Re: sailmakers?
I looked at the sail plan on a website---wild. Looks more like a
junk than anything, easy to build, minimal shaping. Go for 4.5oz
dacron, 5 if you want to go around the Horn.
You can get away with very little broadseaming, maybe 3/4 inch in
the 1st seam and 1/2 that in the 2nd. Give it a bit of foot round
and about 1 1/2 inches of luff curve.
The sail should be fairly flat I think
Good Luck
junk than anything, easy to build, minimal shaping. Go for 4.5oz
dacron, 5 if you want to go around the Horn.
You can get away with very little broadseaming, maybe 3/4 inch in
the 1st seam and 1/2 that in the 2nd. Give it a bit of foot round
and about 1 1/2 inches of luff curve.
The sail should be fairly flat I think
Good Luck
On the one hand, they stretch, come apart at the seams if not stiched, and don't last but a couple years.
On the other hand, they work just fine, and I wouldn't hessitate to put them on a dingy or a "play" boat.
On the gripping hand, I didn't even consider them for my Chebacco. The deciding factor being a comment by a friend of mine that he
needed new sails on his Catalina, because they were starting to stretch a bit. (I couldn't notice anything). I asked him how old
they were: "Oh, they are original to the boat. About 20 years old, I would guess."
So, if you are making a boat on the cheap, as a learning experience, polytarp makes a dandy sail.
If you are spending years to build a boat that you intend to keep forever, use sailcloth.
On the other hand, they work just fine, and I wouldn't hessitate to put them on a dingy or a "play" boat.
On the gripping hand, I didn't even consider them for my Chebacco. The deciding factor being a comment by a friend of mine that he
needed new sails on his Catalina, because they were starting to stretch a bit. (I couldn't notice anything). I asked him how old
they were: "Oh, they are original to the boat. About 20 years old, I would guess."
So, if you are making a boat on the cheap, as a learning experience, polytarp makes a dandy sail.
If you are spending years to build a boat that you intend to keep forever, use sailcloth.
----- Original Message -----
From: "rogerleroy" <rogerleroy@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 11:35 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: sailmakers?
> What do you think of tarp sails?
> I can get the 3 sails I need and then extra material left over for
> 1/3 of the price of nice dacron sails from Sailrite...
> No sowing with the tarp either!
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "oceanplodder2003" <dana-
> tenacity@u...> wrote:
> > Try Sailrite,
> >
> > Yoy get the panels pre-cut off a plotter so the shapes are correct
> > but save money doing the assembly yourself. I've been a
> professional
> > saoilmaker in the past and believe a competent person can get an
> > excellent result this way, particularly with small boat sails.
> >
> > Cheers
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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--- oceanplodder2003 wrote:
The boat I am interested in is the Micro Navigator.
It has full battens, each with a mast jaw and
a sheetlet. Maximum distance from any point on
the sail to a spar or a batten is only 2'6"!
That, I conclude, means low stress on the cloth.
> Tell me what the boat is , and I'll tell youhttp://www.boatdesign.com/micro/files/navigator1.pdf
> what cloth weight to use.
The boat I am interested in is the Micro Navigator.
It has full battens, each with a mast jaw and
a sheetlet. Maximum distance from any point on
the sail to a spar or a batten is only 2'6"!
That, I conclude, means low stress on the cloth.
Guys. Be nice.
I was a sailmaker, in the industry for a number of years (no longer,
needed to make more $$$ so I could play boats).
All the advice so far has been excellent, why not skip sailrite and
just buy some dacron off the roll, and sure experiment with tarps
first. Tell me what the boat is , and I'll tell you what cloth
weight to use. Chances are it will be a simple build, as has been
mentioned a lot of PB sails are very simplistic compared to "the
norm".
Most sailmakers I know wouldn't want your job anyway, lots of extra
work for no money.
Good Luck
I was a sailmaker, in the industry for a number of years (no longer,
needed to make more $$$ so I could play boats).
All the advice so far has been excellent, why not skip sailrite and
just buy some dacron off the roll, and sure experiment with tarps
first. Tell me what the boat is , and I'll tell you what cloth
weight to use. Chances are it will be a simple build, as has been
mentioned a lot of PB sails are very simplistic compared to "the
norm".
Most sailmakers I know wouldn't want your job anyway, lots of extra
work for no money.
Good Luck
--- pvanderwaart wrote:
sailcloths commonly used prior to the
invention of synthetic fiber sail cloth.
Some of Bolger's sail rigs are chosen
for 'lower stress', for instance the
Balanced Lug Rig, and the Chinese Gaff
Rig, and I guess that polytarp is more
suited for applications where the cloth
is under lower stresses than 'modern
sloop rigs'.
In my case at least, I am rationalizing
that cutting my sail from polytarp is
a prototype to experiment with sail
shape. Frankly, I don't trust any
sailmaker I know to economically experiment
with the cut of the 'new' Chinese Gaff
Rig, invented by PB&F. I would rather
do my learning curve with polytarp. If
polytarp proves inadaquate, I can take
what I learn and specify a dacron sail
to just the shape I want.
is that you should inspect all sails and
rigging before embarking, regardless
of what they are made from.
> >What do you think of tarp sails?[I agree with Peter and add:]
> Polytarp is inferior to modern sailclothThough I bet polytarp is superior to the
sailcloths commonly used prior to the
invention of synthetic fiber sail cloth.
Some of Bolger's sail rigs are chosen
for 'lower stress', for instance the
Balanced Lug Rig, and the Chinese Gaff
Rig, and I guess that polytarp is more
suited for applications where the cloth
is under lower stresses than 'modern
sloop rigs'.
In my case at least, I am rationalizing
that cutting my sail from polytarp is
a prototype to experiment with sail
shape. Frankly, I don't trust any
sailmaker I know to economically experiment
with the cut of the 'new' Chinese Gaff
Rig, invented by PB&F. I would rather
do my learning curve with polytarp. If
polytarp proves inadaquate, I can take
what I learn and specify a dacron sail
to just the shape I want.
> I would not take a boat withAn extension of this logical caution,
> polytarp sails anywhere
> that failure of the sail material
> could signifcantly raise the risk
> of calamity.
is that you should inspect all sails and
rigging before embarking, regardless
of what they are made from.
>What do you think of tarp sails?Polytarp is inferior to modern sailcloth in at least three ways:
breaking strength, durability, and resistance to stretch. So, you
sails will be inferior. They may also be adequate. They may be more
fun, since you made them yourself. They may be possible when cost
makes "real" sails impossible.
I would not take a boat with polytarp sails anywhere that failure of
the sail material could signifcantly raise the risk of calamity.
Peter
>What do you think of tarp sails?Well, they work, they're cheap, and you can create some shape by cutting
>I can get the 3 sails I need and then extra material left over for
>1/3 of the price of nice dacron sails from Sailrite...
>No sowing with the tarp either!
and taping (see Jim Michalak's website), but a well-cut sail is indeed a
joy to have. Remember that smalll boat sails up until maybe 75-80 years ago
were just flat panels of cloth anyway.
Then again I've sailed boats with poorly-cut professional sails and you
really just want to go and strangle the sailmaker and get some tarp.
Much tarp info on my Cheap Pages.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
What do you think of tarp sails?
I can get the 3 sails I need and then extra material left over for
1/3 of the price of nice dacron sails from Sailrite...
No sowing with the tarp either!
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "oceanplodder2003" <dana-
tenacity@u...> wrote:
I can get the 3 sails I need and then extra material left over for
1/3 of the price of nice dacron sails from Sailrite...
No sowing with the tarp either!
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "oceanplodder2003" <dana-
tenacity@u...> wrote:
> Try Sailrite,professional
>
> Yoy get the panels pre-cut off a plotter so the shapes are correct
> but save money doing the assembly yourself. I've been a
> saoilmaker in the past and believe a competent person can get an
> excellent result this way, particularly with small boat sails.
>
> Cheers
Thank you very much for your sympathy.
Pep Cruells in Barcelona.
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Sam Glasscock <glasscocklanding@y...>
wrote:
Pep Cruells in Barcelona.
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Sam Glasscock <glasscocklanding@y...>
wrote:
> I know this group has members in Europe, but I don't
> know about Spain specifically. I was lucky enough to
> spend some time in Madrid last year, and much
> appreciated the warmth and courtesy of the Spanish
> people, and the beauty and grandeur of their
> countryside. It is with the greatest shock and
> sadness that I saw the news reports of the
> unspeakable, tragic acts suffered today in Madrid. My
> deepest sympathy goes out to the people of Spain. Sam
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Search - Find what you're looking for faster
>http://search.yahoo.com
I know this group has members in Europe, but I don't
know about Spain specifically. I was lucky enough to
spend some time in Madrid last year, and much
appreciated the warmth and courtesy of the Spanish
people, and the beauty and grandeur of their
countryside. It is with the greatest shock and
sadness that I saw the news reports of the
unspeakable, tragic acts suffered today in Madrid. My
deepest sympathy goes out to the people of Spain. Sam
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com
know about Spain specifically. I was lucky enough to
spend some time in Madrid last year, and much
appreciated the warmth and courtesy of the Spanish
people, and the beauty and grandeur of their
countryside. It is with the greatest shock and
sadness that I saw the news reports of the
unspeakable, tragic acts suffered today in Madrid. My
deepest sympathy goes out to the people of Spain. Sam
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you�re looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com
Doesn't Bohndell make sails for Payson? If I recall correctly, that's
the kind we have for our Brick and it's a nice sail. As Payson's
supplier, they'd be used to sails that are a little different.
the kind we have for our Brick and it's a nice sail. As Payson's
supplier, they'd be used to sails that are a little different.
>Jason wrote:
>
>I've always made tyvek or polytarp sails in the past but this time
>i'm going all out. Trying to find a good quality sailmaker with non
>obscene prices for my soon to be constructed oldshoe navigator. 91sq
>foot cat yawl sprit rig with 3 sets of reef points in tanbark.
>Recomendations?
>Thanks,
>jason
>
Try Sailrite,
Yoy get the panels pre-cut off a plotter so the shapes are correct
but save money doing the assembly yourself. I've been a professional
saoilmaker in the past and believe a competent person can get an
excellent result this way, particularly with small boat sails.
Cheers
Yoy get the panels pre-cut off a plotter so the shapes are correct
but save money doing the assembly yourself. I've been a professional
saoilmaker in the past and believe a competent person can get an
excellent result this way, particularly with small boat sails.
Cheers
Jason --
I was pricing out sails for my Cormorant (247 sq. feet total) and
someone recommended the Asian sailmakers. (Conundrum here -- to
support North American sailmakers, or pay less overseas. . . .?) The
best bid I got was from Rolly Tasker in Thailand, and they say they
have a two-week turnaround:
http://www.rollytasker.com/
The shipping costs will wind up being a large percentage of the total
on a small sail -- but it might be worth an inquiry anyway, and
certainly they're worth keeping in mind for bigger boats.
All best,
Garth
(By the time I'm done building the boat, I suspect I'll only be able
to afford polytarp sails held together with duct tape . . . and maybe
not even the duct tape.)
I was pricing out sails for my Cormorant (247 sq. feet total) and
someone recommended the Asian sailmakers. (Conundrum here -- to
support North American sailmakers, or pay less overseas. . . .?) The
best bid I got was from Rolly Tasker in Thailand, and they say they
have a two-week turnaround:
http://www.rollytasker.com/
The shipping costs will wind up being a large percentage of the total
on a small sail -- but it might be worth an inquiry anyway, and
certainly they're worth keeping in mind for bigger boats.
All best,
Garth
(By the time I'm done building the boat, I suspect I'll only be able
to afford polytarp sails held together with duct tape . . . and maybe
not even the duct tape.)
Stu Hopkins at Dabbler Sails --dab@...
Not cheap, but highly recommended for small-boat sails by everyone who's
had a sail done by him.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
Not cheap, but highly recommended for small-boat sails by everyone who's
had a sail done by him.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
Since most sailmakers will give a quote for free in an instant, why
not try a bunch.
http://www.skycraft.net/
http://www.sails-online.com/
Peter
not try a bunch.
http://www.skycraft.net/
http://www.sails-online.com/
Peter
You will be very happy in all respects with Grant Gambell in Camden, Maine - Bill Kreamer
http://www.gambellandhunter.com/contact.htm
http://www.gambellandhunter.com/contact.htm
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> From: "smithriverranger" <jasonstancil@...>
> Date: 2004/03/11 Thu AM 01:24:39 EST
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] sailmakers?
>
>
I've always made tyvek or polytarp sails in the past but this time
i'm going all out. Trying to find a good quality sailmaker with non
obscene prices for my soon to be constructed oldshoe navigator. 91sq
foot cat yawl sprit rig with 3 sets of reef points in tanbark.
Recomendations?
Thanks,
jason
i'm going all out. Trying to find a good quality sailmaker with non
obscene prices for my soon to be constructed oldshoe navigator. 91sq
foot cat yawl sprit rig with 3 sets of reef points in tanbark.
Recomendations?
Thanks,
jason