Re: [bolger] One Design Racer
Gents,
The idea of a developmental class of simple and cheap wooden
boats is akin to my own thoughts. Let's set some class boundaries
and see if we can drum up even more interest in the OK-TX-AR area.
Here are some similar things I wrote down years ago for an "open"
(home-built) wooden skiff class (edited a little now). A class of
this nature is worth a couple of drives to Texas every year.
My proposal is intended to encourage small craft design and wood
working skills while allowing competitive boats to be simple,
inexpensive and easily built and repaired. As R.D. Culler wrote,
"...can be repaired at the hardware store on a Sunday afternoon."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Proposed Specifications For the Sharpie Surf Class
Hull shall be the Bolger designed Surf and shall measure within the
following limits: length ... , beam..., rocker....
All hulls and other boat structures shall be constructed primarily of
wood or wood products. Any glue or mechanical fastener may be used.
Sheathing is permitted provided that the thickness is not greater
than the planking (eliminates carbon fiber hulls over wood veneer!)
All spars shall be constructed primarily of wood and/or wood
products. May be solid or hollow. No cloth (such as glass cloth or
kevlar), metal, plastic, carbon fiber or other non-wood material is
allowed in spar construction. Glues, fasteners and fittings may be
of any material.
Sails shall be attached with rope or hoops of any material. No sail
track or grooved masts or spars allowed.
Any free standing sailing rig is allowed. Standing rigging is not
permitted. A sail may be set flying however -- one halyard may be
used as standing rigging provided that when the sail is hoisted, the
sail remains attached on the boat on centerline. If the sail is
brought down, the both ends of the halyard must be secured to the
mast.
No metal wire is allowed in any rigging.
One hiking board is allowed. Only one crew member may sit on the
hiking board outboard of the rail. No trapeze may be attached to any
spar.
- - - - - - - - - - -
A talented teenager in high school wood shop with a part time job
could afford to build his own boat and be competitive in this class.
Phil Lea, Russellville, Arkansas
The idea of a developmental class of simple and cheap wooden
boats is akin to my own thoughts. Let's set some class boundaries
and see if we can drum up even more interest in the OK-TX-AR area.
Here are some similar things I wrote down years ago for an "open"
(home-built) wooden skiff class (edited a little now). A class of
this nature is worth a couple of drives to Texas every year.
My proposal is intended to encourage small craft design and wood
working skills while allowing competitive boats to be simple,
inexpensive and easily built and repaired. As R.D. Culler wrote,
"...can be repaired at the hardware store on a Sunday afternoon."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Proposed Specifications For the Sharpie Surf Class
Hull shall be the Bolger designed Surf and shall measure within the
following limits: length ... , beam..., rocker....
All hulls and other boat structures shall be constructed primarily of
wood or wood products. Any glue or mechanical fastener may be used.
Sheathing is permitted provided that the thickness is not greater
than the planking (eliminates carbon fiber hulls over wood veneer!)
All spars shall be constructed primarily of wood and/or wood
products. May be solid or hollow. No cloth (such as glass cloth or
kevlar), metal, plastic, carbon fiber or other non-wood material is
allowed in spar construction. Glues, fasteners and fittings may be
of any material.
Sails shall be attached with rope or hoops of any material. No sail
track or grooved masts or spars allowed.
Any free standing sailing rig is allowed. Standing rigging is not
permitted. A sail may be set flying however -- one halyard may be
used as standing rigging provided that when the sail is hoisted, the
sail remains attached on the boat on centerline. If the sail is
brought down, the both ends of the halyard must be secured to the
mast.
No metal wire is allowed in any rigging.
One hiking board is allowed. Only one crew member may sit on the
hiking board outboard of the rail. No trapeze may be attached to any
spar.
- - - - - - - - - - -
A talented teenager in high school wood shop with a part time job
could afford to build his own boat and be competitive in this class.
Phil Lea, Russellville, Arkansas
--- Inbolger@egroups.com, pmcrannell@y... wrote:
> I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
> sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially
> if you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch -
blow
> high, blow low.
> The Surf would be a good base for radicalization...
> You can easily add side decks if you guys
> feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
> springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You
can
> add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end
of
> the bowsprit) for light air.
> I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
> class. [snip] It'll be cheap and challenging to
> race, taking advantage of easily struck rigs, paddles, and oars.
> Take care,
> Pete Reynolds
> --- Inbolger@egroups.com, T Webber <tbertw@s...> wrote:
> > My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age
> > from 21 -55.
> > He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one
> > design racing
> > Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
Hi. I've just joined the group, and I saw your request for
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
--- Inbolger@egroups.com, T Webber <tbertw@s...> wrote:
> List,
>
> My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from
21 -
> 55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one
design racing
> - tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston
Boat show
> had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices
were "Boat
> Show Specials" and included trailers.
>
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
Bolger
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and
the
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks).
Our goal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year
may be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of
that size
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community
built".
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with
tons of
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU
rules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>
> thanks in advance,
> Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
Hi. I've just joined the group, and I saw your request for
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
--- Inbolger@egroups.com, T Webber <tbertw@s...> wrote:
> List,
>
> My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from
21 -
> 55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one
design racing
> - tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston
Boat show
> had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices
were "Boat
> Show Specials" and included trailers.
>
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
Bolger
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and
the
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks).
Our goal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year
may be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of
that size
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community
built".
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with
tons of
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU
rules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>
> thanks in advance,
> Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
Hi. I've just joined the group, and I saw your request for
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
information. Here's my two cents worth.
I'd go for the Surf. It is very easy to build. It uses only four
sheets of plywood, plus some 2x's. It has lots of room, especially if
you make the rowing seat removeable. It sails like a witch - blow
high, blow low.
The Surf would be a good base for radicalization, if your group
moves in that direction. You can easily add side decks if you guys
feel like hiking. You can even make them strong enough to use a
springboard like the log canoes do, here, on the Chesapeake. You can
add a cheap topsail and a jib (set flying, tacked down to the end of
the bowsprit) for light air. You can scrounge up a bunch of old
spinnakers from a local 420 (or similar) dinghy class, and use them
as asymmetrical chutes, again, tacked to the end of the bowsprit.
Asymmetrical chutes are all the rage, here on the Bay. Many of the
hot one-design classes have them. They are a breeze to handle,
compared to a symmetrical spinnaker.
For longevity of your class, you have to keep recruiting new
members. Again, the Surf is the way to go. The Surf is a striking
looking boat, where the June Bug is very utilitarian. It is also
fast, so you guys can show off your skills in a good boat.
Don't sweat the small size of your lake. J-22's and J-24's
typically sail 1 to 1 1/2 mile windward/leeward courses here in
Annapolis. They go around a number of times, typically four legs. The
key to the fun is a bunch of races per day, at least three if the
breeze allows. You can decrease or increase the laps as the day goes
on. This gives everyone a bunch of chances to recover from a bad race.
I've been working on a set of racing rules for a development
class. I'll try to publish them on this forum, soon. I think the
Bolger guys will really like them. It'll be cheap and challenging to
race, taking advantage of easily sruck rigs, paddles, and oars.
You can have a lot of fun with this boat. I like your idea of
racing. I do a ton of PHRF racing. It's fun, but The J-22 class is
more fun. It's a competitive, one-design, and we tank a lot of races.
So do the really good guys. It's nice to know how you're doing
without checink your stopwatch and rating sheet!
HAVE FUN!
Take care,
Pete Reynolds
--- Inbolger@egroups.com, T Webber <tbertw@s...> wrote:
> List,
>
> My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from
21 -
> 55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one
design racing
> - tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston
Boat show
> had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices
were "Boat
> Show Specials" and included trailers.
>
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
Bolger
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and
the
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks).
Our goal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year
may be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of
that size
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community
built".
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with
tons of
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU
rules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>
> thanks in advance,
> Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
Or better yet, MaMAIB2 (squared) - Massachusetts Messing About in
Bolger Boats.
"david jost" <djos-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4050
Bolger Boats.
"david jost" <djos-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4050
> "lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:see
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4035
> > "matthew long" <owlnmol-@...> wrote:
> > snip
> Matthew,
> I am over in Ashland. Let's try to get a messabout together at
> Hopkinton State Park over the next couple of Months. Would love to
> your Brick in action. I know we are limited to no octane boats, but
> there are enough of us around to do it. Let me check the family
> schedule and come up with a proposal.
>
> David JOst
I'm all for a Hopkinton Messabout as soon as the weather gets (and
stays) warm. Maybe we can call it MaMAIB.
Matthew
"david jost" <djos-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4050
stays) warm. Maybe we can call it MaMAIB.
Matthew
"david jost" <djos-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4050
> "lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:see
> original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4035
> > "matthew long" <owlnmol-@...> wrote:
> > snip
> Matthew,
> I am over in Ashland. Let's try to get a messabout together at
> Hopkinton State Park over the next couple of Months. Would love to
> your Brick in action. I know we are limited to no octane boats, but
> there are enough of us around to do it. Let me check the family
> schedule and come up with a proposal.
>
> David JOst
Tim - what about the Dart dinghy (BWAOM #6, p. 19)? Looks like a nice
little boat. Another wise choice to me could be Gipsy (fully covered on
Dynamite's book on the new instant boats). Best, Pippo
t webber <tbert-@...> wrote:
little boat. Another wise choice to me could be Gipsy (fully covered on
Dynamite's book on the new instant boats). Best, Pippo
t webber <tbert-@...> wrote:
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
yes,
this is a great group of sailors, and they are actually very
competitive! Many members, past and present, of the fleet are very
accomplished. Tyler Moore, Karl Anderson, Tom Leach, Jen Kano, are all
great sailors in their own boats. to start a fleet contact Tom Leach
(harbormaster in Harwich, MA) and then get building. Chase boats are
an essential part of the operation. My Bolger diablo makes a great
one.
this is a great group of sailors, and they are actually very
competitive! Many members, past and present, of the fleet are very
accomplished. Tyler Moore, Karl Anderson, Tom Leach, Jen Kano, are all
great sailors in their own boats. to start a fleet contact Tom Leach
(harbormaster in Harwich, MA) and then get building. Chase boats are
an essential part of the operation. My Bolger diablo makes a great
one.
"lincoln ross" <lincoln-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4035
I am over in Ashland. Let's try to get a messabout together at
Hopkinton State Park over the next couple of Months. Would love to see
your Brick in action. I know we are limited to no octane boats, but
there are enough of us around to do it. Let me check the family
schedule and come up with a proposal.
David JOst
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4035
> "matthew long" <owlnmol-@...> wrote:Matthew,
> snip
I am over in Ashland. Let's try to get a messabout together at
Hopkinton State Park over the next couple of Months. Would love to see
your Brick in action. I know we are limited to no octane boats, but
there are enough of us around to do it. Let me check the family
schedule and come up with a proposal.
David JOst
> >
> > I think the best choice, if you would be willing to tackle plywood
> > lapstrake construction, would be a fleet of Bolger Fieldmouses
> > (Fieldmice?):
> original was multichine plywood!
> snip
> > Matthew Long
> > "Undisputed champion, Brick class, Hopkinton Reservoir, Hopkinton,
> > Mass."
>
> Gee, if you keep goading me like that maybe I'll have to give up the
> design idea I had and build one of those to "race" against you. Wonder
> if our increased displacement (we're largish people) would give us a
> waterline that's enuf longer to make up for the increased wetted
> surface? I did get a set of Brick plans
>
"peter vanderwaart" <pvander-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4046
planning only because age is also associated with planning (stupid
mistakes hurt more as you get older).
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4046
>snipI think this is a spurious relationship. Wider stern is associated with
> 5. Surf has a narrow stern which is good for sailing heeled. June Bug
> has a wider stern which increases stability and carrying capacity, and
> may help promote planning.
planning only because age is also associated with planning (stupid
mistakes hurt more as you get older).
> 6. June Bug is an inch or so deeper mid-ships.June Bug carries a bit more weight as a result, doesn't it?
>snip
> Second, I would vote for Surf over June Bug. This boat really flies,There ought to be a term like 'e-mail remorse' for that feeling you get
> especially with the wind free. If anything, it's cheaper and easier
> than the June Bug to build.
just after hitting the 'send' button when it occurs to you that the
sentiment just expressed may not be correct. So it was with the comment
I made above.
I took the time to compare June Bug to Surf. They are very similar, and
probably sail about the same. But, how do they differ and how do the
differences affect their suitablity.
1. The rigs are the same.
2. Surf gets maximum length out of two sheets of ply, but the
difference is small because she also has flair which shortens the
waterline. Surf is wider, but because of the flair, the width of the
bottom is about the same.
3. Surf actually requires a pinch more wood; the rudder doesn't come
from the basic 4 sheets of ply. Other than that, the BOM must be about
the same.
4. Surf has external chines which must be beveled. June Bug has inside
chines which don't have to be beveled.
5. Surf has a narrow stern which is good for sailing heeled. June Bug
has a wider stern which increases stability and carrying capacity, and
may help promote planning.
6. June Bug is an inch or so deeper mid-ships.
7. I like June Bug's leeboard installation better, but the method could
be used on Surf. JB's straighter side probably causes less turbulence
in way of the leeboard.
8. June Bug has rowing thwarts. The after one encourages the helmsman
to sit too far aft. (An advantage to you when racing, if you know
better.) Aft of midships, Surf is open; forward of midships she has a
'rowing bench' on the centerline which probably complicates getting the
crew to sit to the side.
9. Surf is elegant in appearance, but with good craftmanship, either
boat would be very attractive.
So, on second opinion, I say it's a draw. Personally, I would still
choose Surf, but that may be because of my memory of seeing one fly
down the Mystic River seeming to touch the water no more than the
windward ama of a trimaran.
I don't think these boats are too big for a 1 mile lake. Think about
rowing home when the wind quits. I am in the midst of discussions about
a race for Ideal 18's with legs only a couple hundred yards long. A
little silly, IMHO.
Peter.
This looks like a really fun (if non-Bolger) group. Seem to be a little
short on West-of-the-Mississippi fleets tho.
Interesting tip on stopping dagger board rattle at
http://members.aol.com/ccfrosty/backis4.htm#latex
Thanks a lot,
Larry (In Talent Oregon where it is really and truly spring)
PS Thanks to all for the Nymph Gudgeon & Pintle suggestions - I've gone with
the eyebolt & brass rod idea.
short on West-of-the-Mississippi fleets tho.
Interesting tip on stopping dagger board rattle at
http://members.aol.com/ccfrosty/backis4.htm#latex
Thanks a lot,
Larry (In Talent Oregon where it is really and truly spring)
PS Thanks to all for the Nymph Gudgeon & Pintle suggestions - I've gone with
the eyebolt & brass rod idea.
----- Original Message -----
From: David Jost <djost@...>
To: <bolger@...>
Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 3:28 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: One Design Racer
> You should take a look at the Cape Cod Frosty! We have had a
> successful fleet in Massachusetts for many years. They are built from
> 1/4in luan, fiberglass window screening and bondo. <snip>
"matthew long" <owlnmol-@...> wrote:
snip
snip
design idea I had and build one of those to "race" against you. Wonder
if our increased displacement (we're largish people) would give us a
waterline that's enuf longer to make up for the increased wetted
surface? I did get a set of Brick plans
snip
>original was multichine plywood!
> I think the best choice, if you would be willing to tackle plywood
> lapstrake construction, would be a fleet of Bolger Fieldmouses
> (Fieldmice?):
snip
> Matthew LongGee, if you keep goading me like that maybe I'll have to give up the
> "Undisputed champion, Brick class, Hopkinton Reservoir, Hopkinton,
> Mass."
design idea I had and build one of those to "race" against you. Wonder
if our increased displacement (we're largish people) would give us a
waterline that's enuf longer to make up for the increased wetted
surface? I did get a set of Brick plans
With such a limited racing area, perhaps June Bugs or Surfs might be
too much boat. You might get more fun, and more learning, out of a
fleet of Elegant Punts, Nymphs, or the like. (OK, I won't recommend
Bricks!)
I think the best choice, if you would be willing to tackle plywood
lapstrake construction, would be a fleet of Bolger Fieldmouses
(Fieldmice?): 7'9"x4'10" cat-rigged leeboard dinghy with a whopping 74
sq ft full-battened sail.
PCB said this about Fieldmouse in SMALL BOATS:
"If you feel the urge to sail but only have a small pond to sail on,
the slower the boat, the better, as long as she doesn't feel dead.
'Mouse is almost excessively exciting at times, here sail plan being
huge for her size and weight, and a fleet of them could cram more
racing tactics into a puddle a hundred yards in diameter than the
twelve-meters can find in Long Island Sound."
Matthew Long
"Undisputed champion, Brick class, Hopkinton Reservoir, Hopkinton,
Mass."
too much boat. You might get more fun, and more learning, out of a
fleet of Elegant Punts, Nymphs, or the like. (OK, I won't recommend
Bricks!)
I think the best choice, if you would be willing to tackle plywood
lapstrake construction, would be a fleet of Bolger Fieldmouses
(Fieldmice?): 7'9"x4'10" cat-rigged leeboard dinghy with a whopping 74
sq ft full-battened sail.
PCB said this about Fieldmouse in SMALL BOATS:
"If you feel the urge to sail but only have a small pond to sail on,
the slower the boat, the better, as long as she doesn't feel dead.
'Mouse is almost excessively exciting at times, here sail plan being
huge for her size and weight, and a fleet of them could cram more
racing tactics into a puddle a hundred yards in diameter than the
twelve-meters can find in Long Island Sound."
Matthew Long
"Undisputed champion, Brick class, Hopkinton Reservoir, Hopkinton,
Mass."
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tonsof
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRUrules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
You should take a look at the Cape Cod Frosty! We have had a
successful fleet in Massachusetts for many years. They are built from
1/4in luan, fiberglass window screening and bondo. The mast is a 1.5
inch closet pole and the sail goes on over it with a sleeve. It does
not get much simpler than this. Warning, the boat is not
self-rescueing, very tricky to race, and may suffer from bondo
blow-out. If that happens build another hull for $60 and go again.
check out the fleet at:http://members.aol.com/ccfrosty/index.htm
it is the world's smallest one design racing dinghy. It is also an
international USRYA recognized class.
cpcorrei-@...wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4030
successful fleet in Massachusetts for many years. They are built from
1/4in luan, fiberglass window screening and bondo. The mast is a 1.5
inch closet pole and the sail goes on over it with a sleeve. It does
not get much simpler than this. Warning, the boat is not
self-rescueing, very tricky to race, and may suffer from bondo
blow-out. If that happens build another hull for $60 and go again.
check out the fleet at:http://members.aol.com/ccfrosty/index.htm
it is the world's smallest one design racing dinghy. It is also an
international USRYA recognized class.
cpcorrei-@...wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4030
> In a message dated 3/29/00 5:35:43 AM Pacific Standard Time,tbertw@...
> writes:Bolger
>
> <<
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer andthe
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks).Our goal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first yearmay be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of thatsize
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".of
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRUrules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.Ebb's
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
> >>
> There was a good article in Latitude 38 sometime last year in Max
> column in regards to a readily available plastic roto molded littlesailboat
> boat, I believe under $1000. Now this boat would not be wood (readugly),
> would not be fast, but would allow you to play the game that Max Ebbwrites
> about. Basically you could race when you want to race, and play aversion of
> water polo, but with sailboats also. He envisioned a small beachball
> covered in netting to be easy to grab, that would need to be sailedthrough a
> goal of some kind set up something like a football field. If acompetitor
> sails into your boat (thus the need for the roto molded boats) youmust hand
> over the ball the the opposing team. So the concept is to throw itin the
> direction of another team mate before someone bangs into you. Therace is
> then on to see who can get to the ball first and try to carry it tothe goal.
> Back and forth. This type of game would really develope sailingability on
> all points, promote quick decision making, and developing the abilityto
> predict closing and intercept angles. Sounds like great fun, andwould give
> you another option on that small lake.
>
> Just a thought,
> Chuck.
In a message dated 3/29/00 5:35:43 AM Pacific Standard Time,tbertw@...
writes:
<<
Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
"power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
(with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules with
"NASCAR" allowances for learning.
Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
column in regards to a readily available plastic roto molded little sailboat
boat, I believe under $1000. Now this boat would not be wood (read ugly),
would not be fast, but would allow you to play the game that Max Ebb writes
about. Basically you could race when you want to race, and play a version of
water polo, but with sailboats also. He envisioned a small beach ball
covered in netting to be easy to grab, that would need to be sailed through a
goal of some kind set up something like a football field. If a competitor
sails into your boat (thus the need for the roto molded boats) you must hand
over the ball the the opposing team. So the concept is to throw it in the
direction of another team mate before someone bangs into you. The race is
then on to see who can get to the ball first and try to carry it to the goal.
Back and forth. This type of game would really develope sailing ability on
all points, promote quick decision making, and developing the ability to
predict closing and intercept angles. Sounds like great fun, and would give
you another option on that small lake.
Just a thought,
Chuck.
writes:
<<
Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
"power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
(with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules with
"NASCAR" allowances for learning.
Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>>There was a good article in Latitude 38 sometime last year in Max Ebb's
column in regards to a readily available plastic roto molded little sailboat
boat, I believe under $1000. Now this boat would not be wood (read ugly),
would not be fast, but would allow you to play the game that Max Ebb writes
about. Basically you could race when you want to race, and play a version of
water polo, but with sailboats also. He envisioned a small beach ball
covered in netting to be easy to grab, that would need to be sailed through a
goal of some kind set up something like a football field. If a competitor
sails into your boat (thus the need for the roto molded boats) you must hand
over the ball the the opposing team. So the concept is to throw it in the
direction of another team mate before someone bangs into you. The race is
then on to see who can get to the ball first and try to carry it to the goal.
Back and forth. This type of game would really develope sailing ability on
all points, promote quick decision making, and developing the ability to
predict closing and intercept angles. Sounds like great fun, and would give
you another option on that small lake.
Just a thought,
Chuck.
Check out this web site by the Stevenson's Projects.
http://www.stevproj.com/FastSailrs.html
I know they are not Bolger boats (I hope I don't get kicked out of this
group for this) , but they look like fun little boats. I think you
could also build they cheaply. I have not built any of these boats so I
can not say how they perform under sail. From the write up on these
boats it sounds like they would be right up your alley.
Mark in MN.
t webber <tbert-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4009
http://www.stevproj.com/FastSailrs.html
I know they are not Bolger boats (I hope I don't get kicked out of this
group for this) , but they look like fun little boats. I think you
could also build they cheaply. I have not built any of these boats so I
can not say how they perform under sail. From the write up on these
boats it sounds like they would be right up your alley.
Mark in MN.
t webber <tbert-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=4009
> List,21 -
>
> My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from
> 55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one designracing
> - tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston Boatshow
> had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices were"Boat
> Show Specials" and included trailers.Bolger
>
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer andthe
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Ourgoal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first yearmay be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of thatsize
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".of
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRUrules with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>
> thanks in advance,
> Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
>Bolger
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot
> "power anything" sprit sail.I have two suggestions, but they confict.
First, I would suggest a boat that is more conducive to hiking than the
June Bug. Your crews are going to be hiking, so it makes sense to give
them a little deck edge.
Second, I would vote for Surf over June Bug. This boat really flies,
especially with the wind free. If anything, it's cheaper and easier
than the June Bug to build. Otherwise, it's quite similar, but it was
designed as a sailboat, not a rowing/sailing boat. It doesn't have side
decks for hiking though. IMHO it was Surf that really made the Instant
Boat idea take off, though Teal eventually became more famous. It's a
Payson Plan at www.instantboats.com
The Pirate Racer was designed for good manners when heeled, rather than
for top speed with the crew hiking out. The age group you are taking
about would prefer the latter, I think.
Did you see the results of the Woodenboat design competition for a sail
trainer? Lots of good ideas there. Also in the history of wild ideas
that have been tried in the Moth class. Or Jacques Mertens' re-design
of the Windmill.
Peter (in Connecticut, where some of the daffodils are in bloom.)
Sounds really cool. I vote for the Pirate Racer simply because I like the
looks of her. Check out the section in BWOM; the racing rules wouldn't be
appropriate for the age group you are talking about but the picture of all
those Pirate Racers in action is inspiring. Can't quite conger up the same
image with a bunch of JuneBugs (even though I really like that design.)
looks of her. Check out the section in BWOM; the racing rules wouldn't be
appropriate for the age group you are talking about but the picture of all
those Pirate Racers in action is inspiring. Can't quite conger up the same
image with a bunch of JuneBugs (even though I really like that design.)
> -----Original Message-----
> From: T Webber [SMTP:tbertw@...]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 8:34 AM
> To:bolger@egroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] One Design Racer
>
> List,
>
> My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from 21 -
> 55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one design
> racing
> - tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston Boat show
> had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices were
> "Boat
> Show Specials" and included trailers.
>
> Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
> "power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
> Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
> is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
> polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
> (with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
>
> Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
> trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules
> with
> "NASCAR" allowances for learning.
>
> Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
>
> thanks in advance,
> Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get a NextCard Visa, in 30 seconds!
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>
Tim
How about John Marples 3m tri which you can build for
$1200. Its also an international class! Fast & fun
http://members.aa.net/~markm/3meter_invite.htm
Good luck
Jeff Gilbert
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
How about John Marples 3m tri which you can build for
$1200. Its also an international class! Fast & fun
http://members.aa.net/~markm/3meter_invite.htm
Good luck
Jeff Gilbert
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
----- Original Message -----
From: T Webber <tbertw@...>
Subject: [bolger] One Design Racer
My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from 21 -
55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one design racing
- tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston Boat show
had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices were "Boat
Show Specials" and included trailers.
Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
"power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
(with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules with
"NASCAR" allowances for learning.
Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
thanks in advance,
Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
List,
My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from 21 -
55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one design racing
- tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston Boat show
had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices were "Boat
Show Specials" and included trailers.
Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
"power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
(with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules with
"NASCAR" allowances for learning.
Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
thanks in advance,
Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston
My son is 23 and has a group of 5 or so friends ranging in age from 21 -
55. He has been interested in small boat racing. I prefer one design racing
- tho I have not raced actively for about 18 years. The Houston Boat show
had Sunfish for over $2,000 and Lasers were about $4,000. Prices were "Boat
Show Specials" and included trailers.
Our current concept is a fleet of 4 - 8 JuneBugs with the 59 foot Bolger
"power anything" sprit sail. We have looked at the Pirate Racer and the
Windsprint as alternatives (20 + year old males don't do Bricks). Our goal
is an inexpensive boat (around 4 sheets of plywood). The first year may be
polytarp sails. We have a trailer that can carry 4 - 6 boats of that size
(with some "southern engineering"). Boats would be "community built".
Racing will be done on a very SMALL lake 1/4 x 1 1/2 miles with tons of
trees and houses mucking up the wind. We will probably run USYRU rules with
"NASCAR" allowances for learning.
Does anyone have any suggestions on the boats?
thanks in advance,
Tim - refusing to grow up in Houston