Re: [bolger] Towing with little cars, was General Questions re: Bolger's "Surf"
The one thing that has only been touched on here. With
a small bore motor they don't like to be lugged at
all. They make their power at high RPM. So to keep
them from over heating, keep them spun up so they can
make the power needed. In short down shift as soon as
the RPMs start to fall off on the hills.
I have towed with a 64 VW Baja Bug and 74 VW Bus and
they did the job asked of them. My 79 Toyota 4x4 does
all I ask of it and then some and it's a 2.3L motor.
You also have to learn to plan well ahead of yourself
all the time you are moving. Enjoy the time you have
when you can.
Blessings Krissie
---timbo@...wrote:
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a small bore motor they don't like to be lugged at
all. They make their power at high RPM. So to keep
them from over heating, keep them spun up so they can
make the power needed. In short down shift as soon as
the RPMs start to fall off on the hills.
I have towed with a 64 VW Baja Bug and 74 VW Bus and
they did the job asked of them. My 79 Toyota 4x4 does
all I ask of it and then some and it's a 2.3L motor.
You also have to learn to plan well ahead of yourself
all the time you are moving. Enjoy the time you have
when you can.
Blessings Krissie
---timbo@...wrote:
> I certainly wouldn't portray my old Geo as the____________________________________________________________________________________
> ultimate towing machine.
> And I purposefully purchased my powerboat because it
> is exactly the right
> size to hold my kids and still be reasonably towed
> with my car.
>
> Certainly the larger the vehicle, the less it is
> affected by the weight of
> the trailer.
>
> What I hoped to accomplish was to provide an example
> of what is doable,
> not what is optimal. The original poster is
> wondering if he can budget
> for a $250 trailer, and I'm guessing he can't
> entertain purchasing a
> different vehicle just to tow his boat for 10
> weekends in the summer. Is
> his Passat capable of safely and occasionally towing
> and launching any
> unballasted sailboat under 20 feet without
> destroying his drivetrain?
> Almost certainly.
>
> You are right, hills exacerbate the wear and tear
> that towing puts on a
> car, and I've certainly got no plans to pull my
> powerboat through the
> Rockies, but I'd be confident pulling it a couple
> hundred miles on a
> weekend excursion.
>
> Sometimes it seems that this whole "trailering"
> thing gets portrayed as
> some big scary deal, and it doesn't need to be.
>
> Tim
>
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with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
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I certainly wouldn't portray my old Geo as the ultimate towing machine.
And I purposefully purchased my powerboat because it is exactly the right
size to hold my kids and still be reasonably towed with my car.
Certainly the larger the vehicle, the less it is affected by the weight of
the trailer.
What I hoped to accomplish was to provide an example of what is doable,
not what is optimal. The original poster is wondering if he can budget
for a $250 trailer, and I'm guessing he can't entertain purchasing a
different vehicle just to tow his boat for 10 weekends in the summer. Is
his Passat capable of safely and occasionally towing and launching any
unballasted sailboat under 20 feet without destroying his drivetrain?
Almost certainly.
You are right, hills exacerbate the wear and tear that towing puts on a
car, and I've certainly got no plans to pull my powerboat through the
Rockies, but I'd be confident pulling it a couple hundred miles on a
weekend excursion.
Sometimes it seems that this whole "trailering" thing gets portrayed as
some big scary deal, and it doesn't need to be.
Tim
And I purposefully purchased my powerboat because it is exactly the right
size to hold my kids and still be reasonably towed with my car.
Certainly the larger the vehicle, the less it is affected by the weight of
the trailer.
What I hoped to accomplish was to provide an example of what is doable,
not what is optimal. The original poster is wondering if he can budget
for a $250 trailer, and I'm guessing he can't entertain purchasing a
different vehicle just to tow his boat for 10 weekends in the summer. Is
his Passat capable of safely and occasionally towing and launching any
unballasted sailboat under 20 feet without destroying his drivetrain?
Almost certainly.
You are right, hills exacerbate the wear and tear that towing puts on a
car, and I've certainly got no plans to pull my powerboat through the
Rockies, but I'd be confident pulling it a couple hundred miles on a
weekend excursion.
Sometimes it seems that this whole "trailering" thing gets portrayed as
some big scary deal, and it doesn't need to be.
Tim
> Towing with little cars is possible (I've towed a Dovekie several hundred
> miles with a VW Golf diesel). There are a couple of things to watch for.
> Aside from the length of the rig and different turning radius, Most people
> will immediately note that acceleration is way down. What may not be
> immediately apparent is that braking is degraded and that stopping
> distances are much longer. Plan ahead, slow down gradually, and allow
> lots of room.
>
> While small cars do reasonably well towing on flat ground, hills intoduce
> a lot of complications. Speed up long hills will decrease and the engine
> may overheat.
>
> The major weakness of small cars is not the motor, but rather the
> transmission and CVC joints. These components are not normally designed
> for the loads imposed by towing, particularly up hills. A transmission
> cooler will help some.
>
> There are any number of used, rear wheel drive cars and trucks on the
> market which, with a little work will provide decent towing capabilites;
> this might be a better way to go.
>
> JohnT
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:timbo@...
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 11:01 AM
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Towing with little cars, was General Questions re:
> Bolger's "Surf"
>
>
> Tow Vehicle: 1994 Geo Prizm, 262000 miles on 1.8 Litre engine
> w/automatic
> trans
> Boats I pull with this car:
> * 1974 Silverline 15 ft Trihull w/ 70 HP Johnson (~1000 lbs + trailer)
> * Bolger Light Schooner on 4x8 trailer with long tounge. (~450 lbs +
> trailer)
>
> Attached is a pic of the powerboat on the trailer at the lake.
>
> This little car pulls and launches these boats with no problems. No,
> it's
> not fast. Yes, it takes longer to stop. Yes, it's safe. I run somewhere
> from 50 to 70 mph with the air on. I live near the texas coast, so hills
> are not part of the equation. The automatic makes it easy to pull the
> boat out.
>
> General tips to make towing less of an ordeal for your car.
>
> 1. Don't floor it all the time
> 2. With automatics, try to back off the throttle when the transmission
> is
> ready to shift, it reduces shock loads on the drivetrain.
> 3. With manuals, shift later than normal to keep rpms up. Higher rpms
> with less throttle are better than lower rpms with the pedal to the
> floor.
> 4. Watch your temperature gauge, be ready to slow down and turn off the
> a/c
> 5. Give lots of distance between you and the car in front of you.
> 6. Remember that you're at least twice as long when the trailers
> attached.
> 7. Try to anticipate stoplights. If you can keep it rolling a little by
> the time it turns green, it's that much less stress you put on the car.
> 8. Don't use overdrive much, because the low rpms at highway speeds put
> larger stresses on bearings and rods. (I do use overdrive occasionally
> on
> flat or slight downhill grades)
>
> Todays cars are amazingly well engineered, and small boats are not heavy
> loads as trailers go. Don't be afraid, it's not nearly the big deal it
> can be made out to be.
>
> Check your owner's manual, of course.
> Tim
> >
> > A lot of new cars are not recommended for trailering and to do so
> > would void any warranty. Most probably the engine, tranny, and brakes
> > are up to it but it is an easy way for the manufacturer to avoid
> > responsibilty / liability.
> > If there is no warranty remaining I'd say there is not many, if any
> > cars on the road that cannot occasionally tow a trailer with GVW less
> > than 1000 lbs to 1500 lbs to the nearest lakes/rivers.
> >
> > I'd probably not consider a wooden trailer....
> >
> > JG
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
> >>
> >> For both the boat trailers I have used for my Windsprint, I have
> > had to
> >> add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the
> > bottom
> >> near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
> >> square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to
> > stiffen
> >> it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the
> > cross
> >> bar.
> >>
> >> I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on
> > Yahoo:
> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
> >>
> >> Patrick
> >>
> >> Chris Curtis wrote:
> >> > I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com.
> > They
> >> > have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised
> > to
> >> > find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
> >> >
> >> > At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
> >> > showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and
> > they
> >> > gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a
> > 4X8'
> >> > frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and
> > 1300lbs.
> >> > It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the
> > number
> >> > differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the
> > manual, or
> >> > the fender cover.
> >> >
> >> > I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use
> > it
> >> > for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe
> > be
> >> > added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get
> > to
> >> > assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
> >> > depending on how much I choose to do.
> >> >
> >> > The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did
> > find
> >> > two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
> >> > welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line
> > with
> >> > the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working
> > items I
> >> > needed at no cost in about 10 days.
> >> >
> >> > I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also
> > assemble.
> >> > I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other
> > tasks. My
> >> > boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make
> > wooden "guides" to
> >> > keep the boat straight on the trailer.
> >> >
> >> > Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS
> > authorities
> >> > giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
> >> > engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of
> > hassle.
> >> >
> >> > Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if
> > you
> >> > desire!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Chris Curtis
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> Thanks, Patrick.
> >> >>
> >> >> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West
> > Marine.
> >> >> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> >> >> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried
> > looking
> >> >> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> >> >> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat
> > up to
> >> >> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about
> > the
> >> >> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World"
> > with
> >> >> this cost?)
> >> >>
> >> >> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> >> >> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in
> > a
> >> >> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> >> >> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> >> >> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> >> >> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the
> > southern
> >> >> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure.
> > It
> >> >> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the
> > existing
> >> >> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the
> > boat.
> >> >> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's
> > not
> >> >> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer
> > (it's
> >> >> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> >> >> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> >> >> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize
> > that
> >> >> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat
> > that
> >> >> can hold a family of four.
> >> >>
> >> >> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of
> > building my
> >> >> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> >> >> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm
> > buying
> >> >> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> >> >> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks again!
> >> >> FB
> >> >>
> >> >> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@>
> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
> >> >>>
> >> >> trailer. It
> >> >>
> >> >>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
> >> >>>
> >> >> serious
> >> >>
> >> >>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville
> > station
> >> >>>
> >> >> wagon
> >> >>
> >> >>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The
> > wind
> >> >>>
> >> >> from
> >> >>
> >> >>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off
> > the
> >> >>>
> >> >> road.
> >> >>
> >> >>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
> >> >>>
> >> >> concerns
> >> >>
> >> >>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit
> > from
> >> >>>
> >> >> West
> >> >>
> >> >>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the
> > boat.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Patrick
> >> >>>
> >> >>> marylandbeukers wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible
> > cramped
> >> >>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
> >> >>>>
> >> >> our
> >> >>
> >> >>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
> >> >>>>
> >> >> your
> >> >>
> >> >>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
> >> >>>>
> >> >> Windsprint
> >> >>
> >> >>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm
> > trying
> >> >>>>
> >> >> to
> >> >>
> >> >>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
> >> >>>>
> >> >> onto
> >> >>
> >> >>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
> >> >>>>
> >> >> to
> >> >>
> >> >>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW
> > Passat
> >> >>>> wagon.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
> >> >>>>
> >> >> work
> >> >>
> >> >>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
> >> >>>>
> >> >> Surf?
> >> >>
> >> >>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and -
> > possibly -
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
> >> >>>>
> >> >> will
> >> >>
> >> >>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Any thoughts?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Bolger rules!!!
> >> > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> >> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
> > flogging dead horses
> >> > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
> > posts
> >> > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> >> > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> > 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> >> > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >> > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
> >subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
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>
>
>
>
>
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>
I'll add my 2cents worth.....
I regularly carry, (in the wet season, rather than the hard season)
my canoe and a kayak on the roof of my old diesel VW Rabbit One or
even two boats are really not a problem. The canoe weighs about 45
lbs and the kayak about 55 lbs. The kayak is more difficult not so
much due to its extra weight but the longer length makes it a little
awkward. I am fairly fit and have good upper body strength. I'd not
recommend loading a boat more than 100 lbs on to the roof of a
vehicle, nor a boat much greater than 16 feet, by yourself. With
reliable help you can load something a little bigger.
A canoe or kayak or small rowing boat are about it. Anything bigger
and you should have a trailer as part of the plan.
The thing to remember is that the harder it is to use your boat, in
this case taking it to and from the water, the less you will us it.
Unless your partner is as enthusiastic about the whole trip as you
are, making her (an assumption here, appologies to the women in this
group)help heft the boat around will not endear her to it.
Also....
If you are looking for a boat to do water and picnic stuff with a
family...do not go too small. I am a great fan of rowing boats, which
do carry a bigger load than the abovementioned boats don't try to go
to small. You might carry the young and the better half in a boat on
a calm day, but you all need to be comfortable when there is a wind
and chop in the late afternoon when you leave the beach. Do a little
calculation of your expected loads.
Two adults ........say 75kg/170lbs each
Kids???............say 50kg/110Lb each
Dog
Picnic gear
Your boat must carry easily 600 to 800 lbs, and still have a margin
of safety.
Don't try to go the short cut, and don't try to go bigger than you
can manage. Analyse your needs carefully and choose a design that
meets the needs. Do not try to match your needs to the design you
think you want.
I'll say it again....There is no better way to give the gift of LIFE
to your kids than to share your passion with them...But they should
see the joy first, not the trials and tribulations.
JG
- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Allan Pickman <alpickman@...> wrote:
my Nissan Sentra.
been replaced by something much bigger and faster (a Thistle).
good investment. Yes, it took a (long) weekend to put together, as
well as a sheet of plywood. It has put up with a variety of abuse
without complaint, other than the fact that tail-lights and marker
lights are made of plastic, and tend to break when backed into
something harder. I built a boat cradle for the sunfish that fit
into the stake pockets, and rigged a hoist so that the boat, cradle
and all could be hoisted up to the rafters of the barn.
towing the same boat on a trailer. While the trailer adds a few
hundred pounds to the gross weight, the boat on a trailer adds much
less to the wind resistance than the same boat on the roof of the
car. I live in the hills of New Hampshire, and getting to the lake
requires more hill climbing that highway cruising. I haven't owned a
car with an engine larger than a 1.8 liter four in almost 30 years.
As I approach the age of 60, I will never consider cartopping
anything bigger than kayak or canoe.
the rack, remove the rack etc. and then reverse the sequence on the
next nice Saturday.
the transom to throw off the balance. Adaptation is a piece of cake
for a flat bottomed boat, a little bit of a job for a V bottomed
boat, and a challange for a round bottomed boat. If you can build
the boat, you should be able to figure out how to build a cradle for
it.
I regularly carry, (in the wet season, rather than the hard season)
my canoe and a kayak on the roof of my old diesel VW Rabbit One or
even two boats are really not a problem. The canoe weighs about 45
lbs and the kayak about 55 lbs. The kayak is more difficult not so
much due to its extra weight but the longer length makes it a little
awkward. I am fairly fit and have good upper body strength. I'd not
recommend loading a boat more than 100 lbs on to the roof of a
vehicle, nor a boat much greater than 16 feet, by yourself. With
reliable help you can load something a little bigger.
A canoe or kayak or small rowing boat are about it. Anything bigger
and you should have a trailer as part of the plan.
The thing to remember is that the harder it is to use your boat, in
this case taking it to and from the water, the less you will us it.
Unless your partner is as enthusiastic about the whole trip as you
are, making her (an assumption here, appologies to the women in this
group)help heft the boat around will not endear her to it.
Also....
If you are looking for a boat to do water and picnic stuff with a
family...do not go too small. I am a great fan of rowing boats, which
do carry a bigger load than the abovementioned boats don't try to go
to small. You might carry the young and the better half in a boat on
a calm day, but you all need to be comfortable when there is a wind
and chop in the late afternoon when you leave the beach. Do a little
calculation of your expected loads.
Two adults ........say 75kg/170lbs each
Kids???............say 50kg/110Lb each
Dog
Picnic gear
Your boat must carry easily 600 to 800 lbs, and still have a margin
of safety.
Don't try to go the short cut, and don't try to go bigger than you
can manage. Analyse your needs carefully and choose a design that
meets the needs. Do not try to match your needs to the design you
think you want.
I'll say it again....There is no better way to give the gift of LIFE
to your kids than to share your passion with them...But they should
see the joy first, not the trials and tribulations.
JG
- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Allan Pickman <alpickman@...> wrote:
>when I got tired of single handed cartopping a Sunfish on the roof of
> I bought a Harbor Freight 4x8 utility trailer about 5 years ago
my Nissan Sentra.
>case of going faster than the car in front of it, and the Sunfish has
> It's still in regular use, although the Sentra died of a terminal
been replaced by something much bigger and faster (a Thistle).
>trash, cordwood and manure as well as a boat, and I consider it a
> The trailer came with 8" tires, has been subjected to hauling
good investment. Yes, it took a (long) weekend to put together, as
well as a sheet of plywood. It has put up with a variety of abuse
without complaint, other than the fact that tail-lights and marker
lights are made of plastic, and tend to break when backed into
something harder. I built a boat cradle for the sunfish that fit
into the stake pockets, and rigged a hoist so that the boat, cradle
and all could be hoisted up to the rafters of the barn.
>plopping a boat on the roof of, would be probably be just as happy
> The truth of the matter is that any car that you could consider
towing the same boat on a trailer. While the trailer adds a few
hundred pounds to the gross weight, the boat on a trailer adds much
less to the wind resistance than the same boat on the roof of the
car. I live in the hills of New Hampshire, and getting to the lake
requires more hill climbing that highway cruising. I haven't owned a
car with an engine larger than a 1.8 liter four in almost 30 years.
As I approach the age of 60, I will never consider cartopping
anything bigger than kayak or canoe.
>unhitch the trailer and dry the sails, rather than lift the boat off
> An added advantage is that when you get home, all you have to do is
the rack, remove the rack etc. and then reverse the sequence on the
next nice Saturday.
>modification for a boat up to 14' or 15' long (assuming no engine on
> The 4 x 8 trailer has a 3' or so tongue, so can be used without
the transom to throw off the balance. Adaptation is a piece of cake
for a flat bottomed boat, a little bit of a job for a V bottomed
boat, and a challange for a round bottomed boat. If you can build
the boat, you should be able to figure out how to build a cradle for
it.
>
> Allan
> in the hills
>
I bought a Harbor Freight 4x8 utility trailer about 5 years ago when I got tired of single handed cartopping a Sunfish on the roof of my Nissan Sentra.
It's still in regular use, although the Sentra died of a terminal case of going faster than the car in front of it, and the Sunfish has been replaced by something much bigger and faster (a Thistle).
The trailer came with 8" tires, has been subjected to hauling trash, cordwood and manure as well as a boat, and I consider it a good investment. Yes, it took a (long) weekend to put together, as well as a sheet of plywood. It has put up with a variety of abuse without complaint, other than the fact that tail-lights and marker lights are made of plastic, and tend to break when backed into something harder. I built a boat cradle for the sunfish that fit into the stake pockets, and rigged a hoist so that the boat, cradle and all could be hoisted up to the rafters of the barn.
The truth of the matter is that any car that you could consider plopping a boat on the roof of, would be probably be just as happy towing the same boat on a trailer. While the trailer adds a few hundred pounds to the gross weight, the boat on a trailer adds much less to the wind resistance than the same boat on the roof of the car. I live in the hills of New Hampshire, and getting to the lake requires more hill climbing that highway cruising. I haven't owned a car with an engine larger than a 1.8 liter four in almost 30 years. As I approach the age of 60, I will never consider cartopping anything bigger than kayak or canoe.
An added advantage is that when you get home, all you have to do is unhitch the trailer and dry the sails, rather than lift the boat off the rack, remove the rack etc. and then reverse the sequence on the next nice Saturday.
The 4 x 8 trailer has a 3' or so tongue, so can be used without modification for a boat up to 14' or 15' long (assuming no engine on the transom to throw off the balance. Adaptation is a piece of cake for a flat bottomed boat, a little bit of a job for a V bottomed boat, and a challange for a round bottomed boat. If you can build the boat, you should be able to figure out how to build a cradle for it.
Allan
in the hills
It's still in regular use, although the Sentra died of a terminal case of going faster than the car in front of it, and the Sunfish has been replaced by something much bigger and faster (a Thistle).
The trailer came with 8" tires, has been subjected to hauling trash, cordwood and manure as well as a boat, and I consider it a good investment. Yes, it took a (long) weekend to put together, as well as a sheet of plywood. It has put up with a variety of abuse without complaint, other than the fact that tail-lights and marker lights are made of plastic, and tend to break when backed into something harder. I built a boat cradle for the sunfish that fit into the stake pockets, and rigged a hoist so that the boat, cradle and all could be hoisted up to the rafters of the barn.
The truth of the matter is that any car that you could consider plopping a boat on the roof of, would be probably be just as happy towing the same boat on a trailer. While the trailer adds a few hundred pounds to the gross weight, the boat on a trailer adds much less to the wind resistance than the same boat on the roof of the car. I live in the hills of New Hampshire, and getting to the lake requires more hill climbing that highway cruising. I haven't owned a car with an engine larger than a 1.8 liter four in almost 30 years. As I approach the age of 60, I will never consider cartopping anything bigger than kayak or canoe.
An added advantage is that when you get home, all you have to do is unhitch the trailer and dry the sails, rather than lift the boat off the rack, remove the rack etc. and then reverse the sequence on the next nice Saturday.
The 4 x 8 trailer has a 3' or so tongue, so can be used without modification for a boat up to 14' or 15' long (assuming no engine on the transom to throw off the balance. Adaptation is a piece of cake for a flat bottomed boat, a little bit of a job for a V bottomed boat, and a challange for a round bottomed boat. If you can build the boat, you should be able to figure out how to build a cradle for it.
Allan
in the hills
Hi,
I have just completed a "surf" and did cartop it briefly. I bought a
"goalpost" car rack which goes into the trailer hitch of the car.
This way, I can hang the majority of the boat's weight off the back of
the car, and the boat puts minimal weight on the car's roof rack. The
boat did wobble back and forth quite a bit around corners, but I
really wanted to avoid using a trailer. Once the snow melts and I get
out on the water, I'll let you know how the trailering is going. I
have posted several pictures and an account of building my surf on the
Instantboats website: www.instantboats.com. Search the message board
for my post on the Surf. I did deck over the fore and aft
compartments, and think that the flotation will be a nice safety
feature. Also, it adds to the rigidity and overall strength of the
hull.
-Trevor
I have just completed a "surf" and did cartop it briefly. I bought a
"goalpost" car rack which goes into the trailer hitch of the car.
This way, I can hang the majority of the boat's weight off the back of
the car, and the boat puts minimal weight on the car's roof rack. The
boat did wobble back and forth quite a bit around corners, but I
really wanted to avoid using a trailer. Once the snow melts and I get
out on the water, I'll let you know how the trailering is going. I
have posted several pictures and an account of building my surf on the
Instantboats website: www.instantboats.com. Search the message board
for my post on the Surf. I did deck over the fore and aft
compartments, and think that the flotation will be a nice safety
feature. Also, it adds to the rigidity and overall strength of the
hull.
-Trevor
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "martha2001au" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
>
> Hi FB,-
> Theoretically you could cartop Surf but it would take a lot of
> planning - it is a long boat and relatively heavy. Also If you want
> to take it sailing the mast would be wobbling around a fair bit on
> the roof racks - a small boat trailer or adapted box trailer would
> be easier in my opinion.
> I agree that the floatation chambers are a good idea - if I get
> swamped bailing isn't always possible in a chop and its easier to
> just row or sail to shore and tip the water out - she goes almost as
> well. With her limited freeboard if I was a long way from shore I
> would always be nervous wihout the added bouyancy, especially with
> passengers on board. Agreed, they do cut down on her passenger
> space, but my kids love sitting on the front and rear tanks when I'm
> rowing, it doesn't seem to upset her sideways balance at all.
> By the way, has anyone seen the pictures of Zephyr that used to be
> on the net? I think they belonged to a German guy, haven't been
> able to find them for a while. If anyone has a link with some pics
> that would be great, thought I might build Surfs big sister
>
> cheers,
> Col
>
> -- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@> wrote:
> >
> > My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the it
> is
> > sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore
> and
> > aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will
> hold
> > your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave
> out
> > the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat
> is
> > very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15
> knot
> > winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as a
> > drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your
> needs
> > with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are
> also
> > open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in
> > Bolger 6 in the photo section.
> > Loy
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of
> Bolger's "Surf"
> > > design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able?
> Would you
> > > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four
> (incl. two
> > > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely
> have to
> > > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them
> for
> > > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would
> be
> > > helpful.
> > >
> > > Thanks much!
> > > FB
> > >
> >
>
Towing with little cars is possible (I've towed a Dovekie several hundred miles with a VW Golf diesel). There are a couple of things to watch for. Aside from the length of the rig and different turning radius, Most people will immediately note that acceleration is way down. What may not be immediately apparent is that braking is degraded and that stopping distances are much longer. Plan ahead, slow down gradually, and allow lots of room.
While small cars do reasonably well towing on flat ground, hills intoduce a lot of complications. Speed up long hills will decrease and the engine may overheat.
The major weakness of small cars is not the motor, but rather the transmission and CVC joints. These components are not normally designed for the loads imposed by towing, particularly up hills. A transmission cooler will help some.
There are any number of used, rear wheel drive cars and trucks on the market which, with a little work will provide decent towing capabilites; this might be a better way to go.
JohnT
While small cars do reasonably well towing on flat ground, hills intoduce a lot of complications. Speed up long hills will decrease and the engine may overheat.
The major weakness of small cars is not the motor, but rather the transmission and CVC joints. These components are not normally designed for the loads imposed by towing, particularly up hills. A transmission cooler will help some.
There are any number of used, rear wheel drive cars and trucks on the market which, with a little work will provide decent towing capabilites; this might be a better way to go.
JohnT
----- Original Message -----
From:timbo@...
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 11:01 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Towing with little cars, was General Questions re: Bolger's "Surf"
Tow Vehicle: 1994 Geo Prizm, 262000 miles on 1.8 Litre engine w/automatic
trans
Boats I pull with this car:
* 1974 Silverline 15 ft Trihull w/ 70 HP Johnson (~1000 lbs + trailer)
* Bolger Light Schooner on 4x8 trailer with long tounge. (~450 lbs + trailer)
Attached is a pic of the powerboat on the trailer at the lake.
This little car pulls and launches these boats with no problems. No, it's
not fast. Yes, it takes longer to stop. Yes, it's safe. I run somewhere
from 50 to 70 mph with the air on. I live near the texas coast, so hills
are not part of the equation. The automatic makes it easy to pull the
boat out.
General tips to make towing less of an ordeal for your car.
1. Don't floor it all the time
2. With automatics, try to back off the throttle when the transmission is
ready to shift, it reduces shock loads on the drivetrain.
3. With manuals, shift later than normal to keep rpms up. Higher rpms
with less throttle are better than lower rpms with the pedal to the floor.
4. Watch your temperature gauge, be ready to slow down and turn off the a/c
5. Give lots of distance between you and the car in front of you.
6. Remember that you're at least twice as long when the trailers attached.
7. Try to anticipate stoplights. If you can keep it rolling a little by
the time it turns green, it's that much less stress you put on the car.
8. Don't use overdrive much, because the low rpms at highway speeds put
larger stresses on bearings and rods. (I do use overdrive occasionally on
flat or slight downhill grades)
Todays cars are amazingly well engineered, and small boats are not heavy
loads as trailers go. Don't be afraid, it's not nearly the big deal it
can be made out to be.
Check your owner's manual, of course.
Tim
>
> A lot of new cars are not recommended for trailering and to do so
> would void any warranty. Most probably the engine, tranny, and brakes
> are up to it but it is an easy way for the manufacturer to avoid
> responsibilty / liability.
> If there is no warranty remaining I'd say there is not many, if any
> cars on the road that cannot occasionally tow a trailer with GVW less
> than 1000 lbs to 1500 lbs to the nearest lakes/rivers.
>
> I'd probably not consider a wooden trailer....
>
> JG
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>>
>> For both the boat trailers I have used for my Windsprint, I have
> had to
>> add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the
> bottom
>> near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
>> square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to
> stiffen
>> it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the
> cross
>> bar.
>>
>> I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on
> Yahoo:
>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>> Chris Curtis wrote:
>> > I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com.
> They
>> > have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised
> to
>> > find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
>> >
>> > At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
>> > showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and
> they
>> > gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a
> 4X8'
>> > frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and
> 1300lbs.
>> > It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the
> number
>> > differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the
> manual, or
>> > the fender cover.
>> >
>> > I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use
> it
>> > for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe
> be
>> > added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get
> to
>> > assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
>> > depending on how much I choose to do.
>> >
>> > The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did
> find
>> > two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
>> > welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line
> with
>> > the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working
> items I
>> > needed at no cost in about 10 days.
>> >
>> > I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also
> assemble.
>> > I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other
> tasks. My
>> > boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make
> wooden "guides" to
>> > keep the boat straight on the trailer.
>> >
>> > Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS
> authorities
>> > giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
>> > engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of
> hassle.
>> >
>> > Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if
> you
>> > desire!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Chris Curtis
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >> Thanks, Patrick.
>> >>
>> >> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West
> Marine.
>> >> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
>> >> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried
> looking
>> >> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
>> >> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat
> up to
>> >> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about
> the
>> >> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World"
> with
>> >> this cost?)
>> >>
>> >> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
>> >> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in
> a
>> >> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
>> >> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
>> >> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
>> >> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the
> southern
>> >> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure.
> It
>> >> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the
> existing
>> >> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the
> boat.
>> >> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's
> not
>> >> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer
> (it's
>> >> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
>> >> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
>> >> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize
> that
>> >> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat
> that
>> >> can hold a family of four.
>> >>
>> >> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of
> building my
>> >> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
>> >> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm
> buying
>> >> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
>> >> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks again!
>> >> FB
>> >>
>> >> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@>
> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
>> >>>
>> >> trailer. It
>> >>
>> >>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
>> >>>
>> >> serious
>> >>
>> >>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville
> station
>> >>>
>> >> wagon
>> >>
>> >>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The
> wind
>> >>>
>> >> from
>> >>
>> >>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off
> the
>> >>>
>> >> road.
>> >>
>> >>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
>> >>>
>> >> concerns
>> >>
>> >>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit
> from
>> >>>
>> >> West
>> >>
>> >>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the
> boat.
>> >>>
>> >>> Patrick
>> >>>
>> >>> marylandbeukers wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible
> cramped
>> >>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
>> >>>>
>> >> our
>> >>
>> >>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
>> >>>>
>> >> your
>> >>
>> >>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
>> >>>>
>> >> Windsprint
>> >>
>> >>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm
> trying
>> >>>>
>> >> to
>> >>
>> >>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
>> >>>>
>> >> onto
>> >>
>> >>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
>> >>>>
>> >> to
>> >>
>> >>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW
> Passat
>> >>>> wagon.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
>> >>>>
>> >> work
>> >>
>> >>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
>> >>>>
>> >> Surf?
>> >>
>> >>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and -
> possibly -
>> >>>>
>> >>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
>> >>>>
>> >> will
>> >>
>> >>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Any thoughts?
>> >>>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Bolger rules!!!
>> > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
>> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
> flogging dead horses
>> > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
> posts
>> > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
>> > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>> > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>> > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
>subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Just my 2 cents here. It won't apply to all cases. In my case, every boat decision I made for years was to accommodate 4, myself, my wife, my step son, and potentially a friend for said step son, the friend part being per Mom. He never invited a friend and since he was about 13, now 16, he's been apparently determined to set some sort of record for bad attitude, loser behaviour. After several episodes of extreme emotional drama making him go boating with us, and then him making a major ass of himself on the water, I quit inviting him. I'm now glad that I never got around to a boat that was "very roomy" for 4, which Mom wanted, because it would have been a waste of resources versus what the 2 of us now value in boating. Kids change emotionally as well as physically and even the good ones don't all enjoy boating.
----- Original Message -----
From: John Bell
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: General Questions re: Bolger's "Surf"
A couple of things:
1) trailers are a heck of a lot easier to pull and park than you think,
particularly with small light boats. Even the big ones aren't so hard to
deal with either. I've got a 13'er that I trailer and a 27'er that I
sometimes trailer. The principles of pulling each are the same.
2) as for getting a hitch on a Passat, it's really no problem either.
You can have a very nice class II receiver hitch installed with wiring
for lights for less than $200. I've put hitches on a lot of cars over
the last few years and I've never regretted having it done right.
3) Windsprint (I built one, BTW), Surf, and Zephyr are all very small
boats. IMO they are too small for a family of four. Kids get bigger
fast. I had an 18' power sharpie that seemed huge when I was building
it. After two years the kids doubled in size and it was too small for
everyone to go out together. Any boat you get for four people will
almost certainly be a trailer boat, so you might as well accept it.
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
A couple of things:
1) trailers are a heck of a lot easier to pull and park than you think,
particularly with small light boats. Even the big ones aren't so hard to
deal with either. I've got a 13'er that I trailer and a 27'er that I
sometimes trailer. The principles of pulling each are the same.
2) as for getting a hitch on a Passat, it's really no problem either.
You can have a very nice class II receiver hitch installed with wiring
for lights for less than $200. I've put hitches on a lot of cars over
the last few years and I've never regretted having it done right.
3) Windsprint (I built one, BTW), Surf, and Zephyr are all very small
boats. IMO they are too small for a family of four. Kids get bigger
fast. I had an 18' power sharpie that seemed huge when I was building
it. After two years the kids doubled in size and it was too small for
everyone to go out together. Any boat you get for four people will
almost certainly be a trailer boat, so you might as well accept it.
marylandbeukers wrote:
1) trailers are a heck of a lot easier to pull and park than you think,
particularly with small light boats. Even the big ones aren't so hard to
deal with either. I've got a 13'er that I trailer and a 27'er that I
sometimes trailer. The principles of pulling each are the same.
2) as for getting a hitch on a Passat, it's really no problem either.
You can have a very nice class II receiver hitch installed with wiring
for lights for less than $200. I've put hitches on a lot of cars over
the last few years and I've never regretted having it done right.
3) Windsprint (I built one, BTW), Surf, and Zephyr are all very small
boats. IMO they are too small for a family of four. Kids get bigger
fast. I had an 18' power sharpie that seemed huge when I was building
it. After two years the kids doubled in size and it was too small for
everyone to go out together. Any boat you get for four people will
almost certainly be a trailer boat, so you might as well accept it.
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
Tow Vehicle: 1994 Geo Prizm, 262000 miles on 1.8 Litre engine w/automatic
trans
Boats I pull with this car:
* 1974 Silverline 15 ft Trihull w/ 70 HP Johnson (~1000 lbs + trailer)
* Bolger Light Schooner on 4x8 trailer with long tounge. (~450 lbs + trailer)
Attached is a pic of the powerboat on the trailer at the lake.
This little car pulls and launches these boats with no problems. No, it's
not fast. Yes, it takes longer to stop. Yes, it's safe. I run somewhere
from 50 to 70 mph with the air on. I live near the texas coast, so hills
are not part of the equation. The automatic makes it easy to pull the
boat out.
General tips to make towing less of an ordeal for your car.
1. Don't floor it all the time
2. With automatics, try to back off the throttle when the transmission is
ready to shift, it reduces shock loads on the drivetrain.
3. With manuals, shift later than normal to keep rpms up. Higher rpms
with less throttle are better than lower rpms with the pedal to the floor.
4. Watch your temperature gauge, be ready to slow down and turn off the a/c
5. Give lots of distance between you and the car in front of you.
6. Remember that you're at least twice as long when the trailers attached.
7. Try to anticipate stoplights. If you can keep it rolling a little by
the time it turns green, it's that much less stress you put on the car.
8. Don't use overdrive much, because the low rpms at highway speeds put
larger stresses on bearings and rods. (I do use overdrive occasionally on
flat or slight downhill grades)
Todays cars are amazingly well engineered, and small boats are not heavy
loads as trailers go. Don't be afraid, it's not nearly the big deal it
can be made out to be.
Check your owner's manual, of course.
Tim
trans
Boats I pull with this car:
* 1974 Silverline 15 ft Trihull w/ 70 HP Johnson (~1000 lbs + trailer)
* Bolger Light Schooner on 4x8 trailer with long tounge. (~450 lbs + trailer)
Attached is a pic of the powerboat on the trailer at the lake.
This little car pulls and launches these boats with no problems. No, it's
not fast. Yes, it takes longer to stop. Yes, it's safe. I run somewhere
from 50 to 70 mph with the air on. I live near the texas coast, so hills
are not part of the equation. The automatic makes it easy to pull the
boat out.
General tips to make towing less of an ordeal for your car.
1. Don't floor it all the time
2. With automatics, try to back off the throttle when the transmission is
ready to shift, it reduces shock loads on the drivetrain.
3. With manuals, shift later than normal to keep rpms up. Higher rpms
with less throttle are better than lower rpms with the pedal to the floor.
4. Watch your temperature gauge, be ready to slow down and turn off the a/c
5. Give lots of distance between you and the car in front of you.
6. Remember that you're at least twice as long when the trailers attached.
7. Try to anticipate stoplights. If you can keep it rolling a little by
the time it turns green, it's that much less stress you put on the car.
8. Don't use overdrive much, because the low rpms at highway speeds put
larger stresses on bearings and rods. (I do use overdrive occasionally on
flat or slight downhill grades)
Todays cars are amazingly well engineered, and small boats are not heavy
loads as trailers go. Don't be afraid, it's not nearly the big deal it
can be made out to be.
Check your owner's manual, of course.
Tim
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> A lot of new cars are not recommended for trailering and to do so
> would void any warranty. Most probably the engine, tranny, and brakes
> are up to it but it is an easy way for the manufacturer to avoid
> responsibilty / liability.
> If there is no warranty remaining I'd say there is not many, if any
> cars on the road that cannot occasionally tow a trailer with GVW less
> than 1000 lbs to 1500 lbs to the nearest lakes/rivers.
>
> I'd probably not consider a wooden trailer....
>
> JG
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>>
>> For both the boat trailers I have used for my Windsprint, I have
> had to
>> add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the
> bottom
>> near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
>> square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to
> stiffen
>> it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the
> cross
>> bar.
>>
>> I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on
> Yahoo:
>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>> Chris Curtis wrote:
>> > I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com.
> They
>> > have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised
> to
>> > find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
>> >
>> > At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
>> > showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and
> they
>> > gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a
> 4X8'
>> > frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and
> 1300lbs.
>> > It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the
> number
>> > differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the
> manual, or
>> > the fender cover.
>> >
>> > I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use
> it
>> > for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe
> be
>> > added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get
> to
>> > assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
>> > depending on how much I choose to do.
>> >
>> > The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did
> find
>> > two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
>> > welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line
> with
>> > the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working
> items I
>> > needed at no cost in about 10 days.
>> >
>> > I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also
> assemble.
>> > I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other
> tasks. My
>> > boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make
> wooden "guides" to
>> > keep the boat straight on the trailer.
>> >
>> > Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS
> authorities
>> > giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
>> > engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of
> hassle.
>> >
>> > Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if
> you
>> > desire!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Chris Curtis
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >> Thanks, Patrick.
>> >>
>> >> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West
> Marine.
>> >> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
>> >> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried
> looking
>> >> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
>> >> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat
> up to
>> >> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about
> the
>> >> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World"
> with
>> >> this cost?)
>> >>
>> >> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
>> >> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in
> a
>> >> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
>> >> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
>> >> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
>> >> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the
> southern
>> >> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure.
> It
>> >> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the
> existing
>> >> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the
> boat.
>> >> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's
> not
>> >> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer
> (it's
>> >> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
>> >> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
>> >> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize
> that
>> >> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat
> that
>> >> can hold a family of four.
>> >>
>> >> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of
> building my
>> >> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
>> >> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm
> buying
>> >> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
>> >> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks again!
>> >> FB
>> >>
>> >> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@>
> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
>> >>>
>> >> trailer. It
>> >>
>> >>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
>> >>>
>> >> serious
>> >>
>> >>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville
> station
>> >>>
>> >> wagon
>> >>
>> >>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The
> wind
>> >>>
>> >> from
>> >>
>> >>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off
> the
>> >>>
>> >> road.
>> >>
>> >>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
>> >>>
>> >> concerns
>> >>
>> >>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit
> from
>> >>>
>> >> West
>> >>
>> >>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the
> boat.
>> >>>
>> >>> Patrick
>> >>>
>> >>> marylandbeukers wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible
> cramped
>> >>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
>> >>>>
>> >> our
>> >>
>> >>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
>> >>>>
>> >> your
>> >>
>> >>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
>> >>>>
>> >> Windsprint
>> >>
>> >>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm
> trying
>> >>>>
>> >> to
>> >>
>> >>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
>> >>>>
>> >> onto
>> >>
>> >>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
>> >>>>
>> >> to
>> >>
>> >>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW
> Passat
>> >>>> wagon.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
>> >>>>
>> >> work
>> >>
>> >>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
>> >>>>
>> >> Surf?
>> >>
>> >>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and -
> possibly -
>> >>>>
>> >>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
>> >>>>
>> >> will
>> >>
>> >>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Any thoughts?
>> >>>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Bolger rules!!!
>> > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
>> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
> flogging dead horses
>> > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
> posts
>> > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
>> > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
>> > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>> > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
>subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
Have you seen this pic in Duckworks of a family of four in a JUNE
BUG?
http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger4/photos/view/ae10?b=1
OK, looks a little low in the water to sail, but you might take
turns after motoring to a beach picnic first?
There's many pics around of car topped JUNE BUGs too. I just can't
think exactly where at the moment, but probably in messabout photos,
particularly those in Jim Michalak's newsletter. I recall pics of
Phil Lea's famous modified one, SHOESTRING, atop a car at a
messabout. Phil's boat was slightly enlarged. He gives details here
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/message/7?l=1, elsewhere, and
in some Duckworks articles. Apparently SHOESTRING turned out to be a
very fast sailer.
Tom Jones wrote that if you're going to have a sailing double ender
then it had best be square at both ends, which reminds me of the
many car topped BRICKs. BRICK could fit four (I believe the saying
is they're all adults and with a large dog too), but I think a cut
down and stretched one, as per the instructions for a stretched
PUDDLE DUCK RACER might really be a solution for capacity plus
cartoppability plus all-four-aboard-fun calm river sailing.
Graeme
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
> But I now realize that desire is in conflict with the my otherdesire to have a boat that can hold a family of four. FB
Have you seen this pic in Duckworks of a family of four in a JUNE
BUG?
http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger4/photos/view/ae10?b=1
OK, looks a little low in the water to sail, but you might take
turns after motoring to a beach picnic first?
There's many pics around of car topped JUNE BUGs too. I just can't
think exactly where at the moment, but probably in messabout photos,
particularly those in Jim Michalak's newsletter. I recall pics of
Phil Lea's famous modified one, SHOESTRING, atop a car at a
messabout. Phil's boat was slightly enlarged. He gives details here
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/message/7?l=1, elsewhere, and
in some Duckworks articles. Apparently SHOESTRING turned out to be a
very fast sailer.
Tom Jones wrote that if you're going to have a sailing double ender
then it had best be square at both ends, which reminds me of the
many car topped BRICKs. BRICK could fit four (I believe the saying
is they're all adults and with a large dog too), but I think a cut
down and stretched one, as per the instructions for a stretched
PUDDLE DUCK RACER might really be a solution for capacity plus
cartoppability plus all-four-aboard-fun calm river sailing.
Graeme
Guess I'm out of date. Clyde
Clyde Wisner wrote:
Clyde Wisner wrote:
> Check Northern ydrolics, or maybe it just Northern in Google. I believe[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> you can get a trailer ffor about $150. Clyde
>
> marylandbeukers wrote:
>
> > Thanks, Patrick.
> >
> > I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> > Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> > accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> > on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> > assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> > 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> > same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> > this cost?)
> >
> > Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> > the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> > trailer -
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
Check Northern ydrolics, or maybe it just Northern in Google. I believe
you can get a trailer ffor about $150. Clyde
marylandbeukers wrote:
you can get a trailer ffor about $150. Clyde
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer -
>
>
>
>If anyone has a linkhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/databasequery=Zephyr&submit=Search&
method=reportRows&tbl=6
http://tinyurl.com/33kkrb
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "martha2001au" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
> By the way, has anyone seen the pictures of Zephyr that used to be
> on the net? I think they belonged to a German guy, haven't been
> able to find them for a while. If anyone has a link with some pics
> that would be great, thought I might build Surfs big sister
A lot of new cars are not recommended for trailering and to do so
would void any warranty. Most probably the engine, tranny, and brakes
are up to it but it is an easy way for the manufacturer to avoid
responsibilty / liability.
If there is no warranty remaining I'd say there is not many, if any
cars on the road that cannot occasionally tow a trailer with GVW less
than 1000 lbs to 1500 lbs to the nearest lakes/rivers.
I'd probably not consider a wooden trailer....
JG
would void any warranty. Most probably the engine, tranny, and brakes
are up to it but it is an easy way for the manufacturer to avoid
responsibilty / liability.
If there is no warranty remaining I'd say there is not many, if any
cars on the road that cannot occasionally tow a trailer with GVW less
than 1000 lbs to 1500 lbs to the nearest lakes/rivers.
I'd probably not consider a wooden trailer....
JG
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>
> For both the boat trailers I have used for my Windsprint, I have
had to
> add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the
bottom
> near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
> square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to
stiffen
> it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the
cross
> bar.
>
> I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on
Yahoo:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
>
> Patrick
>
> Chris Curtis wrote:
> > I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com.
They
> > have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised
to
> > find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
> >
> > At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
> > showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and
they
> > gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a
4X8'
> > frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and
1300lbs.
> > It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the
number
> > differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the
manual, or
> > the fender cover.
> >
> > I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use
it
> > for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe
be
> > added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get
to
> > assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
> > depending on how much I choose to do.
> >
> > The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did
find
> > two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
> > welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line
with
> > the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working
items I
> > needed at no cost in about 10 days.
> >
> > I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also
assemble.
> > I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other
tasks. My
> > boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make
wooden "guides" to
> > keep the boat straight on the trailer.
> >
> > Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS
authorities
> > giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
> > engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of
hassle.
> >
> > Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if
you
> > desire!
> >
> >
> >
> > Chris Curtis
> >
> >
> >
> > On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
> >
> >
> >> Thanks, Patrick.
> >>
> >> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West
Marine.
> >> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> >> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried
looking
> >> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> >> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat
up to
> >> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about
the
> >> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World"
with
> >> this cost?)
> >>
> >> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> >> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in
a
> >> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> >> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> >> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> >> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the
southern
> >> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure.
It
> >> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the
existing
> >> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the
boat.
> >> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's
not
> >> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer
(it's
> >> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> >> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> >> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize
that
> >> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat
that
> >> can hold a family of four.
> >>
> >> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of
building my
> >> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> >> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm
buying
> >> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> >> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
> >>
> >> Thanks again!
> >> FB
> >>
> >> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@>
wrote:
> >>
> >>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
> >>>
> >> trailer. It
> >>
> >>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
> >>>
> >> serious
> >>
> >>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville
station
> >>>
> >> wagon
> >>
> >>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The
wind
> >>>
> >> from
> >>
> >>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off
the
> >>>
> >> road.
> >>
> >>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
> >>>
> >> concerns
> >>
> >>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit
from
> >>>
> >> West
> >>
> >>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the
boat.
> >>>
> >>> Patrick
> >>>
> >>> marylandbeukers wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible
cramped
> >>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
> >>>>
> >> our
> >>
> >>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> >>>>
> >>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
> >>>>
> >> your
> >>
> >>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
> >>>>
> >> Windsprint
> >>
> >>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm
trying
> >>>>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
> >>>>
> >> onto
> >>
> >>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
> >>>>
> >> to
> >>
> >>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW
Passat
> >>>> wagon.
> >>>>
> >>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
> >>>>
> >> work
> >>
> >>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
> >>>>
> >> Surf?
> >>
> >>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and -
possibly -
> >>>>
> >>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
> >>>>
> >> will
> >>
> >>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> >>>>
> >>>> Any thoughts?
> >>>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
flogging dead horses
> > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
posts
> > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
For both the boat trailers I have used for my Windsprint, I have had to
add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the bottom
near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to stiffen
it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the cross
bar.
I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on Yahoo:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
Patrick
Chris Curtis wrote:
add an additional cross bar with a couple padded supports for the bottom
near the front of the trailer. For my first trailer, I used a 1.5"
square cross-section steel tube with a piece of 2x2 inside to stiffen
it. For my new trailer, it seemed easier to just use a 4x4 for the cross
bar.
I just put some photos in the "files" section of Bolger 7 on Yahoo:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger7/files/Windsprint%20trailer/
Patrick
Chris Curtis wrote:
> I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com. They
> have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised to
> find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
>
> At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
> showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and they
> gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a 4X8'
> frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and 1300lbs.
> It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the number
> differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the manual, or
> the fender cover.
>
> I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use it
> for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe be
> added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get to
> assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
> depending on how much I choose to do.
>
> The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did find
> two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
> welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line with
> the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working items I
> needed at no cost in about 10 days.
>
> I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also assemble.
> I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other tasks. My
> boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make wooden "guides" to
> keep the boat straight on the trailer.
>
> Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS authorities
> giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
> engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of hassle.
>
> Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if you
> desire!
>
>
>
> Chris Curtis
>
>
>
> On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
>
>
>> Thanks, Patrick.
>>
>> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
>> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
>> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
>> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
>> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
>> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
>> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
>> this cost?)
>>
>> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
>> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
>> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
>> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
>> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
>> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
>> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
>> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
>> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
>> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
>> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
>> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
>> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
>> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
>> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
>> can hold a family of four.
>>
>> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
>> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
>> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
>> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
>> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>>
>> Thanks again!
>> FB
>>
>> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>>
>>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
>>>
>> trailer. It
>>
>>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
>>>
>> serious
>>
>>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station
>>>
>> wagon
>>
>>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind
>>>
>> from
>>
>>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the
>>>
>> road.
>>
>>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
>>>
>> concerns
>>
>>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from
>>>
>> West
>>
>>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
>>>
>>> Patrick
>>>
>>> marylandbeukers wrote:
>>>
>>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
>>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
>>>>
>> our
>>
>>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
>>>>
>>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
>>>>
>> your
>>
>>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
>>>>
>> Windsprint
>>
>>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying
>>>>
>> to
>>
>>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
>>>>
>> onto
>>
>>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
>>>>
>> to
>>
>>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
>>>> wagon.
>>>>
>>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
>>>>
>> work
>>
>>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
>>>>
>> Surf?
>>
>>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
>>>>
>>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
>>>>
>> will
>>
>>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
>>>>
>>>> Any thoughts?
>>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
I was talking about a whole trailer -- comes in three boxes (as I
recall). Includes galvanized frame, roller, bunker-boards, wheels,
wiring, lights, and registration certificate. I do think it might have
cost about $600 a couple years ago. I bought it to replace the trailer I
got in kit form at my local agricultural supply store 10 years ago for
about $300. The axle on that one rusted through, I had it replaced with
a solid steel bar by a local welder, then the entire back end rusted
off. (It was painted, not galvanized.)
I believe that many states will not license a wood trailer -- at least
the axle and frame need to be steel, I think. Do check with MD DMV to
see if they have restrictions.
Car manufacturers have gotten squirrelly about recommending trailering
for their cars. Unless its an SUV or truck, they don't want to commit to
the vehicle being undamaged by towing. Perhaps rightly so, with the
little 4-cylinder engines used today. Still, the weight of a Windsprint
and trailer is small enough that if you don't get crazy about going 75
mph up steep inclines, you shouldn't get into trouble. Of course, I
burned up one or two VW bug engines pulling a 16' fiberglass boat that
was bigger than the car in my youth (going as fast as I could up
reasonably steep hills -- coming into Chapel Hill, NC, I'd get going as
fast as I could at the bottom of the hill -- about 50 mph -- and be
putting along at about 20 by the time I reached the top), so I may not
be a reliable adviser on this.
Patrick
marylandbeukers wrote:
recall). Includes galvanized frame, roller, bunker-boards, wheels,
wiring, lights, and registration certificate. I do think it might have
cost about $600 a couple years ago. I bought it to replace the trailer I
got in kit form at my local agricultural supply store 10 years ago for
about $300. The axle on that one rusted through, I had it replaced with
a solid steel bar by a local welder, then the entire back end rusted
off. (It was painted, not galvanized.)
I believe that many states will not license a wood trailer -- at least
the axle and frame need to be steel, I think. Do check with MD DMV to
see if they have restrictions.
Car manufacturers have gotten squirrelly about recommending trailering
for their cars. Unless its an SUV or truck, they don't want to commit to
the vehicle being undamaged by towing. Perhaps rightly so, with the
little 4-cylinder engines used today. Still, the weight of a Windsprint
and trailer is small enough that if you don't get crazy about going 75
mph up steep inclines, you shouldn't get into trouble. Of course, I
burned up one or two VW bug engines pulling a 16' fiberglass boat that
was bigger than the car in my youth (going as fast as I could up
reasonably steep hills -- coming into Chapel Hill, NC, I'd get going as
fast as I could at the bottom of the hill -- about 50 mph -- and be
putting along at about 20 by the time I reached the top), so I may not
be a reliable adviser on this.
Patrick
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>
>> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
>>
> trailer. It
>
>> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
>>
> serious
>
>> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station
>>
> wagon
>
>> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind
>>
> from
>
>> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the
>>
> road.
>
>> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
>>
> concerns
>
>> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from
>>
> West
>
>> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>> marylandbeukers wrote:
>>
>>> Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
>>> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
>>>
> our
>
>>> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
>>>
>>> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
>>>
> your
>
>>> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
>>>
> Windsprint
>
>>> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying
>>>
> to
>
>>> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
>>>
> onto
>
>>> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
>>>
> to
>
>>> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
>>> wagon.
>>>
>>> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
>>>
> work
>
>>> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
>>>
> Surf?
>
>>> My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
>>>
>
>
>>> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
>>>
> will
>
>>> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
Yes West Marine does have a small boat trailer kit for
730.00 and it's model 7906019. It's on page 812 of
their 07 catalog.
The last I knew wood is a no no for trailer frame..
That's what DOT says. Now if it's farm equipment that
a whole diffrent story. They are also not pulled over
20 mph.
I think you have craigslist.com back your way keep an
eye open on there for a used one.
Harbor Freight Tools does have a boat trailer kit as
well. I also know Northern Tool did as well.
Adding a longer tongue to a flatbed trailer kit is not
all that hard.
I know I have the skills to draw up and make what I
want out of steel or aluminum. But that is also a
field I have or do work in. You can get the raw steel
and cut and fit all the parts and have a weldshop do
all the welding as well.
You may try just go around to the boat dealerships and
price a trailer both new and used. You never know they
may have what you are looking for.
Blessings Krissie
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
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730.00 and it's model 7906019. It's on page 812 of
their 07 catalog.
The last I knew wood is a no no for trailer frame..
That's what DOT says. Now if it's farm equipment that
a whole diffrent story. They are also not pulled over
20 mph.
I think you have craigslist.com back your way keep an
eye open on there for a used one.
Harbor Freight Tools does have a boat trailer kit as
well. I also know Northern Tool did as well.
Adding a longer tongue to a flatbed trailer kit is not
all that hard.
I know I have the skills to draw up and make what I
want out of steel or aluminum. But that is also a
field I have or do work in. You can get the raw steel
and cut and fit all the parts and have a weldshop do
all the welding as well.
You may try just go around to the boat dealerships and
price a trailer both new and used. You never know they
may have what you are looking for.
Blessings Krissie
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit____________________________________________________________________________________
> at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer,
> or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)?
> I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they
> had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to
> pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a
> trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in
> "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta.
http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_tools.html
Hi
I built a 16 ft wooden Brite boat , so I figured I should build the trailer out of wood also. It works fine, I only used 2 wheel barrow tires because I only have to go 1 1/2 miles to the state park to launch it. One thing tho, when you put a side mount crank down stand on the trailer because it's wood the whole thing wants to treek,(twist). If I built another one I would use one that mounts in the center of the trailer. Here in SC you dont have to register trailers.
Dave
marylandbeukers <marylandbeukers@...> wrote: Thanks, Patrick.
I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
this cost?)
Your email below, combined with the others posted under
the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
can hold a family of four.
What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
Thanks again!
FB
I built a 16 ft wooden Brite boat , so I figured I should build the trailer out of wood also. It works fine, I only used 2 wheel barrow tires because I only have to go 1 1/2 miles to the state park to launch it. One thing tho, when you put a side mount crank down stand on the trailer because it's wood the whole thing wants to treek,(twist). If I built another one I would use one that mounts in the center of the trailer. Here in SC you dont have to register trailers.
Dave
marylandbeukers <marylandbeukers@...> wrote: Thanks, Patrick.
I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
this cost?)
Your email below, combined with the others posted under
the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
can hold a family of four.
What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
Thanks again!
FB
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>
> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
trailer. It
> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
serious
> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station
wagon
> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind
from
> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the
road.
> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
concerns
> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from
West
> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
>
> Patrick
>
> marylandbeukers wrote:
> > Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
> > quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
our
> > oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> >
> > Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
your
> > Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
Windsprint
> > weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying
to
> > picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
onto
> > the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
to
> > make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
> > wagon.
> >
> > Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
work
> > for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
Surf?
> > My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
> > allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
will
> > allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> >
> > Any thoughts?
>
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I would add one more bit of advice about car topping. If you use those
ratchet straps to tie down your boat and as one writer noted run them through the
doors or windows of your car to tie both the boat and rack down well. Put a
couple of twists in the strap where they are exposed to the wind. If you don't
there will be a gosh awful racket and hum set up as those straps flutter in
the wind.
************************************** See what's free athttp://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ratchet straps to tie down your boat and as one writer noted run them through the
doors or windows of your car to tie both the boat and rack down well. Put a
couple of twists in the strap where they are exposed to the wind. If you don't
there will be a gosh awful racket and hum set up as those straps flutter in
the wind.
************************************** See what's free athttp://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I carried a Bolger CarTopper on top of my Jeep Cherokee for a few years with
no problems. The jeep was a bit too high for easy loading, but doable since
I had a good place to load at home and with a curb at the parking lot where
I sailed no problems. But when we bought a camper van there was no way to
load the boat on top so bought a cheap trailer (Both Harbor Freight and Northern
Tool sell inexpensive trailers)
With the van I was shown the neatest trick ever about backing a boat down a
launch ramp. Place a trailer hitch ball on your front bumper! My problem was
that the small rear window in the van did not let me observe what the
trailer was doing until it had already jackknifed. One of the guys at a messabout
showed me his set up with a trailer hitch ball on the front bumper. (It bought
some amazed looks at trailer shops when I ordered a front bumper hitch) No
need for brake or light set up with the front hitch of course. But you can see
the boat and trailer going down the ramp and when recovering.
The drill was as follows: Stop in the parking lot at the ramp. Unhitch the
trailer and remove the light board (I had tail and licence plate lamps on a
board that slipped into the stern of the boat so I would not submerge the
lights) Then turn the car around, hook the trailer to the front hitch and drive
forward down the ramp and float the boat off. Recovering; just reverse the
process. Drive forward with the empty trailer down the ramp, float and pull the
boat onto the trailer then back up the ramp (Lots easier to back with the
trailer in front too)
In the parking lot reverse the process, put the trailer and now loaded boat
on the proper hitch and re install the light board and away you go.
John Meacham
P.S. from my experiences at almost any busy boat ramp you will get more help
than you really want. Everyone wants to help you get your trailer off the
ramp so they can have their turn.
************************************** See what's free athttp://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
no problems. The jeep was a bit too high for easy loading, but doable since
I had a good place to load at home and with a curb at the parking lot where
I sailed no problems. But when we bought a camper van there was no way to
load the boat on top so bought a cheap trailer (Both Harbor Freight and Northern
Tool sell inexpensive trailers)
With the van I was shown the neatest trick ever about backing a boat down a
launch ramp. Place a trailer hitch ball on your front bumper! My problem was
that the small rear window in the van did not let me observe what the
trailer was doing until it had already jackknifed. One of the guys at a messabout
showed me his set up with a trailer hitch ball on the front bumper. (It bought
some amazed looks at trailer shops when I ordered a front bumper hitch) No
need for brake or light set up with the front hitch of course. But you can see
the boat and trailer going down the ramp and when recovering.
The drill was as follows: Stop in the parking lot at the ramp. Unhitch the
trailer and remove the light board (I had tail and licence plate lamps on a
board that slipped into the stern of the boat so I would not submerge the
lights) Then turn the car around, hook the trailer to the front hitch and drive
forward down the ramp and float the boat off. Recovering; just reverse the
process. Drive forward with the empty trailer down the ramp, float and pull the
boat onto the trailer then back up the ramp (Lots easier to back with the
trailer in front too)
In the parking lot reverse the process, put the trailer and now loaded boat
on the proper hitch and re install the light board and away you go.
John Meacham
P.S. from my experiences at almost any busy boat ramp you will get more help
than you really want. Everyone wants to help you get your trailer off the
ramp so they can have their turn.
************************************** See what's free athttp://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I took the a trailer like this one on Northern Tools
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_7769_7769
and put on a couple of bunks and then bought a length of square tubing
and replaced the tongue with a much longer one. I carry two Gull dories
at 16' long on it. You will see this trailer at a lot of stores
including local ones.
Here is another trailer from Northern Tools, also found in other stores.
It is a little more spendy but is designed for a boat.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_1063_1063
Friz Funk bought a couple of torsion spring axles from Northern Tool and
built a wooden trailer and trailed his Sneakeasy all the way down the
Alcan to Wisconsin. He doesn't have any pics of it on his web site
unfortunately.
HJ
marylandbeukers wrote:
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_7769_7769
and put on a couple of bunks and then bought a length of square tubing
and replaced the tongue with a much longer one. I carry two Gull dories
at 16' long on it. You will see this trailer at a lot of stores
including local ones.
Here is another trailer from Northern Tools, also found in other stores.
It is a little more spendy but is designed for a boat.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_1063_1063
Friz Funk bought a couple of torsion spring axles from Northern Tool and
built a wooden trailer and trailed his Sneakeasy all the way down the
Alcan to Wisconsin. He doesn't have any pics of it on his web site
unfortunately.
HJ
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
>
>
>
check out the trailers at harbor freight
Tom C
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
Tom C
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
>Marine.
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailerlooking
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-to
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer aboutthe
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World"with
> this cost?)southern
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure.It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix theexisting
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on theboat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it'snot
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer(it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park athat
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat thatmy
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sellsbuying
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for astation
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@> wrote:
> >
> > I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
> trailer. It
> > was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
> serious
> > back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville
> wagonwind
> > -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The
> fromthe
> > passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off
> road.from
> > On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
> concerns
> > pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit
> Westboat.
> > Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the
> >cramped
> > Patrick
> >
> > marylandbeukers wrote:
> > > Good information to know - especially about the possible
> > > quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told methat
> ourof
> > > oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> > >
> > > Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs.
> yourtrying
> > > Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
> Windsprint
> > > weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm
> tohave
> > > picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
> onto
> > > the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also
> toPassat
> > > make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW
> > > wagon.possibly -
> > >
> > > Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
> work
> > > for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
> Surf?
> > > My thinking is that this will help with stability and -
>which
> > > allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments
> will
> > > allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> >
>
I recently purchased a trailer from www.harborfreighttools.com. They
have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised to
find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and they
gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a 4X8'
frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and 1300lbs.
It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the number
differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the manual, or
the fender cover.
I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use it
for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe be
added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get to
assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
depending on how much I choose to do.
The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did find
two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line with
the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working items I
needed at no cost in about 10 days.
I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also assemble.
I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other tasks. My
boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make wooden "guides" to
keep the boat straight on the trailer.
Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS authorities
giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of hassle.
Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if you
desire!
Chris Curtis
have a number of locations all over the country. I was surprised to
find one in Spokane, 2.5 hours from my house up in the sticks.
At the actual store, they had the trailer marked for 299.95. I
showed then the printout from the web (a price of 199.95), and they
gave me the web pricing. The trailer has 12" wheels, and a 4X8'
frame. It has a capacity of somewhere between 1000lbs and 1300lbs.
It's a bit confusing what the capacity really is, because the number
differs depending whether your looking at the web add, the manual, or
the fender cover.
I purchased it to hopefully use for my Philsboat, at 15'. To use it
for Philsboat will require an additional 2x2 square steel pipe be
added to the "nose". I have a neighbor welding buddy I will get to
assist. I'm guessing adding the mod will cost $75 or less,
depending on how much I choose to do.
The trailer was easy to assemble, but took many hours. I did find
two major problems (a cross threaded crown bolt, and a backwards
welded front thingy!!). A call to the harbor freight 800 line with
the invoice number is all it took. They sent me the working items I
needed at no cost in about 10 days.
I think HF also has a boat trailer for 399, that you also assemble.
I went for the flatbed, to save cost, and to use for other tasks. My
boat is flat bottomed anyway, so I planned to make wooden "guides" to
keep the boat straight on the trailer.
Lastly, I used to live in MD. I can't imagine the MS authorities
giving you a tag for your homemade wooden trailer without an
engineers stamp, an environmental impact study, and loads of hassle.
Let me know if you would like pictures, I can send off-list if you
desire!
Chris Curtis
On Apr 3, 2007, at 7:18 AM, marylandbeukers wrote:
> Thanks, Patrick.
>
> I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
> Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
> accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
> on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
> assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
> 12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
> same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
> this cost?)
>
> Your email below, combined with the others posted under
> the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
> trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
> opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
> good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
> broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
> peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
> became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
> trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
> Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
> designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
> required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
> trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
> decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
> desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
> can hold a family of four.
>
> What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
> own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
> everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
> wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
> trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
>
> Thanks again!
> FB
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
> >
> > I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
> trailer. It
> > was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
> serious
> > back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station
> wagon
> > -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind
> from
> > passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the
> road.
> > On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
> concerns
> > pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from
> West
> > Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
> >
> > Patrick
> >
> > marylandbeukers wrote:
> > > Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
> > > quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
> our
> > > oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> > >
> > > Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
> your
> > > Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
> Windsprint
> > > weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying
> to
> > > picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
> onto
> > > the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
> to
> > > make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
> > > wagon.
> > >
> > > Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
> work
> > > for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
> Surf?
> > > My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
>
> > > allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
> will
> > > allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> >
>
>
>
Thanks, Krissie. Your posting, combined with one I got from Patrick,
has convinced me to invest in a trailer - if I can afford it. Please
see my reply (with some other questions) to Patrick's posting under
the "General Surf Questions..." subject line.
It is true that I would have to learn how to drive with a trailer,
but that doesn't cause me much concern. My biggest concern is the
initial investment cost for a trailer (either via purchase or by
construction). I have next to no budget to spend on this boat (thus,
one of my reasons to build it rather than buy one), and I don't want
to build a boat that can't get to the water.
I tried at one time (see my reply posting to Patrick) to buy a used
trailer. But I learned that used trailers are very hard to find in
the mid-Atlantic coat region of the US (I'm from Maryland), and thus
expensive. For some reason, you can find them anywhere in the
northeast or the midwest. Both Craig's List and eBay had lots of
them from there. But once you get south of New Jersey, they're like
gold.
Please keep your comments coming. They help. Thanks again!
FB
has convinced me to invest in a trailer - if I can afford it. Please
see my reply (with some other questions) to Patrick's posting under
the "General Surf Questions..." subject line.
It is true that I would have to learn how to drive with a trailer,
but that doesn't cause me much concern. My biggest concern is the
initial investment cost for a trailer (either via purchase or by
construction). I have next to no budget to spend on this boat (thus,
one of my reasons to build it rather than buy one), and I don't want
to build a boat that can't get to the water.
I tried at one time (see my reply posting to Patrick) to buy a used
trailer. But I learned that used trailers are very hard to find in
the mid-Atlantic coat region of the US (I'm from Maryland), and thus
expensive. For some reason, you can find them anywhere in the
northeast or the midwest. Both Craig's List and eBay had lots of
them from there. But once you get south of New Jersey, they're like
gold.
Please keep your comments coming. They help. Thanks again!
FB
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kristine Bennett <femmpaws@...> wrote:
>
> You know you start putting the boat on the top of the
> car and something slips, someone or something is going
> to get hurt. 150 lbs falling 5 feet can easy brake a
> leg or worst.
>
> That little VW will have no hassle pulling a light
> boat on a trailer. It will save your back and your
> lady loves back as well.
>
> Let's just say you get hurt loading the boat and brake
> a leg... You are out of work 8 to 12 weeks the loss
> income is way more then the cost of a small boat
> trailer BRAND NEW! By how many time????
>
> Also if you go to the trailer you can build a bit
> bigger boat and have more room for every one!
>
> Kids get tired and want someplace to curl up and
> sleep. Also they are going to keep growning so maybe
> build something that will still fit you all 4 or 5
> years down the road.
>
> With the trailer you don't have to manhandle the boat
> 4 times just to enjoy it one afternoon or play.
>
> I have a 12 foot skiff and I have a trailer for it and
> a flatbed for the same trailer so it's useful for
> doing other things as well.
>
> It would be a shame to have your boat all done and
> then have it fall off the car and then someone be in a
> cast for 12 weeks.
>
> OK the down side you will have to learn to drive with
> a trailer. You will have to learn how to make the
> trailer go where you want it when backing. OK so you
> have to go to a larger parking lot and play with it
> for a few hours. Cardboard boxes make good dummys for
> doing that.
>
> Just my feelings on the matter.
>
> Blessings Krissie
>
> > 150 lbs. is *a lot* of boat to lift onto a car, even
> > a short VW, even one end at a time.
>
> > > > Hello,
> > > >
> > > > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or
> > displacement of
> > Bolger's "Surf"
> > > > design? Some other related questions: Is it
> > cartop-able? Would
> > you
> > > > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a
> > family of four
> > (incl. two
> > > > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)?
> > Do I absolutely
> > have to
> > > > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or
> > can I use them
> > for
> > > > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about
> > the design would be
> > > > helpful.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks much!
> > > > FB
>
>
>
>
>
______________________________________________________________________
______________
> No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
> with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
>http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail
>
Thanks, Patrick.
I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
this cost?)
Your email below, combined with the others posted under
the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
can hold a family of four.
What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
Thanks again!
FB
I'm interested in your comment about the trailer kit at West Marine.
Are you speaking about a kit to assemble a trailer, or a trailer
accessories kit (brake lights, wires, hitch, etc.)? I tried looking
on West Marine's website and the only trailer they had was a pre-
assembled one for $630 - and that was only able to pull a boat up to
12 feet. I'd like to keep any purchase cost for a trailer about the
same for building the boat ($200 +/-....am I in "Fantasy World" with
this cost?)
Your email below, combined with the others posted under
the "Cartopping it" subject line, have convinved me to invest in a
trailer - if I can afford it. About a year ago, I had the
opportunity to take possession of a used Siren 17. It was in very
good condition, except that the axle of the trailer it sat on was
broken. The boat was in the guy's backyard way out on the southern
peninsula tip of Maryland where there isn't much infrastructure. It
became such a hassle to organize an effort to either fix the existing
trailer or get a new one that I eventually had to pass on the boat.
Not to mention getting a hitch put on the Passat (something it's not
designed for), getting a Maryland state license for the trailer (it's
required in Maryland) and then learning how to drive & park a
trailer. It really left a bad taste in my mouth, and I eventually
decided to build my own boat and car-top it. But I now realize that
desire is in conflict with the my other desire to have a boat that
can hold a family of four.
What are your (and anyone else's) thoughts on the idea of building my
own trailer out of thick lumber? I did see that West Marine sells
everything else a trailer needs except the frame. And as I'm buying
wood to build the boat, I figure I can also get some lumber for a
trailer? Am I still in Fantasy World?
Thanks again!
FB
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Crockett <pcrockett@...> wrote:
>
> I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a
trailer. It
> was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without
serious
> back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station
wagon
> -- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind
from
> passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the
road.
> On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no
concerns
> pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from
West
> Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
>
> Patrick
>
> marylandbeukers wrote:
> > Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
> > quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
our
> > oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
> >
> > Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
your
> > Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the
Windsprint
> > weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying
to
> > picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat
onto
> > the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have
to
> > make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
> > wagon.
> >
> > Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't
work
> > for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
Surf?
> > My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
> > allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
will
> > allow for more "people" room in the boat.
> >
> > Any thoughts?
>
Krissie is right. I cartopped my Brick for 3 years, yes it can be done but
in the end what an ordeal, your time and energy is better spent enjoying the
boat. You don't need much of a trailer to tow a 150 lbs boat and I suspect
that with a llittle searching a suitable used one could be found.
If you are soley intent on cartopping then please heed this advice. Use
extra rachet straps atttached to the cartopping racks. Open the car doors
or windows as needed and run the straps from the rack through the passenger
compartment, out the other side and attach to the rack on the other side of
the car. this is done to thoughly secure the car racks to the car. Yes they
do come loose, yes the little clips break and more than you boat will be
damaged if it comes off on the way. I do this and the car doors still shut
an the straps can be positioned so the they do not appreciable interfere.
BubbaP
Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check savings
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117
in the end what an ordeal, your time and energy is better spent enjoying the
boat. You don't need much of a trailer to tow a 150 lbs boat and I suspect
that with a llittle searching a suitable used one could be found.
If you are soley intent on cartopping then please heed this advice. Use
extra rachet straps atttached to the cartopping racks. Open the car doors
or windows as needed and run the straps from the rack through the passenger
compartment, out the other side and attach to the rack on the other side of
the car. this is done to thoughly secure the car racks to the car. Yes they
do come loose, yes the little clips break and more than you boat will be
damaged if it comes off on the way. I do this and the car doors still shut
an the straps can be positioned so the they do not appreciable interfere.
BubbaP
>>_________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>____________________________________________________________________________________
>No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
>with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
>http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail
Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check savings
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117
Hi FB,-
Theoretically you could cartop Surf but it would take a lot of
planning - it is a long boat and relatively heavy. Also If you want
to take it sailing the mast would be wobbling around a fair bit on
the roof racks - a small boat trailer or adapted box trailer would
be easier in my opinion.
I agree that the floatation chambers are a good idea - if I get
swamped bailing isn't always possible in a chop and its easier to
just row or sail to shore and tip the water out - she goes almost as
well. With her limited freeboard if I was a long way from shore I
would always be nervous wihout the added bouyancy, especially with
passengers on board. Agreed, they do cut down on her passenger
space, but my kids love sitting on the front and rear tanks when I'm
rowing, it doesn't seem to upset her sideways balance at all.
By the way, has anyone seen the pictures of Zephyr that used to be
on the net? I think they belonged to a German guy, haven't been
able to find them for a while. If anyone has a link with some pics
that would be great, thought I might build Surfs big sister
cheers,
Col
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@...> wrote:
Theoretically you could cartop Surf but it would take a lot of
planning - it is a long boat and relatively heavy. Also If you want
to take it sailing the mast would be wobbling around a fair bit on
the roof racks - a small boat trailer or adapted box trailer would
be easier in my opinion.
I agree that the floatation chambers are a good idea - if I get
swamped bailing isn't always possible in a chop and its easier to
just row or sail to shore and tip the water out - she goes almost as
well. With her limited freeboard if I was a long way from shore I
would always be nervous wihout the added bouyancy, especially with
passengers on board. Agreed, they do cut down on her passenger
space, but my kids love sitting on the front and rear tanks when I'm
rowing, it doesn't seem to upset her sideways balance at all.
By the way, has anyone seen the pictures of Zephyr that used to be
on the net? I think they belonged to a German guy, haven't been
able to find them for a while. If anyone has a link with some pics
that would be great, thought I might build Surfs big sister
cheers,
Col
-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@...> wrote:
>is
> My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the it
> sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The foreand
> aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat willhold
> your family but there will not be much room left. You could leaveout
> the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boatis
> very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15knot
> winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as aneeds
> drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your
> with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat arealso
> open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures inBolger's "Surf"
> Bolger 6 in the photo section.
> Loy
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of
> > design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able?Would you
> > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four(incl. two
> > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutelyhave to
> > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use themfor
> > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design wouldbe
> > helpful.
> >
> > Thanks much!
> > FB
> >
>
There is a reason why my truck has a ball mounted on
the front passangers side! You can do the same thing
with most cars as well.
The one thing I didn't add is. YOu are far more likely
to use the boat if it's easy to get it to and from the
lake. Cartopping is not easy with a 80 lb. boat,
little lone one that's 150 lbs.
Blessings Krissie
--- Wesley Cox <inspirfe@...> wrote:
Be a PS3 game guru.
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the front passangers side! You can do the same thing
with most cars as well.
The one thing I didn't add is. YOu are far more likely
to use the boat if it's easy to get it to and from the
lake. Cartopping is not easy with a 80 lb. boat,
little lone one that's 150 lbs.
Blessings Krissie
--- Wesley Cox <inspirfe@...> wrote:
> I'll second the advice about practice if you go the____________________________________________________________________________________
> trailer route, if you have no experience driving a
> trailer. Practice plenty. I practiced *some* in a
> big empty parking lot with my first boat trailer.
> The first boat ramp I went to, which I had never
> seen before (mistake), was very long, very steep,
> and barely wider than the axle of my truck.
> Thankfully there was a helpful guy there flapping
> his lips in my ear the whole way down, making a
> complete nuisance and distraction of himself. He
> meant well. I've never seen a ramp anything like
> that one since then.
>
Be a PS3 game guru.
Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at Yahoo! Games.
http://videogames.yahoo.com/platform?platform=120121
I'll second the advice about practice if you go the trailer route, if you have no experience driving a trailer. Practice plenty. I practiced *some* in a big empty parking lot with my first boat trailer. The first boat ramp I went to, which I had never seen before (mistake), was very long, very steep, and barely wider than the axle of my truck. Thankfully there was a helpful guy there flapping his lips in my ear the whole way down, making a complete nuisance and distraction of himself. He meant well. I've never seen a ramp anything like that one since then.
----- Original Message -----
From: Kristine Bennett
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 10:13 PM
Subject: [bolger] Car topping or not to.
You know you start putting the boat on the top of the
car and something slips, someone or something is going
to get hurt. 150 lbs falling 5 feet can easy brake a
leg or worst.
That little VW will have no hassle pulling a light
boat on a trailer. It will save your back and your
lady loves back as well.
Let's just say you get hurt loading the boat and brake
a leg... You are out of work 8 to 12 weeks the loss
income is way more then the cost of a small boat
trailer BRAND NEW! By how many time????
Also if you go to the trailer you can build a bit
bigger boat and have more room for every one!
Kids get tired and want someplace to curl up and
sleep. Also they are going to keep growning so maybe
build something that will still fit you all 4 or 5
years down the road.
With the trailer you don't have to manhandle the boat
4 times just to enjoy it one afternoon or play.
I have a 12 foot skiff and I have a trailer for it and
a flatbed for the same trailer so it's useful for
doing other things as well.
It would be a shame to have your boat all done and
then have it fall off the car and then someone be in a
cast for 12 weeks.
OK the down side you will have to learn to drive with
a trailer. You will have to learn how to make the
trailer go where you want it when backing. OK so you
have to go to a larger parking lot and play with it
for a few hours. Cardboard boxes make good dummys for
doing that.
Just my feelings on the matter.
Blessings Krissie
> 150 lbs. is *a lot* of boat to lift onto a car, even
> a short VW, even one end at a time.
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or
> displacement of
> Bolger's "Surf"
> > > design? Some other related questions: Is it
> cartop-able? Would
> you
> > > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a
> family of four
> (incl. two
> > > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)?
> Do I absolutely
> have to
> > > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or
> can I use them
> for
> > > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about
> the design would be
> > > helpful.
> > >
> > > Thanks much!
> > > FB
__________________________________________________________
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
You know you start putting the boat on the top of the
car and something slips, someone or something is going
to get hurt. 150 lbs falling 5 feet can easy brake a
leg or worst.
That little VW will have no hassle pulling a light
boat on a trailer. It will save your back and your
lady loves back as well.
Let's just say you get hurt loading the boat and brake
a leg... You are out of work 8 to 12 weeks the loss
income is way more then the cost of a small boat
trailer BRAND NEW! By how many time????
Also if you go to the trailer you can build a bit
bigger boat and have more room for every one!
Kids get tired and want someplace to curl up and
sleep. Also they are going to keep growning so maybe
build something that will still fit you all 4 or 5
years down the road.
With the trailer you don't have to manhandle the boat
4 times just to enjoy it one afternoon or play.
I have a 12 foot skiff and I have a trailer for it and
a flatbed for the same trailer so it's useful for
doing other things as well.
It would be a shame to have your boat all done and
then have it fall off the car and then someone be in a
cast for 12 weeks.
OK the down side you will have to learn to drive with
a trailer. You will have to learn how to make the
trailer go where you want it when backing. OK so you
have to go to a larger parking lot and play with it
for a few hours. Cardboard boxes make good dummys for
doing that.
Just my feelings on the matter.
Blessings Krissie
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/mail
car and something slips, someone or something is going
to get hurt. 150 lbs falling 5 feet can easy brake a
leg or worst.
That little VW will have no hassle pulling a light
boat on a trailer. It will save your back and your
lady loves back as well.
Let's just say you get hurt loading the boat and brake
a leg... You are out of work 8 to 12 weeks the loss
income is way more then the cost of a small boat
trailer BRAND NEW! By how many time????
Also if you go to the trailer you can build a bit
bigger boat and have more room for every one!
Kids get tired and want someplace to curl up and
sleep. Also they are going to keep growning so maybe
build something that will still fit you all 4 or 5
years down the road.
With the trailer you don't have to manhandle the boat
4 times just to enjoy it one afternoon or play.
I have a 12 foot skiff and I have a trailer for it and
a flatbed for the same trailer so it's useful for
doing other things as well.
It would be a shame to have your boat all done and
then have it fall off the car and then someone be in a
cast for 12 weeks.
OK the down side you will have to learn to drive with
a trailer. You will have to learn how to make the
trailer go where you want it when backing. OK so you
have to go to a larger parking lot and play with it
for a few hours. Cardboard boxes make good dummys for
doing that.
Just my feelings on the matter.
Blessings Krissie
> 150 lbs. is *a lot* of boat to lift onto a car, even____________________________________________________________________________________
> a short VW, even one end at a time.
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or
> displacement of
> Bolger's "Surf"
> > > design? Some other related questions: Is it
> cartop-able? Would
> you
> > > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a
> family of four
> (incl. two
> > > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)?
> Do I absolutely
> have to
> > > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or
> can I use them
> for
> > > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about
> the design would be
> > > helpful.
> > >
> > > Thanks much!
> > > FB
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.
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I car-topped my Windsprint for a year before I invested in a trailer. It
was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without serious
back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station wagon
-- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind from
passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the road.
On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no concerns
pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from West
Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
Patrick
marylandbeukers wrote:
was hard -- no way I could do it now, 10 years later (without serious
back pain the next few days). Also, we sold th Bonneville station wagon
-- it would be a trick to fit it on top of a smaller car. The wind from
passing trucks on th highway would probably sail you right off the road.
On the other hand, with a trailer it is quite light -- I had no concerns
pulling it behind my Mazda Protege. You can buy a trailer kit from West
Marine -- adds a few hundred dollars to the total cost of the boat.
Patrick
marylandbeukers wrote:
> Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that our
> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
>
> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of your
> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the Windsprint
> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying to
> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat onto
> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have to
> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
> wagon.
>
> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't work
> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the Surf?
> My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which will
> allow for more "people" room in the boat.
>
> Any thoughts?
I have 2 thoughts.
150 lbs. is *a lot* of boat to lift onto a car, even a short VW, even one end at a time.
Reducing flotation inside the boat compensated by flotation in an outrigger can only be done so far. I think of the same scenario myself at times. I keep in mind that flotation becomes useful at the worst of times. If you have a capsize in rough water and the outrigger has enough flotation to float the entire rig but the main hull doesn't or doesn't quite, then as you are trying to re-board the boat, it will sink while the outrigger floats. If this doesn't make sense, I'll try to explain further.
150 lbs. is *a lot* of boat to lift onto a car, even a short VW, even one end at a time.
Reducing flotation inside the boat compensated by flotation in an outrigger can only be done so far. I think of the same scenario myself at times. I keep in mind that flotation becomes useful at the worst of times. If you have a capsize in rough water and the outrigger has enough flotation to float the entire rig but the main hull doesn't or doesn't quite, then as you are trying to re-board the boat, it will sink while the outrigger floats. If this doesn't make sense, I'll try to explain further.
----- Original Message -----
From: marylandbeukers
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 10:13 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: General Questions re: Bolger's "Surf"
Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that our
oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of your
Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the Windsprint
weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying to
picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat onto
the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have to
make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
wagon.
Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't work
for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the Surf?
My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which will
allow for more "people" room in the boat.
Any thoughts?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@...> wrote:
>
> My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the it
is
> sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore
and
> aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will
hold
> your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave
out
> the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat is
> very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15 knot
> winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as a
> drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your
needs
> with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are also
> open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in
> Bolger 6 in the photo section.
> Loy
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of
Bolger's "Surf"
> > design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able? Would
you
> > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four
(incl. two
> > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely
have to
> > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them
for
> > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would be
> > helpful.
> >
> > Thanks much!
> > FB
> >
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
...or I could go with the Zephyr. Any comments on how it will handle
on a calm river (the lower Potomac in Maryland) with a family of four
(roughly 550 lbs including some gear(?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
on a calm river (the lower Potomac in Maryland) with a family of four
(roughly 550 lbs including some gear(?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
<marylandbeukers@...> wrote:
>our
> Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
> quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that
> oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)your
>
> Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of
> Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming theWindsprint
> weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm tryingto
> picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat ontoSurf?
> the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have to
> make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
> wagon.
>
> Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't work
> for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the
> My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -will
> allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which
> allow for more "people" room in the boat.it
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@> wrote:
> >
> > My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the
> isis
> > sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore
> and
> > aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will
> hold
> > your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave
> out
> > the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat
> > very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15knot
> > winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam asa
> > drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for youralso
> needs
> > with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are
> > open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in<marylandbeukers@>
> > Bolger 6 in the photo section.
> > Loy
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers"
> > wrote:Would
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of
> Bolger's "Surf"
> > > design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able?
> yoube
> > > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four
> (incl. two
> > > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely
> have to
> > > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them
> for
> > > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would
> > > helpful.
> > >
> > > Thanks much!
> > > FB
> > >
> >
>
Good information to know - especially about the possible cramped
quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that our
oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of your
Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the Windsprint
weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying to
picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat onto
the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have to
make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
wagon.
Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't work
for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the Surf?
My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which will
allow for more "people" room in the boat.
Any thoughts?
quarters. Thank you very much. (Also, my wife just told me that our
oldest now weighs 60 lbs.!)
Can you tell me how much the Windsprint weighs? The 150 lbs. of your
Surf is about the max I wanted to go, and I'm assuming the Windsprint
weighs even more. (150 lbs may not seem like much, but I'm trying to
picture my wife and I up-ending and lifting a 150 lb, 16' boat onto
the top of our car - and the picture isn't pretty.) I also have to
make sure I can find a 4'6"+ roof rack that can fit my VW Passat
wagon.
Let me ask one other advice question: If the windsprint won't work
for me, is it possible to add a removable outrigger rig to the Surf?
My thinking is that this will help with stability and - possibly -
allow me to reduce the size of the flotation compartments which will
allow for more "people" room in the boat.
Any thoughts?
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Loy Seal" <loyseal1@...> wrote:
>
> My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the it
is
> sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore
and
> aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will
hold
> your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave
out
> the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat is
> very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15 knot
> winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as a
> drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your
needs
> with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are also
> open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in
> Bolger 6 in the photo section.
> Loy
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of
Bolger's "Surf"
> > design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able? Would
you
> > recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four
(incl. two
> > kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely
have to
> > have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them
for
> > sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would be
> > helpful.
> >
> > Thanks much!
> > FB
> >
>
My Surf weighs about 150 lbs made from 1/4" SYP plywood and the it is
sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore and
aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will hold
your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave out
the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat is
very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15 knot
winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as a
drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your needs
with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are also
open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in
Bolger 6 in the photo section.
Loy
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@...>
wrote:
sheathed with fiberglass on the bottom to the waterline. The fore and
aft compartments are covered and filled with foam. The boat will hold
your family but there will not be much room left. You could leave out
the compartments but I like the safety of the flotation. The boat is
very fast for sailing. A GPS showed it going over 6 knots in 15 knot
winds last fall. I think I would like something with more beam as a
drift boat. I wonder if the Windsprint would be better for your needs
with a 4'6" beam as opposed to 3'7". The ends of that boat are also
open for more seating. I love my Surf and you can see pictures in
Bolger 6 in the photo section.
Loy
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "marylandbeukers" <marylandbeukers@...>
wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of Bolger's "Surf"
> design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able? Would you
> recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four (incl. two
> kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely have to
> have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them for
> sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would be
> helpful.
>
> Thanks much!
> FB
>
Hello,
Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of Bolger's "Surf"
design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able? Would you
recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four (incl. two
kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely have to
have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them for
sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would be
helpful.
Thanks much!
FB
Can anyone tell me the weight and/or displacement of Bolger's "Surf"
design? Some other related questions: Is it cartop-able? Would you
recommend it as a calm river drift boat for a family of four (incl. two
kids - each weighing less than fifty pounds)? Do I absolutely have to
have the fore and aft compartments covered? Or can I use them for
sitting space? Any other pros and cons about the design would be
helpful.
Thanks much!
FB