Re: small power cruiser ideas?

> There is the 20' Chebacco Boat. Seehttp://www.chebacco.com/
>
> It's meant for sailing but it seems to me that without the
> centreboard, saiing rig and rudder you'd have a pretty fair launch
> that could be driven at 5 kt with very little horsepower and at 7

> with under 20 hp, although with a somewhat nose-up attitude.
>
> That website should open up with a picture of what I think is the
> cruising version of the 20-foot Chebacco, "with a pilot house,
> heads, galley, easily lowered mast in a tabernacle, and lots more
> storage for extended cruising."
>
> The design is meant to be built stitch and glue, a technique that

> suitable for first-time builders. Googling should get you a lot

> information, if you're interested.
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> >
> > I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> > suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
> >
> > -20 ft. loa or less.
> >
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river

> > ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great

> > Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
> >
> > -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> > great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble.

> @
> > 5-7 knots?
> >
> > -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
> >
> > -reasonably easy and quick to build.

----- Original Message -----
From: "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:23 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John B. Trussell" <John.Trussell@w...>
> wrote:
> > Another approach (used with some success by my sailing club) is to
> find an
> > old, cheap, clapped out, fg, sailing, cruiser, scrap the rig, add the
> > interior and cabin of your choice, and put a 10 hp motor on the back.
> > Probably cheaper and quicker.
>
> That sounds like a great idea. Anyone out there tried this? Or know
> of a website about this?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Carl
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, BllFs6@a... wrote:
> Here is a good small power cruiser for ya!
>
> _http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/dockbox/index.htm_
> (http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/dockbox/index.htm)
>
>
> I had a good laugh....but then I had liquid beverage come outa my
nose when
> I noticed what type/class of shanty he had named it! (starts with
an N)
>
> Man, I wanna build one of these babies, strap a small keg to the
deck, hang
> dirty chlorox bottles off the sides for bumpers, throw a few live
chickens on
> the roof, and then camp out in a luxury yatch marina with my
habachi grill
> now!
>
> take care and good luck
>
> Blll

----- Original Message -----
From: "ANDREW AIREY" <andyairey@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> They've also,on occasion,got a 'holier than thou'
> attitude which can be thoroughly nauseating.
> Segregation and effective silencing,where possible,has
> to be the answer,and at least keep powerboats away
> from swimmers.The problem in the UK is that there are
> relatively few sites for extensive powerboat operation
> - Windermere,Loch Lomond and one or two of the bigger
> reservoirs.They've recently imposed a 10mph limit on
> Windermere and it's costing them a fortune in lost
> tourist revenue
> Cheers
> Andy Airey
> PS I've yet to work out whether drivers of SUVs know
> that they're crap drivers and buy SUVs to protect
> themselves or whether driving in a tank just
> encourages them to be crap drivers
> --- John Bell <smallboatdesigner@...>
> wrote:

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dominic tyson" <dominictyson@...>
>
> As a general boating rule, the more power and speed
a boat has, the "crew"
for want of a better word tends to be more selfish,
stupid, arrogant and
disrespectful of other boaters, especially Kayakers,
Canoists, rowers,
sailors and displacement speed powerboats.
> Hugo Tyson , Launceston, Tasmania, Australia.




Bolger rules!!!
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dead horses
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>--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
>
>
>>That sounds like a great idea. Anyone out there tried this? Or
>>
>>
>know of a website about this?
>
>I've seen a site devoted to this, Carl, but I can't find it right now.
> I did pull several similar sites out of my dusty, attic-of-a-brain
>though. First, try <a
>href="http://www.geocities.com/geezerboat">Geezer Boatworks</a>. This
>fellow has converted several lifeboats to cruisers. He used to have
>more examples on his site, but that space is now taken up by his new
>shantyboat.
>
>Second, gaze upon a nice factory cruiser made from a sailboat, the <a
>href="http://www.caribescape.info/tidakapa.htm">Schucker 440</a>.
>(sail rig optional :) This is a nice site by an charter
>captain/cruising author who needed to switch to a trawler for health
>reasons. He ended up choosing a "trawlerized" sailboat to meet his
>lenghty list of requirements. It's a good read, if just to get the
>wish list of a professional boater.
>
>I've long contended that converting a sailboat to a trawler will be my
>least costly way to retire on the water. But Mr. Bolger has me so
>spoiled with his practical features, I don't know if I could accept
>the low tankage, small battery banks, poor visibility, multiple
>through hulls, etc of a production boat.
>
>Also, my friend bought a worn-out pontoon boat and built a
>shanty-style cabin on it. That worked out nice, sort of a poor-man's
>houseboat.
>
>As ever,
>Stew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Bolger rules!!!
>- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
>- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
>- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
>- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> That sounds like a great idea. Anyone out there tried this? Or

> find an old, cheap, clapped out, fg, sailing, cruiser, scrap the

> > Probably cheaper and quicker.
>
> That sounds like a great idea. Anyone out there tried this? Or

> of a website about this?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Carl

----- Original Message -----
From: "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:23 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John B. Trussell" <John.Trussell@w...>
> wrote:
> > Another approach (used with some success by my sailing club) is to
> find an
> > old, cheap, clapped out, fg, sailing, cruiser, scrap the rig, add the
> > interior and cabin of your choice, and put a 10 hp motor on the back.
> > Probably cheaper and quicker.
>
> That sounds like a great idea. Anyone out there tried this? Or know
> of a website about this?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Carl
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

> I'm not even sure how to estimate displacement. This was just a
> sketch to help me visualize some of the ideas in my head. I've
> got "How to Design a Boat" by John Teale

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John B. Trussell"
<John.Trussell@w...>
> wrote:
> > Another approach (used with some success by my sailing club) is to
> find an
> > old, cheap, clapped out, fg, sailing, cruiser, scrap the rig, add
the
> > interior and cabin of your choice, and put a 10 hp motor on the
back.

> If you can get your hands on a copy of The Folding Schooner, check

> Economy Motor Sailor.

> Another approach (used with some success by my sailing club) is to

> old, cheap, clapped out, fg, sailing, cruiser, scrap the rig, add the
> interior and cabin of your choice, and put a 10 hp motor on the back.
> Probably cheaper and quicker.

> Another possibility is to combine the box keel with a vee-bottom.
> Bolger does that with several of his designs, particularly the non-
> planing ones. At least one of his designs has a kind of vee-bottomed
> box keel too.

> I meant to write 2,300 lb., although it looks like nobody noticed

> error. What is your estimate, Carl?
>

----- Original Message -----
From: "Howard Stephenson" <stephensonhw@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 5:58 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> There is the 20' Chebacco Boat. Seehttp://www.chebacco.com/
>
> It's meant for sailing but it seems to me that without the
> centreboard, saiing rig and rudder you'd have a pretty fair launch
> that could be driven at 5 kt with very little horsepower and at 7 kt
> with under 20 hp, although with a somewhat nose-up attitude.
>
> That website should open up with a picture of what I think is the
> cruising version of the 20-foot Chebacco, "with a pilot house,
> heads, galley, easily lowered mast in a tabernacle, and lots more
> storage for extended cruising."
>
> The design is meant to be built stitch and glue, a technique that is
> suitable for first-time builders. Googling should get you a lot more
> information, if you're interested.
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> >
> > I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> > suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
> >
> > -20 ft. loa or less.
> >
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> > ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> > Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
> >
> > -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> > great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
> @
> > 5-7 knots?
> >
> > -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
> >
> > -reasonably easy and quick to build.
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.6/59 - Release Date: 7/27/2005
>
>

----- Original Message -----
From: "willers32" <mwagner@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 11:54 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...> wrote:
> > Enjoy your fantasy then, cuz' it ain't ever gonna happen!
>
>
> I have no illusions of it ever happening. I can count. Monster-boaters
> outnumber "low impact" users of the water by about 3 to 1, or more. In
> a democracy, the minority have no rights at all. The majority can do
> as they please. (Which is exactly why the Founding Fathers hated
> democracy and did their best to prevent it from taking root in the
> republic they founded.)
>
> But, as the song says "I can dream, can't I?"
>
> I has been my experience that most (certainly NOT all) monster-boaters
> are pretty decent folks when you chat with them at the dock. Just as
> many automobile drivers are decent until they get behind the wheel,
> they undergo a transformation once they feel the throbbing of the
> engine. Observation (not scientific study) leads me to the following
> conclusion: most sailors actually invest a good amount of time
> studying and learning seamanship skills. They tend to have a high rate
> of CG Aux certification in basic boating skills and navigation. Power
> boaters seem to have a much lower level of education regarding
> operation of their craft. It seems to me that they look at the
> operation of a boat as being no different than driving a car.
> Certainly the number of charted obstructions hit by power boats every
> year is a good indication.
>
> There are exceptions to every rule, and I expect that subscibers to
> this list, power, sail or row, are more likely to be appropriately
> educated than most power boaters.
>
> But observation on the water indicates most power boaters are not
> subscibers to this list.
>
> The one thing that I will never understand is why in the world would
> you ever want to go that fast on the water anyway? I go out on the
> water to get away from the hustle and bustle of everyday life. The
> last thing I want to do is take it with me. Ghosting along at 3 or 4
> knots is just fine with me. If it takes two weeks to get someplace, so
> what? It's about the journey, not the destination.
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> I meant to write 2,300 lb., although it looks like nobody noticed my
> error. What is your estimate, Carl?
>
> Howard
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stephenson"
> <stephensonhw@a...> wrote:
>
> > 2. Displacement as drawn is about 1,300 lb.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> I put a sketch (in photos -->carl b) of what I was originally
> envisioning after my first pass through BWAOM. Layout something
> like a shortened version of BDG's Lake Union Cruiser (last version o
> n page on www.benford.us/index.html?pcty/) but with an outboard and
a
> box keel like those Australian Tennessees. Then I started to n
> otice that without the pilot house, it reminded me of the micro and
t
> he micro-like boats (above the water line).
>
> A
> nyway. This is what I was thinking about originally. Now there a
> re so many option to consider, I'm not sure what I'm thinking.
>
> C
> arl ﷯

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ron Schroeder" <rjs@b...> wrote:


>Why not a "V"?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Howard Stephenson" <stephensonhw@...>
> 1. It's only about 15'9" long. Why not lengthen it to to your 20'
> maximum? You could then put the motor in a proper outboard well on the
> transom. This adds to safety because you're no longer limited to 15"
> or 20" transom height and fuel fumes go overboard., esp. if you put
> the fuel tank in the well too.
>
> Or have you drawn it with a self-draining cockpit/aft deck, with only
> sitting headroom under the shelter?
>
> 2. Displacement as drawn is about 1,300 lb. You'd probably need less
> than 5 hp to run it at its 5-kt displacement speed. A 9.9 would give a
> fair bit in reserve.
>
> Howard

> Thought I'd get my tuppence worth in here. Still

>
> All behaved responsibly apart from two or three

>
> At the moment these fools have access to the entire

>
> As you say, John, there are fools in every kind of

>
> Bill (costing out the possibility of mounting

>--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...> wrote:
>
>
>>Enjoy your fantasy then, cuz' it ain't ever gonna happen!
>>
>>
>
>
>I have no illusions of it ever happening. I can count. Monster-boaters
>outnumber "low impact" users of the water by about 3 to 1, or more. In
>a democracy, the minority have no rights at all. The majority can do
>as they please. (Which is exactly why the Founding Fathers hated
>democracy and did their best to prevent it from taking root in the
>republic they founded.)
>
>But, as the song says "I can dream, can't I?"
>
>I has been my experience that most (certainly NOT all) monster-boaters
>are pretty decent folks when you chat with them at the dock. Just as
>many automobile drivers are decent until they get behind the wheel,
>they undergo a transformation once they feel the throbbing of the
>engine. Observation (not scientific study) leads me to the following
>conclusion: most sailors actually invest a good amount of time
>studying and learning seamanship skills. They tend to have a high rate
>of CG Aux certification in basic boating skills and navigation. Power
>boaters seem to have a much lower level of education regarding
>operation of their craft. It seems to me that they look at the
>operation of a boat as being no different than driving a car.
>Certainly the number of charted obstructions hit by power boats every
>year is a good indication.
>
>There are exceptions to every rule, and I expect that subscibers to
>this list, power, sail or row, are more likely to be appropriately
>educated than most power boaters.
>
>But observation on the water indicates most power boaters are not
>subscibers to this list.
>
>The one thing that I will never understand is why in the world would
>you ever want to go that fast on the water anyway? I go out on the
>water to get away from the hustle and bustle of everyday life. The
>last thing I want to do is take it with me. Ghosting along at 3 or 4
>knots is just fine with me. If it takes two weeks to get someplace, so
>what? It's about the journey, not the destination.
>
>
>

>
>
>
>Bolger rules!!!
>- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
>- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
>- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
>- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

>Thought I'd get my tuppence worth in here. Still hot under the collar after a trip at the weekend to Loch Lomond. The public beach was being used by windsurfers, kayakers (me for one), powerboaters and jetskiers.
>
>All behaved responsibly apart from two or three jetskiers, who were letting kids (like 10 years old) out alone on these overpowered machines. One was taking a delight in using his bow-wave to knock a windsurfer off his board repeatedly, every time he was getting back aboard it. Another took every opportunity to drive at close quarters across other people's bows, drenching them and choking them with his stink. Did the parents care? I think you already know the answer to that.
>
>At the moment these fools have access to the entire loch, and disrupt dinghy racing, too. There's a proposal, likely to become a rule, that there'll be a 7kt speed limit on one third of the Loch from next season onwards. It can't come quickly enough for me.
>
>As you say, John, there are fools in every kind of boat, but few can cause the widespread misery and frustration that an idiot on a jet-ski can achieve.
>
>Bill (costing out the possibility of mounting torpedo tubes on my kayak)
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Bell
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 3:27 PM
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?
>
>
> Enjoy your fantasy then, cuz' it ain't ever gonna happen!
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "willers32" <mwagner@...>
> To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 10:18 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?
>
>
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...> wrote:
> >
> > > Most modern planing boats would be rendered worthless by such a law
> > because
> > > they don't work well at those speeds.
> >
> > Wouldn't bother me a bit. Such boats belong on the ocean, not in
> > inland waters.
> >
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
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>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>Bolger rules!!!
>- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
>- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
>- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
>- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>Yahoo! Groups Links
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>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
>

> 2. Displacement as drawn is about 1,300 lb.

> It seems to me that the so called 'no wake'
> zones are actually speed limit zones
> and regardless of whether your Topaz Spyder
> makes a wake or not, you are restricted by
> speed.

> speed limit ...(vs.)
> no wake zone ...

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Will Samson" <willsamson@y...> wrote:
> Thought I'd get my tuppence worth in here. Still hot under the
collar after a trip at the weekend to Loch Lomond. The public beach
was being used by windsurfers, kayakers (me for one), powerboaters and
jetskiers.
>
> All behaved responsibly apart from two or three jetskiers, who were
letting kids (like 10 years old) out alone on these overpowered
machines. One was taking a delight in using his bow-wave to knock a
windsurfer off his board repeatedly, every time he was getting back
aboard it. Another took every opportunity to drive at close quarters
across other people's bows, drenching them and choking them with his
stink. Did the parents care? I think you already know the answer to
that.
>
> At the moment these fools have access to the entire loch, and
disrupt dinghy racing, too. There's a proposal, likely to become a
rule, that there'll be a 7kt speed limit on one third of the Loch from
next season onwards. It can't come quickly enough for me.
>
> As you say, John, there are fools in every kind of boat, but few can
cause the widespread misery and frustration that an idiot on a jet-ski
can achieve.
>
> Bill (costing out the possibility of mounting torpedo tubes on my kayak)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nels" <arvent@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 11:10 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...>
> wrote:
> > LOL. I'll bet "Kayakers, Canoists, rowers, sailors and
> displacement speed
> > powerboats" are aren't that much less arrogant, selfish,
> disrespectful, or
> > stupid as anyone else, they just aren't as obvious about it as the
> few bad
> > apples in larger or more powerful craft! Just because we do
> something stupid
> > slowly doesn't make it any less dumb. ;-)
> >
>
> It has been my personal experience that there are two distinct
> levels of mentality when it comes to what could be termed "low
> impact" outdoors people and those who want to bring all their
> technology and comforts into the wild areas for a "quick experiece
> and then get the hell back out of there again".
>
> This applies to hikers as opposed to quad drivers, cross-country
> skiers as opposed to snowmobilers, kayakers and jetskiers, tenters
> and 40 foot motorhomes, VW Westphalias and Humvees. Bicylists and
> Harley owners.
>
> I think the big difference is that the one group genuinely enjoys
> nature and the other group is actually intimidated by it.
>
> Of course this is a broad generalization and there are axceptions in
> every case. Also alchohol does not work very well for a self-
> propelled traveler so if one is a drunk the kayak or mountain bike
> does not get used all that often. One can often get a good deal on
> their toys that require sobriety to operate well:-)
>
> Nels (Speaking from personal experience, both while drunk and sober)
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax:
(978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> Enjoy your fantasy then, cuz' it ain't ever gonna happen!

----- Original Message -----
From: John Bell
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 3:27 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


Enjoy your fantasy then, cuz' it ain't ever gonna happen!


----- Original Message -----
From: "willers32" <mwagner@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 10:18 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...> wrote:
>
> > Most modern planing boats would be rendered worthless by such a law
> because
> > they don't work well at those speeds.
>
> Wouldn't bother me a bit. Such boats belong on the ocean, not in
> inland waters.
>




Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
- Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> LOL. I'll bet "Kayakers, Canoists, rowers, sailors and

> powerboats" are aren't that much less arrogant, selfish,

> stupid as anyone else, they just aren't as obvious about it as the

> apples in larger or more powerful craft! Just because we do

> slowly doesn't make it any less dumb. ;-)
>

----- Original Message -----
From: "willers32" <mwagner@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 10:18 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Bell" <smallboatdesigner@m...> wrote:
>
> > Most modern planing boats would be rendered worthless by such a law
> because
> > they don't work well at those speeds.
>
> Wouldn't bother me a bit. Such boats belong on the ocean, not in
> inland waters.
>

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dominic tyson" <dominictyson@...>
>
> As a general boating rule, the more power and speed a boat has, the "crew"
for want of a better word tends to be more selfish, stupid, arrogant and
disrespectful of other boaters, especially Kayakers, Canoists, rowers,
sailors and displacement speed powerboats.
> Hugo Tyson , Launceston, Tasmania, Australia.

> Most modern planing boats would be rendered worthless by such a law

> they don't work well at those speeds.

> As a general boating rule, the more power and speed a boat has, the

> Hugo Tyson , Launceston, Tasmania, Australia.

----- Original Message -----
From: "willers32" <mwagner@...>
To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 9:56 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


> I'd vote for a speed limit of 15 knots on all inland waters, period;
> alcohol or no alcohol. If you need to get there faster, get in your
> car and drive. Leave the water for us "take it slow and relaxing"
> folks. If you really like pounding your guts out at 75 knots, use the
> ocean. At least on the ocean, the biggest wave around isn't your wake.
>
> --Mike Wagner--
> Skipper of "Walkure", home of the "drilled" margarita, every Fri & Sat
> evening.

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Hugo Tyson <hhetyson@y...> wrote:
> there should be a rule that on boats capable of more than 15 Knots no
> alcohol should be consumed by anybody onboard, but boats below 15
> knots speed an open limit to alcohol consumption--with reason of
> course!!)."
>

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Hugo Tyson <hhetyson@y...> wrote:
there should be a rule that on boats capable of more than 15 Knots no
alcohol should be consumed by anybody onboard, but boats below 15
knots speed an open limit to alcohol consumption--with reason of
course!!)."


I'll vote for that! That's reason number 87 why I like Windermere so
much,7kts cruising speed...just right for keeping the tumblers from
tumbling :-)
Mind you, I've known some folks who simply should not drink at
all,anywhere,anytime since they would probably get themselves killed
just standing still.......in the middle of the freeway.

Sincerely,

Peter Lenihan,known to take a sip or two,every so often,with nary a
bit of guilt nor shame to spoil its' gentle trip down my gullet, from
along the shores of the St.lawrence.........

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> I put a sketch (in photos -->carl b) of what I was originally
> envisioning after my first pass through BWAOM.

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dbaldnz" <oink@w...> wrote:
> > Well, yes Susan, but I'm as soft as marshmallow!
> > Don
>
> Has your wife been informed of this,Don :-)
>
> Peter

> On 8/8/05, ch_bunch wrote:
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff,
>
> The more I think about it, the boat I would build
> would be a Bolger Shivaree 18ft.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> On 8/8/05, ch_bunch wrote:
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff,
>
> The more I think about it, the boat I would build
> would be a Bolger Shivaree 18ft.
>
> I know that the glued plywood lapstrake *seems*
> hard, [but based on a couple personal experiments],
> I have found that plywood lapstrake is negligibly
> harder than taped seams (and in some ways it is
> easier).

> -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff,

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Will Samson" <willsamson@y...> wrote:
> A small caveat though - the bottom and side panels are set out on
the drawings, but the bilge panels have to be made to fit once the
bottom and sides are fixed to the frames. No big deal, but worth a
mention.

> Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.
> -20 ft. loa or less.
> -reasonably easy and quick to build.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dbaldnz" <oink@w...> wrote:
> In this regard, Oink has 400lbs of steel punchings in epoxy spread
out
> under the floorboards and between the bunks; a lot more efficient
than
> water ballast, taking up no more room than before and giving a very
> solid bottom. It makes no apparent difference to performance apart
> from extra stability, for a boat designed to be moored,
> Don


> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@y...>
> wrote:
> >
> > Altering Micro:- For 'rough stuff' the ballast in the Micro fin
keel
> > would confer stability, self righting, and seaworthiness. The
> > leeboard converted 19'6" Long Micro "Zoon" ....

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Clyde Wisner <clydewis@c...> wrote:
> > Jim also has Dorado, which I think is about 18 ft and designed for
> rough
> > seas. Clyde
> >
>
> IMO Dorado is a great looking/performing boat.
>
> SowsEar certainly fits the bill, but IMO is really needs a Fast

> style cutwater to be complete. With a Clam Skiff "shoe" on the hull
> aft which grows into a Fast Brick cutwater, I believe SowsEar would
> be "complete" and a far better boat than what is described by the
> builder.
>
> Don

> I think he does have at least a desire for
> consistancy. I too requested #666 as my design number.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:

> Can't seem to find the MR 21 "Rambler" on the web.
>
> Carl

> Jim also has Dorado, which I think is about 18 ft and designed for

> seas. Clyde
>

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman
> <bruce@h...> wrote:
> >
> > I think that Bolger doesn't 'number' a boat unless
> it is
> > a finished design.
>
> I think he does.
>
> -- Sue --
> (eagerly awaiting #666)
>
> --
> Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> --------------------~-->
> <font face=arial size=-1><a
>

> fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make
> Yahoo! your home page</a></font>
>

>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or
> flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed,
> thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts,
> and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
> Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:
>bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>
>
>

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@y...>
> wrote:
> > Have you considered Jim Michalak's "Sowsear"
>
> I looked at it, but noticed in the discription:
>
> "Sow's Ear should be a bit more seaworthy than Shanteuse but keep in
> mind that no light and small flat bottomed boat is going to be
> seaworthy to any real degree."
>
> So I don't think it could handle a trip like the Great Loop.
>
> > At just over 20' the Murray River 21 "Rambler" could possibly suit.
>
> Can't seem to find the MR 21 "Rambler" on the web.
>
> Carl
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930,
> Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
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> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

> Some recent Bartender photos:
>
>http://www.boat-links.com/BT2005/
>
>http://dragonwall.net/BartenderRendezvous/
>
> And the plans and kits:
>
>http://www.bartenderboats.com/
>
> On Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:23:55 -0700 (PDT), Sam G
> wrote:
> > Wow--the "salty, seaworthy Bartender." That is a
> > blast from the past. I sure wanted to build one
> of
> > those when I was a kid, a neat double-ender.
> > ...
>
> --
> John
> <jkohnen@...>
>http://www.boat-links.com/
> When I think of the number of disagreeable people
> that I know have gone
> to a better world, I am sure hell won't be so bad
> at all. <Mark Twain>
>
>
>

> Have you considered Jim Michalak's "Sowsear"

> At just over 20' the Murray River 21 "Rambler" could possibly suit.

>
> Altering Micro:- For 'rough stuff' the ballast in the Micro fin keel
> would confer stability, self righting, and seaworthiness. The
> leeboard converted 19'6" Long Micro "Zoon"
>http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/zoon.ht)in order to work "fine" must
> have some internal or bolted on plate ballast. In the powerboat you
> probably don't want to lug that weight. There are pictures in the
> Bolger-groups somewhere of the redoubtable Roger Keyes sailing
> offshore in his famous Micro, "Paloma Blanca" (
>http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/keyes.htm), with his latest addition
> of an enclosed raised helm station (Bolger approved). He first built
> her without the ballast keel, but water ballasted, with an outboard
> hung rudder, and leeboards. The set-up was for sheltered, shallow
> water cruising. Duck Flat Wooden Boats in "A Book of Dreams" p60,
> commenting on this, note: "Duck Flat and Commonsense and Phil Bolger
> urge caution in making any changes like this; there is usually an
> unpredictable 'cascading series of consequences'. In this case it is
> in the loss of the original design's neat outboard motor resolution
> and final stability." She had the sail rig, yes, but she was water
> ballasted. A searchable index (http://tinyurl.com/e388h)of
> Australian Amateur Boat Builder magazine (AABB
>http://tinyurl.com/8wzk4) lists Roger's write-up "The Micro
> Modified" at #6 66.
>
> It doesn't take much power to cause the Micro hull to squat.
>
> Have you considered Jim Michalak's "Sowsear" (
>http://tinyurl.com/9xbuw), (http://tinyurl.com/7lmhf)? Very Micro-
> like, and may meet most of your requirements. The flat run aft,
> allows planing with under 25hp max outboard, though see the
> prototype builder's comments - ( Drumming? -perhaps thicker bottom;
> Water over the bow? -bow door; Attention to helm, and blown all
> over? -some method of increased lateral resistance, yet my Micro
> with sails dowsed and 5hp has similar habits heading into, say,
> 20kts or more; lots of fore thought required in narrow spaces!).
>
> At just over 20' the Murray River 21 "Rambler" could possibly suit.
> Not sure of the degree of rough stuff she could handle, but it is
> based on "Green Island 18" which can handle plenty. AABB has
> published good reports from satisfied builders. Likewise for
> designer Mike Roberts, at Headland Boats (
>http://tinyurl.com/8mwlv).
>
> Graeme
>
> >Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.
>
> >The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally I
> >was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> >Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I think
> >about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity. If
> >I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> >suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
>
> >-20 ft. loa or less.
>
> >-seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> >ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> >Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> >-20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> >great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise @
> >5-7 knots?
>
> >-some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> >-reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest woodworking
> >projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock. It's
> >almost big enough to float in. :)
>
> >Thanks everyone!
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> > Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4
> info.
> >
> > The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally
> I
> > was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> > Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I
> think
> > about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity.
> If
> > I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> > suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
> >
> > -20 ft. loa or less.
> >
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> > ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> > Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
> >
> > -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> > great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
> @
> > 5-7 knots?
> >
> > -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
> >
> > -reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest
> woodworking
> > projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock.
> It's
> > almost big enough to float in. :)
> >
> > Thanks everyone!

>
>
>
> I'm as soft as marshmallow!
> > Don
>
> Peter Lenihan <peterlenihan@h...> wrote:
>
> "Has your wife been informed of this,Don :-)
>
> Peter"
>
> I'm too worried I'd be excluded from the group if I commented on

> Don

> Well, yes Susan, but I'm as soft as marshmallow!
> Don

>
> Altering Micro:- For 'rough stuff' the ballast in the Micro fin keel
> would confer stability, self righting, and seaworthiness. The
> leeboard converted 19'6" Long Micro "Zoon"
>http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/zoon.ht)in order to work "fine" must
> have some internal or bolted on plate ballast. In the powerboat you
> probably don't want to lug that weight. There are pictures in the
> Bolger-groups somewhere of the redoubtable Roger Keyes sailing
> offshore in his famous Micro, "Paloma Blanca" (
>http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/keyes.htm), with his latest addition
> of an enclosed raised helm station (Bolger approved). He first built
> her without the ballast keel, but water ballasted, with an outboard
> hung rudder, and leeboards. The set-up was for sheltered, shallow
> water cruising. Duck Flat Wooden Boats in "A Book of Dreams" p60,
> commenting on this, note: "Duck Flat and Commonsense and Phil Bolger
> urge caution in making any changes like this; there is usually an
> unpredictable 'cascading series of consequences'. In this case it is
> in the loss of the original design's neat outboard motor resolution
> and final stability." She had the sail rig, yes, but she was water
> ballasted. A searchable index (http://tinyurl.com/e388h)of
> Australian Amateur Boat Builder magazine (AABB
>http://tinyurl.com/8wzk4) lists Roger's write-up "The Micro
> Modified" at #6 66.
>
> It doesn't take much power to cause the Micro hull to squat.
>
> Have you considered Jim Michalak's "Sowsear" (
>http://tinyurl.com/9xbuw), (http://tinyurl.com/7lmhf)? Very Micro-
> like, and may meet most of your requirements. The flat run aft,
> allows planing with under 25hp max outboard, though see the
> prototype builder's comments - ( Drumming? -perhaps thicker bottom;
> Water over the bow? -bow door; Attention to helm, and blown all
> over? -some method of increased lateral resistance, yet my Micro
> with sails dowsed and 5hp has similar habits heading into, say,
> 20kts or more; lots of fore thought required in narrow spaces!).
>
> At just over 20' the Murray River 21 "Rambler" could possibly suit.
> Not sure of the degree of rough stuff she could handle, but it is
> based on "Green Island 18" which can handle plenty. AABB has
> published good reports from satisfied builders. Likewise for
> designer Mike Roberts, at Headland Boats (
>http://tinyurl.com/8mwlv).
>
> Graeme
>
> >Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.
>
> >The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally I
> >was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> >Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I think
> >about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity. If
> >I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> >suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
>
> >-20 ft. loa or less.
>
> >-seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> >ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> >Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> >-20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> >great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise @
> >5-7 knots?
>
> >-some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> >-reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest woodworking
> >projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock. It's
> >almost big enough to float in. :)
>
> >Thanks everyone!
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> > Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4
> info.
> >
> > The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally
> I
> > was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> > Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I
> think
> > about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity.
> If
> > I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> > suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
> >
> > -20 ft. loa or less.
> >
> > -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> > ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> > Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
> >
> > -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> > great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
> @
> > 5-7 knots?
> >
> > -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
> >
> > -reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest
> woodworking
> > projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock.
> It's
> > almost big enough to float in. :)
> >
> > Thanks everyone!

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Susan Davis" <futabachan@y...> wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dbaldnz" <oink@w...> wrote:
> > Navigator Oink is sitting in the estuary without masts, waiting for
> > coming warmer spring weather.
>
> Really? I would think that she'd be an ideal boat for colder weather,
> given the shelter that she provides....
>
> --
> Susan Davis <futabachan@y...>

----- Original Message -----
From: Howard Stephenson
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 8:36 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: small power cruiser ideas?


I was looking at the plans reproduced in BWAOM. If you go to
http://www.chebacco.com/

... and click on the link to building instructions, you will see it
says: "Construction is `tack and tape'; rather like `stitch and
glue' but without the stitches. The plans give accurate dimensions
for the bulkheads and panels (- no lofting needed -) and the
bulkheads are set up and panels tacked to them."

There is a lot more good information on this page.

Howard

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stephenson"
<stephensonhw@a...> wrote:
> Having another look at the Chebacco plans, I see that panel shapes
are
> not show, whereas offsets are. So it's meant to be built in the
> conventional way over moulds or frames, rather than instant-boat
> stitch-and-glue style.





Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Having another look at the Chebacco plans, I see that panel shapes

> not show, whereas offsets are. So it's meant to be built in the
> conventional way over moulds or frames, rather than instant-boat
> stitch-and-glue style.

On Tue, 9 Aug 2005 09:23:55 -0700 (PDT), Sam G wrote:
> Wow--the "salty, seaworthy Bartender." That is a
> blast from the past. I sure wanted to build one of
> those when I was a kid, a neat double-ender.
> ...

--
John <jkohnen@...>
http://www.boat-links.com/
When I think of the number of disagreeable people that I know have gone
to a better world, I am sure hell won't be so bad at all. <Mark Twain>

>Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.

>The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally I
>was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
>Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I think
>about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity. If
>I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
>suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?


>-20 ft. loa or less.

>-seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
>ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
>Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?

>-20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
>great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise @
>5-7 knots?

>-some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.

>-reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest woodworking
>projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock. It's
>almost big enough to float in. :)

>Thanks everyone!


--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4
info.
>
> The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally
I
> was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I
think
> about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity.
If
> I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
> -20 ft. loa or less.
>
> -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
@
> 5-7 knots?
>
> -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> -reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest
woodworking
> projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock.
It's
> almost big enough to float in. :)
>
> Thanks everyone!

> Navigator Oink is sitting in the estuary without masts, waiting for
> coming warmer spring weather.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:

> I was looking at the Chebacco plans in "Boats with an Open Mind."
> I'm guessing the motor could be moved in a bit to where the rudder
> is. And maybe the keel and ballast could be reduced without sails.
> Would this be more difficult and spendy to build than the Micro Nav
> sans sails?

>
> I think that Bolger doesn't 'number' a boat unless it is
> a finished design.

> > If it were me I would build a _Low Powered Outboard Cruiser_
> > Bolger design #450.
> Yes, a bit big. But an interesting boat. Is it a finished design?
> I find myself humming the Batman theme when I look at it. :)

> I didn't look at the Topaz plans close enough. I
> thought it was an
> enclosed Snow Leopard, but that's not the case. Do
> you have pics?
>
> But, 31 feet is intimidating to me. I'd be
> trailering and I only
> have about 32 feet to build in, so I don't know if
> I'm brave enough
> to take on a task like that. Still, I'd love to see
> pictures if you
> have them.
>
> Carl

> -- Clam Skiff in BWAOM...

> -- Sea Hawk Dory Skiff from Small Boats...

> -- In the Fast Motorsailer chapter in BWAOM...

> -- Micro Trawler or Hawkeye. Bolger has designed an enclosed cabin
> for Hawkeye, which I think would probably come out lighter than a
> Micro Trawler....

> -- And of course, going completely overboard...

> Forgive me for poking my nose in your business--I
> didn't mean to imply that you didn't have good reasons
> for staying short. Its just that I went through a
> similar enterprise a few years ago, and ended up
> building a Bolger Topaz, which can hit hull speed
> (7kts or so) with a 9.9 high-thrust--and will plane
> nicely with more power. The Topaz is a thirty-one
> footer, but a small, inexpensive, light 31 footer,
> easier and cheaper to build, tow and maintain than
> many 20' boats. There are many other options in the
> 20-30 foot range as well. Plenty of reasons to stay
> under 20', too, of course. I love the Redwing myself.
> The 40 LR would be a super island-hopper, and the 19'
> is a pretty, simple, satisfying-looking boat. Sam
>

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.
>
> The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally I
> was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I
think
> about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity. If
> I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
> -20 ft. loa or less.
>
> -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
@
> 5-7 knots?
>
> -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> -reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest woodworking
> projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock.
It's
> almost big enough to float in. :)
>
> Thanks everyone!

> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Sam Glasscock
> <glasscocklanding@y...>
> wrote:
> > Wow--the "salty, seaworthy Bartender." That is a
> > blast from the past. I sure wanted to build one
> of
> > those when I was a kid, a neat double-ender.
> >
> > Bolger's Bantam is a possiblility for a light
> cruiser
> > in the range you are looking for. Chesapeake
> Design
> > has the Redwing if you are looking for a more
> > traditional boat. Why do you want to keep her
> under
> > 20'? There are lots of advantages to a longer
> boat
> > for displacement cruising purposes.
>
> I think keeping it under 20 feet will greatly
> increase my chances of
> completing the boat and keep the financial situation
> in check.
> Someone (Jim Michalak maybe?) had some interesting
> thoughts on why
> they try to stick to designs 20ft or less, but I
> can't seem to find
> the link.
>
> The Bartenders I've seen have inboard wells for the
> outboards. I
> think the space trade-off isn't worth it for a 20
> foot or less
> boat. They also require more that 20hp.
>
> I like the Redwing 18 a lot. It is definitely one
> I'm considering.
>
>
>
>

> > suggestions?
>
> If it were me I would build a _Low Powered Outboard Cruiser_
> Bolger design #450.
>
> Though it might be a bit 'more' than you had in mind,
> it still looks to be cool and useful boat.

> Wow--the "salty, seaworthy Bartender." That is a
> blast from the past. I sure wanted to build one of
> those when I was a kid, a neat double-ender.
>
> Bolger's Bantam is a possiblility for a light cruiser
> in the range you are looking for. Chesapeake Design
> has the Redwing if you are looking for a more
> traditional boat. Why do you want to keep her under
> 20'? There are lots of advantages to a longer boat
> for displacement cruising purposes.

> Although they're designed to be planing boats that would require a
> more than 20 hp to reach their design potential, I think. But I

> the Skiff America 20.
>
> Howard
>

> There is the 20' Chebacco Boat. Seehttp://www.chebacco.com/

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David" <arbordg@y...> wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dudleypeterson" <dudpete@p...>
wrote:> Bartender line of boats. 19' -29'

> suggestions?

> That's one I've certainly had my eye on. All
> published reports are
> good. Or... for a boat capable of handling rougher
> water - the
> Bartender line of boats. 19' -29'
>
> Happy Hunting,
> David Graybeal
> Portland, OR.
>
> "All things in moderation, especially moderation"
>
>
>

> Have you considered the Skiff America 20? If interested in further
> study check out the following link:
>
>http://www.skiffamerica20.com/
>
> Dudley
>

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
> Thanks Ron S for the info about your boat and Nels for the AF4 info.
>
> The more I look, the more difficult the choices seem. Originally I
> was all hepped up about designing my own or altering plans (Micro
> Nav with no sails or AF4 with mini-pilothouse), but the more I
think
> about it, the more concerned I am about creating a monstrosity. If
> I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
> -20 ft. loa or less.
>
> -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
@
> 5-7 knots?
>
> -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> -reasonably easy and quick to build. So far my biggest woodworking
> projects are built-in bookcases and a 7 foot grandfather clock.
It's
> almost big enough to float in. :)
>
> Thanks everyone!

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ch_bunch" <ch_bunch@y...> wrote:
>
> I listed out what I'm thinking of, maybe others might have some
> suggestions for available stock plans or plans with simple mods?
>
> -20 ft. loa or less.
>
> -seaworthy enough to handle some rough stuff, but mostly river and
> ICW. I like to imagine doing a solo motor around the great loop.
> Would the AF4 be sturdy enough for this?
>
> -20 hp outboard. I'd prefer something smaller. Something with
> great mpg with just enough extra to keep me out of trouble. Cruise
@
> 5-7 knots?
>
> -some sort of hard shelter over the tiller plus a cuddy cabin.
>
> -reasonably easy and quick to build.