Re: Wood for Rubens Nymph-a budget issue
i wonder if you would be "fighting delamination" if you had fully
glassed your "garbage plywood" inside and out?? i bet that you would
not be.
bill in nc
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hector" <bruce_hector@h...>
wrote:
glassed your "garbage plywood" inside and out?? i bet that you would
not be.
bill in nc
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hector" <bruce_hector@h...>
wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "witts_end.geo" <waffleiron@c...>but
>
> I was planning on not glassing the bottom of mine as well.
>
> :That's good logic for a trailler/dry storage boat. Glass the seams
> and keep her painted. She'll last a long time, maybe not forever,
> a long time. I didn't glass the outside of my Seagull, I just planto
> take care of her, keep her off the rocks and sharps, and re-varnishtrust
> every winter.
>
> This project is a test to determine if I can build a boat.
>
> :Good, but flawed, (because anyone can build a boat with epoxy,
> me, as Phil says, it's the incompetents friend) I felt the sameway,
> and built my first two (a Diablo and a Nymph) from garbage qualityand
> mahogany undelay. Now, two years later, I'm fighting delamination
> splitting at every turn. ut the boats still work fine. All vesselslikely
> since have been highest quality marine ply, well OK, not TIMS.
>
> I'll build more.
>
> : Yep, you sure will!
>
> 2) It will only be in the water when used. We will also most
> store it in our garage.
>
> Good, no-one will steal it then, of course, no-one steals homemade
> wooden boats anyway. Just try to sell one!
>
> 3) I can't budget a lot of money for the project, but I can't stand
> sitting here reading about building boats any longer. Must...build.
>
> :Now, why would ANYONE feel that way, after reading in this group,
> pondering Phil's books and quaffing the odd beer. Seems strange to
> me... Build a boat? Madness! Young man, madness!
>
> Does this sound reasonable, or am I still off my rocker
>
> :I hope so. If not, you're off your rocker, but who isn't.
>
> Bruce Hector
>http://www.brucesboats.com
--- "witts_end.geo" wrote:
There is truth to the premise
that you can build two non-glassed
boats for the cost of one glassed
boat.
Building boats is so fun, that
quick and dirty non-glassed boats
are a genuine option. View them
as disposable, shorter term toys.
My Roar rowboat, el-cheapo luan ply, minimal
polyester resin and glass on the seams
and only the middle panel of the bottom
shows wear and neglect after eight years,
but is still darn servicable.
Many Bolger designs, expecially the
simpler ones and the older ones do not
specify the use of fiberglass and resin.
Personally, I would splurge on that 5 ply
mahogany 1/4" Meranti plywood $37/sheet.
An excellent value.
> Must...build.I can relate!
There is truth to the premise
that you can build two non-glassed
boats for the cost of one glassed
boat.
Building boats is so fun, that
quick and dirty non-glassed boats
are a genuine option. View them
as disposable, shorter term toys.
My Roar rowboat, el-cheapo luan ply, minimal
polyester resin and glass on the seams
and only the middle panel of the bottom
shows wear and neglect after eight years,
but is still darn servicable.
Many Bolger designs, expecially the
simpler ones and the older ones do not
specify the use of fiberglass and resin.
Personally, I would splurge on that 5 ply
mahogany 1/4" Meranti plywood $37/sheet.
An excellent value.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "witts_end.geo" <waffleiron@c...>
I was planning on not glassing the bottom of mine as well.
:That's good logic for a trailler/dry storage boat. Glass the seams
and keep her painted. She'll last a long time, maybe not forever, but
a long time. I didn't glass the outside of my Seagull, I just plan to
take care of her, keep her off the rocks and sharps, and re-varnish
every winter.
This project is a test to determine if I can build a boat.
:Good, but flawed, (because anyone can build a boat with epoxy, trust
me, as Phil says, it's the incompetents friend) I felt the same way,
and built my first two (a Diablo and a Nymph) from garbage quality
mahogany undelay. Now, two years later, I'm fighting delamination and
splitting at every turn. ut the boats still work fine. All vessels
since have been highest quality marine ply, well OK, not TIMS.
I'll build more.
: Yep, you sure will!
2) It will only be in the water when used. We will also most likely
store it in our garage.
Good, no-one will steal it then, of course, no-one steals homemade
wooden boats anyway. Just try to sell one!
3) I can't budget a lot of money for the project, but I can't stand
sitting here reading about building boats any longer. Must...build.
:Now, why would ANYONE feel that way, after reading in this group,
pondering Phil's books and quaffing the odd beer. Seems strange to
me... Build a boat? Madness! Young man, madness!
Does this sound reasonable, or am I still off my rocker
:I hope so. If not, you're off your rocker, but who isn't.
Bruce Hector
http://www.brucesboats.com
I was planning on not glassing the bottom of mine as well.
:That's good logic for a trailler/dry storage boat. Glass the seams
and keep her painted. She'll last a long time, maybe not forever, but
a long time. I didn't glass the outside of my Seagull, I just plan to
take care of her, keep her off the rocks and sharps, and re-varnish
every winter.
This project is a test to determine if I can build a boat.
:Good, but flawed, (because anyone can build a boat with epoxy, trust
me, as Phil says, it's the incompetents friend) I felt the same way,
and built my first two (a Diablo and a Nymph) from garbage quality
mahogany undelay. Now, two years later, I'm fighting delamination and
splitting at every turn. ut the boats still work fine. All vessels
since have been highest quality marine ply, well OK, not TIMS.
I'll build more.
: Yep, you sure will!
2) It will only be in the water when used. We will also most likely
store it in our garage.
Good, no-one will steal it then, of course, no-one steals homemade
wooden boats anyway. Just try to sell one!
3) I can't budget a lot of money for the project, but I can't stand
sitting here reading about building boats any longer. Must...build.
:Now, why would ANYONE feel that way, after reading in this group,
pondering Phil's books and quaffing the odd beer. Seems strange to
me... Build a boat? Madness! Young man, madness!
Does this sound reasonable, or am I still off my rocker
:I hope so. If not, you're off your rocker, but who isn't.
Bruce Hector
http://www.brucesboats.com
Similar to Joe, I am also gearing up to build my first boat. I"m
not buildin a Nymph. I'm building Ira's (don't remember the last
name) double paddle dory.
I was planning on not glassing the bottom of mine as well. I'm not
sure what Joe's reasoning is, but these are my reasons:
1) This project is a test to determine if I can build a boat. If
I succeed, I'll build more. If I fail, I want to cut my losses.
As such, I want a usable boat in the end, but I'm willing to
compromise a little in case it turns out to be firewood.
2) It will only be in the water when used. We will also most likely
store it in our garage.
3) I can't budget a lot of money for the project, but I can't stand
sitting here reading about building boats any longer.
Must...build.
Does this sound reasonable, or am I still off my rocker. I've been
studying like crazy, but I'm still ignorant.
BTW, I enjoy reading the group. Thanks for sharing opinions and
experiences.
not buildin a Nymph. I'm building Ira's (don't remember the last
name) double paddle dory.
I was planning on not glassing the bottom of mine as well. I'm not
sure what Joe's reasoning is, but these are my reasons:
1) This project is a test to determine if I can build a boat. If
I succeed, I'll build more. If I fail, I want to cut my losses.
As such, I want a usable boat in the end, but I'm willing to
compromise a little in case it turns out to be firewood.
2) It will only be in the water when used. We will also most likely
store it in our garage.
3) I can't budget a lot of money for the project, but I can't stand
sitting here reading about building boats any longer.
Must...build.
Does this sound reasonable, or am I still off my rocker. I've been
studying like crazy, but I'm still ignorant.
BTW, I enjoy reading the group. Thanks for sharing opinions and
experiences.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "bill shamblin" <shamblin@h...> wrote:
> hate to hear about someone trying to skimp on glassing the hull.
it
> changes a 3 year boat to a 30 year boat. plywood MUST be kept dry.
> you will hear all kinds of stories about how long this or that
boat
> survived without glassing the hull, but for a plywood boat that is
> really used it is a constant struggle without glassing, which need
> not be that intimidating. fiberglass for day sailers, epoxyglass
for
> boats that stay in the water. inside is as important as out
because
> sooner or later the hull will collect some rainwater and youll be
> screwed without it.
>
> the old saw for saving on plywood is buy cheaper and 1 size
thicker.
> hull weight doesnt matter much on a trailer and in the water and
may
> even help sailing properties.
>
>
> assembling with drywall screws and apower drill so screws can be
left
> in when covering saves time effort.
>
> large un-spliced quarterround works well for chine logs with the
> epoxy method up to 16 feet.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "jsomera1972" <jsomera1972@y...>
wrote:
> > After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens
> nymph
> > as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so
I've
> > been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project,
> while
> > still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
> > safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that
I
> > would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about
> other
> > various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat
with
> > occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to
have
> the
> > checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
> > sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
> > sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would
double
> > taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
> > issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the
> numbers
> > to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building
it
> > with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are
that
> > 1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of
cheap
> > ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
> > cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
> > epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I
> totally
> > off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
> > thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other
possible
> > money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
> > Joe
I think, if you go the glass/epoxy route, you can save money by using
Raka epoxy (www.raka.com) and 1 oz glass cloth. I got my glass from, as
I recall, www.defenderus.com. The light cloth is a bit more of a pain to
put on, but it uses less epoxy and is cheap. Also, this combo is so
light that people have used it to finish model airplanes with, though in
that case I bet the use of epoxy is more sparing and a lot more care per
square inch is taken. My Nymph (not Rubens) is done this way, tho I
think I used 6 oz on the bottom. No checking so far, seems to be a
durable finish. I think it's been two years or so, stored outside much
of the time, but not in the sun. Light weight is definitely something to
try for; I think light boats get used more as it's easier to haul them
around. In our case boat usage is often prevented by my s.o.'s
reluctance to deal with preparation, etc. so a lighter boat helps some,
plus sometimes my back is sore but I can still pick up the Nymph. This
weight issue might make occume a good choice, but I can't claim to know
much about it. My Nymph is mystery wood as it was an abandoned project I
picked up.
If I was building a Rubens Nymph and I was concerned about the middle
panel oilcanning, instead of buying a sheet of 3/8 just for that one
piece, I'd see if I couldn't put a stringer down the middle, maybe on
the inside. Making more than one panel out of it would make the boat a
lot heavier. Or maybe I'd just use 6 oz glass inside and outside in that
area. Preferably uniglass, but now we're talking something fancy. I'm
kind of surprised that oil canning would be a problem as there's a lot
of curve to that panel.
If you are patient, you might see if you can find some luan that doesn't
fall apart when you whisper "water", as this stuff doesn't seem to check
easily. However, people have had variable results with luan's durability
and if you think there's any chance that the boat will sit with water in
it for long, don't use it. If you have the good stuff and store it
carefully, then paint should be enough to prevent luan from checking for
a long time. The price is right.
I think given glass sheathing the fir should be MORE durable than
occume, but also heavier. I did a glassed fir underlayment dinghy last
year (or was it the year before?) for a friend and it seems to be
working out very well. However, it was a bit heavier than I might have
liked. The glass was structurally necessary in places because all 3
plies were equal thickness so that the middle layer contributed very
little thickness or strength in the crosswise direction. BTW, it
apparently makes a great yacht tender: tows well, rows well, good
capacity. Apparently it even fits the ramp it was designed for
(gunwhales on inside). Pretty ugly but very simple.
Raka epoxy (www.raka.com) and 1 oz glass cloth. I got my glass from, as
I recall, www.defenderus.com. The light cloth is a bit more of a pain to
put on, but it uses less epoxy and is cheap. Also, this combo is so
light that people have used it to finish model airplanes with, though in
that case I bet the use of epoxy is more sparing and a lot more care per
square inch is taken. My Nymph (not Rubens) is done this way, tho I
think I used 6 oz on the bottom. No checking so far, seems to be a
durable finish. I think it's been two years or so, stored outside much
of the time, but not in the sun. Light weight is definitely something to
try for; I think light boats get used more as it's easier to haul them
around. In our case boat usage is often prevented by my s.o.'s
reluctance to deal with preparation, etc. so a lighter boat helps some,
plus sometimes my back is sore but I can still pick up the Nymph. This
weight issue might make occume a good choice, but I can't claim to know
much about it. My Nymph is mystery wood as it was an abandoned project I
picked up.
If I was building a Rubens Nymph and I was concerned about the middle
panel oilcanning, instead of buying a sheet of 3/8 just for that one
piece, I'd see if I couldn't put a stringer down the middle, maybe on
the inside. Making more than one panel out of it would make the boat a
lot heavier. Or maybe I'd just use 6 oz glass inside and outside in that
area. Preferably uniglass, but now we're talking something fancy. I'm
kind of surprised that oil canning would be a problem as there's a lot
of curve to that panel.
If you are patient, you might see if you can find some luan that doesn't
fall apart when you whisper "water", as this stuff doesn't seem to check
easily. However, people have had variable results with luan's durability
and if you think there's any chance that the boat will sit with water in
it for long, don't use it. If you have the good stuff and store it
carefully, then paint should be enough to prevent luan from checking for
a long time. The price is right.
I think given glass sheathing the fir should be MORE durable than
occume, but also heavier. I did a glassed fir underlayment dinghy last
year (or was it the year before?) for a friend and it seems to be
working out very well. However, it was a bit heavier than I might have
liked. The glass was structurally necessary in places because all 3
plies were equal thickness so that the middle layer contributed very
little thickness or strength in the crosswise direction. BTW, it
apparently makes a great yacht tender: tows well, rows well, good
capacity. Apparently it even fits the ramp it was designed for
(gunwhales on inside). Pretty ugly but very simple.
>Joe wrote:
>
>After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens nymph
>as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
>been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project, while
>still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
>safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
>would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about other
>various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
>occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have the
>checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
>sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
>sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
>taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
>issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the numbers
>to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
>with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
>1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
>ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
>cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
>epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I totally
>off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
>thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
>money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
>Joe
>
hate to hear about someone trying to skimp on glassing the hull. it
changes a 3 year boat to a 30 year boat. plywood MUST be kept dry.
you will hear all kinds of stories about how long this or that boat
survived without glassing the hull, but for a plywood boat that is
really used it is a constant struggle without glassing, which need
not be that intimidating. fiberglass for day sailers, epoxyglass for
boats that stay in the water. inside is as important as out because
sooner or later the hull will collect some rainwater and youll be
screwed without it.
the old saw for saving on plywood is buy cheaper and 1 size thicker.
hull weight doesnt matter much on a trailer and in the water and may
even help sailing properties.
assembling with drywall screws and apower drill so screws can be left
in when covering saves time effort.
large un-spliced quarterround works well for chine logs with the
epoxy method up to 16 feet.
changes a 3 year boat to a 30 year boat. plywood MUST be kept dry.
you will hear all kinds of stories about how long this or that boat
survived without glassing the hull, but for a plywood boat that is
really used it is a constant struggle without glassing, which need
not be that intimidating. fiberglass for day sailers, epoxyglass for
boats that stay in the water. inside is as important as out because
sooner or later the hull will collect some rainwater and youll be
screwed without it.
the old saw for saving on plywood is buy cheaper and 1 size thicker.
hull weight doesnt matter much on a trailer and in the water and may
even help sailing properties.
assembling with drywall screws and apower drill so screws can be left
in when covering saves time effort.
large un-spliced quarterround works well for chine logs with the
epoxy method up to 16 feet.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "jsomera1972" <jsomera1972@y...> wrote:
> After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens
nymph
> as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
> been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project,
while
> still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
> safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
> would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about
other
> various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
> occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have
the
> checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
> sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
> sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
> taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
> issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the
numbers
> to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
> with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
> 1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
> ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
> cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
> epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I
totally
> off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
> thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
> money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
> Joe
Having spent the last two weekends sanding fir ply with lots of
checks on my 17" console skiff. I would take a little more time and
glass it. I did epoxy coat the topsides but used no glass and this
has proven to be a mistake. I have heard folks mention that they
have used 2-6 oz cloth to glass the interiors like this and the
checking has not occured. If it were my money I might splurge a
little on the glass and epoxy regardless of ply choices. I have not
been blessed to have built any boats with all marine ply I always
seem to have at least one sheet of Home Depots finest in there (Most
of my boats are all Home Depot wood actually).
checks on my 17" console skiff. I would take a little more time and
glass it. I did epoxy coat the topsides but used no glass and this
has proven to be a mistake. I have heard folks mention that they
have used 2-6 oz cloth to glass the interiors like this and the
checking has not occured. If it were my money I might splurge a
little on the glass and epoxy regardless of ply choices. I have not
been blessed to have built any boats with all marine ply I always
seem to have at least one sheet of Home Depots finest in there (Most
of my boats are all Home Depot wood actually).
Joe,
I don't have nearly as much experience as some of the other builders
here but here is my two cents worth.
I just built a regular sized nymph as my first boat and I only had
about $50 total in wood (1/4" exterior ply from Loew's), and that
includes gunnels, seat, etc. The fiberglass sheathing ended up
costing around $200 but I was wasteful during the learning process
and used West system which is expensive (I also have a 1/2 gal left -
perfect excuse to start another boat :). I checked after I had
finished and if I had upgraded to marine ply I would have added less
than $25 to the total ($10 a sheet vs $22). On the other hand, I
spent a ton of time filling voids and knot holes and had one of the
frames crack and have to be recut because I missed a void that went
all the way through. If I had to do it again I would use the best
grade of ply I could. I think you could probably get away with
double taping the seams provided the second tape was a little wider
than the first.
One other hint before you start - I haven't seen plans for the
rubens nymph but I understand that the only real difference is the
bottom is wider than the original. I read on someones site while I
was trying to decide what to build that they had oilcanning problems
using 1/4" ply on the bottom of the rubens nymph. A bottom skid or
upgrading to 3/8" might help.
Good Luck and have fun,
Regards,
Doug
I don't have nearly as much experience as some of the other builders
here but here is my two cents worth.
I just built a regular sized nymph as my first boat and I only had
about $50 total in wood (1/4" exterior ply from Loew's), and that
includes gunnels, seat, etc. The fiberglass sheathing ended up
costing around $200 but I was wasteful during the learning process
and used West system which is expensive (I also have a 1/2 gal left -
perfect excuse to start another boat :). I checked after I had
finished and if I had upgraded to marine ply I would have added less
than $25 to the total ($10 a sheet vs $22). On the other hand, I
spent a ton of time filling voids and knot holes and had one of the
frames crack and have to be recut because I missed a void that went
all the way through. If I had to do it again I would use the best
grade of ply I could. I think you could probably get away with
double taping the seams provided the second tape was a little wider
than the first.
One other hint before you start - I haven't seen plans for the
rubens nymph but I understand that the only real difference is the
bottom is wider than the original. I read on someones site while I
was trying to decide what to build that they had oilcanning problems
using 1/4" ply on the bottom of the rubens nymph. A bottom skid or
upgrading to 3/8" might help.
Good Luck and have fun,
Regards,
Doug
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Leinweber" <chuck@d...> wrote:
> Joe:
>
> You don't "have" to do a full fiberglass sheath on fir ply.
Checking is only a cosmetic problem, and does not keep a boat from
floating. Douglas Fir has a lot going for it: such as high strength
to weight ratio, and good rot resistance. For a knock around boat
that you do not need to keep in a pristine condition, it would be a
good choice. If you want a gold plater, well....
>
> At a messabout on the gulf coast this summer, I had the pleasure
of sailing in a 20 year old home built Sabot. It was made entirely
of Doug Fir and had a bedsheet for a sail. It really looked awful,
but the family that owned the boat probably had more fun with it for
less money than 99% of all the boats ever made.
>
> Chuck
> After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens
nymph
> as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so
I've
> been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project,
while
> still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
> safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that
I
> would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about
other
> various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat
with
> occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to
have the
> checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
> sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
> sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would
double
> taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
> issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the
numbers
> to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building
it
> with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are
that
> 1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of
cheap
> ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
> cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
> epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I
totally
> off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
> thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other
possible
> money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
> Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joe:
You don't "have" to do a full fiberglass sheath on fir ply. Checking is only a cosmetic problem, and does not keep a boat from floating. Douglas Fir has a lot going for it: such as high strength to weight ratio, and good rot resistance. For a knock around boat that you do not need to keep in a pristine condition, it would be a good choice. If you want a gold plater, well....
At a messabout on the gulf coast this summer, I had the pleasure of sailing in a 20 year old home built Sabot. It was made entirely of Doug Fir and had a bedsheet for a sail. It really looked awful, but the family that owned the boat probably had more fun with it for less money than 99% of all the boats ever made.
Chuck
After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens nymph
as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project, while
still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about other
various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have the
checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the numbers
to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I totally
off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
Joe
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
You don't "have" to do a full fiberglass sheath on fir ply. Checking is only a cosmetic problem, and does not keep a boat from floating. Douglas Fir has a lot going for it: such as high strength to weight ratio, and good rot resistance. For a knock around boat that you do not need to keep in a pristine condition, it would be a good choice. If you want a gold plater, well....
At a messabout on the gulf coast this summer, I had the pleasure of sailing in a 20 year old home built Sabot. It was made entirely of Doug Fir and had a bedsheet for a sail. It really looked awful, but the family that owned the boat probably had more fun with it for less money than 99% of all the boats ever made.
Chuck
After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens nymph
as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project, while
still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about other
various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have the
checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the numbers
to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I totally
off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
Joe
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am pretty new to boat building myself and have only built two small
craft but here are my two cents. There are several options that fall
between occume and ACX. Marinetech and Aquatech are both more
affordable than occume and don't check like fir. They don't bend as
easily as occume and will increase the weight of your boat. One
thing about I did not sheathed either boat in glass cloth but did
coat the boats inside and out with epoxy and good primer and paint.
I have not built Rubens Nymph but if memory serves sheathing the hull
with glass is not required. When you are done and look at the total
cost of your boat you will realize that the diffence in the cost of
the ply is a small percentage of the overall expense - I would not
skimp here - get some good ply. There are people that post here that
have more boat building skill in their hangnails than I have in my
whole body, I'm sure they will correct me on this. Hope this is
helpfull.
Scott
craft but here are my two cents. There are several options that fall
between occume and ACX. Marinetech and Aquatech are both more
affordable than occume and don't check like fir. They don't bend as
easily as occume and will increase the weight of your boat. One
thing about I did not sheathed either boat in glass cloth but did
coat the boats inside and out with epoxy and good primer and paint.
I have not built Rubens Nymph but if memory serves sheathing the hull
with glass is not required. When you are done and look at the total
cost of your boat you will realize that the diffence in the cost of
the ply is a small percentage of the overall expense - I would not
skimp here - get some good ply. There are people that post here that
have more boat building skill in their hangnails than I have in my
whole body, I'm sure they will correct me on this. Hope this is
helpfull.
Scott
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "jsomera1972" <jsomera1972@y...> wrote:
> After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens
nymph
> as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
> been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project,
while
> still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
> safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
> would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about
other
> various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
> occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have
the
> checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
> sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
> sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
> taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
> issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the
numbers
> to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
> with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
> 1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
> ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
> cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
> epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I
totally
> off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
> thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
> money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
> Joe
After much deliberation, I've decided that will build a Rubens nymph
as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project, while
still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about other
various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have the
checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the numbers
to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I totally
off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
Joe
as my first boat. As most of us, I'm on a limited budget, so I've
been trying to figure out ways to save money with this project, while
still ending up with a quality boat (meaning one that will float
safely and last for many years). I was originally thinking that I
would build it with ¼" ACX ply. Then I got to wondering about other
various marine grade ply woods. If I were to build the boat with
occume, which from what I have read so far, does not seem to have the
checking problems associated with fir ply, would I still have to
sheath it with fiberglass? I understand that the fibergalss
sheathing provides some of the boat's rigidity. But would double
taping the seams , in lieu of a full sheathing, help with this
issue? The questions may be mute as I have not crunched the numbers
to get an idea of the cost of doing it this way versus building it
with fir ply and full fg sheathing. My thoughts, however, are that
1) a boat made with occume would last longer than one made of cheap
ply, 2) I could save some money by not having to buy fiberglass
cloth , 3) I could save more money by not having to buy as much
epoxy. I try to think outside of the box sometimes, but am I totally
off base here? Anyhow, I would appreciate hearing any of your
thoughts. I would also greatly appreciate hearing other possible
money saving tips. Thanks in advance,
Joe