Re: [bolger] Re: steel AS 29
it's what a lot of the guys on origamiboats yahoogroup do. of course
the building method is very different from regular steel boats, some use
new designs, others convert old ones, like converting a bolger dead rise
liveaboard, to origami. origami's a stressed sheet method and doesn't
need frames or stringers, gets some interesting curves, but lots of
strength, also incredibly fast builds.
bruce@...wrote:
http://www.skaar.101main.net
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/spcdvd/
http://www.petitiononline.com/impjapan/petition-sign.html?
moderator ofwildsteam@yahoogroups.com
DOM and proud!!!
the building method is very different from regular steel boats, some use
new designs, others convert old ones, like converting a bolger dead rise
liveaboard, to origami. origami's a stressed sheet method and doesn't
need frames or stringers, gets some interesting curves, but lots of
strength, also incredibly fast builds.
bruce@...wrote:
> I suppose there are spray on insulations,--
> like they use in fireproofing buildings,
> which would be easier than cut and fitting,
> but you still would need to build a wooden
> boat inside a steel boat using wood
> paneling and/or other inside finish
> materials to cover up the insulation.
http://www.skaar.101main.net
http://www.PetitionOnline.com/spcdvd/
http://www.petitiononline.com/impjapan/petition-sign.html?
moderator ofwildsteam@yahoogroups.com
DOM and proud!!!
Given the demise of the Loose Moose II, he might have been biased in
favor of lightning resistance!
David Ryan wrote:
favor of lightning resistance!
David Ryan wrote:
>
>
>>>Does anyone know of someone buildiing either an as29 or as39 out of
>>>steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
>>
>>
>
>When I was working with Bob Wise last Summer, he quipped that he
>should have considered building the Loose Moose II entirely out of
>stainless steel. Apparently he had an "in" with a fabricator, but
>didn't think of it until the hull was mostly complete. Don't know how
>serious he was, or recall how many beers had been consumed at the
>time.
>
>YIBB,
>
>David
>
There is already a steel sharpie design, #642 Antispray.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger2/files/AntiSpray/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger2/files/AntiSpray/
--- "jrtaylorinflag" wrote:
But, I am sure AS hulls could be economically
constructed out of steel plate.
Weston Farmer #487 is one example, an
extreme sharpie sailboat 46' x 6'9" and
there are other(s) but I forget the name(s).
I recall that PCB wrote something like:
===
The *gotcha* is that steel conducts the
cold from the water so efficiently, that
the hull inside needs a layer of insulation
or it will sweat condensation and be
miserable and wet.
The time you save working with steel will
be more than spent with the detail work of
interior insulation and the 'ceilings' to
cover the insulation.
====
I suppose there are spray on insulations,
like they use in fireproofing buildings,
which would be easier than cut and fitting,
but you still would need to build a wooden
boat inside a steel boat using wood
paneling and/or other inside finish
materials to cover up the insulation.
> buildiing either an as29 or as39 out ofNot specifically, to my limited knowledge...
> steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented
> on its feasibility?
But, I am sure AS hulls could be economically
constructed out of steel plate.
Weston Farmer #487 is one example, an
extreme sharpie sailboat 46' x 6'9" and
there are other(s) but I forget the name(s).
I recall that PCB wrote something like:
===
The *gotcha* is that steel conducts the
cold from the water so efficiently, that
the hull inside needs a layer of insulation
or it will sweat condensation and be
miserable and wet.
The time you save working with steel will
be more than spent with the detail work of
interior insulation and the 'ceilings' to
cover the insulation.
====
I suppose there are spray on insulations,
like they use in fireproofing buildings,
which would be easier than cut and fitting,
but you still would need to build a wooden
boat inside a steel boat using wood
paneling and/or other inside finish
materials to cover up the insulation.
>Does anyone know of someone buildiing either an as29 or as39 out ofWhen I was working with Bob Wise last Summer, he quipped that he
>steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
should have considered building the Loose Moose II entirely out of
stainless steel. Apparently he had an "in" with a fabricator, but
didn't think of it until the hull was mostly complete. Don't know how
serious he was, or recall how many beers had been consumed at the
time.
YIBB,
David
--
C.E.P.
415 W.46th Street
New York, New York 10036
http://www.crumblingempire.com
Mobile (646) 325-8325
Office (212) 247-0296
I know that at least one Solution 48 was built in steel (nice job, too). I
talked to Suzanne about it some time back, and she was quite enthusiastic
about steel as a building medium. I have some twenty years experience in
steel shipbuilding and maintenance, and I believe the AS39 would take nicely
to steel construction. I'd say the AS29 as well, but I do tend to overbuild
and I suspect my AS29 would turn out a tad on the heavy side; OTOH, the AS39
in steel should work out very close to the composite plywood weight. You
could probably do the same with the AS29, it would simply take some planning
and engineering.
Why not drop a fax to PB&F and explore the subject? I'm sure you'd be
rewarded with a solid opinion.
David Romasco
_____
From: jrtaylorinflag [mailto:jrtaylorinflag@...]
Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 2:53 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] steel AS 29
Does anyone know of someone buildiing either an as29 or as39 out of
steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
little bit of research from reading some books on steel boat
construction suggests the minimum recomended hull plating would be
approx. 5lbs./sq ft. not including framing. ( stringers & ribs etc.)
As I see it steel would be heavier but part of the weight differance
could be offset by not needing to plank the bottom in 3/4 plywood and
planking the deck in plywood. I don't know the wt. of actual finished
plywood/fiberglass/epoxy but strikes me as it may not be that much
lighter than the 5lbs/sq ft. for steel. I am aware of at least one
sharpie he wrote about in one of his books but I don't recall that he
addressed the wt. differances between steel and plywood/epoxy
construction.
In many ways I find working in steel easier than working in wood
and its cheap plus its coral-reef-proof. Aluminum is VERY easy to
fabricate. You Can cut aluminum plating with any cirular saw as easy
as plyood! Also you can instantly glue it all together with a
relatively cheap mig welder. However its not cheap, it doesn't take
paint well,(read moe money)and its not as reef-proof.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
talked to Suzanne about it some time back, and she was quite enthusiastic
about steel as a building medium. I have some twenty years experience in
steel shipbuilding and maintenance, and I believe the AS39 would take nicely
to steel construction. I'd say the AS29 as well, but I do tend to overbuild
and I suspect my AS29 would turn out a tad on the heavy side; OTOH, the AS39
in steel should work out very close to the composite plywood weight. You
could probably do the same with the AS29, it would simply take some planning
and engineering.
Why not drop a fax to PB&F and explore the subject? I'm sure you'd be
rewarded with a solid opinion.
David Romasco
_____
From: jrtaylorinflag [mailto:jrtaylorinflag@...]
Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 2:53 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] steel AS 29
Does anyone know of someone buildiing either an as29 or as39 out of
steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
little bit of research from reading some books on steel boat
construction suggests the minimum recomended hull plating would be
approx. 5lbs./sq ft. not including framing. ( stringers & ribs etc.)
As I see it steel would be heavier but part of the weight differance
could be offset by not needing to plank the bottom in 3/4 plywood and
planking the deck in plywood. I don't know the wt. of actual finished
plywood/fiberglass/epoxy but strikes me as it may not be that much
lighter than the 5lbs/sq ft. for steel. I am aware of at least one
sharpie he wrote about in one of his books but I don't recall that he
addressed the wt. differances between steel and plywood/epoxy
construction.
In many ways I find working in steel easier than working in wood
and its cheap plus its coral-reef-proof. Aluminum is VERY easy to
fabricate. You Can cut aluminum plating with any cirular saw as easy
as plyood! Also you can instantly glue it all together with a
relatively cheap mig welder. However its not cheap, it doesn't take
paint well,(read moe money)and its not as reef-proof.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Does anyone know of someone buildiing either an as29 or as39 out of
steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
little bit of research from reading some books on steel boat
construction suggests the minimum recomended hull plating would be
approx. 5lbs./sq ft. not including framing. ( stringers & ribs etc.)
As I see it steel would be heavier but part of the weight differance
could be offset by not needing to plank the bottom in 3/4 plywood and
planking the deck in plywood. I don't know the wt. of actual finished
plywood/fiberglass/epoxy but strikes me as it may not be that much
lighter than the 5lbs/sq ft. for steel. I am aware of at least one
sharpie he wrote about in one of his books but I don't recall that he
addressed the wt. differances between steel and plywood/epoxy
construction.
In many ways I find working in steel easier than working in wood
and its cheap plus its coral-reef-proof. Aluminum is VERY easy to
fabricate. You Can cut aluminum plating with any cirular saw as easy
as plyood! Also you can instantly glue it all together with a
relatively cheap mig welder. However its not cheap, it doesn't take
paint well,(read moe money)and its not as reef-proof.
steel or if Mr.Bolger has ever commented on its feasibility? My
little bit of research from reading some books on steel boat
construction suggests the minimum recomended hull plating would be
approx. 5lbs./sq ft. not including framing. ( stringers & ribs etc.)
As I see it steel would be heavier but part of the weight differance
could be offset by not needing to plank the bottom in 3/4 plywood and
planking the deck in plywood. I don't know the wt. of actual finished
plywood/fiberglass/epoxy but strikes me as it may not be that much
lighter than the 5lbs/sq ft. for steel. I am aware of at least one
sharpie he wrote about in one of his books but I don't recall that he
addressed the wt. differances between steel and plywood/epoxy
construction.
In many ways I find working in steel easier than working in wood
and its cheap plus its coral-reef-proof. Aluminum is VERY easy to
fabricate. You Can cut aluminum plating with any cirular saw as easy
as plyood! Also you can instantly glue it all together with a
relatively cheap mig welder. However its not cheap, it doesn't take
paint well,(read moe money)and its not as reef-proof.