RE: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
While the chain component of an anchor rode does provide some chafe
protection from bottom obstructions, the primary functions are to
provide a shock absorbing action (long before the anchor line comes
taut, the chain has already slowed the shock) and to lessen the angle of
the catenary at the anchor end (this is not a substitute for proper
scope, but will maximize the effect of what is paid out).
Clearly, longer and heavier chain will aid the good effects. The best
weight and length are relative factors based on boat size and desired
ease of handling. My wholly personal approach is to take the
manufacturers' recommendations in hand, shake my head incredulously, and
oversize the daylights out of everything. The Admiral seems to concur
(although our last two big boats have had electric windlasses, so this
might not be a major factor), and she's in charge of ground tackle
management (despite what you might think about sexist roles, she
actually LIKES anchoring; to each their own, I guess...).
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: M Fx [mailto:mfxboats@...]
Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 1:49 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
This is more applicable to large ships than small
boats... but the vast majority of an anchor's holding
power comed from the *chain* rather than the anchor
itself. It wraps around rocks, sits in the mud, sand,
etc. It will sit there in a large lump, weighing more
than your anchor, or stretch out over a length of
seabed grabbing hold of everything in its path. So,
I'd advise using a rather small anchor with good
holding power, and bending to it 50 or so feet of
heavy galvanized steel chain- more if you sail in
deeper waters. For ships, the recommended scope of
chain is 7-9 times the depth of the water... not that
this is necessarily of use to small- boat sailors, but
it might give a bit of perspective...
-MFX
--- David Romasco <dromasco@...> wrote:
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- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
protection from bottom obstructions, the primary functions are to
provide a shock absorbing action (long before the anchor line comes
taut, the chain has already slowed the shock) and to lessen the angle of
the catenary at the anchor end (this is not a substitute for proper
scope, but will maximize the effect of what is paid out).
Clearly, longer and heavier chain will aid the good effects. The best
weight and length are relative factors based on boat size and desired
ease of handling. My wholly personal approach is to take the
manufacturers' recommendations in hand, shake my head incredulously, and
oversize the daylights out of everything. The Admiral seems to concur
(although our last two big boats have had electric windlasses, so this
might not be a major factor), and she's in charge of ground tackle
management (despite what you might think about sexist roles, she
actually LIKES anchoring; to each their own, I guess...).
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: M Fx [mailto:mfxboats@...]
Sent: Friday, July 26, 2002 1:49 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
This is more applicable to large ships than small
boats... but the vast majority of an anchor's holding
power comed from the *chain* rather than the anchor
itself. It wraps around rocks, sits in the mud, sand,
etc. It will sit there in a large lump, weighing more
than your anchor, or stretch out over a length of
seabed grabbing hold of everything in its path. So,
I'd advise using a rather small anchor with good
holding power, and bending to it 50 or so feet of
heavy galvanized steel chain- more if you sail in
deeper waters. For ships, the recommended scope of
chain is 7-9 times the depth of the water... not that
this is necessarily of use to small- boat sailors, but
it might give a bit of perspective...
-MFX
--- David Romasco <dromasco@...> wrote:
> I agree with Peter. I was sailing last weekend on a__________________________________________________
> 26' sloop with a
> neophyte sailor who was asking me to confirm the
> advice he'd received,
> namely that he needed a 4 lb Danforth with 50' of
> 3/16" line for a lunch
> hook....
>
> My aversion to small anchors is based mostly on my
> personal theory that
> the holding bottom has a constant state of solidity
> versus a varying
> amount of anchor weight and palm area/penetration
> (no formula intended,
> sorry). Small boats don't necessarily imply being
> able to use toy
> anchors.
>
> Of course, I had five anchors on my last boat and am
> rapidly adding to
> the collection on my two current boats, so take my
> opinion in that
> perspective. <G>
>
> David Romasco
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 2:46 PM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
>
>
> > Something I could use..
> > when...
> > the wind is blowing me towards Rhode Island.
>
> I don't know what you have against RI. It seems like
> a nice enough
> place to me, especially as compared to the empty
> North Atlantic (in
> the other direction).
>
> I have two opinions about anchors for smallish
> boats.
>
> 1) They are uncomfortable boatmates, all sharp
> points and awkward
> sizes. Whatever you decide on, have a bag, box,
> case, or whatever to
> keep it in so you don't fall over it, and the rode
> doesn't get
> tangled in storage.
>
> 2) Chain is a better boatmate than an anchor. Thirty
> feet of light
> chain at the anchor end of the rode may let you
> downsize the anchor
> itself a bit with no sharp points of its own.
Do You Yahoo!?
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-302>
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This is more applicable to large ships than small
boats... but the vast majority of an anchor's holding
power comed from the *chain* rather than the anchor
itself. It wraps around rocks, sits in the mud, sand,
etc. It will sit there in a large lump, weighing more
than your anchor, or stretch out over a length of
seabed grabbing hold of everything in its path. So,
I'd advise using a rather small anchor with good
holding power, and bending to it 50 or so feet of
heavy galvanized steel chain- more if you sail in
deeper waters. For ships, the recommended scope of
chain is 7-9 times the depth of the water... not that
this is necessarily of use to small- boat sailors, but
it might give a bit of perspective...
-MFX
--- David Romasco <dromasco@...> wrote:
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
http://health.yahoo.com
boats... but the vast majority of an anchor's holding
power comed from the *chain* rather than the anchor
itself. It wraps around rocks, sits in the mud, sand,
etc. It will sit there in a large lump, weighing more
than your anchor, or stretch out over a length of
seabed grabbing hold of everything in its path. So,
I'd advise using a rather small anchor with good
holding power, and bending to it 50 or so feet of
heavy galvanized steel chain- more if you sail in
deeper waters. For ships, the recommended scope of
chain is 7-9 times the depth of the water... not that
this is necessarily of use to small- boat sailors, but
it might give a bit of perspective...
-MFX
--- David Romasco <dromasco@...> wrote:
> I agree with Peter. I was sailing last weekend on a__________________________________________________
> 26' sloop with a
> neophyte sailor who was asking me to confirm the
> advice he'd received,
> namely that he needed a 4 lb Danforth with 50' of
> 3/16" line for a lunch
> hook....
>
> My aversion to small anchors is based mostly on my
> personal theory that
> the holding bottom has a constant state of solidity
> versus a varying
> amount of anchor weight and palm area/penetration
> (no formula intended,
> sorry). Small boats don't necessarily imply being
> able to use toy
> anchors.
>
> Of course, I had five anchors on my last boat and am
> rapidly adding to
> the collection on my two current boats, so take my
> opinion in that
> perspective. <G>
>
> David Romasco
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 2:46 PM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
>
>
> > Something I could use..
> > when...
> > the wind is blowing me towards Rhode Island.
>
> I don't know what you have against RI. It seems like
> a nice enough
> place to me, especially as compared to the empty
> North Atlantic (in
> the other direction).
>
> I have two opinions about anchors for smallish
> boats.
>
> 1) They are uncomfortable boatmates, all sharp
> points and awkward
> sizes. Whatever you decide on, have a bag, box,
> case, or whatever to
> keep it in so you don't fall over it, and the rode
> doesn't get
> tangled in storage.
>
> 2) Chain is a better boatmate than an anchor. Thirty
> feet of light
> chain at the anchor end of the rode may let you
> downsize the anchor
> itself a bit with no sharp points of its own.
Do You Yahoo!?
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Hi Dave
I have a personal preference on a small boat anchor. I dislike the
Danforth type because they frequently get stuff caught in the crux of
the flukes and you have no holding power. I bought a "Claw" which is
a knockoff of a Bruce. It is half the price and I used it on my 23
ft schooner and now on my Sneakeasy. It has never failed to hold.
It is one piece and I store it in a Rubbermaid tub with 100 ft of 1/2
inch nylon line. Like any anchor if you have a motor, reverse it
after setting the anchor which enhances the set.
FWIW
Steve Bosquette
I have a personal preference on a small boat anchor. I dislike the
Danforth type because they frequently get stuff caught in the crux of
the flukes and you have no holding power. I bought a "Claw" which is
a knockoff of a Bruce. It is half the price and I used it on my 23
ft schooner and now on my Sneakeasy. It has never failed to hold.
It is one piece and I store it in a Rubbermaid tub with 100 ft of 1/2
inch nylon line. Like any anchor if you have a motor, reverse it
after setting the anchor which enhances the set.
FWIW
Steve Bosquette
> > Their 'main' anchor is a 15 kilo Bruce with 100 feet of 3/8" chainWelcome to Canada (and presumably a bunch of other places), where
> > and 50 meters of 16 mm nylon multiplait.
>
> Feet, pounds, kilograms, fathoms, inches, meters, millimeters. An
> average of more than one unit of measurement per line...
they sell epoxy by the liter, and 4x8 sheets of plywood. How do you
feel about 400 grams of 3.5" nails?
Reason number six why politicians should never be allowed to travel.
On Thursday 25 July 2002 07:48, brucehallman wrote:
average of more than one unit of measurement per line...
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
> On their 33 foot boat, they carry five anchors and lots of chain: AFeet, pounds, kilograms, fathoms, inches, meters, millimeters. An
> 35 pound CQR [w/40 ft chain], two 15 kilo Bruces [w/100 feet chain
> each], one 7.5 Kilo Bruce [for kedging w/3 fathoms chain], and a 65
> pound Luke [a three part stocked anchor w/20 feet of chain]
>
> Their 'main' anchor is a 15 kilo Bruce with 100 feet of 3/8" chain
> and 50 meters of 16 mm nylon multiplait.
average of more than one unit of measurement per line...
--
Bruce Fountain (fountainb@...)
Senior Software Engineer
Union Switch and Signal Pty Ltd
Perth Western Australia
tel: +618 9256 0083
"P.S.
And this begs the question: where can one learn more about
the "Herreshoff three-piece"?"
If anyone is interested, I could direct you to Peter Duff (builder of the
Stone Horse, Shearwater, Dovekie... ) who has a supply of 3 piece anchors
that may be of a Bolger design. Leo
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
And this begs the question: where can one learn more about
the "Herreshoff three-piece"?"
If anyone is interested, I could direct you to Peter Duff (builder of the
Stone Horse, Shearwater, Dovekie... ) who has a supply of 3 piece anchors
that may be of a Bolger design. Leo
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This anchor conversation made me wonder about PCB's opinion about
anchors. His only writing about anchors I can recall is Chapter 33
of his book _The Folding Schooner_ where he writes:
"'Nobody should buy a stockless anchor under fifty pounds', I
muttered to myself (I'm libertarian and *never* say 'there ought to
be a law'")
He writes of the 'plow types' in which he includes Taylor, CQR and
Maxim [and I also guess he would include the Bruce type]:
"The plow turned out just as hard to clean as the Danforths with the
same habit of failing to take hold just when it is needed most."
His chapter goes on to describe his futile experiment to design
a 'better' anchor, and he writes:
"My present idea is that no anchor of any design weighing under
sixteen or eighteen pounds is reliable for even the smallest boat,
because it is too light to drive its bills into anything but soft
mud. Weight for weight, I judge the two modern anchor types are
almost if not quite as good as the traditional type with a short
scope. On all very small anchors, needle points and razor edges may
be the most important features for reliability when let go suddenly."
I understand that he means the plow and Danforth types are 'modern'
and a stocked anchor is traditional.
He ends the chapter thus:
"The immediate effect of the experiment has been that I have abruptly
stopped sneering at stockless anchors. If I stick with stock
anchors, as I probably will with Resolution, it'll be for a number of
petty reasons of which the most important is that it's easier to get
all the mud off them. My storm anchor will be some imitation of a
Herreshoff three-piece, because it will be stowed below decks and
will weight something like 120 pounds: I don't care to bring it on
deck in one trip."
P.S.
And this begs the question: where can one learn more about
the "Herreshoff three-piece"?
P.P.S.
I also just re-read the chapter about anchors in Annie Hill's
excellent book Voyaging on a Small Income. A very impressive book
[and chapter] and her two main points are 1) You can't have too many
anchors. 2) you need lots of chain.
On their 33 foot boat, they carry five anchors and lots of chain: A
35 pound CQR [w/40 ft chain], two 15 kilo Bruces [w/100 feet chain
each], one 7.5 Kilo Bruce [for kedging w/3 fathoms chain], and a 65
pound Luke [a three part stocked anchor w/20 feet of chain]
Their 'main' anchor is a 15 kilo Bruce with 100 feet of 3/8" chain
and 50 meters of 16 mm nylon multiplait.
The spare Bruce is to replace the first if lost, but also to loan to
help someone else out in a pinch. [Who for instance might be dragging
anchor and threatening to cause damage in a crowded anchorage.]
She sums up her philosophy: "...sooner or later you will be in a
situation where you would give all the money that you possess for a
decent anchor."
anchors. His only writing about anchors I can recall is Chapter 33
of his book _The Folding Schooner_ where he writes:
"'Nobody should buy a stockless anchor under fifty pounds', I
muttered to myself (I'm libertarian and *never* say 'there ought to
be a law'")
He writes of the 'plow types' in which he includes Taylor, CQR and
Maxim [and I also guess he would include the Bruce type]:
"The plow turned out just as hard to clean as the Danforths with the
same habit of failing to take hold just when it is needed most."
His chapter goes on to describe his futile experiment to design
a 'better' anchor, and he writes:
"My present idea is that no anchor of any design weighing under
sixteen or eighteen pounds is reliable for even the smallest boat,
because it is too light to drive its bills into anything but soft
mud. Weight for weight, I judge the two modern anchor types are
almost if not quite as good as the traditional type with a short
scope. On all very small anchors, needle points and razor edges may
be the most important features for reliability when let go suddenly."
I understand that he means the plow and Danforth types are 'modern'
and a stocked anchor is traditional.
He ends the chapter thus:
"The immediate effect of the experiment has been that I have abruptly
stopped sneering at stockless anchors. If I stick with stock
anchors, as I probably will with Resolution, it'll be for a number of
petty reasons of which the most important is that it's easier to get
all the mud off them. My storm anchor will be some imitation of a
Herreshoff three-piece, because it will be stowed below decks and
will weight something like 120 pounds: I don't care to bring it on
deck in one trip."
P.S.
And this begs the question: where can one learn more about
the "Herreshoff three-piece"?
P.P.S.
I also just re-read the chapter about anchors in Annie Hill's
excellent book Voyaging on a Small Income. A very impressive book
[and chapter] and her two main points are 1) You can't have too many
anchors. 2) you need lots of chain.
On their 33 foot boat, they carry five anchors and lots of chain: A
35 pound CQR [w/40 ft chain], two 15 kilo Bruces [w/100 feet chain
each], one 7.5 Kilo Bruce [for kedging w/3 fathoms chain], and a 65
pound Luke [a three part stocked anchor w/20 feet of chain]
Their 'main' anchor is a 15 kilo Bruce with 100 feet of 3/8" chain
and 50 meters of 16 mm nylon multiplait.
The spare Bruce is to replace the first if lost, but also to loan to
help someone else out in a pinch. [Who for instance might be dragging
anchor and threatening to cause damage in a crowded anchorage.]
She sums up her philosophy: "...sooner or later you will be in a
situation where you would give all the money that you possess for a
decent anchor."
Anchor wisdom--you have happened on one of my favorite topics. There
is no deeper metaphysical moment in all of sailing than when you
attach your vessel, which is designed to move on the water, to the
unseen bottom with a single thin line and walk away.
After anchoring quite often, and usually successfully, I have some
rules of thumb. One is obvious, be more conservative when the
consequences of failure are really bad--unattended boat, severe
weather, etc.
Another is to think about what you are trying to minimize as you size
your anchor gear--weight, expense, awkwardness of stowage, etc. For
instance, I want my lunch hook to be relatively secure, but easy to
retrieve (not too heavy) and I want it to work well over a relatively
short period of time. So I have a Danforth with no chain. The
anchor is big for a lunch hook, but the overall weight is light
because of the all-nylon rode. I keep a substantial hunk of chain
and some extra shackles in the bilge and it becomes a reasonably good
second main anchor with that attached (the chain probably weighs more
than the anchor)
If you want to minimize expense, the way to go is probably a larger
size of a cheap knockoff anchor. If stowage is an issue, you might
consider a small anchor of a style chosen to fit the space and more
weight of chain to help the anchor out. (If you unshackle the parts
for stowage remember to keep some wire ties aboard to mouse the
shackles.)
A couple of observations: I am a great believer in the good quality
Danforth-style anchors, but they have some real limitations. They
either take or they don't, it depends on the bottom consistency, and
whether they have been fouled by weed or a hard object like a rock or
a clam. Since they sometimes pull out and reset (or not) after a
wind or a tide change, they are unreliable for long term unattended
anchoring. Plow and claw style anchors have much less holding power
per pound of anchor weight and they creep through most bottoms, but
they rarely let go entirely and they seem to change direction more
reliably....
Oh, Help, stop me before I write a 10,000 word essay....you get the
picture.
Best,
George
is no deeper metaphysical moment in all of sailing than when you
attach your vessel, which is designed to move on the water, to the
unseen bottom with a single thin line and walk away.
After anchoring quite often, and usually successfully, I have some
rules of thumb. One is obvious, be more conservative when the
consequences of failure are really bad--unattended boat, severe
weather, etc.
Another is to think about what you are trying to minimize as you size
your anchor gear--weight, expense, awkwardness of stowage, etc. For
instance, I want my lunch hook to be relatively secure, but easy to
retrieve (not too heavy) and I want it to work well over a relatively
short period of time. So I have a Danforth with no chain. The
anchor is big for a lunch hook, but the overall weight is light
because of the all-nylon rode. I keep a substantial hunk of chain
and some extra shackles in the bilge and it becomes a reasonably good
second main anchor with that attached (the chain probably weighs more
than the anchor)
If you want to minimize expense, the way to go is probably a larger
size of a cheap knockoff anchor. If stowage is an issue, you might
consider a small anchor of a style chosen to fit the space and more
weight of chain to help the anchor out. (If you unshackle the parts
for stowage remember to keep some wire ties aboard to mouse the
shackles.)
A couple of observations: I am a great believer in the good quality
Danforth-style anchors, but they have some real limitations. They
either take or they don't, it depends on the bottom consistency, and
whether they have been fouled by weed or a hard object like a rock or
a clam. Since they sometimes pull out and reset (or not) after a
wind or a tide change, they are unreliable for long term unattended
anchoring. Plow and claw style anchors have much less holding power
per pound of anchor weight and they creep through most bottoms, but
they rarely let go entirely and they seem to change direction more
reliably....
Oh, Help, stop me before I write a 10,000 word essay....you get the
picture.
Best,
George
--- In bolger@y..., Stuart Crawford <scrawford@p...> wrote:
> It's also worth remembering the role chain plays in the working of
anchors.
>
[SNIP]
>
> on 24/7/02 7:32 AM, pvanderwaart at pvanderw@o... wrote:
>
> >> I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if I
> >> thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs.
> >
It's also worth remembering the role chain plays in the working of anchors.
Stuart Crawford
New Zealand
on 24/7/02 7:32 AM, pvanderwaart atpvanderw@...wrote:
Stuart Crawford
New Zealand
on 24/7/02 7:32 AM, pvanderwaart atpvanderw@...wrote:
>> I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if I
>> thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs.
>
> I'm starting to wonder what size I have for my Capri 22. I don't
> think it's as heavy as 20, but I do think it's pretty adequate.
>
> Looking around on the web, I seem most of the big name retailers have
> abandoned the Rule/Danforth product.
>
> Athttp://www.rule-industries.com/anchor.htmI find that the Danforth
> Standard comes in 9, 14, 16, and 25 lb sizes. Mine must be the 14 or
> 16. Their chart is a joke. It goes by boat length and ignores weight,
> freeboard, power/sail, etc.
>
> The question is, do you want to trust a Happy Hooker that cost 1/4 as
> much.
>
> Peter
>
FBBB --
I took a look at the Danforth and Bruce tables for anchors and both
advised something sub 10 pounds for my purposes. So figuring there's
only a minor penalty in handiness to go up in size a bit, and
allowing for the fact that what I got is a chinese imitation of an
older style (a navy, to be exact) I picked up a 15 pound K-mart
special. It appears to be made of steel, but I'm not sure it's not
just silver paint masquerading as zinc coating. One nice thing about
it is it breaks down into two very stowable and not particularly
pointy pieces At any rate, the price was right and it might work.
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296
I took a look at the Danforth and Bruce tables for anchors and both
advised something sub 10 pounds for my purposes. So figuring there's
only a minor penalty in handiness to go up in size a bit, and
allowing for the fact that what I got is a chinese imitation of an
older style (a navy, to be exact) I picked up a 15 pound K-mart
special. It appears to be made of steel, but I'm not sure it's not
just silver paint masquerading as zinc coating. One nice thing about
it is it breaks down into two very stowable and not particularly
pointy pieces At any rate, the price was right and it might work.
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296
I also have an 8 pound Danforth for a 24' tri, weighing 800#, and
with a 26' rig.- I am not expert on these things, but thought I was
being reasonably generous. I have a fairly large chain on it,
however. KH said I could probably get away with one of those little
Bruce anchors they use for the in-house demos! \
-- In bolger@y..., "jas_orr" <jas_orr@y...> wrote:
with a 26' rig.- I am not expert on these things, but thought I was
being reasonably generous. I have a fairly large chain on it,
however. KH said I could probably get away with one of those little
Bruce anchors they use for the in-house demos! \
-- In bolger@y..., "jas_orr" <jas_orr@y...> wrote:
> I use an eight pound Danforth with my Chebacco.
A light 10 lb Danforth or Bruce is fine as a lunch hook and in many
light duty situations. For overnight anchoring where you can sleep
with confidence and not need to stay up all night on anchor watch I'd
double that to a 20 pounder with at least 12 feet of chain. The more
the merrier. For serious anchoring it's the length of the rode that
does the work. Almost up and down is OK for a monitored lunch break
in sheltered water, holding you place in a storm calls for 10:1 or
more. To confidently anchor in 12 feet of water that means a rode 120
feet long with 12 of that being chain.
A folding/breakdown fisherman's anchor is a good second hook as it is
the only one that'll hold well in rocks or weed.
One of those large Tupperware type boxes sized to fit your anchor and
coiled rode would work well on an open boat to keep it all ready and
out of the way.
Remember to secure the end before you toss the hook overboard.
light duty situations. For overnight anchoring where you can sleep
with confidence and not need to stay up all night on anchor watch I'd
double that to a 20 pounder with at least 12 feet of chain. The more
the merrier. For serious anchoring it's the length of the rode that
does the work. Almost up and down is OK for a monitored lunch break
in sheltered water, holding you place in a storm calls for 10:1 or
more. To confidently anchor in 12 feet of water that means a rode 120
feet long with 12 of that being chain.
A folding/breakdown fisherman's anchor is a good second hook as it is
the only one that'll hold well in rocks or weed.
One of those large Tupperware type boxes sized to fit your anchor and
coiled rode would work well on an open boat to keep it all ready and
out of the way.
Remember to secure the end before you toss the hook overboard.
I use an eight pound Danforth with my Chebacco. I also carry a
heavier anchor, since the Danforth should only be marginal, according
to het books, but I've never had to get out the heavy anchor. The
Danforth has always held, despite being pulled up occasionally with a
ton of weed around it and once with a big rock jammed between the
flukes.
Despite its theoretical weaknesses, I've found this relatively small
Danforth very easy to stow and use, and reliable for my purposes.
Jamie Orr
heavier anchor, since the Danforth should only be marginal, according
to het books, but I've never had to get out the heavy anchor. The
Danforth has always held, despite being pulled up occasionally with a
ton of weed around it and once with a big rock jammed between the
flukes.
Despite its theoretical weaknesses, I've found this relatively small
Danforth very easy to stow and use, and reliable for my purposes.
Jamie Orr
--- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
> FBBB --
>
> I'd like to get an anchor for my Light Scooner, something I could
use
> as mooring on an overnight trip or drop when I've just experienced
a
> catastrophic rigging failure and the wind is blowing me towards
Rhode
> Island.
>
> Any thoughts on what would be a good size/style for such usage?
>
> YIBB,
>
> David
>
> C.E.P.
> 415 W.46th Street
> New York, New York 10036
>http://www.crumblingempire.com
> Mobile (646) 325-8325
> Office (212) 247-0296
> I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if II'm starting to wonder what size I have for my Capri 22. I don't
> thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs.
think it's as heavy as 20, but I do think it's pretty adequate.
Looking around on the web, I seem most of the big name retailers have
abandoned the Rule/Danforth product.
Athttp://www.rule-industries.com/anchor.htmI find that the Danforth
Standard comes in 9, 14, 16, and 25 lb sizes. Mine must be the 14 or
16. Their chart is a joke. It goes by boat length and ignores weight,
freeboard, power/sail, etc.
The question is, do you want to trust a Happy Hooker that cost 1/4 as
much.
Peter
I agree with Peter. I was sailing last weekend on a 26' sloop with a
neophyte sailor who was asking me to confirm the advice he'd received,
namely that he needed a 4 lb Danforth with 50' of 3/16" line for a lunch
hook....
My aversion to small anchors is based mostly on my personal theory that
the holding bottom has a constant state of solidity versus a varying
amount of anchor weight and palm area/penetration (no formula intended,
sorry). Small boats don't necessarily imply being able to use toy
anchors.
Of course, I had five anchors on my last boat and am rapidly adding to
the collection on my two current boats, so take my opinion in that
perspective. <G>
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 2:46 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
place to me, especially as compared to the empty North Atlantic (in
the other direction).
I have two opinions about anchors for smallish boats.
1) They are uncomfortable boatmates, all sharp points and awkward
sizes. Whatever you decide on, have a bag, box, case, or whatever to
keep it in so you don't fall over it, and the rode doesn't get
tangled in storage.
2) Chain is a better boatmate than an anchor. Thirty feet of light
chain at the anchor end of the rode may let you downsize the anchor
itself a bit with no sharp points of its own.
I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if I
thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs. I can't really defend
the choice, but I'm not sure I believe in the
smaller/lighter/stronger/more expensive anchor theory. They work
pretty well in the sand and mud that is typical of southern New
England, although I have had more than my share of failed anchorings.
Peter
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Bolger rules!!!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
neophyte sailor who was asking me to confirm the advice he'd received,
namely that he needed a 4 lb Danforth with 50' of 3/16" line for a lunch
hook....
My aversion to small anchors is based mostly on my personal theory that
the holding bottom has a constant state of solidity versus a varying
amount of anchor weight and palm area/penetration (no formula intended,
sorry). Small boats don't necessarily imply being able to use toy
anchors.
Of course, I had five anchors on my last boat and am rapidly adding to
the collection on my two current boats, so take my opinion in that
perspective. <G>
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 2:46 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: Anchor for a Scooner?
> Something I could use..I don't know what you have against RI. It seems like a nice enough
> when...
> the wind is blowing me towards Rhode Island.
place to me, especially as compared to the empty North Atlantic (in
the other direction).
I have two opinions about anchors for smallish boats.
1) They are uncomfortable boatmates, all sharp points and awkward
sizes. Whatever you decide on, have a bag, box, case, or whatever to
keep it in so you don't fall over it, and the rode doesn't get
tangled in storage.
2) Chain is a better boatmate than an anchor. Thirty feet of light
chain at the anchor end of the rode may let you downsize the anchor
itself a bit with no sharp points of its own.
I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if I
thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs. I can't really defend
the choice, but I'm not sure I believe in the
smaller/lighter/stronger/more expensive anchor theory. They work
pretty well in the sand and mud that is typical of southern New
England, although I have had more than my share of failed anchorings.
Peter
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
<http://rd.yahoo.com/M=228862.2128520.3581629.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705
065791:HM/A=1155065/R=0/*http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/990-1736-1039
-302>
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Something I could use..I don't know what you have against RI. It seems like a nice enough
> when...
> the wind is blowing me towards Rhode Island.
place to me, especially as compared to the empty North Atlantic (in
the other direction).
I have two opinions about anchors for smallish boats.
1) They are uncomfortable boatmates, all sharp points and awkward
sizes. Whatever you decide on, have a bag, box, case, or whatever to
keep it in so you don't fall over it, and the rode doesn't get
tangled in storage.
2) Chain is a better boatmate than an anchor. Thirty feet of light
chain at the anchor end of the rode may let you downsize the anchor
itself a bit with no sharp points of its own.
I'd probably end up with a standard Danforth (or imitation if I
thought the quality was there) of about 20 lbs. I can't really defend
the choice, but I'm not sure I believe in the
smaller/lighter/stronger/more expensive anchor theory. They work
pretty well in the sand and mud that is typical of southern New
England, although I have had more than my share of failed anchorings.
Peter
FBBB --
I'd like to get an anchor for my Light Scooner, something I could use
as mooring on an overnight trip or drop when I've just experienced a
catastrophic rigging failure and the wind is blowing me towards Rhode
Island.
Any thoughts on what would be a good size/style for such usage?
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296
I'd like to get an anchor for my Light Scooner, something I could use
as mooring on an overnight trip or drop when I've just experienced a
catastrophic rigging failure and the wind is blowing me towards Rhode
Island.
Any thoughts on what would be a good size/style for such usage?
YIBB,
David
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296