Re: [bolger] Re: pouring lead - lost foam process

There is more to it and here it is:



"Making the daggerboard

One of my design modifications was the centerboard.
Sharpies usually carry a drop type of board that is
hinged on an axle. Some sharpies have two (tandem)
boards, some leeboards. I modified the traditional
designs to use a ballasted daggerboard. I chose a
daggerboard because the clean exit from the hull and
the aspect ratio make it more efficient. Its small
slot size reduces lost hull displacement. A
daggerboard also takes up less room in the cabin.

I chose a NACA 0010 foil section for the board. I
built the daggerboard and ballast component before the
case so I could build the case to fit the board. It�s
hard to modify a NACA foil section, but you can easily
modify the case for a precise fit.

Basically, I followed the procedures outlined in the
Gougeon Publication 000-448 How to Build Centerboards
and Rudders. However, I modified this method by
ripping the strips to specific widths dictated by the
template. This saved material and minimized machining.
I also sawed a 1/2" deep slot in the ends of each
strip into which thin 1/8" plywood would fit snugly.
Thus, I was able to align the laminate during the
gluing operation (Figure 3).

Adding ballast

The daggerboard has lead ballast on the end. I wanted
to be able to hoist the board completely, so I needed
the lead to be the same foil shape as the board
(rather than a bulb shape). The ballast weighs 200
pounds.

I used the "lost foam" process to produce the ballast.
I first needed a foam plug the same shape as the
board. I glued foil section plywood templates to each
end of an oversized block of blue insulation foam. I
then wrapped thin piano wire around two wooden dowels
and connected the wire with alligator clips to my
truck battery. I pulled the hot wire taut and dragged
it across the templates, cutting the foam to the exact
foil shape in about 30 seconds. I added some peaks to
the top of the ballast to key into the board (Figure
4). Then I placed the foam in an oversized hole dug in
the yard and filled around the foam with Portland
cement, allowing it to cure for a week.

I had some buddies come over to melt the lead and do
the pour. We built a wood fire, added charcoal, and
supercharged it with my shop vac. We melted
miscellaneous lead scraps and wheel weights in an iron
pot cum crucible. (I was also using bread pans to mold
25 ingots at 35 pounds each for internal ballast.) The
foam plug vaporized as we ladled the liquid lead (over
600�F) into the mold. It bubbled, hissed and gurgled
for a few minutes, and half an hour later we were
digging it out of the ground. Light taps with hammers
cracked off the Portland cement, revealing the
accurate casting.

Using hardware bonding techniques, I drilled holes in
top of the lead ballast, and then bonded in 3/8"
stainless steel threaded rod (Figure 5). We know that
you can get about 1,000 lb. per inch of bury into wood
as well as lead, so my 12 threaded rods with 2 to 3
inches of bury was overkill. I prefit the ballast to
the board (Figure 6), before bonding the two with
epoxy thickened with 406 Colloidal Silica Filler.

Making the daggerboard case

Once the daggerboard was completed, I built the
daggerboard case wide enough to allow for clearance.
My unique approach to constructing the case allowed me
to complete all treatment to the interior before
closing the case. Of course, once the case is closed,
access is severely limited. I bonded the Okoume
daggerboard case ends to one plywood side producing a
1" radius interior fillet. For abrasion resistance, I
then applied a layer of 6 oz fiberglass. I also
glassed the remaining side that was not yet attached.
Next, I applied a thick 1/32" coat of 425 Copper
Additive. I used copper additive for several reasons.
First, it is very hard and takes abrasion
well�abrasion from potential rubbing from the
daggerboard over the years. Also, the copper additive
has some antifouling potential so it may aid in
preventing marine growth. From experience and testing,
we know that it will at least make the surface easier
to clean.

Once all of the interior surfaces were cured and
sanded smooth, I bonded the adjoining side. Then, as
with the frames, I prefinished the daggerboard case
exterior with WEST SYSTEM 105/207. "



______________________________________________________________________
Games, Movies, Music & Sports!http://entertainment.yahoo.ca
Got a feeling that the hot wire saw might produce a seam that would
repair itself right behind the moving wire. I don't think that the lead
would cool quickly enough for the technique to work. Suggest that the
chainsaw approach has merit. Kids stupid enough to eat lead chips would,
after all, be saving their parents all that money that would someday be
wasted on a college.
Jim

thomas dalzell wrote:

> What aboout a hot wire saw? Just melt that red hot
> wire through there. I sure wouldn't be sawing it up.
> Stuff is poisonous, and really is unethical to fire it
> all over an area that may in the future be played in
> by kids (don't know the specifics, just throwing out
> an as if)
> --- Langmuir <llangmuir@...> wrote:
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> they burried
> a blue foam plug in the yard, and then poured the lead
> into this hole in the ground burning out the foam.

There has got to be more to it than that. Somewhere in the Bolger
canon is a story about a builder who used a wood mold buried in the
ground. The lead leaked through a hole in the mold and dispersed
itself many feet underground. Not an EPA approved method, I should
think.

I think you would have to use the foam male mold to create a female
mold in casting sand.

In the book by the first non-stop single-handed navigator (Knox-
Johnson?), there is a description of how the his boat's keel was cast
in India. The process began with the shape produced as a male mold in
sand. I forget how it went from there.

Peter
I try to stay away from this stuff, but I like the
method I read about in Epoxyworks, where they burried
a blue foam plug in the yard, and then poured the lead
into this hole in the ground burning out the foam.
You would have to be careful about moisture.


--- elejon <jmcdan@...> wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>


<tt>
Gary,<BR>
<BR>
My experience has been that there is no common glue
which can <BR>
withstand the 600�F. molten lead.  Forget glue
and add plenty of

______________________________________________________________________
Games, Movies, Music & Sports!http://entertainment.yahoo.ca
What aboout a hot wire saw? Just melt that red hot
wire through there. I sure wouldn't be sawing it up.
Stuff is poisonous, and really is unethical to fire it
all over an area that may in the future be played in
by kids (don't know the specifics, just throwing out
an as if)
--- Langmuir <llangmuir@...> wrote:

<HR>
<html><body>


<tt>
Greetings Gary,<BR>
I cut up the lead ballast from my Long Micro (3ft x
1ft x 4ins) into 10<BR>
blocks<BR>
in about an hour using a Skill 7 1/4ins saw with a
carbide blade for timber.<BR>
Each cut<BR>
through the 4 inch thick lead took 5

______________________________________________________________________
Games, Movies, Music & Sports!http://entertainment.yahoo.ca
Greetings Gary,
I cut up the lead ballast from my Long Micro (3ft x 1ft x 4ins) into 10
blocks
in about an hour using a Skill 7 1/4ins saw with a carbide blade for timber.
Each cut
through the 4 inch thick lead took 5 goes on each side. If the foundry
wasn't about to close
I'd expect it to take 2-3 hours but it is possible and that's all you have
to know.

Regards, Gavin Langmuir.
----- Original Message -----
From: gbship2001 <gbship@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 12:52 PM
Subject: [bolger] pouring lead qesutions


> After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
> chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
> modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
> the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a way
> to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
> but it was too spead out and didn't melt. I tried cutting it with a
> gas powered 14-inch circular saw with a metal cutting grinding
> place. That worked wonders on the stainless keel skin but wouldn't
> hardly go through the lead, which is up to 5 inches thick in places.
> Anyone have any other ideas? There's only one local salvage place for
> lead and while the price is cheap, they may not have the 1,000 pounds
> I need.
>
> Also, I remember in some long ago posts people menationing some
> compound they coated their molds with to help the lead release.
> Anyone recall what that is and where it can be obtained?
>
> Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
> constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
> mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?
>
> A quick response is requested; I'll be pouring, if all goes well,
> Thrusday afternoon or next weekend.
>
> Thanks
>
> Gary Blankenship
> Tallahassee, FL
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Can you put it over a bonfire or serious bed of hot coals? Maybe that
way you can melt whole thing and repour directly or into ingots. Of
course
you will have to worry about mechanical support and plumbing that can
take the the heat, plus you should be very sure that if there's a
break in the plumbing it won't break out and run all over your feet.
Maybe do it in some kind of depresssion to catch the lead? This is a
place to be very conservative.
--- In bolger@y..., "gbship2001" <gbship@i...> wrote:
> After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
> chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
> modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
> the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a
way
> to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
> but it was too spead out and didn't melt. snip
>
> Gary Blankenship
> Tallahassee, FL
ISO 60 Folks, Here's a chance to ask about the wing keel layout. Clyde

gbship2001 wrote:

> After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
> chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
> modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
> the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a way
> to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
> but it was too spead out and didn't melt. I tried cutting it with a
> gas powered 14-inch circular saw with a metal cutting grinding
> place. That worked wonders on the stainless keel skin but wouldn't
> hardly go through the lead, which is up to 5 inches thick in places.
> Anyone have any other ideas? There's only one local salvage place for
> lead and while the price is cheap, they may not have the 1,000 pounds
> I need.
>
> Also, I remember in some long ago posts people menationing some
> compound they coated their molds with to help the lead release.
> Anyone recall what that is and where it can be obtained?
>
> Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
> constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
> mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?
>
> A quick response is requested; I'll be pouring, if all goes well,
> Thrusday afternoon or next weekend.
>
> Thanks
>
> Gary Blankenship
> Tallahassee, FL
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Gary,

My experience has been that there is no common glue which can
withstand the 600°F. molten lead. Forget glue and add plenty of
bracing and drywall screws. For form rigidity, I use 2X4's on edge,
held by screwing through the mold sidewall from the inside and into
the 2X4.

Let's just say that I've never seen a mold that was TOO rigid!

The high temp also makes even 1" thick OSB unsuitable for molds....
it becomes soft and pliable. I've had no problem with appropriately
thick plywood.

For 'one-shot' molds, I don't bother coating the wood mold.... the
limited charring has never been a problem. Besides, the smoke makes
the whole process look more impressive -- ha!

I frequently seal corners, crevices, mold imperfections, and small
leak paths with common drywall spackling compound. As long as it is
allowed to dry COMPLETELY, you'll find the compound stands up well to
the molten lead.....remember, COMPLETELY dry!!

Have fun, pour safely.

John

>
> Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
> constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
> mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?
>
> Thanks
>
> Gary Blankenship
Chain saw works like a charm, a small one will be fine. Do spread a
big tarp under all as the "leadchips" will fly, and a suprising
amount
of them. Wear protective gear and start with a NEW chain on the saw
as
it cuts a bit wider kerf than a used chain and will cut straighter,
keeping the bar from binding. Check and adjust the tension on the
chain often. Also use good quailty bar oil. Don't run the saw housing
and dogs up to the lead, the chips will load up and clog things up.
Holding the saw back a bit will give them room to drop out of the
way.

Watch out for the pieces you cut off when they fall, they're heavy.

And like John said, watch out for keelbolts, their nuts, washers, or
sometimes "J" hooked ends.

Rick




One problem is I can't salvage
> the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a
way
> to cut it up.
I think a chain saw (no kidding) was mentioned a long time ago as an answer
to cutting big chuncks of lead.

Abrasive blade is no-no. Try a carbide tipped wood cutting blade. Maybe a
plastic/aluminum blade.

WEAR FACE SHIELD.

Water glass aka sodium silicate. You can get it at McMaster-Carr, among
other places. Worked pretty good for the last small lead pour I did.

I would think mechanical fasteners AND glue. Glue to prevent runs, and
screws to hold it together when the softens because of the heat.

----- Original Message -----
From: "gbship2001" <gbship@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 05, 2002 9:52 PM
Subject: [bolger] pouring lead qesutions


> After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
> chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
> modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
> the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a way
> to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
> but it was too spead out and didn't melt. I tried cutting it with a
> gas powered 14-inch circular saw with a metal cutting grinding
> place. That worked wonders on the stainless keel skin but wouldn't
> hardly go through the lead, which is up to 5 inches thick in places.
> Anyone have any other ideas? There's only one local salvage place for
> lead and while the price is cheap, they may not have the 1,000 pounds
> I need.
>
> Also, I remember in some long ago posts people menationing some
> compound they coated their molds with to help the lead release.
> Anyone recall what that is and where it can be obtained?
>
> Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
> constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
> mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?
>
> A quick response is requested; I'll be pouring, if all goes well,
> Thrusday afternoon or next weekend.
>
> Thanks
>
> Gary Blankenship
> Tallahassee, FL
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
I've heard that you can saw up old lead keels successfully with a chainsaw.
Watch out for keel bolts, though.

As for coating the mold, you need some sodium silicate. Contact me off-list
and I'll arrange to get you some when you are getting closer to being ready.

JB


----- Original Message -----
From: "gbship2001" <gbship@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 05, 2002 10:52 PM
Subject: [bolger] pouring lead qesutions


| After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
| chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
| modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
| the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a way
| to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
| but it was too spead out and didn't melt. I tried cutting it with a
| gas powered 14-inch circular saw with a metal cutting grinding
| place. That worked wonders on the stainless keel skin but wouldn't
| hardly go through the lead, which is up to 5 inches thick in places.
| Anyone have any other ideas? There's only one local salvage place for
| lead and while the price is cheap, they may not have the 1,000 pounds
| I need.
|
| Also, I remember in some long ago posts people menationing some
| compound they coated their molds with to help the lead release.
| Anyone recall what that is and where it can be obtained?
|
| Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
| constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
| mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?
|
| A quick response is requested; I'll be pouring, if all goes well,
| Thrusday afternoon or next weekend.
|
| Thanks
|
| Gary Blankenship
| Tallahassee, FL
|
|
|
|
| Bolger rules!!!
| - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
| - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
| - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
| - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
| - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
|
| Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|
|
After more than a year's delay cause by some miscellaneous personal
chaos, I'm finally getting ready to pour the lead keel wings for the
modifications to my Bolger 30-footer. One problem is I can't salvage
the lead from the old keel for the new one because I can't find a way
to cut it up. Does anyone have any suggestions? I tried melting it,
but it was too spead out and didn't melt. I tried cutting it with a
gas powered 14-inch circular saw with a metal cutting grinding
place. That worked wonders on the stainless keel skin but wouldn't
hardly go through the lead, which is up to 5 inches thick in places.
Anyone have any other ideas? There's only one local salvage place for
lead and while the price is cheap, they may not have the 1,000 pounds
I need.

Also, I remember in some long ago posts people menationing some
compound they coated their molds with to help the lead release.
Anyone recall what that is and where it can be obtained?

Finally, although my mold is built, I'm curious how others
constructed theirs and how they stood up to the heat. Did you glue,
mechanically fasten, caulk the joints, and how did that work?

A quick response is requested; I'll be pouring, if all goes well,
Thrusday afternoon or next weekend.

Thanks

Gary Blankenship
Tallahassee, FL