Re: [bolger] Re: Small Plywood Diesel Cruiser
Welcome to the Problem!
I looked at all these and wound up with the 20 foot "Sweet Caroline" hull
plans from Glen-L, will do my own cabin and accomodations... It would do
nicely at displacement speeds with a 4-stroke 9.9, and probably be very
competitive with the diesel on a life-cycle-cost basis.
Don Hodges
www.ecoastlife.com
I looked at all these and wound up with the 20 foot "Sweet Caroline" hull
plans from Glen-L, will do my own cabin and accomodations... It would do
nicely at displacement speeds with a 4-stroke 9.9, and probably be very
competitive with the diesel on a life-cycle-cost basis.
Don Hodges
www.ecoastlife.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakari Aaltonen <sakaria@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 23, 2000 11:49 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Small Plywood Diesel Cruiser
> Thank you for all the suggestions. My comments:
>
> BOLGER
> Tahiti is too big.
>
> DEVLIN
> Dipper is too small. Surf Scoter is too fast, i.e., meant
> for a *big* engine. Black Crown, Topknot, Czarinna: too big.
> By the way, the Devlin site lists boats that are not meant
> for amateur construction; plans are not available for Black
> Crown, say. Plans *are* available for Czarinna, no doubt
> a nice boat, but running at 0.75mpg or thereabouts would
> ruin me financially. Diesel is USD3.00 a gallon, here.
>
> DAVIS
> Jack Tar is not half bad, but the house is too small.
>
> STAMBAUGH
> The Redwing house is too *low*.
>
> HANKINSON
> Nordcoaster is pretty close to what I have in mind, but it
> does look a bit fat. Two berths is all I need.
>
> 1940 Richardson 34.5'
> (http://www.nemaine.com/classicboatworks/saleboats.html)
> Nice, but too big. And I'm really looking for plans, not a
> built boat.
>
>
> Sakari Aaltonen
>
>
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Threadmates:
I had the second thought that 'Czar' was actually designed
by William Garden. Turns out it was profiled with lines and
offsets as 'Tlingit' by Joel White in 'Plain and Fancy
Powerboats' for WB 96 as contrast to the magnificent 92'
wooden express motoryacht Czarrina.
A motor canoe. The Eastope was a 3 cylinder, 30 horsepower.
"Burns 2 gallons per hour while making ten knots." Made with
2 x 4s and plywood.
It was also shown from the designer's point of view with
pictures in Garden's more recently released book.
I'm not surprised Bolger panned the other Badger. As a
proposition, the Sailing Dory is not myth, but fallacy, to him.
Mark
I had the second thought that 'Czar' was actually designed
by William Garden. Turns out it was profiled with lines and
offsets as 'Tlingit' by Joel White in 'Plain and Fancy
Powerboats' for WB 96 as contrast to the magnificent 92'
wooden express motoryacht Czarrina.
A motor canoe. The Eastope was a 3 cylinder, 30 horsepower.
"Burns 2 gallons per hour while making ten knots." Made with
2 x 4s and plywood.
It was also shown from the designer's point of view with
pictures in Garden's more recently released book.
I'm not surprised Bolger panned the other Badger. As a
proposition, the Sailing Dory is not myth, but fallacy, to him.
Mark
>Yes I'm interested; thank you. I know of the Benford books, but
> Sakari,
> Have you perused any of Jay Benford's designs?
> ..........................Unfortunately, Benford doesn't post any of his
> designs on his web site: <http://www.tillerbooks.com/aboutbdg.htm>.
> Obviously, he wants you to buy his books to see his designs. I could
> scan and send you a couple of pages out of his _Cruising Designs_
> if you're interested.
have never got around to ordering.
> Glen L's 24' "Hercules" design, sort of a smallish trawler yacht, isIt looks almost identical to the Hankinson Nordcoaster. Fat and
> also appropriate for a small diesel, is built of plywood, sleeps two or
> four, and has full standing headroom.
top-heavy; it lacks a certain, shall we say, *sleekness*.
Sakari Aaltonen
Mark,
I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with such a boat by Benford, but my
book is from 1996, so it might be new. He did design a 40'
plywood skipjack (ketch rigged) and a series of sailing dories
from 30' to 37.5', the most famous of which is Pete and Annie
Hill's 34' junk schooner rigged Badger (not to be confused with
the "Badger" design by Phil Bolger). Btw, Bolger had some
sour things to say about this design after the Hills visited him
(note how I cleverly included the required Bolger connection
in this posting!). Are you sure you're not thinking of Czarina
by Devlin?
david
Mark Albanese wrote:
I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with such a boat by Benford, but my
book is from 1996, so it might be new. He did design a 40'
plywood skipjack (ketch rigged) and a series of sailing dories
from 30' to 37.5', the most famous of which is Pete and Annie
Hill's 34' junk schooner rigged Badger (not to be confused with
the "Badger" design by Phil Bolger). Btw, Bolger had some
sour things to say about this design after the Hills visited him
(note how I cleverly included the required Bolger connection
in this posting!). Are you sure you're not thinking of Czarina
by Devlin?
david
Mark Albanese wrote:
> David,
>
> What's the name of the Benford 60' dory with the 10 hp
> Easthope engine, or something? Czar?
> That's always been one beautiful and effective boat to me.
>
>
Mark,
Bill Gardner designed such a craft ( I think her name was Tillicum) which
served as a commuter in the Puget sound area very successfully. Small she
wasn't, and not diesel either. I guess she'd run all day on a cupful of
gasoline, though.
Jim
Mark Albanese wrote:
Bill Gardner designed such a craft ( I think her name was Tillicum) which
served as a commuter in the Puget sound area very successfully. Small she
wasn't, and not diesel either. I guess she'd run all day on a cupful of
gasoline, though.
Jim
Mark Albanese wrote:
> David,
>
> What's the name of the Benford 60' dory with the 10 hp
> Easthope engine, or something? Czar?
> That's always been one beautiful and effective boat to me.
>
> david wrote:
> >
> > Sakari,
> > Have you perused any of Jay Benford's designs? Pete Spectre
> > of _WoodenBoat_ once described them as being "so salty they'll
> > make your eyes rust".
>
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> Bolger rules:
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> - stay on topic
> - use punctuation
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David,
What's the name of the Benford 60' dory with the 10 hp
Easthope engine, or something? Czar?
That's always been one beautiful and effective boat to me.
david wrote:
What's the name of the Benford 60' dory with the 10 hp
Easthope engine, or something? Czar?
That's always been one beautiful and effective boat to me.
david wrote:
>
> Sakari,
> Have you perused any of Jay Benford's designs? Pete Spectre
> of _WoodenBoat_ once described them as being "so salty they'll
> make your eyes rust".
Sakari,
Have you perused any of Jay Benford's designs? Pete Spectre
of _WoodenBoat_ once described them as being "so salty they'll
make your eyes rust". Most of his boats are for pretty advanced
construction methods, but his 26', 27' and 30' deadrise boats and
his 25' tug yacht are appropriate for amateur plywood construction
(but certainly not stitch and glue). The deadrise boats have many
cabin and interior options. Also intriguing are his 20' and 24' "Friday
Harbor" ferry yachts, also plywood, lots of interior space for their
length, but, of course, they look like miniature ferry boats, right out
of Disney World. Unfortunately, Benford doesn't post any of his
designs on his web site: <http://www.tillerbooks.com/aboutbdg.htm>.
Obviously, he wants you to buy his books to see his designs. I could
scan and send you a couple of pages out of his _Cruising Designs_
if you're interested.
Glen L's 24' "Hercules" design, sort of a smallish trawler yacht, is
also appropriate for a small diesel, is built of plywood, sleeps two or
four, and has full standing headroom. The cockpit is kinda minimal,
but they also offer fishing boat with a cuddy on the same hull (call it
another name, however) See a photo at: <http://www.glen-l.com/>,
go to "price list for plans and kits", then to "C2: Cruisers 23' to 26',
and scroll down. I actually own plans for this one but I'll probably
never build it,
david
Have you perused any of Jay Benford's designs? Pete Spectre
of _WoodenBoat_ once described them as being "so salty they'll
make your eyes rust". Most of his boats are for pretty advanced
construction methods, but his 26', 27' and 30' deadrise boats and
his 25' tug yacht are appropriate for amateur plywood construction
(but certainly not stitch and glue). The deadrise boats have many
cabin and interior options. Also intriguing are his 20' and 24' "Friday
Harbor" ferry yachts, also plywood, lots of interior space for their
length, but, of course, they look like miniature ferry boats, right out
of Disney World. Unfortunately, Benford doesn't post any of his
designs on his web site: <http://www.tillerbooks.com/aboutbdg.htm>.
Obviously, he wants you to buy his books to see his designs. I could
scan and send you a couple of pages out of his _Cruising Designs_
if you're interested.
Glen L's 24' "Hercules" design, sort of a smallish trawler yacht, is
also appropriate for a small diesel, is built of plywood, sleeps two or
four, and has full standing headroom. The cockpit is kinda minimal,
but they also offer fishing boat with a cuddy on the same hull (call it
another name, however) See a photo at: <http://www.glen-l.com/>,
go to "price list for plans and kits", then to "C2: Cruisers 23' to 26',
and scroll down. I actually own plans for this one but I'll probably
never build it,
david
>
sorry I forgot dash, selway-fisher.com, all sorts of interesting things and very
pleasant to deal with Paul Fisher. Clyde
"Clyde S. Wisner" wrote:
pleasant to deal with Paul Fisher. Clyde
"Clyde S. Wisner" wrote:
> You might look at Selway Fisher.com in UK. Clyde
>
>StepHydro@...wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 06/24/2000 12:<BR49:<BR17 AM
> > Eastern Daylight,sakaria@...writes:> 1940 Richardson 34.5'
> > > (http://www.nemaine.com/classicboatworks/saleboats.html)
> > > Nice, but too big. And I'm really looking for plans, not a
> > > built boat.
> >
> > Sakari,
> >
> > I believe I've recently seen, on the net, plans for a ca. 1926 Alco cruiser,
> > about 26'. I didn't mark it, but I'll bet a search would turn it up.
> >
> > cheers/Step
> >
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> Bolger rules:
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You might look at Selway Fisher.com in UK. Clyde
StepHydro@...wrote:
StepHydro@...wrote:
> In a message dated 06/24/2000 12:<BR49:<BR17 AM
> Eastern Daylight,sakaria@...writes:> 1940 Richardson 34.5'
> > (http://www.nemaine.com/classicboatworks/saleboats.html)
> > Nice, but too big. And I'm really looking for plans, not a
> > built boat.
>
> Sakari,
>
> I believe I've recently seen, on the net, plans for a ca. 1926 Alco cruiser,
> about 26'. I didn't mark it, but I'll bet a search would turn it up.
>
> cheers/Step
>
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> Get Your FREE Online Credit Report!
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>
> Bolger rules:
> - no cursing
> - stay on topic
> - use punctuation
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - add content: send "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
>Yes, I like quiet, but a small diesel cruiser would also, as a rule,
> Sakari,
> Just to throw out another option... A used Catalina 22 or similar sailboat (swing
> keel, or remove/shorten the keel) and a Honda 8 hp will move you at a very quiet
> 6mph hull speed, and I'd bet the economy would be right up there with your diesel.
> (whisper quiet, no fumes) Then too, you could keep the sails.....
> There is a C22 on Tahoe with a 10 horse in a well. These rigs with trailer come
> as cheap as $2000. I know, it is not wood, but just a thought....
> Jim
have standing headroom. Small sailboats, as a rule, haven't.
Thank you,
Sakari Aaltonen
Sakari,
Just to throw out another option... A used Catalina 22 or similar sailboat (swing
keel, or remove/shorten the keel) and a Honda 8 hp will move you at a very quiet
6mph hull speed, and I'd bet the economy would be right up there with your diesel.
(whisper quiet, no fumes) Then too, you could keep the sails.....
There is a C22 on Tahoe with a 10 horse in a well. These rigs with trailer come
as cheap as $2000. I know, it is not wood, but just a thought....
Jim
Just to throw out another option... A used Catalina 22 or similar sailboat (swing
keel, or remove/shorten the keel) and a Honda 8 hp will move you at a very quiet
6mph hull speed, and I'd bet the economy would be right up there with your diesel.
(whisper quiet, no fumes) Then too, you could keep the sails.....
There is a C22 on Tahoe with a 10 horse in a well. These rigs with trailer come
as cheap as $2000. I know, it is not wood, but just a thought....
Jim
>You probably mean Elco (as sold by www.databoat.com, for example.)
> I believe I've recently seen, on the net, plans for a ca. 1926 Alco cruiser,
> about 26'. I didn't mark it, but I'll bet a search would turn it up.
>
> cheers/Step
The plans are certainly cheap at USD65 or so, but... The cockpit
is too long.
It's becoming evident that looks matter a great deal to me.
There is an article at Duckworks about the Magellan Challenge
that mentions and shows the prototype boat, Pazapa from Australia.
The specs are very close to mine, but the boat looks...
Well...
Thank you,
Sakari Aaltonen
In a message dated 06/24/2000 4:<BR02:<BR04 AM
Eastern Daylight ,sakaria@...writes:
Then put a 30 hp in it!! A boat designed for 300 hp will go approximately as
fast on 30 hp as will a boat designed for 30 hp (PCB wrote this up in one of
his SBJ cartoons). Now, it may make a larger wake at "30 hp speed" than the
other boat, but not necessarily.
Cheers/Step
Eastern Daylight ,sakaria@...writes:
> But wait--a 200hp engine? *30hp* is plenty to me...Sakari,
Then put a 30 hp in it!! A boat designed for 300 hp will go approximately as
fast on 30 hp as will a boat designed for 30 hp (PCB wrote this up in one of
his SBJ cartoons). Now, it may make a larger wake at "30 hp speed" than the
other boat, but not necessarily.
Cheers/Step
In a message dated 06/24/2000 12:<BR49:<BR17 AM
Eastern Daylight,sakaria@...writes:> 1940 Richardson 34.5'
I believe I've recently seen, on the net, plans for a ca. 1926 Alco cruiser,
about 26'. I didn't mark it, but I'll bet a search would turn it up.
cheers/Step
Eastern Daylight,sakaria@...writes:> 1940 Richardson 34.5'
> (http://www.nemaine.com/classicboatworks/saleboats.html)Sakari,
> Nice, but too big. And I'm really looking for plans, not a
> built boat.
I believe I've recently seen, on the net, plans for a ca. 1926 Alco cruiser,
about 26'. I didn't mark it, but I'll bet a search would turn it up.
cheers/Step
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Small Plywood Diesel CruiserI agree--the 28-footer with the longer house looks even better
>
> Sakari,
> Heres a beauty
>http://www.downeastboats.com/26.htm
> Jeff Gilbert
to me. Then again, this appears to be company that builds and
sells boats, that is, they don't sell plans.
But wait--a 200hp engine? *30hp* is plenty to me...
Sakari Aaltonen
----- Original Message -----
From: Sakari Aaltonen <sakaria@...>
To: Jeff Gilbert <jgilbert@...>
Sent: Saturday, June 24, 2000 4:24 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Small Plywood Diesel Cruiser
Sakari,
Heres a beauty
http://www.downeastboats.com/26.htm
Jeff Gilbert