Re: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
[bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersHi Carl,
My slip is narrow so that and hydrodynamic efficiency will be the limiting factor in boat design. I am leaning toward a warped V hull with a beam on waterline of slightly less than 4 feet and slightly flaired sides for a maximum beam of a little over 5 feet. Transom would be about 6 inches narrower than maximum beam. The bottom would have enough rocker so that fully loaded (with batteries), the transom would be just out of the water. The V would slightly increase to the center so the chines would just barely touch the water line at that point and become even steeper and a few inches higher toward the bow to help cut thru the chop. I am thinking that the rear third of the rocker would be a straight line rather than a curve so without batteries, the weight could be farther aft and the very shallow V would give lift for semi-displacement with 8 HP at an S/L ratio of ~2 or 2.5. Anderson connectors would allow quick removal of batteries if I want to convert from electric to outboard propulsion quickly.
I think this could be a dual purpose hull, displacement when heavily loaded but almost planing when lightly loaded (and more power) with little compromise in either mode.
I would build a very light removable cabin for weather protection and to allow the hull to be stored upside down in the winter. The top of the cabin would hold solar panels that would be connected to my house photovoltaic system when the boat is in storage. The top of the cabin would become an awning to protect the south entrance of my house in the winter. I'll try to scan some of my sketches and post them in the files section.
I am not expecting to use this boat on the open ocean but the bay does get moderate chop.
Ron
Long Island, NY
My slip is narrow so that and hydrodynamic efficiency will be the limiting factor in boat design. I am leaning toward a warped V hull with a beam on waterline of slightly less than 4 feet and slightly flaired sides for a maximum beam of a little over 5 feet. Transom would be about 6 inches narrower than maximum beam. The bottom would have enough rocker so that fully loaded (with batteries), the transom would be just out of the water. The V would slightly increase to the center so the chines would just barely touch the water line at that point and become even steeper and a few inches higher toward the bow to help cut thru the chop. I am thinking that the rear third of the rocker would be a straight line rather than a curve so without batteries, the weight could be farther aft and the very shallow V would give lift for semi-displacement with 8 HP at an S/L ratio of ~2 or 2.5. Anderson connectors would allow quick removal of batteries if I want to convert from electric to outboard propulsion quickly.
I think this could be a dual purpose hull, displacement when heavily loaded but almost planing when lightly loaded (and more power) with little compromise in either mode.
I would build a very light removable cabin for weather protection and to allow the hull to be stored upside down in the winter. The top of the cabin would hold solar panels that would be connected to my house photovoltaic system when the boat is in storage. The top of the cabin would become an awning to protect the south entrance of my house in the winter. I'll try to scan some of my sketches and post them in the files section.
I am not expecting to use this boat on the open ocean but the bay does get moderate chop.
Ron
Long Island, NY
----- Original Message -----
From: ch_bunch
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 11:29 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18
to
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
Hey Ron,
I don't have anything to add about plywood, but I'd be very
interested to know more about your boat plans. I've been twisting
and squeezing state boat pics for the last few weeks trying to come
up with a way to make a 20 foot with the same nice lines and economy
as Mr B's power sharpies. I'm envious of all the micro sail
cruisers out there like Paradox and Micro Nav; wish something
similar could be done with a power boat. Could a squished 20 foot,
7kph, 8hp Tennessee be sturdy enough to do the Great Loop? Or the
Bahamas?
Or a Champlain with a cuddy and small pilothouse? Thoughts anyone?
Carl
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ron--In the past I have fiberglassed bottoms. I really don't like messing
with or sanding fiberglass on large surfaces (and, with epoxy, a fg bottom
can get pretty pricy). My current project is a 19 ft boat weighing around
500-550 lbs. It has been sitting on a concrete floor while I climb around in
it. The overlay appears to be very resistant to abrasion. However, it does
dent a little if it is sitting on a pebble/scrap of wood when its fat owner
climbs on board.
My bottom panel is a double lamination of 3/8" with a curve in it and the
bottom is very stiff.
Good luck.
John T
with or sanding fiberglass on large surfaces (and, with epoxy, a fg bottom
can get pretty pricy). My current project is a 19 ft boat weighing around
500-550 lbs. It has been sitting on a concrete floor while I climb around in
it. The overlay appears to be very resistant to abrasion. However, it does
dent a little if it is sitting on a pebble/scrap of wood when its fat owner
climbs on board.
My bottom panel is a double lamination of 3/8" with a curve in it and the
bottom is very stiff.
Good luck.
John T
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 12:53 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliers
> Re: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliersHi John,
>
>
> Hi John,
>
> It looks like 5/16" is available but I am leaning toward 3/8" for the
bottom anyway. I guess that I am leaning toward the best MDO that I can get
for the bottom rather than marine ply. The hull will probably be a shallow
V (10-15 degree deadrise) with enough rocker to keep the transom out of the
water at normal load (semi-displacement) and a steeper V toward the bow.
Most likely I will go with 1/4" ply for the sides so I need to select the
species for that. The sides will be painted too so cost and durability is
more important than anything else.
>
> Ron
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Bell
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 9:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliers
>
>
> There is no 1/4" MDO that I have found. The thinnest stuff available is
> 3/8".
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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>
Re: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliersHi John,
Hi John,
It looks like 5/16" is available but I am leaning toward 3/8" for the bottom anyway. I guess that I am leaning toward the best MDO that I can get for the bottom rather than marine ply. The hull will probably be a shallow V (10-15 degree deadrise) with enough rocker to keep the transom out of the water at normal load (semi-displacement) and a steeper V toward the bow. Most likely I will go with 1/4" ply for the sides so I need to select the species for that. The sides will be painted too so cost and durability is more important than anything else.
Ron
Hi John,
It looks like 5/16" is available but I am leaning toward 3/8" for the bottom anyway. I guess that I am leaning toward the best MDO that I can get for the bottom rather than marine ply. The hull will probably be a shallow V (10-15 degree deadrise) with enough rocker to keep the transom out of the water at normal load (semi-displacement) and a steeper V toward the bow. Most likely I will go with 1/4" ply for the sides so I need to select the species for that. The sides will be painted too so cost and durability is more important than anything else.
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: John Bell
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 9:02 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliers
There is no 1/4" MDO that I have found. The thinnest stuff available is
3/8".
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
http://aslocke.freeownhost.com/welcome.htm
or check at duckworks: Michalak's AF4 is really popular.
Then there is Redwing and Benford and Hankinson and Glen-L
Bolgers Micro Trawler
The thing is when you get down to small displacement cruisers you
might as well have one that can sail some of the time and also
motorsail. Just makes it a lot more fun, versatile and more
comfortable in my mind:-)
Even if it is a cheap polytarp junk or lug rig. Lot's of people
going that route.
Nels
>> Or a Champlain with a cuddy and small pilothouse? Thoughtsanyone?
>Try this site for ideas
> Carl
http://aslocke.freeownhost.com/welcome.htm
or check at duckworks: Michalak's AF4 is really popular.
Then there is Redwing and Benford and Hankinson and Glen-L
Bolgers Micro Trawler
The thing is when you get down to small displacement cruisers you
might as well have one that can sail some of the time and also
motorsail. Just makes it a lot more fun, versatile and more
comfortable in my mind:-)
Even if it is a cheap polytarp junk or lug rig. Lot's of people
going that route.
Nels
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to ato
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either anHey Ron,
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
I don't have anything to add about plywood, but I'd be very
interested to know more about your boat plans. I've been twisting
and squeezing state boat pics for the last few weeks trying to come
up with a way to make a 20 foot with the same nice lines and economy
as Mr B's power sharpies. I'm envious of all the micro sail
cruisers out there like Paradox and Micro Nav; wish something
similar could be done with a power boat. Could a squished 20 foot,
7kph, 8hp Tennessee be sturdy enough to do the Great Loop? Or the
Bahamas?
Or a Champlain with a cuddy and small pilothouse? Thoughts anyone?
Carl
Concrete forms are usaly HDO which is slicker and glass and paint will
not stick as well to it.
Jon
not stick as well to it.
Jon
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> > I get blank stares when
> > I ask for MDO at the lumber yards.
> >
> > Ron
>
> Ask the local sign painter ...
> or the local concrete formwork contractor
> where they buy theirs.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "chodges31711" <chodges@a...> wrote:
The difference between Crezone and signal it that Signal has
hardwood faces which make it virtually free of any possible print-
through from the fir innards. Crezone may show some over time unless
completely sealed to keep out moisture. So far after 13 years my
Micro shows none but it was finished by Peter Lenihan so you cannot
tell it is plywood at all anyway!
Price comparison per sheet at Harbor for 4X8 sheets:
Crezone finished 1 side 3/8" $30.84
Crezone finished 2 sides " $36.40
Crezone primed 1 side " $37.84
Crezone primed 2 sides " $43.45
Signal - none in stock
Crezone F1S 1/2" $36.91
Crezone F2S " $42.75
Crezone F1S Primed " $42.05
Crezone F2S " " $47.65
Signal F2S only one kind " $52.33
So for a boat that is going to be lined like a BW2 The first one
listed would be all you needed. If you want the best then the last
one listed:-)
The inner sides of the F1S look just like standard marine fir except
there could be some patches or small knots. The edges are water-
proof sealed on them all that I saw.
Cheers, Nels
> I think Pacific NW MDO, like Olypanel, is probably fir.That's what I was told when I talked to a rep at Olympic.
The difference between Crezone and signal it that Signal has
hardwood faces which make it virtually free of any possible print-
through from the fir innards. Crezone may show some over time unless
completely sealed to keep out moisture. So far after 13 years my
Micro shows none but it was finished by Peter Lenihan so you cannot
tell it is plywood at all anyway!
Price comparison per sheet at Harbor for 4X8 sheets:
Crezone finished 1 side 3/8" $30.84
Crezone finished 2 sides " $36.40
Crezone primed 1 side " $37.84
Crezone primed 2 sides " $43.45
Signal - none in stock
Crezone F1S 1/2" $36.91
Crezone F2S " $42.75
Crezone F1S Primed " $42.05
Crezone F2S " " $47.65
Signal F2S only one kind " $52.33
So for a boat that is going to be lined like a BW2 The first one
listed would be all you needed. If you want the best then the last
one listed:-)
The inner sides of the F1S look just like standard marine fir except
there could be some patches or small knots. The edges are water-
proof sealed on them all that I saw.
Cheers, Nels
"Guardian" is recommended for boat hulls and if you plan to glass the
outside it may be the best choice.
"Crezon," the next step up, has a better sanded finish.
"Signal," the top grade, has thin hardwood outside vaneers for extrs
smooth surfaces.
My local building supply orders from an Olympic Panel wholesaler
(Dixie Plywood) that runs regular delivery routes out of Atlanta.
Charles
outside it may be the best choice.
"Crezon," the next step up, has a better sanded finish.
"Signal," the top grade, has thin hardwood outside vaneers for extrs
smooth surfaces.
My local building supply orders from an Olympic Panel wholesaler
(Dixie Plywood) that runs regular delivery routes out of Atlanta.
Charles
> The thinnest panels Olympic sells are the "Guardian"and "PREPRIMED"
> type at 5/16". For all the others, 3/8" is the thinnest.
>
> CREZONE is the only kind I am familar with though
Concrete forms may be HDO - high density overlay. The paper and
phenolic surfaces are thicker and slicker (very smooth/no tooth). It
is not recommended for boats. One problem is that it is hard to get
anything (like paint) to stick to it - an advantage for concrete
forms.
Charles
phenolic surfaces are thicker and slicker (very smooth/no tooth). It
is not recommended for boats. One problem is that it is hard to get
anything (like paint) to stick to it - an advantage for concrete
forms.
Charles
> 1) As nearly as I can tell, there are several grades of MDO. Therelatively
> cheap stuff is used mostly for concrete forms and is available withMDO on
> one side or both sides. The more expensive stuff is intended foruse in
> outdoor signs. Signal falls in this category.
I think Pacific NW MDO, like Olypanel, is probably fir. In Fritz
Funk's sneakeasy building log I think he mentions that he found his
MDO to be poplar. He did not use it and replaced it with fir.
GaPacfic MDO may be pine. There are inferior MDO brands. Crezon is
recommended for boats. Signal is higher quality and more expensive.
The quality difference may be primarily more sanding and finishing.
Charles
Funk's sneakeasy building log I think he mentions that he found his
MDO to be poplar. He did not use it and replaced it with fir.
GaPacfic MDO may be pine. There are inferior MDO brands. Crezon is
recommended for boats. Signal is higher quality and more expensive.
The quality difference may be primarily more sanding and finishing.
Charles
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
> [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
> Oooo, I see that the Signal MDO is made in 5/16" too.
>
> Ron
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Nels
>http://www.olypanel.com/
>
> Nels
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am currently building with Signal brand MDO which I obtained mail order
from Harbor Sales.
1) As nearly as I can tell, there are several grades of MDO. The relatively
cheap stuff is used mostly for concrete forms and is available with MDO on
one side or both sides. The more expensive stuff is intended for use in
outdoor signs. Signal falls in this category.
2) The sign grade is built to meet state Highway Department specs and is
pretty good stuff. The inner cores look like fir. There are two thin face
veneers of some sort of dark brown hardwood. The face veneers are supposed
to keep wood grain from "printing" through the overlay. I've cut up 10
sheets of the stuff and while I find an occassional pin knot in a veneer, I
haven't found anything bigger than 3/16" and no voids. I've cut it with a
saber saw, a skill saw, a power plane, a Japanese pull saw, a low angle
block plane, and a side grinder with no splintering or tearing.
3) Epoxy sticks to it just fine. Scraps left outside since last November
show no signs of deterioration or water penetration of the overlay.
4) The downside is that, as far as I have been able to tell, MDO doesn't
come in 1/4"; 3/8" is the thinnest I've found.
I'm getting close to completion, but it will be a year or so before I can
comment on longevity. At this point, I'm pleased.
John T
from Harbor Sales.
1) As nearly as I can tell, there are several grades of MDO. The relatively
cheap stuff is used mostly for concrete forms and is available with MDO on
one side or both sides. The more expensive stuff is intended for use in
outdoor signs. Signal falls in this category.
2) The sign grade is built to meet state Highway Department specs and is
pretty good stuff. The inner cores look like fir. There are two thin face
veneers of some sort of dark brown hardwood. The face veneers are supposed
to keep wood grain from "printing" through the overlay. I've cut up 10
sheets of the stuff and while I find an occassional pin knot in a veneer, I
haven't found anything bigger than 3/16" and no voids. I've cut it with a
saber saw, a skill saw, a power plane, a Japanese pull saw, a low angle
block plane, and a side grinder with no splintering or tearing.
3) Epoxy sticks to it just fine. Scraps left outside since last November
show no signs of deterioration or water penetration of the overlay.
4) The downside is that, as far as I have been able to tell, MDO doesn't
come in 1/4"; 3/8" is the thinnest I've found.
I'm getting close to completion, but it will be a year or so before I can
comment on longevity. At this point, I'm pleased.
John T
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 1:54 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
> [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersHi David,
>
> I saw Harborsales from my search for MDO in this site. I haven't yet
found an answer to the salt/fresh water question or if the better grades of
MDO hold up as well as different marine plywoods when the boat is left in
the water 5 or 6 monts at a time with the Yahoo search engine.
>
> Thanks,
> Ron
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 1:14 PM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> > shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
> > 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> > 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> > will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> > down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
> >
> > What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
> > for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
> > that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
> >
> > I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
> > suppliers?
> >
> > This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Ron
>
> ************
>
> Hi Ron,
>
> I'm on the run, so can't dig too much for info. I've not used MDO
> personally, but keep reading about it. Seems like a very nify material
> for boatbuilding where a painted finish is intended. Quick hint:
> there's a search funtion on this, and all, Yahoo Groups. I typed MDO
> into this one, and see that Harborsales in Metro DC area sells the
> good MDO. I'm on W. Coast, so I don't know if they have stores closer
> to you, but they might be able to direct you. Also, apparently there
> are several grades of MDO. I understand what you want is the Sign
> Grade, like "Signal" from Crezon. Othere Yahoo Groups to try: Backyard
> Boatbuilding; Boatdesign; MessaboutW; dwforum. Hope that's somewhat
> helpful.
>
> Cheers,
> David Graybeal
> Portland, OR.
>
> "The workboat finish is a case of mind over matter. If you don't mind,
> it don't matter" - Lew Clayman (until he proves differently)
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930,
Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.16/50 - Release Date: 7/15/2005
>
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
type at 5/16". For all the others, 3/8" is the thinnest.
CREZONE is the only kind I am familar with though, and have
purcheased 3/8, 5/8 and 3/4" panels, prices were about 30 to 40%
cheaper than marine fir plywood at the local dealer (Windsor Plywood
Regina, SK CDA)
If you call your regional rep. - he will advise you of the closest
retailer and you can call them and get them to place your order.
Normally what they do is combine your order with others - mostly
construction outfits. The rep migh also tell you the retailer who
makes the most frequent orders if you have more than one to choose
from. Mine actually checked the order history of the retailers in my
area!
The reps toll-free number is at the website. I have found them very
efficient to deal with.
Nels
> [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersThe thinnest panels Olympic sells are the "Guardian" and "PREPRIMED"
>http://www.olypanel.com/
>
> Nels
>
> Hi Nels,
>
> Thanks for the link.
>
type at 5/16". For all the others, 3/8" is the thinnest.
CREZONE is the only kind I am familar with though, and have
purcheased 3/8, 5/8 and 3/4" panels, prices were about 30 to 40%
cheaper than marine fir plywood at the local dealer (Windsor Plywood
Regina, SK CDA)
If you call your regional rep. - he will advise you of the closest
retailer and you can call them and get them to place your order.
Normally what they do is combine your order with others - mostly
construction outfits. The rep migh also tell you the retailer who
makes the most frequent orders if you have more than one to choose
from. Mine actually checked the order history of the retailers in my
area!
The reps toll-free number is at the website. I have found them very
efficient to deal with.
Nels
[bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
Oooo, I see that the Signal MDO is made in 5/16" too.
Ron
Oooo, I see that the Signal MDO is made in 5/16" too.
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: Nels
http://www.olypanel.com/
Nels
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
http://www.olypanel.com/
Nels
Hi Nels,
Thanks for the link.
Hi Howard,
It's interesting the regional differences. Here in the US, it is sheathing plywood, 3 layers of the cheapest thing that they can still call wood, lots of voids in the face and core but good glue.
g'day
Ron
http://www.olypanel.com/
Nels
Hi Nels,
Thanks for the link.
Hi Howard,
It's interesting the regional differences. Here in the US, it is sheathing plywood, 3 layers of the cheapest thing that they can still call wood, lots of voids in the face and core but good glue.
g'day
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: Howard Stephenson
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 4:06 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
I was going to suggest bracing plywood, but Google indicates this is a
purely Australian product. It's nailed to sections of a house's timber
frame to make it resistant to wind load etc.
The piece I have home -- not stolen from a building site ;-] -- is
3/16" 3-ply, with three tropical hardwood veneers held together by
waterproof glue, and no voids that I can find. It's quite cheap and
would be ideal for building a small boat, but a bit light for a boat
18' long.
Howard
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I was going to suggest bracing plywood, but Google indicates this is a
purely Australian product. It's nailed to sections of a house's timber
frame to make it resistant to wind load etc.
The piece I have home -- not stolen from a building site ;-] -- is
3/16" 3-ply, with three tropical hardwood veneers held together by
waterproof glue, and no voids that I can find. It's quite cheap and
would be ideal for building a small boat, but a bit light for a boat
18' long.
Howard
purely Australian product. It's nailed to sections of a house's timber
frame to make it resistant to wind load etc.
The piece I have home -- not stolen from a building site ;-] -- is
3/16" 3-ply, with three tropical hardwood veneers held together by
waterproof glue, and no voids that I can find. It's quite cheap and
would be ideal for building a small boat, but a bit light for a boat
18' long.
Howard
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
Nels
> [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersHi David,http://www.olypanel.com/
>
Nels
[bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersHi David,
I saw Harborsales from my search for MDO in this site. I haven't yet found an answer to the salt/fresh water question or if the better grades of MDO hold up as well as different marine plywoods when the boat is left in the water 5 or 6 monts at a time with the Yahoo search engine.
Thanks,
Ron
I saw Harborsales from my search for MDO in this site. I haven't yet found an answer to the salt/fresh water question or if the better grades of MDO hold up as well as different marine plywoods when the boat is left in the water 5 or 6 monts at a time with the Yahoo search engine.
Thanks,
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: David
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 1:14 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
> What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
> for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
> that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
>
> I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
> suppliers?
>
> This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron
************
Hi Ron,
I'm on the run, so can't dig too much for info. I've not used MDO
personally, but keep reading about it. Seems like a very nify material
for boatbuilding where a painted finish is intended. Quick hint:
there's a search funtion on this, and all, Yahoo Groups. I typed MDO
into this one, and see that Harborsales in Metro DC area sells the
good MDO. I'm on W. Coast, so I don't know if they have stores closer
to you, but they might be able to direct you. Also, apparently there
are several grades of MDO. I understand what you want is the Sign
Grade, like "Signal" from Crezon. Othere Yahoo Groups to try: Backyard
Boatbuilding; Boatdesign; MessaboutW; dwforum. Hope that's somewhat
helpful.
Cheers,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR.
"The workboat finish is a case of mind over matter. If you don't mind,
it don't matter" - Lew Clayman (until he proves differently)
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
Hi Ron,
I'm on the run, so can't dig too much for info. I've not used MDO
personally, but keep reading about it. Seems like a very nify material
for boatbuilding where a painted finish is intended. Quick hint:
there's a search funtion on this, and all, Yahoo Groups. I typed MDO
into this one, and see that Harborsales in Metro DC area sells the
good MDO. I'm on W. Coast, so I don't know if they have stores closer
to you, but they might be able to direct you. Also, apparently there
are several grades of MDO. I understand what you want is the Sign
Grade, like "Signal" from Crezon. Othere Yahoo Groups to try: Backyard
Boatbuilding; Boatdesign; MessaboutW; dwforum. Hope that's somewhat
helpful.
Cheers,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR.
"The workboat finish is a case of mind over matter. If you don't mind,
it don't matter" - Lew Clayman (until he proves differently)
> Hi All,************
>
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
> What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
> for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
> that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
>
> I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
> suppliers?
>
> This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron
Hi Ron,
I'm on the run, so can't dig too much for info. I've not used MDO
personally, but keep reading about it. Seems like a very nify material
for boatbuilding where a painted finish is intended. Quick hint:
there's a search funtion on this, and all, Yahoo Groups. I typed MDO
into this one, and see that Harborsales in Metro DC area sells the
good MDO. I'm on W. Coast, so I don't know if they have stores closer
to you, but they might be able to direct you. Also, apparently there
are several grades of MDO. I understand what you want is the Sign
Grade, like "Signal" from Crezon. Othere Yahoo Groups to try: Backyard
Boatbuilding; Boatdesign; MessaboutW; dwforum. Hope that's somewhat
helpful.
Cheers,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR.
"The workboat finish is a case of mind over matter. If you don't mind,
it don't matter" - Lew Clayman (until he proves differently)
> I get blank stares whenAsk the local sign painter ...
> I ask for MDO at the lumber yards.
>
> Ron
or the local concrete formwork contractor
where they buy theirs.
[bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliersHi Jon,
I have seen it on the web as thin as 3/8" too. Is salt water better or harder on the wood than fresh water? I get blank stares when I ask for MDO at the lumber yards.
Ron
I have seen it on the web as thin as 3/8" too. Is salt water better or harder on the wood than fresh water? I get blank stares when I ask for MDO at the lumber yards.
Ron
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon & Wanda(Tink)
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 10:26 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood choices and suppliers
3/8ths is as thin as it comes as far as I have found. It is a little
stiffer then most other plywoods paints and glasses well. The specs
call for it to stay solid for 25 years with just paint and no
maintance. I have a peice in my back yard that is raw and just
leaning on the fence for better then 5 years and it is still solid.
Have heard many good stories of it used in boats. Most lumber yards
don't carry it in stock but can order it check for price and it comes
in 5'X10' also.
Jon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am also interested in MDO plywood for boats. I have bought truckloads
of 3/4 and 5/8 with both faces MDO for concrete forms. It was very
durable and could withstand many uses. The edges and corners would ware
round before the faces gave out. That was a long time ago when all
plywood was assumed to be fir. ""What is the species of wood that is
being used under the MDO that is being used for boats."" I would assume,
today, that to be pine???? I bought a sheet of 3/4 MDO (on one side)
that had a "white" wood core that also seemed to rot very very quickly.
I would NOT use that on anything in the water...... or outdoors.
Thank you for the response. JHW
3/8ths is as thin as it comes as far as I have found. It is a little
stiffer then most other plywoods paints and glasses well. The specs
call for it to stay solid for 25 years with just paint and no
maintance. I have a peice in my back yard that is raw and just
leaning on the fence for better then 5 years and it is still solid.
Have heard many good stories of it used in boats. Most lumber yards
don't carry it in stock but can order it check for price and it comes
in 5'X10' also.
Jon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
of 3/4 and 5/8 with both faces MDO for concrete forms. It was very
durable and could withstand many uses. The edges and corners would ware
round before the faces gave out. That was a long time ago when all
plywood was assumed to be fir. ""What is the species of wood that is
being used under the MDO that is being used for boats."" I would assume,
today, that to be pine???? I bought a sheet of 3/4 MDO (on one side)
that had a "white" wood core that also seemed to rot very very quickly.
I would NOT use that on anything in the water...... or outdoors.
Thank you for the response. JHW
3/8ths is as thin as it comes as far as I have found. It is a little
stiffer then most other plywoods paints and glasses well. The specs
call for it to stay solid for 25 years with just paint and no
maintance. I have a peice in my back yard that is raw and just
leaning on the fence for better then 5 years and it is still solid.
Have heard many good stories of it used in boats. Most lumber yards
don't carry it in stock but can order it check for price and it comes
in 5'X10' also.
Jon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".I have only been able to find MDO as thin as 1/2".
> Ron
3/8ths is as thin as it comes as far as I have found. It is a little
stiffer then most other plywoods paints and glasses well. The specs
call for it to stay solid for 25 years with just paint and no
maintance. I have a peice in my back yard that is raw and just
leaning on the fence for better then 5 years and it is still solid.
Have heard many good stories of it used in boats. Most lumber yards
don't carry it in stock but can order it check for price and it comes
in 5'X10' also.
Jon
stiffer then most other plywoods paints and glasses well. The specs
call for it to stay solid for 25 years with just paint and no
maintance. I have a peice in my back yard that is raw and just
leaning on the fence for better then 5 years and it is still solid.
Have heard many good stories of it used in boats. Most lumber yards
don't carry it in stock but can order it check for price and it comes
in 5'X10' also.
Jon
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
> What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various
plywoods
> for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
> that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or
1/4".
>
> I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
> suppliers?
>
> This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25
years.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron
There is no 1/4" MDO that I have found. The thinnest stuff available is
3/8".
Look at some of the Atkin designs for inspiration.
3/8".
Look at some of the Atkin designs for inspiration.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 8:08 AM
Subject: [bolger] Plywood choices and suppliers
> Hi All,
>
> I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
> shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
> 20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
> 8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
> will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
> down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
>
> What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
> for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
> that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
>
> I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
> suppliers?
>
> This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ron
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Hi All,
I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
suppliers?
This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
Thanks,
Ron
I will be building a "Long Narrow Powerboat" probably similar to a
shrunk down "Sneakeazy" or "Tennassee" with a length of about 18 to
20 feet and with a beam of around 4 feet. Power will be either an
8HP outboard or a solar/electric drive of at least 3HP. The boat
will be in salt water for the summer/fall season and stored upside
down for the rest of the year (Removable cabin).
What are the advantages/disadvantages of MDO vs. the various plywoods
for this use. The boat will be painted, not varnished. I suspect
that the bottom will be 9mm or 3/8" and the sides will be 6mm or 1/4".
I live on Long Island NY. Any good suppliers out here or internet
suppliers?
This will be my third plywood boat but the first one in over 25 years.
Thanks,
Ron