Re: long boat on plastic car
I think that the nylon tube stuff falls into the "etc." category, not
the shock cord category.
BTW, for tying down to racks, I find the nylon straps with a cam
buckle at the end are well worth having. I also sometimes use the
ratchet cinch straps, but I think they are a bit too brutal in most
cases. They do a nice job when cartopping several pieces of lousy
luan, tho.
the shock cord category.
BTW, for tying down to racks, I find the nylon straps with a cam
buckle at the end are well worth having. I also sometimes use the
ratchet cinch straps, but I think they are a bit too brutal in most
cases. They do a nice job when cartopping several pieces of lousy
luan, tho.
--- In bolger@y..., Mark Albanese <marka@h...> wrote:
> Not all schock cord is the same. For example, check out the 2500 and
4000 pound test,
> nylon tubed stuff at
>http://www.commonwealth.net/rockets/cdimisc.html
>
> Mark
Lincoln,
Good for you! I'm glad you found a way to go. ( I'll bet that route did take some
figuring. )
I think the end ropes are there mostly just for backup. The rack and cinching to it are
the most important element. I see all kinds of 17' kayaks goin' down the road without
them. Still, if it can be done, it doesn't hurt.
I've 'topped my 125 pound Windsprint with one of those old, metal tubing Quik-N-Easy roof
racks. I used to tie the boat down with more rope than really necessary. Before getting a
trailer, I reduced it to just heavy, rubber band type shock cord from the oarlocks to the
rack and another set all the way over the top, both snugged just short of deflecting the
bottom much, plus the ends. No bobbing, no weaving; it survives the trucks.
I basically use the same system + the boats own painter to fix it to the trailer, only the
quickeneasy roller is
bolted to that now.
After this discussion, I think I'd swap my cartop endcords for some rope though.
Mark
Lincoln Ross wrote:
Good for you! I'm glad you found a way to go. ( I'll bet that route did take some
figuring. )
I think the end ropes are there mostly just for backup. The rack and cinching to it are
the most important element. I see all kinds of 17' kayaks goin' down the road without
them. Still, if it can be done, it doesn't hurt.
I've 'topped my 125 pound Windsprint with one of those old, metal tubing Quik-N-Easy roof
racks. I used to tie the boat down with more rope than really necessary. Before getting a
trailer, I reduced it to just heavy, rubber band type shock cord from the oarlocks to the
rack and another set all the way over the top, both snugged just short of deflecting the
bottom much, plus the ends. No bobbing, no weaving; it survives the trucks.
I basically use the same system + the boats own painter to fix it to the trailer, only the
quickeneasy roller is
bolted to that now.
After this discussion, I think I'd swap my cartop endcords for some rope though.
Mark
Lincoln Ross wrote:
>
> That's not a bad idea, tho a shock cord is just a device for changing
> the oscillation frequency of the boat slightly. Lines to secure boats
> need to be fairly stiff. Anyway, I found that I could tie to the front
> suspension member (seemed like combination sway bar/ lower control arm)
> on the part inboard of the bushing, then lead up inside fender, between
> a couple of heavy plastic things, and out a "nostril" vent. Has worked
> well for 400 miles now, but I'm not sure what's due to the rack and what
> to the front ties. Rear ties maybe not necessary. Any one tie or strap
> broken has a back up, but there are only 2 straps and 3 pieces of rope.
> Mark wrote:
> > rnlocnil wrote:
> > > The trailer hitch is a good idea for those with the budget for it.
> >
> > You may have solved the problem for yourself by now, but thinking how to solve one of my
> > own very different transport problems I had a thought for you.
> >
> > For the Saturn's rear, why not just drill a whole in about the right place for a frame
> > hitch, then hook a shock cord into that. That should be close enough to reach without much
> > fuss. In front, just lead the guy line all the way back if you have to. If cinched well to
> > the rack in the first place, you'll be safe enough. Then head out to the lake!
> >
> > Mark
> >
>
> --
> Lincoln Ross
> NOTE ADDRESS CHANGE:
>lincolnr@...
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Talk about distracting links!!! Hiding that one from my sons all right,
and myself.
HJ
Mark Albanese wrote:
and myself.
HJ
Mark Albanese wrote:
>
> Not all schock cord is the same. For example, check out the 2500 and 4000 pound test,
> nylon tubed stuff at
>http://www.commonwealth.net/rockets/cdimisc.html
>
> Mark
>
> --
Not all schock cord is the same. For example, check out the 2500 and 4000 pound test,
nylon tubed stuff at
http://www.commonwealth.net/rockets/cdimisc.html
Mark
nylon tubed stuff at
http://www.commonwealth.net/rockets/cdimisc.html
Mark
That's not a bad idea, tho a shock cord is just a device for changing
the oscillation frequency of the boat slightly. Lines to secure boats
need to be fairly stiff. Anyway, I found that I could tie to the front
suspension member (seemed like combination sway bar/ lower control arm)
on the part inboard of the bushing, then lead up inside fender, between
a couple of heavy plastic things, and out a "nostril" vent. Has worked
well for 400 miles now, but I'm not sure what's due to the rack and what
to the front ties. Rear ties maybe not necessary. Any one tie or strap
broken has a back up, but there are only 2 straps and 3 pieces of rope.
Mark wrote:
Lincoln Ross
NOTE ADDRESS CHANGE:
lincolnr@...
the oscillation frequency of the boat slightly. Lines to secure boats
need to be fairly stiff. Anyway, I found that I could tie to the front
suspension member (seemed like combination sway bar/ lower control arm)
on the part inboard of the bushing, then lead up inside fender, between
a couple of heavy plastic things, and out a "nostril" vent. Has worked
well for 400 miles now, but I'm not sure what's due to the rack and what
to the front ties. Rear ties maybe not necessary. Any one tie or strap
broken has a back up, but there are only 2 straps and 3 pieces of rope.
Mark wrote:
> rnlocnil wrote:--
> > The trailer hitch is a good idea for those with the budget for it.
>
> You may have solved the problem for yourself by now, but thinking how to solve one of my
> own very different transport problems I had a thought for you.
>
> For the Saturn's rear, why not just drill a whole in about the right place for a frame
> hitch, then hook a shock cord into that. That should be close enough to reach without much
> fuss. In front, just lead the guy line all the way back if you have to. If cinched well to
> the rack in the first place, you'll be safe enough. Then head out to the lake!
>
> Mark
>
Lincoln Ross
NOTE ADDRESS CHANGE:
lincolnr@...
Bill,
I guess I am what you'd call a fair weather cartopper. Still, if I can grab the boat and
shake the whole car down to it roots repeatedly without shifting, it seems tight enough
for most purposes here. I _am_ obsessive about checking it all every now and then.
The hole in the Saturn frame would also work with line if it had a hook bent on and with
an adjustable part in the middle. An 'A' with legs to either side would work in both directions.
Mark
wmrpage@...wrote:
I guess I am what you'd call a fair weather cartopper. Still, if I can grab the boat and
shake the whole car down to it roots repeatedly without shifting, it seems tight enough
for most purposes here. I _am_ obsessive about checking it all every now and then.
The hole in the Saturn frame would also work with line if it had a hook bent on and with
an adjustable part in the middle. An 'A' with legs to either side would work in both directions.
Mark
wmrpage@...wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/16/02 6:24:28 PM Central Daylight Time,
>marka@...writes:
>
> > then hook a shock cord into that.
>
> I do not believe that there is any virtue or wisdom in using elastic cord as
> a primary, secondary or tertiary hold-down on a car-topped boat. The last
> thing you want while cruising at 65+ mph into a storm front with a 17' canoe
> on top of your car is to have the boat start to develop its independent
> aerodynamic behavior because it has some degrees of freedom of motion.
>
> Every boat and car is a different proposition, but (IMHO) you want the boat
> cinched down tight. This requires suitably firm attachment points, and
> perhaps clever strap routing on newer cars, as well as suitable attachment
> locations on the boat, so you don't strain it with loads it was not intended
> to handle. 3/8"-1/2" Nylon rope is stretchy enough to allow you to pre-load
> the ropes so that the boat will stay put. Anything "stretchier" is an
> invitation for trouble.
>
> Ciao for Niao,
> Bill in MN
> >
In a message dated 8/16/02 6:24:28 PM Central Daylight Time,
marka@...writes:
a primary, secondary or tertiary hold-down on a car-topped boat. The last
thing you want while cruising at 65+ mph into a storm front with a 17' canoe
on top of your car is to have the boat start to develop its independent
aerodynamic behavior because it has some degrees of freedom of motion.
Every boat and car is a different proposition, but (IMHO) you want the boat
cinched down tight. This requires suitably firm attachment points, and
perhaps clever strap routing on newer cars, as well as suitable attachment
locations on the boat, so you don't strain it with loads it was not intended
to handle. 3/8"-1/2" Nylon rope is stretchy enough to allow you to pre-load
the ropes so that the boat will stay put. Anything "stretchier" is an
invitation for trouble.
Ciao for Niao,
Bill in MN
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
marka@...writes:
> then hook a shock cord into that.I do not believe that there is any virtue or wisdom in using elastic cord as
a primary, secondary or tertiary hold-down on a car-topped boat. The last
thing you want while cruising at 65+ mph into a storm front with a 17' canoe
on top of your car is to have the boat start to develop its independent
aerodynamic behavior because it has some degrees of freedom of motion.
Every boat and car is a different proposition, but (IMHO) you want the boat
cinched down tight. This requires suitably firm attachment points, and
perhaps clever strap routing on newer cars, as well as suitable attachment
locations on the boat, so you don't strain it with loads it was not intended
to handle. 3/8"-1/2" Nylon rope is stretchy enough to allow you to pre-load
the ropes so that the boat will stay put. Anything "stretchier" is an
invitation for trouble.
Ciao for Niao,
Bill in MN
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> For the Saturn's rear, why not just drill a whole in about the right place for a frameIf they are off the centerline, run _both_ on the passenger side of the car.
> hitch, then hook a shock cord into that. In front, just lead the guy line all the way back if you have to.
rnlocnil wrote:
own very different transport problems I had a thought for you.
For the Saturn's rear, why not just drill a whole in about the right place for a frame
hitch, then hook a shock cord into that. That should be close enough to reach without much
fuss. In front, just lead the guy line all the way back if you have to. If cinched well to
the rack in the first place, you'll be safe enough. Then head out to the lake!
Mark
> The trailer hitch is a good idea for those with the budget for it.You may have solved the problem for yourself by now, but thinking how to solve one of my
own very different transport problems I had a thought for you.
For the Saturn's rear, why not just drill a whole in about the right place for a frame
hitch, then hook a shock cord into that. That should be close enough to reach without much
fuss. In front, just lead the guy line all the way back if you have to. If cinched well to
the rack in the first place, you'll be safe enough. Then head out to the lake!
Mark
Even if I trusted the suction cups, the body work is plastic and quite
floppy. Interesting idea, though. I already have a good roof rack.
Thanks for the idea.
floppy. Interesting idea, though. I already have a good roof rack.
Thanks for the idea.
--- In bolger@y..., "announcer97624" <caj@k...> wrote:
> I was going to suggest some large suction cups I saw in a RV
> magazine. They were for that exact problem plus the had a low
profile
> rack for the roof to stop the scratch hazard with suction cups also.
snip
I was going to suggest some large suction cups I saw in a RV
magazine. They were for that exact problem plus the had a low profile
rack for the roof to stop the scratch hazard with suction cups also.
My buddy in the glass business told me that he has used similar units
for carrying glass for years and he has used his for pulling small
dents from his wife's car.
I think Bruce's idea will be much less expensive. You can always get
a foam pad for the roof, blankets tend to flap and scratch the paint
surface if you travel any distance.
magazine. They were for that exact problem plus the had a low profile
rack for the roof to stop the scratch hazard with suction cups also.
My buddy in the glass business told me that he has used similar units
for carrying glass for years and he has used his for pulling small
dents from his wife's car.
I think Bruce's idea will be much less expensive. You can always get
a foam pad for the roof, blankets tend to flap and scratch the paint
surface if you travel any distance.
--- In bolger@y..., "brucehallman" <brucehallman@y...> wrote:
> --- In bolger@y..., Mark Albanese <marka@h...> wrote:
> > >Maybe somebody else has a bow idea.
>
> A few years back someone in MAIB described this method:
>
> Open the hood and locate some strong looking bolts, in my car the
> fender is bolted to the engine well about every 8 inches with 3/8"
> bolts. Take two lengths of nylon strapping and melt two 3/8" holes
> in each, and connect to car with the fender bolts. These straps
can
> then loop outside the engine compartment with the hood close. I
> attach to these loops with 'blue strap' ratcheting web straps.
>
> I put them both on the front and the back.
>
> See a picture at
>http://www.hallman.org/bolger/micro/day01/01.jpg
In a message dated 8/11/02 12:08:17 PM Central Daylight Time,
brucehallman@...writes:
it when I have to replace my 20 yr. old import with a newer plastic car!
Ciao for Niao,
Bill in MN
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
brucehallman@...writes:
> A few years back someone in MAIB described this method:I'm impressed!! Thanks for sharing. I need to file this away where I'll find
>
> Open the hood and locate some strong looking bolts
it when I have to replace my 20 yr. old import with a newer plastic car!
Ciao for Niao,
Bill in MN
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- In bolger@y..., Mark Albanese <marka@h...> wrote:
Open the hood and locate some strong looking bolts, in my car the
fender is bolted to the engine well about every 8 inches with 3/8"
bolts. Take two lengths of nylon strapping and melt two 3/8" holes
in each, and connect to car with the fender bolts. These straps can
then loop outside the engine compartment with the hood close. I
attach to these loops with 'blue strap' ratcheting web straps.
I put them both on the front and the back.
See a picture at
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/micro/day01/01.jpg
> >Maybe somebody else has a bow idea.A few years back someone in MAIB described this method:
Open the hood and locate some strong looking bolts, in my car the
fender is bolted to the engine well about every 8 inches with 3/8"
bolts. Take two lengths of nylon strapping and melt two 3/8" holes
in each, and connect to car with the fender bolts. These straps can
then loop outside the engine compartment with the hood close. I
attach to these loops with 'blue strap' ratcheting web straps.
I put them both on the front and the back.
See a picture at
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/micro/day01/01.jpg
see below
--- In bolger@y..., Mark Albanese <marka@h...> wrote:
snip> I just went
> around the metal bumper and hooked them from behind. Just fiddled
combining lengths a bit
> to get the perfect tension.
Nice to have a metal bumper that you can lead things around. It's
buried very deep in the Saturn.
>
> One wouldn't go so far as to have to get all the way underneath the
car each time to find
> them, but the Saturn might have someplace handy to grab a metal hook
down under.
>
> Mark
If there's anything solid to tie to, it will definitely involve
crawling around under the car or else threatening the integrity of the
hood or trunk. THat's why I asked. I've done a good deal of crawling
around already and have found one spot close to the edge off center in
the back. Everything else seems further under than I'd like, as it
gives the ropes more room to slide sideways. The aero guys did some
good work on the Saturn and there are various plastic doohickeys to
make the air go where they want under the nose. I'm surprised the
thing doesn't get even better mileage than it does.
The trailer hitch is a good idea for those with the budget for it.
Maybe when I get a job...
> You can buy a mount from Saturn for a towing hitch that will stick outYes, right.
> from the back and give you a stern line purchase.
>Maybe somebody else has a bow idea.I put a few miles with a Windsprint atop a decent sized car and high strength rack, using
ganged up schock cords for each end. It steadied that one, but only up to 55. I just went
around the metal bumper and hooked them from behind. Just fiddled combining lengths a bit
to get the perfect tension.
One wouldn't go so far as to have to get all the way underneath the car each time to find
them, but the Saturn might have someplace handy to grab a metal hook down under.
Mark
You can buy a mount from Saturn for a towing hitch that will stick out
from the back and give you a stern line purchase. Maybe somebody else
has a bow idea.
Call Saturn, I bet you are not the first with the problem.
HJ
rnlocnil wrote:
from the back and give you a stern line purchase. Maybe somebody else
has a bow idea.
Call Saturn, I bet you are not the first with the problem.
HJ
rnlocnil wrote:
>
> Anyone have any tips on how to secure bow and stern on 14' boat on top
> of '93 Saturn SL? Saturn seems to have hidden anything substantial way
> under or inside the car. Anything that's easy to grab is plastic and
> floppy!
>
>
Anyone have any tips on how to secure bow and stern on 14' boat on top
of '93 Saturn SL? Saturn seems to have hidden anything substantial way
under or inside the car. Anything that's easy to grab is plastic and
floppy!
of '93 Saturn SL? Saturn seems to have hidden anything substantial way
under or inside the car. Anything that's easy to grab is plastic and
floppy!