Re: Re: Sprit Sail
Comparing a Laser to a Thomaston Galley seems quite a stretch. Both are
nice boats, but there is no relation I can see. As I recall, Laser is a
planing boat requiring abs of steel, but very fun. Kind of wet, no way
to relax, and no way to row. No need to bail after righting. All
properties quite different from the Galley.
I saw a Galley on the beach at the Snow Row in Hull, MA a while back.
nice boats, but there is no relation I can see. As I recall, Laser is a
planing boat requiring abs of steel, but very fun. Kind of wet, no way
to relax, and no way to row. No need to bail after righting. All
properties quite different from the Galley.
I saw a Galley on the beach at the Snow Row in Hull, MA a while back.
>pvanderwaart wrote:
>> There have been many Gypsy/Laser comparisions on this board,
>
I built and owned a Thomaston Galley in the early '70's. I used mine as a rowing boat and as a duck hunting/fishing boat. It was about 20 years later when my son started racing Lasers, and I think the TG is a very different type (and slower across the board) than a Laser. TG's deadrise and weaker rear quarters don't provide the same sail carrying power as a Laser, and hiking out on or over TG's narrow gunwale wuold be impossibly uncomfortable. Bolger writes that the boat will power with a small motor, but in those days, I couldn't afford a motor. It rowed well and would carry me and my wife, or me, my 90 lb lab, and 6 decoys in some comfort. It was light enough for a young man to drag across land or through the marsh and stable enough so that I could get back in or get the dog back in. Camouflaged easily, but rowing into a chop was wet--that long snout doesn't turn any spray.
It was a nice boat for my purposes and had capabilities I never used.
John T
It was a nice boat for my purposes and had capabilities I never used.
John T
----- Original Message -----
From: pvanderwaart
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2004 5:58 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Sprit Sail
> Has anyone around here ever built, seen, or heard of a
> Thomaston Galley?
I sailed one for a few minutes at a Small Craft day at Mystic many
years ago. As compared to a Laser, I would guess it's heavier, and
heavier to handle. The boat was fresh from Payson's shop, and there
were some Bolgeresque features that most anyone would change pretty
quickly. For example, in tacking the sheet had to be caught around a
thumb cleat on the new lee quarter. Not too convenient, and it could
flip out of there easily.
As best I recall, she has a fair amount of rocker, so she will not
pick up and plane like Gypsy and the Laser.
If we think of the category of "rowing and sailing boats", then the
Galley, Gypsy, Featherwind, Commonsense skiff and even more PCB boats
belog. I think that the Galley is better suited to rough and cold
water than Gypsy, she has more clear space (good for gunning, or
sleeping).
Peter
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Has anyone around here ever built, seen, or heard of aI sailed one for a few minutes at a Small Craft day at Mystic many
> Thomaston Galley?
years ago. As compared to a Laser, I would guess it's heavier, and
heavier to handle. The boat was fresh from Payson's shop, and there
were some Bolgeresque features that most anyone would change pretty
quickly. For example, in tacking the sheet had to be caught around a
thumb cleat on the new lee quarter. Not too convenient, and it could
flip out of there easily.
As best I recall, she has a fair amount of rocker, so she will not
pick up and plane like Gypsy and the Laser.
If we think of the category of "rowing and sailing boats", then the
Galley, Gypsy, Featherwind, Commonsense skiff and even more PCB boats
belog. I think that the Galley is better suited to rough and cold
water than Gypsy, she has more clear space (good for gunning, or
sleeping).
Peter
If the data base is right, then Sparkler is MUCH larger. I don't see the
"Lightning" someone mentioned in there either, if that is a Bolger boat.
The non Bolger Lightning I know is much larger than a Laser as well. I
don't have "30 Odd Boats" yet.
"Lightning" someone mentioned in there either, if that is a Bolger boat.
The non Bolger Lightning I know is much larger than a Laser as well. I
don't have "30 Odd Boats" yet.
>Bruce Hallman wrote:
>
>
>>> A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaper
>>> might be good.
>>
>>
>
>Bolger's lighter, cheaper answer to Laser would
>be Sparkler; another Bolger boat I plan to build
>someday
>
FWIW, Dan Segal, writing of the original Gypsy in Small Boat Journal wrote
that Gypsy was originally called Galley II, and that Bolger described
it as a "tack and tape successor to the Thomaston Galley".
So, perhaps the Thomaston Galley could also be considered in the same class
as a Laser?
Has anyone around here ever built, seen, or heard of a Thomaston Galley?
Phil Bolger writes of owning one and being very fond of it.
that Gypsy was originally called Galley II, and that Bolger described
it as a "tack and tape successor to the Thomaston Galley".
So, perhaps the Thomaston Galley could also be considered in the same class
as a Laser?
Has anyone around here ever built, seen, or heard of a Thomaston Galley?
Phil Bolger writes of owning one and being very fond of it.
> pvanderwaart wrote:
> There have been many Gypsy/Laser comparisions on this board,
> Gypsy might be considered a lighter cheaper Bolger boatThere have been many Gypsy/Laser comparisions on this board,
> similar to a Laser.
actually. Performance-wise, Gypsy comes out pretty well but you will
want to add some sort of side seats or side decks if you want to
hike often and hard. There have also been of reports of breaking the
Gypsy rig by driving the boat hard, so get the best grained wood you
can and don't undersize it.
Gypsy will take on water like any open boat while it will roll over
the decked Laser.
Peter
My mistake, 'Sparkler' is Bolger's simplification to a Lightning. :)
Gypsy might be considered a lighter cheaper Bolger boat
similar to a Laser.
Gypsy might be considered a lighter cheaper Bolger boat
similar to a Laser.
> I don't see theNo, no, no. I meant that Sparkler is Bolger's simplification of the
> "Lightning" someone mentioned in there either,...
S&S Lightning, (and, by implication, not a simplification of the
Laser).
The Commonsense Skiff is more Laser-like in size.
>With a sheet in your hand and the boom and a 43 squ.You'd be surprised how hard that is, even with a 30 sq ft sail. Trust me.
>foot sail, I think you tighten and flatten the sail just by pulling
>it
>in.
Been there, screwed up, so to speak. <chuckle>
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
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Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
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_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John B. Trussell"
<John.Trussell@w...>
wrote:
Sweet Pea. Te sail was lashed to the head of the mast and to a cleat
at the bottom of the mast. I didn't have a vang as the idea was to
have a rig which was easy to strike and start rowing.
O.K., that makes sense and when I put the rig together (right now
it's
a pile of sticks in the garage) , I think this will be obvious. I was
concerned mostly that the sail would ride up like a pair of cheap
underwear without something to hold it down. I've never had an open
jaw, only gooseneck, thus the puzzle. I think it'll work out. I think
Mr. Bolger prefers the boom on a sprit sail to stop the rythmic roll,
the "death roll." With a sheet in your hand and the boom and a 43 squ.
foot sail, I think you tighten and flatten the sail just by pulling
it
in. Not only is it not rocket science, it isn't very high tech sail
science either, but it looks fun. I'll try to post some pictures if I
can figure out how to do that. Thanks for the responses, they are
helpful and I appreciate the interest of the group.. Charles Rouse
P.S. when my wife saw a drawing of the little sail she asked why
don't
I just use one of our table clothes. I think I'll go for dacron.
<John.Trussell@w...>
wrote:
> I'm late to this thread, but I did have a Sweet Pea sprit sail onmy
Sweet Pea. Te sail was lashed to the head of the mast and to a cleat
at the bottom of the mast. I didn't have a vang as the idea was to
have a rig which was easy to strike and start rowing.
O.K., that makes sense and when I put the rig together (right now
it's
a pile of sticks in the garage) , I think this will be obvious. I was
concerned mostly that the sail would ride up like a pair of cheap
underwear without something to hold it down. I've never had an open
jaw, only gooseneck, thus the puzzle. I think it'll work out. I think
Mr. Bolger prefers the boom on a sprit sail to stop the rythmic roll,
the "death roll." With a sheet in your hand and the boom and a 43 squ.
foot sail, I think you tighten and flatten the sail just by pulling
it
in. Not only is it not rocket science, it isn't very high tech sail
science either, but it looks fun. I'll try to post some pictures if I
can figure out how to do that. Thanks for the responses, they are
helpful and I appreciate the interest of the group.. Charles Rouse
P.S. when my wife saw a drawing of the little sail she asked why
don't
I just use one of our table clothes. I think I'll go for dacron.
I don't remember any death roll problems on the Laser, but maybe
compared to a Tech dinghy .....(approximate hull shape like barrel). Or
maybe I just tacked downwind. The Laser planes so well it's probably
faster that way. A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaper
might be good. I wonder if that Dart, or whatever it's called, in the
beginning of BWAOM is like that?
(But I bet my S.O. wouldn't enjoy anything that was like a Laser.)
compared to a Tech dinghy .....(approximate hull shape like barrel). Or
maybe I just tacked downwind. The Laser planes so well it's probably
faster that way. A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaper
might be good. I wonder if that Dart, or whatever it's called, in the
beginning of BWAOM is like that?
(But I bet my S.O. wouldn't enjoy anything that was like a Laser.)
>Roger Derby wrote:
>Now that's an argument I can relate to.
>
>I borrowed a new Laser to pick up the buoys after one of our races and
>downwind was about the scariest thing I've met. Ten seconds and I decided
>I'd rather tack downwind.
>
>Go fast rigging is a lot of fun to play with, but it is expensive.Come come. An Opti vang is one clam cleat, one foot of line, and a eye of
some sort on the boom. Expensive? Naw. Complicated? You set it and forget
it.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
> Bolger's lighter, cheaper answer to Laser wouldYou must be thinking of a Lightning.
> be Sparkler; another Bolger boat I plan to build
> someday :)
I'm late to this thread, but I did have a Sweet Pea sprit sail on my Sweet Pea. Te sail was lashed to the head of the mast and to a cleat at the bottom of the mast. I didn't have a vang as the idea was to have a rig which was easy to strike and start rowing. If I were trying to race (in which case, I probably would not choose either a Brick, a Sweet Pea, or a sprit sail), I would install a vang, but for casual day sailing with a sprit sail, a vang is a complication I wouldn't fool with. If you are concerned about the boom rising and setting off a rhythmic roll, either a leg of mutton sail with a sprit boom or a balanced lug are more or less "self vanging".
Alternatively, you could replace the designed boom with a sprit boom with the snotter about a foot above the foot of the sail. Go fast rigging is a lot of fun to play with, but it is expensive. On a small boat like a Brick (OK, Brick is a big small boat) it will often be inconvenient to move around and pull strings. There is a lot to be said for keeping everything as simple as possible.
John T
Alternatively, you could replace the designed boom with a sprit boom with the snotter about a foot above the foot of the sail. Go fast rigging is a lot of fun to play with, but it is expensive. On a small boat like a Brick (OK, Brick is a big small boat) it will often be inconvenient to move around and pull strings. There is a lot to be said for keeping everything as simple as possible.
John T
----- Original Message -----
From: Roger Derby
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, July 19, 2004 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Re: Sprit Sail
Actually, I don't remember if it was a Laser or a Force Five. Didn't they
come out about the same time?
Anyway, it was a former student's brand new boat, jib-headed sail and round
bottom, and I had an audience. I wasn't worried about getting hurt, but I
sure didn't want to look stupid (again).
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lincoln Ross" <lincolnr@...>
> I don't remember any death roll problems on the Laser, but maybe
> compared to a Tech dinghy .....(approximate hull shape like barrel). Or
> maybe I just tacked downwind. The Laser planes so well it's probably
> faster that way. A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaper
> might be good. I wonder if that Dart, or whatever it's called, in the
> beginning of BWAOM is like that?
>
> (But I bet my S.O. wouldn't enjoy anything that was like a Laser.)
>
> >Roger Derby wrote:
> >Now that's an argument I can relate to.
> >
> >I borrowed a new Laser to pick up the buoys after one of our races and
> >downwind was about the scariest thing I've met. Ten seconds and I
decided
> >I'd rather tack downwind.
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaperBolger's lighter, cheaper answer to Laser would
> might be good.
be Sparkler; another Bolger boat I plan to build
someday :)
Actually, I don't remember if it was a Laser or a Force Five. Didn't they
come out about the same time?
Anyway, it was a former student's brand new boat, jib-headed sail and round
bottom, and I had an audience. I wasn't worried about getting hurt, but I
sure didn't want to look stupid (again).
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
come out about the same time?
Anyway, it was a former student's brand new boat, jib-headed sail and round
bottom, and I had an audience. I wasn't worried about getting hurt, but I
sure didn't want to look stupid (again).
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lincoln Ross" <lincolnr@...>
> I don't remember any death roll problems on the Laser, but maybe
> compared to a Tech dinghy .....(approximate hull shape like barrel). Or
> maybe I just tacked downwind. The Laser planes so well it's probably
> faster that way. A Bolger boat like a Laser but lighter and cheaper
> might be good. I wonder if that Dart, or whatever it's called, in the
> beginning of BWAOM is like that?
>
> (But I bet my S.O. wouldn't enjoy anything that was like a Laser.)
>
> >Roger Derby wrote:
> >Now that's an argument I can relate to.
> >
> >I borrowed a new Laser to pick up the buoys after one of our races and
> >downwind was about the scariest thing I've met. Ten seconds and I
decided
> >I'd rather tack downwind.
Well, I thought I'd pulled all of the stupid moves, but that one escaped me.
I've been upset over jibes, pun intended, but once I learned to "meet the
boom with the tiller," the problem went away.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
I've been upset over jibes, pun intended, but once I learned to "meet the
boom with the tiller," the problem went away.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "craig o'donnell" <dadadata@...>
> >I've been trying to picture "everything wraps around the mast" without
> >success.
> >
> >That's an Opti pram rig I put on Dadink (bottom of
> >http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/Dink.html) The mast swivels. If bad
things
> >happen to the set of the sail, release the sheet or turn up into the
wind.
>
> Downwind, or in a jibe, especially an unplanned one, if you let the boom
> lift and the wind shifts (or you are sailing by the lee) the boom can go
> vertical without a vang. Everything then wraps around the mast.
>I've been trying to picture "everything wraps around the mast" withoutDownwind, or in a jibe, especially an unplanned one, if you let the boom
>success.
>
>That's an Opti pram rig I put on Dadink (bottom of
>http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/Dink.html) The mast swivels. If bad things
>happen to the set of the sail, release the sheet or turn up into the wind.
lift and the wind shifts (or you are sailing by the lee) the boom can go
vertical without a vang. Everything then wraps around the mast.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
see below
trimmed sail is an advertisement that I either don't know or don't care
what I'm doing. I'm not exactly a snob, as I don't mind being seen in a
Brick, but I like to get some control over my sail. The downhaul is not
exactly expensive: one cheapo cleat and two feet of smallish line. Also,
a flat sail with the draft further aft lets you handle more wind.
death roll in the first place. Try jibing a Tech dinghy in 15 or so
knots of wind if you want to know what I mean. The rounder the bottom of
the boat, the more you need that vang.
snip
>Roger Derby wrote:Well, that depends on how you feel about your sailing. To me, a poorly
>
>None of the several boats I've sailed had a downhaul or boom vang. I kind
>of associate that with the go-fast crowd. The weight of the boom and the
>sheet holds the boom down. Of course the gooseneck is often bolted to the
>mast, so only the clew tries to rise on those boats. The downhaul lets you
>change luff tension and shape the sail, but for most day sailing, it's just
>another string.
>
trimmed sail is an advertisement that I either don't know or don't care
what I'm doing. I'm not exactly a snob, as I don't mind being seen in a
Brick, but I like to get some control over my sail. The downhaul is not
exactly expensive: one cheapo cleat and two feet of smallish line. Also,
a flat sail with the draft further aft lets you handle more wind.
>snipAh, but if you tighten up the vang you are much less likely to have the
>
>I have the impression that where the vang really pays off is when running,
>but that's when the loads on the sail are least -- true wind minus boat
>speed gives a very low apparent wind. Also, when running, it's comforting
>to have the boom lift away from those waves which are trying to catch it and
>cause a broach.
>
death roll in the first place. Try jibing a Tech dinghy in 15 or so
knots of wind if you want to know what I mean. The rounder the bottom of
the boat, the more you need that vang.
snip
Now that's an argument I can relate to.
I borrowed a new Laser to pick up the buoys after one of our races and
downwind was about the scariest thing I've met. Ten seconds and I decided
I'd rather tack downwind.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
I borrowed a new Laser to pick up the buoys after one of our races and
downwind was about the scariest thing I've met. Ten seconds and I decided
I'd rather tack downwind.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lincoln Ross" <lincolnr@...>
<snip>
> Ah, but if you tighten up the vang you are much less likely
> to have the death roll in the first place. Try jibing a Tech
> dinghy in 15 or so knots of wind if you want to know what
> I mean. The rounder the bottom of the boat, the more you
> need that vang.
> snip
I've been trying to picture "everything wraps around the mast" without
success.
That's an Opti pram rig I put on Dadink (bottom of
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/Dink.html) The mast swivels. If bad things
happen to the set of the sail, release the sheet or turn up into the wind.
(The only reason I used it is that when I was building the mast, I grabbed
an 8' 2x4 rather than the 12' one I'd set aside. After it was all done, I
measured it; cussed; and went with the pram sail which had been living in a
grocery bag on my closet shelf for 23 years.)
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
success.
That's an Opti pram rig I put on Dadink (bottom of
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/Dink.html) The mast swivels. If bad things
happen to the set of the sail, release the sheet or turn up into the wind.
(The only reason I used it is that when I was building the mast, I grabbed
an 8' 2x4 rather than the 12' one I'd set aside. After it was all done, I
measured it; cussed; and went with the pram sail which had been living in a
grocery bag on my closet shelf for 23 years.)
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "craig o'donnell" <dadadata@...>
> >I have the impression that where the vang really pays off is when
running,
> >but that's when the loads on the sail are least -- true wind minus boat
> >speed gives a very low apparent wind. Also, when running, it's
comforting
> >to have the boom lift away from those waves which are trying to catch it
and
> >cause a broach.
>
> Until the sail lifts the boom and everything wraps around the mast. Which
> in fact happened last week to one of our Opti students who forgot to rig
> his vang tightly enough, so it worked out of the clam cleat. That's what a
> vang is for.
>
> This is my objection to the standing lug on a CLC Eastport Pram. The boom
> can lift when running and the sail can wrap around the mast. Same sail,
> rigged as a balanced lug by moving the boom past the mast, this cannot
> happen.
>I have the impression that where the vang really pays off is when running,Until the sail lifts the boom and everything wraps around the mast. Which
>but that's when the loads on the sail are least -- true wind minus boat
>speed gives a very low apparent wind. Also, when running, it's comforting
>to have the boom lift away from those waves which are trying to catch it and
>cause a broach.
in fact happened last week to one of our Opti students who forgot to rig
his vang tightly enough, so it worked out of the clam cleat. That's what a
vang is for.
This is my objection to the standing lug on a CLC Eastport Pram. The boom
can lift when running and the sail can wrap around the mast. Same sail,
rigged as a balanced lug by moving the boom past the mast, this cannot
happen.
>While the twenty-some Optimist Prams we used for training in the HalifaxI doubt you'll see a vangless Opti anymore. it's not a "gofast" thingie if
>Sailing Association did not have the vangs, one of our graduates would come
>back for the annual season finale with his own pram. It did have all that
>go-fast stuff and he had the competition psyched out before the starting
>gun. Those training boats were pretty rough, being used by raw beginners
>for some six classes each summer. Almost all were the original plywood
>version.
it's just a line to a cleat. It's a kind of downhaul and it keeps the boom
under control.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
None of the several boats I've sailed had a downhaul or boom vang. I kind
of associate that with the go-fast crowd. The weight of the boom and the
sheet holds the boom down. Of course the gooseneck is often bolted to the
mast, so only the clew tries to rise on those boats. The downhaul lets you
change luff tension and shape the sail, but for most day sailing, it's just
another string.
If you think about the loads on the sail and remember that you can't push a
rope, you'll see that the sail pulls forward on the sheet (and/or clew
outhaul) and aft on the mast, at least when close-hauled. The vertical
force on the foot is small; e.g. the many loose-footed sails. Many of the
small boats that Chappell documented had only a fore-stay, no shrouds, no
back-stays, just lead the halyard to the bow for a fore-stay and you're
done.
I have the impression that where the vang really pays off is when running,
but that's when the loads on the sail are least -- true wind minus boat
speed gives a very low apparent wind. Also, when running, it's comforting
to have the boom lift away from those waves which are trying to catch it and
cause a broach.
While the twenty-some Optimist Prams we used for training in the Halifax
Sailing Association did not have the vangs, one of our graduates would come
back for the annual season finale with his own pram. It did have all that
go-fast stuff and he had the competition psyched out before the starting
gun. Those training boats were pretty rough, being used by raw beginners
for some six classes each summer. Almost all were the original plywood
version.
Roger (I just closed my case. The CB case that is.)
derbyrm@...
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
of associate that with the go-fast crowd. The weight of the boom and the
sheet holds the boom down. Of course the gooseneck is often bolted to the
mast, so only the clew tries to rise on those boats. The downhaul lets you
change luff tension and shape the sail, but for most day sailing, it's just
another string.
If you think about the loads on the sail and remember that you can't push a
rope, you'll see that the sail pulls forward on the sheet (and/or clew
outhaul) and aft on the mast, at least when close-hauled. The vertical
force on the foot is small; e.g. the many loose-footed sails. Many of the
small boats that Chappell documented had only a fore-stay, no shrouds, no
back-stays, just lead the halyard to the bow for a fore-stay and you're
done.
I have the impression that where the vang really pays off is when running,
but that's when the loads on the sail are least -- true wind minus boat
speed gives a very low apparent wind. Also, when running, it's comforting
to have the boom lift away from those waves which are trying to catch it and
cause a broach.
While the twenty-some Optimist Prams we used for training in the Halifax
Sailing Association did not have the vangs, one of our graduates would come
back for the annual season finale with his own pram. It did have all that
go-fast stuff and he had the competition psyched out before the starting
gun. Those training boats were pretty rough, being used by raw beginners
for some six classes each summer. Almost all were the original plywood
version.
Roger (I just closed my case. The CB case that is.)
derbyrm@...
http://derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "craig o'donnell" <dadadata@...>
> >I'm building a Long Tortoise, plans from Mr. Payson. I decided it
> >should have a sprit sail and I can buy one from Payson, the one
> >intended for Sweet Pea. I have a question on the foot of the sail. It
> >has a boom with open jaws against the mast. What holds the sail down?
> >I don't see a downhaul. Is the sheet enough to hold the sail down?
> >Anyone know?
> >
> >Charles Rouse
>
> Really? I thought Sweet Pea had two sprit booms with snotters.. But
> checking BWAOM I see it does not.
>
> Nornally a boom vang holds the boom down. On an Opti pram, which would
> be a similar sail, the vang is fastened to the boom about 8 inches out
from the
> mast and goes thru a jam cleat on the aft side just above the partner.
>
> You could probably use a simple downhaul running through holes on each
> wing of the jaw (tie a bowline) and down to a clam cleat. The closer the
> line is to the mast the less vanging there is though.
>
> One way to rig the sheet will give some vanging.
>
> 1. Traveler across the stern. A single block on this. Tie one end of the
> sheet to this block. Run the sheet up thru a single block on the boom,
> forward to another single block, and down to the helmsperson's hand.
>I'm building a Long Tortoise, plans from Mr. Payson. I decided itReally? I thought Sweet Pea had two sprit booms with snotters.. But
>should have a sprit sail and I can buy one from Payson, the one
>intended for Sweet Pea. I have a question on the foot of the sail. It
>has a boom with open jaws against the mast. What holds the sail down?
>I don't see a downhaul. Is the sheet enough to hold the sail down?
>Anyone know?
>
>Charles Rouse
checking BWAOM I see it does not.
Nornall a boom vang holds the boom down. On an Opti pram, which would be a
similar sail, the vang is fastened to the boom about 8 inches out from the
mast and goes thru a jam cleat on the aft side just above the partner.
You could probably use a simple downhaul running through holes on each
wing of the jaw (tie a bowline) and down to a clam cleat. The closer the
line is to the mast the less vanging there is though.
One way to rig the sheet will give some vanging.
1. Traveler across the stern. A single block on this. Tie one end of the
sheet to this block. Run the sheet up thru a single block on the boom,
forward to another single block, and down to the helmsperson's hand.
--
Craig O'Donnell
Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
<http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
_________________________________
-- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
-- Macintosh kinda guy
Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
_________________________________
I'm building a Long Tortoise, plans from Mr. Payson. I decided it
should have a sprit sail and I can buy one from Payson, the one
intended for Sweet Pea. I have a question on the foot of the sail. It
has a boom with open jaws against the mast. What holds the sail down?
I don't see a downhaul. Is the sheet enough to hold the sail down?
Anyone know?
Charles Rouse
should have a sprit sail and I can buy one from Payson, the one
intended for Sweet Pea. I have a question on the foot of the sail. It
has a boom with open jaws against the mast. What holds the sail down?
I don't see a downhaul. Is the sheet enough to hold the sail down?
Anyone know?
Charles Rouse