Re: [bolger] Re: Long Micro launched!

What at this wonderful math fails to take into account is what happens, if you hit a rock at speed. The solid lead casting will absorb the impact, along with a brief radical change of trim. Whatever filler you use to bind your bits of lead together, (cement, epoxy, congealed snot), will not serve as well. Concrete will transmit the impact pretty much directly to the hull, epoxy perhaps(I think) a little less. In a life time on the water I have hit a rock at speed twice, once with a lead keel and the other with cement/iron blend. The lead was better in every measurable respect. It did pean over a little but a thump was way easier on the hull and crew than a jarring THUMPP with the cement.
I'd personally go for the casting. The savings in cost and or perceived trouble are negligable when you invest a year or three of spare time and some thousands of dollars in a boat of your own creation.
Good luck.
JG


----- Original Message ----
From: Kathy Kreamer <kreamers@...>
To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:00:38 PM
Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Long Micro launched!

I gleaned the following from the internet. Your mileage may vary.

If you take a bunch of spheres, say marbles in a jar, they will randomly
pack in what is called Random Close Packing (RCP). This has been shown to be
about 64 percent of volume fraction.

If you shake the jar hard enough to allow for migration and re-arrangement
of marbles, you might get to the maximum of 74 percent that is called
Hexagonal Close Packing (HCP).

---------

Spherical particles of equal size theoretically may be packed in five
different ways, e.g. (1) cubical with a theoretical void space of 47.64%,
(2) single-staggered or cubical-tetrahedral with a theoretical void space of
39.55%, (3) double-staggered with a theoretical void space of 30.20%, (4)
pyramidal, and (5) tetrahedral; the void spaces in the latter two are
identical, 25.95%.

Secondary, ternary, quaternary, and quinary spheres each set smaller than
its predecessor, may be fitted into the voids in this last type of packing
and the voids reduced theoretically to 14.9%.

The use of very fine filler in the remaining voids will then reduce the
voids theoretically to 3.9%.

- Bill

_____

From: bolger@yahoogroups. com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
BllFs6@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 10:21 AM
To: bolger@yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Long Micro launched!

In a message dated 11/20/2007 9:47:53 PM Central Standard Time,
kingw@bgnet. <mailto:kingw% 40bgnet.bgsu. edu> bgsu.edu writes:

But anyway, what I remember was
that using shot and epoxy made for a much lighter keel.

If you use lead shot...all of the same size beads/balls. ...you'll get a keel

about 70 percent the weight of a solid lead one...so, make the keel a few
inches deeper and it should even out...but do the calcs yourself and a test
batch to confirm the numbers....also i'd suspect lead shot would cost ALOT
more
than bulk or scrap lead....but I dont know that for a fact....

Has anyone suggested this route?

Make a mold for the keel....the mold is flat on its side....with the upper
face/side of the mold non existent.... or in other words the mold is like a
gaint shallow pan...

Now, just melt your lead a small pot at time....pour into mold....do it at
your leisure...over days/weeks/months if necessary..

You'll basically end up with keel made up of many thin sheets of
lead.....and if you clean and or gouge/roughen up the surface between pours,
those thin
"sheets of lead should be VERY well bonded....or stand up a bunch of nairs
on
thier heads before the first pour....that should also bond the sheets
together very well..

Just an idea of avoiding the scary prospect of melting/handling/ pouring
massive quantities of molten lead all at once....

Also, be careful about ventilation, fumes, safety glasses, gloves, boots etc

etc...

Blll

************ ********* ********* ********Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest

products.
(http://money.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I gleaned the following from the internet. Your mileage may vary.



If you take a bunch of spheres, say marbles in a jar, they will randomly
pack in what is called Random Close Packing (RCP). This has been shown to be
about 64 percent of volume fraction.



If you shake the jar hard enough to allow for migration and re-arrangement
of marbles, you might get to the maximum of 74 percent that is called
Hexagonal Close Packing (HCP).

---------

Spherical particles of equal size theoretically may be packed in five
different ways, e.g. (1) cubical with a theoretical void space of 47.64%,
(2) single-staggered or cubical-tetrahedral with a theoretical void space of
39.55%, (3) double-staggered with a theoretical void space of 30.20%, (4)
pyramidal, and (5) tetrahedral; the void spaces in the latter two are
identical, 25.95%.



Secondary, ternary, quaternary, and quinary spheres each set smaller than
its predecessor, may be fitted into the voids in this last type of packing
and the voids reduced theoretically to 14.9%.



The use of very fine filler in the remaining voids will then reduce the
voids theoretically to 3.9%.



- Bill


_____

From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
BllFs6@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 10:21 AM
To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Long Micro launched!




In a message dated 11/20/2007 9:47:53 PM Central Standard Time,
kingw@bgnet. <mailto:kingw%40bgnet.bgsu.edu> bgsu.edu writes:

But anyway, what I remember was
that using shot and epoxy made for a much lighter keel.

If you use lead shot...all of the same size beads/balls....you'll get a keel

about 70 percent the weight of a solid lead one...so, make the keel a few
inches deeper and it should even out...but do the calcs yourself and a test
batch to confirm the numbers....also i'd suspect lead shot would cost ALOT
more
than bulk or scrap lead....but I dont know that for a fact....

Has anyone suggested this route?

Make a mold for the keel....the mold is flat on its side....with the upper
face/side of the mold non existent....or in other words the mold is like a
gaint shallow pan...

Now, just melt your lead a small pot at time....pour into mold....do it at
your leisure...over days/weeks/months if necessary..

You'll basically end up with keel made up of many thin sheets of
lead.....and if you clean and or gouge/roughen up the surface between pours,
those thin
"sheets of lead should be VERY well bonded....or stand up a bunch of nairs
on
thier heads before the first pour....that should also bond the sheets
together very well..

Just an idea of avoiding the scary prospect of melting/handling/pouring
massive quantities of molten lead all at once....

Also, be careful about ventilation, fumes, safety glasses, gloves, boots etc

etc...

Blll

**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest

products.
(http://money.
<http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001>
aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In a message dated 11/20/2007 9:47:53 PM Central Standard Time,
kingw@...writes:

But anyway, what I remember was
that using shot and epoxy made for a much lighter keel.



If you use lead shot...all of the same size beads/balls....you'll get a keel
about 70 percent the weight of a solid lead one...so, make the keel a few
inches deeper and it should even out...but do the calcs yourself and a test
batch to confirm the numbers....also i'd suspect lead shot would cost ALOT more
than bulk or scrap lead....but I dont know that for a fact....

Has anyone suggested this route?

Make a mold for the keel....the mold is flat on its side....with the upper
face/side of the mold non existent....or in other words the mold is like a
gaint shallow pan...

Now, just melt your lead a small pot at time....pour into mold....do it at
your leisure...over days/weeks/months if necessary..

You'll basically end up with keel made up of many thin sheets of
lead.....and if you clean and or gouge/roughen up the surface between pours, those thin
"sheets of lead should be VERY well bonded....or stand up a bunch of nairs on
thier heads before the first pour....that should also bond the sheets
together very well..

Just an idea of avoiding the scary prospect of melting/handling/pouring
massive quantities of molten lead all at once....

Also, be careful about ventilation, fumes, safety glasses, gloves, boots etc
etc...

Blll



**************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest
products.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What's the business on LMN?

LM is the same beam as Micro, so is the Nav cabin etc just transplanted
to her big sister; or is it OK in athwartships dimensions, but
requiring a flexible builder to stretch and interpret lengthwise?

Sailplan should be easy enough to "Michalak" size up.

What else?

Graeme
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Col" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Bill,
> I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for installing
> your keel - I have a Micro project underway and am trying to think
> ahead (keel anxiety I believe). I like your idea (gleaned from
your
> pics) of building the total keel bar the lead and then pushing it
in
> later - sounds like a less stressful process than some other
methods
> I've read about. I'd like to have the boat all but completed
before
> installing the lead to enable the boat to be wheeled around for as
> long as possible without all that weight in place. Using your
method I
> could even paint the bottom while it was upside down and touch up
the
> keel with a brush later on. Did you have a "dummy" plywood keel
made
> up to make sure the real one fit when the moment came? Any other
tips
> and tricks? Any traps to watch out for?
> Many thanks,
> Col


Here is how I did mine,really easy.
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/micro/index.htm

Peter
Col,
You are most welcome.
Search this group's archive b/c someone calculatted the weight of
using lead shot (as opposed to a solid lead keel). Or maybe they had
an opinon and did not calculate it. But anyway, what I remember was
that using shot and epoxy made for a much lighter keel. You could run
a small test- see how much a few cc's of lead shot weighs as compared
to an equal volume of lead.

My LM she sits high on her lines in the water (and my LM is heavier
than the plans with its .5 inch sides and deck and the framing for the
self bailing cockpit). I think these Bolger shapies can carry
considerable weight. Anyway, it's fun to figure it all out.

Bill

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Col" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@> wrote:
> >Thanks Bill, Bruce and Dennis,
> Appreciate the comments, plenty of food for thought there. Thanks
> Bill for posting the new photos - as you say a picture tells a
> thousand words. I don't think using lead ingots would weaken the
> keel too much being jammed in tight, drowned in epoxy and nailed
> throught the plywood. I am tempted to try it in one piece though -
> I like a challenge! Making sure it will fit on the first lift will
> be vital though - don't want to have to let it down if its too thick
> in the middle!
>
> Cheers
> Col
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>Thanks Bill, Bruce and Dennis,
Appreciate the comments, plenty of food for thought there. Thanks
Bill for posting the new photos - as you say a picture tells a
thousand words. I don't think using lead ingots would weaken the
keel too much being jammed in tight, drowned in epoxy and nailed
throught the plywood. I am tempted to try it in one piece though -
I like a challenge! Making sure it will fit on the first lift will
be vital though - don't want to have to let it down if its too thick
in the middle!

Cheers
Col


> Col,
> A micro, how exciting! Very cool.
> The pictures named "lead, keel, and boat" should detail how I
> constructed my keel framing, and installed my lead. I won't bore
you
> with most of the details, unless you would like a detailed
> description. Methinks the pictures tell the story better than I
can.
>http://personal.bgsu.edu/~kingw/boat/
>
> I went through various plans for my lead keel before I finally
> installed my lead. First I made a template for my lead when the
keel
> was framed (but not yet sheathed in plywood) (at the point when I
took
> the "keel frame" picture). I used a sheet of scrap plywood and
traced
> the shape my lead would assume. I planned to use that plywood as
the
> bottom of my keel mold (because I had visions of pouring my own
lead
> and making a one-piece lead keel). As I built my LM, I shifted my
> molten lead plan to making a reinforced sheet-metal mold (which I
> made). I figured I could place my lead into the mold, suspend it
all
> over a charcoal fire and use a leaf-blower to get things hot. The
> metal mold would keep me from pouring molten lead into my mold (I
read
> about this plan on the old CSD newsletters. The leaf blower I saw
> Bruce Hallman use). It seemed safer and easier to use my melting
> vessel as my mold.
>
> Summer wore on, and the sailing season was shrinking. Keel anxiety
> filled my mind. And I still wasn't happy with how I would roll my
537
> lb. floppy lead biscuit under my boat, stand it up on end (and not
> have it fall over on its side) and (either) jack it up into the
keel,
> or lower my LM onto the lead biscuit. If something was not right,
I
> would have to remove it and trim. The keel would be slathered in
> hardening epoxy.
>
> I eventually bought 50 lb. lead shielding bricks. They were 2.5
> inches wide (perfect) (they come in other thicknesses too), a bit
too
> long (I trimmed them), but they fit together with a little
> chevron/bird's mouth. I slathered each with thickened epoxy,
lifted
> each one into my keel slot, drilled four holes and set bronze
screws.
> I made a wooden shoe (for the bottom of the slot), and then sealed
> the whole unit up with rows of fiberglass tape, and covered it all
> with fiberglass cloth. A "pieced" lead keel such as this is not as
> strong as a one-piece lead keel. I don't know if the difference is
> significant. Dan Gonneau had a pieced keel and sailed his LM for
> years without trouble. I took that as a good sign.
>
> As you probably know, there are multiple ways of making your lead.
I
> trust you have seen Lenihan's article on casting his Micro keel?
Andy
> Pryor had a one piece lead keel and slid it into place with a
jack. He
> wrote that it was far easier than he had envisioned (and installing
> his lead was the last thing he did before launching). Other people
> have used lead bricks, shot, etc. The only danger with piecing your
> lead together is that your keel may come up light. If I had more
time
> I would have cast my own bricks (methinks 50 lbs is about right-
> manageable) and used those.
>
> That's my story. If you have other questions or want to see more
> pictures of specific things, let me know. And if possible, please
> post pictures. It's always exciting to see other boats in
progress.
>
> Bill, in Ohio
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Col" <cmoone11@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Bill,
> > I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for
installing
> > your keel - I have a Micro project underway and am trying to
think
> > ahead (keel anxiety I believe). I like your idea (gleaned from
your
> > pics) of building the total keel bar the lead and then pushing
it in
> > later - sounds like a less stressful process than some other
methods
> > I've read about. I'd like to have the boat all but completed
before
> > installing the lead to enable the boat to be wheeled around for
as
> > long as possible without all that weight in place. Using your
method I
> > could even paint the bottom while it was upside down and touch
up the
> > keel with a brush later on. Did you have a "dummy" plywood keel
made
> > up to make sure the real one fit when the moment came? Any
other tips
> > and tricks? Any traps to watch out for?
> > Many thanks,
> > Col
> >
>
-


I realize that the Micro is alot larger than my Old Shoe, but FWIW
you can see how I did my keel on my web site:
http://www.solopublications.com/flanweb.html

Its a personal choice, no real "right" way and to each his/her own.
I gave the task a great deal of thought and moved ahead with what I
felt would be easiest for me as a solo builder. Having direct access
to that keel without having to lay on my back was a big factor in
doing what I did. I also realize that the hull will now have to be
turned with the weight of that keel acting as an anchor. My solution
for that is a rolling frame and a few hands to help.

Best of luck in any case.

Regards,

Dennis L.
Bellingham, Wa.


-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Bruce,
> Don't you have pictures of your casting operation on one of the
yahoo
> Bolger sites?
>
> I'll add that I did a lot of my interior joinery work with my hull
> lying on its side. I was able to get my fiberglass cloth (on the
> outside of the hull) to lie flat, AND I avoided the "up-n-down the
> ladder routine" while installing the interior bits. Another trick I
> learned from a Bruce.
>
> Bill
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@> wrote:
> >
> > > I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for
installing
> > > your keel
> >
> > Just for comparison, here is how I did it:
> >
> >>>SNIP<<<<
>
http://image08.webshots.com/8/0/6/44/121100644qadyRL_fs.jpg


> Bruce,
> Don't you have pictures of your casting operation on one of the yahoo
> Bolger sites?
Bruce,
Don't you have pictures of your casting operation on one of the yahoo
Bolger sites?

I'll add that I did a lot of my interior joinery work with my hull
lying on its side. I was able to get my fiberglass cloth (on the
outside of the hull) to lie flat, AND I avoided the "up-n-down the
ladder routine" while installing the interior bits. Another trick I
learned from a Bruce.

Bill

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
>
> > I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for installing
> > your keel
>
> Just for comparison, here is how I did it:
>
>>>SNIP<<<<
> I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for installing
> your keel

Just for comparison, here is how I did it:

I built my casting mold using 'cement board' bought at Home Depot, the
stuff used as tile underlayment shower stalls. I packed sand around
the edges. You do the casting on its side. I didn't get the shape
exactly right, but was able to easily cut the casting using a Skilsaw
later.

I melted the lead (wheel weights) in a used steel paint bucket propped
up on bricks, with BBQ briquettes for heat, and a leaf blower to hot
things up. I didn't try to pour the lead, or use piping, but instead
used a steel ladle to dip (a bean can bolted to a piece of steel). If
I were to do it over, I would first render the wheel weights free from
their steel clips in small batches (creating ingots). And then I
would do another big melt for the main casting using the ingots. I
did the melt in 1/3rds, three layers to get the mold full.

Let it cool overnight. The hardened slug is pretty easy to handle by
rolling it around on pieces of pipes. When I was ready to install the
lead in the fin keel, I built a 'dolly truck' which holds the lead
casting upright at 90 degrees out of a piece of 3/4" plywood with 1x2
wooden braces. This plywood truck was easy to roll around the shop
floor on pipe rollers.

I jacked the hull up and set it on sturdy blocking, then rolled the
lead into position underneath. Then using my farm jack I lowered the
hull down into precise position and nailed it into place. You work on
your back under the hull so be EXTRA EXTRA sure that your blocking is
safe so you don't get squished and killed should hull fall down. In
my opinion this is the best sequence because it allows 95% of the
interior finish work can be done with the hull down low, saving a
zillion steps up and down a ladder.
Col,
A micro, how exciting! Very cool.
The pictures named "lead, keel, and boat" should detail how I
constructed my keel framing, and installed my lead. I won't bore you
with most of the details, unless you would like a detailed
description. Methinks the pictures tell the story better than I can.
http://personal.bgsu.edu/~kingw/boat/

I went through various plans for my lead keel before I finally
installed my lead. First I made a template for my lead when the keel
was framed (but not yet sheathed in plywood) (at the point when I took
the "keel frame" picture). I used a sheet of scrap plywood and traced
the shape my lead would assume. I planned to use that plywood as the
bottom of my keel mold (because I had visions of pouring my own lead
and making a one-piece lead keel). As I built my LM, I shifted my
molten lead plan to making a reinforced sheet-metal mold (which I
made). I figured I could place my lead into the mold, suspend it all
over a charcoal fire and use a leaf-blower to get things hot. The
metal mold would keep me from pouring molten lead into my mold (I read
about this plan on the old CSD newsletters. The leaf blower I saw
Bruce Hallman use). It seemed safer and easier to use my melting
vessel as my mold.

Summer wore on, and the sailing season was shrinking. Keel anxiety
filled my mind. And I still wasn't happy with how I would roll my 537
lb. floppy lead biscuit under my boat, stand it up on end (and not
have it fall over on its side) and (either) jack it up into the keel,
or lower my LM onto the lead biscuit. If something was not right, I
would have to remove it and trim. The keel would be slathered in
hardening epoxy.

I eventually bought 50 lb. lead shielding bricks. They were 2.5
inches wide (perfect) (they come in other thicknesses too), a bit too
long (I trimmed them), but they fit together with a little
chevron/bird's mouth. I slathered each with thickened epoxy, lifted
each one into my keel slot, drilled four holes and set bronze screws.
I made a wooden shoe (for the bottom of the slot), and then sealed
the whole unit up with rows of fiberglass tape, and covered it all
with fiberglass cloth. A "pieced" lead keel such as this is not as
strong as a one-piece lead keel. I don't know if the difference is
significant. Dan Gonneau had a pieced keel and sailed his LM for
years without trouble. I took that as a good sign.

As you probably know, there are multiple ways of making your lead. I
trust you have seen Lenihan's article on casting his Micro keel? Andy
Pryor had a one piece lead keel and slid it into place with a jack. He
wrote that it was far easier than he had envisioned (and installing
his lead was the last thing he did before launching). Other people
have used lead bricks, shot, etc. The only danger with piecing your
lead together is that your keel may come up light. If I had more time
I would have cast my own bricks (methinks 50 lbs is about right-
manageable) and used those.

That's my story. If you have other questions or want to see more
pictures of specific things, let me know. And if possible, please
post pictures. It's always exciting to see other boats in progress.

Bill, in Ohio

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Col" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Bill,
> I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for installing
> your keel - I have a Micro project underway and am trying to think
> ahead (keel anxiety I believe). I like your idea (gleaned from your
> pics) of building the total keel bar the lead and then pushing it in
> later - sounds like a less stressful process than some other methods
> I've read about. I'd like to have the boat all but completed before
> installing the lead to enable the boat to be wheeled around for as
> long as possible without all that weight in place. Using your method I
> could even paint the bottom while it was upside down and touch up the
> keel with a brush later on. Did you have a "dummy" plywood keel made
> up to make sure the real one fit when the moment came? Any other tips
> and tricks? Any traps to watch out for?
> Many thanks,
> Col
>
Hi Bill,
I was wondering if you could outline your procedure for installing
your keel - I have a Micro project underway and am trying to think
ahead (keel anxiety I believe). I like your idea (gleaned from your
pics) of building the total keel bar the lead and then pushing it in
later - sounds like a less stressful process than some other methods
I've read about. I'd like to have the boat all but completed before
installing the lead to enable the boat to be wheeled around for as
long as possible without all that weight in place. Using your method I
could even paint the bottom while it was upside down and touch up the
keel with a brush later on. Did you have a "dummy" plywood keel made
up to make sure the real one fit when the moment came? Any other tips
and tricks? Any traps to watch out for?
Many thanks,
Col
Yes I do. I finished it this year and have sailed it quite a bit.
Although you have inspired me to make somthing bigger better suited to
the Great Lakes. Maybe a Michalak Picara? It is about the same size
as Long Micro but does not have the keel so my thought was it would be
easier to trailer. Since dockage in Chicago land is so expensive.

Chris

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Chris,
> Thanks. My boat is right around East Harbor- weedy and shallow, but
> nice. Thus far I've been too busy with work (and detered by the rain
> we're getting) to get sailing again. With luck and fair winds I hope
> to head over to the islands this season.
>
> Don't you have a Philsboat?
>
> Bill
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Feller" <chrisbfeller@> wrote:
> >
> > Bill,
> >
> > Beautiful boat! You are also in a great location. I have
> > spent many nights anchored out in East Harbor. That part of Lake Erie
> > is my favorite place to sail. It was always my dream to build a Long
> > Micro and sail her on Lake Erie. I look forward to hearing about your
> > cruising adventures. If you are not familiar Put in bay is a great
> > place to go during the week. Very quiet and nice secure mooring.
> >
> > Chris Feller
> >
>
Chris,
Thanks. My boat is right around East Harbor- weedy and shallow, but
nice. Thus far I've been too busy with work (and detered by the rain
we're getting) to get sailing again. With luck and fair winds I hope
to head over to the islands this season.

Don't you have a Philsboat?

Bill

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Feller" <chrisbfeller@...> wrote:
>
> Bill,
>
> Beautiful boat! You are also in a great location. I have
> spent many nights anchored out in East Harbor. That part of Lake Erie
> is my favorite place to sail. It was always my dream to build a Long
> Micro and sail her on Lake Erie. I look forward to hearing about your
> cruising adventures. If you are not familiar Put in bay is a great
> place to go during the week. Very quiet and nice secure mooring.
>
> Chris Feller
>
Bill,

Beautiful boat! You are also in a great location. I have
spent many nights anchored out in East Harbor. That part of Lake Erie
is my favorite place to sail. It was always my dream to build a Long
Micro and sail her on Lake Erie. I look forward to hearing about your
cruising adventures. If you are not familiar Put in bay is a great
place to go during the week. Very quiet and nice secure mooring.

Chris Feller

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> I am pleased to announce the successful launch of my Long Micro (named
> Pugnacious) yesterday. It has been a very busy couple of days, so
> I'll post more details during the next week. But for now I wanted to
> share some pictures of the trailering, and my LM being slung into the
> placid waters of Lake Erie, Ohio (the USA side of Lake Erie. Across
> the water from Nels and Peter and one of the Bruce's). I spent the
> rest of my day stepping the mast and mizzen, running the rigging, and
> generally preparing my LM for lake duties. I was able to motor out
> into Lake Erie and raise the mizzen. There was almost no wind and
> time was running out, so it was a very short excursion and I have no
> useful information about how the LM sails. She does motor beautifully.
>
> In the next few days I will post my expenses and my building log
> (right around 900 hours of serious building time, not including
> running errands, sitting in the moaning chair, or day dreaming in my
> shop). At this point here are the useful tidbits I can pass along to
> fellow micro/LM builders and dreamers.
>
> 1. My LM fits comfortably onto a 16 foot flatbed trailer. The head of
> the mast hangs off the back of the trailer considerably, but it's at
> least 7 feet above the road and probably not a big (i.e., legal)
> concern for motoring.
> 2. I bought a 6 hp (4 stroke) Tohatsu long shaft (20") outboard with
> an alternator (the Tohatsu is the same as the small Mercury and Nissan
> outboards). The long shaft is the PERFECT length for an LM. The prop
> sits a few inches above the bottom of the keel, so it's well
> protected. The 25" shaft would be too long. I had to modify (notch
> the top of) the transom a bit so I could tilt the outboard upward.
> 3. With two of us aboard and the outboard cranked up to 80-90 percent
> power, the gps indicated speeds of 6.0 to 6.1 mph. There was almost
> no wind out, and the waters were calm.
>
> I have posted pictures of my LM on the trailer, and hanging in the
> sling. Ironically, I got so busy with rigging (etc.) that I failed to
> take any pictures of my LM in the water. When empty, however, it sits
> a little high on her lines. I think she sits about right with two
> people aboard (my LM is built a little heavy). I'll take and share
> more pictures soon.
>
> Finally, let me say that I have enjoyed participating in this group
> (for the past four years). I have learned a lot by reading what
> others have to say, and I've gleaned some excellent advice. I hope I
> have been helpful to others as well.
>
>http://personal.bgsu.edu/~kingw/boat/
>
> Bill, in Ohio
>
Dennis,
The hull and sides (up to the top cap) were sheathed in 6 oz
fiberglass and epoxy. The flooding wells and cockpit sole got 4 oz
cloth. I applied three coats of varnish. The 6 oz cloth has just a
hint of weave print through. You have to be within a foot of it, and
looking carefully, but you can see a little weave here and there.

I know well what you must be feeling as you try to complete your shoe
before winter. That was the story of my whole summer. Your sailing
season is longer than mine however. My marina will pull my LM on
October 15th. *frown*

Michael,
I think you requested interior pictures? I don't have any decent
pictures. It's hard to get a good shot of the interior since it's
rather small and hard to get a good perspective with my camera. I
built my bunk-area of the interior to the plans (two bunk flats, and a
little galley/cubby in the front). I lost most of the space under the
cockpit b/c I built a self-bailing cockpit. My interior is also
spartan. Some of it is epoxy coated ply, other parts have (white)
tinted epoxy, and still other parts paint. If you want an idea of
what the cabin layout is, I've posted five pictures (four are old and
before I attached the cabin top/deck). They give you a rough idea of
what the interior looks like. The fifth cabin picture shows the aft
end of the bunk area (and the storage area under the cockpit). This
fifth pic was taken while I was wiring, so I have cleaned up the
wiring and labeled everything.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "lancasterdennis" <dlancast@...> wrote:
>
> -
> Well in the end, you done good. I like the color combo. How many
> coats of varnish on the brightwork? I'm assuming epoxy underneath?
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "lancasterdennis" <dlancast@...> wrote:
>I'd like to see some pictures from the inside! Nice looking boat!!
> -
> Well in the end, you done good. I like the color combo. How many
> coats of varnish on the brightwork? I'm assuming epoxy underneath?
>
> Ahhhh.. splash date projected for my "Shoe" for end of this
summer..
> that still
> might happen, but by end of summer may mean 1st of November or I
may
> have to do one more winter. I need to get the boat out of the
garage
> and on the trailer before winter sets.. caw has to come in from the
> cold you know. In light of all this, I have upped my work hours..
> its
> every night during the week and full day on Fridays and where ever
I
> can fit time in on the weekend. Things are moving now. I have
> started my keel mockup today.
>
> Anxious to see some sailing pictures Bill, so go sailing!
>
> Regards,
>
> Dennis
> Bellingham, Wa.
>
>
>
>
> -- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@> wrote:
> >
> > Dennis,
> > Thanks for the congrats. I copied the idea of finishing the area
> > between the cap/rub rail bright from one of the first LM photos I
> ever
> > saw on the internet (the webpage is now gone and I cannot find the
> > picture anywhere). Some people can't stand the sight of varnished
> > plywood, but I'm the only boat in my marina with an appreciable
> amount
> > of bright work, even if it's only plywood.
> >
> > I had initially tried white sides with just a hint of green in
them,
> > but ended up with a startling visage of sea foam green. I used to
> > have a 1968 Ford pickup which was sea foam green (Ford marketed
it
> as
> > "lunar green" that year), so when people say my LM wearing the
same
> > color they started to wonder about me. I ended up repainting the
> > sides white, and I like them much better that way.
> >
> > When are you going to splash that shoe?
> >
> > Bill, in Ohio
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "lancasterdennis" <dlancast@>
wrote:
> > >
> > > --
> > > Hi Bill,
> > >
> > > Just want to congratulate you on the 'launch'... she looks
great
> and
> > > I can only imagine the wonderful feeling of seeing her get into
> the
> > > water for the first time. I also like your choice of color and
> > > having the area between the rub rail and cap rail bright is a
> very
> > > nice touch...just might do that on my "Old Shoe".
> > >
> > > Here is wishing you the very best.... fair winds and smooth
> sailin
> > > ahead.
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > >
> > > Dennis
> > > Bellingham, WA
> > >
> >
>
-
Well in the end, you done good. I like the color combo. How many
coats of varnish on the brightwork? I'm assuming epoxy underneath?

Ahhhh.. splash date projected for my "Shoe" for end of this summer..
that still
might happen, but by end of summer may mean 1st of November or I may
have to do one more winter. I need to get the boat out of the garage
and on the trailer before winter sets.. caw has to come in from the
cold you know. In light of all this, I have upped my work hours..
its
every night during the week and full day on Fridays and where ever I
can fit time in on the weekend. Things are moving now. I have
started my keel mockup today.

Anxious to see some sailing pictures Bill, so go sailing!

Regards,

Dennis
Bellingham, Wa.




-- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Dennis,
> Thanks for the congrats. I copied the idea of finishing the area
> between the cap/rub rail bright from one of the first LM photos I
ever
> saw on the internet (the webpage is now gone and I cannot find the
> picture anywhere). Some people can't stand the sight of varnished
> plywood, but I'm the only boat in my marina with an appreciable
amount
> of bright work, even if it's only plywood.
>
> I had initially tried white sides with just a hint of green in them,
> but ended up with a startling visage of sea foam green. I used to
> have a 1968 Ford pickup which was sea foam green (Ford marketed it
as
> "lunar green" that year), so when people say my LM wearing the same
> color they started to wonder about me. I ended up repainting the
> sides white, and I like them much better that way.
>
> When are you going to splash that shoe?
>
> Bill, in Ohio
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "lancasterdennis" <dlancast@> wrote:
> >
> > --
> > Hi Bill,
> >
> > Just want to congratulate you on the 'launch'... she looks great
and
> > I can only imagine the wonderful feeling of seeing her get into
the
> > water for the first time. I also like your choice of color and
> > having the area between the rub rail and cap rail bright is a
very
> > nice touch...just might do that on my "Old Shoe".
> >
> > Here is wishing you the very best.... fair winds and smooth
sailin
> > ahead.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Dennis
> > Bellingham, WA
> >
>
Congratulations on the launch, what a nice job, this is exciting!
Dennis,
Thanks for the congrats. I copied the idea of finishing the area
between the cap/rub rail bright from one of the first LM photos I ever
saw on the internet (the webpage is now gone and I cannot find the
picture anywhere). Some people can't stand the sight of varnished
plywood, but I'm the only boat in my marina with an appreciable amount
of bright work, even if it's only plywood.

I had initially tried white sides with just a hint of green in them,
but ended up with a startling visage of sea foam green. I used to
have a 1968 Ford pickup which was sea foam green (Ford marketed it as
"lunar green" that year), so when people say my LM wearing the same
color they started to wonder about me. I ended up repainting the
sides white, and I like them much better that way.

When are you going to splash that shoe?

Bill, in Ohio

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "lancasterdennis" <dlancast@...> wrote:
>
> --
> Hi Bill,
>
> Just want to congratulate you on the 'launch'... she looks great and
> I can only imagine the wonderful feeling of seeing her get into the
> water for the first time. I also like your choice of color and
> having the area between the rub rail and cap rail bright is a very
> nice touch...just might do that on my "Old Shoe".
>
> Here is wishing you the very best.... fair winds and smooth sailin
> ahead.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Dennis
> Bellingham, WA
>
--
Hi Bill,

Just want to congratulate you on the 'launch'... she looks great and
I can only imagine the wonderful feeling of seeing her get into the
water for the first time. I also like your choice of color and
having the area between the rub rail and cap rail bright is a very
nice touch...just might do that on my "Old Shoe".

Here is wishing you the very best.... fair winds and smooth sailin
ahead.

Best regards,

Dennis
Bellingham, WA


- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> I am pleased to announce the successful launch of my Long Micro
(named
> Pugnacious) yesterday. It has been a very busy couple of days, so
> I'll post more details during the next week. But for now I wanted
to
> share some pictures of the trailering, and my LM being slung into
the
> placid waters of Lake Erie, Ohio (the USA side of Lake Erie. Across
> the water from Nels and Peter and one of the Bruce's). I spent the
> rest of my day stepping the mast and mizzen, running the rigging,
and
> generally preparing my LM for lake duties. I was able to motor out
> into Lake Erie and raise the mizzen. There was almost no wind and
> time was running out, so it was a very short excursion and I have no
> useful information about how the LM sails. She does motor
beautifully.
>
> In the next few days I will post my expenses and my building log
> (right around 900 hours of serious building time, not including
> running errands, sitting in the moaning chair, or day dreaming in my
> shop). At this point here are the useful tidbits I can pass along
to
> fellow micro/LM builders and dreamers.
>
> 1. My LM fits comfortably onto a 16 foot flatbed trailer. The head
of
> the mast hangs off the back of the trailer considerably, but it's at
> least 7 feet above the road and probably not a big (i.e., legal)
> concern for motoring.
> 2. I bought a 6 hp (4 stroke) Tohatsu long shaft (20") outboard with
> an alternator (the Tohatsu is the same as the small Mercury and
Nissan
> outboards). The long shaft is the PERFECT length for an LM. The
prop
> sits a few inches above the bottom of the keel, so it's well
> protected. The 25" shaft would be too long. I had to modify (notch
> the top of) the transom a bit so I could tilt the outboard upward.
> 3. With two of us aboard and the outboard cranked up to 80-90
percent
> power, the gps indicated speeds of 6.0 to 6.1 mph. There was almost
> no wind out, and the waters were calm.
>
> I have posted pictures of my LM on the trailer, and hanging in the
> sling. Ironically, I got so busy with rigging (etc.) that I failed
to
> take any pictures of my LM in the water. When empty, however, it
sits
> a little high on her lines. I think she sits about right with two
> people aboard (my LM is built a little heavy). I'll take and share
> more pictures soon.
>
> Finally, let me say that I have enjoyed participating in this group
> (for the past four years). I have learned a lot by reading what
> others have to say, and I've gleaned some excellent advice. I hope
I
> have been helpful to others as well.
>
>http://personal.bgsu.edu/~kingw/boat/
>
> Bill, in Ohio
>
Hi all,
I am pleased to announce the successful launch of my Long Micro (named
Pugnacious) yesterday. It has been a very busy couple of days, so
I'll post more details during the next week. But for now I wanted to
share some pictures of the trailering, and my LM being slung into the
placid waters of Lake Erie, Ohio (the USA side of Lake Erie. Across
the water from Nels and Peter and one of the Bruce's). I spent the
rest of my day stepping the mast and mizzen, running the rigging, and
generally preparing my LM for lake duties. I was able to motor out
into Lake Erie and raise the mizzen. There was almost no wind and
time was running out, so it was a very short excursion and I have no
useful information about how the LM sails. She does motor beautifully.

In the next few days I will post my expenses and my building log
(right around 900 hours of serious building time, not including
running errands, sitting in the moaning chair, or day dreaming in my
shop). At this point here are the useful tidbits I can pass along to
fellow micro/LM builders and dreamers.

1. My LM fits comfortably onto a 16 foot flatbed trailer. The head of
the mast hangs off the back of the trailer considerably, but it's at
least 7 feet above the road and probably not a big (i.e., legal)
concern for motoring.
2. I bought a 6 hp (4 stroke) Tohatsu long shaft (20") outboard with
an alternator (the Tohatsu is the same as the small Mercury and Nissan
outboards). The long shaft is the PERFECT length for an LM. The prop
sits a few inches above the bottom of the keel, so it's well
protected. The 25" shaft would be too long. I had to modify (notch
the top of) the transom a bit so I could tilt the outboard upward.
3. With two of us aboard and the outboard cranked up to 80-90 percent
power, the gps indicated speeds of 6.0 to 6.1 mph. There was almost
no wind out, and the waters were calm.

I have posted pictures of my LM on the trailer, and hanging in the
sling. Ironically, I got so busy with rigging (etc.) that I failed to
take any pictures of my LM in the water. When empty, however, it sits
a little high on her lines. I think she sits about right with two
people aboard (my LM is built a little heavy). I'll take and share
more pictures soon.

Finally, let me say that I have enjoyed participating in this group
(for the past four years). I have learned a lot by reading what
others have to say, and I've gleaned some excellent advice. I hope I
have been helpful to others as well.

http://personal.bgsu.edu/~kingw/boat/

Bill, in Ohio