[bolger] Re: Financing Scheme
I'm afraid I have to agree that building boats doesn't pay. I always build
for my own needs, not for future selling prospects. Having said that, I
have just about recouped the cost of materials for the boats I have sold on,
AND I really enjoyed using them for a few years before selling them.
The boats that sell best (around here anyway) are classes that are raced
locally - Few of them are good cruising boats, and the buyers invariably
prefer plastic over wood.
Bill Samson
--bill.samson@...
Chebacco News can be viewed on:
http://members.xoom.com/billsamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Crandall <crandall@...>
To:bolger@egroups.com<bolger@egroups.com>
Date: 07 February 2000 16:59
Subject: [bolger] Re: Financing Scheme
for my own needs, not for future selling prospects. Having said that, I
have just about recouped the cost of materials for the boats I have sold on,
AND I really enjoyed using them for a few years before selling them.
The boats that sell best (around here anyway) are classes that are raced
locally - Few of them are good cruising boats, and the buyers invariably
prefer plastic over wood.
Bill Samson
--bill.samson@...
Chebacco News can be viewed on:
http://members.xoom.com/billsamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Crandall <crandall@...>
To:bolger@egroups.com<bolger@egroups.com>
Date: 07 February 2000 16:59
Subject: [bolger] Re: Financing Scheme
>On Wed, 2 Feb 2000, andy farquhar wrote:
>> I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can be
>> self-sustaining. Here's how:
>> 1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
>> 2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
>> 3. Build the boat;
>> 4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
>> 5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a small margin;
>> 6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum payments);
>> 7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
>> I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers. If
>> anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind. Any
>> responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for my
>> spouse that the above scheme may actually work.
>
>Alas, I cannot support you in your notion that this will work.
>Your boat is unlikely to sell for its cost--unless you are a very skilled
>worker, and the market for funky boats is excellent where you live.
>
>You will take much of a year to get your boat together. Let's say you pay
>$800 for materials (this is a low-ball estimate), not counting sails.
>Then, you will be paying a bare minimum, of say, 10% from your credit
>card. Compounded, this will be over 11%. You will make minimum payments,
>and carry a balance over two years, which will affect the amount of
>available credit you have (it will shrink it--already bought your house
>and car?).
>
>Then, after two years, you will have a boat that you have paid over $960
>for, that you invested a year in building, two in maintenance, and it
>didn't turn out perfect in the first place, just looks pretty good (not
>counting sails).
>
>You try to sell it yourself--the ads cost $35 or more, and you find that
>no one will touch your boat without a trailer (the value of yours has
>shrunk by 35%, but the cost of it increased 22% because of the interest)
>and you have to add the sails, which are now two years old and worth, say
>50% of new, (but you still owe almost 100% because you've been making
>minimum payments) and further, it takes a full year to sell the boat (it
>took me two years to sell a Catalina 22, a much easier to sell boat that
>was at a great price).
>
>Look--it's a cheap hobby, and the value of the whole thing is in the
>doing, having, and using. You won't make your money back. I would try a
>different tack. Compare the costs of building and using the boat, to what
>you would otherwise do with your time and energy. It's cheaper than going
>to the movies every week--it's cheaper than target shooting--it's cheaper
>than weekend drives with meals on the road--it's cheaper than furniture
>building.
>
>If you can afford an Oldshoe, by buying the pieces over time, as you need
>them, then just build it. Promise your wife that having the boat willbe a
>lot of fun, that you'll be a proud fella for building a great boat, and
>that, in the end, if she wants, you'll sell it after two seasons. But
>don't think that boating can be self-financing. Unless you're *very* good
>as a builder, and clever at selling high, you'll certainly lose money.
>
>Don't lose your patience, self-esteem, credit rating, and faith of your
>spouse at the same time.
>
> Chris Crandallcrandall@...(785) 864-4131
> Department of Psychology University of Kansas Lawrence, KS 66045
> I have data convincingly disconfirming the Duhem-Quine hypothesis.
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Valentine's Day Shopping Made Simple.
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1158/5/_/3457/_/949942772/
>
>-- Talk to your group with your own voice!
>--http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=bolger&m=1
>
>
>
That sir has the ring of truth about it. Indees my first boat, a Teal was
built as therapy in a one room apartment. I'm still married to that
apartment mate after 22 years. Sanity and small boats, what a concept!
Rennie
built as therapy in a one room apartment. I'm still married to that
apartment mate after 22 years. Sanity and small boats, what a concept!
Rennie
>From: "Lincoln Ross" <lincolnr@...>______________________________________________________
>Reply-To:bolger@egroups.com
>To:bolger@...
>Subject: [bolger] Re: Financing Scheme
>Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 09:10:06 -0800
>
>"andy farquhar" <afarquha-@...> wrote:
>original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2345
> > I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can be
> > self-sustaining. snip
>
>Think of it as cheap therapy. If you can save 10 or 15 trips to the
>shrink at $75 or $100 each. Maybe you can get your health insurance to
>pay.
>
>Or, just say, "I've realised the boat won't really pay for itself and,
>since I can't afford to build it, let's go skiing this weekend instead."
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Finding a sweetheart is hard work. Shopping for one shouldn't be.
>Click here for Valentine Surprises!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1181/5/_/3457/_/949943422/
>
>-- Create a poll/survey for your group!
>--http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=bolger&m=1
>
>
> > All that said, I have never been good at making deals, while othersseem to
> > always come out on top when buying and selling.You are probably right, Tim. This is my main argument for not putting
> >
> > Chuck Leinweber
>
> Not with wooden boats they don't! (Designer is immaterial)
>
> Tim & FT2
>
too much money in materials (like marine plywood).
>Been there, done that, failed dismally....
> Now, if you can figure out how to market a Bolger boat to the tupperware
> boat people.... Maybe enter your [pick boat] in a couple of races?
Tim & FT2
Nothing exceeds like success...
> All that said, I have never been good at making deals, while others seem toNot with wooden boats they don't! (Designer is immaterial)
> always come out on top when buying and selling.
>
> Chuck Leinweber
Tim & FT2
"andy farquhar" <afarquha-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2345
advertisement for a state of the art transceiver in the $2500 price
range, and when she comes to, agree to build a boat instead. It works
every time.
Stan, Snow Goose
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2345
> I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can beAndy, Tell your wife you want to get into ham radio, then show her an
> self-sustaining. snip
advertisement for a state of the art transceiver in the $2500 price
range, and when she comes to, agree to build a boat instead. It works
every time.
Stan, Snow Goose
Chris:
Sounds like the voice of experience. Everything you say is right on the
money. I especially like the part about comparing it to alternate forms of
entertainment.
My experience has been much the same: I finally gave away my first two
boats, another I built for a guy for the cost of materials, but he got to
pick out the design (I really wanted to build a boat). My Bolger Tennessee
I sold for about half of what I had in it after about a year of trying.
All that said, I have never been good at making deals, while others seem to
always come out on top when buying and selling.
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
Sounds like the voice of experience. Everything you say is right on the
money. I especially like the part about comparing it to alternate forms of
entertainment.
My experience has been much the same: I finally gave away my first two
boats, another I built for a guy for the cost of materials, but he got to
pick out the design (I really wanted to build a boat). My Bolger Tennessee
I sold for about half of what I had in it after about a year of trying.
All that said, I have never been good at making deals, while others seem to
always come out on top when buying and selling.
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Crandall <crandall@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2000 8:59 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Financing Scheme
> On Wed, 2 Feb 2000, andy farquhar wrote:
> > I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can be
> > self-sustaining. Here's how:
> > 1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
> > 2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
> > 3. Build the boat;
> > 4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
> > 5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a small margin;
> > 6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum payments);
> > 7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
> > I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers. If
> > anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind. Any
> > responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for my
> > spouse that the above scheme may actually work.
>
> Alas, I cannot support you in your notion that this will work.
> Your boat is unlikely to sell for its cost--unless you are a very skilled
> worker, and the market for funky boats is excellent where you live.
>
> You will take much of a year to get your boat together. Let's say you pay
> $800 for materials (this is a low-ball estimate), not counting sails.
> Then, you will be paying a bare minimum, of say, 10% from your credit
> card. Compounded, this will be over 11%. You will make minimum payments,
> and carry a balance over two years, which will affect the amount of
> available credit you have (it will shrink it--already bought your house
> and car?).
>
> Then, after two years, you will have a boat that you have paid over $960
> for, that you invested a year in building, two in maintenance, and it
> didn't turn out perfect in the first place, just looks pretty good (not
> counting sails).
>
> You try to sell it yourself--the ads cost $35 or more, and you find that
> no one will touch your boat without a trailer (the value of yours has
> shrunk by 35%, but the cost of it increased 22% because of the interest)
> and you have to add the sails, which are now two years old and worth, say
> 50% of new, (but you still owe almost 100% because you've been making
> minimum payments) and further, it takes a full year to sell the boat (it
> took me two years to sell a Catalina 22, a much easier to sell boat that
> was at a great price).
>
> Look--it's a cheap hobby, and the value of the whole thing is in the
> doing, having, and using. You won't make your money back. I would try a
> different tack. Compare the costs of building and using the boat, to what
> you would otherwise do with your time and energy. It's cheaper than going
> to the movies every week--it's cheaper than target shooting--it's cheaper
> than weekend drives with meals on the road--it's cheaper than furniture
> building.
>
> If you can afford an Oldshoe, by buying the pieces over time, as you need
> them, then just build it. Promise your wife that having the boat willbe a
> lot of fun, that you'll be a proud fella for building a great boat, and
> that, in the end, if she wants, you'll sell it after two seasons. But
> don't think that boating can be self-financing. Unless you're *very* good
> as a builder, and clever at selling high, you'll certainly lose money.
>
> Don't lose your patience, self-esteem, credit rating, and faith of your
> spouse at the same time.
>
> Chris Crandallcrandall@...(785) 864-4131
> Department of Psychology University of Kansas Lawrence, KS 66045
> I have data convincingly disconfirming the Duhem-Quine hypothesis.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Valentine's Day Shopping Made Simple.
>http://click.egroups.com/1/1158/5/_/3457/_/949942772/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> --http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=bolger&m=1
>
>
"andy farquhar" <afarquha-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2345
shrink at $75 or $100 each. Maybe you can get your health insurance to
pay.
Or, just say, "I've realised the boat won't really pay for itself and,
since I can't afford to build it, let's go skiing this weekend instead."
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2345
> I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can beThink of it as cheap therapy. If you can save 10 or 15 trips to the
> self-sustaining. snip
shrink at $75 or $100 each. Maybe you can get your health insurance to
pay.
Or, just say, "I've realised the boat won't really pay for itself and,
since I can't afford to build it, let's go skiing this weekend instead."
On Wed, 2 Feb 2000, andy farquhar wrote:
Your boat is unlikely to sell for its cost--unless you are a very skilled
worker, and the market for funky boats is excellent where you live.
You will take much of a year to get your boat together. Let's say you pay
$800 for materials (this is a low-ball estimate), not counting sails.
Then, you will be paying a bare minimum, of say, 10% from your credit
card. Compounded, this will be over 11%. You will make minimum payments,
and carry a balance over two years, which will affect the amount of
available credit you have (it will shrink it--already bought your house
and car?).
Then, after two years, you will have a boat that you have paid over $960
for, that you invested a year in building, two in maintenance, and it
didn't turn out perfect in the first place, just looks pretty good (not
counting sails).
You try to sell it yourself--the ads cost $35 or more, and you find that
no one will touch your boat without a trailer (the value of yours has
shrunk by 35%, but the cost of it increased 22% because of the interest)
and you have to add the sails, which are now two years old and worth, say
50% of new, (but you still owe almost 100% because you've been making
minimum payments) and further, it takes a full year to sell the boat (it
took me two years to sell a Catalina 22, a much easier to sell boat that
was at a great price).
Look--it's a cheap hobby, and the value of the whole thing is in the
doing, having, and using. You won't make your money back. I would try a
different tack. Compare the costs of building and using the boat, to what
you would otherwise do with your time and energy. It's cheaper than going
to the movies every week--it's cheaper than target shooting--it's cheaper
than weekend drives with meals on the road--it's cheaper than furniture
building.
If you can afford an Oldshoe, by buying the pieces over time, as you need
them, then just build it. Promise your wife that having the boat willbe a
lot of fun, that you'll be a proud fella for building a great boat, and
that, in the end, if she wants, you'll sell it after two seasons. But
don't think that boating can be self-financing. Unless you're *very* good
as a builder, and clever at selling high, you'll certainly lose money.
Don't lose your patience, self-esteem, credit rating, and faith of your
spouse at the same time.
Chris Crandallcrandall@...(785) 864-4131
Department of Psychology University of Kansas Lawrence, KS 66045
I have data convincingly disconfirming the Duhem-Quine hypothesis.
> I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can beAlas, I cannot support you in your notion that this will work.
> self-sustaining. Here's how:
> 1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
> 2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
> 3. Build the boat;
> 4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
> 5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a small margin;
> 6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum payments);
> 7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
> I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers. If
> anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind. Any
> responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for my
> spouse that the above scheme may actually work.
Your boat is unlikely to sell for its cost--unless you are a very skilled
worker, and the market for funky boats is excellent where you live.
You will take much of a year to get your boat together. Let's say you pay
$800 for materials (this is a low-ball estimate), not counting sails.
Then, you will be paying a bare minimum, of say, 10% from your credit
card. Compounded, this will be over 11%. You will make minimum payments,
and carry a balance over two years, which will affect the amount of
available credit you have (it will shrink it--already bought your house
and car?).
Then, after two years, you will have a boat that you have paid over $960
for, that you invested a year in building, two in maintenance, and it
didn't turn out perfect in the first place, just looks pretty good (not
counting sails).
You try to sell it yourself--the ads cost $35 or more, and you find that
no one will touch your boat without a trailer (the value of yours has
shrunk by 35%, but the cost of it increased 22% because of the interest)
and you have to add the sails, which are now two years old and worth, say
50% of new, (but you still owe almost 100% because you've been making
minimum payments) and further, it takes a full year to sell the boat (it
took me two years to sell a Catalina 22, a much easier to sell boat that
was at a great price).
Look--it's a cheap hobby, and the value of the whole thing is in the
doing, having, and using. You won't make your money back. I would try a
different tack. Compare the costs of building and using the boat, to what
you would otherwise do with your time and energy. It's cheaper than going
to the movies every week--it's cheaper than target shooting--it's cheaper
than weekend drives with meals on the road--it's cheaper than furniture
building.
If you can afford an Oldshoe, by buying the pieces over time, as you need
them, then just build it. Promise your wife that having the boat willbe a
lot of fun, that you'll be a proud fella for building a great boat, and
that, in the end, if she wants, you'll sell it after two seasons. But
don't think that boating can be self-financing. Unless you're *very* good
as a builder, and clever at selling high, you'll certainly lose money.
Don't lose your patience, self-esteem, credit rating, and faith of your
spouse at the same time.
Chris Crandallcrandall@...(785) 864-4131
Department of Psychology University of Kansas Lawrence, KS 66045
I have data convincingly disconfirming the Duhem-Quine hypothesis.
I have forwarded your message to my wife...hehehehehe
Actualy, if you do a nice job, use good materials, and take care of the boat, your idea has merit.
Now, if you can figure out how to market a Bolger boat to the tupperware boat people.... Maybe enter your old shoe in a couple of races?
andy farquhar wrote:
I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can be
self-sustaining. Here's how:
1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
3. Build the boat;
4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a
small margin;
6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum
payments);
7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers.
If
anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind.
Any
responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for
my
spouse that the above scheme may actually work.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Valentine's Day Shopping Made Simple. Click Here!
http://click.egroups.com/1/1155/5/_/3457/_/949935773/
-- Create a poll/survey for your group!
--http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=bolger&m=1
I have convinced my spouse that my boatbuilding hobby can be
self-sustaining. Here's how:
1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
3. Build the boat;
4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a small margin;
6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum payments);
7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers. If
anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind. Any
responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for my
spouse that the above scheme may actually work.
self-sustaining. Here's how:
1. Get the cheapest credit card you can find;
2. Charge all boat-related costs to the new card;
3. Build the boat;
4. Enjoy the boat for a couple of years;
5. Sell the boat for costs, plus finance costs, plus a small margin;
6. Pay off the credit card (you have been making minimum payments);
7. Start over, but build a slightly bigger boat.
I have started an oldshoe and hope to enjoy it for two summers. If
anyone is interested in buying one in two years, keep me in mind. Any
responses, even if not serious, will be appreciated as evidence for my
spouse that the above scheme may actually work.