Re: Chebacco Stem with red oak??
You're heading in the right direction. I laminated marine ply for
the Chebacco inner stem and placed the outer stem in bedding
compound, bolted to the inner stem with SB lag screws--these are
interior, they go through the inner stem (recessed to allow the mast
to slide along the inner stem) and engage the outer stem.
the Chebacco inner stem and placed the outer stem in bedding
compound, bolted to the inner stem with SB lag screws--these are
interior, they go through the inner stem (recessed to allow the mast
to slide along the inner stem) and engage the outer stem.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "bh100014" <ben.ho@s...> wrote:
> I came across a Memmonite who makes wooden sledges. They are
> seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
> a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red
oak,
> not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong.
But
> for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
> which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job? This guys
> tells me that they use red oak because it handles the elements much
> better than white oak, keeps its shape, and is strong enough for a
> full-size sled. I figure if this stuff can handle getting grinded
on
> snow-covered roads day-in day-out, without the benefit of modern
> vanish & epoxy etc., then it's got to be pretty strong and durable!
>
> Ben Ho
Thank you all for your input.
It looks like the safe bet is to stay away from red oak. The inner
stem doesn't need to be pretty, and it seems the stems of most
Chebacco's are built from laminating marine ply, so I probably
should just stick with marine plywood. Douglas Fir is no longer
readily available around here. Sometimes you can find it in recycled
lumber, and it's not cheap either. But who says marine ply is
cheap...
It looks like the safe bet is to stay away from red oak. The inner
stem doesn't need to be pretty, and it seems the stems of most
Chebacco's are built from laminating marine ply, so I probably
should just stick with marine plywood. Douglas Fir is no longer
readily available around here. Sometimes you can find it in recycled
lumber, and it's not cheap either. But who says marine ply is
cheap...
> Ben Ho
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "bh100014" <ben.ho@s...> wrote:
Hi Ben,
One man's opinion... I have to agree with Peter V. Here at Arbor
Woodworks, we usually do cabinetry, millwork & furniture - but we have
done some marine work. The single most tedious, aggravating type of
project is digging out rot and repairing the affected member. Between
car, bicycle, house, wife, boat, and entire shop full of tools, I have
plenty of maintaince chores to do. I don't need to set myself up for more.
Because the tyloses (pores) of R. Oak are open, and therefore very
receptive to soaking up water (it's like a bloody sponge, in fact),
and because the wood itself has very little inherent rot resistance
(unlike teak or w. red cedar, etc.), it mildews (very unsightly). Then
it rots entirely. I would never put it anywhere I couldn't easy
unscrew, remove from bedding compound, and replace. In fact, I can't
really think of any marine application where Red Oak would be my first
choice, or even distant twentieth choice.
We are currently building a 15'-6" sailing dinghy. I have used Western
Red Cedar for all of the framing that would be difficult to replace. I
used Douglas Fir (Oregon Pine) for the gunwales, inwales, and bottom
runners. Tough wood. Not as rot resistant as the cedar, but in easily
replaced locations.
Good Luck & Happy Sailing,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR.
Remembering the immortal words of grandad..."When smoking a salmon,
never inhale!"
> I came across a Memmonite who makes wooden sledges. They are**********************************
> seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
> a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red oak,
> not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong. But
> for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
> which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job?
>
> Ben Ho
Hi Ben,
One man's opinion... I have to agree with Peter V. Here at Arbor
Woodworks, we usually do cabinetry, millwork & furniture - but we have
done some marine work. The single most tedious, aggravating type of
project is digging out rot and repairing the affected member. Between
car, bicycle, house, wife, boat, and entire shop full of tools, I have
plenty of maintaince chores to do. I don't need to set myself up for more.
Because the tyloses (pores) of R. Oak are open, and therefore very
receptive to soaking up water (it's like a bloody sponge, in fact),
and because the wood itself has very little inherent rot resistance
(unlike teak or w. red cedar, etc.), it mildews (very unsightly). Then
it rots entirely. I would never put it anywhere I couldn't easy
unscrew, remove from bedding compound, and replace. In fact, I can't
really think of any marine application where Red Oak would be my first
choice, or even distant twentieth choice.
We are currently building a 15'-6" sailing dinghy. I have used Western
Red Cedar for all of the framing that would be difficult to replace. I
used Douglas Fir (Oregon Pine) for the gunwales, inwales, and bottom
runners. Tough wood. Not as rot resistant as the cedar, but in easily
replaced locations.
Good Luck & Happy Sailing,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR.
Remembering the immortal words of grandad..."When smoking a salmon,
never inhale!"
Anything you are likely to use for a stem is only "moderately" or non
resistent to rot. Best use epoxy and glass. If you are using epoxy
then be extremely scrupulous about soaking epoxy into the end
grain-especially with red oak. White Oak does not take to epoxy they
tell me so skip that. You may have checking with White Oak. You could
always go get a chunk of Purpleheart or some such if you are not going
to epoxy and glass. If the outer stem is sacrificial you might
consider a glass "gasket" epoxied between the inner and outer stems so
if the outer stem rots it won't infect the inner stem.
Bob Chamberland
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "bh100014" <ben.ho@s...> wrote:
resistent to rot. Best use epoxy and glass. If you are using epoxy
then be extremely scrupulous about soaking epoxy into the end
grain-especially with red oak. White Oak does not take to epoxy they
tell me so skip that. You may have checking with White Oak. You could
always go get a chunk of Purpleheart or some such if you are not going
to epoxy and glass. If the outer stem is sacrificial you might
consider a glass "gasket" epoxied between the inner and outer stems so
if the outer stem rots it won't infect the inner stem.
Bob Chamberland
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "bh100014" <ben.ho@s...> wrote:
> I came across a Memmonite who makes wooden sledges. They are
> seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
> a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red oak,
> not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong. But
> for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
> which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job? This guys
> tells me that they use red oak because it handles the elements much
> better than white oak, keeps its shape, and is strong enough for a
> full-size sled. I figure if this stuff can handle getting grinded on
> snow-covered roads day-in day-out, without the benefit of modern
> vanish & epoxy etc., then it's got to be pretty strong and durable!
>
> Ben Ho
<ben.ho@...> wrote:
----------------^^
Why not use lumberyard Douglas Fir?
I understand that Canada has lots of
that wood. It is strong, takes glue, has
a decent price and is moderately rot
resistant.
I have read, but don't know first hand,
that Red Oak is prone to rot.
> a stem for a Chebacco!sympatico.ca is from Canada, right?
----------------^^
Why not use lumberyard Douglas Fir?
I understand that Canada has lots of
that wood. It is strong, takes glue, has
a decent price and is moderately rot
resistant.
I have read, but don't know first hand,
that Red Oak is prone to rot.
I suggest you take some scraps and see if you can get a good epoxy bond.
I've heard varying tales, some say it just doesn't work, but ...
It's beautiful wood and unless you're planning on pushing barges, it should
work fine, if you can bond it.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
I've heard varying tales, some say it just doesn't work, but ...
It's beautiful wood and unless you're planning on pushing barges, it should
work fine, if you can bond it.
Roger
derbyrm@...
derbyrm.mystarband.net/default.htm
----- Original Message -----
From: "bh100014" <ben.ho@...>
> I came across a Memmonite who makes wooden sledges. They are
> seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
> a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red oak,
> not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong. But
> for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
> which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job? This guys
> tells me that they use red oak because it handles the elements much
> better than white oak, keeps its shape, and is strong enough for a
> full-size sled. I figure if this stuff can handle getting grinded on
> snow-covered roads day-in day-out, without the benefit of modern
> vanish & epoxy etc., then it's got to be pretty strong and durable!
The question is rot. If the boat is going to be kept on a trailer,
I'd go for the red oak without a qualm. If the boat is going to be
kept in the water, I'd think a bit. If the epoxy job is really good,
you will probably be alright, but the stem would not be easy to
replace if it did fail.
Peter (very open to the ideas of others on this issue.)
I'd go for the red oak without a qualm. If the boat is going to be
kept in the water, I'd think a bit. If the epoxy job is really good,
you will probably be alright, but the stem would not be easy to
replace if it did fail.
Peter (very open to the ideas of others on this issue.)
I came across a Memmonite who makes wooden sledges. They are
seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red oak,
not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong. But
for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job? This guys
tells me that they use red oak because it handles the elements much
better than white oak, keeps its shape, and is strong enough for a
full-size sled. I figure if this stuff can handle getting grinded on
snow-covered roads day-in day-out, without the benefit of modern
vanish & epoxy etc., then it's got to be pretty strong and durable!
Ben Ho
seasoned, steam-bent, and about the exact size and shape I need for
a stem for a Chebacco! The problem is that they are made of red oak,
not white oak. I know red oak is open grained and not as strong. But
for the inner stem which will be glassed, or for the outer stem
which is more for aesthetics, will red oak do the job? This guys
tells me that they use red oak because it handles the elements much
better than white oak, keeps its shape, and is strong enough for a
full-size sled. I figure if this stuff can handle getting grinded on
snow-covered roads day-in day-out, without the benefit of modern
vanish & epoxy etc., then it's got to be pretty strong and durable!
Ben Ho