Re: [bolger] Re: Chebacco people: question about ballast and a few other things
I prefer pilot house and batteries as my "ballast"...
----- Original Message -----
From: "ymaapub" <tcomrie@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 9:44 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Chebacco people: question about ballast and a few
other things
> Dig through the archives in this group and you'll find the ballast
question has been debated before. Those proud Chebacconists
> insist that no ballast is needed, but concede that a few extra passengers
are good to have on windy days. When I build mine, I will
> probably put in four water ballast tanks under the floor so that I have
the option to add weight depending on conditions.
>
> Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep
(according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always stay
> on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Well, with Bolger boats, tacking is trivial. No jib. So, you don't HAVE to
go "ready, about", just throw the tiller over.
So, you live ballast doesn't need to understand english...
go "ready, about", just throw the tiller over.
So, you live ballast doesn't need to understand english...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Lefebvre" <paul@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 12:19 PM
Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Chebacco people: question about ballast and a few
other things
> That conjures up quite an amusing image:
>
> Ready About!
>
> Baaaaaaaaa!!!!!
>
> ;)
>
> > Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep
> > (according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always stay
> > on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
> - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
> > Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep.I asked my friend Leander about this. He is very knowledgable about
sheep. Here is is reply:
"My experience with sea going sheep is limited to loading them into
Grand Banks Dories to lug them on and off islands off the coast of
Nova Scotia. My experience is that they are flighty and undependable
around water and need to be either hog tied or packed so tightly into
a high sided dory that they can not move and then they settle down
ok. We used to round up sheep on islands and drive them with dogs
down onto the pebble beach where the wild island sheep could be
slowed down enough to control. Every once in a while one of them
would strike out into the surf and head for Portugal. They did fine
until the fleece started to get wet and then would sink like a stone.
I had a dog that could retrieve such as that."
Peter
That conjures up quite an amusing image:
Ready About!
Baaaaaaaaa!!!!!
;)
Ready About!
Baaaaaaaaa!!!!!
;)
> Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep
> (according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always stay
> on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
Arrgh!
There ain't nuttin' like mutton when the cold North wind blows
and ye got too much sail in yer riggin' an' yer bowsprit keeps poking
its nose inta the next wave while yer breakfast floods the
scuppers.....arrrgh.....an' carrots is good but lead is much better
whenever the weather gets yer sheets in a tether.So stick to the
plans with green eggs and ham and leave the wee sheep on a green
stretch of grass.Arrrgh!
I can't wait until someone builds the stretched version of the
Chebacco,a most beautiful vessel to behold!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan....
There ain't nuttin' like mutton when the cold North wind blows
and ye got too much sail in yer riggin' an' yer bowsprit keeps poking
its nose inta the next wave while yer breakfast floods the
scuppers.....arrrgh.....an' carrots is good but lead is much better
whenever the weather gets yer sheets in a tether.So stick to the
plans with green eggs and ham and leave the wee sheep on a green
stretch of grass.Arrrgh!
I can't wait until someone builds the stretched version of the
Chebacco,a most beautiful vessel to behold!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan....
--- In bolger@y..., "ymaapub" <tcomrie@y...> wrote:
>
> Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep
(according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always
stay
> on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
Dig through the archives in this group and you'll find the ballast question has been debated before. Those proud Chebacconists
insist that no ballast is needed, but concede that a few extra passengers are good to have on windy days. When I build mine, I will
probably put in four water ballast tanks under the floor so that I have the option to add weight depending on conditions.
Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep (according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always stay
on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
insist that no ballast is needed, but concede that a few extra passengers are good to have on windy days. When I build mine, I will
probably put in four water ballast tanks under the floor so that I have the option to add weight depending on conditions.
Another option is live ballast in the form of a few sheep. Sheep (according to the old timers) are afraid of water and will always stay
on the high side of the boat, just where you need them.
--- In bolger@y..., "Sean" <mcgrew@w...> wrote:
See notes below...
> Hey Jamie, the wall paper on this computer is that picture of
Wayward
> Lass on the reach. Hopefully mine will end up looking a lot like
> that one. OK, no extra lead--easier to make the keel box. What
wood
> did you make your keel box out of?
My keel is framed with 1 1/2 x 1 1/2 fir, with 1/2 inch fir ply on
the sides. The frames actually turned out just a little fatter than
that, as I had some nice fir that had to be thickness planed --
otherwise I'd have bought the nominal 2 x 2 called for.
>
> No limber holes in the Bulkhead #1. Check. I suppose you just
> sponge out any rain water from the mast-stepping slide opening?
Or
> did you make a boot to go around the mast at the partner?
I built a lip around the hole and on the slot cover to take a boot,
but haven't ever got around to making the boot. Wayward Lass lives
on a trailer, under a tarp, so not much water gets in, and what does
is confined to the forward area. It would be different if I kept
her on a mooring. Yes, I just sponge it out.
>
> I priced my wood quotes at 18 sheets of 1/2" and 8 sheets of 1/4"
> because I had read that forming the forward bilge panels and cabin
> roof could be a bugger with 1/2". Is this really enough, or
should I
> order a couple extra sheets to make the extras? I'm wondering if
the
> keel could be laminated from 1/2" ply, and if so, how much more
wood
> this would take. The wood I'm leaning towards at this point is
> Meranti BS1088 + Lloyd's stamped from World Panel.
Nice plywood -- I used marine fir. I glassed the hull and
everywhere the sun could reach, so I've had no checking. I never
counted my plywood sheets because I bought them locally, and only 5
or 6 at a time. I've an idea I needed about 10 sheets of 1/4 for
the bilges because I couldn't quite get two bilge pieces out of each
sheet -- I have a lot of not quite wide enough pieces left over,
probably enough to build a cartopper someday.
>
> One last question. I've built a canoe, and am waiting for the
paint
> to dry on my 14 ft flatiron dory skiff. While I wait for the wood
> fund to charge up, I'm currently building a sailing pram by stitch
> and glue. These boats are all open, so the frame pieces are all
used
> exactly as cut. My question is about Molds #s 2 and 3 inside the
> cabin. The plans give the outer dimensions, but don't show
anything
> indicating how they would be cut if left in the boat. Am I to
assume
> that they are for shaping the cabin sides and roof stringers and
then
> removed before the cabin top is installed? These two forms have
me
> puzzled.
Those two come out completely. I made about a six inch cut down
from the top and up from the bottom of each of them, so that when
the day came to remove them, I could just join the cuts then pull
out the pieces. Use any stiff, cheap board for these, not your good
ply.
>
> Another thing I'm sorting through is the size and type of nails to
> tack the thing together with, but I'm rereading Build the New
Instant
> Boats and have copies of Instant Boats and Building the Bolger
Bobcat
> coming, and maybe I can get it from Payson's writings.
I tried bronze ring nails to nail the transom to its framing, but
found it hard to drive the heads down far enough so they didn't make
a bump. After that I used screws -- which are nice because you can
dry fit the pieces as often as you need to before gluing. I used 1"
#10 screws to fasten ply to framing -- mine were bronze, which was
overkill since they get covered in glass. I suppose all screws
could be taken out once the epoxy in the joints goes off, but I left
mine in for insurance.
>
>
Jamie
Hey Jamie, the wall paper on this computer is that picture of Wayward
Lass on the reach. Hopefully mine will end up looking a lot like
that one. OK, no extra lead--easier to make the keel box. What wood
did you make your keel box out of?
No limber holes in the Bulkhead #1. Check. I suppose you just
sponge out any rain water from the mast-stepping slide opening? Or
did you make a boot to go around the mast at the partner?
I priced my wood quotes at 18 sheets of 1/2" and 8 sheets of 1/4"
because I had read that forming the forward bilge panels and cabin
roof could be a bugger with 1/2". Is this really enough, or should I
order a couple extra sheets to make the extras? I'm wondering if the
keel could be laminated from 1/2" ply, and if so, how much more wood
this would take. The wood I'm leaning towards at this point is
Meranti BS1088 + Lloyd's stamped from World Panel.
One last question. I've built a canoe, and am waiting for the paint
to dry on my 14 ft flatiron dory skiff. While I wait for the wood
fund to charge up, I'm currently building a sailing pram by stitch
and glue. These boats are all open, so the frame pieces are all used
exactly as cut. My question is about Molds #s 2 and 3 inside the
cabin. The plans give the outer dimensions, but don't show anything
indicating how they would be cut if left in the boat. Am I to assume
that they are for shaping the cabin sides and roof stringers and then
removed before the cabin top is installed? These two forms have me
puzzled.
Another thing I'm sorting through is the size and type of nails to
tack the thing together with, but I'm rereading Build the New Instant
Boats and have copies of Instant Boats and Building the Bolger Bobcat
coming, and maybe I can get it from Payson's writings.
Thanks,
Sean
Lass on the reach. Hopefully mine will end up looking a lot like
that one. OK, no extra lead--easier to make the keel box. What wood
did you make your keel box out of?
No limber holes in the Bulkhead #1. Check. I suppose you just
sponge out any rain water from the mast-stepping slide opening? Or
did you make a boot to go around the mast at the partner?
I priced my wood quotes at 18 sheets of 1/2" and 8 sheets of 1/4"
because I had read that forming the forward bilge panels and cabin
roof could be a bugger with 1/2". Is this really enough, or should I
order a couple extra sheets to make the extras? I'm wondering if the
keel could be laminated from 1/2" ply, and if so, how much more wood
this would take. The wood I'm leaning towards at this point is
Meranti BS1088 + Lloyd's stamped from World Panel.
One last question. I've built a canoe, and am waiting for the paint
to dry on my 14 ft flatiron dory skiff. While I wait for the wood
fund to charge up, I'm currently building a sailing pram by stitch
and glue. These boats are all open, so the frame pieces are all used
exactly as cut. My question is about Molds #s 2 and 3 inside the
cabin. The plans give the outer dimensions, but don't show anything
indicating how they would be cut if left in the boat. Am I to assume
that they are for shaping the cabin sides and roof stringers and then
removed before the cabin top is installed? These two forms have me
puzzled.
Another thing I'm sorting through is the size and type of nails to
tack the thing together with, but I'm rereading Build the New Instant
Boats and have copies of Instant Boats and Building the Bolger Bobcat
coming, and maybe I can get it from Payson's writings.
Thanks,
Sean
Hey thanks, Sean, I love an excuse to talk about Chebaccos...
No, you don't need ballast. I built mine to the plans and have never
felt the need for ballast. I think if you keep looking in Chebacco
News, old articles, you'll find that Tim Smith bought a Chebacco with
300 pounds of ballast in it, and one of the first things he did was
pull it out.
Eliminating limber holes in number one bulkhead, right behind the
mast, stops any rain water that runs down the mast from getting into
the living area. You should keep the other limber holes.
I can't comment on other modifications, since I built to the plans.
Personally, I think Bolger got it right the first time, but some
builders have made changes -- look on the Chebacco site again to find
them.
You mentioned the plywood -- the plans suggest making the bilge panel
from two layers of 1/4 inch instead of one layer of 1/2 inch to make
bending easier. I found that the curve in the bilge area of number
one bulkhead needed to be more pronounced as the 1/4 "tortures" more
easily. I would suggest making that curve bulge out about maybe 3/8
inch more in the centre, to avoid having to fill in a gap as I did.
Also consider making the cabin roof from two layers of 1/4 inch to
make the bending easier up there. Some builders report difficulty in
getting the edges fastened down without distortion when they used 1/2
inch.
It's a good design to build, there's a friendly network of builders
to give advice (whether you want it or not), and you get a great boat
at the end of it all.
Jamie Orr
No, you don't need ballast. I built mine to the plans and have never
felt the need for ballast. I think if you keep looking in Chebacco
News, old articles, you'll find that Tim Smith bought a Chebacco with
300 pounds of ballast in it, and one of the first things he did was
pull it out.
Eliminating limber holes in number one bulkhead, right behind the
mast, stops any rain water that runs down the mast from getting into
the living area. You should keep the other limber holes.
I can't comment on other modifications, since I built to the plans.
Personally, I think Bolger got it right the first time, but some
builders have made changes -- look on the Chebacco site again to find
them.
You mentioned the plywood -- the plans suggest making the bilge panel
from two layers of 1/4 inch instead of one layer of 1/2 inch to make
bending easier. I found that the curve in the bilge area of number
one bulkhead needed to be more pronounced as the 1/4 "tortures" more
easily. I would suggest making that curve bulge out about maybe 3/8
inch more in the centre, to avoid having to fill in a gap as I did.
Also consider making the cabin roof from two layers of 1/4 inch to
make the bending easier up there. Some builders report difficulty in
getting the edges fastened down without distortion when they used 1/2
inch.
It's a good design to build, there's a friendly network of builders
to give advice (whether you want it or not), and you get a great boat
at the end of it all.
Jamie Orr
--- In bolger@y..., "Sean" <mcgrew@w...> wrote:
> I was wondering if anyone who has built and sailed a chebacco 20
> sheet ply can tell me if added lead ballast is needed, or if
building
> to plans is satisfactory. I was reading the beach cat letter in
the
> Files section and adding 200 pounds of lead to the keel was
mentioned.
>
> At this point, I'm studying the plans to make sure I know how
> everything goes together, and I have two quotes on the plywood, so
I
> can get the wood ordered and get to making sawdust. I read
something
> (in Chebacco News, I think) about eliminating the limber holes in
the
> cabin area to keep the water out, but am unclear about which ones
and
> why exactly that would work.
>
> Any other modifications that I should be thinking about at this
point?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Sean
I was wondering if anyone who has built and sailed a chebacco 20
sheet ply can tell me if added lead ballast is needed, or if building
to plans is satisfactory. I was reading the beach cat letter in the
Files section and adding 200 pounds of lead to the keel was mentioned.
At this point, I'm studying the plans to make sure I know how
everything goes together, and I have two quotes on the plywood, so I
can get the wood ordered and get to making sawdust. I read something
(in Chebacco News, I think) about eliminating the limber holes in the
cabin area to keep the water out, but am unclear about which ones and
why exactly that would work.
Any other modifications that I should be thinking about at this point?
Thanks,
Sean
sheet ply can tell me if added lead ballast is needed, or if building
to plans is satisfactory. I was reading the beach cat letter in the
Files section and adding 200 pounds of lead to the keel was mentioned.
At this point, I'm studying the plans to make sure I know how
everything goes together, and I have two quotes on the plywood, so I
can get the wood ordered and get to making sawdust. I read something
(in Chebacco News, I think) about eliminating the limber holes in the
cabin area to keep the water out, but am unclear about which ones and
why exactly that would work.
Any other modifications that I should be thinking about at this point?
Thanks,
Sean