Re: [bolger] Panga (como en BC Sur)
If someone wanted a vee-bottomed alternative to Tennessee (low power
requirement, long and narrow), they could have a look at the largest of these
designs. It's eighteen inches or so shorter than Tennessee and a little
narrower, but instructions are given as to how to increase the beam up to
20%. No lofting necessary and complete instructions given for building either
in plywood or sawn timber.
Howard
In a message dated 03-04-02 3:34:22 PM E. Australia Standard Time,
jhkohnen@...writes:
requirement, long and narrow), they could have a look at the largest of these
designs. It's eighteen inches or so shorter than Tennessee and a little
narrower, but instructions are given as to how to increase the beam up to
20%. No lofting necessary and complete instructions given for building either
in plywood or sawn timber.
Howard
In a message dated 03-04-02 3:34:22 PM E. Australia Standard Time,
jhkohnen@...writes:
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Not by Bolger, but nice fishing boats nonetheless:
>
>http://www.fao.org/DOCREP/003/W7260E/W7260E00.htm
>
>
Not by Bolger, but nice fishing boats nonetheless:
http://www.fao.org/DOCREP/003/W7260E/W7260E00.htm
http://www.fao.org/DOCREP/003/W7260E/W7260E00.htm
On Mon, 1 Apr 2002 19:16:17 -0500, Wade Leftwich wrote:
> Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in Baja California, casting
> for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in the bluewater. The
> most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot Clam Skiff, but pangas
> have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
>
> Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along those lines, or someone
> else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a gringo?
>
> I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about trailering down to the
> Jersey Shore.
>
> Wade Leftwich
> Ithaca, NY
--
John <jkohnen@...>
http://www.boat-links.com/
One must have a heart of stone to read the death of Little Nell by
Dickens without laughing. <Oscar Wilde>
You can vaccum bag it, which might seem like overkill
with a simple part like this, but with the right
yellow glue, you would only need an hour of running to
dry it, and you get the perfect bond. If you are
epoxying the whole thing anyway it should be fine.
Other than that, clamp the edges with epoxy in the
joint, and put a few heavy thing in the middle
______________________________________________________________________
Find, Connect, Date!http://personals.yahoo.ca
with a simple part like this, but with the right
yellow glue, you would only need an hour of running to
dry it, and you get the perfect bond. If you are
epoxying the whole thing anyway it should be fine.
Other than that, clamp the edges with epoxy in the
joint, and put a few heavy thing in the middle
______________________________________________________________________
Find, Connect, Date!http://personals.yahoo.ca
>My garage finally warmed up enough to make sawdust.A couple of things:
>
>I am making the leeboard for my Teal by gluing two 1/4 pieces
>of plywood together. What do you folks do to insure a good
>close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
>clamps, or both?
>
1) You can make the board out of a single sheet of 1/4, 2 layers of
1/4, or a single sheet of 1/2. All will be stronger than the tines. I
know because I've done all three and and the board rip off the tines
or just plain breaking the tines by driving the boat hard. (Picture
two full grown man hiked out on the weather rail of a Teal while
using a Sunfish rig in about 20+ knots of wind) If you use fir,
covering with epoxy and glass will make your paint job last a lot
longer, but isn't necessary for strength. Luan doens't seem to check
nearly as bad as fir. Don't know if it has a down side.
2) Between breaking, losing, or running over with my car, I've
laminated about a half dozen rudders or board and the only thing
that's worked for me is to use LOTS of thickened epoxy and screw the
two sides together. All attempts at clamping/weighting have wasted
my time, epoxy and patience. When I build the daggerboard for my
Light Scooner I ran a line of sheet rock screws all around the
perimeter and put a bunch in the middle for good measure.
3) As suggested both some others, glue first, cut second seems to be
a good idea. Much easier to square up to rectangular boards.
4) The Teal is an awesome little boat. Whatever you end up doing
you'll love your Teal!
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296
Light layer of glass may not help. I suspect that the elastic modulus
of woven glass/epoxy is such that the wood does almost all the work
if stressed along the grain. Unidirectional glass might be different.
However, I haven't done any tests. As you increase the thickness of
woven glass, it will increase the thickness of the board and
eventually will work harder.
of woven glass/epoxy is such that the wood does almost all the work
if stressed along the grain. Unidirectional glass might be different.
However, I haven't done any tests. As you increase the thickness of
woven glass, it will increase the thickness of the board and
eventually will work harder.
--- In bolger@y..., "rlspell2000" <richard@s...> wrote:
> Make sure the surface grain of the ply is running longways too. A
> light layer of glass will help also, if you are sticking with 1/2"
snip
see below.
--- In bolger@y..., "rlspell2000" <richard@s...> wrote:
> Make sure the surface grain of the ply is running longways too. A
> light layer of glass will help also, if you are sticking with 1/2"
This depends on the thickness of the surface plies. For luan, with the
incredibly thin faces it has, it's probably better to put the surface
plies crosswise and use the strength of the much thicker center.
Generally, as you use more layers of plywood glued together, thickness
of the surface plies becomes more and more critical. If a kind of
plywood has optimised surface ply thickness such that strength is
equal in either direction, then it will be half as thick as it should
be if you glue two pieces together. Same goes for stiffness, tho in
that case optimal thickness of face ply will be less.
> --- In bolger@y..., "GarthAB" <garth@b...> wrote:
> > What do you folks do to insure a good
> > > close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
> > > clamps, or both?
> > >
> > > hal
> >
> >
If you have enough thickened epoxy and a good fit, just a little
weight to keep the halves in place is ok. If you are using some other
kind of glue you will want to sandwich it between two flat surfaces
and use LOTS of weight. If you have a vacuum pump, throw it in a
garbage bag with a length of paper towels, seal with MoreTite, thick
caulk, or similar, and pump the air out for up to 15lbs/in^2 clamping,
which is certainly more than enough for most glues. That's what I did,
but I didn't get it into the bag fast enough.
> > Hal --
snip
> >
> > Also to consider -- maybe make this board 3/4" thick. I don't know
> > about the forces a Teal generates, but the 1/2" bilgeboard
> prescribed
> > by Bolger/Payson for the Windsprint failed me in a bit of a swell.
Compare length of board on Windspint and Teal. Stress will go
approximately with square of free length of board and with square of
speed of boat. I suspect proper orientation of faces will be
sufficient, but I don't know that.
snip
> > For glue-up -- try slathering the faces with glue, then tapping a
> few
> > small nails through the pieces to keep them from sliding around,
snip
> > The sliding around thing is weird -- you'd think gravity would be
> > more or less equal all around and your pieces would stay put, but
> > glued up wood finds a downhill where you'd never dream there is
> one,
> > and away it goes.
> >
> > All best,
> > Garth
I've seen this too. Maybe try tape to avoid nail holes? Some kind of
double ended short tack for same purpose?
Make sure the surface grain of the ply is running longways too. A
light layer of glass will help also, if you are sticking with 1/2"
light layer of glass will help also, if you are sticking with 1/2"
--- In bolger@y..., "GarthAB" <garth@b...> wrote:
> What do you folks do to insure a good
> > close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
> > clamps, or both?
> >
> > hal
>
>
> Hal --
>
> Richard has a good idea about cutting oversized and trimming after
> glue-up.
>
> Also to consider -- maybe make this board 3/4" thick. I don't know
> about the forces a Teal generates, but the 1/2" bilgeboard
prescribed
> by Bolger/Payson for the Windsprint failed me in a bit of a swell.
> The boat slid sideways down a wave face, and I heard a CRACK. The
> board snapped off right across the line where it exited the bottom
of
> the case.
>
> For glue-up -- try slathering the faces with glue, then tapping a
few
> small nails through the pieces to keep them from sliding around,
and
> then weighting liberally with cinder blocks, big rocks, etc. Put
wax
> paper under the whole assembly so it doesn't glue to the floor.
>
> The sliding around thing is weird -- you'd think gravity would be
> more or less equal all around and your pieces would stay put, but
> glued up wood finds a downhill where you'd never dream there is
one,
> and away it goes.
>
> All best,
> Garth
What do you folks do to insure a good
Richard has a good idea about cutting oversized and trimming after
glue-up.
Also to consider -- maybe make this board 3/4" thick. I don't know
about the forces a Teal generates, but the 1/2" bilgeboard prescribed
by Bolger/Payson for the Windsprint failed me in a bit of a swell.
The boat slid sideways down a wave face, and I heard a CRACK. The
board snapped off right across the line where it exited the bottom of
the case.
For glue-up -- try slathering the faces with glue, then tapping a few
small nails through the pieces to keep them from sliding around, and
then weighting liberally with cinder blocks, big rocks, etc. Put wax
paper under the whole assembly so it doesn't glue to the floor.
The sliding around thing is weird -- you'd think gravity would be
more or less equal all around and your pieces would stay put, but
glued up wood finds a downhill where you'd never dream there is one,
and away it goes.
All best,
Garth
> close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),Hal --
> clamps, or both?
>
> hal
Richard has a good idea about cutting oversized and trimming after
glue-up.
Also to consider -- maybe make this board 3/4" thick. I don't know
about the forces a Teal generates, but the 1/2" bilgeboard prescribed
by Bolger/Payson for the Windsprint failed me in a bit of a swell.
The boat slid sideways down a wave face, and I heard a CRACK. The
board snapped off right across the line where it exited the bottom of
the case.
For glue-up -- try slathering the faces with glue, then tapping a few
small nails through the pieces to keep them from sliding around, and
then weighting liberally with cinder blocks, big rocks, etc. Put wax
paper under the whole assembly so it doesn't glue to the floor.
The sliding around thing is weird -- you'd think gravity would be
more or less equal all around and your pieces would stay put, but
glued up wood finds a downhill where you'd never dream there is one,
and away it goes.
All best,
Garth
Cut them oversized, trim after glued together. For 1/4" sqeeze them
between a couple pieces of MDF or something. Put wax paper down so
any epoxy that sqeezes out doesn't glue your leeboard to the other
boards.
Use two or three cinder blocks for weight, or equivelent.
between a couple pieces of MDF or something. Put wax paper down so
any epoxy that sqeezes out doesn't glue your leeboard to the other
boards.
Use two or three cinder blocks for weight, or equivelent.
--- In bolger@y..., Hal Lynch <hal@c...> wrote:
> My garage finally warmed up enough to make sawdust.
>
> I am making the leeboard for my Teal by gluing two 1/4 pieces
> of plywood together. What do you folks do to insure a good
> close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
> clamps, or both?
>
> hal
My garage finally warmed up enough to make sawdust.
I am making the leeboard for my Teal by gluing two 1/4 pieces
of plywood together. What do you folks do to insure a good
close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
clamps, or both?
hal
I am making the leeboard for my Teal by gluing two 1/4 pieces
of plywood together. What do you folks do to insure a good
close fit of the two halves? Do you use weight (how much?),
clamps, or both?
hal
--- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY
> Viva la Panga! Not only do they use them in B.C, but also throughoutOne day some years ago I was fishing out of Pensacola in a 28-foot sportfisherman, and one of the guys boated a small mako that wasn't quite dead yet. We all sat on the bridge while the shark ate a couple of rods, and the gaff, and a good chunk of the fighting chair. If we had been in a skiff we would have had to jump in the water and let the shark have the boat.
> the rest of Mexico. Friends of mine in Puerto Angel go out as far at
> 30 miles for tibaron (shark). They asked me if I'd like to join them
> and I said I wasn't feeling well ;-)
>
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY
Viva la Panga! Not only do they use them in B.C, but also throughout
the rest of Mexico. Friends of mine in Puerto Angel go out as far at
30 miles for tibaron (shark). They asked me if I'd like to join them
and I said I wasn't feeling well ;-)
A Bolger version? How about the Diablo Grande?
YIBB,
David
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296
the rest of Mexico. Friends of mine in Puerto Angel go out as far at
30 miles for tibaron (shark). They asked me if I'd like to join them
and I said I wasn't feeling well ;-)
A Bolger version? How about the Diablo Grande?
YIBB,
David
>Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in Baja California, castingC.E.P.
>for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in the bluewater. The
>most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot Clam Skiff, but pangas
>have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
>
>Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along those lines, or someone
>else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a gringo?
>
>I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about trailering down to the
>Jersey Shore.
>
>Wade Leftwich
>Ithaca, NY
>
>
>Bolger rules!!!
>- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
>- pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
>- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
>- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester,
>MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
(212) 247-0296
Brucesboat does look quite panga-like, except that doesn't have the high bow
that seems to be favored in the American tropics, both Atlantic and Pacific.
Very nice looking, and a whole lot lighter than the Clam Skiff. (I would be
keeping the boat on the beach or on a trailer anyway, and do not anticipate
dredging clams or hauling lobsterpots.)
For my "intended" use, which would include some offshore runs, it looks a bit
low in the water; a Tolman Skiff, or a Tracy O'Brien Predator, or one of
those nice boats at www.bateau.com might be better.
But for the use the boat is actually likely to get -- putting around on
Cayuga Lake -- Brucesboat looks terrific.
Thanks for the tip.
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY
that seems to be favored in the American tropics, both Atlantic and Pacific.
Very nice looking, and a whole lot lighter than the Clam Skiff. (I would be
keeping the boat on the beach or on a trailer anyway, and do not anticipate
dredging clams or hauling lobsterpots.)
For my "intended" use, which would include some offshore runs, it looks a bit
low in the water; a Tolman Skiff, or a Tracy O'Brien Predator, or one of
those nice boats at www.bateau.com might be better.
But for the use the boat is actually likely to get -- putting around on
Cayuga Lake -- Brucesboat looks terrific.
Thanks for the tip.
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY
On Tuesday 02 April 2002 04:15, you wrote:
> Date: Mon, 01 Apr 2002 19:23:15 -0800
> From: Mark Albanese <marka@...>
> Subject: Re: Panga (como en BC Sur)
>
> This seems suitably Panga-like.
>http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/store/plans/jim/brucesboat/index.htm
>
> Mark
>
> Wade Leftwich wrote:
> >
> > Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in Baja
> > California, casting
> > for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in
> > the bluewater. The
> > most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot
> > Clam Skiff, but pangas
> > have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
> >
> > Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along
> > those lines, or someone
> > else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a
> > gringo?
> >
> > I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about
> > trailering down to the
> > Jersey Shore.
> >
> > Wade Leftwich
> > Ithaca, NY
This seems suitably Panga-like.
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/store/plans/jim/brucesboat/index.htm
Mark
Wade Leftwich wrote:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/store/plans/jim/brucesboat/index.htm
Mark
Wade Leftwich wrote:
>
> Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in Baja
> California, casting
> for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in
> the bluewater. The
> most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot
> Clam Skiff, but pangas
> have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
>
> Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along
> those lines, or someone
> else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a
> gringo?
>
> I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about
> trailering down to the
> Jersey Shore.
>
> Wade Leftwich
> Ithaca, NY
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging
> dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and
> punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip
> all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms
> of Service.
As you dougtless know, Bolger considers the Clam Skiff
etc... to be a V hull. That is obviously a bit of an
exageration, but about 10 years ago I wrote him to see
what he thought of the Clam Skiff as a Bonefisher, you
know a flats skiff. The question was sort of "do you
think I could get away with using the CS, or wouldn't
I be better off getting you to design for me a a real
Bonefishing skiff". He was all for my just adding the
decks, consoles, rod carrying gear in a Clam skiff.
The point is that to a certain extent a V hull is a V
hull, to a certain extent it is just an arrangement of
bouyancy. As regards that, you can taylor the degree
of V in a CS by just adding an extra layer down the
middle, if you feel that is where the Bouy, should be.
As regards the lack of V-ness, I think he regards
that as an advantage, in terms of construction, wear,
traillering, weight, bite in a turn, and so forth.
--- Wade Leftwich <wade@...> wrote:
<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in
Baja California, casting <BR>
for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin
out in the bluewater. The <BR>
most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot
Clam Skiff, but pangas <BR>
have a shallow vee and a higher bow.<BR>
<BR>
______________________________________________________________________
Find, Connect, Date!http://personals.yahoo.ca
etc... to be a V hull. That is obviously a bit of an
exageration, but about 10 years ago I wrote him to see
what he thought of the Clam Skiff as a Bonefisher, you
know a flats skiff. The question was sort of "do you
think I could get away with using the CS, or wouldn't
I be better off getting you to design for me a a real
Bonefishing skiff". He was all for my just adding the
decks, consoles, rod carrying gear in a Clam skiff.
The point is that to a certain extent a V hull is a V
hull, to a certain extent it is just an arrangement of
bouyancy. As regards that, you can taylor the degree
of V in a CS by just adding an extra layer down the
middle, if you feel that is where the Bouy, should be.
As regards the lack of V-ness, I think he regards
that as an advantage, in terms of construction, wear,
traillering, weight, bite in a turn, and so forth.
--- Wade Leftwich <wade@...> wrote:
<HR>
<html><body>
<tt>
Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in
Baja California, casting <BR>
for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin
out in the bluewater. The <BR>
most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot
Clam Skiff, but pangas <BR>
have a shallow vee and a higher bow.<BR>
<BR>
______________________________________________________________________
Find, Connect, Date!http://personals.yahoo.ca
Pangas are those 20-foot outboard skiffs you see in Baja California, casting
for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in the bluewater. The
most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot Clam Skiff, but pangas
have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along those lines, or someone
else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a gringo?
I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about trailering down to the
Jersey Shore.
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY
for roosterfish by the rocks or trolling for marlin out in the bluewater. The
most panga-like Bolger design I know of is the 18-foot Clam Skiff, but pangas
have a shallow vee and a higher bow.
Is there another Bolger boat that is a bit more along those lines, or someone
else's design that would be suitable for homebuilding by a gringo?
I live near Lake Ontario, and am also thinking about trailering down to the
Jersey Shore.
Wade Leftwich
Ithaca, NY