Re: Champlain Pictures
THere may be a reason for that. A former co-worker who switched to
computers because he couldn't afford to work for almost nothing used
to tell me horror stories about shoddy construction on things like
this "trawler", even into the $100k to $200k territory. Lets just say
if it has a hawsepipe, go under the deck and see how it's attached!
Now that the company and market went kaput, I wonder what he does?
computers because he couldn't afford to work for almost nothing used
to tell me horror stories about shoddy construction on things like
this "trawler", even into the $100k to $200k territory. Lets just say
if it has a hawsepipe, go under the deck and see how it's attached!
Now that the company and market went kaput, I wonder what he does?
--- In bolger@y..., "pvanderwaart" <pvanderw@o...> wrote:
snip
> The bottom line is that these boats have a lot of detail work, and
> are expensive to have professionally built. The professional thinks
> that the finished boat should sell for enough to pay him for his
> time, but I don't think the market would say so. For example,
$76,000
> will buy you a 36' fiberglass trawler with a 210hp Diesel.
> (http://www.yachtworld.com/listing/yw_listing_detail.jsp?
> checked_boats=919222)
snip
>
> Peter
> Be honest guys, is that a realistic price?Let's be practical. There is no such thing as a market price for
something like this, because there is no market. There is not enough
supply or enough demand.
There seems to be more of a market history with the Retriever design,
which is of similar size and complexity. If I remember correctly, one
was built professionally (by Tony Grove?) for a price rumored to be
in the $75K range. I could easily see 1000 hours at $50/hour putting
$50,000 on the tab. The $50 includes shop overhead. How much do you
pay your auto mechanic?
In MAIB over the summer, a Retriever was advertised at $29K,
including 90hp Honda and trailer. The boat was described as being
built by Dave Montegomery. (I remember reading about a Montegomery
boat that was delivered unfinished, but I think it was a Fast
Motorsailer.)
I think I also recall that there was a Retriever built and advertised
by a Hudson River area builder in the last couple years. I don't
remember the price, but it was probably similar.
The bottom line is that these boats have a lot of detail work, and
are expensive to have professionally built. The professional thinks
that the finished boat should sell for enough to pay him for his
time, but I don't think the market would say so. For example, $76,000
will buy you a 36' fiberglass trawler with a 210hp Diesel.
(http://www.yachtworld.com/listing/yw_listing_detail.jsp?
checked_boats=919222)
Most folks who put home-built, plywood Bolger boats on the market
seem to be doing well to get back the cost of materials.
One final story: a builder in the Maritimes cold-molded a catboat to
a Bolger design. He wanted to sell it for about $50,000. A very
reputable broker in the Cape Cod area advised him that it would go
for about $20,000 in that catboat-o-philic region. I still regret
that I didn't buy it.
So the bottom line is if you want it for the price advertised, go
ahead and buy it, because you probably won't be able to buy one
anywhere else at any price. But if you are willing to have something
different, you can probably get more boat for less money. Maybe a
fiberglass steam boat?
Peter
Don't forget overhead. Tools and workspace are not cheap. OTOH, I have
heard that house carpenters get paid more than boat carpenters, even
tho it's easier. Maybe this was just sour grapes, but I don't think
so.
heard that house carpenters get paid more than boat carpenters, even
tho it's easier. Maybe this was just sour grapes, but I don't think
so.
--- In bolger@y..., "struelpeter" <daveb@p...> wrote:
> a good carpenter makes at least 30.00 an hour,,, I would think a
> skilled boat builder would be able to command a better wage than
> that,,
> but that price is way out there,, maybe a mistake
>
> David bosworth
>
> --- In bolger@y..., "brucehallman" <brucehallman@y...> wrote:
> > --- "jeff" <boatbuilding@g...> wrote:
> > > I'm curious if it was professionally
> > > built going for $59,000.
> >
> > This is a different boat than the
> > "Han van Pelt" Champlain, which
> > was described as being built in
> > 800 hours [including trailer].
> >
> > Assuming $20/hr, that totals $16,000
> > for labor, plus perhaps that much
> > again formotor, materials and trailer
> > = $32K +/-
> >
> > So, $59,000 seems like a un-realistic
> > sales price.
> >
> > Isn't that more than the Retreiver
> > being offered in the MAIB classified
> > advertisements a few months back?
> >
> > Never-the-less; Wow! I want one!
a good carpenter makes at least 30.00 an hour,,, I would think a
skilled boat builder would be able to command a better wage than
that,,
but that price is way out there,, maybe a mistake
David bosworth
skilled boat builder would be able to command a better wage than
that,,
but that price is way out there,, maybe a mistake
David bosworth
--- In bolger@y..., "brucehallman" <brucehallman@y...> wrote:
> --- "jeff" <boatbuilding@g...> wrote:
> > I'm curious if it was professionally
> > built going for $59,000.
>
> This is a different boat than the
> "Han van Pelt" Champlain, which
> was described as being built in
> 800 hours [including trailer].
>
> Assuming $20/hr, that totals $16,000
> for labor, plus perhaps that much
> again formotor, materials and trailer
> = $32K +/-
>
> So, $59,000 seems like a un-realistic
> sales price.
>
> Isn't that more than the Retreiver
> being offered in the MAIB classified
> advertisements a few months back?
>
> Never-the-less; Wow! I want one!
NO! thats $10,000 more
CCG
Ken <renueden@...> wrote:Is the top a sundeck on that?
Ken
CCG
Ken <renueden@...> wrote:Is the top a sundeck on that?
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: "mi8088" <mi8088@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 11:40 AM
Subject: [bolger] Champlain Pictures
> Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
> great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
> everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
>http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
> that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
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Be honest guys, is that a realistic price? What would that cost to build if you did it yourself? I do like the color .
CCG
mi8088 <mi8088@...> wrote:Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
CCG
mi8088 <mi8088@...> wrote:Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hi,
I'm the guy that posted those pictures of a CHAMPLAIN in build in
the files section.This was a boat I visited while in Florida several
years ago and it had a varied history of multiple owners.The pictures
were taken at a pro yard in Stuart Fla. which,if I recall,had been
stiffed by the latest owner who wanted the yard to finish the boat
but didn't pay blah,blah,blah.....
Anyway,I suspect the one for sale is indeed the same one as it
shows no raised center section(as per plan) and the one I saw ALSO
had no raised center section(as per the desires of one of the
owner/builders) but NOT approved by the good offices of PCB&F's.A few
other little things in the photos also lead me to conclude that it is
the same boat.
Alot of that asking price must also represent many many months of
expensive inside storage that the last shop had to deal with.
Hope this helps,
Peter Lenihan
I'm the guy that posted those pictures of a CHAMPLAIN in build in
the files section.This was a boat I visited while in Florida several
years ago and it had a varied history of multiple owners.The pictures
were taken at a pro yard in Stuart Fla. which,if I recall,had been
stiffed by the latest owner who wanted the yard to finish the boat
but didn't pay blah,blah,blah.....
Anyway,I suspect the one for sale is indeed the same one as it
shows no raised center section(as per plan) and the one I saw ALSO
had no raised center section(as per the desires of one of the
owner/builders) but NOT approved by the good offices of PCB&F's.A few
other little things in the photos also lead me to conclude that it is
the same boat.
Alot of that asking price must also represent many many months of
expensive inside storage that the last shop had to deal with.
Hope this helps,
Peter Lenihan
--- In bolger@y..., "mi8088" <mi8088@a...> wrote:
> Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
> great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
> everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
>http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
> that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
--- "jeff" <boatbuilding@g...> wrote:
"Han van Pelt" Champlain, which
was described as being built in
800 hours [including trailer].
Assuming $20/hr, that totals $16,000
for labor, plus perhaps that much
again formotor, materials and trailer
= $32K +/-
So, $59,000 seems like a un-realistic
sales price.
Isn't that more than the Retreiver
being offered in the MAIB classified
advertisements a few months back?
Never-the-less; Wow! I want one!
> I'm curious if it was professionallyThis is a different boat than the
> built going for $59,000.
"Han van Pelt" Champlain, which
was described as being built in
800 hours [including trailer].
Assuming $20/hr, that totals $16,000
for labor, plus perhaps that much
again formotor, materials and trailer
= $32K +/-
So, $59,000 seems like a un-realistic
sales price.
Isn't that more than the Retreiver
being offered in the MAIB classified
advertisements a few months back?
Never-the-less; Wow! I want one!
Is the top a sundeck on that?
Ken
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: "mi8088" <mi8088@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 11:40 AM
Subject: [bolger] Champlain Pictures
> Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
> great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
> everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
>http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
> that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
I'm curious if it was professionally built going for $59,000. I would doubt
you could get anywhere close to that doing it yourself. Then interior looks
like it had a lot of hours in trim work. Nice. I can only hope the Wyo
turns somewhere close to that interior since it's very similar in design.
Jeff
you could get anywhere close to that doing it yourself. Then interior looks
like it had a lot of hours in trim work. Nice. I can only hope the Wyo
turns somewhere close to that interior since it's very similar in design.
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: "mi8088" <mi8088@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 12:40 PM
Subject: [bolger] Champlain Pictures
> Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
> great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
> everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
>http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
> that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Long time reader, first time post - hope this works. I found some
great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce
great pictures of a completed Champlain for sale that I thought
everyone would enjoy viewing. Pictures are located at
http://www.marine-concepts.com/broker.This might be the same boat
that was being built in the Champlain files section. Bruce