fast motorsailer

would like to talk to someone who has built the fast motorsailer

Not a Bolger boat, but check out this comfortable cruiser that can be built in lengths 23- 27'.

http://www.boatdesigns.com/cgi-bin/store/web_store.cgi?page=coastalcrsr.html&&cart_id=4663265_5739

Ken

----- Original Message -----
From: Don Tyson
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 3:42 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: fast motorsailer

Peter,
Do yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted. I've never heard of it but it sounds interesting. I guess my real interest these days is exploring shallow inner-coastal and riverine areas. Of course I like sailing but it is the inability to cover an ground and keep a schedule that keeps people from visiting me for more than a daysail.
I had a wonderful sailing boat which I sold this past fall.....28' 1960 Pearson Triton. I found out I get very seasick on the ocean. On the IWC and associated bays where I can sail there is very little room for someting that draws 4'. A Tennessee could go vitually anywhere accross the flats. I will return to sailing again someday soon but it will be for daysailing small boats and dinghys.
I have looked at al the factory stuff out there, that I can afford, but it doesn't afford much!

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I like Champlain but I think I can get more speed for the same amount of miles covered and less buildng work. I guess when I see Champ, and all the other window boats, I guess I think of all that sill work as opposed to ply-sided structures which have aftermarket windows punched into them.

pvanderwaart <pvanderw@...> wrote:> Do yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted.

I suggested Retriever because it has the same speed potential as the
FMS. If you are willing to stick to displacement speed, i.e. 6 kts,
then Champlain is the boat.

Big Bolger Problem: too many choices.

Peter

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Yes , I know what you mean. Hollywood is one thing and then theres the reality most of us live in. However to up my chances of getting my sweetie on board I plan to eliminate the Porta-Potti in lew of a flusher of some sort.

Nels <arvent@...> wrote:--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Don Tyson wrote:

>> One thing I wanted to ask Nels is What type of "Babes" he might

meet while on his FMS as opposed to ones he might meet on a brand
new Hinckley.

Hmmm that is an interesting question, and of course purely
hypothetical on my part having noever been near either of these types
of boats.

I expect I would be more apt to meet someone who is more broadminded
and discerning on a FMS. Maybe not as attached to worldly goods and
fast cars? More into nature and quiet contemplation. Not afraid to be
unique and outside the circle of glitz and glamor. Not afraid to
handle the mainsheet and help out in cleaning out the porta potti.

Sorta like me;-)

Cheers, Nels

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I can barely see it clearly. What I see looks roomy.

Bruce Hector <bruce_hector@...> wrote:--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Don Tyson wrote: Do
yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted.

I posted a small pic of Retriever in the files at Bolger2. It's
names retriever thumb nail.jpg and is near the bottom of the files
list.

Bruce Hector

This was for sale in MAIB a few months ago with a better pic, but
all my maibs are in the frozen north.

Bolger rules!!!
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- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
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- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Do yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted.

I suggested Retriever because it has the same speed potential as the
FMS. If you are willing to stick to displacement speed, i.e. 6 kts,
then Champlain is the boat.

Big Bolger Problem: too many choices.

Peter

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Don Tyson <tysond99@y...> wrote:

>> One thing I wanted to ask Nels is What type of "Babes" he might

I saw a 35' cruising trawler last year that a man from Michigan built for himself 20 some years ago and every year he heads for FLA in it a 7 - 8 kts. It had a very small diesel in it that went forever on fuel.
The most interesting thing is that he had a mast like one that would be used to load freight onboard. It was short and stout and he said that when running or on a beam quarter he can usually set a sail on this stubby mast and turn off the engine and maintain the same speed. Of course he makes this trip in the fall and spring when there is plenty of wind.
One thing I wanted to ask Nels is What type of "Babes" he might meet while on his FMS as opposed to ones he might meet on a brand new Hinckley. Would these "Babes have the same qualities or would one set of "babes" be more enlightened?......Thank goodness I'm married to my "Babe" and won't need the boat for that reason. I do like Nels suggestion that sails are nice to brace against in choppy water. I don't know how important that is though on motorboats ( I never owned a motorboat yet). Heaving too is not a big issue to me on account of the areas where I sail are all narow w/sandy bottoms, I'd just drop the hook when needed.
Now Which boat(s) to build....................................................

Don

Bruce Hector <bruce_hector@...> wrote:
A sacn of the original version and PB&F's newest rendition with a
sloop rig are in bolger2 at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger2/files/Bolger%20scans/

I've been on Bob Cushing;s FMS (only in the garage, sadly) and it is
a very roomy, beemy cruiser.

I think the newer sloop version, with the smaller, round leeboards
is quite smart.

Bos'un Bruce
ps, Be sure to join Bolger2 and Bolger3 and look through all the
files and photos. Then you'll NEVER be able to decide on just ONE
Bolger boat. Many of us here suffer from the "Bet ya' can't build
just one...." syndrom.

Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Don Tyson <tysond99@y...> wrote: Do
yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted.

I posted a small pic of Retriever in the files at Bolger2. It's
names retriever thumb nail.jpg and is near the bottom of the files
list.

Bruce Hector

This was for sale in MAIB a few months ago with a better pic, but
all my maibs are in the frozen north.

Peter,
Do yo know where Pics of Retreiver is posted. I've never heard of it but it sounds interesting. I guess my real interest these days is exploring shallow inner-coastal and riverine areas. Of course I like sailing but it is the inability to cover an ground and keep a schedule that keeps people from visiting me for more than a daysail.
I had a wonderful sailing boat which I sold this past fall.....28' 1960 Pearson Triton. I found out I get very seasick on the ocean. On the IWC and associated bays where I can sail there is very little room for someting that draws 4'. A Tennessee could go vitually anywhere accross the flats. I will return to sailing again someday soon but it will be for daysailing small boats and dinghys.
I have looked at al the factory stuff out there, that I can afford, but it doesn't afford much!
For the uses mentioned above shallow draft and moderate speed toward any point of the compass, and good mpg are the key points. MPG is what it is whether in a displacement trawler with a 10horse motor or a planing boat i.e. FMS.
There is also 1-2' chop to contend with. In other words Clam Skiff, w/big motor and huge cabin, is not the answer either.
Something like tennessee is probly not comfy on the bay at speeds faster than 10-12mph and I assume that 18-25 would probly do it in late day chop for FMS.

I might eventually ask PCB alot more questions but before that I want to be more familiar with all the ins and outs of his work.

As far as having sails aboard for the reasons you cited I must say that some compromises might be made but for now I'm separating the two(sailing and motoring).
Don

pvanderwaart <pvanderw@...> wrote:

> I'd also have to wonder if I'd have bothered with the rig
> if the boat motored as well as he claims it does?

I'm not a motorboat guy, but Bolger has designed as many good rough-
water powerboats as anyone. If you have a specific question, ask him
directly. You can decide for yourself if you agree with using the
big, expensive engine to get 34 mph, or if you would be happy with
something less. I suppose (on the basis of no evidence) that he
cruises in the mid-twenties. Based on what I see on the docks near my
boat, the big engine is not out of line with current views on power.

If you are interested in a straight motorboat, then you have to
choose between the FMS and Retriever (the most obviously similar
straight powerboat). One might think that the latter would be the
clear choice since the design was not 'compromised' for some sailing
ability, but I'm not sure but what I like the layout of the FMS
better. And you could probably find 10 or more other PCB powerboat
designs in that size range with various capabilities and
constructions.

There are several reasons to have the motorsailer rather than a
straight powerboat. Here are some of the most obvious. 1) Amusement -
the opportunity to sail for pleasure when you are not going anywhere
in partcular. 2) Emergency power - you can get home despite engine
trouble or running out of gas. 3) Ability to boost the engine -
flying the sail while running the engine may reduce fuel consumption
and noise.

Peter

Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

A sacn of the original version and PB&F's newest rendition with a
sloop rig are in bolger2 at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger2/files/Bolger%20scans/

I've been on Bob Cushing;s FMS (only in the garage, sadly) and it is
a very roomy, beemy cruiser.

I think the newer sloop version, with the smaller, round leeboards
is quite smart.

Bos'un Bruce
ps, Be sure to join Bolger2 and Bolger3 and look through all the
files and photos. Then you'll NEVER be able to decide on just ONE
Bolger boat. Many of us here suffer from the "Bet ya' can't build
just one...." syndrom.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "pvanderwaart" <pvanderw@o...> wrote:

>> There are several reasons to have the motorsailer rather than a
> straight powerboat. Here are some of the most obvious. 1)

Amusement -

> the opportunity to sail for pleasure when you are not going

anywhere

> in partcular. 2) Emergency power - you can get home despite engine
> trouble or running out of gas. 3) Ability to boost the engine -
> flying the sail while running the engine may reduce fuel

consumption

> and noise.
>
> Peter

4. Ability to heave too and remain in one location without using the
motor.

5. Using the sail to steady the motion.

6. Ability to choose a course and create a change of scenery without
having to start the motor. Particularly if you added an autopilot or
self-steering gear.

7.Option to use a small motor like a T9.9 and makes some significant
passages with very small fuel requirements. (Canals, inland waterways
with wake restrictions, easier trailering.)

8. Give a choice of options that are entirely opposite to a motorboat.

9. Be the owner of a craft that would boggle everyone's pre-
conceptions.

10. Increased opportunities to meet babes. As well as having a
sailboat that would blow the doors off all the rest if you decided
you wanted to get away from them!

> I'd also have to wonder if I'd have bothered with the rig
> if the boat motored as well as he claims it does?

Peter , I've been to the site listed but couldn't find any friends to discuss it with at that site. I would love to ask some questions of the builder. I'd also have to wonder if I'd have bothered with the rig if the boat motored as well as he claims it does?

Don

pvanderwaart <pvanderw@...> wrote:

> I would like to hear more about FMS.

Here is a good website by a gentleman who was more interested in
power than sail. He used a big engine and ran at high speed. I think
this was the first built. On the boat, the house was carried a bit
farther forward, which I think is an improvement.

http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/fms.htm

Bolger published in MAIB about a boat in Germany that was pretty much
to plan including rig and leeboard. He also published an update with
a more conventional rig, I believe.

Peter

Bolger rules!!!
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- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
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- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> I would like to hear more about FMS.

I would like to hear more about FMS. Has anyone seen or built one of
these and is this an example of a power step sharpie of some other
type. It seems roomy and shallow.

I'm laying off the Tennessee Idea for now. It seems that if I built
a Tennessee I'd be expected to leave a walk-through hole in the roof
(to be athentic and PCB-like). Further, If I went up top to plug
that hole I'd be a "Bimbo".

Anyway FMS looks like it has a real roof. Looks typically roomy
like other Bolger boxes. Looks light. Looks classic yet unigue. Easy
to build?