Re: WDJ Ballast problem and solution
My solution would be to make a top sealed much like Frank has said
but with a twist. In the center of the cover you place a recessed
pocket where you put another small cover that opens easily. inside of
that will be the valve stem from an large innertube. You place an
innertube inside of the compartment with the bars and inflate the
tube to about 2-3 PSI. That will make the lead stable and fill the
compartment. Do not use anymore air pressure because it can destroy
all your work with only about 25 PSI. If you ever move the boat into
the mountains remove the air pressure because it will increase as you
go up in altitude.
John
but with a twist. In the center of the cover you place a recessed
pocket where you put another small cover that opens easily. inside of
that will be the valve stem from an large innertube. You place an
innertube inside of the compartment with the bars and inflate the
tube to about 2-3 PSI. That will make the lead stable and fill the
compartment. Do not use anymore air pressure because it can destroy
all your work with only about 25 PSI. If you ever move the boat into
the mountains remove the air pressure because it will increase as you
go up in altitude.
John
--- In bolger@y..., "sanmi" <sanmi@y...> wrote:
> Herb, who built my AS-29, had exactly the same concern for his
> ballast boxes, which are supposed to be permanently sealed. He
came
> up with a clever solution:
>
> 1. He made "box tops" and fastened them over the ballast
compartment
> by setting bolts pointing upward into the walls with epoxy. You
put
> the top on and tie it down with nuts and washers. There are eight
> galvanized 3/8" (or maybe 1/4") bolts for each box. There is 2000
> lbs of lead for the boat, 1000 lbs in each box. The tops are 1"
> thick - two layers of 1/2" ply.
>
> 2. He placed the lead in the boxes and stuffed the rest with
> miscellaneous chunks of 2x4 and other pieces of wood.
>
> With the lids tied down, the whole mess is tight and secure, and I
> can check the compartments for each haulout, but lifting the lid
and
> moving the lead around.
>
> Very convenient.
>
> Frank San Miguel
> Wilmington, DE, USA
>
>
Hi,
You may be able to glue in tie-down points, for example two 50 mm by
100mm pieces of wood with notches cut in the bottom side, so you can
lace the weights down. Epoxy glue and strips of fiberglass over the
wood between the notches would be strong enough.
Good luck,
Ford Walton
mikestockstill wrote:
You may be able to glue in tie-down points, for example two 50 mm by
100mm pieces of wood with notches cut in the bottom side, so you can
lace the weights down. Epoxy glue and strips of fiberglass over the
wood between the notches would be strong enough.
Good luck,
Ford Walton
mikestockstill wrote:
>
> Hi -
>
> > Thanks for the tip regarding 2X4's. I am afraid the openings I made
> > are to big to use your solution. In case of a roll over the pigs
> will
> > fall out and cause a major cathastrophy...
>
> That would not be a good thing. it would not be difficult to brace
> the opening closed once the 2x4's are in place - it would be helpful
> if you can post some photos of the opening you cut - use a lot of
> light in the tank itself when snapping the photos --- put a ruler or
> something there too to give an idea of the scale.
>
> Mike
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Great idea Rich!
Buy the sand sold by the bag for sand boxes. I would cost more than beach
sand but it's very dry and clean. With the tanks sealed, you wouldn't have
to worry about moisture problems.
At the end of a season a good shop vac with remove it for long term storage
to keep the bottom from warping from the weight since it's not designed for
that kind of weight out without the water to help support it.
Jeff
Buy the sand sold by the bag for sand boxes. I would cost more than beach
sand but it's very dry and clean. With the tanks sealed, you wouldn't have
to worry about moisture problems.
At the end of a season a good shop vac with remove it for long term storage
to keep the bottom from warping from the weight since it's not designed for
that kind of weight out without the water to help support it.
Jeff
Herb, who built my AS-29, had exactly the same concern for his
ballast boxes, which are supposed to be permanently sealed. He came
up with a clever solution:
1. He made "box tops" and fastened them over the ballast compartment
by setting bolts pointing upward into the walls with epoxy. You put
the top on and tie it down with nuts and washers. There are eight
galvanized 3/8" (or maybe 1/4") bolts for each box. There is 2000
lbs of lead for the boat, 1000 lbs in each box. The tops are 1"
thick - two layers of 1/2" ply.
2. He placed the lead in the boxes and stuffed the rest with
miscellaneous chunks of 2x4 and other pieces of wood.
With the lids tied down, the whole mess is tight and secure, and I
can check the compartments for each haulout, but lifting the lid and
moving the lead around.
Very convenient.
Frank San Miguel
Wilmington, DE, USA
ballast boxes, which are supposed to be permanently sealed. He came
up with a clever solution:
1. He made "box tops" and fastened them over the ballast compartment
by setting bolts pointing upward into the walls with epoxy. You put
the top on and tie it down with nuts and washers. There are eight
galvanized 3/8" (or maybe 1/4") bolts for each box. There is 2000
lbs of lead for the boat, 1000 lbs in each box. The tops are 1"
thick - two layers of 1/2" ply.
2. He placed the lead in the boxes and stuffed the rest with
miscellaneous chunks of 2x4 and other pieces of wood.
With the lids tied down, the whole mess is tight and secure, and I
can check the compartments for each haulout, but lifting the lid and
moving the lead around.
Very convenient.
Frank San Miguel
Wilmington, DE, USA
--- In bolger@y..., "mikestockstill" <mkstocks@b...> wrote:
> Hi -
>
> > Thanks for the tip regarding 2X4's. I am afraid the openings I
made
> > are to big to use your solution. In case of a roll over the pigs
> will
> > fall out and cause a major cathastrophy...
>
> That would not be a good thing. it would not be difficult to brace
> the opening closed once the 2x4's are in place - it would be
helpful
> if you can post some photos of the opening you cut - use a lot of
> light in the tank itself when snapping the photos --- put a ruler
or
> something there too to give an idea of the scale.
>
> Mike
Sell the lead, fill the compartments with sand, silly.
----- Original Message -----
From: "bjharbo" <bharbo@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 3:36 AM
Subject: [bolger] WDJ Ballast problem and solution
I would like to share with you a tip I got from Sven Yrvind who is
visiting me right now regarding securing lead pigs in my schooner.
The WDJ is designed for water ballast tanks. The design brief called
for trailerablity which is of no interest for me. My boat will be
kept on a mooring between April/May and October, will be liftet out
of the water with a crane and placed on a cradle at the marina in the
winter. In other words the inside of the tanks will be exposed to
water partly under hydrostatic pressure for the entire sailing season.
I hade finished the tanks last year and got second and third
thoughts. This is for all practical purposes my first boat building
project (I have built two stitch and glue kayaks) and had no
confidence in how I had protected the inside of the tanks. They were
closed in and had 6" Beckson deck plates for inspection, flooding and
draining. There is no way to check the inside for rot and I guess
that the water would find a way into the wood and make a desaster
behind my back!
Que faire? I made a big openings into all four
compartments and bought 500 kg of lead in pigs/bars, 25 kgs each. The
problem now was how to secure those pigs safely to the bottom. I did
not dare to remove to much of the tank tops not to weaken the hull (I
guess that the tank tops are to be reckoned as "structural"). That
however made it difficult to bore for bolts and screws.
Sven suggested the following solution:
1. Wrap the bars in plastic
2. Wrap the wrapped bars with polyester band or rope (5-6 turns per
bar (which is abt 30 cm long)
3. Put thickened epoxy on the bottom where you want to place the pig
(s)
The polyester will suck epoxy and secure the pigs. The pigs can later
easily be removed.
Comments?
Bjørn
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Hi -
the opening closed once the 2x4's are in place - it would be helpful
if you can post some photos of the opening you cut - use a lot of
light in the tank itself when snapping the photos --- put a ruler or
something there too to give an idea of the scale.
Mike
> Thanks for the tip regarding 2X4's. I am afraid the openings I madewill
> are to big to use your solution. In case of a roll over the pigs
> fall out and cause a major cathastrophy...That would not be a good thing. it would not be difficult to brace
the opening closed once the 2x4's are in place - it would be helpful
if you can post some photos of the opening you cut - use a lot of
light in the tank itself when snapping the photos --- put a ruler or
something there too to give an idea of the scale.
Mike
Hi Mike,
I coated the entire surface of the tanks with several layers of
epoxy. However, it would not have been possible to cover all of it
with cloth due to all the clamps and hard edges. Anyway it is too
late now.
Thanks for the tip regarding 2X4's. I am afraid the openings I made
are to big to use your solution. In case of a roll over the pigs will
fall out and cause a major cathastrophy...
Bjørn
I coated the entire surface of the tanks with several layers of
epoxy. However, it would not have been possible to cover all of it
with cloth due to all the clamps and hard edges. Anyway it is too
late now.
Thanks for the tip regarding 2X4's. I am afraid the openings I made
are to big to use your solution. In case of a roll over the pigs will
fall out and cause a major cathastrophy...
Bjørn
--- In bolger@y..., "mikestockstill" <mkstocks@b...> wrote:
> Hi -
>
> I used cloth and epoxy on the insides of my tanks - that should
keep
> them from rotting. Not sure if that will help you at this point
> though....
>
> In your case - how about you put the lead pigs in the bottom and
fill
> the remaining comparment with short 2x4's? Make them the same size
> as the pigs. Very easy to take in and out - no glue needed, and no
> shifting around.
>
> Mike
Hi -
I used cloth and epoxy on the insides of my tanks - that should keep
them from rotting. Not sure if that will help you at this point
though....
In your case - how about you put the lead pigs in the bottom and fill
the remaining comparment with short 2x4's? Make them the same size
as the pigs. Very easy to take in and out - no glue needed, and no
shifting around.
Mike
I used cloth and epoxy on the insides of my tanks - that should keep
them from rotting. Not sure if that will help you at this point
though....
In your case - how about you put the lead pigs in the bottom and fill
the remaining comparment with short 2x4's? Make them the same size
as the pigs. Very easy to take in and out - no glue needed, and no
shifting around.
Mike
I would like to share with you a tip I got from Sven Yrvind who is
visiting me right now regarding securing lead pigs in my schooner.
The WDJ is designed for water ballast tanks. The design brief called
for trailerablity which is of no interest for me. My boat will be
kept on a mooring between April/May and October, will be liftet out
of the water with a crane and placed on a cradle at the marina in the
winter. In other words the inside of the tanks will be exposed to
water partly under hydrostatic pressure for the entire sailing season.
I hade finished the tanks last year and got second and third
thoughts. This is for all practical purposes my first boat building
project (I have built two stitch and glue kayaks) and had no
confidence in how I had protected the inside of the tanks. They were
closed in and had 6" Beckson deck plates for inspection, flooding and
draining. There is no way to check the inside for rot and I guess
that the water would find a way into the wood and make a desaster
behind my back!
Que faire? I made a big openings into all four
compartments and bought 500 kg of lead in pigs/bars, 25 kgs each. The
problem now was how to secure those pigs safely to the bottom. I did
not dare to remove to much of the tank tops not to weaken the hull (I
guess that the tank tops are to be reckoned as "structural"). That
however made it difficult to bore for bolts and screws.
Sven suggested the following solution:
1. Wrap the bars in plastic
2. Wrap the wrapped bars with polyester band or rope (5-6 turns per
bar (which is abt 30 cm long)
3. Put thickened epoxy on the bottom where you want to place the pig
(s)
The polyester will suck epoxy and secure the pigs. The pigs can later
easily be removed.
Comments?
Bjørn
visiting me right now regarding securing lead pigs in my schooner.
The WDJ is designed for water ballast tanks. The design brief called
for trailerablity which is of no interest for me. My boat will be
kept on a mooring between April/May and October, will be liftet out
of the water with a crane and placed on a cradle at the marina in the
winter. In other words the inside of the tanks will be exposed to
water partly under hydrostatic pressure for the entire sailing season.
I hade finished the tanks last year and got second and third
thoughts. This is for all practical purposes my first boat building
project (I have built two stitch and glue kayaks) and had no
confidence in how I had protected the inside of the tanks. They were
closed in and had 6" Beckson deck plates for inspection, flooding and
draining. There is no way to check the inside for rot and I guess
that the water would find a way into the wood and make a desaster
behind my back!
Que faire? I made a big openings into all four
compartments and bought 500 kg of lead in pigs/bars, 25 kgs each. The
problem now was how to secure those pigs safely to the bottom. I did
not dare to remove to much of the tank tops not to weaken the hull (I
guess that the tank tops are to be reckoned as "structural"). That
however made it difficult to bore for bolts and screws.
Sven suggested the following solution:
1. Wrap the bars in plastic
2. Wrap the wrapped bars with polyester band or rope (5-6 turns per
bar (which is abt 30 cm long)
3. Put thickened epoxy on the bottom where you want to place the pig
(s)
The polyester will suck epoxy and secure the pigs. The pigs can later
easily be removed.
Comments?
Bjørn