Becky Thatcher
I forgot,
follow-up on #669 is in Vol. 23, No. 18 , Feb.1/06, p.29ff.
follow-up on #669 is in Vol. 23, No. 18 , Feb.1/06, p.29ff.
Nels,
Do you remember if there were photos
in the MAIB mentioned?
-=Grant=-
Do you remember if there were photos
in the MAIB mentioned?
-=Grant=-
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@...> wrote:
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@> wrote:
> >
> > I was scratching my brain trying to figure out the geometry of the
> new
> > BEcky Thatcher paddle wheel in the latest PB&F article in MAIB, until
> > I discovered that the illustration is upside down!
> >
>
> Wow that does make it a lot clearer! I often have trouble
> understanding diagrams linked to text, so had given up on this one.
> Now it makes perfect sense:-) Neat solution for getting a strong
> reverse.
>
> I scanned the diagram and turned it right way up and was going to add
> it to the Becky Thatcher folder, but could not locate the folder.
> Seems to have disappeared of else is under some other label.
>
> Very frustrating trying to find anything in the files - but we have
> been down that road before...
>
> Nels
It is no doubt blasphemy, but it seems like a human powered houseboat is a vast complication over a small 4 stroke outboard which would provide much better performance economically...
JohnT
JohnT
----- Original Message -----
From: Stuart Crawford
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 9:29 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Becky Thatcher
I would appreciate an update if you do find that issue. It sounds like
similar speeds to rowing a dinghy, which I would consider impressive on a
boat of that size. and I do understand the issues involved with head winds.
I think Bolger says something like there is no future going into a head wind
in anything human powered.
Stuart.
On 5/2/08 7:18 AM, "jamesmaib" <jamesmaib@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi Stuart
> I am a new member to the group
> When I started my e-mail sub to MAIB early 2006 there was a 2 part
> article in the "Bolger on Design" section on Becky Thatcher. There was
> a very detailed description of a self feathering paddle wheel. My
> memory is a bit hazy but I seem to remember a 3 day trip in northern
> America which gave an average speed of 3-4 mph.Lots of pics of
> completed craft. As always with human power and a superstructure, there
> were problems with head winds. This seems to have been the same with
> the Escargot. (www.gruene-flotte.de) If I can find the disc with that
> issue I will update you
>
> Fair winds from Ireland
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I would appreciate an update if you do find that issue. It sounds like
similar speeds to rowing a dinghy, which I would consider impressive on a
boat of that size. and I do understand the issues involved with head winds.
I think Bolger says something like there is no future going into a head wind
in anything human powered.
Stuart.
similar speeds to rowing a dinghy, which I would consider impressive on a
boat of that size. and I do understand the issues involved with head winds.
I think Bolger says something like there is no future going into a head wind
in anything human powered.
Stuart.
On 5/2/08 7:18 AM, "jamesmaib" <jamesmaib@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi Stuart
> I am a new member to the group
> When I started my e-mail sub to MAIB early 2006 there was a 2 part
> article in the "Bolger on Design" section on Becky Thatcher. There was
> a very detailed description of a self feathering paddle wheel. My
> memory is a bit hazy but I seem to remember a 3 day trip in northern
> America which gave an average speed of 3-4 mph.Lots of pics of
> completed craft. As always with human power and a superstructure, there
> were problems with head winds. This seems to have been the same with
> the Escargot. (www.gruene-flotte.de) If I can find the disc with that
> issue I will update you
>
> Fair winds from Ireland
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hi Stuart
I am a new member to the group
When I started my e-mail sub to MAIB early 2006 there was a 2 part
article in the "Bolger on Design" section on Becky Thatcher. There was
a very detailed description of a self feathering paddle wheel. My
memory is a bit hazy but I seem to remember a 3 day trip in northern
America which gave an average speed of 3-4 mph.Lots of pics of
completed craft. As always with human power and a superstructure, there
were problems with head winds. This seems to have been the same with
the Escargot. (www.gruene-flotte.de) If I can find the disc with that
issue I will update you
Fair winds from Ireland
I am a new member to the group
When I started my e-mail sub to MAIB early 2006 there was a 2 part
article in the "Bolger on Design" section on Becky Thatcher. There was
a very detailed description of a self feathering paddle wheel. My
memory is a bit hazy but I seem to remember a 3 day trip in northern
America which gave an average speed of 3-4 mph.Lots of pics of
completed craft. As always with human power and a superstructure, there
were problems with head winds. This seems to have been the same with
the Escargot. (www.gruene-flotte.de) If I can find the disc with that
issue I will update you
Fair winds from Ireland
On 5/2/08 5:09 AM, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
camping boat for sheltered waters and lakes.
Your Paddlin¹ Madeline pictures look good. Fancy doing some of Becky
Thatcher and Sitka Explorer?
Stuart.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>Did you ever hear how well it went, as designed? It looks like a good
>
>
>
> I recall that Paul Everett, the person who commissioned the design,
> did finish her.
>
> Have you seen my isometric model of the Paddlin' Madeline?
>
>http://flickr.com/photos/hallman/1360743493/in/photostream/
>
camping boat for sheltered waters and lakes.
Your Paddlin¹ Madeline pictures look good. Fancy doing some of Becky
Thatcher and Sitka Explorer?
Stuart.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
On Feb 3, 2008 9:59 PM, Stuart Crawford <stuartcnz@...> wrote:
did finish her.
Have you seen my isometric model of the Paddlin' Madeline?
http://flickr.com/photos/hallman/1360743493/in/photostream/
>I recall that Paul Everett, the person who commissioned the design,
>
> Does any one know how well the human powered stern wheeler Becky Thatcher
> worked in
> practice?
>
> Are there any examples of one finished, on the internet?
>
> Stuart.
did finish her.
Have you seen my isometric model of the Paddlin' Madeline?
http://flickr.com/photos/hallman/1360743493/in/photostream/
Does any one know how well the human powered stern wheeler Becky Thatcher worked in
practice?
Are there any examples of one finished, on the internet?
Stuart.
practice?
Are there any examples of one finished, on the internet?
Stuart.
Pedal power through easy stages to the ring mines of Saturn! Has
another nautical writer tried that?
another nautical writer tried that?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@...> wrote:
>
> I have added >
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger_study_plans_only/files/
I have added an early write up on BT to the files at this location:
Would be fun to go cruising with another couple and backpacking gear.
Sometimes one couple might like to walk along the tow path as well, or
sleep ashore, but no need to carry a heavy pack or use the big boots.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger_study_plans_only/files/
Nels
Would be fun to go cruising with another couple and backpacking gear.
Sometimes one couple might like to walk along the tow path as well, or
sleep ashore, but no need to carry a heavy pack or use the big boots.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger_study_plans_only/files/
Nels
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "ravenouspi" <ravenous@...> wrote:
http://tinyurl.com/9ctme
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger_study_plans_only/files/
Nels
>File "Flipping Sternwheel" added to the Becky Thatcher Folder.
> Bolger_Study_Plans_Only
> Files
http://tinyurl.com/9ctme
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger_study_plans_only/files/
Nels
Bolger_Study_Plans_Only
Files
Files
> I scanned the diagram and turned it right way up and was going to add
> it to the Becky Thatcher folder, but could not locate the folder.
> Seems to have disappeared of else is under some other label.
>
> Very frustrating trying to find anything in the files - but we have
> been down that road before...
>
> Nels
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, sportofmtl@... wrote:
without any protroburances so you can glass it after the boat is
assembled, just ending the glass at the edge of the bottom. You could
do the sides and ends with fiberglass only on the plywood, inside the
external gunnel and chines. The external chines and gunnel could be
protected with just an epoxy coat, they won't check anyway much.
I've thought about using a Tortois for a dodger on my Santana 27, but
haven't done it.
Reed
>I've built 3 Tortoiseses (Torti?). The bottom is as slick as can be
> We intend to build Tortoise for use as a tender to our Sabre 28.
>
without any protroburances so you can glass it after the boat is
assembled, just ending the glass at the edge of the bottom. You could
do the sides and ends with fiberglass only on the plywood, inside the
external gunnel and chines. The external chines and gunnel could be
protected with just an epoxy coat, they won't check anyway much.
I've thought about using a Tortois for a dodger on my Santana 27, but
haven't done it.
Reed
If I'm not mistaken, I seem to recall I did this on a dinghy I
designed and built. It will stiffen the wood slightly, of course,
unless you bend it while the epoxy is still "green". If that's an
issue, then you might consider using the 3 ply stuff and putting the
grain on the outer layers across the boat. You would have to put a
splice in it this way, though. If you keep the glassed piece in a cool
place, for a short time, you might use that Florida sun to make it
easy to bend when it's time to apply it.You might want to glass the
inside after assembly as well, tho I'm not so sure. When you do that,
it gets a lot stiffer. I recall I needed to do that to get confidence
it would hold up well. Only favorable comments about the dinghy in
service. My design is probably a bit harder to build than the
Tortoise, but I bet it rows a lot better, and it might well fit your
spot. Now if only I could remember where I put the data....
(I'll bet someplace Bolger has a design of the same sort as mine but
much better. But I know mine is not bad. Keep your towing eye low on
whatever you make.)
Why am I being quixotic enough to suggest my dinghy design when the
transom will be removable? They all look very bad when full of water.
designed and built. It will stiffen the wood slightly, of course,
unless you bend it while the epoxy is still "green". If that's an
issue, then you might consider using the 3 ply stuff and putting the
grain on the outer layers across the boat. You would have to put a
splice in it this way, though. If you keep the glassed piece in a cool
place, for a short time, you might use that Florida sun to make it
easy to bend when it's time to apply it.You might want to glass the
inside after assembly as well, tho I'm not so sure. When you do that,
it gets a lot stiffer. I recall I needed to do that to get confidence
it would hold up well. Only favorable comments about the dinghy in
service. My design is probably a bit harder to build than the
Tortoise, but I bet it rows a lot better, and it might well fit your
spot. Now if only I could remember where I put the data....
(I'll bet someplace Bolger has a design of the same sort as mine but
much better. But I know mine is not bad. Keep your towing eye low on
whatever you make.)
Why am I being quixotic enough to suggest my dinghy design when the
transom will be removable? They all look very bad when full of water.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, sportofmtl@... wrote:
>
> We intend to build Tortoise for use as a tender to our Sabre 28.
The design's dimensions are such that it should fit neatly inverted on
the cabin top and, if built with a removeable stern transom, should
double as a hard dodger when not being towed...i.e. most of the time.
> This brings me to my question: Since the boat will spend most of
its time inverted in the Florida sun, we want to fiberglass the
exterior; probably with 4oz cloth & epoxy. The design calls for the
framing outside the hull, so can we fiberglass the 1/4" plywood before
we cut the parts and assemble the boat successfully? Will the
fiberglass/epoxy (especially the bottom) give when being bent into place?
> Tom Cason- sunny Central FL
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Hi Tom,
bottom) > give when being bent into place?
It's a fairly stiff curve, but I bet you could bend it into shape
with only 4 oz. cloth. You could always bend the bottom, perhaps
slightly oversized, over the assembled sides and glass it that way
before cutting it to final shape. Another option is to simply glass
it after assembly and mask off the chine logs and transom framing, or
glass them, too.
If it were me, I'd probably glass most of the panels after cutting
them out. It's a simple matter to trim the glass at the edges, and
you won't need to cover a whole sheet of plywood with epoxy and
glass. I think I would leave the bottom panel long by several inches
to give some room past the area to be glassed on each end. Then I'd
temporarily attach a stop to each of two sawhorses such that the
distance between the two sawhorses (and stops) could be adjusted
to "pinch" the bottom panel up into a curve that's close to the final
shape. A pair of 2x4's or similar clamped to the sawhorse legs would
keep them from springing away from other. Then glass away.
Note that the boat will be a very flimsy structure without the stern
transom. Perhaps you can work out a way to pivot the whole thing up
at the bow transom to avoid making the stern transom removable.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
> The design calls for the framing outside the hull, so can wethe > boat successfully? Will the fiberglass/epoxy (especially the
> fiberglass the 1/4" plywood before we cut the parts and assemble
bottom) > give when being bent into place?
It's a fairly stiff curve, but I bet you could bend it into shape
with only 4 oz. cloth. You could always bend the bottom, perhaps
slightly oversized, over the assembled sides and glass it that way
before cutting it to final shape. Another option is to simply glass
it after assembly and mask off the chine logs and transom framing, or
glass them, too.
If it were me, I'd probably glass most of the panels after cutting
them out. It's a simple matter to trim the glass at the edges, and
you won't need to cover a whole sheet of plywood with epoxy and
glass. I think I would leave the bottom panel long by several inches
to give some room past the area to be glassed on each end. Then I'd
temporarily attach a stop to each of two sawhorses such that the
distance between the two sawhorses (and stops) could be adjusted
to "pinch" the bottom panel up into a curve that's close to the final
shape. A pair of 2x4's or similar clamped to the sawhorse legs would
keep them from springing away from other. Then glass away.
Note that the boat will be a very flimsy structure without the stern
transom. Perhaps you can work out a way to pivot the whole thing up
at the bow transom to avoid making the stern transom removable.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
Tom, the bottom panel should still take the rocker
when preglassed. This would be made easier if the
bottom is pre-bent to the rough curve before glassing.
If you are building with the outside chines, however,
can't the bottom be glassed in place? That is the
easier way. I am thinking about using a stretched
Tortoise as a combination tender/awning myself. I
built one in the past, and sold it--it was a great
little boat. You are right to glass the fir ply--it
will check like mad, otherwise. Sam
---sportofmtl@...wrote:
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
when preglassed. This would be made easier if the
bottom is pre-bent to the rough curve before glassing.
If you are building with the outside chines, however,
can't the bottom be glassed in place? That is the
easier way. I am thinking about using a stretched
Tortoise as a combination tender/awning myself. I
built one in the past, and sold it--it was a great
little boat. You are right to glass the fir ply--it
will check like mad, otherwise. Sam
---sportofmtl@...wrote:
> We intend to build Tortoise for use as a tender to__________________________________________________
> our Sabre 28. The design's dimensions are such that
> it should fit neatly inverted on the cabin top and,
> if built with a removeable stern transom, should
> double as a hard dodger when not being towed...i.e.
> most of the time.
> This brings me to my question: Since the boat will
> spend most of its time inverted in the Florida sun,
> we want to fiberglass the exterior; probably with
> 4oz cloth & epoxy. The design calls for the framing
> outside the hull, so can we fiberglass the 1/4"
> plywood before we cut the parts and assemble the
> boat successfully? Will the fiberglass/epoxy
> (especially the bottom) give when being bent into
> place?
> Tom Cason- sunny Central FL
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
We intend to build Tortoise for use as a tender to our Sabre 28. The design's dimensions are such that it should fit neatly inverted on the cabin top and, if built with a removeable stern transom, should double as a hard dodger when not being towed...i.e. most of the time.
This brings me to my question: Since the boat will spend most of its time inverted in the Florida sun, we want to fiberglass the exterior; probably with 4oz cloth & epoxy. The design calls for the framing outside the hull, so can we fiberglass the 1/4" plywood before we cut the parts and assemble the boat successfully? Will the fiberglass/epoxy (especially the bottom) give when being bent into place?
Tom Cason- sunny Central FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This brings me to my question: Since the boat will spend most of its time inverted in the Florida sun, we want to fiberglass the exterior; probably with 4oz cloth & epoxy. The design calls for the framing outside the hull, so can we fiberglass the 1/4" plywood before we cut the parts and assemble the boat successfully? Will the fiberglass/epoxy (especially the bottom) give when being bent into place?
Tom Cason- sunny Central FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Very frustrating trying to find anything in the files - but we havePut it in Flickr, with a Bolger tag and finding it would then be easy.
> been down that road before...
The inadaquacy of the search functions in Yahoo are a shame,
both for the message archive and the files/photos.
...considering the spectatular improvements in searching abilities
in Google, Flickr, del.icio.us, and many more.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
understanding diagrams linked to text, so had given up on this one.
Now it makes perfect sense:-) Neat solution for getting a strong
reverse.
I scanned the diagram and turned it right way up and was going to add
it to the Becky Thatcher folder, but could not locate the folder.
Seems to have disappeared of else is under some other label.
Very frustrating trying to find anything in the files - but we have
been down that road before...
Nels
>new
> I was scratching my brain trying to figure out the geometry of the
> BEcky Thatcher paddle wheel in the latest PB&F article in MAIB, untilWow that does make it a lot clearer! I often have trouble
> I discovered that the illustration is upside down!
>
understanding diagrams linked to text, so had given up on this one.
Now it makes perfect sense:-) Neat solution for getting a strong
reverse.
I scanned the diagram and turned it right way up and was going to add
it to the Becky Thatcher folder, but could not locate the folder.
Seems to have disappeared of else is under some other label.
Very frustrating trying to find anything in the files - but we have
been down that road before...
Nels
I was scratching my brain trying to figure out the geometry of the new
BEcky Thatcher paddle wheel in the latest PB&F article in MAIB, until
I discovered that the illustration is upside down!
BEcky Thatcher paddle wheel in the latest PB&F article in MAIB, until
I discovered that the illustration is upside down!