Re: State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff, now Illinois??
Illinois can be seen at the following link. My thanks to Mr. Hallman.
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Illinois/
Don Schultz
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Illinois/
Don Schultz
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "john_fader" <johnfader@b...> wrote:
> Bruce,
>
> I keep reading mention of the Illinois, but haven't seen even
lines.
> Anyone know where they're hedden?
>
> Cheers/Fader
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hector" <bruce_hector@h...>
> wrote:
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Hugo Tyson <hhetyson@y...> wrote:
> > > Do you mean the French Canadians
> >
> > Es imposible por les Quebequois a ser estrange, o seran sans
amable.
> > Translation from horrible grade school French: (It is impossible
for
> > the grenoilles (frogs) to be strange or without friendship)
> >
> > I believe I was referring to the Manitobans.
> >
> > Everyone knows how archaic, rural (consider the Hutterites and
> > Dukabors) and disinterested in things nautical they are!
Excepting
> > the brave sailors who conquered Lake Winnipeg adn Lake Manitoba,
> that
> > is. And the couriers-de-bois who first mapped and settled the
area.
> To
> > say nothing of the Metis who made a homeland there and suffered
the
> > first (and so far only) Canadian civil war.
> >
> > Bo'sun Blackheart Bruce
> > Desperately attempting to get my mouth off of my boot.
> >
> > p.s. I think adding a foot or so to the beam of a Idaho would be
> > seconded only by adding a yard or so to the Illinois.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@h...> wrote:
close and personal for any length of time with Windermeres' sexy,soft
and slick bottom like moi :-) Not to suggest that I am in anyway
nothing more then skilled in "frottage" despite endless hours doing
exactly that .............!
To build one of these bottoms really expands ones appreciation for
both the art and science of boat design. And,in many ways,leaves you
thinking,"why,of course! as in,this is a perfectly logical evolution
toward designing out some of the traditional sharpies so called bad
habits while retaining the allure of plywood construction for the
amateur builders. I firmly believe that this design evolution
will,over time,bring back the popularity of sharpie hulls and,more
importantly,good old plywood construction!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan,keeping up my hard won callused palms with a short list
of "honey-doos" while preparing for another massive dumping of
snow,from along the shores of the St.Lawrence.........
> Then to add further complication you have the box keeleddisplacement
> sharpie designs, like WINDEMERE that result in a hull that neitherOh Nels, that's just because you haven't had the chance to get up
> pounds in a seaway, nor slaps at anchor and almost completely blurs
> one's conceptual understanding of a sharpie hull.
close and personal for any length of time with Windermeres' sexy,soft
and slick bottom like moi :-) Not to suggest that I am in anyway
nothing more then skilled in "frottage" despite endless hours doing
exactly that .............!
To build one of these bottoms really expands ones appreciation for
both the art and science of boat design. And,in many ways,leaves you
thinking,"why,of course! as in,this is a perfectly logical evolution
toward designing out some of the traditional sharpies so called bad
habits while retaining the allure of plywood construction for the
amateur builders. I firmly believe that this design evolution
will,over time,bring back the popularity of sharpie hulls and,more
importantly,good old plywood construction!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan,keeping up my hard won callused palms with a short list
of "honey-doos" while preparing for another massive dumping of
snow,from along the shores of the St.Lawrence.........
--- leewan wrote:
I wonder why more people
don't consider the Fiddler II
[see scan in Bolger2/files]
[hope this URL works]
http://tinyurl.com/yqgsd
About the same size as a
Clam Skiff, faster, with
a double bed and a toilet
room! I bet that the low
headroom is something that
you could learn to live with.
LF Herreshoff said it well,
[paraphrasing] I have never
known a sailer that didn't
prefer eating while seated
and sleeping while prone.
Extending the slot top from
just the width of the boat
to be a "T" shape might be
possible. But I would be
inclined to try to build it
per plans, and retrofit the
larger hatch only afterwards.
In Phil we trust...
> The clam skiff isWith that being a goal,
> high on my [wish] list
> [for] a roomy quick
> boat??
I wonder why more people
don't consider the Fiddler II
[see scan in Bolger2/files]
[hope this URL works]
http://tinyurl.com/yqgsd
About the same size as a
Clam Skiff, faster, with
a double bed and a toilet
room! I bet that the low
headroom is something that
you could learn to live with.
LF Herreshoff said it well,
[paraphrasing] I have never
known a sailer that didn't
prefer eating while seated
and sleeping while prone.
Extending the slot top from
just the width of the boat
to be a "T" shape might be
possible. But I would be
inclined to try to build it
per plans, and retrofit the
larger hatch only afterwards.
In Phil we trust...
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "leewan" <chuckandaudre@m...> wrote:
So the CS
> evolved into the CCS then to Tenn and now Wyo or the above mods---
> completely out of control.
>
> chuck
Hi chuck,
The above comment officially qualifies you as a full-fledged
Bolgerista, a condition for which there is no cure, but only deeper
forms of mania, until your total focus in life become centered around
water, plywood and the interfaces between:-)
To answer your query, the standard sharpie hull, is by far the
easiest and cheapest to build and if you stay with displacement
speeds - uses a lot less power. Once you move into the step sharpie
designs all the above becomes consideralby more complicated. A step
sharpie is one hull built atop another and then properly and strongly
joined. Bolger says that MICROTRAWLER "...may be the most expensive
14 1/2 footer in existence."
Then to add further complication you have the box keeled displacement
sharpie designs, like WINDEMERE that result in a hull that neither
pounds in a seaway, nor slaps at anchor and almost completely blurs
one's conceptual understanding of a sharpie hull.
One thing is to make a commitment to attend a messabout where you can
personally view examples of each concept. I have heard this actually
makes things worse, but at least you will know you are not alone in
your insanity:-)
Cheers, Nels
Hi I've been following all the discussion with interest as I try to
figure out what I want to do. The clam skiff is high on my list but
guess what, I would want to modify it, ie like the cabin clam
skiff. But wait, it occurs to me why not start with the micro
trawler or Hawkeye, or even the fast motor sailor. They seem to
carry a lot of beam relative to their length so why not stretch the
length, keep the beam and end up with a roomy quick boat?? Is it
harder or more expensive to build these boats relative to the CCS or
Tennessee (the sharpie cruisers)?
I have really enjoyed the discussion on this board; my first contact
with Bolger was the folding schooner 20+ years ago when I was in the
sailboat business. It is real fun to find all the interest and talk
about his designs now. I am thinking of maybe a small fishing boat
for here in Minnesota but also something I could use in Fla over the
winter (just retired and stuck in Minn for this winter). So the CS
evolved into the CCS then to Tenn and now Wyo or the above mods---
completely out of control.
chuck
figure out what I want to do. The clam skiff is high on my list but
guess what, I would want to modify it, ie like the cabin clam
skiff. But wait, it occurs to me why not start with the micro
trawler or Hawkeye, or even the fast motor sailor. They seem to
carry a lot of beam relative to their length so why not stretch the
length, keep the beam and end up with a roomy quick boat?? Is it
harder or more expensive to build these boats relative to the CCS or
Tennessee (the sharpie cruisers)?
I have really enjoyed the discussion on this board; my first contact
with Bolger was the folding schooner 20+ years ago when I was in the
sailboat business. It is real fun to find all the interest and talk
about his designs now. I am thinking of maybe a small fishing boat
for here in Minnesota but also something I could use in Fla over the
winter (just retired and stuck in Minn for this winter). So the CS
evolved into the CCS then to Tenn and now Wyo or the above mods---
completely out of control.
chuck
>posts
>
>
> Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
>>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bruce and John,
I'm sorry but I blinked and missed something. What is Clam Cabin Skiff, Idaho? Is that what your talking about. I thought, originally, that you were talking about Clam Skiff on page 68 of BWAOM
I wonder if this wouldn't be a good time to employ fold-up or telescopic pipe cots. Each berth could be a bi-fold 28" or 30" (perfect for snoozing)which when folded away, or pushed in, could double as setees.
Don
Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
--- john_fader wrote:
[about Clam Cabin Skiff]
One thing to note with the
Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
width of the boat is only
5'4" overall.
The berths are only about
26" wide and the walkway
is only about 12" wide.
[Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
14" a bit narrow to walk down.
And, two people seated face to
face would be knee knocking.
http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
That it too tight, for
most all large adults,
in my opinion.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm sorry but I blinked and missed something. What is Clam Cabin Skiff, Idaho? Is that what your talking about. I thought, originally, that you were talking about Clam Skiff on page 68 of BWAOM
I wonder if this wouldn't be a good time to employ fold-up or telescopic pipe cots. Each berth could be a bi-fold 28" or 30" (perfect for snoozing)which when folded away, or pushed in, could double as setees.
Don
Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
--- john_fader wrote:
[about Clam Cabin Skiff]
One thing to note with the
Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
width of the boat is only
5'4" overall.
The berths are only about
26" wide and the walkway
is only about 12" wide.
[Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
14" a bit narrow to walk down.
And, two people seated face to
face would be knee knocking.
http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
That it too tight, for
most all large adults,
in my opinion.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It depends on the additional width to be achieved, of course, but
for CCS (for axample) a couple sheets would do it, with strips taped
in right down the middle and covered by the shoe.
John
for CCS (for axample) a couple sheets would do it, with strips taped
in right down the middle and covered by the shoe.
John
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@h...> wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Bosquette" <sbosquette@c...>
> wrote:
> > I had a similar idea to widen and extend my Sneakeasy.
>
> Wider - You want wider?
>
> Here is what Bolger says about WYOMING P. 355 BWAOM
>
> An alternate bottom, like that of the modified Sneakeasy, would
cure
> the handling problem but would take longer to build, slap more,
and
> need water several inches deeper. It would allow making her as
much
> wider as one liked, out to Microtrawler proportions (i.e. 27 feet
> wide; see Chapter 54.), for an entirely different and much more
> expensive , boat.
>
> I wonder how many sheets of plywood that would take?
>
> Nels:-)
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Bosquette" <sbosquette@c...>
wrote:
Here is what Bolger says about WYOMING P. 355 BWAOM
An alternate bottom, like that of the modified Sneakeasy, would cure
the handling problem but would take longer to build, slap more, and
need water several inches deeper. It would allow making her as much
wider as one liked, out to Microtrawler proportions (i.e. 27 feet
wide; see Chapter 54.), for an entirely different and much more
expensive , boat.
I wonder how many sheets of plywood that would take?
Nels:-)
wrote:
> I had a similar idea to widen and extend my Sneakeasy.Wider - You want wider?
Here is what Bolger says about WYOMING P. 355 BWAOM
An alternate bottom, like that of the modified Sneakeasy, would cure
the handling problem but would take longer to build, slap more, and
need water several inches deeper. It would allow making her as much
wider as one liked, out to Microtrawler proportions (i.e. 27 feet
wide; see Chapter 54.), for an entirely different and much more
expensive , boat.
I wonder how many sheets of plywood that would take?
Nels:-)
I had a similar idea to widen and extend my Sneakeasy. I was goinf\g
to cut her in half, separate the halves and put in a 2 ft wide box
keel about 9 inches deep. It would give musch additional interior
volume and also allowed 6 ft headroom. The profile on the drawings
was acceptable. I was going to bring the bow to a point again though.
Before you do that to the AF4 why not just build the AF4 Grande like
I'm doing. Lots of interior volume.
Steve Bosquette
to cut her in half, separate the halves and put in a 2 ft wide box
keel about 9 inches deep. It would give musch additional interior
volume and also allowed 6 ft headroom. The profile on the drawings
was acceptable. I was going to bring the bow to a point again though.
Before you do that to the AF4 why not just build the AF4 Grande like
I'm doing. Lots of interior volume.
Steve Bosquette
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "vicskiff" <john.ewing@s...> wrote:
> But what if you widened CCS per my post #34146? To repeat:
>
> "I have been playing with the idea of an insert of something between
> 6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull... This would widen the
> living space commensurately. On the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-
> sided, this would result in a pram bow -- which, if desired, could
> be returned to a point by adding a 'falsie'."
>
> John
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> > --- john_fader wrote:
> > [about Clam Cabin Skiff]
> >
> > One thing to note with the
> > Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
> > width of the boat is only
> > 5'4" overall.
> >
> > The berths are only about
> > 26" wide and the walkway
> > is only about 12" wide.
> > [Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
> >
> > 25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
> > 14" a bit narrow to walk down.
> > And, two people seated face to
> > face would be knee knocking.
> >
> >http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
> >
> > That it too tight, for
> > most all large adults,
> > in my opinion.
But what if you widened CCS per my post #34146? To repeat:
"I have been playing with the idea of an insert of something between
6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull... This would widen the
living space commensurately. On the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-
sided, this would result in a pram bow -- which, if desired, could
be returned to a point by adding a 'falsie'."
John
"I have been playing with the idea of an insert of something between
6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull... This would widen the
living space commensurately. On the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-
sided, this would result in a pram bow -- which, if desired, could
be returned to a point by adding a 'falsie'."
John
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> --- john_fader wrote:
> [about Clam Cabin Skiff]
>
> One thing to note with the
> Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
> width of the boat is only
> 5'4" overall.
>
> The berths are only about
> 26" wide and the walkway
> is only about 12" wide.
> [Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
>
> 25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
> 14" a bit narrow to walk down.
> And, two people seated face to
> face would be knee knocking.
>
>http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
>
> That it too tight, for
> most all large adults,
> in my opinion.
--- john_fader wrote:
[about Clam Cabin Skiff]
One thing to note with the
Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
width of the boat is only
5'4" overall.
The berths are only about
26" wide and the walkway
is only about 12" wide.
[Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
14" a bit narrow to walk down.
And, two people seated face to
face would be knee knocking.
http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
That it too tight, for
most all large adults,
in my opinion.
[about Clam Cabin Skiff]
One thing to note with the
Clam Cabin Skiff, is the
width of the boat is only
5'4" overall.
The berths are only about
26" wide and the walkway
is only about 12" wide.
[Or perhaps 25" and 14".]
25" is a bit narrow to sleep on.
14" a bit narrow to walk down.
And, two people seated face to
face would be knee knocking.
http://hallman.org/bolger/ClamSkiff/ccs.gif
That it too tight, for
most all large adults,
in my opinion.
I am so sorry to hear that. Even with the repair needed to the
transom, it would have been a nice river cruiser for my climate. As
much as I'd like to come to Finland, i don't think it would have been
fun to motor it home :-)
Cheers/Don
transom, it would have been a nice river cruiser for my climate. As
much as I'd like to come to Finland, i don't think it would have been
fun to motor it home :-)
Cheers/Don
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Sakari Aaltonen <sakari@a...> wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, john_fader wrote:
>
> > Did you find a home for your CCS? I reallyu wished I were your
> > neighbor when I read that you were selling it on :-)
>
> No. A friend took it apart with a chainsaw.
>
>
> Sakari Aaltonen
On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, john_fader wrote:
Sakari Aaltonen
> Did you find a home for your CCS? I reallyu wished I were yourNo. A friend took it apart with a chainsaw.
> neighbor when I read that you were selling it on :-)
Sakari Aaltonen
Take a peak here:
http://tinyurl.com/yr3en
for a link that, I hope, takes you to the largest of the state series
power sharpies.
B. Hector
http://tinyurl.com/yr3en
for a link that, I hope, takes you to the largest of the state series
power sharpies.
B. Hector
Sakari,
thanks for the reminder. I think I could live quite nicely with good
sitting headroom and a Birdwatcher slot for standing room. The
"central cabin" would have a solid sitting headroom top with long
sliding hatches either end. In worm weather, a large rainfly at
standing height would cover the whole cabin. In cold weather, a laddie
can go outside for a stretch if needed.
Cheers/Fader
Did you find a home for your CCS? I reallyu wished I were your
neighbor when I read that you were selling it on :-)
thanks for the reminder. I think I could live quite nicely with good
sitting headroom and a Birdwatcher slot for standing room. The
"central cabin" would have a solid sitting headroom top with long
sliding hatches either end. In worm weather, a large rainfly at
standing height would cover the whole cabin. In cold weather, a laddie
can go outside for a stretch if needed.
Cheers/Fader
Did you find a home for your CCS? I reallyu wished I were your
neighbor when I read that you were selling it on :-)
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Sakari Aaltonen <sakari@a...> wrote:
d wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
> > live-aboard.
>
> The CCS looks a lot larger than it is. The cabin height is only
about 150cm (5').
>
> Sakari Aaltonen
Bruce,
I keep reading mention of the Illinois, but haven't seen even lines.
Anyone know where they're hedden?
Cheers/Fader
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hector" <bruce_hector@h...>
wrote:
I keep reading mention of the Illinois, but haven't seen even lines.
Anyone know where they're hedden?
Cheers/Fader
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hector" <bruce_hector@h...>
wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Hugo Tyson <hhetyson@y...> wrote:that
> > Do you mean the French Canadians
>
> Es imposible por les Quebequois a ser estrange, o seran sans amable.
> Translation from horrible grade school French: (It is impossible for
> the grenoilles (frogs) to be strange or without friendship)
>
> I believe I was referring to the Manitobans.
>
> Everyone knows how archaic, rural (consider the Hutterites and
> Dukabors) and disinterested in things nautical they are! Excepting
> the brave sailors who conquered Lake Winnipeg adn Lake Manitoba,
> is. And the couriers-de-bois who first mapped and settled the area.To
> say nothing of the Metis who made a homeland there and suffered the
> first (and so far only) Canadian civil war.
>
> Bo'sun Blackheart Bruce
> Desperately attempting to get my mouth off of my boot.
>
> p.s. I think adding a foot or so to the beam of a Idaho would be
> seconded only by adding a yard or so to the Illinois.
John,
back last summer I had a correspondence with PCB about aadding up to
30" to CCS, to give room for an enclosed head and a small galley, both
at the aft end of the cabin. There was also talk of adding a bit more
to the rear deck to allow better storage of more fuel tanks. Bolger
said that the extra length would make her a better boat in all ways,
if one were willing to absorb the greater expense of a larger motor
and more fuel (or silling to go slower; me :-)
Of course, the expansion I'm thinking abuot is way more than we'd
discussed. Before I'd make such a boat, I'd get Bolger's opinion on
it.
Cheers/fader
back last summer I had a correspondence with PCB about aadding up to
30" to CCS, to give room for an enclosed head and a small galley, both
at the aft end of the cabin. There was also talk of adding a bit more
to the rear deck to allow better storage of more fuel tanks. Bolger
said that the extra length would make her a better boat in all ways,
if one were willing to absorb the greater expense of a larger motor
and more fuel (or silling to go slower; me :-)
Of course, the expansion I'm thinking abuot is way more than we'd
discussed. Before I'd make such a boat, I'd get Bolger's opinion on
it.
Cheers/fader
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "vicskiff" <john.ewing@s...> wrote:
> I have been playing with the idea of an insert of something between
> 6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull, on either CCS or
> Michalak's AF4. This would widen the living space commensurately. On
> the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-sided, this would result in a
> pram bow -- which, if desired, could be returned to a point by
> adding a 'falsie'.
>
> John
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Hugo Tyson <hhetyson@y...> wrote:
Translation from horrible grade school French: (It is impossible for
the grenoilles (frogs) to be strange or without friendship)
I believe I was referring to the Manitobans.
Everyone knows how archaic, rural (consider the Hutterites and
Dukabors) and disinterested in things nautical they are! Excepting
the brave sailors who conquered Lake Winnipeg adn Lake Manitoba, that
is. And the couriers-de-bois who first mapped and settled the area. To
say nothing of the Metis who made a homeland there and suffered the
first (and so far only) Canadian civil war.
Bo'sun Blackheart Bruce
Desperately attempting to get my mouth off of my boot.
p.s. I think adding a foot or so to the beam of a Idaho would be
seconded only by adding a yard or so to the Illinois.
> Do you mean the French CanadiansEs imposible por les Quebequois a ser estrange, o seran sans amable.
Translation from horrible grade school French: (It is impossible for
the grenoilles (frogs) to be strange or without friendship)
I believe I was referring to the Manitobans.
Everyone knows how archaic, rural (consider the Hutterites and
Dukabors) and disinterested in things nautical they are! Excepting
the brave sailors who conquered Lake Winnipeg adn Lake Manitoba, that
is. And the couriers-de-bois who first mapped and settled the area. To
say nothing of the Metis who made a homeland there and suffered the
first (and so far only) Canadian civil war.
Bo'sun Blackheart Bruce
Desperately attempting to get my mouth off of my boot.
p.s. I think adding a foot or so to the beam of a Idaho would be
seconded only by adding a yard or so to the Illinois.
Do you mean the French Canadians !!! ? I'm told they can be a bit strange, or are you talking south of your border and across the lakes? !!
Bruce Hector <bruce_hector@...> wrote:--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
The craftier. sneakier, more devious, luckier rascals became Canadians!
I won't say anything nasty about who they gave us for neighbours.
Bruce Hector
Bolger rules!!!
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- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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Bruce Hector <bruce_hector@...> wrote:--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
> But Bruce, those narrowboats are built that way because the BritsNah, they just shipped the ones that got caught to Oz.
> prematurely shipped all the rugged types off to Oz,
The craftier. sneakier, more devious, luckier rascals became Canadians!
I won't say anything nasty about who they gave us for neighbours.
Bruce Hector
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
The craftier. sneakier, more devious, luckier rascals became Canadians!
I won't say anything nasty about who they gave us for neighbours.
Bruce Hector
> But Bruce, those narrowboats are built that way because the BritsNah, they just shipped the ones that got caught to Oz.
> prematurely shipped all the rugged types off to Oz,
The craftier. sneakier, more devious, luckier rascals became Canadians!
I won't say anything nasty about who they gave us for neighbours.
Bruce Hector
But Bruce, those narrowboats are built that way because the Brits
prematurely shipped all the rugged types off to Oz, and there were nought
but them pasty-faced lads left to dig the canals that those narrowboats ran
in. You can see where I'm going with this...
David
_____
From: Bruce Hector [mailto:bruce_hector@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 5:56 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
prematurely shipped all the rugged types off to Oz, and there were nought
but them pasty-faced lads left to dig the canals that those narrowboats ran
in. You can see where I'm going with this...
David
_____
From: Bruce Hector [mailto:bruce_hector@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 5:56 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
> Hmmm.. you're talking about a 6'x6'x32' enclosed box
I don't know. Consider what the Brit's do with their 7 foot beam
narrowboats. Some go to over 70 feet long on that little bitty beam.
I know TIMS kept getting more stable as we piled on the length. At 96
feet I could (and did) walk on the gun'wales with the stability of a
bridge!
Bruce Hector
Just keep the bottom flat and the sides plumb (or even add in a little
tumblehome for more stability) and you'll be alright.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
narrowboats. Some go to over 70 feet long on that little bitty beam.
I know TIMS kept getting more stable as we piled on the length. At 96
feet I could (and did) walk on the gun'wales with the stability of a
bridge!
Bruce Hector
Just keep the bottom flat and the sides plumb (or even add in a little
tumblehome for more stability) and you'll be alright.
> Hmmm.. you're talking about a 6'x6'x32' enclosed boxI don't know. Consider what the Brit's do with their 7 foot beam
narrowboats. Some go to over 70 feet long on that little bitty beam.
I know TIMS kept getting more stable as we piled on the length. At 96
feet I could (and did) walk on the gun'wales with the stability of a
bridge!
Bruce Hector
Just keep the bottom flat and the sides plumb (or even add in a little
tumblehome for more stability) and you'll be alright.
I have been playing with the idea of an insert of something between
6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull, on either CCS or
Michalak's AF4. This would widen the living space commensurately. On
the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-sided, this would result in a
pram bow -- which, if desired, could be returned to a point by
adding a 'falsie'.
John
6 and 12 in. running the length of the hull, on either CCS or
Michalak's AF4. This would widen the living space commensurately. On
the CCS saloon launch, being plumb-sided, this would result in a
pram bow -- which, if desired, could be returned to a point by
adding a 'falsie'.
John
> Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpiesI have thought about putting the clam skiff cabin and shoe on an
> must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
> headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
> (why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
> and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
> live-aboard.
Idaho hull to get standing height. This would make the Idaho design
more appealing. The Idaho was designed for wheel chair camping and
standing height was not a requirement. It would be a "Long Cabin Clam
Skiff" or an "Updated Idaho" depending on which stern you used. It
would be for a day boat with more room and load capacity than the
skiff. The cabin could be lengthened and other things added. You
could tent over the whole thing in good weather and batten down in
the cabin to ride out bad. Five feet wide is still mighty narrow for
a liveaboard but OK for camping. Five feet wide is great for
trailering.
I guess you could add a foot to the width of Idaho and have a scaled
down Dakota (or long Tenn.) without the rocker.
Charles
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, john_fader wrote:
150cm (5').
Sakari Aaltonen
> Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpiesThe CCS looks a lot larger than it is. The cabin height is only about
> must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
> headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
> (why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
> and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
> live-aboard.
150cm (5').
Sakari Aaltonen
DAvid,
those dimensions are for the hull. I'd say that the aft 4' would be
given to power and the fore 6' to an open bow; one doesn't live
"inside" forever :-)Still, a 21-23' box is LARGE.
It is difficult to see how the box can be less than 5 1/2' wide and
have two comfortable berths, though one could lose 6" of that by
putting the berths on the same side and skimping a bit on width in the
galley and the other furniture on that side. Of course, having the
"occasional" berth in the main saloon is no problem for a single
liveaboard.
I visualize the accomodation, from aft going fwd. being engine space,
then in the cabin; Locker on one side, head across, "captain's cabin"
(berth across from desk/library/enclosed reading/charts, etc.) then
the main saloon with a berth on one side, across from open area with
chairs and the helm. Finally, the open foredeck and then anchor/wet
well.
So, maybe it could have 6" side decks and a box that is 6'3" tall, 5'
wide, and 23' long. I wonder what that would do for stability on a 33'
X 6' hull????
Cheers/Fader
those dimensions are for the hull. I'd say that the aft 4' would be
given to power and the fore 6' to an open bow; one doesn't live
"inside" forever :-)Still, a 21-23' box is LARGE.
It is difficult to see how the box can be less than 5 1/2' wide and
have two comfortable berths, though one could lose 6" of that by
putting the berths on the same side and skimping a bit on width in the
galley and the other furniture on that side. Of course, having the
"occasional" berth in the main saloon is no problem for a single
liveaboard.
I visualize the accomodation, from aft going fwd. being engine space,
then in the cabin; Locker on one side, head across, "captain's cabin"
(berth across from desk/library/enclosed reading/charts, etc.) then
the main saloon with a berth on one side, across from open area with
chairs and the helm. Finally, the open foredeck and then anchor/wet
well.
So, maybe it could have 6" side decks and a box that is 6'3" tall, 5'
wide, and 23' long. I wonder what that would do for stability on a 33'
X 6' hull????
Cheers/Fader
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David Romasco" <dromasco@g...> wrote:
> Hmmm.. you're talking about a 6'x6'x32' enclosed box (and a
powerboat to
> boot). I think this is a design area that Bolger would have serious
> stability and safety questions on. I have the plans for Idaho, and
have
> spent some time thinking about enclosures. With the best will in
the world,
> I can't get past a light (1/4") hardtop with a canvas enclosure. I
think
> anything more substantial on this sort of hull is hanging it out
over the
> edge; this, of course, is relative to waters sailed in.
> David
> I am hoping that standing headroom can beYou might check out the 30' Cargo Motorsailer (or whatever the name
> achieved safely in 31-33' LOA and a bit narrower breadth of beam,
> maybe 6' to keep near that 6:1 ratio of L/W.
is). There is a scan (Cargo MS 30.gif) at Bolger2
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger2/files/MS%20Cargo%20Boat/
(The other pic there is a pastiche.)
I guess it's a more complicated bottom type, but what a wonderful
boat for laid back cruising. Everyone always wants changed. My first
idea was to make the house continuous and deleted the well deck. My
second thought was want a wonderful spot the well deck would be.
Tom MacNaughton claims that "real liveaboards" remove their inboard
engines and want to eliminate their cockpits because of the "wasted"
space. I would counter-claim that they started with a boat that was
too small.
Peter
Hmmm.. you're talking about a 6'x6'x32' enclosed box (and a powerboat to
boot). I think this is a design area that Bolger would have serious
stability and safety questions on. I have the plans for Idaho, and have
spent some time thinking about enclosures. With the best will in the world,
I can't get past a light (1/4") hardtop with a canvas enclosure. I think
anything more substantial on this sort of hull is hanging it out over the
edge; this, of course, is relative to waters sailed in.
David
_____
From: john_fader [mailto:johnfader@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 12:17 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
Yes, David,
thanks for reminding me of that one. She's definitely a pretty thinng.
I am hoping that standing headroom ( a bit lower than in MkV39) can be
achieved safely in 31-33' LOA and a bit narrower breadth of beam,
maybe 6' to keep near that 6:1 ratio of L/W. I realize that this is
starting to sound a bit like a stretched Tennessee, but for the flat
bottom.... or like a wider Idaho. However, the basic package of CCS
looks to work well as a liveaboard, as encouraged by the V39.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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ult?mqso=60178397&partid=4116730> click here
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
boot). I think this is a design area that Bolger would have serious
stability and safety questions on. I have the plans for Idaho, and have
spent some time thinking about enclosures. With the best will in the world,
I can't get past a light (1/4") hardtop with a canvas enclosure. I think
anything more substantial on this sort of hull is hanging it out over the
edge; this, of course, is relative to waters sailed in.
David
_____
From: john_fader [mailto:johnfader@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 12:17 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
Yes, David,
thanks for reminding me of that one. She's definitely a pretty thinng.
I am hoping that standing headroom ( a bit lower than in MkV39) can be
achieved safely in 31-33' LOA and a bit narrower breadth of beam,
maybe 6' to keep near that 6:1 ratio of L/W. I realize that this is
starting to sound a bit like a stretched Tennessee, but for the flat
bottom.... or like a wider Idaho. However, the basic package of CCS
looks to work well as a liveaboard, as encouraged by the V39.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yes, David,
thanks for reminding me of that one. She's definitely a pretty thinng.
I am hoping that standing headroom ( a bit lower than in MkV39) can be
achieved safely in 31-33' LOA and a bit narrower breadth of beam,
maybe 6' to keep near that 6:1 ratio of L/W. I realize that this is
starting to sound a bit like a stretched Tennessee, but for the flat
bottom.... or like a wider Idaho. However, the basic package of CCS
looks to work well as a liveaboard, as encouraged by the V39.
thanks for reminding me of that one. She's definitely a pretty thinng.
I am hoping that standing headroom ( a bit lower than in MkV39) can be
achieved safely in 31-33' LOA and a bit narrower breadth of beam,
maybe 6' to keep near that 6:1 ratio of L/W. I realize that this is
starting to sound a bit like a stretched Tennessee, but for the flat
bottom.... or like a wider Idaho. However, the basic package of CCS
looks to work well as a liveaboard, as encouraged by the V39.
John, here's a twist that might interest you:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/store/plans/markv/39/index.htm
_____
From: john_fader [mailto:johnfader@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 11:03 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
I've been reading the State Series and Tennessee somewhat desultorily,
and now wish that I'd been mofre observant :-)
This is possibly just idle curiosity, as I plan to build a Sneakeasy
later this winter, but...
Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpies
must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
(why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
live-aboard.
I have an available 4-cyl I/O drive, free, which is likely to be
overkill for it, but would run more cheaply than a 65-100hp outboard,
esp at 6-8 kts, which is my preferred cruising speed if I don't have
anywhere important to go.
If you remember such a discussion, I'd appreciate a pointer to it, or
even an approximate date.
TIA/The Fader
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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ult?mqso=60178397&partid=4116730> click here
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/store/plans/markv/39/index.htm
_____
From: john_fader [mailto:johnfader@...]
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 11:03 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] State Series ----> Cabin Clam Skiff
I've been reading the State Series and Tennessee somewhat desultorily,
and now wish that I'd been mofre observant :-)
This is possibly just idle curiosity, as I plan to build a Sneakeasy
later this winter, but...
Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpies
must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
(why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
live-aboard.
I have an available 4-cyl I/O drive, free, which is likely to be
overkill for it, but would run more cheaply than a 65-100hp outboard,
esp at 6-8 kts, which is my preferred cruising speed if I don't have
anywhere important to go.
If you remember such a discussion, I'd appreciate a pointer to it, or
even an approximate date.
TIA/The Fader
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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ult?mqso=60178397&partid=4116730> click here
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<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I've been reading the State Series and Tennessee somewhat desultorily,
and now wish that I'd been mofre observant :-)
This is possibly just idle curiosity, as I plan to build a Sneakeasy
later this winter, but...
Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpies
must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
(why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
live-aboard.
I have an available 4-cyl I/O drive, free, which is likely to be
overkill for it, but would run more cheaply than a 65-100hp outboard,
esp at 6-8 kts, which is my preferred cruising speed if I don't have
anywhere important to go.
If you remember such a discussion, I'd appreciate a pointer to it, or
even an approximate date.
TIA/The Fader
and now wish that I'd been mofre observant :-)
This is possibly just idle curiosity, as I plan to build a Sneakeasy
later this winter, but...
Does anyone remember any discussion as to how large these sharpies
must be (at a minimum, in both length and width)to allow standing
headroom (6'2" in my case, 1.88m)??? I've looked at Cabin Clam Skiff
(why didn't PCB name that "Saloon Launch"??? as John E. calls it :-)
and wondered about it's potential for a "cheapish" Florida
live-aboard.
I have an available 4-cyl I/O drive, free, which is likely to be
overkill for it, but would run more cheaply than a 65-100hp outboard,
esp at 6-8 kts, which is my preferred cruising speed if I don't have
anywhere important to go.
If you remember such a discussion, I'd appreciate a pointer to it, or
even an approximate date.
TIA/The Fader