[bolger] Into the deep blue
BO>I also wonder if the AS29 (it's in the real cruiser section, isn't
BO>it?) is up to the task. It doesn't look like a cheap boat, but it
BO>does look like a *lot* of boat for the money, and even more for the
BO>length.
BO>David Ryan
David,
THis question tackled during the explosions over christmas. See posts
from me, Chuck Merrell, PCB
Tim & FT2
BO>it?) is up to the task. It doesn't look like a cheap boat, but it
BO>does look like a *lot* of boat for the money, and even more for the
BO>length.
BO>David Ryan
David,
THis question tackled during the explosions over christmas. See posts
from me, Chuck Merrell, PCB
Tim & FT2
BO>For Carlos' and everone's benefit, has anyone tried any of the "cold"
BO>weather epoxies? some of these purport to cure at anything above 32
BO>degrees. Reports appreciated.
BO>Robert & Amy Lundy
As this product is unavailable in the US (only its imitators :-) this is
perhaps not a great deal of help -- however, BoteCote epoxy using its
fast hardener cures in a period of about a day with temperatures below
40F tho' not below the magic 32F (our little mountain is a cold hole in
winter). WEST system or system three must surely carry an equivalent.
Flip side is that it goes off in half an hour in the height of summer...
Tim & Flying Tadpole
BO>weather epoxies? some of these purport to cure at anything above 32
BO>degrees. Reports appreciated.
BO>Robert & Amy Lundy
As this product is unavailable in the US (only its imitators :-) this is
perhaps not a great deal of help -- however, BoteCote epoxy using its
fast hardener cures in a period of about a day with temperatures below
40F tho' not below the magic 32F (our little mountain is a cold hole in
winter). WEST system or system three must surely carry an equivalent.
Flip side is that it goes off in half an hour in the height of summer...
Tim & Flying Tadpole
>I got Buehler's book for Christmas (along with Parker's "New
>George Buehler's "Buehler's Backyard Boatbuilding" and build Hagar
>(plans in the book). I don't think there are that many such cheap and
>seaworthy designs around. Maybe the Seabird would do too, but it seems
>to me that Hagar is a tougher guy.
Cold-Molded..) and have been reading and re-reading them almost
nightly. I particularly like Beuhler's "Dragonfly," but at 50 feet,
that will do more to keep me ashore than take me to sea. Hagar
certainly seems like a viable option. I've got to figure out where I
can steal some keel timbers from.
>Also, the Serpentaire (22'Took a look at this boat
>plywood/epoxy sloop, plans from bateau.com) is a proven passagemaker,
(http://www.bateau.com/plans/sail/SP22_study.htm)Five panel stich
and glue. Sounds a lot like the bird, except the bird is bigger, has
a longer shallower keel, and a simpler rig. Bateau quotes $2500 -
$4000 for the hull and $2900 for the sails/spars. I suppose the
numbers would be similiar for the bird, but maybe the simpler rig
would leave money for an engine.
>and I think that Bruce Roberts' Spray 22 comes very close to it. AnotherIn talking about sailplan center of effort, Buehler dismisses
>sturdy little boat is Bruce Roberts' Tom Thumb (steel).
>The AS-29 is nice, but I don't think one would feel very safe in
>breaking seas due to the plumb sides... I do not know of other Bolger
>cheap blue water cruisers, but then I don't know all PCB's designs...
usefullness of the idea (relating to boats with wide asses,) as being
based on four assumptions that are rarely true for a boat one at a
time, let alone all four at once (sails sheeted a'mid ship, wind
directly abeam, boat not healed over, and one I can remember.)
Bolger consistently sites pounding at anchor as the major vice of his
flat bottomed, plum sided craft. Perhaps when they are out in the
shit, the topsides don't spend that much time straight up and down.
YIBB,
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
> >the
> >So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> >cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> >littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is gettingirresistible.
>******************
"Cheap" is defined by what you value. If your airplane is 'going
down', almost any price would seem "cheap" for a good parachute!
My vote for minimum boat to take on the Atlantic would be Bolger's COL.
H.G. HASLER, design #635. Steel hull, 20' LOA, 2'/5' draft, 8' beam,
6350# displacement, Bolger Chinese Gaffer. Sailed entirely from below
decks. Many, many unique features ensuring comfort and safety during
blue water stints.
Nice three-page writeup in Messing About In Boats....don't remember
issue number, try searchable MAIB index.
In the article, the Bolgers said, ".... the most capable 20-footer ever
conceived."
John
I know, I know, but if only these guys would listen they could arrive at
sixty with too little time, too little money, and too many boats, just like
us!
Don Hodges, in the Florida panhandle where it's suddenly Warm and Windy...
sixty with too little time, too little money, and too many boats, just like
us!
Don Hodges, in the Florida panhandle where it's suddenly Warm and Windy...
----- Original Message -----
From: Chuck Leinweber <chuck@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 1:28 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> Don:
>
> You're just a big wet blanket, aren't you ;-) What you have to understand
> is that David is still trying to hold on to the sweet bird of youth, while
> you and I have long kissed it goodbye. We have got wise and rational
about
> the best way to use what precious few years are left to us. He's still a
> little impetuous.
>
> David:
>
> The AS-39 is a proven Bolger ocean cruiser.
>
> Chuck Leinweber
> Duckworks Magazine
>http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Donald Hodges <dhodges@...>
> To: <bolger@egroups.com>
> Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 1:17 PM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
>
>
> > David,
> >
> > I admire your yearning to voyage, it can be a gratifying experience.
> >
> > That said, there is a lot of drudgerey and boredom involved too;
actually
> > crossing the ocean is pretty boring day to day. Finding a hospitable
port
> > of call and meeting others of like mind is more interesting.
> >
> > There is a LOT of enjoyment to be found on the North American littoral,
> > whether you cruise the whole thing on your own bottom or sample it in a
> > trailerable boat. My vote goes to the sampling approach...
> >
> > Don Hodges
> >dhodges@...
> >http://www.ecoastlife.com
> > Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
> > Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: David Ryan <david@...>
> > To: <bolger@egroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 8:47 PM
> > Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> >
> >
> > > So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> > > cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> > > the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
> > > irresistible.
> > >
> > > YIBB,
> > >
> > > David Ryan
> > > Minister of Information and Culture
> > > Crumbling Empire Productions
> > > (212) 247-0296
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! Rates as low as 2.9%
> > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points,
> > no hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the
> > credit you deserve! Apply now! Get your NextCard Visa at:
> >http://click.egroups.com/1/930/5/_/3457/_/950469442/
> >
> > -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> > --http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=bolger&m=1
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9%
> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/932/5/_/3457/_/950470441/
>
> -- Talk to your group with your own voice!
> --http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=bolger&m=1
>
>
>
David
David Ryan ha scritto:
Pippo
David Ryan ha scritto:
> I also wonder if the AS29 (it's in the real cruiser section, isn'tYes, it is in the real cruisers section...
> it?)
Pippo
Hi David
David Ryan ha scritto:
windsurf, with rowboats, etc, and that a world tour has been completed
with a 19' open boat (Dudley Dix design), a simple answer would be: buy
George Buehler's "Buehler's Backyard Boatbuilding" and build Hagar
(plans in the book). I don't think there are that many such cheap and
seaworthy designs around. Maybe the Seabird would do too, but it seems
to me that Hagar is a tougher guy. Also, the Serpentaire (22'
plywood/epoxy sloop, plans from bateau.com) is a proven passagemaker,
and I think that Bruce Roberts' Spray 22 comes very close to it. Another
sturdy little boat is Bruce Roberts' Tom Thumb (steel).
The AS-29 is nice, but I don't think one would feel very safe in
breaking seas due to the plumb sides... I do not know of other Bolger
cheap blue water cruisers, but then I don't know all PCB's designs...
Best, Pippo
David Ryan ha scritto:
> 1) The boat must be capable of make passage across the AtlanticWell, not considering the fact that the Atlantic has been crossed with a
> 2) The boat should be as inexpensive as possible.
> 3) If possible, I would like to build this boat myself.
windsurf, with rowboats, etc, and that a world tour has been completed
with a 19' open boat (Dudley Dix design), a simple answer would be: buy
George Buehler's "Buehler's Backyard Boatbuilding" and build Hagar
(plans in the book). I don't think there are that many such cheap and
seaworthy designs around. Maybe the Seabird would do too, but it seems
to me that Hagar is a tougher guy. Also, the Serpentaire (22'
plywood/epoxy sloop, plans from bateau.com) is a proven passagemaker,
and I think that Bruce Roberts' Spray 22 comes very close to it. Another
sturdy little boat is Bruce Roberts' Tom Thumb (steel).
The AS-29 is nice, but I don't think one would feel very safe in
breaking seas due to the plumb sides... I do not know of other Bolger
cheap blue water cruisers, but then I don't know all PCB's designs...
Best, Pippo
david ryan <davi-@...> wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2623
long, sailed aroung the world. Built in back of a fish and chips shop
in the 50's. Probably not the perfect design now, but maybe
instructive. I remember reading his book, Trekka aroung the World, many
years ago. Probably many instructive things, but I just don't remember
them. Oh yes, he was inspired by seeing Tilikum, but he didn't want to
use such a design himself.
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=2623
> >>So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewaterHas anyone mentioned John Guzzwell and his boat, Trekka? 20 1/2 feet
> >>cruiser (snip
> The design parameters (right now,) are:
>
> 1) The boat must be capable of make passage across the Atlantic snip
>
> 2) The boat should be as inexpensive as possible. snip
>
> 3) If possible, I would like to build this boat myself.snip
long, sailed aroung the world. Built in back of a fish and chips shop
in the 50's. Probably not the perfect design now, but maybe
instructive. I remember reading his book, Trekka aroung the World, many
years ago. Probably many instructive things, but I just don't remember
them. Oh yes, he was inspired by seeing Tilikum, but he didn't want to
use such a design himself.
>she's also big enough to prevent me from ever getting out of the boat
>
>The AS-39 is a proven Bolger ocean cruiser.
yard. anyone have an educated guess what she'd cost to build stout
but cheap?
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
>David,Oh good God, not cars! Nothing in my life has ever been easier when
>
>I admire your yearning to voyage, it can be a gratifying experience.
>
>That said, there is a lot of drudgerey and boredom involved too; actually
>crossing the ocean is pretty boring day to day. Finding a hospitable port
>of call and meeting others of like mind is more interesting.
>
>There is a LOT of enjoyment to be found on the North American littoral,
>whether you cruise the whole thing on your own bottom or sample it in a
>trailerable boat. My vote goes to the sampling approach...
it involved being dependant on my own automobile! As I have said
before, I am not an anticonsumptionista, but I am convinced that
automobiles, especially large ones are a false economy. I spend
$2,500 dollars last year running my '92 honda civic, and it's paid
for. I probably could have taken a taxi everywhere I wanted to go for
that price!
As for boredom, it turns out most of the thing I like (fishing,
surfing, climbing, working) are mostly boring most of time. Yet
somehow the total effect of any one of these activities is more
exciting/interesting than the description of the activity rates. I
hope that sailing the blue sea is the same and there's only one way
to find out...
YIBB,
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
Don:
You're just a big wet blanket, aren't you ;-) What you have to understand
is that David is still trying to hold on to the sweet bird of youth, while
you and I have long kissed it goodbye. We have got wise and rational about
the best way to use what precious few years are left to us. He's still a
little impetuous.
David:
The AS-39 is a proven Bolger ocean cruiser.
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
You're just a big wet blanket, aren't you ;-) What you have to understand
is that David is still trying to hold on to the sweet bird of youth, while
you and I have long kissed it goodbye. We have got wise and rational about
the best way to use what precious few years are left to us. He's still a
little impetuous.
David:
The AS-39 is a proven Bolger ocean cruiser.
Chuck Leinweber
Duckworks Magazine
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Donald Hodges <dhodges@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 1:17 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> David,
>
> I admire your yearning to voyage, it can be a gratifying experience.
>
> That said, there is a lot of drudgerey and boredom involved too; actually
> crossing the ocean is pretty boring day to day. Finding a hospitable port
> of call and meeting others of like mind is more interesting.
>
> There is a LOT of enjoyment to be found on the North American littoral,
> whether you cruise the whole thing on your own bottom or sample it in a
> trailerable boat. My vote goes to the sampling approach...
>
> Don Hodges
>dhodges@...
>http://www.ecoastlife.com
> Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
> Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Ryan <david@...>
> To: <bolger@egroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 8:47 PM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
>
>
> > So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> > cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> > the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
> > irresistible.
> >
> > YIBB,
> >
> > David Ryan
> > Minister of Information and Culture
> > Crumbling Empire Productions
> > (212) 247-0296
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! Rates as low as 2.9%
> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points,
> no hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the
> credit you deserve! Apply now! Get your NextCard Visa at:
>http://click.egroups.com/1/930/5/_/3457/_/950469442/
>
> -- Easily schedule meetings and events using the group calendar!
> --http://www.egroups.com/cal?listname=bolger&m=1
>
>
David,
I admire your yearning to voyage, it can be a gratifying experience.
That said, there is a lot of drudgerey and boredom involved too; actually
crossing the ocean is pretty boring day to day. Finding a hospitable port
of call and meeting others of like mind is more interesting.
There is a LOT of enjoyment to be found on the North American littoral,
whether you cruise the whole thing on your own bottom or sample it in a
trailerable boat. My vote goes to the sampling approach...
Don Hodges
dhodges@...
http://www.ecoastlife.com
Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
I admire your yearning to voyage, it can be a gratifying experience.
That said, there is a lot of drudgerey and boredom involved too; actually
crossing the ocean is pretty boring day to day. Finding a hospitable port
of call and meeting others of like mind is more interesting.
There is a LOT of enjoyment to be found on the North American littoral,
whether you cruise the whole thing on your own bottom or sample it in a
trailerable boat. My vote goes to the sampling approach...
Don Hodges
dhodges@...
http://www.ecoastlife.com
Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
----- Original Message -----
From: David Ryan <david@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 8:47 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
> irresistible.
>
> YIBB,
>
> David Ryan
> Minister of Information and Culture
> Crumbling Empire Productions
> (212) 247-0296
>
>>So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewaterAt this point, I feel as if I am willing to dispense with comfort,
>>cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
>>the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
>>irresistible.
>
>Let's see. You are looking at a displacement of at least 10,000 lbs
>in order to have sufficient carrying capacity. In addition some sort
>of hint about your itinerary would be helpful.
>
>Among Bolger boats, I think the most likely candidates are strip
>planked: Romp & Manatee (Different Boats), Volunteer (BWAOM).
>
>Tanton has a design 997, as 32' ply sloop for this market. It's a
>v-bottom boat, but I believe he thinks of it as a type of sharpie.
ease of re-sale, appearance, and anything else that might get in the
way of actually doing it!
The design parameters (right now,) are:
1) The boat must be capable of make passage across the Atlantic from
West to East of the latitude and time of year offering the greatest
chance of success/least risk of death. Yes, I know there are no
guarantees, and that an experience sailor could probably make it in a
Micro with s/he got lucky with the weather. I'd like a boat that
brings the passage above the level of a stunt.
2) The boat should be as inexpensive as possible. I'm sure there is a
graph of cost and safety somewhere. I'd like to be in the proper
quadrant. Again, I'm not interested in a stunt.
3) If possible, I would like to build this boat myself. The boat need
not be as simple as an "Instant Boat" or any of the instant boat
cousins, but any increased difficulty that does not lower cost or
increase safety has no place in the equation. In the end if the
choice is between buying someone's tupperware headache or not going
at all, I'll take the tupperware.
I seem to remember someone quoting Bolger about most sailing
accomplishments being over-rated. I suspect this is true. I don't
care!
YIBB,
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
David Ryan wrote:
snip
on the radio today.
snip
> > Celebrated by drinking a couple of beers and watching therebroadcast
> > of the "Floating Neutrinos." Totally inspiring!Any connection between the Floating and Flying Neutrinos? I heard them
> >
> >
on the radio today.
>Let's see. You are looking at a displacement of at least 10,000 lbs in
>So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
>cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in the
>littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting irresistible.
order to have sufficient carrying capacity. In addition some sort of hint
about your itinerary would be helpful.
Among Bolger boats, I think the most likely candidates are strip planked:
Romp & Manatee (Different Boats), Volunteer (BWAOM).
Tanton has a design 997, as 32' ply sloop for this market. It's a v-bottom
boat, but I believe he thinks of it as a type of sharpie.
Peter
>It's not a builder's answer, but the least expensive way is to make aThis crossed my mind too. Not nearly as appealing as making a passage
>lowball offer on one of the thousands of bluewater cruisers quietly molding
>away at every marina I have ever visited.
>
on a boat you built you self, but maybe the better option in the
"passage/no passage" equation.
I read and re-read the Seabird '86 chapter in BWAOM last night. My
standard formula for calculating cost is add up everything I can
think of then multiply by 4, but I haven't done this for the 'bird
yet.
I also wonder if the AS29 (it's in the real cruiser section, isn't
it?) is up to the task. It doesn't look like a cheap boat, but it
does look like a *lot* of boat for the money, and even more for the
length.
Real world experiences and anecdotes welcome on all counts.
YIBB,
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
I have to agree with Don. I have been a Bolger fan since I read his first
book. I have many of his plans and just about all of his books. But the
boat I sail today is exactly what Don suggested. I found a 1978 Columbia
10.7 (35') for $20,000. There is no way I could have built an equivalent
boat for the money. In addition, it had been let go long enough to reduce
the price. It needs enough work that it satisfies my need to "build"
things.
Paul W. Esterle
Capt'n Pauley Video Productions
423.989.3159
S/V Bryn Awel, Columbia 10.7
Bristol, Tenn. USA
http://www.captnpauley.bigstep.com
http://pages.preferred.com/~pesterle/
book. I have many of his plans and just about all of his books. But the
boat I sail today is exactly what Don suggested. I found a 1978 Columbia
10.7 (35') for $20,000. There is no way I could have built an equivalent
boat for the money. In addition, it had been let go long enough to reduce
the price. It needs enough work that it satisfies my need to "build"
things.
Paul W. Esterle
Capt'n Pauley Video Productions
423.989.3159
S/V Bryn Awel, Columbia 10.7
Bristol, Tenn. USA
http://www.captnpauley.bigstep.com
http://pages.preferred.com/~pesterle/
----- Original Message -----
From: Donald Hodges <dhodges@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2000 1:14 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> It's not a builder's answer, but the least expensive way is to make a
> lowball offer on one of the thousands of bluewater cruisers quietly
molding
> away at every marina I have ever visited.
>
> Don Hodges
>dhodges@...
>http://www.ecoastlife.com
> Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
> Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Ryan <david@...>
> To: <bolger@egroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 8:47 PM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
>
>
> > >Well, after seemingly four weeks of horrible flu, bad weather, honey-do
> and
> > >what not, I FINALLY got some building done on the Windsprint. The
other
> > >gunwale was layed on today and came out ok. Hoping to get the second
> course
> > >on both sides tomorrow. Its nice when Florida weather is finally
Florida
> > >weater again.
> >
> > got some work done on the LS Margaret Ellen today too! Hand-planed
> > one of the masts to a sort-of-round shape.
> >
> > Celebrated by drinking a couple of beers and watching the rebroadcast
> > of the "Floating Neutrinos." Totally inspiring!
> >
> > So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> > cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> > the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
> > irresistible.
> >
> > YIBB,
> >
> > David Ryan
> > Minister of Information and Culture
> > Crumbling Empire Productions
> > (212) 247-0296
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > GET A NEXTCARD VISA, in 30 seconds! Get rates as low as 2.9%
> > Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR and no hidden fees. Apply NOW!
> >http://click.egroups.com/1/932/5/_/3457/_/950409963/
> >
> > eGroups.com Home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/
> >http://www.egroups.com- Simplifying group communications
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! Rates as low as 2.9%
> Intro or 9.9% Fixed APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points,
> no hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the
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> -- Create a poll/survey for your group!
> --http://www.egroups.com/vote?listname=bolger&m=1
>
>
It's not a builder's answer, but the least expensive way is to make a
lowball offer on one of the thousands of bluewater cruisers quietly molding
away at every marina I have ever visited.
Don Hodges
dhodges@...
http://www.ecoastlife.com
Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
lowball offer on one of the thousands of bluewater cruisers quietly molding
away at every marina I have ever visited.
Don Hodges
dhodges@...
http://www.ecoastlife.com
Your Cyber-Vacation - Loafing on the Emerald Coast
Small Boats, Building, Fishing, Paddling, Rowing, Sailing
----- Original Message -----
From: David Ryan <david@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 8:47 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
> >Well, after seemingly four weeks of horrible flu, bad weather, honey-do
and
> >what not, I FINALLY got some building done on the Windsprint. The other
> >gunwale was layed on today and came out ok. Hoping to get the second
course
> >on both sides tomorrow. Its nice when Florida weather is finally Florida
> >weater again.
>
> got some work done on the LS Margaret Ellen today too! Hand-planed
> one of the masts to a sort-of-round shape.
>
> Celebrated by drinking a couple of beers and watching the rebroadcast
> of the "Floating Neutrinos." Totally inspiring!
>
> So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
> cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
> the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
> irresistible.
>
> YIBB,
>
> David Ryan
> Minister of Information and Culture
> Crumbling Empire Productions
> (212) 247-0296
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>Well, after seemingly four weeks of horrible flu, bad weather, honey-do andgot some work done on the LS Margaret Ellen today too! Hand-planed
>what not, I FINALLY got some building done on the Windsprint. The other
>gunwale was layed on today and came out ok. Hoping to get the second course
>on both sides tomorrow. Its nice when Florida weather is finally Florida
>weater again.
one of the masts to a sort-of-round shape.
Celebrated by drinking a couple of beers and watching the rebroadcast
of the "Floating Neutrinos." Totally inspiring!
So what's the cheapest way for a fellow to put together a bluewater
cruiser (short of "Son of Town Hall II) I've spent my whole life in
the littoral zone, but the lure of the deep blue sea is getting
irresistible.
YIBB,
David Ryan
Minister of Information and Culture
Crumbling Empire Productions
(212) 247-0296
Well, after seemingly four weeks of horrible flu, bad weather, honey-do and
what not, I FINALLY got some building done on the Windsprint. The other
gunwale was layed on today and came out ok. Hoping to get the second course
on both sides tomorrow. Its nice when Florida weather is finally Florida
weater again.
Robert, on the warm shores of Tampa Bay.....
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
what not, I FINALLY got some building done on the Windsprint. The other
gunwale was layed on today and came out ok. Hoping to get the second course
on both sides tomorrow. Its nice when Florida weather is finally Florida
weater again.
Robert, on the warm shores of Tampa Bay.....
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
tjfatche-@...wrote:
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=1606
Chesapeake Light Craft will be happy to answer questions about MAS'
low-temperature epoxy. I forget what it's called - Cold Cure or
something equivalent.
CLC sells more MAS than anyone else, for what it's worth, they excel at
customer service, and it is hard to beat their MAS epoxy prices.
Sign me -- satisfied MAS epoxy buyer.
original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=1606
>"cold"
> BO>For Carlos' and everone's benefit, has anyone tried any of the
> BO>weather epoxies? some of these purport to cure at anything above32
> BO>degrees. Reports appreciated.Just FYI for all --
>
Chesapeake Light Craft will be happy to answer questions about MAS'
low-temperature epoxy. I forget what it's called - Cold Cure or
something equivalent.
CLC sells more MAS than anyone else, for what it's worth, they excel at
customer service, and it is hard to beat their MAS epoxy prices.
Sign me -- satisfied MAS epoxy buyer.
Carlos:
It has been my experience (limited to West System products, mostly, but
chemistry is chemistry) that epoxy will set and cure, eventually. Either you
have to raise the ambient temperature in the workshop artificially or you have
to wait for Springtime to do it naturally. I discovered this during the three
year construction of a 22' Benford Gunkholer in a poorly heated, poorly
insulated shop in the Catskill Mountains. Winter temps outside were about -10 to
30 F (-24 to -1 C), and inside temps were seldom above 40 F (5 C). None the
less, the epoxy all went off, although it sometimes took weeks and the resulting
amine blush was like snow on a mountain. The construction delays were great
opportunities to hunker down by the fire and hibernate (vegetate?),
david
Carlos Byars wrote:
It has been my experience (limited to West System products, mostly, but
chemistry is chemistry) that epoxy will set and cure, eventually. Either you
have to raise the ambient temperature in the workshop artificially or you have
to wait for Springtime to do it naturally. I discovered this during the three
year construction of a 22' Benford Gunkholer in a poorly heated, poorly
insulated shop in the Catskill Mountains. Winter temps outside were about -10 to
30 F (-24 to -1 C), and inside temps were seldom above 40 F (5 C). None the
less, the epoxy all went off, although it sometimes took weeks and the resulting
amine blush was like snow on a mountain. The construction delays were great
opportunities to hunker down by the fire and hibernate (vegetate?),
david
Carlos Byars wrote:
> I hope you arranged for a temperature high enough, or used a fast hardner. I
> used slow setting stuff that 6 weeks later is still is not cured. Since I
> can't scrape it off, I'm trashing those sheets and starting over. With
> another epoxy, to be sure. Far as I can tell, epoxy work is strictly a
> summer-time occupation.
> ______________________________________________________
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> FreeLotto.com is the only internet site to offer three free chances
> a day to win $1,000,000.00. We've already had two $1,000,000.00
> jackpot winners and thousands of other cash prizes. You could be
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>http://click.egroups.com/1/445/5/_/3457/_/947516283/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> --http://www.egroups.com/docvault/bolger/?m=1
Living in florida has advantages. Especially when it comes to epoxy. At
the same time, the cure time for the stem/sternpost has been about twice as
long as for the other work I did in warmer weather, with only about a 15
degree (72 degrees vs 87 degrees) difference in daily highs.
For Carlos' and everone's benefit, has anyone tried any of the "cold"
weather epoxies? some of these purport to cure at anything above 32
degrees. Reports appreciated.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
the same time, the cure time for the stem/sternpost has been about twice as
long as for the other work I did in warmer weather, with only about a 15
degree (72 degrees vs 87 degrees) difference in daily highs.
For Carlos' and everone's benefit, has anyone tried any of the "cold"
weather epoxies? some of these purport to cure at anything above 32
degrees. Reports appreciated.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Carlos Byars [mailto:c_byars@...]
> Sent: January 10, 2000 9:58 AM
> To:bolger@egroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Windsprint Progress
>
>
> I hope you arranged for a temperature high enough, or used a fast
> hardner. I
> used slow setting stuff that 6 weeks later is still is not cured. Since I
> can't scrape it off, I'm trashing those sheets and starting over. With
> another epoxy, to be sure. Far as I can tell, epoxy work is strictly a
> summer-time occupation.
> ______________________________________________________
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> FreeLotto.com is the only internet site to offer three free chances
> a day to win $1,000,000.00. We've already had two $1,000,000.00
> jackpot winners and thousands of other cash prizes. You could be
> a $1,000,000.00 winner tonight!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/445/5/_/3457/_/947516283/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> --http://www.egroups.com/docvault/bolger/?m=1
>
>
>
You can apply it in cold weather, but you need to use the proper hardener and/or
heat the work.
I've put Raka on with fast hardener, and two days later it was still soft. The
instructions say "must be 50 degrees for 12 hours". I turned the heat up in the
shop overnight and all was well.
Carlos Byars wrote:
heat the work.
I've put Raka on with fast hardener, and two days later it was still soft. The
instructions say "must be 50 degrees for 12 hours". I turned the heat up in the
shop overnight and all was well.
Carlos Byars wrote:
> I hope you arranged for a temperature high enough, or used a fast hardner. I
> used slow setting stuff that 6 weeks later is still is not cured. Since I
> can't scrape it off, I'm trashing those sheets and starting over. With
> another epoxy, to be sure. Far as I can tell, epoxy work is strictly a
> summer-time occupation.
> ______________________________________________________
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> FreeLotto.com is the only internet site to offer three free chances
>
> a day to win $1,000,000.00. We've already had two $1,000,000.00
>
> jackpot winners and thousands of other cash prizes. You could be
>
> a $1,000,000.00 winner tonight!
>http://click.egroups.com/1/445/5/_/3457/_/947516283/
>
> -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault
> --http://www.egroups.com/docvault/bolger/?m=1
I hope you arranged for a temperature high enough, or used a fast hardner. I
used slow setting stuff that 6 weeks later is still is not cured. Since I
can't scrape it off, I'm trashing those sheets and starting over. With
another epoxy, to be sure. Far as I can tell, epoxy work is strictly a
summer-time occupation.
______________________________________________________
used slow setting stuff that 6 weeks later is still is not cured. Since I
can't scrape it off, I'm trashing those sheets and starting over. With
another epoxy, to be sure. Far as I can tell, epoxy work is strictly a
summer-time occupation.
______________________________________________________
Finally decided not to wait any longer on a "perfect" day/night combination
for epoxy work. We've had perfect weather (77/55) for boating, but I'm gun
shy about letting epoxy set up overnight in my unheated/uninsulated garage
without a guarrantee of 65 degrees or higher. To make sure everything stays
warm, I bought one of those ceramic element heaters from Lowes for $39.
I've used one of these (borrowed) before to spend winter nights on board in
a marina when I had my Catalina 27 and was impressed with their design and
heat output. The one I bought today even ocillates, like a fan. Its set on
low, the garage is nice and toasty and the epoxy can cure.
Finally put a skim coat on all the areas that were still showing weave
pattern (mostly along the edge grain of the bottom) and put glass
cloth/epoxy over the stem/sternpost. Other than one more small job, this is
it for the glass work, the rest is just epoxy coating inside and out.
Working on a non-horizontal surface (even a small one) was significantly
harder than doing the bottom. I tried my "thumbtack" method of getting the
glass flattened and held in place, saturated 50% of it with epoxy, then
pulled the tacks and finsihed the rest. Worked ok. Tomorrow, hopefully,
I'll flip the boat and start on the triple laminated gunwales.
On an "ain't that grand" note, a guy on rec.boats.building recently posted
that he had plans for a "Penguin Class" racing dinghy that dated to the
early 50s that he didn't want. I picked them up for $10, just to look at
and maybe even frame if they look nice. The Penguin was apparently designed
by Phillip Rhodes back in the 40s and are still actively raced along the
east cost and in chicago.
Nice to see that Tennessee/Houston avenged that miserable loss in Buffalo in
1992 in fine fashion.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
for epoxy work. We've had perfect weather (77/55) for boating, but I'm gun
shy about letting epoxy set up overnight in my unheated/uninsulated garage
without a guarrantee of 65 degrees or higher. To make sure everything stays
warm, I bought one of those ceramic element heaters from Lowes for $39.
I've used one of these (borrowed) before to spend winter nights on board in
a marina when I had my Catalina 27 and was impressed with their design and
heat output. The one I bought today even ocillates, like a fan. Its set on
low, the garage is nice and toasty and the epoxy can cure.
Finally put a skim coat on all the areas that were still showing weave
pattern (mostly along the edge grain of the bottom) and put glass
cloth/epoxy over the stem/sternpost. Other than one more small job, this is
it for the glass work, the rest is just epoxy coating inside and out.
Working on a non-horizontal surface (even a small one) was significantly
harder than doing the bottom. I tried my "thumbtack" method of getting the
glass flattened and held in place, saturated 50% of it with epoxy, then
pulled the tacks and finsihed the rest. Worked ok. Tomorrow, hopefully,
I'll flip the boat and start on the triple laminated gunwales.
On an "ain't that grand" note, a guy on rec.boats.building recently posted
that he had plans for a "Penguin Class" racing dinghy that dated to the
early 50s that he didn't want. I picked them up for $10, just to look at
and maybe even frame if they look nice. The Penguin was apparently designed
by Phillip Rhodes back in the 40s and are still actively raced along the
east cost and in chicago.
Nice to see that Tennessee/Houston avenged that miserable loss in Buffalo in
1992 in fine fashion.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg, fla.
robert@...
amy@...
Well, with Hurricane Irene missing us in Tampa Bay, I was able to get some
building time in this weekend.
All three temporary molds are now complete. I want to thank whoever
advocated sawing just close to the line and then taking it down with a belt
sander. My underpowered belt sander is just right for this and it worked
great. also means I can use the jigsaw, instead of the hated circular saw.
Am quite envious of Leander with his new left blade saw.
I had previously put one coat of epoxy on the outside of the seams of one
side (this was my first try with epoxy, have never worked with it before).
On the other side, I put down a four inch slice of 6 oz cloth and saturated.
Worked pretty well. The only thing I screwed up was using wax paper again
(I know, stupid twice) and putting a big paverblock on it, without a smoothe
pice of wood under the paver. You see the paver had some strategically
placed small clumps of something on it which caused facinating designs in
the epoxy/cloth. Never expected to escape fairing anyway. All-in-all a
good experience.
Managed to cut out the mast step and outline some other parts. Spent some
time washing the amine blush off the places I've epoxied so far. Used Mr.
Clean at 30/70 and a stiff brush. Everything is squeaky, instead of slick,
which is what it's supposed to be right?Other than a few minor items, I'm
ready to try to make a boat shape, hopefully next weekend.
Will be finding the polyethelene sheeting at home depot post haste. I've
stuck wax paper to Weldwood glue and now epoxy. Egad.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg,Fla.
building time in this weekend.
All three temporary molds are now complete. I want to thank whoever
advocated sawing just close to the line and then taking it down with a belt
sander. My underpowered belt sander is just right for this and it worked
great. also means I can use the jigsaw, instead of the hated circular saw.
Am quite envious of Leander with his new left blade saw.
I had previously put one coat of epoxy on the outside of the seams of one
side (this was my first try with epoxy, have never worked with it before).
On the other side, I put down a four inch slice of 6 oz cloth and saturated.
Worked pretty well. The only thing I screwed up was using wax paper again
(I know, stupid twice) and putting a big paverblock on it, without a smoothe
pice of wood under the paver. You see the paver had some strategically
placed small clumps of something on it which caused facinating designs in
the epoxy/cloth. Never expected to escape fairing anyway. All-in-all a
good experience.
Managed to cut out the mast step and outline some other parts. Spent some
time washing the amine blush off the places I've epoxied so far. Used Mr.
Clean at 30/70 and a stiff brush. Everything is squeaky, instead of slick,
which is what it's supposed to be right?Other than a few minor items, I'm
ready to try to make a boat shape, hopefully next weekend.
Will be finding the polyethelene sheeting at home depot post haste. I've
stuck wax paper to Weldwood glue and now epoxy. Egad.
Robert & Amy Lundy
St. Petersburg,Fla.