AS-29 ballast - Re: plastic coating
My AF3, Cream Cheese, cost 2300 without the trailer, but I could have
gotten it down to 1500 if I had really tried which I wasn't. An I
only used ACX plywood since she is a little trailer sailor.
http://www.geocities.com/sanmi/creamcheese/costs.html
She weighs about 350 lbs with gear.
1500/350 = $4.3 BBU (boat baloney units)
2300/350 = $6.5 BBU
Maybe we should make a poll - "What is your boat's BBU?"
Frank
gotten it down to 1500 if I had really tried which I wasn't. An I
only used ACX plywood since she is a little trailer sailor.
http://www.geocities.com/sanmi/creamcheese/costs.html
She weighs about 350 lbs with gear.
1500/350 = $4.3 BBU (boat baloney units)
2300/350 = $6.5 BBU
Maybe we should make a poll - "What is your boat's BBU?"
Frank
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> --- Peter Lenihan wrote:
> > $6.50-$7.00 CAN.......just for the boat
>
> So, my 1,200 lb Micro Navigator
> would cost $8K Canadian?
>
> I might be fooling myself, but
> my mental accounting ledger still
> totals less than $1,000.
>
> [Not counting bandaids, tools,
> electric bill, coffee, rent paid
> for my garage/shop, karma.]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
how to tax"junk" but I figure it is just a question of time, not
desire.
Now,if they could just figure out how to get us some nice warm sunny
California weather up here all year long........I'd go back to voting
for the crooks:-)
Peter Lenihan
> Another little appreciated virtueNo argument there Bruce.....even our government has yet to figure out
> of the 'value added' of cheap and
> scrounged materials, [here in California
> at least], is that they are tax free!
how to tax"junk" but I figure it is just a question of time, not
desire.
Now,if they could just figure out how to get us some nice warm sunny
California weather up here all year long........I'd go back to voting
for the crooks:-)
Peter Lenihan
--- Peter Lenihan wrote:
and you *do* achieve a yacht finish,
very impressive!
My level of finish is more of the
'looks good from 50 feet' quality.
I do think that my work is strong,
though not all that smooth.
I would rather have *two* rough finish
boats: instead of *one* shiny boat.
Another little appreciated virtue
of the 'value added' of cheap and
scrounged materials, [here in California
at least], is that they are tax free!
> I really wanted a Micro YACHTI have seen photo's of your work,
and you *do* achieve a yacht finish,
very impressive!
My level of finish is more of the
'looks good from 50 feet' quality.
I do think that my work is strong,
though not all that smooth.
I would rather have *two* rough finish
boats: instead of *one* shiny boat.
Another little appreciated virtue
of the 'value added' of cheap and
scrounged materials, [here in California
at least], is that they are tax free!
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
Your Micro Navigator"could" cost that much......it all depends
on what standard you want to build to ;-). My Micro cost a kitten's
hair over $6000.00 CAN. to build in 1993 and I've got the bills to
prove it. Sure,I also could have gotten a gold medal in"dumpster
diving" too had I really worked at it but I was;
a)too damned lazy.
b)too damned stupid
c)too much of a fraddy cat
d)too damned proud
I suppose any of the above could be made to "fit" but in truth
I really wanted a Micro YACHT and a vessel to try out my growing
inventory of woodworking skills.The logic being that any big time
booboos would not cost me an arm and a leg on such a small boat.
As I gradually assemble WINDERMERE, I lean heavily on the
experiences gained through the MICRO and catch myself sometimes about
to make another booboo just in ther nick of time.........I am glad I
did my MICRO the way I did.
It all boils down to what your end objective is with a self
made boat.C'est la vie!
sincerely,
Peter Lenihan......who almost got spooked early this morning by what
I took to be FROST on the windshield.........
> --- Peter Lenihan wrote:Bruce,
> > $6.50-$7.00 CAN.......just for the boat
>
> So, my 1,200 lb Micro Navigator
> would cost $8K Canadian?
>
> I might be fooling myself, but
> my mental accounting ledger still
> totals less than $1,000.
>
> [Not counting bandaids, tools,
> electric bill, coffee, rent paid
> for my garage/shop, karma.]
Your Micro Navigator"could" cost that much......it all depends
on what standard you want to build to ;-). My Micro cost a kitten's
hair over $6000.00 CAN. to build in 1993 and I've got the bills to
prove it. Sure,I also could have gotten a gold medal in"dumpster
diving" too had I really worked at it but I was;
a)too damned lazy.
b)too damned stupid
c)too much of a fraddy cat
d)too damned proud
I suppose any of the above could be made to "fit" but in truth
I really wanted a Micro YACHT and a vessel to try out my growing
inventory of woodworking skills.The logic being that any big time
booboos would not cost me an arm and a leg on such a small boat.
As I gradually assemble WINDERMERE, I lean heavily on the
experiences gained through the MICRO and catch myself sometimes about
to make another booboo just in ther nick of time.........I am glad I
did my MICRO the way I did.
It all boils down to what your end objective is with a self
made boat.C'est la vie!
sincerely,
Peter Lenihan......who almost got spooked early this morning by what
I took to be FROST on the windshield.........
--- Peter Lenihan wrote:
would cost $8K Canadian?
I might be fooling myself, but
my mental accounting ledger still
totals less than $1,000.
[Not counting bandaids, tools,
electric bill, coffee, rent paid
for my garage/shop, karma.]
> $6.50-$7.00 CAN.......just for the boatSo, my 1,200 lb Micro Navigator
would cost $8K Canadian?
I might be fooling myself, but
my mental accounting ledger still
totals less than $1,000.
[Not counting bandaids, tools,
electric bill, coffee, rent paid
for my garage/shop, karma.]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Spelling" <richard@c...>
wrote:
to boat building site, no storage fees etc...etc...etc....you've
gotta give yerself some breathing room for a ton of ancilliary cost
and all of this over several months/years........
Peter Lenihan
wrote:
> Boat Baloney = $2 - $4 a pound.$6.50-$7.00 CAN.......just for the boat......no transportation cost
>
> 7300lbs displacement make this about a $15000 boat.
to boat building site, no storage fees etc...etc...etc....you've
gotta give yerself some breathing room for a ton of ancilliary cost
and all of this over several months/years........
Peter Lenihan
--- Richard Spelling wrote:
2,000 of lead equals only
30 five gallon buckets of
'free' wheel weights, melted
with 'scrounged' firewood
in 'salvaged' metal paint
buckets. Cost $0.
One sheet of 1/2 CDX plywood
weighs 50 pounds and costs
$22 = $0.44 per pound much
less than $2 to $4 / pound.
MDO is still less than $1/lb
and results in much epoxy, cloth
sandpaper and time saved.
Heck, Raka epoxy costs less than
$5 per pound.
Money only starts adding up when
you go out buying motors and the
electronics...motors can be
scrounged and electronics can be
skimped.
A poly tarp main sail on AS-29 might
be a stretch, but one could re-cut a
used sail found free by dumpster
diving at the marina. The mizzen
could be polytarp.
> Boat Baloney = $2 - $4 a pound.I can dream can't I? ...
2,000 of lead equals only
30 five gallon buckets of
'free' wheel weights, melted
with 'scrounged' firewood
in 'salvaged' metal paint
buckets. Cost $0.
One sheet of 1/2 CDX plywood
weighs 50 pounds and costs
$22 = $0.44 per pound much
less than $2 to $4 / pound.
MDO is still less than $1/lb
and results in much epoxy, cloth
sandpaper and time saved.
Heck, Raka epoxy costs less than
$5 per pound.
Money only starts adding up when
you go out buying motors and the
electronics...motors can be
scrounged and electronics can be
skimped.
A poly tarp main sail on AS-29 might
be a stretch, but one could re-cut a
used sail found free by dumpster
diving at the marina. The mizzen
could be polytarp.
Boat Baloney = $2 - $4 a pound.
7300lbs displacement make this about a $15000 boat.
7300lbs displacement make this about a $15000 boat.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank San Miguel" <sanmi@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:19 PM
Subject: [bolger] AS-29 ballast - Re: plastic coating
> 2000lbs lead.
> The total boat is 7300lbs displacement.
> The boat has significant positive boyancy.
>
> I couldn't find the note about foam and boyancy. Is it on the
> building key or the drawings?
>
> Frank
> Landenberg, PA
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> > --- dnjost wrote:
> > > reading the AS29
> > > discussions religiously.
> >
> > My collection of AS-29 plans
> > is in part illegible. I cannot
> > read the number describing the
> > amount of lead ballast...does
> > that really read 8,000 lbs!
> >
> > The other note that describes
> > 3,000 lbs of foam and 3,000 of
> > wood buoyancy would result in a
> > 'sinker'...but I thought that AS-29
> > had positive buoyancy. What am
> > I missing?
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject tohttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
--- Frank San Miguel wrote:
[and would love to read it!]. There
is a note on the drawing in the
chapter of the book BWAOM, but you
need a magnifying glass to read it.
"Total Foam Buoyancy 50 CF = 3,000 lbs.
Positive Buoyancy of wood structure about
3,000 lbs.: Boat will be stable with about
2 ft freeboard fully flooded."
The 2,000 of lead, I imagine, could be
cast into manhandle-able pieces. One
piece, 1 1/2" by 3 1/2" by 3' 4 1/2" would
weight about 100 lbs... ten per side.
about 1,800 board feet costing perhaps
$3,600 premium grade, or half that if
shop grade $1,800.
How much epoxy? 30 gallons? $995?
Plus, about the same labor as a Superbrick.
$4,000 for hull, $2,000 for sails, $2,000 for
motor.
>I have never read the building key,
> I couldn't find the note about foam
> and buoyancy. Is it on the
> building key or the drawings?
[and would love to read it!]. There
is a note on the drawing in the
chapter of the book BWAOM, but you
need a magnifying glass to read it.
"Total Foam Buoyancy 50 CF = 3,000 lbs.
Positive Buoyancy of wood structure about
3,000 lbs.: Boat will be stable with about
2 ft freeboard fully flooded."
The 2,000 of lead, I imagine, could be
cast into manhandle-able pieces. One
piece, 1 1/2" by 3 1/2" by 3' 4 1/2" would
weight about 100 lbs... ten per side.
> 2000lbs lead. The total boatI rough numbers, 5,300 lbs of wood is
> is 7300lbs displacement.
about 1,800 board feet costing perhaps
$3,600 premium grade, or half that if
shop grade $1,800.
How much epoxy? 30 gallons? $995?
Plus, about the same labor as a Superbrick.
$4,000 for hull, $2,000 for sails, $2,000 for
motor.
2000lbs lead.
The total boat is 7300lbs displacement.
The boat has significant positive boyancy.
I couldn't find the note about foam and boyancy. Is it on the
building key or the drawings?
Frank
Landenberg, PA
The total boat is 7300lbs displacement.
The boat has significant positive boyancy.
I couldn't find the note about foam and boyancy. Is it on the
building key or the drawings?
Frank
Landenberg, PA
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> --- dnjost wrote:
> > reading the AS29
> > discussions religiously.
>
> My collection of AS-29 plans
> is in part illegible. I cannot
> read the number describing the
> amount of lead ballast...does
> that really read 8,000 lbs!
>
> The other note that describes
> 3,000 lbs of foam and 3,000 of
> wood buoyancy would result in a
> 'sinker'...but I thought that AS-29
> had positive buoyancy. What am
> I missing?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Mi'ki <mike78612003@y...> wrote:
the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass.
and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and
permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus
surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned
eggs at room temperature for six months.
1. a gelatine from the swim bladder of sturgeon.
2. thin mica, used for windows as for a "Surrey with a fringe on the
top that you can roll right down in case there is a change in the
weather" and as for old kerosene heating stoves).
3. Any of various water-soluble silicate glass compounds used as a
preservative for eggs, in plaster and cement, and in various
purification and refining processes. Also called soluble glass, water
glass. (The 'glue' in corrugated paper boxes.)
> just located a possible proofing product, it is used to make eggssafe for long storage with out the use of refrigeration , you clean
the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass.
and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and
permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus
surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned
eggs at room temperature for six months.
>isinglass:
1. a gelatine from the swim bladder of sturgeon.
2. thin mica, used for windows as for a "Surrey with a fringe on the
top that you can roll right down in case there is a change in the
weather" and as for old kerosene heating stoves).
3. Any of various water-soluble silicate glass compounds used as a
preservative for eggs, in plaster and cement, and in various
purification and refining processes. Also called soluble glass, water
glass. (The 'glue' in corrugated paper boxes.)
--- dnjost wrote:
is in part illegible. I cannot
read the number describing the
amount of lead ballast...does
that really read 8,000 lbs!
The other note that describes
3,000 lbs of foam and 3,000 of
wood buoyancy would result in a
'sinker'...but I thought that AS-29
had positive buoyancy. What am
I missing?
> reading the AS29My collection of AS-29 plans
> discussions religiously.
is in part illegible. I cannot
read the number describing the
amount of lead ballast...does
that really read 8,000 lbs!
The other note that describes
3,000 lbs of foam and 3,000 of
wood buoyancy would result in a
'sinker'...but I thought that AS-29
had positive buoyancy. What am
I missing?
This is the stuff I used to coat the wooden mold for my Micro. I got
it from another builder of boats. It only took a small amount 2
pints? to coat the entire mold. The mold is still useable!
David Jost
"former owner of Firefly, reading the AS29 discussions religiously."
it from another builder of boats. It only took a small amount 2
pints? to coat the entire mold. The mold is still useable!
David Jost
"former owner of Firefly, reading the AS29 discussions religiously."
Maybe not - it depends on if it is still water soluble after it is
applied. I suspect that it is.
Bill
applied. I suspect that it is.
Bill
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
> Peter, I think you're correct. Maybe it WOULD pass the dishwasher
test....
>
> David Romasco
>
I remember that in England the stuff is called "isinglass", and my lttle
dictionary shows it as a product got from sturgeons.
Alvan Eames.
dictionary shows it as a product got from sturgeons.
Alvan Eames.
Peter, I think you're correct. Maybe it WOULD pass the dishwasher test....
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:30 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: plastic coating
molten lead?
Peter
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: pvanderwaart [mailto:pvanderw@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:30 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: plastic coating
> "water glass" is Sodium Silicate and has been around forever.Is this not the stuff used to line a wooden mold before a pour of
molten lead?
Peter
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> "water glass" is Sodium Silicate and has been around forever.Is this not the stuff used to line a wooden mold before a pour of
molten lead?
Peter
"water glass" is Sodium Silicate and has been around forever. We used to
get it at the drug store.
sodium silicate
n.
Any of various water-soluble silicate glass compounds used as a preservative
for eggs, in plaster and cement, and in various purification and refining
processes. Also called soluble glass, water glass.
Roger
derbyrm@...
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net
get it at the drug store.
sodium silicate
n.
Any of various water-soluble silicate glass compounds used as a preservative
for eggs, in plaster and cement, and in various purification and refining
processes. Also called soluble glass, water glass.
Roger
derbyrm@...
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net
----- Original Message -----
From: "JW Kelley"jonkel49@...
> Can you give us more information on this product? Dealers, specs
> anything.
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Mi'ki <mike78612003@y...> wrote:
> > just located a possible proofing product, it is used to make eggs
> safe for long storage with out the use of refrigeration , you clean
> the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass.
> and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and
> permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus
> surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned
> eggs at room temperature for six months.
Sheesh, this list covers ALL topics!
'Water glass' is simply sodium silicate dissolved in water. You can
probably obtain it at any commercial chemical supply house. Amount
dissolved controls viscosity (your experience may vary, in other words).
Suspect the coating wouldn't survive the dishwasher test.....
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: JW Kelley [mailto:jonkel49@...]
Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 11:51 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: plastic coating
Can you give us more information on this product? Dealers, specs
anything.
'Water glass' is simply sodium silicate dissolved in water. You can
probably obtain it at any commercial chemical supply house. Amount
dissolved controls viscosity (your experience may vary, in other words).
Suspect the coating wouldn't survive the dishwasher test.....
David Romasco
-----Original Message-----
From: JW Kelley [mailto:jonkel49@...]
Sent: Wednesday, October 01, 2003 11:51 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: plastic coating
Can you give us more information on this product? Dealers, specs
anything.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Mi'ki <mike78612003@y...> wrote:
> just located a possible proofing product, it is used to make eggs
safe for long storage with out the use of refrigeration , you clean
the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass.
and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and
permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus
surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned
eggs at room temperature for six months.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Can you give us more information on this product? Dealers, specs
anything.
anything.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Mi'ki <mike78612003@y...> wrote:
> just located a possible proofing product, it is used to make eggs
safe for long storage with out the use of refrigeration , you clean
the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass.
and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and
permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus
surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned
eggs at room temperature for six months.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
just located a possible proofing product, it is used to make eggs safe for long storage with out the use of refrigeration , you clean the fresh eggs and then coat with something called, water glass. and it is very cheap, it is supposed to penatrade the surface and permanently seal and its water proof, says it can go on any porus surface., has any one tried it, The label says it can keep cleaned eggs at room temperature for six months.
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]