Re: Sharpie Displacements, Questions, Minnesota, Idaho, Tennesse
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin & Chrissy" <jager6863@s...> wrote:
His answer was:
"We've misplaced the work sheets on this design, but it's somewhere
between 3,000 and 3,500. It will vary a lot depending materials,
outfitting, etc."
Ralph
>I have the plans for Minnesota, and asked Bolger this very question.
> Does anyone know the design displacement of the Bolger Minnesota
> design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs.
His answer was:
"We've misplaced the work sheets on this design, but it's somewhere
between 3,000 and 3,500. It will vary a lot depending materials,
outfitting, etc."
Ralph
>Does anyone know the design displacement of the Bolger MinnesotaFax your question to Bolger directly, they will probably answer
>design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs?
> - Fax: (978) 282-1349
within a days time.
Another boat in this size range would be Windermere, a bit wider,
but a better cruising boat in my opinion.
Kevin,
I can't find any data on Minnesota, but can make general comments
about displacement. It means, of course, the amount (weight or
volume) of water displaced by the hull when it's afloat. Some of the
weights you have been quoting look like bare hull weights, without
engines, crew, stores, fuel, portable toilet, ground tackle etc. For
example, Tennessee as drawn displaces something like 1 to 1.2 long
tons.
At least on his bigger designs, Bolger usually shows a design
displacement somewhere. On some of them he will show two numbers:
light and heavy. He's designed so many boats that he probably doesn't
do weight calculations to see that they match the designed
displacement.
When estimating weights for cruising boats, it's customary to assume
that it is carrying 50% of its capacity of consumable items like
water and fuel and, I guess, the average number of passengers/crew.
A useful number is the pounds per inch of immersion. With Tennessee,
it would be about 700, if my (literally) back-of-the-envelope
calculation is correct. In other words, if you added an extra 700lb
of gear, you'd bring the waterline up by only an inch -- i.e. not
very much.
Some of the old Jim Michalak newsletters give a lot of interesting
and useful information about estimating the weight of a boat. He uses
techniques he learnt when designing rockets, believe it or not.
Tennessee would be a possibility. You could arrange full headroom
under a canopy over the long cockpit. Curtains would make it ok for
two people to sleep there in mild weather, with another two in the
cabin. There is a small galley and toilet compartment, but not full
headroom in this area. Some have devised a kind of pop-top.
Your biggest expense may be the nearly 30 sheets of 3/8" plywood
required to build it, if you use marine ply. My guess is the trailer
will cost about as much as the ply.
Others in this group might be able to suggest something a little
larger and more expensive, with full headroom, but more trailer
weight and designed for larger engines.
Howard
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin & Chrissy" <jager6863@s...>
wrote:
I can't find any data on Minnesota, but can make general comments
about displacement. It means, of course, the amount (weight or
volume) of water displaced by the hull when it's afloat. Some of the
weights you have been quoting look like bare hull weights, without
engines, crew, stores, fuel, portable toilet, ground tackle etc. For
example, Tennessee as drawn displaces something like 1 to 1.2 long
tons.
At least on his bigger designs, Bolger usually shows a design
displacement somewhere. On some of them he will show two numbers:
light and heavy. He's designed so many boats that he probably doesn't
do weight calculations to see that they match the designed
displacement.
When estimating weights for cruising boats, it's customary to assume
that it is carrying 50% of its capacity of consumable items like
water and fuel and, I guess, the average number of passengers/crew.
A useful number is the pounds per inch of immersion. With Tennessee,
it would be about 700, if my (literally) back-of-the-envelope
calculation is correct. In other words, if you added an extra 700lb
of gear, you'd bring the waterline up by only an inch -- i.e. not
very much.
Some of the old Jim Michalak newsletters give a lot of interesting
and useful information about estimating the weight of a boat. He uses
techniques he learnt when designing rockets, believe it or not.
Tennessee would be a possibility. You could arrange full headroom
under a canopy over the long cockpit. Curtains would make it ok for
two people to sleep there in mild weather, with another two in the
cabin. There is a small galley and toilet compartment, but not full
headroom in this area. Some have devised a kind of pop-top.
Your biggest expense may be the nearly 30 sheets of 3/8" plywood
required to build it, if you use marine ply. My guess is the trailer
will cost about as much as the ply.
Others in this group might be able to suggest something a little
larger and more expensive, with full headroom, but more trailer
weight and designed for larger engines.
Howard
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin & Chrissy" <jager6863@s...>
wrote:
>
> Does anyone know the design displacement of the Bolger Minnesota
> design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs.
>
> How much "slop" is built into these design displacement, ie 10%, 5%,
> etc. I'm a little confused based on weights quoted by different
> sources and builders, I have heard quote for Tennesse any where from
> 1,000 to 2,000 lbs, which is correct?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin & Chrissy" <jager6863@s...> wrote:
the boat and the outboard engine will be the single largest expense of
all. I want simple construction and light weight. I'm aware of the
lake series
For what you describe, it is Idaho you want. Minnesota can be thought
of as a smaller Wyoming with construction, and joiner work appropriate
for high power and high speed. Both are intended for over 100hp
engines. I would expect Minnesota to have a dry weight significantly
greater than Idaho.
Idaho has a lightly built hull with a design of 7.5-25 hp. IMO
Sneakeasy and Idaho are similar designs of slightly different scale.
>range should be similar. It appears the trailer can cost as much as
> Does anyone know the design displacement of the Bolger Minnesota
> design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs.......
> .........The cost in wood/materials to build a boat in this size
the boat and the outboard engine will be the single largest expense of
all. I want simple construction and light weight. I'm aware of the
lake series
> (and Topaz) of boats but they seem more complicated to build and seemKevin,
> to have greater displacement for their size.
>
For what you describe, it is Idaho you want. Minnesota can be thought
of as a smaller Wyoming with construction, and joiner work appropriate
for high power and high speed. Both are intended for over 100hp
engines. I would expect Minnesota to have a dry weight significantly
greater than Idaho.
Idaho has a lightly built hull with a design of 7.5-25 hp. IMO
Sneakeasy and Idaho are similar designs of slightly different scale.
Does anyone know the design displacement of the Bolger Minnesota
design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs.
How much "slop" is built into these design displacement, ie 10%, 5%,
etc. I'm a little confused based on weights quoted by different
sources and builders, I have heard quote for Tennesse any where from
1,000 to 2,000 lbs, which is correct?
Idealy I would like a boat at least 6 feet wide that can cruise one to
two couples for a long weekend. The boat needs to be trailerable. Hull
speed is desirable with a little power in reserve when needed. The
twin 70 hp outboards of Minnesota are of zero interest to me, but the
hull at 33' x 6' and standing headroom seems to match what I'm looking
for size wise. How much power would be needed to drive Minnesota at
hull speeds?
I have a Ford Ranger pick-up (Bronco II actually) that I will use as
my tow vehicle so no 10,000 lb boats will suffice.
Idaho 1,400 lbs. (narrow beam, 4'10" headroom)
Tennesse 1,000 lbs? (6' beam, no standing headroom)
Minnesota ??? lbs. (6' beam, standing headroom)
Dakota ???? lbs. (7' beam, standing headroom, 38' too long, too
heavy?)
I have read all the revelvant posts (scanning 30k+ took a long time)
in this group over the last week and I've noticed a lot of confusion
regarding the Bolger Sharpies in the 30 foot size range. I need a
simple hull that can be driven at comfortable displacement speeds and
can be equipped with a head and galley for weekend river/lake
cruising.
The cost in wood/materials to build a boat in this size range should
be similar. It appears the trailer can cost as much as the boat and
the outboard engine will be the single largest expense of all. I want
simple construction and light weight. I'm aware of the lake series
(and Topaz) of boats but they seem more complicated to build and seem
to have greater displacement for their size.
Thanks for everyones help and advice.
Kevin
design as compared to the other powered sharpie designs.
How much "slop" is built into these design displacement, ie 10%, 5%,
etc. I'm a little confused based on weights quoted by different
sources and builders, I have heard quote for Tennesse any where from
1,000 to 2,000 lbs, which is correct?
Idealy I would like a boat at least 6 feet wide that can cruise one to
two couples for a long weekend. The boat needs to be trailerable. Hull
speed is desirable with a little power in reserve when needed. The
twin 70 hp outboards of Minnesota are of zero interest to me, but the
hull at 33' x 6' and standing headroom seems to match what I'm looking
for size wise. How much power would be needed to drive Minnesota at
hull speeds?
I have a Ford Ranger pick-up (Bronco II actually) that I will use as
my tow vehicle so no 10,000 lb boats will suffice.
Idaho 1,400 lbs. (narrow beam, 4'10" headroom)
Tennesse 1,000 lbs? (6' beam, no standing headroom)
Minnesota ??? lbs. (6' beam, standing headroom)
Dakota ???? lbs. (7' beam, standing headroom, 38' too long, too
heavy?)
I have read all the revelvant posts (scanning 30k+ took a long time)
in this group over the last week and I've noticed a lot of confusion
regarding the Bolger Sharpies in the 30 foot size range. I need a
simple hull that can be driven at comfortable displacement speeds and
can be equipped with a head and galley for weekend river/lake
cruising.
The cost in wood/materials to build a boat in this size range should
be similar. It appears the trailer can cost as much as the boat and
the outboard engine will be the single largest expense of all. I want
simple construction and light weight. I'm aware of the lake series
(and Topaz) of boats but they seem more complicated to build and seem
to have greater displacement for their size.
Thanks for everyones help and advice.
Kevin