #13 and
#5 - at #13 I inclined the bulkhead the same as the transom, 20
degrees, to enable lounging. I cut an 8" diameter hole in the frame
at station #3 for access. I cut out holes in the frame at station #6
on either side of the daggerboard case leaving 2 1/2" all around to
give access forward to the bulkhead at station #5. I added a skeg 2"
deep and 24" long.
Daggerboard case:
I eliminated the portion that extends aft to station #9 and extended
the case to gunwale level and framed the top with 3/4" X 1 1/2" for
the decking to land on. I lengthened to daggerboard so that it
extends the designed distance below the hull.
Seats:
I eliminated all the seating shown in the plans and made a small
removeable rowing stool that I stow under the forward deck.
Deck framing:
All the frames have 3/4" X 1 1/2" framing along the top edge for
attaching the decking. I installed knees to support the deck 6" aft
of station #10 and 6" aft of station #7. These are made of two layers
of 1/4" ply and incorporate hooks for oar stowage. I installed a 3/4"
X 1 1/2" beam at the aft end of the daggerboard case (6" aft of
station #7) that is supported by the knees and the daggerboard case.
The side deck beams I laminated in place of three pieces of 3/4"
square stock. The side decks are 12" wide and the deck beams follow
the curve of the gunwales. Where the oarlocks and the cleat at the
bow mount I installed reinforcements of 3/4# ply - at the oarlocks
they measure 3" X 6" and at the bow it extends back to station #1. I
eliminated the athwartships mast partner and replaced it with a
longitudinal reinforcement of 1/4" ply between the frame at station
#6 and the bulkhead at station #5.
Decking:
The decking is all 1/4" ply and is glassed with 6 oz. cloth. I
trimmed the decking 1/4" at all the edges then covered all the raw
edges with 3/4" square stock that I had rabbeted 1/4" X 1/2" and then
rounded over. I nailed these in place with bronze ring nails and then
sanded the heads off them after the glue cured. I added a 3/4" X 6"
square reinforcement to the mast partner above the deck and added a
coaming just forward of that. I added a Jonesport cleat at the bow
and risers for the oarlocks. I installed 8" Bomar hatches for access
to the watertight compartments fore and aft.
Rigging:
I made the mast of four 1 1/4" square pieces. I added a second sheave
at the end of the boom to reduce the force on the mainsheet. Also
added a jam cleat on the tiller to hold the sheet. The lower sheave
for the sheet is attached to the tiller just forward of the rudder
through a hole with a jam knot. I am going to "leather" the boom and
mast with 1/8" nylon line to eliminate the grinding between the two.
Rudder:
The gudgeons are made from 3/4" ply doubled and then glued, filleted
and glassed to the transom. The pintles are 3/4" ply and 3/4" dowels
glued, filleted and glassed to the rudder. The top of the rudder is
just the plain double 1/4" ply and the tiller has a slot, i.e. the
rudder is inside the tiller rather than the tiller being inside the
rudder as shown in the plans. I made the tiller to the original
design length of 60" and mounted the hiking stick below rather than
on top.
Criticism:
The side decks should be a little narrower to give more cockpit room -
maybe 9" wide rather than the 12" I made them. The rear of the
cockpit is mostly unuseable when underway, but I wanted lie-down
length - if this is not important the bulkhead could remain at
station #12. For as little freeboard as this boat has it surely does
blow about when rowing in a breeze. Sailing this boat is great fun.
Cheers,
Paul
I thought I would list the modifications that I made to the Gypsy
design. I think decking the boat was most significant as it makes the
Gypsy so much more seaworthy - I don't want to imagine sailing it on
Casco Bay without a deck. Even decked I've taken water into the
cockpit!
The hull:
I used butt straps at all the panel joints and taped them on the
outside of the hull. The motor board in the transom I reduced to 1
1/2" width. After assembling the hull I removed the molds at stations
#12 and #9 and installed water tight bulkheads at stations #13 and
#5 - at #13 I inclined the bulkhead the same as the transom, 20
degrees, to enable lounging. I cut an 8" diameter hole in the frame
at station #3 for access. I cut out holes in the frame at station #6
on either side of the daggerboard case leaving 2 1/2" all around to
give access forward to the bulkhead at station #5. I added a skeg 2"
deep and 24" long.
Daggerboard case:
I eliminated the portion that extends aft to station #9 and extended
the case to gunwale level and framed the top with 3/4" X 1 1/2" for
the decking to land on. I lengthened to daggerboard so that it
extends the designed distance below the hull.
Seats:
I eliminated all the seating shown in the plans and made a small
removeable rowing stool that I stow under the forward deck.
Deck framing:
All the frames have 3/4" X 1 1/2" framing along the top edge for
attaching the decking. I installed knees to support the deck 6" aft
of station #10 and 6" aft of station #7. These are made of two layers
of 1/4" ply and incorporate hooks for oar stowage. I installed a 3/4"
X 1 1/2" beam at the aft end of the daggerboard case (6" aft of
station #7) that is supported by the knees and the daggerboard case.
The side deck beams I laminated in place of three pieces of 3/4"
square stock. The side decks are 12" wide and the deck beams follow
the curve of the gunwales. Where the oarlocks and the cleat at the
bow mount I installed reinforcements of 3/4# ply - at the oarlocks
they measure 3" X 6" and at the bow it extends back to station #1. I
eliminated the athwartships mast partner and replaced it with a
longitudinal reinforcement of 1/4" ply between the frame at station
#6 and the bulkhead at station #5.
Decking:
The decking is all 1/4" ply and is glassed with 6 oz. cloth. I
trimmed the decking 1/4" at all the edges then covered all the raw
edges with 3/4" square stock that I had rabbeted 1/4" X 1/2" and then
rounded over. I nailed these in place with bronze ring nails and then
sanded the heads off them after the glue cured. I added a 3/4" X 6"
square reinforcement to the mast partner above the deck and added a
coaming just forward of that. I added a Jonesport cleat at the bow
and risers for the oarlocks. I installed 8" Bomar hatches for access
to the watertight compartments fore and aft.
Rigging:
I made the mast of four 1 1/4" square pieces. I added a second sheave
at the end of the boom to reduce the force on the mainsheet. Also
added a jam cleat on the tiller to hold the sheet. The lower sheave
for the sheet is attached to the tiller just forward of the rudder
through a hole with a jam knot. I am going to "leather" the boom and
mast with 1/8" nylon line to eliminate the grinding between the two.
Rudder:
The gudgeons are made from 3/4" ply doubled and then glued, filleted
and glassed to the transom. The pintles are 3/4" ply and 3/4" dowels
glued, filleted and glassed to the rudder. The top of the rudder is
just the plain double 1/4" ply and the tiller has a slot, i.e. the
rudder is inside the tiller rather than the tiller being inside the
rudder as shown in the plans. I made the tiller to the original
design length of 60" and mounted the hiking stick below rather than
on top.
Criticism:
The side decks should be a little narrower to give more cockpit room -
maybe 9" wide rather than the 12" I made them. The rear of the
cockpit is mostly unuseable when underway, but I wanted lie-down
length - if this is not important the bulkhead could remain at
station #12. For as little freeboard as this boat has it surely does
blow about when rowing in a breeze. Sailing this boat is great fun.
Cheers,
Paul
Let me be the first to write about Gypsy modifications. The first time I dumped it I found that it is critical to deck the bow and stern
to add flotation (as many people do)-- I was not able to self-rescue. Decking the front meant losing the oar stows, which just broke
my heart. Now I lash the oars along the center line of the boat which is not a terribly good system.
The modification that I have been thinking of is of some kind of removable perch that can be positioned to allow one to hike way
out in a good blow as does the sliding seat on a sailing canoe.
to add flotation (as many people do)-- I was not able to self-rescue. Decking the front meant losing the oar stows, which just broke
my heart. Now I lash the oars along the center line of the boat which is not a terribly good system.
The modification that I have been thinking of is of some kind of removable perch that can be positioned to allow one to hike way
out in a good blow as does the sliding seat on a sailing canoe.
That's a completely separate issue -- we're not talking about
download bandwith to a subscriber's home computer, we're talking
about the storage space taken up in each subscriber's mailbox on
their mail server. Posting a URL, or letting the rest of the
list know that you've added it to the Bolger2 Files or Photos
section is a much more polite way to share your boat photos than
attempting to have the Yahoo server deliver a separate copy to
each of the several hundred list members, if it even will.
-- Sue --
(who used to run large corporate email systems for a living)
Thanks for your reply Sue, as well as your gracious points.
Many of the points that you bring to the forefront are indeed true, your example of increased bandwidth storage requirements on a mailserver or listserver increases primarily in two distinct ways:
1. the number of allotted subscribers with their mailboxes.
2. the demands or needs made by these subscribers for satisfactory storage.
A system that fulfills these requirements is easier on the System administrator or those who maintain the server, as well as the users. It is a "Quality" system. When an initial assessment to purchase hardware and server software is initially considered, one of the forefront questions addressed is "Scale-ability". A system that requires a complete Software or Hardware overhaul after growth makes for a great deal of work & hand wringing! Looking out to the technology horizon, we both have to admit that a time is coming when graphics will be incorporated into emails and accepted without a second thought. Why should "I" as a user, have to point & click my way through a myriad of folders & directories for data when it could be right there with the intended email? I would not buy Time Magazine solely for the content if I had to pick up an additional copy for the graphics. Outlook Express offers graphics and text incorporated as an HTML option with their email in Windows.
If I were a System Administrator, or server site owner more concerned with "change" or facing an outlay for new equipment, I would be quite content if I could keep my users from demanding more and better services by pidgeon-holing them within my means of service. That would not make me a provider of quality service though, would it?
Warm Regards,
Dennis Couch
(who will be catching a flight this Saturday
for training on installation of a Timekeeping
Attendence System Server (TASS) for the Fed Gov'mt)
Keep those boat pictures coming in folks!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
download bandwith to a subscriber's home computer, we're talking
about the storage space taken up in each subscriber's mailbox on
their mail server. Posting a URL, or letting the rest of the
list know that you've added it to the Bolger2 Files or Photos
section is a much more polite way to share your boat photos than
attempting to have the Yahoo server deliver a separate copy to
each of the several hundred list members, if it even will.
-- Sue --
(who used to run large corporate email systems for a living)
Thanks for your reply Sue, as well as your gracious points.
Many of the points that you bring to the forefront are indeed true, your example of increased bandwidth storage requirements on a mailserver or listserver increases primarily in two distinct ways:
1. the number of allotted subscribers with their mailboxes.
2. the demands or needs made by these subscribers for satisfactory storage.
A system that fulfills these requirements is easier on the System administrator or those who maintain the server, as well as the users. It is a "Quality" system. When an initial assessment to purchase hardware and server software is initially considered, one of the forefront questions addressed is "Scale-ability". A system that requires a complete Software or Hardware overhaul after growth makes for a great deal of work & hand wringing! Looking out to the technology horizon, we both have to admit that a time is coming when graphics will be incorporated into emails and accepted without a second thought. Why should "I" as a user, have to point & click my way through a myriad of folders & directories for data when it could be right there with the intended email? I would not buy Time Magazine solely for the content if I had to pick up an additional copy for the graphics. Outlook Express offers graphics and text incorporated as an HTML option with their email in Windows.
If I were a System Administrator, or server site owner more concerned with "change" or facing an outlay for new equipment, I would be quite content if I could keep my users from demanding more and better services by pidgeon-holing them within my means of service. That would not make me a provider of quality service though, would it?
Warm Regards,
Dennis Couch
(who will be catching a flight this Saturday
for training on installation of a Timekeeping
Attendence System Server (TASS) for the Fed Gov'mt)
Keep those boat pictures coming in folks!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- In bolger@y..., "brucehector" <bruce_hector@h...> wrote:
> The files section of this group is full, ie. at the max. sizeGreat! Thanks Bruce, C-Ya there...
> permitted by Yahoo Groups.
>
> Go the the Yahoo Group named "BOLGER2", there's room both in its
> photo and files section. When it fills up we'll create Bolger3.
>
> Bruce Hector
> www.brucesboats.com
> the "Bandwidth Fear" thingie seems to more & more fall intoThat's a completely separate issue -- we're not talking about
> the "Urban Myth" drawer. The 'net is everything graphical at every
> page, & every site. One cannot go onto a URL without having
> another window pop open with an ad for something or other of
> little interest to me.
download bandwith to a subscriber's home computer, we're talking
about the storage space taken up in each subscriber's mailbox on
their mail server. Posting a URL, or letting the rest of the
list know that you've added it to the Bolger2 Files or Photos
section is a much more polite way to share your boat photos than
attempting to have the Yahoo server deliver a separate copy to
each of the several hundred list members, if it even will.
-- Sue --
(who used to run large corporate email systems for a living)
--
Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
--- In bolger@y..., "denniscouch" <DENCOUCH@A...> wrote:
this a "Computer Maven" newsgroup, I would agree with you. But at
least 2 people whose web pages I've looked at, download the email
digest form via Cell phone (Because they live on boats).
> ~snipped stuff~Dennis, you make your points well and not abusively (Thanks). Were
> the "Bandwidth Fear" thingie seems to more & more fall into
> the "Urban Myth" drawer.
> ~snipped stuff~
> Bruce? this is the price that some must pay. As technology marches
> forward, the world becomes a better place. It does not make sense
this a "Computer Maven" newsgroup, I would agree with you. But at
least 2 people whose web pages I've looked at, download the email
digest form via Cell phone (Because they live on boats).
The files section of this group is full, ie. at the max. size
permitted by Yahoo Groups.
Go the the Yahoo Group named "BOLGER2", there's room both in its
photo and files section. When it fills up we'll create Bolger3.
Bruce Hector
www.brucesboats.com
permitted by Yahoo Groups.
Go the the Yahoo Group named "BOLGER2", there's room both in its
photo and files section. When it fills up we'll create Bolger3.
Bruce Hector
www.brucesboats.com
I attempted to upload images to the files section, you can still see
the empty folder....message was something about the bandwidth
insufficient to house it...surprizing in that it was not a very large
file....
I was not aware of the band width problem faced by others in other
countries....
I am a civil designer and I frequently move about and create files of
50 megs or more (digitized arial photos use much of this). My boss
would be seriously unimpressed if I were limited to small files, it
would take a week or more to crank out what I can do in a few key
strokes (not very profitable!) All of the other groups that I
participate in freely use attatchments...
I would happily post images of my boats, (there are a few out there)
but it is far from a need (getting a strip built kayak or canoe from
the car to the water in a public parking lot almost always draws a
few interested people, it can be very time consuming!)
Anyway, I'm building a boat, getting in a few night classes and
working full time...if posting here works next go great, if not it
may be a while (if ever) to post here
Charley
the empty folder....message was something about the bandwidth
insufficient to house it...surprizing in that it was not a very large
file....
I was not aware of the band width problem faced by others in other
countries....
I am a civil designer and I frequently move about and create files of
50 megs or more (digitized arial photos use much of this). My boss
would be seriously unimpressed if I were limited to small files, it
would take a week or more to crank out what I can do in a few key
strokes (not very profitable!) All of the other groups that I
participate in freely use attatchments...
I would happily post images of my boats, (there are a few out there)
but it is far from a need (getting a strip built kayak or canoe from
the car to the water in a public parking lot almost always draws a
few interested people, it can be very time consuming!)
Anyway, I'm building a boat, getting in a few night classes and
working full time...if posting here works next go great, if not it
may be a while (if ever) to post here
Charley
On Tuesday 26 February 2002 14:52, denniscouch wrote:
list do. Because of the advertising etc the webpage is much too
slow to be useful to me.
Baud rates are poor at work, appalling at home. A bunch of
unsolicited graphics really hurts.
But most importantly: even if bandwidth wasn't a problem, there
are better ways to publish your graphics. Posting them on the
web (eg under the Bolger files section) is not hard and has the
advantage of being less transient than email. And finally,
yahoo strips out binaries so we have no choice anyway.
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
> the "Bandwidth Fear" thingie seems to more & more fall intoNot true. I am reading this posting as email, as many on this
> the "Urban Myth" drawer. The 'net is everything graphical at every
> page, & every site. One cannot go onto a URL without having another
> window pop open with an ad for something or other of little interest
> to me. Any bandwidth saved by one or two of us not posting pictures
> of our pride & joy for others, will be used by someone for
> unappreciated advertising. This page has it's share of graphics,
> true?
list do. Because of the advertising etc the webpage is much too
slow to be useful to me.
Baud rates are poor at work, appalling at home. A bunch of
unsolicited graphics really hurts.
But most importantly: even if bandwidth wasn't a problem, there
are better ways to publish your graphics. Posting them on the
web (eg under the Bolger files section) is not hard and has the
advantage of being less transient than email. And finally,
yahoo strips out binaries so we have no choice anyway.
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
I believe that the reason the attachments were not allowed is because
they are pharsed out by YAHOO GROUPS before the listserver does its
magic. Two folders here can be used for uploading of photos or files
& a link to them pasted into the posting.
~snipped stuff~
the "Urban Myth" drawer. The 'net is everything graphical at every
page, & every site. One cannot go onto a URL without having another
window pop open with an ad for something or other of little interest
to me. Any bandwidth saved by one or two of us not posting pictures
of our pride & joy for others, will be used by someone for
unappreciated advertising. This page has it's share of graphics,
true?
~snipped stuff~
forward, the world becomes a better place. It does not make sense to
throttle back technology by dumbing down to placate those who cannot
keep up. My brother still swears that the common man has no need for
a computer. If he & others sharing his way of thought had his way,
you could possibly not even be in your line of work you enjoy today.
Warm regards,
Dennis Couch
they are pharsed out by YAHOO GROUPS before the listserver does its
magic. Two folders here can be used for uploading of photos or files
& a link to them pasted into the posting.
~snipped stuff~
> Look at it this way: if 10% of the messages on this list were tothe "Bandwidth Fear" thingie seems to more & more fall into
> carry a graphic then the bandwidth of the group would increase
> by about 1000%. I know my employer would be unimpressed.
the "Urban Myth" drawer. The 'net is everything graphical at every
page, & every site. One cannot go onto a URL without having another
window pop open with an ad for something or other of little interest
to me. Any bandwidth saved by one or two of us not posting pictures
of our pride & joy for others, will be used by someone for
unappreciated advertising. This page has it's share of graphics,
true?
~snipped stuff~
> Many of the people on this list are not situated in the land ofBruce? this is the price that some must pay. As technology marches
> infinite bandwidth and have to pay (and wait) for their downloads.
forward, the world becomes a better place. It does not make sense to
throttle back technology by dumbing down to placate those who cannot
keep up. My brother still swears that the common man has no need for
a computer. If he & others sharing his way of thought had his way,
you could possibly not even be in your line of work you enjoy today.
Warm regards,
Dennis Couch
> Bruce Fountain (fountainb@s...)
> Senior Software Engineer
> Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
> Perth Western Australia
> tel: +618 9256 0083
On Tuesday 26 February 2002 10:29, geocharley wrote:
carry a graphic then the bandwidth of the group would increase
by about 1000%. I know my employer would be unimpressed.
Many of the people on this list are not situated in the land of
infinite bandwidth and have to pay (and wait) for their downloads.
Much better to place your images on the web somewhere. Then
people can choose to access the image if they are interested.
As a bonus, the image will remain there for some time for the
benefit of others.
The Bolger and Bolger2 groups provide a file area for storing
images, or there are a number of sites which will provide
free webspace. I should love to see your boats.
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
> Way too much effort and headache....I don't need to be using "badLook at it this way: if 10% of the messages on this list were to
> form"....I have built four striking and functional boats, I have
> pictures of two on file, if you want to see them e-mail me
> direct...I'll leave my membership open for 3-4 days then vamoose!
> (with no images to aid in discussion this is not likely to be a worth
> while use of my time)
carry a graphic then the bandwidth of the group would increase
by about 1000%. I know my employer would be unimpressed.
Many of the people on this list are not situated in the land of
infinite bandwidth and have to pay (and wait) for their downloads.
Much better to place your images on the web somewhere. Then
people can choose to access the image if they are interested.
As a bonus, the image will remain there for some time for the
benefit of others.
The Bolger and Bolger2 groups provide a file area for storing
images, or there are a number of sites which will provide
free webspace. I should love to see your boats.
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
I didn't mean to sound too critical. Sorry if it came across that way.
As I recall it's not hard to put things in the files section, and
there are a bunch of fun things there. Hope you will stay. At those
times when I'm really getting into boats, I find it a very fun list.
At other times I drift off into my other hobbies, but it's fun when I
come back.
As I recall it's not hard to put things in the files section, and
there are a bunch of fun things there. Hope you will stay. At those
times when I'm really getting into boats, I find it a very fun list.
At other times I drift off into my other hobbies, but it's fun when I
come back.
--- In bolger@y..., "geocharley" <geocharley@y...> wrote:
> Way too much effort and headache....I don't need to be using "bad
> form"....I have built four striking and functional boats, I have
> pictures of two on file, if you want to see them e-mail me
> direct...I'll leave my membership open for 3-4 days then vamoose!
> (with no images to aid in discussion this is not likely to be a
worth
> while use of my time)
>
> Charley
Way too much effort and headache....I don't need to be using "bad
form"....I have built four striking and functional boats, I have
pictures of two on file, if you want to see them e-mail me
direct...I'll leave my membership open for 3-4 days then vamoose!
(with no images to aid in discussion this is not likely to be a worth
while use of my time)
Charley
form"....I have built four striking and functional boats, I have
pictures of two on file, if you want to see them e-mail me
direct...I'll leave my membership open for 3-4 days then vamoose!
(with no images to aid in discussion this is not likely to be a worth
while use of my time)
Charley
It's not really good form to send attachments directly to a list such
as this. It requires lots of download time for everyone if it works,
and many of those people won't want it and some may have to pay money
for their bits or may have to wait for a slow connection to deal with
it. I don't know if this list bans attachments, but others do. THat
doesn't mean I don't want to see the pictures!
as this. It requires lots of download time for everyone if it works,
and many of those people won't want it and some may have to pay money
for their bits or may have to wait for a slow connection to deal with
it. I don't know if this list bans attachments, but others do. THat
doesn't mean I don't want to see the pictures!
--- In bolger@y..., "geocharley" <geocharley@y...> wrote:
> > The picture didn't come through, at least not for us web viewers.
> > Maybe post it to the Files section?
> >
> > Also -- what were your modifications? We had a few short threads
> last
> > summer about small modifications to Gypsy. I'd love to know what
> you
> > did.
> >
>
> Hi Garth....I don't know why the image attatchments did not come
> through...I will see if I can post to the files section...snip
> The picture didn't come through, at least not for us web viewers.last
> Maybe post it to the Files section?
>
> Also -- what were your modifications? We had a few short threads
> summer about small modifications to Gypsy. I'd love to know whatyou
> did.Hi Garth....I don't know why the image attatchments did not come
>
through...I will see if I can post to the files section...As for mods
to the Gypsy I'm starting small, just modifications to the ribs for
asthetics and function as well as enclosing the decks with cedar
strip (mahogany actually) and epoxy-glass in a pleasing and strong
shallow arch. I'm setting this boat up for some rowdy fun sailing
storms on Lake Tahoe. Oh, I'm also using sailboard mast, boom and
racing sail.... We have a nice wind slot onto a local lake that
almost daily cranks out south westers of gail force, should be lots
of fun!!
--- In bolger@y..., Charley Dean <geocharley@y...> wrote:
rather than actual theft. Some other junk that was stored in
the basement storage area, presumably abandoned there by
previous tenants, also got cleaned out right around the same
time, and I can understand how a bare unpainted Frosty hull
might be mistaken for "junk," especially as this had been
sitting down there for a couple of years. I was in the middle
of moving out at the time, and never had a chance to follow up....
-- Sue --
(consoling myself by banging together a Tortoise :-) )
--
Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
>I'm guessing that this was a case of an overzealous landlord
> Hi Sue, Sorry to hear about your boat takin' a walk on
> ya'. I do know the feeling, Ive had two of my boats
> stolen. Fortunately, I live in a small town and the
> vessels were both recovered.
rather than actual theft. Some other junk that was stored in
the basement storage area, presumably abandoned there by
previous tenants, also got cleaned out right around the same
time, and I can understand how a bare unpainted Frosty hull
might be mistaken for "junk," especially as this had been
sitting down there for a couple of years. I was in the middle
of moving out at the time, and never had a chance to follow up....
-- Sue --
(consoling myself by banging together a Tortoise :-) )
--
Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
Hi Charley --
The picture didn't come through, at least not for us web viewers.
Maybe post it to the Files section?
Also -- what were your modifications? We had a few short threads last
summer about small modifications to Gypsy. I'd love to know what you
did.
All best,
Garth
The picture didn't come through, at least not for us web viewers.
Maybe post it to the Files section?
Also -- what were your modifications? We had a few short threads last
summer about small modifications to Gypsy. I'd love to know what you
did.
All best,
Garth
> Here is a pic of my second boat project, I'm on my 4th
> now (gypsy modified to my liking in autocad 2000)
Hi Sue, Sorry to hear about your boat takin' a walk on
ya'. I do know the feeling, Ive had two of my boats
stolen. Fortunately, I live in a small town and the
vessels were both recovered.
I'm very new here, I will try to catch up on the
threads...
Here is a pic of my second boat project, I'm on my 4th
now (gypsy modified to my liking in autocad 2000)
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
http://sports.yahoo.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ya'. I do know the feeling, Ive had two of my boats
stolen. Fortunately, I live in a small town and the
vessels were both recovered.
I'm very new here, I will try to catch up on the
threads...
Here is a pic of my second boat project, I'm on my 4th
now (gypsy modified to my liking in autocad 2000)
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
http://sports.yahoo.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> wow! a Frosty! That Tom Leach design would fit right in here.They're fun little boats. Mine were built to the old unrevised
plans (on which the pieces didn't fit together quite right); the
experimental self-rescuing one that I did an e-glass layup over
vanished from the basement of my apartment building before I had
a chance to fit her out and test her, but I still have the other
one, built as drawn.
-- Sue --
(#819 and #821)
--
Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
Cool, I saw the first 4 did not realize 2 more were out. My question
was regarding the Patrick O'brien based movie with P. Bolger's HMS
Rose in it. Know anything about that, anyone?
Thanks much for the input.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
was regarding the Patrick O'brien based movie with P. Bolger's HMS
Rose in it. Know anything about that, anyone?
Thanks much for the input.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
>4
> Andy, There have been 6 Horatio Hornblowers made by A&E. The first
> tell the story of "Midshipman Hornblower", then next 2and
> tell "Lieutenant Hornblower" 's tale. I have all 6 movies on DVD
> they are a treat. (They are out, in other words). Here's hoping for
> the next book soon!
Count me in! Pleasant bay or Harwich, I'll bring Chebacco.
this Cape Cod messabout could be cool.
this Cape Cod messabout could be cool.
--- In bolger@y..., "roue20ca" <amoore@h...> wrote:
tell the story of "Midshipman Hornblower", then next 2
tell "Lieutenant Hornblower" 's tale. I have all 6 movies on DVD and
they are a treat. (They are out, in other words). Here's hoping for
the next book soon!
> I love those old sea story movies, black and white real old ormodern
> remakes. I very much injoyed the serious on A&E about Horatioit
> Hornblower. Do you know, approx when the movie might come out? Is
> a made for TV movie? ...Andy, There have been 6 Horatio Hornblowers made by A&E. The first 4
>
> Thanks even if you can't answer my questions
>
> Andy Moore
tell the story of "Midshipman Hornblower", then next 2
tell "Lieutenant Hornblower" 's tale. I have all 6 movies on DVD and
they are a treat. (They are out, in other words). Here's hoping for
the next book soon!
I traded (straight up) an old Jeep Wagoneer(a freeby) for the '81
Dodge PU I have now. Costs about $20 a month to own (for insurance)
and another $20-30 to drive (for gas). Starts in any weather, burns a
quart of oil every 800-1000 mi. Wife hates it, I love it. It pulls a
13' camper, a boat trailer with 16 ft boat, carries a couple of other
boats on top and in the bed, hauls junk to the dump and carries my
advertising for boat building. Gas mileage isn't the greatest,
windshield needs to be replaced, driver's side door has cancer (bad),
transmission kickdown doesn't work and one of the tires has a week
leak (goes flat in a week). If its still running in 20 yrs, I'll
still have it!
Dodge PU I have now. Costs about $20 a month to own (for insurance)
and another $20-30 to drive (for gas). Starts in any weather, burns a
quart of oil every 800-1000 mi. Wife hates it, I love it. It pulls a
13' camper, a boat trailer with 16 ft boat, carries a couple of other
boats on top and in the bed, hauls junk to the dump and carries my
advertising for boat building. Gas mileage isn't the greatest,
windshield needs to be replaced, driver's side door has cancer (bad),
transmission kickdown doesn't work and one of the tires has a week
leak (goes flat in a week). If its still running in 20 yrs, I'll
still have it!
--- In bolger@y..., "roger99a" <roger99a@h...> wrote:
> I have an old beater Ford F250 pickup, 22 years old, that costs
> roughly $40/month to keep. Even when I consider the initial cost 6
> years ago, the transmission and the one set of tires I bought for
> it, it is still only $75/month. It sure is handy to have around,
> too. I use it on the weekends to haul trash, lumber and anything
> else I need to carry. Plus I have a spare vehicle for when the
main
> car breaks down or needs service. Now you can probably rent a
truck
> once a month for $40, but then you have to go to the rental place
> and spend an hour there, more time to return it, and you will do it
> less often because of the inconvenience. Saving the money will cost
> you the time.
> I just can't see how a good redneck can get along without a pickup
> truck.
>
> Roger S
>
> --- In bolger@y..., "roue20ca" <amoore@h...> wrote:
> > Just thinking out loud now but my experience has been that most
> > sailing is done locally on a Wed Night or Weekend. The serious
> cruise
> > comes once maybe twice a year and for some people every other
> year.
> > So what if you considered renting a suitable vehicle for the long
> > weekend or even week that you need it and then you don't have to
> worry
> > about a large vehicle when you don't need it. Initial price for
> > rental might seem high but think about running such a vehicle year
> > round when you only need it for say 2 weeks max. Course the other
> > option would be to have 2 vehicles, so now one sits unused most
of
> the
> > year and still coast money. You would have to do some research
and
> > you may find you have lots of other uses for a large truck but it
> is
> > worth looking at I think. Note too that a diesle engine would give
> > better milage both while towing and not; and is a better alround
> work
> > horse so if renting or buying I think it would try to get a diesle
> > truck.
> >
> >
> > Andy Moore
> > Nova Scotia
> > Canada
As I mentioned some people may have many other uses for a truck and
that certainly would justify buying one verses renting one. As for
the time, I live in a city and rental places will deliver if time is
that critical; mind you it does not take me 1 hour to get a vehicle
which I can pick up on a route I likely travel 2 or 3 times a day and
usually with someone else in the car so that does not even become a
problem. Once again if I lived a 1 hour or 2 out side a town it would
be a different situation, car rental agencies will not deliver that
far out. If I were planning a vacation towing a boat and having some
fun, the last thing I would want is to risk ruining that vacation
because of a 22 year old truck that gives up the ghost! Thats the
cost of a broken truck, and years vacation plus any other expences
payed that you didn't get to use because the truck broke down. Not
this guy.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
that certainly would justify buying one verses renting one. As for
the time, I live in a city and rental places will deliver if time is
that critical; mind you it does not take me 1 hour to get a vehicle
which I can pick up on a route I likely travel 2 or 3 times a day and
usually with someone else in the car so that does not even become a
problem. Once again if I lived a 1 hour or 2 out side a town it would
be a different situation, car rental agencies will not deliver that
far out. If I were planning a vacation towing a boat and having some
fun, the last thing I would want is to risk ruining that vacation
because of a 22 year old truck that gives up the ghost! Thats the
cost of a broken truck, and years vacation plus any other expences
payed that you didn't get to use because the truck broke down. Not
this guy.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
--- In bolger@y..., "roger99a" <roger99a@h...> wrote:
> I have an old beater Ford F250 pickup, 22 years old, that costs
> roughly $40/month to keep. Even when I consider the initial cost 6
> years ago, the transmission and the one set of tires I bought for
> it, it is still only $75/month. It sure is handy to have around,
> too. I use it on the weekends to haul trash, lumber and anything
> else I need to carry. Plus I have a spare vehicle for when the main
> car breaks down or needs service. Now you can probably rent a truck
> once a month for $40, but then you have to go to the rental place
> and spend an hour there, more time to return it, and you will do it
> less often because of the inconvenience. Saving the money will cost
> you the time.
> I just can't see how a good redneck can get along without a pickup
> truck.
>
> Roger S
I have an old beater Ford F250 pickup, 22 years old, that costs
roughly $40/month to keep. Even when I consider the initial cost 6
years ago, the transmission and the one set of tires I bought for
it, it is still only $75/month. It sure is handy to have around,
too. I use it on the weekends to haul trash, lumber and anything
else I need to carry. Plus I have a spare vehicle for when the main
car breaks down or needs service. Now you can probably rent a truck
once a month for $40, but then you have to go to the rental place
and spend an hour there, more time to return it, and you will do it
less often because of the inconvenience. Saving the money will cost
you the time.
I just can't see how a good redneck can get along without a pickup
truck.
Roger S
roughly $40/month to keep. Even when I consider the initial cost 6
years ago, the transmission and the one set of tires I bought for
it, it is still only $75/month. It sure is handy to have around,
too. I use it on the weekends to haul trash, lumber and anything
else I need to carry. Plus I have a spare vehicle for when the main
car breaks down or needs service. Now you can probably rent a truck
once a month for $40, but then you have to go to the rental place
and spend an hour there, more time to return it, and you will do it
less often because of the inconvenience. Saving the money will cost
you the time.
I just can't see how a good redneck can get along without a pickup
truck.
Roger S
--- In bolger@y..., "roue20ca" <amoore@h...> wrote:
> Just thinking out loud now but my experience has been that most
> sailing is done locally on a Wed Night or Weekend. The serious
cruise
> comes once maybe twice a year and for some people every other
year.
> So what if you considered renting a suitable vehicle for the long
> weekend or even week that you need it and then you don't have to
worry
> about a large vehicle when you don't need it. Initial price for
> rental might seem high but think about running such a vehicle year
> round when you only need it for say 2 weeks max. Course the other
> option would be to have 2 vehicles, so now one sits unused most of
the
> year and still coast money. You would have to do some research and
> you may find you have lots of other uses for a large truck but it
is
> worth looking at I think. Note too that a diesle engine would give
> better milage both while towing and not; and is a better alround
work
> horse so if renting or buying I think it would try to get a diesle
> truck.
>
>
> Andy Moore
> Nova Scotia
> Canada
A Cape Cod messabout seems like a fine idea, and I'd probably attend
if a sloppy Michalak boat is allowed. (The sloppiness is not
Michalak's but the first builder's. I doubt if I will ever pick up
someone else's project again after the first two.) However, I do
wonder if in August it wouldn't be faster to row to the messabout
instead of trying to drive. I suppose if the recession is still in
force then it won't be as much of a problem.
if a sloppy Michalak boat is allowed. (The sloppiness is not
Michalak's but the first builder's. I doubt if I will ever pick up
someone else's project again after the first two.) However, I do
wonder if in August it wouldn't be faster to row to the messabout
instead of trying to drive. I suppose if the recession is still in
force then it won't be as much of a problem.
--- In bolger@y..., "futabachan" <futabachan@y...> wrote:
> > I hope to have Firefly done (or sailable) before then. How about
a
> > Cape Cod Messabout the 1st weekend in August? Pleasant Bay?
>
> Is this a private party, or is just anyone invited? I don't think
> I'll have my Paradox in the water by August, but I hope to have a
> Windsprint done by then, and if not, I can unearth my old Cape Cod
> Frosty (left over from my previous flurry of boatbuilding)....
>
> --
> Susan Davis <futabachan@y...>
Just thinking out loud now but my experience has been that most
sailing is done locally on a Wed Night or Weekend. The serious cruise
comes once maybe twice a year and for some people every other year.
So what if you considered renting a suitable vehicle for the long
weekend or even week that you need it and then you don't have to worry
about a large vehicle when you don't need it. Initial price for
rental might seem high but think about running such a vehicle year
round when you only need it for say 2 weeks max. Course the other
option would be to have 2 vehicles, so now one sits unused most of the
year and still coast money. You would have to do some research and
you may find you have lots of other uses for a large truck but it is
worth looking at I think. Note too that a diesle engine would give
better milage both while towing and not; and is a better alround work
horse so if renting or buying I think it would try to get a diesle
truck.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
sailing is done locally on a Wed Night or Weekend. The serious cruise
comes once maybe twice a year and for some people every other year.
So what if you considered renting a suitable vehicle for the long
weekend or even week that you need it and then you don't have to worry
about a large vehicle when you don't need it. Initial price for
rental might seem high but think about running such a vehicle year
round when you only need it for say 2 weeks max. Course the other
option would be to have 2 vehicles, so now one sits unused most of the
year and still coast money. You would have to do some research and
you may find you have lots of other uses for a large truck but it is
worth looking at I think. Note too that a diesle engine would give
better milage both while towing and not; and is a better alround work
horse so if renting or buying I think it would try to get a diesle
truck.
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
I love those old sea story movies, black and white real old or modern
remakes. I very much injoyed the serious on A&E about Horatio
Hornblower. Do you know, approx when the movie might come out? Is it
a made for TV movie? ...
Thanks even if you can't answer my questions
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
remakes. I very much injoyed the serious on A&E about Horatio
Hornblower. Do you know, approx when the movie might come out? Is it
a made for TV movie? ...
Thanks even if you can't answer my questions
Andy Moore
Nova Scotia
Canada
> Speaking of the Rose, I hear she is being used in a movie as the
> Surprise in Patrick Obrian's "Master and Commander". The Surprise is
> a 28 gun frigate circa 1760-70. Talk about type casting.
>
Phil, do you have an automatic transmission? I pulled my AF2 out
several times with my 4 cylinder S-10 w/auto without any problems at
all, even on steep ramps.
A stick is harder, my Tacoma kind of had some issues, in 2hi it is
difficult not to spin the wheels when I let the clutch out. Pulls it
up the ramp just fine though.
You should borrow a boat and trailer of similar weight, and try to
launch and retieve with your Escort. (maybe with the owner standing
by as backup?)
several times with my 4 cylinder S-10 w/auto without any problems at
all, even on steep ramps.
A stick is harder, my Tacoma kind of had some issues, in 2hi it is
difficult not to spin the wheels when I let the clutch out. Pulls it
up the ramp just fine though.
You should borrow a boat and trailer of similar weight, and try to
launch and retieve with your Escort. (maybe with the owner standing
by as backup?)
--- In bolger@y..., "phillip_lea" <phillip_lea@y...> wrote:
> My thoughts run the other direction. My June Bug is too small so I
> am going to build bigger. But when Jim Michalak told me that a
fully
> loaded Norm's Boat would push the 1000 pound limit of my tow
vehicle
> (my Ford, Escort may have trouble pulling out at the ramp),
> postponement of anything "that" large was in order. Now I am back
> to thoughts of a more capable (sea/lakeworthy) Windsprinta micro
> camping daysailer where my wife and daughter can keep their seats
dry
> on a blustery day. Buying a new tow vehicle is a way to really
push
> up the cost of a plywood boat.
>
> Keep it simple, light, and cheap.
>
> Phil Lea
> Russellville
>
> > While browsing the New England Boat Show of overly austentacious
> > yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
> > I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well
> known
> > North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with a
> > picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said
that
> he
> > did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats.
And
> he
> > added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
> > response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
> > customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite
fond
> of
> > Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
> > has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
> > When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
> > sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to
a
> > customer.
> > David Jost
> > "licking his wounds"
Somewhere on the Maine coastal highway with a June Bug in tow, this
Arkansas boy stopped at a used wooden boat establishment where a
Herreshoff 12 and varnished lapstrake canoes were on display. I was
very aware of my humble status, pulling a Bolger plumb-sided plywood
skiff into a roadside exhibit of exquisite handmade craft. However,
I was taken aback when the owner offered sincere praise (in a
reserved northeastern manner of course). He helped tighten down the
boat's lashings even taking the time to cut some patches of
leather to protect the house paint finish. He acknowledged that he
had just sold a Bolger boat one week previous. I accepted his
business card (now long lost) and continued on to Mahone Bay for the
Great Boat Festival. Tough experience that you had. I hope that you
voted with your pocket book and bought your trailer elsewhere.
I like the idea of sailing around him when he trying to sell a
boatthat is great. Show him how fast a "fake" boat can be.
(Thanks Richard for the "Fake Boat" article).
Speaking of ostentatious craft, what about ostentatious dreaming.
Here we live in a small Arkansas River town (pop. 23,000), but the
magazine selection at our local Hastings (video, music, magazines,
books [in that order]) would have one believe that we were in Miami
or Chicago. We are greeted with "Yachting", "Passage Maker", and
"Hot Boats" magazines!? Give me a break, who buys this stuff! There
isn't one boat within 75 miles that is longer than the resident
Macgregor 26.
My thoughts run the other direction. My June Bug is too small so I
am going to build bigger. But when Jim Michalak told me that a fully
loaded Norm's Boat would push the 1000 pound limit of my tow vehicle
(my Ford, Escort may have trouble pulling out at the ramp),
postponement of anything "that" large was in order. Now I am back
to thoughts of a more capable (sea/lakeworthy) Windsprinta micro
camping daysailer where my wife and daughter can keep their seats dry
on a blustery day. Buying a new tow vehicle is a way to really push
up the cost of a plywood boat.
Keep it simple, light, and cheap.
Phil Lea
Russellville
Arkansas boy stopped at a used wooden boat establishment where a
Herreshoff 12 and varnished lapstrake canoes were on display. I was
very aware of my humble status, pulling a Bolger plumb-sided plywood
skiff into a roadside exhibit of exquisite handmade craft. However,
I was taken aback when the owner offered sincere praise (in a
reserved northeastern manner of course). He helped tighten down the
boat's lashings even taking the time to cut some patches of
leather to protect the house paint finish. He acknowledged that he
had just sold a Bolger boat one week previous. I accepted his
business card (now long lost) and continued on to Mahone Bay for the
Great Boat Festival. Tough experience that you had. I hope that you
voted with your pocket book and bought your trailer elsewhere.
I like the idea of sailing around him when he trying to sell a
boatthat is great. Show him how fast a "fake" boat can be.
(Thanks Richard for the "Fake Boat" article).
Speaking of ostentatious craft, what about ostentatious dreaming.
Here we live in a small Arkansas River town (pop. 23,000), but the
magazine selection at our local Hastings (video, music, magazines,
books [in that order]) would have one believe that we were in Miami
or Chicago. We are greeted with "Yachting", "Passage Maker", and
"Hot Boats" magazines!? Give me a break, who buys this stuff! There
isn't one boat within 75 miles that is longer than the resident
Macgregor 26.
My thoughts run the other direction. My June Bug is too small so I
am going to build bigger. But when Jim Michalak told me that a fully
loaded Norm's Boat would push the 1000 pound limit of my tow vehicle
(my Ford, Escort may have trouble pulling out at the ramp),
postponement of anything "that" large was in order. Now I am back
to thoughts of a more capable (sea/lakeworthy) Windsprinta micro
camping daysailer where my wife and daughter can keep their seats dry
on a blustery day. Buying a new tow vehicle is a way to really push
up the cost of a plywood boat.
Keep it simple, light, and cheap.
Phil Lea
Russellville
> While browsing the New England Boat Show of overly austentaciousknown
> yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
> I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well
> North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with ahe
> picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that
> did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. Andhe
> added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly theof
> response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
> customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond
> Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
> has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
> When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
> sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
> customer.
> David Jost
> "licking his wounds"
Well Dave, count me in on the messabout! As for whether I'll be bringing a
Micro, that's another matter. But I will try, and who knows, perhaps having
that deadline looming will allow me to make faster progress. I've been
plodding along, but as usual life continues to get in the way of
intentions.... last weekend I lost 2 days purchasing, and then installing, a
new water heater, to preserve both my own health and the harmony of my
marriage.... Still it's exciting to be putting tools to wood at last, and
momentum is building quickly! I hope my boat will be ready, but if it isn't
I'll build the dinghy (elegant punt, inspired by the test-drive at Champlain
last summer!) and at least have a Bolger boat to bring next time!
Paul L.
Micro, that's another matter. But I will try, and who knows, perhaps having
that deadline looming will allow me to make faster progress. I've been
plodding along, but as usual life continues to get in the way of
intentions.... last weekend I lost 2 days purchasing, and then installing, a
new water heater, to preserve both my own health and the harmony of my
marriage.... Still it's exciting to be putting tools to wood at last, and
momentum is building quickly! I hope my boat will be ready, but if it isn't
I'll build the dinghy (elegant punt, inspired by the test-drive at Champlain
last summer!) and at least have a Bolger boat to bring next time!
Paul L.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dnjost [mailto:djost@...]
> Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 2:54 PM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: insult to our collective egos
>
>
>
>
> Paul,
> We will be in Chatham the end of July and beginning of August.
> I hope to have Firefly done (or sailable) before then. How about a
> Cape Cod Messabout the 1st weekend in August? Pleasant Bay?
>
> David Jost
> "letting the sawdust settle around his gorgeous, gleaming, cabin
> hatch"
>
>
>
>
> >
> > admiring a bow and stern transom and two bulkheads and thinking
> he'd better
> > really get going, in his cavelike workshop on Cape Cod....
> >
> > > From: dnjost [mailto:djost@m...]
> > > Subject: [bolger] insult to our collective egos
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
wow! a Frosty! That Tom Leach design would fit right in here. I
spent countless hours tooling around in a Frosty, bondo blowout and
all. this Cape Cod messabout could be cool. Let me contact the
Harwich harbormaster and see if we can put something together in
round cove, Harwich. Perhaps the Pleasant Bay Yacht club can
sponsor.
David Jost
"getting warm all over thinking about hot chowder and tall stories
from the frosty crew" > --
spent countless hours tooling around in a Frosty, bondo blowout and
all. this Cape Cod messabout could be cool. Let me contact the
Harwich harbormaster and see if we can put something together in
round cove, Harwich. Perhaps the Pleasant Bay Yacht club can
sponsor.
David Jost
"getting warm all over thinking about hot chowder and tall stories
from the frosty crew" > --
> Susan Davis <futabachan@y...>
> I hope to have Firefly done (or sailable) before then. How about aIs this a private party, or is just anyone invited? I don't think
> Cape Cod Messabout the 1st weekend in August? Pleasant Bay?
I'll have my Paradox in the water by August, but I hope to have a
Windsprint done by then, and if not, I can unearth my old Cape Cod
Frosty (left over from my previous flurry of boatbuilding)....
--
Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
Paul,
We will be in Chatham the end of July and beginning of August.
I hope to have Firefly done (or sailable) before then. How about a
Cape Cod Messabout the 1st weekend in August? Pleasant Bay?
David Jost
"letting the sawdust settle around his gorgeous, gleaming, cabin
hatch"
We will be in Chatham the end of July and beginning of August.
I hope to have Firefly done (or sailable) before then. How about a
Cape Cod Messabout the 1st weekend in August? Pleasant Bay?
David Jost
"letting the sawdust settle around his gorgeous, gleaming, cabin
hatch"
>he'd better
> admiring a bow and stern transom and two bulkheads and thinking
> really get going, in his cavelike workshop on Cape Cod....
>
> > From: dnjost [mailto:djost@m...]
> > Subject: [bolger] insult to our collective egos
I'll bring my Sneakeasy down from Portland,Me to join the
procession!! I'd like to attend a messabout in Gloucester too if you
get one going!!
Steve Bosquette
procession!! I'd like to attend a messabout in Gloucester too if you
get one going!!
Steve Bosquette
--- In bolger@y..., "Paul Lefebvre" <paul@w...> wrote:
> Dave,
> I believe it was Elinor Roosevelt who said 'no-one can insult you
without
> your permission'.... Rather than an insult to anyone's ego, I see
it as a
> testament to that individual's lack of intelligence. If that's how
he does
> business, by insulting prospective customers before they can get a
word in
> edgewise, he deserves whatever he gets down the road. Imagine him
10 years
> from now, working at a seedy used-car lot, at night, in the chilly
February
> rain.... ;-)
> I went to the Boston boat show 5 years ago intent on building a
larger boat,
> and trying to get prices on the major systems - $20K for a diesel
engine,
> more for stove, fittings, etc. I even had the money at the time,
but all
> asked what kind of boat I had, and once I failed to spout the name
of a
> known, oversized, expensive, commercially-produced status barge,
they
> treated me as a waste of time (why bother to set up shop at a boat
show if
> you're gonna act like that?) so I haven't gone back to Boston - I
go to the
> Portland show in March and rub elbows with kindred souls instead!
Granted,
> there isn't as much money to be made from us backyard builders as
there
> would be from those with the will or ability to take out ridiculous
> mortgages on production boats and be dependent on those businesses
for
> overpriced maintenance, so perhaps these guys resent our lack of
dependence
> on their industry, and don't just dislike our taste in boat
designs. But
> little home-built boats still need certain basic services and
accessories
> provided by that industry, and I, too, will be shopping for a Micro
trailer
> and maybe a motor in the near future; if this business is indeed a
potential
> supplier of such things in our region, I'd appreciate it if you'd
send me
> (off-line) the name so I'll know not to patronize it with my hard-
earned
> dollars.... and let me know when you plan to visit him in your
Micro, maybe
> if it's late enough in the season and I stay really focussed, I'll
have mine
> done and trailer it up (on a trailer I buy elsewhere, or build
myself!) and
> join you in thumbing a nose at him! Maybe we could even stage a
Bolger
> messabout right there next to his yard... (Come to think of it,
wouldn't it
> be neat to have one in or near Gloucester?)
> Paul L.
>
> admiring a bow and stern transom and two bulkheads and thinking
he'd better
> really get going, in his cavelike workshop on Cape Cod....
>
> > From: dnjost [mailto:djost@m...]
> > Subject: [bolger] insult to our collective egos
I went to the Miami Boat show last weekend.
The star of the show was a 60' wood schooner about 80 years old, that
was not even in the show. The owner was kind enough to let people
walk through the boat.
----
A friend of mine accompanied me who only knows what salesmen have
told him. That fiberglass is the only way to go.
There was a gizmo that allowed you dry out your water logged
fiberglass hull in only one month as opposed to 3-4 months.
And then there was the life rafts in a case costing anywhere from
$500-2500. You need them because your fiber glass boat will not
float if it is holed unless you fill the cabin with foam. You also
get to pay $250/year to have them checked and repacked.
And then there was the 10' fiberglass dingy that my friend and I
could not pick up together. It was to heavy.
And then there was the boat that had stainless steel rod rigging.
The manufacturer seemed quite proud of the fact that the rigging cost
as much or more than the hull. I'll bet the salesmen liked that too.
"ALL" the boats had high aspect rigs with lots of rigging and most
had spreaders. In order to support that they of course had deeper
keels. There was not one stayless low aspect rig at the show.
I asked one of the salesmen what shoal draft meant on his 28' boat.
His response was 3 feet.
You have to remember, salesmen get paid on commission. Why would
they want a cost effective functional boat at their pier. I sure
would make it hard to sell some of the plastic monstrosities I saw at
the Miami boat show.
The star of the show was a 60' wood schooner about 80 years old, that
was not even in the show. The owner was kind enough to let people
walk through the boat.
----
A friend of mine accompanied me who only knows what salesmen have
told him. That fiberglass is the only way to go.
There was a gizmo that allowed you dry out your water logged
fiberglass hull in only one month as opposed to 3-4 months.
And then there was the life rafts in a case costing anywhere from
$500-2500. You need them because your fiber glass boat will not
float if it is holed unless you fill the cabin with foam. You also
get to pay $250/year to have them checked and repacked.
And then there was the 10' fiberglass dingy that my friend and I
could not pick up together. It was to heavy.
And then there was the boat that had stainless steel rod rigging.
The manufacturer seemed quite proud of the fact that the rigging cost
as much or more than the hull. I'll bet the salesmen liked that too.
"ALL" the boats had high aspect rigs with lots of rigging and most
had spreaders. In order to support that they of course had deeper
keels. There was not one stayless low aspect rig at the show.
I asked one of the salesmen what shoal draft meant on his 28' boat.
His response was 3 feet.
You have to remember, salesmen get paid on commission. Why would
they want a cost effective functional boat at their pier. I sure
would make it hard to sell some of the plastic monstrosities I saw at
the Miami boat show.
Dave,
I believe it was Elinor Roosevelt who said 'no-one can insult you without
your permission'.... Rather than an insult to anyone's ego, I see it as a
testament to that individual's lack of intelligence. If that's how he does
business, by insulting prospective customers before they can get a word in
edgewise, he deserves whatever he gets down the road. Imagine him 10 years
from now, working at a seedy used-car lot, at night, in the chilly February
rain.... ;-)
I went to the Boston boat show 5 years ago intent on building a larger boat,
and trying to get prices on the major systems - $20K for a diesel engine,
more for stove, fittings, etc. I even had the money at the time, but all
asked what kind of boat I had, and once I failed to spout the name of a
known, oversized, expensive, commercially-produced status barge, they
treated me as a waste of time (why bother to set up shop at a boat show if
you're gonna act like that?) so I haven't gone back to Boston - I go to the
Portland show in March and rub elbows with kindred souls instead! Granted,
there isn't as much money to be made from us backyard builders as there
would be from those with the will or ability to take out ridiculous
mortgages on production boats and be dependent on those businesses for
overpriced maintenance, so perhaps these guys resent our lack of dependence
on their industry, and don't just dislike our taste in boat designs. But
little home-built boats still need certain basic services and accessories
provided by that industry, and I, too, will be shopping for a Micro trailer
and maybe a motor in the near future; if this business is indeed a potential
supplier of such things in our region, I'd appreciate it if you'd send me
(off-line) the name so I'll know not to patronize it with my hard-earned
dollars.... and let me know when you plan to visit him in your Micro, maybe
if it's late enough in the season and I stay really focussed, I'll have mine
done and trailer it up (on a trailer I buy elsewhere, or build myself!) and
join you in thumbing a nose at him! Maybe we could even stage a Bolger
messabout right there next to his yard... (Come to think of it, wouldn't it
be neat to have one in or near Gloucester?)
Paul L.
admiring a bow and stern transom and two bulkheads and thinking he'd better
really get going, in his cavelike workshop on Cape Cod....
I believe it was Elinor Roosevelt who said 'no-one can insult you without
your permission'.... Rather than an insult to anyone's ego, I see it as a
testament to that individual's lack of intelligence. If that's how he does
business, by insulting prospective customers before they can get a word in
edgewise, he deserves whatever he gets down the road. Imagine him 10 years
from now, working at a seedy used-car lot, at night, in the chilly February
rain.... ;-)
I went to the Boston boat show 5 years ago intent on building a larger boat,
and trying to get prices on the major systems - $20K for a diesel engine,
more for stove, fittings, etc. I even had the money at the time, but all
asked what kind of boat I had, and once I failed to spout the name of a
known, oversized, expensive, commercially-produced status barge, they
treated me as a waste of time (why bother to set up shop at a boat show if
you're gonna act like that?) so I haven't gone back to Boston - I go to the
Portland show in March and rub elbows with kindred souls instead! Granted,
there isn't as much money to be made from us backyard builders as there
would be from those with the will or ability to take out ridiculous
mortgages on production boats and be dependent on those businesses for
overpriced maintenance, so perhaps these guys resent our lack of dependence
on their industry, and don't just dislike our taste in boat designs. But
little home-built boats still need certain basic services and accessories
provided by that industry, and I, too, will be shopping for a Micro trailer
and maybe a motor in the near future; if this business is indeed a potential
supplier of such things in our region, I'd appreciate it if you'd send me
(off-line) the name so I'll know not to patronize it with my hard-earned
dollars.... and let me know when you plan to visit him in your Micro, maybe
if it's late enough in the season and I stay really focussed, I'll have mine
done and trailer it up (on a trailer I buy elsewhere, or build myself!) and
join you in thumbing a nose at him! Maybe we could even stage a Bolger
messabout right there next to his yard... (Come to think of it, wouldn't it
be neat to have one in or near Gloucester?)
Paul L.
admiring a bow and stern transom and two bulkheads and thinking he'd better
really get going, in his cavelike workshop on Cape Cod....
> From: dnjost [mailto:djost@...]
> Subject: [bolger] insult to our collective egos
Must be because your boat is "fake"!
(see my duckworks article for an explanation)
(see my duckworks article for an explanation)
--- In bolger@y..., "dnjost" <djost@m...> wrote:
> While browsing the New England Boat Show of overly austentacious
> yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
> I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well
known
> North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with a
> picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that
he
> did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. And
he
> added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
> response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
> customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond
of
> Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
> has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
> When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
> sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
> customer.
>
> David Jost
> "licking his wounds"
opinions are like buttholes - everybody has one.
Mike
Mike
> picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said thathe
> did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. Andhe
> added, he would never take one of those in trade!
After being docked in Newport for most of last summer, the Rose is now up on
dry land being refitted for the movie.
Paul W. Esterle
Capt'n Pauley Video Productions
423.989.3159
S/V Bryn Awel, Columbia 10.7
Bristol, Tenn. USA
http://www.captnpauley.bigstep.com
http://pages.preferred.com/~pesterle/
dry land being refitted for the movie.
Paul W. Esterle
Capt'n Pauley Video Productions
423.989.3159
S/V Bryn Awel, Columbia 10.7
Bristol, Tenn. USA
http://www.captnpauley.bigstep.com
http://pages.preferred.com/~pesterle/
Seth Macinko told me a story (which I hope I have right) of standing on
the dock with a gentleman in the New England area who was quick to bad
mouth Bolger Square boats. When Seth pointed out the Rose, which was
filling the foreground, as a Bolger Boat, this individual refused to
believe.
Speaking of the Rose, I hear she is being used in a movie as the
Surprise in Patrick Obrian's "Master and Commander". The Surprise is a
28 gun frigate circa 1760-70. Talk about type casting.
HJ
dnjost wrote:
the dock with a gentleman in the New England area who was quick to bad
mouth Bolger Square boats. When Seth pointed out the Rose, which was
filling the foreground, as a Bolger Boat, this individual refused to
believe.
Speaking of the Rose, I hear she is being used in a movie as the
Surprise in Patrick Obrian's "Master and Commander". The Surprise is a
28 gun frigate circa 1760-70. Talk about type casting.
HJ
dnjost wrote:
>
> When I presented him with a picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that he
> did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. And he
> added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
> response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
> customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond of
> Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
> has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
> When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
> sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
> customer.
>
> David Jost
> "licking his wounds"
>
> -
The man obviously had his ego up you know where.
Keep in mind that when messing with boats you will meet every kind there
is.
John Brown
Toronto
dnjost wrote:
Keep in mind that when messing with boats you will meet every kind there
is.
John Brown
Toronto
dnjost wrote:
>
> While browsing the New England Boat Show of overly austentacious
> yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
> I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well known
> North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with a
> picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that he
> did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. And he
> added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
> response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
> customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond of
> Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
> has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
> When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
> sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
> customer.
>
> David Jost
> "licking his wounds"
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
FBBB --
Maybe it's the 13 degree flair, but I've never had anything but the
most positive reactions to both my teal and my scooner.
At the beach I always get help pulling the teal out of the surf from
love-struck middle aged men ("I always wanted to build a boat") The
really swoon when they see the fish flopping in the bottom.
In the lake the LSME is loved by the people who share the mooring
area those who live near it as well. When I parade her through the
more commercial area of Lake Montauk, it's all smiles and waves.
I'm getting itchy to build again and thinking a Birdwatcher would be
just the thing for me and my little girl. No doubt she'd get some
puzzled looks, but insults? Well I guess some people just have bad
manners.
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
New York, New York 10001
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296
Maybe it's the 13 degree flair, but I've never had anything but the
most positive reactions to both my teal and my scooner.
At the beach I always get help pulling the teal out of the surf from
love-struck middle aged men ("I always wanted to build a boat") The
really swoon when they see the fish flopping in the bottom.
In the lake the LSME is loved by the people who share the mooring
area those who live near it as well. When I parade her through the
more commercial area of Lake Montauk, it's all smiles and waves.
I'm getting itchy to build again and thinking a Birdwatcher would be
just the thing for me and my little girl. No doubt she'd get some
puzzled looks, but insults? Well I guess some people just have bad
manners.
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
New York, New York 10001
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296
I had mixed reactions, some liked my Frolic and though she was a beautiful boat and where envious. Yet, sometimes the sneers would happen as if I could not afford to be in their waters if I had to build my own boat.
Well too bad, it's my hobby and I liked my boat. I normally chose to hang with the non-snobs because they just where better folks.
Not to beat my own drum, but most of the people sneering, I could have bought their boat with cash and not had the huge mortgage they had to take out for their bleach bottle express.
As in the Wyoming, yes I could buy a boat and do the cruise. But it's not the money for me, there is something about the pride of ownership when you build your own and can then maintain on your own.
Can you think of anything more unique and beautiful than a Wyoming gliding into an anchorage with hardly a wake or noise. You can't buy that!
Let em sneer, it's their loss and our gain.
(Okay now I'm off the soap box)
Cheers!
Jeff
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Well too bad, it's my hobby and I liked my boat. I normally chose to hang with the non-snobs because they just where better folks.
Not to beat my own drum, but most of the people sneering, I could have bought their boat with cash and not had the huge mortgage they had to take out for their bleach bottle express.
As in the Wyoming, yes I could buy a boat and do the cruise. But it's not the money for me, there is something about the pride of ownership when you build your own and can then maintain on your own.
Can you think of anything more unique and beautiful than a Wyoming gliding into an anchorage with hardly a wake or noise. You can't buy that!
Let em sneer, it's their loss and our gain.
(Okay now I'm off the soap box)
Cheers!
Jeff
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It doesnt matter what you build, someone will have something negative to
say. I built a 40' Wharram, and that even got negative comments. Don Peters
say. I built a 40' Wharram, and that even got negative comments. Don Peters
While browsing the New England Boat Show of overly austentacious
yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well known
North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with a
picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that he
did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. And he
added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond of
Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
customer.
David Jost
"licking his wounds"
yachts, I decided to check out trailers for Firefly.
I was caught by surprise when I visited one booth of a well known
North Shore small boat brokerage. When I presented him with a
picture of firefly (dimensions included), he sneered and said that he
did not understand why anyone would build one of Phil's boats. And he
added, he would never take one of those in trade! Hardly the
response I would expect from someone whose livelyhood depends on
customers purchasing items. My ego was bruised as I am quite fond of
Firefly. (I took my first season's nap in her today).
has anyone else had this kind of humiliating experience.
When Firefly is done, I plan to launch her next to his yard and
sail circles around one of his boats as he is demonstrating it to a
customer.
David Jost
"licking his wounds"