Re: Modular Power Sharpie Concept
--- In bolger@y..., "brucehector" <bruce_hector@h...> wrote:
bulkhead that goes across the bottom, up the sides, and across the
roof in one piece (can be made of sub-assemblies). In this case if
the crossection was 6' tall by 8' wide, you could assemble two pieces
of 3/4" ply so that you have a giant solid piece of that size,
aassemble two in the boat side by side, and then saw the boat appart.
Glass everything in sight.
The ring part comes from the fact they would only need to be about 6"
deep all around the boat, except accross the bottom where they have
to be above the waterline.
> I don't know what you mean by a "ring frame", can you post a sketch?If you have a completely enclosed boat, the ring frame is just a
>
>
bulkhead that goes across the bottom, up the sides, and across the
roof in one piece (can be made of sub-assemblies). In this case if
the crossection was 6' tall by 8' wide, you could assemble two pieces
of 3/4" ply so that you have a giant solid piece of that size,
aassemble two in the boat side by side, and then saw the boat appart.
Glass everything in sight.
The ring part comes from the fact they would only need to be about 6"
deep all around the boat, except accross the bottom where they have
to be above the waterline.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Albanese" <marka@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 21, 2002 9:50 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Modular Power Sharpie Concept - Carrier
>
> You wrote,
> >What about a water train?
>
> Phil Bolger a has mentioned a, "Semi rigid hitch."
> What would that be like?
>
>
> Mark
>
>
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I'm glad you mentioned this, Stew. It throws a more technical slant on, "Semi rigid."
I had in mind something like a thick, rubber bar, or maybe UMDHW, that had a little shock
absorbing flex.
Just to pull a little cabin with a boat too small.
Mark
Stew Miller wrote:
I had in mind something like a thick, rubber bar, or maybe UMDHW, that had a little shock
absorbing flex.
Just to pull a little cabin with a boat too small.
Mark
Stew Miller wrote:
>
> Mark Albanese wrote:
> > Phil Bolger a has mentioned a, "Semi rigid hitch."
> > What would that be like?
>
> Some tugs have two horizontal pins sticking out of their hull, one to
> port and one starboard. These pins slide into slots in the barge, and
> are then locked in place. This is horizontally rigid, when turning, but
> allows the tug/barge unit to flex with the waves. I think this may be
> considered semi rigid.
>
> In the water train senario, I would think a tongue with omnidirection
> movement on one end and vertical movement only at the other would work
> fine. Picture the tow bars on the front bumpers of cars and jeeps, a
> ball hitch on one end and a horizontal axis hinge on the other. This
> system is used all the time on four wheel trailers such as hay wagons,
> freight dollys and double trailer semi rigs. It must be flexible to
> handle bumps and curbs or waves, yet rigid to keep the towee (vehicle or
> barge) from running into the tower (tractor or tug boat) when stopping.
> It also allows backing up, which a tow rope doesn't.
>
> Imagine what folks would think, sailing past a row of barges anchored in
> a cove. Tongues folded up on one end and trailer hitches on the other.
What about a shoal draft tug and a few barges
http://www.macnaughtongroup.com/bufflehe.htm
http://www.macnaughtongroup.com/hush.htm
A modular power sharpie could full fill all demands made but not as
well as one specifically designed for each duty. A jack of all trade
but master of none.
The next real question is how much time do I dedicate to seemingly
endless project when being on the water and enjoying it is my quest?
We must decide what really matters and where my line is drawn is
when I must get building funds from the Boss. Some things are
possible but not probable.
http://www.macnaughtongroup.com/bufflehe.htm
http://www.macnaughtongroup.com/hush.htm
A modular power sharpie could full fill all demands made but not as
well as one specifically designed for each duty. A jack of all trade
but master of none.
The next real question is how much time do I dedicate to seemingly
endless project when being on the water and enjoying it is my quest?
We must decide what really matters and where my line is drawn is
when I must get building funds from the Boss. Some things are
possible but not probable.
--- In bolger@y..., Stew Miller <junkmail@m...> wrote:
> Mark Albanese wrote:
> > Phil Bolger a has mentioned a, "Semi rigid hitch."
> > What would that be like?
>
> Some tugs have two horizontal pins sticking out of their hull, one
to
> port and one starboard. These pins slide into slots in the barge,
and
> are then locked in place. This is horizontally rigid, when
turning, but
> allows the tug/barge unit to flex with the waves. I think this may
be
> considered semi rigid.
>
> In the water train senario, I would think a tongue with
omnidirection
> movement on one end and vertical movement only at the other would
work
> fine. Picture the tow bars on the front bumpers of cars and jeeps,
a
> ball hitch on one end and a horizontal axis hinge on the other.
This
> system is used all the time on four wheel trailers such as hay
wagons,
> freight dollys and double trailer semi rigs. It must be flexible
to
> handle bumps and curbs or waves, yet rigid to keep the towee
(vehicle or
> barge) from running into the tower (tractor or tug boat) when
stopping.
> It also allows backing up, which a tow rope doesn't.
>
> Imagine what folks would think, sailing past a row of barges
anchored in
> a cove. Tongues folded up on one end and trailer hitches on the
other.
Mark Albanese wrote:
port and one starboard. These pins slide into slots in the barge, and
are then locked in place. This is horizontally rigid, when turning, but
allows the tug/barge unit to flex with the waves. I think this may be
considered semi rigid.
In the water train senario, I would think a tongue with omnidirection
movement on one end and vertical movement only at the other would work
fine. Picture the tow bars on the front bumpers of cars and jeeps, a
ball hitch on one end and a horizontal axis hinge on the other. This
system is used all the time on four wheel trailers such as hay wagons,
freight dollys and double trailer semi rigs. It must be flexible to
handle bumps and curbs or waves, yet rigid to keep the towee (vehicle or
barge) from running into the tower (tractor or tug boat) when stopping.
It also allows backing up, which a tow rope doesn't.
Imagine what folks would think, sailing past a row of barges anchored in
a cove. Tongues folded up on one end and trailer hitches on the other.
> Phil Bolger a has mentioned a, "Semi rigid hitch."Some tugs have two horizontal pins sticking out of their hull, one to
> What would that be like?
port and one starboard. These pins slide into slots in the barge, and
are then locked in place. This is horizontally rigid, when turning, but
allows the tug/barge unit to flex with the waves. I think this may be
considered semi rigid.
In the water train senario, I would think a tongue with omnidirection
movement on one end and vertical movement only at the other would work
fine. Picture the tow bars on the front bumpers of cars and jeeps, a
ball hitch on one end and a horizontal axis hinge on the other. This
system is used all the time on four wheel trailers such as hay wagons,
freight dollys and double trailer semi rigs. It must be flexible to
handle bumps and curbs or waves, yet rigid to keep the towee (vehicle or
barge) from running into the tower (tractor or tug boat) when stopping.
It also allows backing up, which a tow rope doesn't.
Imagine what folks would think, sailing past a row of barges anchored in
a cove. Tongues folded up on one end and trailer hitches on the other.
I don't know what you mean by a "ring frame", can you post a sketch?
I don't mean that the individual units should operate independently,
just float when detached to the extent that they could be left
anchored or moored to a float when not needed.
I've considered a male/female wedge shaped indentation/protrusion in
exterior chine logs and outwales made from 2" by 10"s, perhaps
secured with bolts and/or diagonal cables tighened with turnbuckles
or cam locks. I may have to make a half scale proof of concept to try
different fastenings, sort of a modular Sneakeasy with detachable
bow, passenger and stern power sections to see how it could all come
together.
How does the Break Down Schooner anf Insolent60 connect up?
I don't mean that the individual units should operate independently,
just float when detached to the extent that they could be left
anchored or moored to a float when not needed.
I've considered a male/female wedge shaped indentation/protrusion in
exterior chine logs and outwales made from 2" by 10"s, perhaps
secured with bolts and/or diagonal cables tighened with turnbuckles
or cam locks. I may have to make a half scale proof of concept to try
different fastenings, sort of a modular Sneakeasy with detachable
bow, passenger and stern power sections to see how it could all come
together.
How does the Break Down Schooner anf Insolent60 connect up?
You wrote,
What would that be like?
Mark
>What about a water train?Phil Bolger a has mentioned a, "Semi rigid hitch."
What would that be like?
Mark
What about a water train? Rather than segments that become a larger
boat with all the compromises, why not have a series of "cars". The
image of a train of pontoon boats may not be that appealing, but it
might work.
Also, for the aircraft carrier, how about a fast cat, like a wave
piercing ferry, it gets going at about twenty knots, you just land
the plane on it at near zero relative speed, and the whole thing
needn't be that large, Gold Coast has them from about 30'. On the
other hand I don't know how you fire off the plane.
The obvious answer was the old way in which a flying boat/seaplane
was launched and retrieved from the water. Having been in the FB
design business for a while, I like this idea. I can see the let-
down factor vs. a personal aircraft carrier, on the other hand, there
is something to be said about a boat with its own plane at a
practical level. What it did in terms of extending the reach of the
navy goes for tourism also. Imagine you are chugging down the
intercostal, with sidetrips to Okefenoke, and the Bahamas.
boat with all the compromises, why not have a series of "cars". The
image of a train of pontoon boats may not be that appealing, but it
might work.
Also, for the aircraft carrier, how about a fast cat, like a wave
piercing ferry, it gets going at about twenty knots, you just land
the plane on it at near zero relative speed, and the whole thing
needn't be that large, Gold Coast has them from about 30'. On the
other hand I don't know how you fire off the plane.
The obvious answer was the old way in which a flying boat/seaplane
was launched and retrieved from the water. Having been in the FB
design business for a while, I like this idea. I can see the let-
down factor vs. a personal aircraft carrier, on the other hand, there
is something to be said about a boat with its own plane at a
practical level. What it did in terms of extending the reach of the
navy goes for tourism also. Imagine you are chugging down the
intercostal, with sidetrips to Okefenoke, and the Bahamas.
If they just had a big ring frame at either end, which extended on
the bottom, above the waterline, then they could just be bolted
together. Alignment might be provided with a tapered flange,
creating a male and female ring frame interface.
I think making them separable operable would not be worth the
compromise, which would include bottom the shape of submerged
surfaces, and it would require having enclosed ends to the segments,
which even if removable for continuity when assembled, would be a lot
of extra building. I don't see much trouble with having them
assembleable on the water, but having them operate separately might
be a nuisance.
It would be fun to have them made up out of catamaran segments.
Lower resistance for motoring, and catamaran shapes can be hauled up
on a lifting trailer, then deposited on the ground, something that is
difficult with monohulls.
the bottom, above the waterline, then they could just be bolted
together. Alignment might be provided with a tapered flange,
creating a male and female ring frame interface.
I think making them separable operable would not be worth the
compromise, which would include bottom the shape of submerged
surfaces, and it would require having enclosed ends to the segments,
which even if removable for continuity when assembled, would be a lot
of extra building. I don't see much trouble with having them
assembleable on the water, but having them operate separately might
be a nuisance.
It would be fun to have them made up out of catamaran segments.
Lower resistance for motoring, and catamaran shapes can be hauled up
on a lifting trailer, then deposited on the ground, something that is
difficult with monohulls.
>Over at the egroup "Woodenpowerboats" someone came up with an ideaSuper conducting magnets!
>My biggest mind block right now is how to join the sections together
>in a solid yet easily attached or detached fashion while they are
>floating.
Keep your eyes on the prize, Bruce.
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296
Over at the egroup "Woodenpowerboats" someone came up with an idea
for an infinite power sharpie to be assembled at a messabout for a
world's record of some sort, longest boat assembled in 1 day sort of
thing.
This got me thinking, always a dangerous game.
So I'm thinking of a modular power sharpie with an 8 foot beam, built
up of sections that would all share a common fore and aft bulkhead.
I've posted a sketch to the photo section of this group in a folder
oddly named Modular Sharpie. MPS would be all the boats you need, as
you need them. Going out for a quick spin, just take the bow and
stern power unit. Want to have lunch afloat?, add in the galley and
dining unit. Company coming?, just attach the bunk house section. I
would want each unit to be independently water-tight, so when not
needed they could be anchored in a sheltered bay safely to save on
marina fees. It would be fun to license the 8' stern power unit, to
save on canal, park and marina fees and drive the licensing agents
nuts.
My biggest mind block right now is how to join the sections together
in a solid yet easily attached or detached fashion while they are
floating. Problems that come to mind are:
- lining them up as they bob and weave without crushing more than a
finger or two in the process.
- keeping them solidly linked while underway in a mild to medium
chop, this is not a blue water concept, but should be safe for the
intercoastal waterway and canals of the continent.
There's lot of great experience and finer minds than mine in this
group, so I'm open to suggestions. Several of PB&F's boats have had
folding or joing sections, so I hoping for some experienced and
workable plans.
Bruce Hector, thinking that if the concept works, then 5 or 6 larger
20' by 20' modules would make a great little ultralight aircraft
carrier.
for an infinite power sharpie to be assembled at a messabout for a
world's record of some sort, longest boat assembled in 1 day sort of
thing.
This got me thinking, always a dangerous game.
So I'm thinking of a modular power sharpie with an 8 foot beam, built
up of sections that would all share a common fore and aft bulkhead.
I've posted a sketch to the photo section of this group in a folder
oddly named Modular Sharpie. MPS would be all the boats you need, as
you need them. Going out for a quick spin, just take the bow and
stern power unit. Want to have lunch afloat?, add in the galley and
dining unit. Company coming?, just attach the bunk house section. I
would want each unit to be independently water-tight, so when not
needed they could be anchored in a sheltered bay safely to save on
marina fees. It would be fun to license the 8' stern power unit, to
save on canal, park and marina fees and drive the licensing agents
nuts.
My biggest mind block right now is how to join the sections together
in a solid yet easily attached or detached fashion while they are
floating. Problems that come to mind are:
- lining them up as they bob and weave without crushing more than a
finger or two in the process.
- keeping them solidly linked while underway in a mild to medium
chop, this is not a blue water concept, but should be safe for the
intercoastal waterway and canals of the continent.
There's lot of great experience and finer minds than mine in this
group, so I'm open to suggestions. Several of PB&F's boats have had
folding or joing sections, so I hoping for some experienced and
workable plans.
Bruce Hector, thinking that if the concept works, then 5 or 6 larger
20' by 20' modules would make a great little ultralight aircraft
carrier.