Re: [bolger] UltraPly

A uni-directional core is just what we _don't_ want in a boat. That four
ply core is the same as a single ply as far as strength is concerned. If
the face plies are good and thick the Ultraply would be OK, about like
good three ply, but if the face plies are painted on, like those on el
cheapo lauan, then the strength won't be any better than the el cheapo
stuff.

On Tue, 18 Sep 2007 17:09:54 -0700, Garth wrote:

> ...
> (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
> ...
> º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> ...

--
John <jkohnen@...>
A society that gets rid of all its troublemakers goes downhill.
<Robert A. Heinlein>

Jim -

I noticed the different smell, too. Must be something about the glue they use.

You must make tough joints! I was able to use a router and roundover bit for the chine/bottom joint -- took about 10 minutes. Of course, I was only cutting through the ply, the pine I used for the chine log and a tiny layer of epoxy.

I guess you can be confident in those joints!

DC

---- Jim Kessler <jkess777@...> wrote:

> David,
> Funny mine had an outer plank looking face. Might have been that
> particular patch I don't know. A local lumber yard carries it here
> because of the warrenty. Some vynal companies won't warrent thier
> vynal flooring unless ultraply is used.
>
> Mine was also in the 20+ dollar range. I sent an e-mail to thier
> customer service guy with a link to my boatsite I'm waiting for what
> thier reply will be conscerning useing thier product for boats.
>
> I will personally use it on all my boats. Both sides clear saves alot
> of time and money while building.
>
> The only drawback was the inability to use a flushbit to fair up the
> sides to the bottom of the scooner. Either the ultraply was to
> difficult doubled or the fillit material I used combined with the
> ultraply was to overwhelming. I had no chioce but to use an ele hand
> planer.
>
> This material smells different than any ply I have ever cut I guess
> due to the glue and materials used.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
> >
> > I had the same experience as related here -- in "torture" testing,
> I found the Ultraply to be as tough as any other 1/4-inch ply.
> The "score and snap" video cracks me up. Unless you score through and
> into the bottom veneer, there is no way you can snap it (well -- I
> WAS able to snap it by clamping along the edge of my workbench at the
> score line and using all of my 226 pounds on the overhanging piece --
> the resulting edge was ripped and jagged).
> >
> > I paid $21 or $22 bucks at a local hardware store/building supply
> center. i think he ordered a pallet of it for a specific local
> contractor who ended up not using all of it. I don't know if he'll
> have any in the future, so I bought enough to build a couple of small
> kayaks/canoes in addition to what I needed for the AF3.
> >
> > There are 4 plies -- all look to be the same thickness. I don't
> understand the comments about the face being a combination of many
> pieces -- mine looks like a standard piece of plywood. Their web site
> says something about parallel veneers in the center or some such
> thing, but again, the pieces I have seem to have the inner veneers
> NOT parallel -- the end grain is much darker on one than the other.
> >
> > Last night I put two pieces in the dishwasher and put another in a
> pot of boiling water for 90 minutes. They all look exactly the same
> as before the test -- all edges solid; no delamination whatsoever.
> >
> > I started a photo album here on the Bolger group entitled "Michalak
> AF3." There's a close up of the plies there.
> >
> > David C
> >
> > It's a real pleasure to work with - both
> >
> >
> > ---- Jim Kessler <jkess777@...> wrote:
> > > Hello all,
> > > I used Ultraply on this boat
> > >http://www.valsarae.com/blank.em?pid=699835
> > > I was first very sceptical of using it until I did my own type of
> > > tests on it comparing it to regular ply. I found it just a tough
> or
> > > tougher so all my reserves vanished.
> > > It would be great for a onesided bright boat. If you lay it out
> > > properly it looks like a planked boat because of the planked
> style
> > > face. The face isn't a single piece of veneer as regular ply but
> made
> > > up of multi pieces running the length. It can be seen in some of
> the
> > > building pics. I was going to keep part of the boat bright but
> during
> > > building one side caught on fire by a propane heater to close to
> the
> > > boat while flipping it. So it was repaired and painted.
> > >
> > > I would not build a boat with this material without glassing the
> > > exterior hull. I used oilbase paint to finish the inside in a way
> > > that gave a deep impergnation of oil. Both I think are needed.
> > >
> > > Jim
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi David --
> > > >
> > > > You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop
> right
> > > > now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> > > > (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
> > > >
> > > > The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does
> the "no
> > > > voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But
> the
> > > > "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . .
> Though
> > > > perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Âº 15 year warranty
> > > > Âº 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> > > > Âº 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> > > > Âº Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> > > > Âº Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> > > > Âº The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> > > > Âº Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> > > > Âº Solid back
> > > > Âº Solid core
> > > > Âº High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not
> delaminate
> > > > Âº Select hardwood construction
> > > > Âº Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> > > > Âº No callbacks!
> > > > Âº Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render
> plywood
> > > > unusable as underlayment
> > > > Âº Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> > > > >
> > > > > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not
> seen it
> > > > at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> > > > >
> > > > > DC
> > > > >
> > > > > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > > > > Hi David --
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the
> enquiring
> > > minds in
> > > > > > this group?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Garth
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Bolger rules!!!
> > > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> > > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
> flogging dead horses
> > > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
> posts
> > > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> > > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
> 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> > > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
>subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

David,
If you go to the second page of the scooner build site in the third
picture down you can see the final finished piece of the bottom
installed. On that piece you can clearly see the planked look of the
ultraply. All my sheets had that plank look.

Jim

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "David" <arbordg@...> wrote:
>
> So it appears that the 2 core plies are perpendicular to the 2 face
> plies. That's encouraging. And the 4 plies are close to equal
> thickness. That's encouraging. And you've done your own strength
test.
> That's encouraging. And the price is right.
>
> You've decided to invest your time and money in trust to this
> material. That's encouraging. I might be encouraged enough to build
> (being the cynical, surly, old curmudgeon I am) a semi-disposable
> boat, like a Puddle Duck Racer. If you - and other early adopters -
> are still happy with your choice in 10 years, I might venture the
use
> of this material in a more time-consuming boat design.
>
> God, have I gotten conservative in my old age, or what <G>
>
> Cheers,
> David Graybeal
> Portland, OR
>
> "If a liberal is a conservative who's been jailed unfairly, a
> conservative is a liberal who's been mugged"
>
> ***********
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> >
> > I had the same experience as related here -- in "torture"
testing, I
> found the Ultraply to be as tough as any other 1/4-inch ply. The
> "score and snap" video cracks me up. Unless you score through and
into
> the bottom veneer, there is no way you can snap it (well -- I WAS
able
> to snap it by clamping along the edge of my workbench at the score
> line and using all of my 226 pounds on the overhanging piece -- the
> resulting edge was ripped and jagged).
> >
> > I paid $21 or $22 bucks at a local hardware store/building supply
> center. i think he ordered a pallet of it for a specific local
> contractor who ended up not using all of it. I don't know if he'll
> have any in the future, so I bought enough to build a couple of
small
> kayaks/canoes in addition to what I needed for the AF3.
> >
> > There are 4 plies -- all look to be the same thickness. I don't
> understand the comments about the face being a combination of many
> pieces -- mine looks like a standard piece of plywood. Their web
site
> says something about parallel veneers in the center or some such
> thing, but again, the pieces I have seem to have the inner veneers
NOT
> parallel -- the end grain is much darker on one than the other.
> >
> > Last night I put two pieces in the dishwasher and put another in a
> pot of boiling water for 90 minutes. They all look exactly the same
> as before the test -- all edges solid; no delamination whatsoever.
> >
> > I started a photo album here on the Bolger group
entitled "Michalak
> AF3." There's a close up of the plies there.
> >
> > David C
> >
> > It's a real pleasure to work with - both
>

David,
Funny mine had an outer plank looking face. Might have been that
particular patch I don't know. A local lumber yard carries it here
because of the warrenty. Some vynal companies won't warrent thier
vynal flooring unless ultraply is used.

Mine was also in the 20+ dollar range. I sent an e-mail to thier
customer service guy with a link to my boatsite I'm waiting for what
thier reply will be conscerning useing thier product for boats.

I will personally use it on all my boats. Both sides clear saves alot
of time and money while building.

The only drawback was the inability to use a flushbit to fair up the
sides to the bottom of the scooner. Either the ultraply was to
difficult doubled or the fillit material I used combined with the
ultraply was to overwhelming. I had no chioce but to use an ele hand
planer.

This material smells different than any ply I have ever cut I guess
due to the glue and materials used.

Jim

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
>
> I had the same experience as related here -- in "torture" testing,
I found the Ultraply to be as tough as any other 1/4-inch ply.
The "score and snap" video cracks me up. Unless you score through and
into the bottom veneer, there is no way you can snap it (well -- I
WAS able to snap it by clamping along the edge of my workbench at the
score line and using all of my 226 pounds on the overhanging piece --
the resulting edge was ripped and jagged).
>
> I paid $21 or $22 bucks at a local hardware store/building supply
center. i think he ordered a pallet of it for a specific local
contractor who ended up not using all of it. I don't know if he'll
have any in the future, so I bought enough to build a couple of small
kayaks/canoes in addition to what I needed for the AF3.
>
> There are 4 plies -- all look to be the same thickness. I don't
understand the comments about the face being a combination of many
pieces -- mine looks like a standard piece of plywood. Their web site
says something about parallel veneers in the center or some such
thing, but again, the pieces I have seem to have the inner veneers
NOT parallel -- the end grain is much darker on one than the other.
>
> Last night I put two pieces in the dishwasher and put another in a
pot of boiling water for 90 minutes. They all look exactly the same
as before the test -- all edges solid; no delamination whatsoever.
>
> I started a photo album here on the Bolger group entitled "Michalak
AF3." There's a close up of the plies there.
>
> David C
>
> It's a real pleasure to work with - both
>
>
> ---- Jim Kessler <jkess777@...> wrote:
> > Hello all,
> > I used Ultraply on this boat
> >http://www.valsarae.com/blank.em?pid=699835
> > I was first very sceptical of using it until I did my own type of
> > tests on it comparing it to regular ply. I found it just a tough
or
> > tougher so all my reserves vanished.
> > It would be great for a onesided bright boat. If you lay it out
> > properly it looks like a planked boat because of the planked
style
> > face. The face isn't a single piece of veneer as regular ply but
made
> > up of multi pieces running the length. It can be seen in some of
the
> > building pics. I was going to keep part of the boat bright but
during
> > building one side caught on fire by a propane heater to close to
the
> > boat while flipping it. So it was repaired and painted.
> >
> > I would not build a boat with this material without glassing the
> > exterior hull. I used oilbase paint to finish the inside in a way
> > that gave a deep impergnation of oil. Both I think are needed.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi David --
> > >
> > > You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop
right
> > > now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> > > (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
> > >
> > > The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does
the "no
> > > voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But
the
> > > "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . .
Though
> > > perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
> > >
> > >
> > > Âº 15 year warranty
> > > Âº 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> > > Âº 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> > > Âº Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> > > Âº Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> > > Âº The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> > > Âº Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> > > Âº Solid back
> > > Âº Solid core
> > > Âº High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not
delaminate
> > > Âº Select hardwood construction
> > > Âº Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> > > Âº No callbacks!
> > > Âº Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render
plywood
> > > unusable as underlayment
> > > Âº Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> > > >
> > > > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not
seen it
> > > at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> > > >
> > > > DC
> > > >
> > > > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > > > Hi David --
> > > > >
> > > > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the
enquiring
> > minds in
> > > > > this group?
> > > > >
> > > > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > > > >
> > > > > Garth
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Bolger rules!!!
> > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
flogging dead horses
> > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
posts
> > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> > - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-
subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

A correction -- The outer laminates ARE thinner than the two inner layers.

DC

So it appears that the 2 core plies are perpendicular to the 2 face
plies. That's encouraging. And the 4 plies are close to equal
thickness. That's encouraging. And you've done your own strength test.
That's encouraging. And the price is right.

You've decided to invest your time and money in trust to this
material. That's encouraging. I might be encouraged enough to build
(being the cynical, surly, old curmudgeon I am) a semi-disposable
boat, like a Puddle Duck Racer. If you - and other early adopters -
are still happy with your choice in 10 years, I might venture the use
of this material in a more time-consuming boat design.

God, have I gotten conservative in my old age, or what <G>

Cheers,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR

"If a liberal is a conservative who's been jailed unfairly, a
conservative is a liberal who's been mugged"

***********

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
>
> I had the same experience as related here -- in "torture" testing, I
found the Ultraply to be as tough as any other 1/4-inch ply. The
"score and snap" video cracks me up. Unless you score through and into
the bottom veneer, there is no way you can snap it (well -- I WAS able
to snap it by clamping along the edge of my workbench at the score
line and using all of my 226 pounds on the overhanging piece -- the
resulting edge was ripped and jagged).
>
> I paid $21 or $22 bucks at a local hardware store/building supply
center. i think he ordered a pallet of it for a specific local
contractor who ended up not using all of it. I don't know if he'll
have any in the future, so I bought enough to build a couple of small
kayaks/canoes in addition to what I needed for the AF3.
>
> There are 4 plies -- all look to be the same thickness. I don't
understand the comments about the face being a combination of many
pieces -- mine looks like a standard piece of plywood. Their web site
says something about parallel veneers in the center or some such
thing, but again, the pieces I have seem to have the inner veneers NOT
parallel -- the end grain is much darker on one than the other.
>
> Last night I put two pieces in the dishwasher and put another in a
pot of boiling water for 90 minutes. They all look exactly the same
as before the test -- all edges solid; no delamination whatsoever.
>
> I started a photo album here on the Bolger group entitled "Michalak
AF3." There's a close up of the plies there.
>
> David C
>
> It's a real pleasure to work with - both

I had the same experience as related here -- in "torture" testing, I found the Ultraply to be as tough as any other 1/4-inch ply. The "score and snap" video cracks me up. Unless you score through and into the bottom veneer, there is no way you can snap it (well -- I WAS able to snap it by clamping along the edge of my workbench at the score line and using all of my 226 pounds on the overhanging piece -- the resulting edge was ripped and jagged).

I paid $21 or $22 bucks at a local hardware store/building supply center. i think he ordered a pallet of it for a specific local contractor who ended up not using all of it. I don't know if he'll have any in the future, so I bought enough to build a couple of small kayaks/canoes in addition to what I needed for the AF3.

There are 4 plies -- all look to be the same thickness. I don't understand the comments about the face being a combination of many pieces -- mine looks like a standard piece of plywood. Their web site says something about parallel veneers in the center or some such thing, but again, the pieces I have seem to have the inner veneers NOT parallel -- the end grain is much darker on one than the other.

Last night I put two pieces in the dishwasher and put another in a pot of boiling water for 90 minutes. They all look exactly the same as before the test -- all edges solid; no delamination whatsoever.

I started a photo album here on the Bolger group entitled "Michalak AF3." There's a close up of the plies there.

David C

It's a real pleasure to work with - both

---- Jim Kessler <jkess777@...> wrote:

> Hello all,
> I used Ultraply on this boat
>http://www.valsarae.com/blank.em?pid=699835
> I was first very sceptical of using it until I did my own type of
> tests on it comparing it to regular ply. I found it just a tough or
> tougher so all my reserves vanished.
> It would be great for a onesided bright boat. If you lay it out
> properly it looks like a planked boat because of the planked style
> face. The face isn't a single piece of veneer as regular ply but made
> up of multi pieces running the length. It can be seen in some of the
> building pics. I was going to keep part of the boat bright but during
> building one side caught on fire by a propane heater to close to the
> boat while flipping it. So it was repaired and painted.
>
> I would not build a boat with this material without glassing the
> exterior hull. I used oilbase paint to finish the inside in a way
> that gave a deep impergnation of oil. Both I think are needed.
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@...> wrote:
> >
> > Hi David --
> >
> > You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop right
> > now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> > (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
> >
> > The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does the "no
> > voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But the
> > "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . . Though
> > perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
> >
> >
> > º 15 year warranty
> > º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> > º 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> > º Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> > º Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> > º The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> > º Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> > º Solid back
> > º Solid core
> > º High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not delaminate
> > º Select hardwood construction
> > º Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> > º No callbacks!
> > º Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render plywood
> > unusable as underlayment
> > º Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> > >
> > > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen it
> > at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> > >
> > > DC
> > >
> > > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > > Hi David --
> > > >
> > > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring
> minds in
> > > > this group?
> > > >
> > > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > > >
> > > > Garth
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Hello all,
I used Ultraply on this boat
http://www.valsarae.com/blank.em?pid=699835
I was first very sceptical of using it until I did my own type of
tests on it comparing it to regular ply. I found it just a tough or
tougher so all my reserves vanished.
It would be great for a onesided bright boat. If you lay it out
properly it looks like a planked boat because of the planked style
face. The face isn't a single piece of veneer as regular ply but made
up of multi pieces running the length. It can be seen in some of the
building pics. I was going to keep part of the boat bright but during
building one side caught on fire by a propane heater to close to the
boat while flipping it. So it was repaired and painted.

I would not build a boat with this material without glassing the
exterior hull. I used oilbase paint to finish the inside in a way
that gave a deep impergnation of oil. Both I think are needed.

Jim

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@...> wrote:
>
> Hi David --
>
> You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop right
> now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
>
> The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does the "no
> voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But the
> "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . . Though
> perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
>
>
> º 15 year warranty
> º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> º 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> º Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> º Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> º The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> º Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> º Solid back
> º Solid core
> º High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not delaminate
> º Select hardwood construction
> º Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> º No callbacks!
> º Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render plywood
> unusable as underlayment
> º Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> >
> > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> >
> > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen it
> at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> >
> > DC
> >
> > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > Hi David --
> > >
> > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring
minds in
> > > this group?
> > >
> > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > >
> > > Garth
> >
>

Interesting stuff. There are several things, though, that aren't clear
from their website. First, thickness of face veneers. Is this
nominally 4 equal plies? I'd hope so. Second, grain orientation. Are
the inner two plies perpendicular or parallel (my assumption) to the
face veneers? What's the pricing like? That's a big part of the
decision making process.

It appears that this product was developed with unidirectional veneers
in order to make underlayment installation quicker. That would work
well for floors, where there is no twisting or cross-grain sheer
stress. In fact, very little dynamic loading at all. By going
unidirectional, they've compromised some of the typical benefits of
plywood: stability; cross-grain strength.

I could see this material stripped up and used as planks for plywood
lapstrake construction. The grain orientation might even be better -
or at least more like real lumber - than standard plywood.

I could also see it used to cover the hull of a larger boat, where one
needed to use multiple layers, and could alternate the grain
orientation a bit.

Thinking back to the various boats I've worked on, they were all 1/4"
stitch & glue or screw & glue hulls. Bolger Long Light Dory. Storer
Goat Island Skiff. D5's. Puddle Duck Racer. I wouldn't be comfortable
using unidirectional plywood on any of them - even if it survives the
boil test.

Of course, this is all EasyChair Engineering. I'm certainly willing to
reconsider if someone does some actual strength testing, so we can
compare.

Cheers,
David Graybeal
Portland, OR

"When facts are few, experts are many"

*****************

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Kessler" <jkess777@...> wrote:
>
> It doesn't score and snap as they show in thier vids. It's tough
> stuff. Max over at duckworks used it on 2 boats and actually asked me
> where I got mine because he wanted more and couldnt find it.
>
> Jim

It doesn't score and snap as they show in thier vids. It's tough
stuff. Max over at duckworks used it on 2 boats and actually asked me
where I got mine because he wanted more and couldnt find it.

Jim

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Anderson" <bawrytr@...> wrote:
>
> I remember seeing at least a couple of boats being put together with
> UltraPly, a light schooner as I recall. As I remember one side of
the
> plywood was printed with UltraPly in giant letters -- not so good if
> one wants to finish both sides bright. Garth, maybe if you kick this
> one over to DW forum somebody will have some long-term practical
> experience with the stuff.
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi David --
> >
> > You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop right
> > now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> > (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
> >
> > The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does the "no
> > voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But the
> > "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . .
Though
> > perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
> >
> >
> > º 15 year warranty
> > º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> > º 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> > º Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> > º Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> > º The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> > º Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> > º Solid back
> > º Solid core
> > º High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not delaminate
> > º Select hardwood construction
> > º Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> > º No callbacks!
> > º Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render
plywood
> > unusable as underlayment
> > º Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> > >
> > > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen
it
> > at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> > >
> > > DC
> > >
> > > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > > Hi David --
> > > >
> > > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring
> minds in
> > > > this group?
> > > >
> > > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > > >
> > > > Garth
> > >
> >
>

I remember seeing at least a couple of boats being put together with
UltraPly, a light schooner as I recall. As I remember one side of the
plywood was printed with UltraPly in giant letters -- not so good if
one wants to finish both sides bright. Garth, maybe if you kick this
one over to DW forum somebody will have some long-term practical
experience with the stuff.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "GarthAB" <garth@...> wrote:
>
> Hi David --
>
> You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop right
> now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
> (http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).
>
> The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does the "no
> voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But the
> "score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . . Though
> perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.
>
>
> º 15 year warranty
> º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
> º 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
> º Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
> º Approved by major flooring manufacturers
> º The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
> º Clear face with no defects = very smooth
> º Solid back
> º Solid core
> º High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not delaminate
> º Select hardwood construction
> º Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
> º No callbacks!
> º Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render plywood
> unusable as underlayment
> º Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@> wrote:
> >
> > Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
> >
> > I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen it
> at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> >
> > DC
> >
> > ---- GarthAB <garth@> wrote:
> > > Hi David --
> > >
> > > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring
minds in
> > > this group?
> > >
> > > Also -- where did you buy it?
> > >
> > > Garth
> >
>

Hi David --

You're probably stewing up a little UltraPly on the stovetop right
now, but I thought I'd share this from the UltraPly website
(http://www.morelandcompany.com/ultraply.htm).

The "marine grade phenolic glue line" sounds good. As does the "no
voids" part, and the "guaranteed not to delaminate" part. But the
"score and snap for easy installation" -- not so much. . . . Though
perhaps we could do that with any thin plywood.

º 15 year warranty
º 4 ply uni-directional core = added stability
º 4 x 8 and 4 x 4 size available for convenience
º Score and snaps with a knife for easy installation
º Approved by major flooring manufacturers
º The FIRST underlayment guaranteed against "yellowing"
º Clear face with no defects = very smooth
º Solid back
º Solid core
º High solid marine grade phenolic glue line - will not delaminate
º Select hardwood construction
º Guaranteed not to warp, buckle, or delaminate
º No callbacks!
º Guaranteed not to have core voids or core laps that render plywood
unusable as underlayment
º Calibrated 5.5 mm thickness to ensure consistency

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
>
> Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.
>
> I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen it
at Lowe's or Home Depot.
>
> DC
>
> ---- GarthAB <garth@...> wrote:
> > Hi David --
> >
> > Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring minds in
> > this group?
> >
> > Also -- where did you buy it?
> >
> > Garth
>

I'm was really hoping to keep my boat out of compost piles.

(sorry . . . couldn't resist ;)

DC

---- Rick Bedard <sctree@...> wrote:

> For plywood going into a boat of any long term value I like to cut two pieces about an inch wide and a foot long. Place one offcut on a shelf in the workshop and stick the second halfway into a compost pile leaving the other half exposed to the elements. Wait a month or so, cut up the test pieces and then make your decision.
>
> Rick
>
> GarthAB <garth@...> wrote: Hi David --
>
> Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring minds in
> this group?
>
> Also -- where did you buy it?
>
> Garth
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
> >
> > I'm building a Michalak AF3 out of a floor underlayment product
> trade names "UltraPly." I've finished the bottom and am getting ready
> to sand and paint before flipping back onto the trailer to add the
> decks, etc.
> >
> > Cost me around$22/sheet, and it's really nice to work with. Really
> smooth sides - no voids.
> >
> > I have some pictures in the photo section at the group
> "Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3"
> > The link is :
> >
>http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3/photos/browse/708e
> >
> > I can put some photos up here, if you'd like.
> >
> > David C.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Good idea -- I'll do one tonight.

I bought it at my local Servistar hardware store. I've not seen it at Lowe's or Home Depot.

DC

---- GarthAB <garth@...> wrote:

> Hi David --
>
> Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring minds in
> this group?
>
> Also -- where did you buy it?
>
> Garth
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
> >
> > I'm building a Michalak AF3 out of a floor underlayment product
> trade names "UltraPly." I've finished the bottom and am getting ready
> to sand and paint before flipping back onto the trailer to add the
> decks, etc.
> >
> > Cost me around$22/sheet, and it's really nice to work with. Really
> smooth sides - no voids.
> >
> > I have some pictures in the photo section at the group
> "Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3"
> > The link is :
> >
>http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3/photos/browse/708e
> >
> > I can put some photos up here, if you'd like.
> >
> > David C.
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

For plywood going into a boat of any long term value I like to cut two pieces about an inch wide and a foot long. Place one offcut on a shelf in the workshop and stick the second halfway into a compost pile leaving the other half exposed to the elements. Wait a month or so, cut up the test pieces and then make your decision.

Rick

GarthAB <garth@...> wrote: Hi David --

Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring minds in
this group?

Also -- where did you buy it?

Garth

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
>
> I'm building a Michalak AF3 out of a floor underlayment product
trade names "UltraPly." I've finished the bottom and am getting ready
to sand and paint before flipping back onto the trailer to add the
decks, etc.
>
> Cost me around$22/sheet, and it's really nice to work with. Really
smooth sides - no voids.
>
> I have some pictures in the photo section at the group
"Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3"
> The link is :
>
http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3/photos/browse/708e
>
> I can put some photos up here, if you'd like.
>
> David C.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi David --

Could you do a boil test on an offcut, for all the enquiring minds in
this group?

Also -- where did you buy it?

Garth

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, David Cassidy <d.cassidy@...> wrote:
>
> I'm building a Michalak AF3 out of a floor underlayment product
trade names "UltraPly." I've finished the bottom and am getting ready
to sand and paint before flipping back onto the trailer to add the
decks, etc.
>
> Cost me around$22/sheet, and it's really nice to work with. Really
smooth sides - no voids.
>
> I have some pictures in the photo section at the group
"Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3"
> The link is :
>
http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3/photos/browse/708e
>
> I can put some photos up here, if you'd like.
>
> David C.

I'm building a Michalak AF3 out of a floor underlayment product trade names "UltraPly." I've finished the bottom and am getting ready to sand and paint before flipping back onto the trailer to add the decks, etc.

Cost me around$22/sheet, and it's really nice to work with. Really smooth sides - no voids.

I have some pictures in the photo section at the group "Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3"
The link is :
http://ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/Michalak_Boats_Photos_Only_3/photos/browse/708e

I can put some photos up here, if you'd like.

David C.

---- Gene T <goldranger02-boats@...> wrote:

> Michael,
> Could you tell me some more about this Floor Laminate Material of which you speak. I haven't been to the store but on line didn't provide any information. Not even sure what I'd be looking for. What department, how big??? Thanks.
>
> Sincerely, Gene T.
>
> "We may have all come on different ships, but we are in the same boat now" -- Rev. Martin Luther King
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Michael <skipper-mike@...>
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 11:57:44 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: 5.2 mm luan Gypsy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I would not bother with Luan for anything exterior. Especially a boat.
>
> If you want a thin, well glued material available at your local Home
>
> Depot. Use their floor laminate material.
>
> Using a Weenie Roller and West System or some other 2 part epoxy such as
>
> MAS. Simply mix the material, add some Acitone to thin (wet out0 and
>
> roll it on both sides and edges (after cutting to your needed size)
>
> This will seal the grain fairly deep.
>
> Ofcourse, it will need an extra coat after final construction.
>
>
>
> This floor laminate sells for about $17.00 per sheet right now at our
>
> local Home Depot.
>
> --- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, "mkriley48" <mkriley@... > wrote:
>
> >
>
> > hi,
>
> > I did boat repair for many years in florida and a very large portion
>
> > of my income was derived from removing luan from boats. many times the
>
> > stuff delaminiated so badly it it resembled the pages of a book. Also
>
> > the wood itself is about the most rot prone going. It composts
>
> > readily. all the oriental boats have to under go massive
>
> > reconstruction due to plywood failure.
>
> > a parting note is that home depot ALWAYS buys from the cheapest
>
> vender.
>
> > mike
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > --- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, "ksapelkin" iiqtub5086@ wrote:
>
> > >
>
> > > Hello,
>
> > >
>
> > > Just bought some 5.2 mm luan from Home Depot to construct a Gypsy.
>
> > > Now am having second thoughts. It feels pretty flimsy.
>
> > >
>
> > > I thought to encapsulate in epoxy and glass both sides of the hull,
>
> > > frames etc. Maybe 10 oz glass on the inside bottom and 4 oz on the
>
> > > sides and frames. Or 4 oz all over the inside.
>
> > >
>
> > > Is this plywood ok for this application?
>
> > >
>
> > > Thanks,
>
> > >
>
> > > Kirill
>
> > >
>
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Michael,
Could you tell me some more about this Floor Laminate Material of which you speak. I haven't been to the store but on line didn't provide any information. Not even sure what I'd be looking for. What department, how big??? Thanks.

Sincerely, Gene T.

"We may have all come on different ships, but we are in the same boat now" -- Rev. Martin Luther King

----- Original Message ----
From: Michael <skipper-mike@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 11:57:44 AM
Subject: [bolger] Re: 5.2 mm luan Gypsy

I would not bother with Luan for anything exterior. Especially a boat.

If you want a thin, well glued material available at your local Home

Depot. Use their floor laminate material.

Using a Weenie Roller and West System or some other 2 part epoxy such as

MAS. Simply mix the material, add some Acitone to thin (wet out0 and

roll it on both sides and edges (after cutting to your needed size)

This will seal the grain fairly deep.

Ofcourse, it will need an extra coat after final construction.

This floor laminate sells for about $17.00 per sheet right now at our

local Home Depot.

--- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, "mkriley48" <mkriley@... > wrote:

>

> hi,

> I did boat repair for many years in florida and a very large portion

> of my income was derived from removing luan from boats. many times the

> stuff delaminiated so badly it it resembled the pages of a book. Also

> the wood itself is about the most rot prone going. It composts

> readily. all the oriental boats have to under go massive

> reconstruction due to plywood failure.

> a parting note is that home depot ALWAYS buys from the cheapest

vender.

> mike

>

>

>

>

>

>

> --- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, "ksapelkin" iiqtub5086@ wrote:

> >

> > Hello,

> >

> > Just bought some 5.2 mm luan from Home Depot to construct a Gypsy.

> > Now am having second thoughts. It feels pretty flimsy.

> >

> > I thought to encapsulate in epoxy and glass both sides of the hull,

> > frames etc. Maybe 10 oz glass on the inside bottom and 4 oz on the

> > sides and frames. Or 4 oz all over the inside.

> >

> > Is this plywood ok for this application?

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> > Kirill

> >

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]