[bolger] Re: Oldshoe Builders
In a message dated 99-09-30 08:05:57 EDT, you write:
<< I like the idea of leaving the screws in. Do you countersink them in 1/4"
plywood or just reef them down real good?
Would you do the same with the framing of the bulkheads?
Mike >>
Mike, I would think that moderation is called for in snugging down the
screws so that the epoxy goop doesnt get squeezed out of the joint, leaving a
dry joint that does not seal well. My plan is to use a thickener to
compensate for the fact that the best I could do on the angles was about 2
degrees of accuracy. Regards, Warren
<< I like the idea of leaving the screws in. Do you countersink them in 1/4"
plywood or just reef them down real good?
Would you do the same with the framing of the bulkheads?
Mike >>
Mike, I would think that moderation is called for in snugging down the
screws so that the epoxy goop doesnt get squeezed out of the joint, leaving a
dry joint that does not seal well. My plan is to use a thickener to
compensate for the fact that the best I could do on the angles was about 2
degrees of accuracy. Regards, Warren
Hi Mike:
It would probably be best to do so, but I don't for two reasons: 1)it would
require short screws which are hard to put in, hard to find, and of dubious
holding ability. 2) If you use 1 x 2's for framing, you already have twice
as much contact with the bulkhead as you do with the sides.
If I was using glass tape on both sides of the bulkhead/side joint, I would
not use screws at all. For me, though, screws are easier than tape.
Chuck
It would probably be best to do so, but I don't for two reasons: 1)it would
require short screws which are hard to put in, hard to find, and of dubious
holding ability. 2) If you use 1 x 2's for framing, you already have twice
as much contact with the bulkhead as you do with the sides.
If I was using glass tape on both sides of the bulkhead/side joint, I would
not use screws at all. For me, though, screws are easier than tape.
Chuck
> I like the idea of leaving the screws in. Do you countersink them in 1/4"test:
> plywood or just reef them down real good?
>
> Would you do the same with the framing of the bulkheads?
>
> Mike
>
>
> In a message dated 9/29/99 5:21:37 AM,duckworks@...writes:
>
> << I like to use SS or silicon bronze screws and leave them in. Do a
> Make two sample joints that are similar to your side/bulkhead joint: taketo
> four six by six inch pieces of ply , and 2 six inch 1x2s, glue the 1x2s
> the edge of two of the ply pieces (so it looks like part of a bulkhead )one
> then glue and screw the other pieces of ply to the bulkhead sections as if
> you were attaching sides. After the glue has set, remove the nails from
> of the test panels, and destroy both of them. I think you will besurprised
> how much stronger the joint with screws is.
> >>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> eGroups.com home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
>http://www.egroups.com- Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>
>
I like the idea of leaving the screws in. Do you countersink them in 1/4"
plywood or just reef them down real good?
Would you do the same with the framing of the bulkheads?
Mike
In a message dated 9/29/99 5:21:37 AM,duckworks@...writes:
<< I like to use SS or silicon bronze screws and leave them in. Do a test:
Make two sample joints that are similar to your side/bulkhead joint: take
four six by six inch pieces of ply , and 2 six inch 1x2s, glue the 1x2s to
the edge of two of the ply pieces (so it looks like part of a bulkhead )
then glue and screw the other pieces of ply to the bulkhead sections as if
you were attaching sides. After the glue has set, remove the nails from one
of the test panels, and destroy both of them. I think you will be surprised
how much stronger the joint with screws is.
plywood or just reef them down real good?
Would you do the same with the framing of the bulkheads?
Mike
In a message dated 9/29/99 5:21:37 AM,duckworks@...writes:
<< I like to use SS or silicon bronze screws and leave them in. Do a test:
Make two sample joints that are similar to your side/bulkhead joint: take
four six by six inch pieces of ply , and 2 six inch 1x2s, glue the 1x2s to
the edge of two of the ply pieces (so it looks like part of a bulkhead )
then glue and screw the other pieces of ply to the bulkhead sections as if
you were attaching sides. After the glue has set, remove the nails from one
of the test panels, and destroy both of them. I think you will be surprised
how much stronger the joint with screws is.
>>
Mike,
instant boat construction calls for nailing (with ring shank nails) and
gluing the sides to the bulkheads, leaving the nails in if the're
silicon bronze or SS. On my Micro, I'll also tape the bulkheads to the
sides inside with biaxial FG tape and epoxy resin. Regarding the
sequence, it is recommended to do a dry run (no glue) first, check if
everything is OK, then glue. I would attach the widest bulkhead first,
then bow and transom, then the other ones. Best, Pippo
teakdec-@...wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=393
instant boat construction calls for nailing (with ring shank nails) and
gluing the sides to the bulkheads, leaving the nails in if the're
silicon bronze or SS. On my Micro, I'll also tape the bulkheads to the
sides inside with biaxial FG tape and epoxy resin. Regarding the
sequence, it is recommended to do a dry run (no glue) first, check if
everything is OK, then glue. I would attach the widest bulkhead first,
then bow and transom, then the other ones. Best, Pippo
teakdec-@...wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=393
> I mentioned in a previous post that I started a model of Oldshoe. I'mjust
> cutting out oak tag sides and bulkheads and trimming the bulkheadswith balsa
> wood. Anyway, I taped the sides to the bulkheads tonight just to geta feel
> for how the boat looks and fits together. Amazing how all thosedifferent
> sized bulkheads align themselves inside the boat. A question though.How
> would any of you attach the bulkheads to the sides? Glue and screw?Then take
> out the screws and fill? It will be a very interesting task given therocker
> of the bottom. Would you do the bow and transom first then follow-upwith the
> other bulkheads?
Mike:
I like to use SS or silicon bronze screws and leave them in. Do a test:
Make two sample joints that are similar to your side/bulkhead joint: take
four six by six inch pieces of ply , and 2 six inch 1x2s, glue the 1x2s to
the edge of two of the ply pieces (so it looks like part of a bulkhead )
then glue and screw the other pieces of ply to the bulkhead sections as if
you were attaching sides. After the glue has set, remove the nails from one
of the test panels, and destroy both of them. I think you will be surprised
how much stronger the joint with screws is.
Chuck
I like to use SS or silicon bronze screws and leave them in. Do a test:
Make two sample joints that are similar to your side/bulkhead joint: take
four six by six inch pieces of ply , and 2 six inch 1x2s, glue the 1x2s to
the edge of two of the ply pieces (so it looks like part of a bulkhead )
then glue and screw the other pieces of ply to the bulkhead sections as if
you were attaching sides. After the glue has set, remove the nails from one
of the test panels, and destroy both of them. I think you will be surprised
how much stronger the joint with screws is.
Chuck
> Oldshoers, newshoers, tapshoers, horseshoers, etc.,balsa
>
> I mentioned in a previous post that I started a model of Oldshoe. I'm just
> cutting out oak tag sides and bulkheads and trimming the bulkheads with
> wood. Anyway, I taped the sides to the bulkheads tonight just to get afeel
> for how the boat looks and fits together. Amazing how all those differenttake
> sized bulkheads align themselves inside the boat. A question though. How
> would any of you attach the bulkheads to the sides? Glue and screw? Then
> out the screws and fill? It will be a very interesting task given therocker
> of the bottom. Would you do the bow and transom first then follow-up withthe
> other bulkheads?
>
> More later.
>
> Mike Masten
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> eGroups.com home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
>http://www.egroups.com- Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>
>
Oldshoers, newshoers, tapshoers, horseshoers, etc.,
I mentioned in a previous post that I started a model of Oldshoe. I'm just
cutting out oak tag sides and bulkheads and trimming the bulkheads with balsa
wood. Anyway, I taped the sides to the bulkheads tonight just to get a feel
for how the boat looks and fits together. Amazing how all those different
sized bulkheads align themselves inside the boat. A question though. How
would any of you attach the bulkheads to the sides? Glue and screw? Then take
out the screws and fill? It will be a very interesting task given the rocker
of the bottom. Would you do the bow and transom first then follow-up with the
other bulkheads?
More later.
Mike Masten
I mentioned in a previous post that I started a model of Oldshoe. I'm just
cutting out oak tag sides and bulkheads and trimming the bulkheads with balsa
wood. Anyway, I taped the sides to the bulkheads tonight just to get a feel
for how the boat looks and fits together. Amazing how all those different
sized bulkheads align themselves inside the boat. A question though. How
would any of you attach the bulkheads to the sides? Glue and screw? Then take
out the screws and fill? It will be a very interesting task given the rocker
of the bottom. Would you do the bow and transom first then follow-up with the
other bulkheads?
More later.
Mike Masten
Warren,
I would be just as happy to hear your Oldshoe discussion on the group
myself... It's an interesting boat.
Gregg
At 09:48 AM 9/27/1999 EDT, you wrote:
I would be just as happy to hear your Oldshoe discussion on the group
myself... It's an interesting boat.
Gregg
At 09:48 AM 9/27/1999 EDT, you wrote:
>To all,others
> Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
>write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2
>(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
>group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
>construction.
> Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
>cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
>recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
>reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
> Best regards, Warren
> E-Mail:KF4call@...
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>eGroups.com home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
>http://www.egroups.com- Simplifying group communications
>
>
>
>
>
Mike - have you tried the fast-cure - 4200?
Gregg
Gregg
>Warren,
>
>Thanks for seeking out Oldshoe builders. I just received the plans and am now
>trying to build a model out of oak tag and balsa. My background:
>
>- I recently built and have sailed Windsprint. I posted an e-mail about my
>experience to the Bolger group and got almost no response. Anyway, I've
>selected Oldshoe as my next project because I want a small, stable boat that
>is easy to rig and comfortable to sail.
>
>- I have virtually no wood working or boat building skills. On Windsprint I
>did almost everything twice. To cut a straight line on a piece of plywood I
>have to lay clamp down a guide!
>
>- I am allergic to epoxy so I will not be using it on Oldshoe. I'm going to
>try 3M 5200.
>
>- I have no idea how to read the plans and make the boat go together (that's
>why the model).
>
>- I wish they sold clamps at the grocery store so everytime I went I could
>buy another one.
>
>Warren, do I understand you to say you have cut out the bulkheads and added
>the framing? How did you handle the bevels? Did you do the cutouts after
>gluing the framing to the plywood? What kind of fasteners are you using? If
>nails, how do you drive them? When I tried to drive in ring nails on my
>Windsprint I had a heck of a time with them curling over once the rings got
>to the wood. And it was near impossible to pull them out.
>
>Gotta go now. The firstmate calls.
>
>Mike Masten
>In a message dated 9/27/99 5:54:03 AM,KF4call@...writes:
>
><< To all,
> Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
>write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2 others
>(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
>group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
>construction.
> Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
>cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
>recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
>reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
> Best regards, Warren
> E-Mail:KF4call@...
> >>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>eGroups.com home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
>http://www.egroups.com- Simplifying group communications
Warren,
Thanks for seeking out Oldshoe builders. I just received the plans and am now
trying to build a model out of oak tag and balsa. My background:
- I recently built and have sailed Windsprint. I posted an e-mail about my
experience to the Bolger group and got almost no response. Anyway, I've
selected Oldshoe as my next project because I want a small, stable boat that
is easy to rig and comfortable to sail.
- I have virtually no wood working or boat building skills. On Windsprint I
did almost everything twice. To cut a straight line on a piece of plywood I
have to lay clamp down a guide!
- I am allergic to epoxy so I will not be using it on Oldshoe. I'm going to
try 3M 5200.
- I have no idea how to read the plans and make the boat go together (that's
why the model).
- I wish they sold clamps at the grocery store so everytime I went I could
buy another one.
Warren, do I understand you to say you have cut out the bulkheads and added
the framing? How did you handle the bevels? Did you do the cutouts after
gluing the framing to the plywood? What kind of fasteners are you using? If
nails, how do you drive them? When I tried to drive in ring nails on my
Windsprint I had a heck of a time with them curling over once the rings got
to the wood. And it was near impossible to pull them out.
Gotta go now. The firstmate calls.
Mike Masten
In a message dated 9/27/99 5:54:03 AM,KF4call@...writes:
<< To all,
Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2 others
(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
construction.
Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
Best regards, Warren
E-Mail:KF4call@...
Thanks for seeking out Oldshoe builders. I just received the plans and am now
trying to build a model out of oak tag and balsa. My background:
- I recently built and have sailed Windsprint. I posted an e-mail about my
experience to the Bolger group and got almost no response. Anyway, I've
selected Oldshoe as my next project because I want a small, stable boat that
is easy to rig and comfortable to sail.
- I have virtually no wood working or boat building skills. On Windsprint I
did almost everything twice. To cut a straight line on a piece of plywood I
have to lay clamp down a guide!
- I am allergic to epoxy so I will not be using it on Oldshoe. I'm going to
try 3M 5200.
- I have no idea how to read the plans and make the boat go together (that's
why the model).
- I wish they sold clamps at the grocery store so everytime I went I could
buy another one.
Warren, do I understand you to say you have cut out the bulkheads and added
the framing? How did you handle the bevels? Did you do the cutouts after
gluing the framing to the plywood? What kind of fasteners are you using? If
nails, how do you drive them? When I tried to drive in ring nails on my
Windsprint I had a heck of a time with them curling over once the rings got
to the wood. And it was near impossible to pull them out.
Gotta go now. The firstmate calls.
Mike Masten
In a message dated 9/27/99 5:54:03 AM,KF4call@...writes:
<< To all,
Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2 others
(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
construction.
Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
Best regards, Warren
E-Mail:KF4call@...
>>
To all,
Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2 others
(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
construction.
Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
Best regards, Warren
E-Mail:KF4call@...
Are there any Oldshoe builders or daydreamers out there? If so, please
write me if you would wish to correspond by e-mail with myself and 1-2 others
(so far), who are also building this boat. The purpose of the informal
group would be to share ideas and generally provide support related to
construction.
Some have described Oldshoe as a baby Micro without a cabin. It is a
cat-ketch with ballast keel and is 12ft. LOA with a 16-inch draft. I have
recently started to build one, having just completed the solid wood
reinforcers for the frames as my first step.
Best regards, Warren
E-Mail:KF4call@...