[bolger] Re: durability in whitewater
Russ,
Great work! Looks like a functional quick and dirty river canoe. I
hope she takes good care of you. I couldn't get your page to work very
well. Only one image loaded. But I was able to save the "broken-?"
images and your html and view from my drive? Go figure.
Keep us posted!
'Member - boat in water - water out of boat!
david
Russ Ingram wrote:
SOME CLICKS THAT COUNT!!
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http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/featherwind.html
Quasi esoteric musical instruments
http://unicornstrings.com
Great work! Looks like a functional quick and dirty river canoe. I
hope she takes good care of you. I couldn't get your page to work very
well. Only one image loaded. But I was able to save the "broken-?"
images and your html and view from my drive? Go figure.
Keep us posted!
'Member - boat in water - water out of boat!
david
Russ Ingram wrote:
> tryhttp://members.xoom.com/russ_ingram/canoe.htm--
>
> "russ ingram"russingra-@...wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3468
> > I threw together a web page:
>http://members.xoom.com/russ_ingram/cano
> e.
> > htm ...just construction pics so far. Will add trip pics in a couple
>
> > of weeks if I survive! :)
> >
> > Russ
> >
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> eGroups.com Home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
> www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
SOME CLICKS THAT COUNT!!
Feed someone.
http://www.thehungersite.com/
Save a little rain forest.
http://rainforest.care2.com/front.html/player12296
Simplicity Boats (& mirror sites)
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/index.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/index.html
Here's my latest boat:
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/featherwind.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/featherwind.html
Quasi esoteric musical instruments
http://unicornstrings.com
tryhttp://members.xoom.com/russ_ingram/canoe.htm
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3468
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3468
> I threw together a web page:http://members.xoom.com/russ_ingram/canoe.
> htm ...just construction pics so far. Will add trip pics in a couple
> of weeks if I survive! :)
>
> Russ
>
I threw together a web page:http://members.xoom.com/russ_ingram/canoe.
htm ...just construction pics so far. Will add trip pics in a couple
of weeks if I survive! :)
Russ
htm ...just construction pics so far. Will add trip pics in a couple
of weeks if I survive! :)
Russ
what's a canoe full of water weigh?
Say, 17' long x 2' beam x 1' deep x 0.7 (allowance for taper at the
ends) * 62.4 lbs/cu ft = 1485 lbs.
approx. 3/4 ton.
Peter
Say, 17' long x 2' beam x 1' deep x 0.7 (allowance for taper at the
ends) * 62.4 lbs/cu ft = 1485 lbs.
approx. 3/4 ton.
Peter
Best plan is not to bash into the big ones. On my own canoe camping trips
I've seen the remains of two canoes that had gone down the rapid the wrong
way -- one was a production fibreglass model, and the other was aluminum.
Both had been torn in half (the aluminum had been pounded pretty well flat
to boot). I think the damage usually occurs after an upset, when the canoe
is full of water -- when it hits more rocks then, it effectively weighs a
ton or so (I haven't done the math, what's a canoe full of water weigh?) and
the hull breaks up quite easily. We had this happen to us on a small scale
-- the canoe hit a rockpile, tipped and filled, then rolled along a shallow
stretch. Both gunnels broke, one seat and the centre thwart popped out, and
the hull took several holes.
So what I started out to say is I would go with the 1/4 -- it should be
strong enough for normal use, scraping over the usually rounded river rocks.
That way it will be light over the portages, which can't be avoided as
easily as rocks.
Good Luck
Jamie Orr
-----Original Message-----
From: Russ Ingram [mailto:russingram@...]
Sent: Friday, March 03, 2000 7:14 PM
To:bolger@...
Subject: [bolger] durability in whitewater
Hi All,
I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
Thanks!
Russ
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I've seen the remains of two canoes that had gone down the rapid the wrong
way -- one was a production fibreglass model, and the other was aluminum.
Both had been torn in half (the aluminum had been pounded pretty well flat
to boot). I think the damage usually occurs after an upset, when the canoe
is full of water -- when it hits more rocks then, it effectively weighs a
ton or so (I haven't done the math, what's a canoe full of water weigh?) and
the hull breaks up quite easily. We had this happen to us on a small scale
-- the canoe hit a rockpile, tipped and filled, then rolled along a shallow
stretch. Both gunnels broke, one seat and the centre thwart popped out, and
the hull took several holes.
So what I started out to say is I would go with the 1/4 -- it should be
strong enough for normal use, scraping over the usually rounded river rocks.
That way it will be light over the portages, which can't be avoided as
easily as rocks.
Good Luck
Jamie Orr
-----Original Message-----
From: Russ Ingram [mailto:russingram@...]
Sent: Friday, March 03, 2000 7:14 PM
To:bolger@...
Subject: [bolger] durability in whitewater
Hi All,
I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
Thanks!
Russ
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We'll be floating the upper Buffalo River in Arkansas...just small
stretches of whitewater, and only if we get some rain between now and
when we go! I completed the glueing and screwing today, will sand and
paint in the next day or two. Pictures will be posted soon!
"jack e. bearden" <bearde-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3434
stretches of whitewater, and only if we get some rain between now and
when we go! I completed the glueing and screwing today, will sand and
paint in the next day or two. Pictures will be posted soon!
"jack e. bearden" <bearde-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3434
> Russ, what kind of whitewater are you facing on your trip? Anythingbeyond
> class 1 could be pretty scary in a flat bottom, hard chined boat. Thatgenerally
> grabbing principle mentioned earlier, combined with fast water
> results in being pivoted broadside to the current. Getting hit by aswamped
> conoe, even in knee deep water, is a bit like catching a log rollingoff a
> truck. Drift boats seem to be designed especially for "deep"whitewater
> where fetching up on rocks is less likely. Face front rowing and heavynever one
> rocker is what makes them so effective in whitewater. But hey, I'm
> to be a wet blanket. Especially since you've pretty well built theboat
> while others have chatted about it. Just get the hell out of the wayif she
> flips in the rapids and above all else make sure your food is inwaterproof
> containers. Have fun.
>
> jeb, still armchair sailing on the shores of Fundy
>
>
sounds like good stuff, but at $250, it's 4 times what i've put into
the boat!
"chuck leinweber" <chuc-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3432
the boat!
"chuck leinweber" <chuc-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3432
> Greg Tatman includes a UHMW plate for the bottom of his driftboatkits. I
> imagine he would sell one by itself, and more importantly, tell youhow to
> attach it.of
>
>http://www.gregboats.com/pages/uhmw.html
>
> Chuck Leinweber
> Duckworks Magazine
>http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lincoln Ross <lincolnr@...>
> To: <bolger@...>
> Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 10:23 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: durability in whitewater
>
>
> > "russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
> > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3426
> > > I have a sheet of 1/4" thick plastic (HDPE?) that I was thinking
> > > glueing/screwing to the bottom..snip
> >
> > Sounds heavy. Can you affort to lug that much around?
> >
> > Congrats on your quick construction!
> >
> >
Turns out it was only 1/8"...weighs about 10 lbs.
"lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3428
"lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3428
> "russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3426
> > I have a sheet of 1/4" thick plastic (HDPE?) that I was thinking of
> > glueing/screwing to the bottom..snip
>
> Sounds heavy. Can you affort to lug that much around?
>
> Congrats on your quick construction!
>
This could be educational! Please follow up on your return with a
description of your adventures. My two cents on emergency repair kit: Duct
tape.
description of your adventures. My two cents on emergency repair kit: Duct
tape.
Greg Tatman includes a UHMW plate for the bottom of his driftboat kits. I
imagine he would sell one by itself, and more importantly, tell you how to
attach it.
http://www.gregboats.com/pages/uhmw.html
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
imagine he would sell one by itself, and more importantly, tell you how to
attach it.
http://www.gregboats.com/pages/uhmw.html
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Lincoln Ross <lincolnr@...>
To: <bolger@...>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 10:23 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: durability in whitewater
> "russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3426
> > I have a sheet of 1/4" thick plastic (HDPE?) that I was thinking of
> > glueing/screwing to the bottom..snip
>
> Sounds heavy. Can you affort to lug that much around?
>
> Congrats on your quick construction!
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3426
Congrats on your quick construction!
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3426
> I have a sheet of 1/4" thick plastic (HDPE?) that I was thinking ofSounds heavy. Can you affort to lug that much around?
> glueing/screwing to the bottom..snip
Congrats on your quick construction!
Russ, what kind of whitewater are you facing on your trip? Anything beyond
class 1 could be pretty scary in a flat bottom, hard chined boat. That
grabbing principle mentioned earlier, combined with fast water generally
results in being pivoted broadside to the current. Getting hit by a swamped
conoe, even in knee deep water, is a bit like catching a log rolling off a
truck. Drift boats seem to be designed especially for "deep" whitewater
where fetching up on rocks is less likely. Face front rowing and heavy
rocker is what makes them so effective in whitewater. But hey, I'm never one
to be a wet blanket. Especially since you've pretty well built the boat
while others have chatted about it. Just get the hell out of the way if she
flips in the rapids and above all else make sure your food is in waterproof
containers. Have fun.
jeb, still armchair sailing on the shores of Fundy
class 1 could be pretty scary in a flat bottom, hard chined boat. That
grabbing principle mentioned earlier, combined with fast water generally
results in being pivoted broadside to the current. Getting hit by a swamped
conoe, even in knee deep water, is a bit like catching a log rolling off a
truck. Drift boats seem to be designed especially for "deep" whitewater
where fetching up on rocks is less likely. Face front rowing and heavy
rocker is what makes them so effective in whitewater. But hey, I'm never one
to be a wet blanket. Especially since you've pretty well built the boat
while others have chatted about it. Just get the hell out of the way if she
flips in the rapids and above all else make sure your food is in waterproof
containers. Have fun.
jeb, still armchair sailing on the shores of Fundy
I have a sheet of 1/4" thick plastic (HDPE?) that I was thinking of
glueing/screwing to the bottom...unfortunatly I don't have enough to
cover the entire bottom, so I was thinking of covering just the center
third of the boat. I got most of the boat built today...just need to
install the bow and stern transoms and build some flotation chambers,
then slap on a couple of coats of paint. I'll post some pics later.
Thanks for all the replies!
Russ
"lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3419
glueing/screwing to the bottom...unfortunatly I don't have enough to
cover the entire bottom, so I was thinking of covering just the center
third of the boat. I got most of the boat built today...just need to
install the bow and stern transoms and build some flotation chambers,
then slap on a couple of coats of paint. I'll post some pics later.
Thanks for all the replies!
Russ
"lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3419
> Based on my (extremely limited) whitewater experience, you might want
> to do something to make the bottom slippery. The contrast between
> sticking to every rock in an aluminum canoe and sliding over them all
> in a tupperware boat is educational. I should think plywood, bare or
> with most kinds of paint I can think of, would tend to stick. The one
> time I hit a rock in a plywood boat it stuck quite well, had to move
> around to tilt the boat to get free. Unfortunately, slippery things
> don't glue well. Not sure what to recommend.
>
> Also, I think someone else has mentioned that a good amount of rocker
> is a good idea, though in this case I'm afraid the recommendation is
> not based on personal experience.
>
Russ-
I suggest you give serious consideration to using 1/2" ply on the
bottom of your whitewater boat. My experience is that 1/4" ply (even
fiberglassed) won't hold up well under hard impact. I knocked a hole
all the way through the 1/4" BC pine plywood bottom (glassed inside and
out) of my 16' sailboat on a barely submerged stump while sailing a few
years ago; I was sailing in a large man-made lake and some of the trees
hadn't been cut before the reservior was flooded 30 years prior, and
this obstacle was not visible above the surface of the lake. We struck
it and it came right on through the bottom of the boat without any
trouble.
I don't think fiberglassing the bottom would make much difference if
you are banging into rocks in whitewater, and also thinking of only
getting a season's use of the boat.
I would also think it would be worth-while to carry some epoxy, a few
small scraps of fiberglass cloth, and filler of you choice to fix
cracks or holes.
Greg Rinaca
Coldspring, Tx.
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3407
I suggest you give serious consideration to using 1/2" ply on the
bottom of your whitewater boat. My experience is that 1/4" ply (even
fiberglassed) won't hold up well under hard impact. I knocked a hole
all the way through the 1/4" BC pine plywood bottom (glassed inside and
out) of my 16' sailboat on a barely submerged stump while sailing a few
years ago; I was sailing in a large man-made lake and some of the trees
hadn't been cut before the reservior was flooded 30 years prior, and
this obstacle was not visible above the surface of the lake. We struck
it and it came right on through the bottom of the boat without any
trouble.
I don't think fiberglassing the bottom would make much difference if
you are banging into rocks in whitewater, and also thinking of only
getting a season's use of the boat.
I would also think it would be worth-while to carry some epoxy, a few
small scraps of fiberglass cloth, and filler of you choice to fix
cracks or holes.
Greg Rinaca
Coldspring, Tx.
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3407
> Hi All,
>
> I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
> throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
> bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
> half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
> is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Russ
>
Based on my (extremely limited) whitewater experience, you might want
to do something to make the bottom slippery. The contrast between
sticking to every rock in an aluminum canoe and sliding over them all
in a tupperware boat is educational. I should think plywood, bare or
with most kinds of paint I can think of, would tend to stick. The one
time I hit a rock in a plywood boat it stuck quite well, had to move
around to tilt the boat to get free. Unfortunately, slippery things
don't glue well. Not sure what to recommend.
Also, I think someone else has mentioned that a good amount of rocker
is a good idea, though in this case I'm afraid the recommendation is
not based on personal experience.
to do something to make the bottom slippery. The contrast between
sticking to every rock in an aluminum canoe and sliding over them all
in a tupperware boat is educational. I should think plywood, bare or
with most kinds of paint I can think of, would tend to stick. The one
time I hit a rock in a plywood boat it stuck quite well, had to move
around to tilt the boat to get free. Unfortunately, slippery things
don't glue well. Not sure what to recommend.
Also, I think someone else has mentioned that a good amount of rocker
is a good idea, though in this case I'm afraid the recommendation is
not based on personal experience.
"Jeffrey L. West" wrote:
is used. Even if the glue is waterproof as in AC or BC ply when the end
grain starts to suck up the water the expansion and contraction causes
delamination. The glue doesn't "fail" (the glue is still in great shape)
there's just no wood attached to it!!
So I vote for paint even if it's a quick couple of coats of latex house
paint rolled on. Wont increase cost or time much. A minimum would be to
seal the ply edges with something.
djb
Feed someone.
http://www.thehungersite.com/
Save a little rain forest.
http://rainforest.care2.com/front.html/player12296
Simplicity Boats (& mirror sites)
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/index.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/index.html
Here's my latest boat:
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/featherwind.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/featherwind.html
Quasi esoteric musical instruments
http://unicornstrings.com
>In my experience it's critical to paint a plywood boat even if no epoxy
> > Is painting even neccessary?
> Not realy, no exposed epoxy to deteriorate in the sun, no paint
> needed.
> Be sure to use but blocks.
is used. Even if the glue is waterproof as in AC or BC ply when the end
grain starts to suck up the water the expansion and contraction causes
delamination. The glue doesn't "fail" (the glue is still in great shape)
there's just no wood attached to it!!
So I vote for paint even if it's a quick couple of coats of latex house
paint rolled on. Wont increase cost or time much. A minimum would be to
seal the ply edges with something.
djb
>SOME CLICKS THAT COUNT!!
>
Feed someone.
http://www.thehungersite.com/
Save a little rain forest.
http://rainforest.care2.com/front.html/player12296
Simplicity Boats (& mirror sites)
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/index.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/index.html
Here's my latest boat:
http://members.tripod.com/simplicityboats/featherwind.html
http://members.xoom.com/simpleboats/featherwind.html
Quasi esoteric musical instruments
http://unicornstrings.com
Russ,
I built a "Six-Hour Canoe" a couple of years ago for paddling around on
the river. If you're not familiar with it, it is a flat bottomed
double paddle canoe designed by a past 'WoodenBoat' editor I believe.
Construction was 1/4" plywwod (2 sheets scarfed together to make about
a 14-15' canoe with chine construction instead of stitch and glue.
Very pretty little boat and overall I loved it for solo paddling on the
calm waters we had, but I think it would have been a bit heavy for
whitewater work and the flat bottom wasn't particularily maneuverable
compared to other canoes I've paddled. (I felt the chines acted like
mini keels). You could probably get around this by increasing the
rocker a bit , but then you'd have to increase the hull depth to regain
an acceptable level of freeboard......weight climbs, the design
modification spiral again. To answer your question though I believe
the 1/4" bottom would have taken quite a bit of abuse because of the
chine log construction and a midpoint frame that stiffened the bottom
considerably.
My only other concern would be that <$100 may only get you a disposable
boat since epoxy is basically out for gluing and edge sealing due to
expense and being forced to use lower grades of plywood for cost
savings. I'm probably out of touch with prices in North America, but
the above canoe in Australia came in at around $200+ AUD with epoxy,
paint, varnish, 1/4" 'Hoop Pine' plywood (marine grade glue), and pine
for chines and framing material. Australian lumber prices may be quite
a bit higher though. I also always have a difficult time 'throwing'
woodworking projects together because I tend to feel wood deserves a
higher grade of finish, so my costs might be a bit higher because of
that.
Regards,
Mark Oliver
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3407
I built a "Six-Hour Canoe" a couple of years ago for paddling around on
the river. If you're not familiar with it, it is a flat bottomed
double paddle canoe designed by a past 'WoodenBoat' editor I believe.
Construction was 1/4" plywwod (2 sheets scarfed together to make about
a 14-15' canoe with chine construction instead of stitch and glue.
Very pretty little boat and overall I loved it for solo paddling on the
calm waters we had, but I think it would have been a bit heavy for
whitewater work and the flat bottom wasn't particularily maneuverable
compared to other canoes I've paddled. (I felt the chines acted like
mini keels). You could probably get around this by increasing the
rocker a bit , but then you'd have to increase the hull depth to regain
an acceptable level of freeboard......weight climbs, the design
modification spiral again. To answer your question though I believe
the 1/4" bottom would have taken quite a bit of abuse because of the
chine log construction and a midpoint frame that stiffened the bottom
considerably.
My only other concern would be that <$100 may only get you a disposable
boat since epoxy is basically out for gluing and edge sealing due to
expense and being forced to use lower grades of plywood for cost
savings. I'm probably out of touch with prices in North America, but
the above canoe in Australia came in at around $200+ AUD with epoxy,
paint, varnish, 1/4" 'Hoop Pine' plywood (marine grade glue), and pine
for chines and framing material. Australian lumber prices may be quite
a bit higher though. I also always have a difficult time 'throwing'
woodworking projects together because I tend to feel wood deserves a
higher grade of finish, so my costs might be a bit higher because of
that.
Regards,
Mark Oliver
"russ ingram" <russingra-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=3407
> Hi All,
>
> I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
> throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
> bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
> half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
> is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Russ
>
The comments in response my previous post were helpful.
----------
though, you wouldn't need that much and it's much more forgiving.
Be sure to use but blocks.
exterior fir, but blocks, exterior chine logs, epoxy glue, no paint.
Bang it up for a season, then give it away.
Make it as long as is reasonable.
--
Richard
Spelling|richard@...|http://www.spellingbusiness.com
SBE Communications, Business Solutions for the next Millennium and
Beyond!
Boat building projects:http://www.spellingbusiness.com/boats/
--
Jeff:
I'm with Richard on this one. You have to have some lumber (1x2's) for the
chines and gunwales. This is really no big deal, most lumber yards will
carry this size, so you shouldn't have to do any ripping. I wouldn't insist
on epoxy, though. Try the polyurethane in a tube.
Take a look at Fritz Funk's Wacky Lassie:
http://www.alaska.net/~fritzf/Boats/Wacky_Lassie/Wacky_Lassie.htm
If you read to the bottom, you will see that he has gone to external chine
logs for this boat because of the ease of construction.
Are you still planning on building that Idaho?
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.hilconet.com/~dworksmg
----------
----------
>From: "Jeff West" <jeffwest@...>Jeff West wrote:
>To:bolger@...
>Subject: [bolger] Desert river canoe design recommendations?
>Date: Sun, Jan 16, 2000, 10:43 PM
>
> Hi all,
> Here in Arizona we have some rivers that flow year round, flowing more
> during some months than others. Most of the time, like following March
> after the snow melt-off in the high country, one would drag bottom and
> bang around rocks between pools at 75-150 fps. None-the-less, I would
> like to throw something together for camping and such during those
> shallow times. Plastic is awsome stuff but "I don't want to".
>
> My thoughts gravitate towards a double paddle six-hour cajun canoe type
> of thing, but that seems too fragile, time consuming and expensive for
> this level of rough duty. What about a 2' wide plywood version of a
> scow like athttp://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/short/sci_am/scow_1876.
> html or a beefed up version of the pirogue athttp://www.unclejohns.com
> ? I could handle a single season of use out of a design, to be
> replaced with a new one each spring. Thus, the less expense the better.
>
> Is it possible to create such a beast out of just ACX and WeldWood with
> no lumber at all?
>
> Is no epoxy and glass, even on chines possible?
>
> Is painting even neccessary?
>
> So I guess what I need are suggestions for the design of a
> controllable, cartopable, one man and gear mini Ark design!
>
> Any ideas, ye creative problem solvers?
>
> Thanks,
> Jeff
>
> Is it possible to create such a beast out of just ACX and WeldWood withNot really, use lumber for chine logs.
> no lumber at all?
>
> Is no epoxy and glass, even on chines possible?exterior chine logs, you could get away with it. Best to use epoxy
>
though, you wouldn't need that much and it's much more forgiving.
> Is painting even neccessary?Not realy, no exposed epoxy to deteriorate in the sun, no paint needed.
Be sure to use but blocks.
> So I guess what I need are suggestions for the design of aLots of potential designs, I'm partial to the pirogue, out of 3/8
> controllable, cartopable, one man and gear mini Ark design!
>
exterior fir, but blocks, exterior chine logs, epoxy glue, no paint.
Bang it up for a season, then give it away.
Make it as long as is reasonable.
--
Richard
Spelling|richard@...|http://www.spellingbusiness.com
SBE Communications, Business Solutions for the next Millennium and
Beyond!
Boat building projects:http://www.spellingbusiness.com/boats/
--
Jeff:
I'm with Richard on this one. You have to have some lumber (1x2's) for the
chines and gunwales. This is really no big deal, most lumber yards will
carry this size, so you shouldn't have to do any ripping. I wouldn't insist
on epoxy, though. Try the polyurethane in a tube.
Take a look at Fritz Funk's Wacky Lassie:
http://www.alaska.net/~fritzf/Boats/Wacky_Lassie/Wacky_Lassie.htm
If you read to the bottom, you will see that he has gone to external chine
logs for this boat because of the ease of construction.
Are you still planning on building that Idaho?
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.hilconet.com/~dworksmg
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>From: "Russ Ingram" <russingram@...>
>To:bolger@...
>Subject: [bolger] durability in whitewater
>Date: Fri, Mar 3, 2000, 8:14 PM
>
> Hi All,
>
> I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
> throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
> bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
> half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
> is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
>
> Thanks!
>
> Russ
>
>
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>
Hi All,
I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
Thanks!
Russ
I'm taking a canoe/camping trip in a few weeks. I'm thinking of
throwing together a plywood boat. What do you think...will a 1/4"
bottom hold up if I bash into rocks in whitewater, or should I go with
half inch? There won't be any fiberglass sheathing, since the object
is to build a boat for less than the cost of renting one (about $100).
Thanks!
Russ