Re: [bolger] Re: What boat!
Thanks for that website! I love the 15' Cat.
Hajo
Hajo
On Dec 30, 2007 5:54 AM, graeme19121984 <graeme19121984@...> wrote:
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com<bolger%40yahoogroups.com>,
> "aquatronclaus" <dragoboats@...> wrote:
> > Micro seems more and more genius to me, so when I get
> > that far to the keel work, I must take it from there, maybe with a
> > little help (one of my best friends is Morten Olesen
> > www.boatplans.dk) a Danish Naval Architect (he knows my weakness
> > for Bolger)
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <dragoboats@...> wrote:
then. From his 19' Hjerting pram pictures:
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=21&of=41&id=29
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=22&of=41&id=29
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=41&of=41&id=29
I know my weakness for dories! Any and all dories! Oh dear... :-)
Cheers
Graeme
> Micro seems more and more genius to me, so when I getAh, I think Morten would know something of ballasted salient keels
> that far to the keel work, I must take it from there, maybe with a
> little help (one of my best friends is Morten Olesen
> www.boatplans.dk) a Danish Naval Architect (he knows my weakness
> for Bolger)
then. From his 19' Hjerting pram pictures:
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=21&of=41&id=29
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=22&of=41&id=29
http://www.boatplans.dk/pictures.asp?no=41&of=41&id=29
I know my weakness for dories! Any and all dories! Oh dear... :-)
Cheers
Graeme
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dnjost" <davidjost@...> wrote:
Claus
>David!Thank you, i renember this page, but couldn´t find it, so many thanks!
Claus
> Claus -
>
> I found where I put my old web page on Micro.
>http://mysite.verizon.net/vzeokhsb/Micro.htm
>
> Some stuff might be helpful here.
>
> Hard to believe I was doing this so long ago.
>
> David Jost
>
Claus -
I found where I put my old web page on Micro.
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzeokhsb/Micro.htm
Some stuff might be helpful here.
Hard to believe I was doing this so long ago.
David Jost
I found where I put my old web page on Micro.
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzeokhsb/Micro.htm
Some stuff might be helpful here.
Hard to believe I was doing this so long ago.
David Jost
Use the bevel tool and take the bevels right off the plans. Then set
your circular saw to the same bevel, double check it and then cut.
The only frame I had an issue with was the bow transom, despite the
warning in the construction plans to be careful here. I wound up
really screwing up the first one so badly I had to build a second.
Fortunately, that is the smallest piece of plywood on the boat. Build
oversize and cut to plans.
prebeveling the ply seems like a lot of extra work to me. IMHO.
David Jost
"having ruminations on Birdwatcher, Clam Skiff, and a June Bug all at
once" "There is no such thing as too many boats."
your circular saw to the same bevel, double check it and then cut.
The only frame I had an issue with was the bow transom, despite the
warning in the construction plans to be careful here. I wound up
really screwing up the first one so badly I had to build a second.
Fortunately, that is the smallest piece of plywood on the boat. Build
oversize and cut to plans.
prebeveling the ply seems like a lot of extra work to me. IMHO.
David Jost
"having ruminations on Birdwatcher, Clam Skiff, and a June Bug all at
once" "There is no such thing as too many boats."
On Dec 28, 2007 3:14 AM, Col <cmoone11@...> wrote:
with the 'Simpson' framing hardware. Those fat galvanized nails drive
with a hammer nicely into the lead casting. The entire keel is
freeflooded, so there is no need to worry about any of those things.
No epoxy is needed to hold the lead ballast, the nails hold fine. The
keel doesn't really use 'timber' as it is built from plain old
construction 2x4 lumber and plain 1/4" exterior plywood. Also, a
fair finish on the keel is worthwhile only for the 'looks pretty'
factor, and you cannot see the keel easily so you don't need to worry
about recessing or patching the nail holes. Neither is fiberglass
needed on the keel.
Still, I love the type of boat that has all the 'looks pretty' just
right, and if that is the type of boat you want I say go for it! Just
keep in mind that a Micro doesn't need the 'looks pretty' to be a
great and useful utility boat.
After five years of life and enjoyment, my Micro has developed a
crust, dirt and patina which totally obscures a couple hundred wasted
hours working on 'looks pretty' which was in hindsight was just lost
time.
(Just trying to keep the marine growth on the bottom makes the thought
of worrying about filling the nail holes from the keel seem
insignifiant.)
>I used the short fat 'Simpson' nails, they sell at Home Depot for use
> I will go "back to the future" a bit with my Micro keel construction
> and its use of nails, I haven't used boat nails before on my previous
> boats, having used screws only to hold plywood/timber in place until
> the epoxy glue dries. To achieve a fair finish on the keel sides, and
> a result that will keep out water, do you bang them in flush with the
> ply and then fibreglass over? The ply doesn't seem thick enough to
> effectively recess/fill each nail head.
> Cheers,
> Col
with the 'Simpson' framing hardware. Those fat galvanized nails drive
with a hammer nicely into the lead casting. The entire keel is
freeflooded, so there is no need to worry about any of those things.
No epoxy is needed to hold the lead ballast, the nails hold fine. The
keel doesn't really use 'timber' as it is built from plain old
construction 2x4 lumber and plain 1/4" exterior plywood. Also, a
fair finish on the keel is worthwhile only for the 'looks pretty'
factor, and you cannot see the keel easily so you don't need to worry
about recessing or patching the nail holes. Neither is fiberglass
needed on the keel.
Still, I love the type of boat that has all the 'looks pretty' just
right, and if that is the type of boat you want I say go for it! Just
keep in mind that a Micro doesn't need the 'looks pretty' to be a
great and useful utility boat.
After five years of life and enjoyment, my Micro has developed a
crust, dirt and patina which totally obscures a couple hundred wasted
hours working on 'looks pretty' which was in hindsight was just lost
time.
(Just trying to keep the marine growth on the bottom makes the thought
of worrying about filling the nail holes from the keel seem
insignifiant.)
Many thanks for all your attention and advises, I had some designs in
my mind, the Micro always has been my favorite # 1 boat, only the
keel seemed to be a challenge, but after reading different plans over
and over again, Micro seems more and more genius to me, so when I get
that far to the keel work, I must take it from there, maybe with a
little help (one of my best friends is Morten Olesen
www.boatplans.dk) a Danish Naval Architect (he knows my weakness for
Bolger) I now will start up slowly with cutting the bulkheads, by the
way, beveling has also been a little problem how to do, this time I
will try to cut out the ply for the bulkheads with the bevels on the
plans, and glue prebeveled framesticks on them, will there be a
problem doing it this way?
Best regards
Claus - Denmark
my mind, the Micro always has been my favorite # 1 boat, only the
keel seemed to be a challenge, but after reading different plans over
and over again, Micro seems more and more genius to me, so when I get
that far to the keel work, I must take it from there, maybe with a
little help (one of my best friends is Morten Olesen
www.boatplans.dk) a Danish Naval Architect (he knows my weakness for
Bolger) I now will start up slowly with cutting the bulkheads, by the
way, beveling has also been a little problem how to do, this time I
will try to cut out the ply for the bulkheads with the bevels on the
plans, and glue prebeveled framesticks on them, will there be a
problem doing it this way?
Best regards
Claus - Denmark
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Col" <cmoone11@...> wrote:
>
>
> I will go "back to the future" a bit with my Micro keel
construction
> and its use of nails, I haven't used boat nails before on my
previous
> boats, having used screws only to hold plywood/timber in place
until
> the epoxy glue dries. To achieve a fair finish on the keel sides,
and
> a result that will keep out water, do you bang them in flush with
the
> ply and then fibreglass over? The ply doesn't seem thick enough to
> effectively recess/fill each nail head.
> Cheers,
> Col
>
> > It is a matter of personal opinion and taste of course. I would be
> > afraid my bolts wouldn't line up with my bolt holes. And/or my
bolt
> > holes would find a way to leak. The Bolger method calls for nails
> > instead of bolts. And, I found the process of driving nails
through
> > the plywood into the lead very simple, easy, cheap and, more
> > important: Tolerant of dimensional imperfections.
> >
> >
>
I will go "back to the future" a bit with my Micro keel construction
and its use of nails, I haven't used boat nails before on my previous
boats, having used screws only to hold plywood/timber in place until
the epoxy glue dries. To achieve a fair finish on the keel sides, and
a result that will keep out water, do you bang them in flush with the
ply and then fibreglass over? The ply doesn't seem thick enough to
effectively recess/fill each nail head.
Cheers,
Col
and its use of nails, I haven't used boat nails before on my previous
boats, having used screws only to hold plywood/timber in place until
the epoxy glue dries. To achieve a fair finish on the keel sides, and
a result that will keep out water, do you bang them in flush with the
ply and then fibreglass over? The ply doesn't seem thick enough to
effectively recess/fill each nail head.
Cheers,
Col
> It is a matter of personal opinion and taste of course. I would be
> afraid my bolts wouldn't line up with my bolt holes. And/or my bolt
> holes would find a way to leak. The Bolger method calls for nails
> instead of bolts. And, I found the process of driving nails through
> the plywood into the lead very simple, easy, cheap and, more
> important: Tolerant of dimensional imperfections.
>
>
There's also Jason Stancil's Micro "Multum in Parvo" (Much in Little).
Many suggested and actual mods are archived here from msg #34587 to
launch at #46125 ("I build a micro navigator, but with a
offcenterboard, internal ballast and a huge single balanced lug sail.")
Jason's launch photos are in bolger6 group files:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger6/files/jason%27s%20navigator%
20like%20boat/
Graeme
Many suggested and actual mods are archived here from msg #34587 to
launch at #46125 ("I build a micro navigator, but with a
offcenterboard, internal ballast and a huge single balanced lug sail.")
Jason's launch photos are in bolger6 group files:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger6/files/jason%27s%20navigator%
20like%20boat/
Graeme
--- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bill" <kingw@...> wrote:
>
> Claus,
> I know of two lee-board, internal ballast micros. "Zoon" and Roger
> Keyes' "Paloma Blanca."
Claus,
I know of two lee-board, internal ballast micros. "Zoon" and Roger
Keyes' "Paloma Blanca." Paloma was initially built without the keel
and used water ballast, but Roger later built a keel and ballast.
Roger's exploits sailing his micro can be found in the files section
of the Bolger 7 group (in the Paloma Blanca file). It's great reading.
I would still build with a ballasted keel, however.
Bill, Long micro builder/skipper.
I know of two lee-board, internal ballast micros. "Zoon" and Roger
Keyes' "Paloma Blanca." Paloma was initially built without the keel
and used water ballast, but Roger later built a keel and ballast.
Roger's exploits sailing his micro can be found in the files section
of the Bolger 7 group (in the Paloma Blanca file). It's great reading.
I would still build with a ballasted keel, however.
Bill, Long micro builder/skipper.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Grome <bagacayboatworks@...> wrote:
>
> > Have you heard of any Micros with internal
> > ballast? - I have seen one A2 in Bolger 4
> > with a lug sail??
>
>
> Claus,
>
> If you use internal ballast it will no longer be a Micro, and it may
not
> perform the way you would like.
>
> I don't see why so many people are so afraid of melting and pouring
lead
> anyways. It's no big deal. Naturally it makes sense to learn how to
> do it properly before you try it, but please don't let it scare you.
> It is really easy.
>
> Sincerely,
> Ken Grome
> Bagacay Boatworks
> www.bagacayboatworks.com
>
> I found one of these lead selleers on ebay (of whom there are many)I saw a posting a couple years back from a guy who had contacted a
> who was willing to cast the lead in fairly large ingots for me,
> 46 pound ones, the correct thickness for the keel, 1.5 inches.
> All I had to do was cut a curve on one end to fit them to the
> shoe keel, fit them side by side tightly, cut the bottom edge
> to fit the sheathing, and bed them well in thickened epoxy.
> They were very easy to cut on my small bandsaw, or to hand-plan
> a little for better fits.-- Mason Smith
firm that provides lead sheathing for medical offices with X-ray
machines (and radioactive hazards, too, I suppose). They are used to
supply sheets in various thicknesses, and were happy to provide a
sheet in any desired thickness. I don't remember if they would cut to
shape, but that's not too hard, as Mason describes above. The excess
pieces can be sold back to the vendor. It seems like a pretty good
deal, and I'd look into it if I were building a boat with a flat
casting like a Micro.
> However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method withIt is a matter of personal opinion and taste of course. I would be
> traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
> boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
afraid my bolts wouldn't line up with my bolt holes. And/or my bolt
holes would find a way to leak. The Bolger method calls for nails
instead of bolts. And, I found the process of driving nails through
the plywood into the lead very simple, easy, cheap and, more
important: Tolerant of dimensional imperfections.
I confess, getting dimensions exactly right is not my style.
Especially dimensions measured over long distances of curved surface,
like with boats.
The beauty of the Bolger Micro design is that it is a 'big' capable
boat which, through elegant simplicity (thank the genius of PCB), can
be achievable by ordinary folks with simply skills and a small
pocketbook.
Essentially every deviation from the plans makes her more costly and
time consuming to build.
That is not to say that a Micro cannot be made more expensive and
complex, and sometimes can be improved in that process. But the Micro
does not *have* to be so. Hundreds have been built exactly per plans,
with total satisfaction.
Bob,
When I built my micro, I bought 25# canvas bags of lead birdshot from
the reloader supply, estimated the packing at 75%, and increased the
side area of the ballast while maintaining the CG. I potted them with
polyester resin (which got pretty hot!), assuming they'd bulge the
sides over time without it. The fill lead/air ratio was more like 50%,
so it came out 25% light. I did this upside down, on the boat, so
rolling it was exciting.
I added a full-length iron strap/shoe to the bottom of the keel to
restore the righting moment, which was nice.
Gregg Carlson
When I built my micro, I bought 25# canvas bags of lead birdshot from
the reloader supply, estimated the packing at 75%, and increased the
side area of the ballast while maintaining the CG. I potted them with
polyester resin (which got pretty hot!), assuming they'd bulge the
sides over time without it. The fill lead/air ratio was more like 50%,
so it came out 25% light. I did this upside down, on the boat, so
rolling it was exciting.
I added a full-length iron strap/shoe to the bottom of the keel to
restore the righting moment, which was nice.
Gregg Carlson
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Slimak" <otter55806@...> wrote:
> I'll bet that I once had the most unusual lead ballast. When I built
> my Roberts Spray 28 back in the early '80s I used 4000 lbs of smashed
> bullets from the Minneapolis PD firing range! They were being forced
> to shut down when the dangers of lead fumes became known. For a long
> time they had been pouring their own lead wadcutters and reloading to
> make practice affordable for the officers. This was being done right
> in the basement of City Hall, I believe. Anyway, it had to stop, and
> they had to get rid of the lead, so I took it. Each lead wadcutter,
> when it hit the steel back plates of the range, smashed flat into
> wafers a bit smaller than a quarter in diameter and so thin it took
> several to get the same thickness as a quarter. When poured into the
> ballast space they fit together tightly, like fish scales, so I saw
> no reason to melt them down. I simply bolted on a cover plate and
> epoxy/glassed over it so nothing would go flying in case of a
> knockdown.
>
> Bob
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dnjost" <davidjost@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I just received news that one member (whom I know is lurking in the
> > background), cut his lead into small chunks, turned the boat on
> it's
> > side, sheathed 1/2, then epoxied his chunks in place. No pouring.
> >
> > Rumor has it, that it was a successful build and seems plenty
> strong
> > enough.
> >
> > However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method with
> > traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
> > boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
> >
> > It is a great boat and I wouldn't let the keel stop me.
> >
> > David Jost
> > former Micro owner. Birdwatcher and Clam skiff under way
> >
>
One small correction to David's post, from the member who made a good Micro keel without pouring lead. I found one of these lead selleers on ebay (of whom there are many) who was willing to cast the lead in fairly large ingots for me, 46 pound ones, the correct thickness for the keel, 1.5 inches. All I had to do was cut a curve on one end to fit them to the shoe keel, fit them side by side tightly, cut the bottom edge to fit the sheathing, and bed them well in thickened epoxy. They were very easy to cut on my small bandsaw, or to hand-plan a little for better fits.-- Mason Smith
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'll bet that I once had the most unusual lead ballast. When I built
my Roberts Spray 28 back in the early '80s I used 4000 lbs of smashed
bullets from the Minneapolis PD firing range! They were being forced
to shut down when the dangers of lead fumes became known. For a long
time they had been pouring their own lead wadcutters and reloading to
make practice affordable for the officers. This was being done right
in the basement of City Hall, I believe. Anyway, it had to stop, and
they had to get rid of the lead, so I took it. Each lead wadcutter,
when it hit the steel back plates of the range, smashed flat into
wafers a bit smaller than a quarter in diameter and so thin it took
several to get the same thickness as a quarter. When poured into the
ballast space they fit together tightly, like fish scales, so I saw
no reason to melt them down. I simply bolted on a cover plate and
epoxy/glassed over it so nothing would go flying in case of a
knockdown.
Bob
my Roberts Spray 28 back in the early '80s I used 4000 lbs of smashed
bullets from the Minneapolis PD firing range! They were being forced
to shut down when the dangers of lead fumes became known. For a long
time they had been pouring their own lead wadcutters and reloading to
make practice affordable for the officers. This was being done right
in the basement of City Hall, I believe. Anyway, it had to stop, and
they had to get rid of the lead, so I took it. Each lead wadcutter,
when it hit the steel back plates of the range, smashed flat into
wafers a bit smaller than a quarter in diameter and so thin it took
several to get the same thickness as a quarter. When poured into the
ballast space they fit together tightly, like fish scales, so I saw
no reason to melt them down. I simply bolted on a cover plate and
epoxy/glassed over it so nothing would go flying in case of a
knockdown.
Bob
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dnjost" <davidjost@...> wrote:
>
>
> I just received news that one member (whom I know is lurking in the
> background), cut his lead into small chunks, turned the boat on
it's
> side, sheathed 1/2, then epoxied his chunks in place. No pouring.
>
> Rumor has it, that it was a successful build and seems plenty
strong
> enough.
>
> However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method with
> traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
> boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
>
> It is a great boat and I wouldn't let the keel stop me.
>
> David Jost
> former Micro owner. Birdwatcher and Clam skiff under way
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "dnjost" <davidjost@...> wrote:
It was exactly the way I wanted to do it!!
Claus
>
>
> I just received news that one member (whom I know is lurking in the
> background), cut his lead into small chunks, turned the boat on
it's
> side, sheathed 1/2, then epoxied his chunks in place. No pouring.
>
> Rumor has it, that it was a successful build and seems plenty
strong
> enough.
>
> However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method with
> traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
> boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
>
> It is a great boat and I wouldn't let the keel stop me.
>
> David Jost
> former Micro owner. Birdwatcher and Clam skiff under way
>
I just received news that one member (whom I know is lurking in the
background), cut his lead into small chunks, turned the boat on it's
side, sheathed 1/2, then epoxied his chunks in place. No pouring.
Rumor has it, that it was a successful build and seems plenty strong
enough.
However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method with
traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
It is a great boat and I wouldn't let the keel stop me.
David Jost
former Micro owner. Birdwatcher and Clam skiff under way
background), cut his lead into small chunks, turned the boat on it's
side, sheathed 1/2, then epoxied his chunks in place. No pouring.
Rumor has it, that it was a successful build and seems plenty strong
enough.
However, if I were to do it again I would use Peter's method with
traditional keel bolts. It would have been far easier to place the
boat over the keel and just bolt in place.
It is a great boat and I wouldn't let the keel stop me.
David Jost
former Micro owner. Birdwatcher and Clam skiff under way
Otter "1" is a great boat, and it should satisfy your requirement for
an easy build... But it is only a little more boat than AF3. From
your other choices, and especially your interest in Micro, I have a
feeling you're needing a boat that has more room. Go the Anhinga!
Graeme
an easy build... But it is only a little more boat than AF3. From
your other choices, and especially your interest in Micro, I have a
feeling you're needing a boat that has more room. Go the Anhinga!
Graeme
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <dragoboats@...> wrote:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/micro/index.htm
No sweat!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan
>room
> I will start up a new boatproject up soon, after some advise in this
> forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel??? Is it
> possible to make the Micro with internal ballast, there should be
> for it??Lead keel for a Micro? No problem! See here:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/micro/index.htm
No sweat!
Sincerely,
Peter Lenihan
Hi Chris,
...snip...
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
...snip...
> I amI believe it's called AS19. Gaff rig, inside ballast, and leeboards.
> sure that one could design a boat like this that sails very well.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
I know what you mean by not being able to get a design out of you
head. I have always though about build a Long Micro. I bought the
plans many years ago. The biggest reason I never built it is the sail
rig. The mast is 30 feet long just too long for my meager 19 foot
long garage. Also the keel seems a bit cumbersome on the trailer.
But regardless of these reasons I really like the design. Maybe I
will build it someday with a balanced lug or gaff rig.
I am sure that the Micro would work with internal ballast and while
you are at it you could use a lee board instead of the keel. However
as someone else said at that point you are building a different boat
than Micro. But then again that is probably not a bad thing. I am
sure that one could design a boat like this that sails very well.
Chris Feller
head. I have always though about build a Long Micro. I bought the
plans many years ago. The biggest reason I never built it is the sail
rig. The mast is 30 feet long just too long for my meager 19 foot
long garage. Also the keel seems a bit cumbersome on the trailer.
But regardless of these reasons I really like the design. Maybe I
will build it someday with a balanced lug or gaff rig.
I am sure that the Micro would work with internal ballast and while
you are at it you could use a lee board instead of the keel. However
as someone else said at that point you are building a different boat
than Micro. But then again that is probably not a bad thing. I am
sure that one could design a boat like this that sails very well.
Chris Feller
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <dragoboats@...> wrote:
>
> I will start up a new boatproject up soon, after some advise in this
> forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel??? Is it
> possible to make the Micro with internal ballast, there should be room
> for it?? The 15,6 Lake Launch I have seen in the files on this side,
> where can I purchase the plans, I am from Denmark and need to pay with
> credit card, Pay Pal etc. I will cut the frames etc. for Micro and
> maybe also for the Lake Launch here in the winther and make the
> assambly work outside in the Summer, last I build boats was also two
> boats at the same time (Sea Wolf Kayak from Selway Fisher and the
> Piccup squared from Michalak, I like to work on two projects at the
> same time.
>
> Have you heard of any Micros with internalClaus,
> ballast? - I have seen one A2 in Bolger 4
> with a lug sail??
If you use internal ballast it will no longer be a Micro, and it may not
perform the way you would like.
I don't see why so many people are so afraid of melting and pouring lead
anyways. It's no big deal. Naturally it makes sense to learn how to
do it properly before you try it, but please don't let it scare you.
It is really easy.
Sincerely,
Ken Grome
Bagacay Boatworks
www.bagacayboatworks.com
> Hey Claus..if you do melt that lead in an old pot on a camp stove, beRead the lead MSDS for the hazards of melting lead
> sure to do it outside and stay upwind of it..sniff too much of those lead
> fumes
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=9&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.teckcominco.com%2FDocumentViewer.aspx%3FelementId%3D115443%26portalName%3Dtc&ei=1_luR530Aqn8pgSvhZyuDw&usg=AFQjCNGqIRhBT1c5VDXL3TTVTrQ_s1q7jA&sig2=gqLY7Xwz4_cZCkLyya-pZQ
By all means be careful and melt lead with good ventilation, but in my
opinion the fumes issue doesn't get serious unless you overheat the
lead. And, in my experience, it is hard to generate enough heat to
get it barely pass the melting point.
For instance, you don't get a lot of 'steam' off of water at 33
degrees F., but at 100 degrees you get a lot of steam. Lead at 622
degrees has just barely melted.
In my opinion the bigger risks are that it is heavy, and that if mixed
with water it spatters violently. Also, be aware that molten lead is
liquid, with a viscosity similar to water. Keep things bone dry, wear
boots, gloves and goggles to protect yourself from the spatter risk.
Hey Claus..if you do melt that lead in an old pot on a camp stove, be
sure to do it outside and stay upwind of it..sniff too much of those lead fumes
and you'll wind up talkin' like Anna Nicole Smith or Ralph the Cable Guy.
Tyson in Galveston
**************************************
See AOL's top
rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop00030000000004)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sure to do it outside and stay upwind of it..sniff too much of those lead fumes
and you'll wind up talkin' like Anna Nicole Smith or Ralph the Cable Guy.
Tyson in Galveston
**************************************
See AOL's top
rated recipes (http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop00030000000004)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
OK Bruce, I will try that when I am that far and the make the decission
then, I hope to cut some parts here in the Christmas days. Have you
heard of any Micros with internal ballast? - I have seen one A2 in
Bolger 4 with a lug sail??
Claus
www.baadhuset.com
>
> > forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel???
>
> Before you give up on a true blue Micro, I suggest you get your hands
> on 10 pounds of lead, a camp stove and an old pot. Melt the lead and
> see how it is easy to do, then imagine doing it on a Micro keel.
>
> forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel???Before you give up on a true blue Micro, I suggest you get your hands
on 10 pounds of lead, a camp stove and an old pot. Melt the lead and
see how it is easy to do, then imagine doing it on a Micro keel.
I will start up a new boatproject up soon, after some advise in this
forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel??? Is it
possible to make the Micro with internal ballast, there should be room
for it?? The 15,6 Lake Launch I have seen in the files on this side,
where can I purchase the plans, I am from Denmark and need to pay with
credit card, Pay Pal etc. I will cut the frames etc. for Micro and
maybe also for the Lake Launch here in the winther and make the
assambly work outside in the Summer, last I build boats was also two
boats at the same time (Sea Wolf Kayak from Selway Fisher and the
Piccup squared from Michalak, I like to work on two projects at the
same time.
forum, I can´t get the Micro out of my head, but the keel??? Is it
possible to make the Micro with internal ballast, there should be room
for it?? The 15,6 Lake Launch I have seen in the files on this side,
where can I purchase the plans, I am from Denmark and need to pay with
credit card, Pay Pal etc. I will cut the frames etc. for Micro and
maybe also for the Lake Launch here in the winther and make the
assambly work outside in the Summer, last I build boats was also two
boats at the same time (Sea Wolf Kayak from Selway Fisher and the
Piccup squared from Michalak, I like to work on two projects at the
same time.
Hi there!
For me it is not a matter of use, it is more to build a boat, I am
boatdealer in Denmark and have many options to gp on water, my
homebuilt boat will be used on day trips on some lakes here in
Denmark, the Musicbox looks quite interresting, but the Viola may
look even more interresting to me, I will get hold in the plans, I
want chine logs, external rudder, leeboards, internal ballast and a
simple rig, Sharpie or lugsail, that is the perfect project for me,
maybe the Micro with internal ballast and still the keel?
Claus
Denmark
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Feller" <chrisbfeller@...>
wrote:
For me it is not a matter of use, it is more to build a boat, I am
boatdealer in Denmark and have many options to gp on water, my
homebuilt boat will be used on day trips on some lakes here in
Denmark, the Musicbox looks quite interresting, but the Viola may
look even more interresting to me, I will get hold in the plans, I
want chine logs, external rudder, leeboards, internal ballast and a
simple rig, Sharpie or lugsail, that is the perfect project for me,
maybe the Micro with internal ballast and still the keel?
Claus
Denmark
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Feller" <chrisbfeller@...>
wrote:
>varied.
> You might consider the Musicbox2 or Musicbox3 if you like the Micro
> and want to avoid the keel. The boats you mentioned are quite
> Many of them have a different mission than the others. For exampleday
> the Jessie Cooper is a small live aboard cruser where the AF3 is a
> sailer with the ability to camp cruse.with
>
> What type of sailing do you plan to do?
>
> 1. What body of water?
> 2. Do you plan on going on long cruses or just mostly day sailing
> the occasional overnighter?docked?
> 3. How many people will be coming along?
> 4. Is self righting an important feature to you?
> 5. Do you plan on trailering the boat or will it be moored or
>wrote:
> Answers to these questions will bring you closer to a decision about
> which type you might want. Then you can choose between many options
> in each category.
>
> Just remember that many people believe that the smallest boat that
> fits your mission will get the most use and enjoyment.
>
> Chris Feller
>
> For example if you mostly day sail with the ocasional overnight
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <aquatronboat@>
> >Michalak
> > I have build a Selway Seawolf kayak and a Picup Squared from
> > for a couple of years ago, now I want to try something bigger, itis
> > hard to choose, it must not be too complicated, I think of theMicro,
> > but the lead keel is a challenge for me I guess, I am thinking ofthe
> > Jessie Cooper or the Martha Jane but really don´t know if the arewill me
> > to "heavy" for me to build, the Anhinga or the Otter I will be my
> > choise, am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats
> > the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straightforeward,
> > but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
> > Cooper.
> >
>
I am talking about Otter I, I have had the plans for anhinga for
years, I think I paid 50 bucks for them (secondhand). I also will
take a closer look on Michalak Musicbox and the Viola as well!
Can I use internal ballast for the micro and still make the keel
without ballast?
Claus
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@...>
wrote:
years, I think I paid 50 bucks for them (secondhand). I also will
take a closer look on Michalak Musicbox and the Viola as well!
Can I use internal ballast for the micro and still make the keel
without ballast?
Claus
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@...>
wrote:
>doing
> Which Otter? 1, or II?
>
> Don't be put off by the lead keels - there are various ways of
> it, without too much sweat, as many have found.the
>
> Jesse Cooper and Martha Jane are bigger builds than the others you
> mention, and of course JC is quite a bigger job than MJ. (Consider
> fit out too.) You haven't mentioned Long Micro which probably givesa
> lot more bang for the effort and cost than do either MJ or JC.build,
>
> I think Anhinga would be the easiest and least complicated to
> hands down, but there has only been one other built, and so it iswrote:
> pretty much an unknown quantity in so far as its performance goes.
>
> By the way, what did the Anhinga plans cost?
>
> Graeme
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <aquatronboat@>
> > am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will meforeward,
> > the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight
> > but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
> > Cooper.
> >
>
As well the Michalak version of Micro without the lead keel? Picara?
http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/michalak.htm
His article on self righting
http://homepages.apci.net/~michalak/
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@...>
wrote:
http://www.duckworksbbs.com/plans/jim/michalak.htm
His article on self righting
http://homepages.apci.net/~michalak/
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "graeme19121984" <graeme19121984@...>
wrote:
>doing
> Which Otter? 1, or II?
>
> Don't be put off by the lead keels - there are various ways of
> it, without too much sweat, as many have found.the
>
> Jesse Cooper and Martha Jane are bigger builds than the others you
> mention, and of course JC is quite a bigger job than MJ. (Consider
> fit out too.) You haven't mentioned Long Micro which probably givesa
> lot more bang for the effort and cost than do either MJ or JC.build,
>
> I think Anhinga would be the easiest and least complicated to
> hands down, but there has only been one other built, and so it iswrote:
> pretty much an unknown quantity in so far as its performance goes.
>
> By the way, what did the Anhinga plans cost?
>
> Graeme
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <aquatronboat@>
> > am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will meforeward,
> > the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight
> > but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
> > Cooper.
> >
>
You might consider the Musicbox2 or Musicbox3 if you like the Micro
and want to avoid the keel. The boats you mentioned are quite varied.
Many of them have a different mission than the others. For example
the Jessie Cooper is a small live aboard cruser where the AF3 is a day
sailer with the ability to camp cruse.
What type of sailing do you plan to do?
1. What body of water?
2. Do you plan on going on long cruses or just mostly day sailing with
the occasional overnighter?
3. How many people will be coming along?
4. Is self righting an important feature to you?
5. Do you plan on trailering the boat or will it be moored or docked?
Answers to these questions will bring you closer to a decision about
which type you might want. Then you can choose between many options
in each category.
Just remember that many people believe that the smallest boat that
fits your mission will get the most use and enjoyment.
Chris Feller
For example if you mostly day sail with the ocasional overnight
and want to avoid the keel. The boats you mentioned are quite varied.
Many of them have a different mission than the others. For example
the Jessie Cooper is a small live aboard cruser where the AF3 is a day
sailer with the ability to camp cruse.
What type of sailing do you plan to do?
1. What body of water?
2. Do you plan on going on long cruses or just mostly day sailing with
the occasional overnighter?
3. How many people will be coming along?
4. Is self righting an important feature to you?
5. Do you plan on trailering the boat or will it be moored or docked?
Answers to these questions will bring you closer to a decision about
which type you might want. Then you can choose between many options
in each category.
Just remember that many people believe that the smallest boat that
fits your mission will get the most use and enjoyment.
Chris Feller
For example if you mostly day sail with the ocasional overnight
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <aquatronboat@...> wrote:
>
> I have build a Selway Seawolf kayak and a Picup Squared from Michalak
> for a couple of years ago, now I want to try something bigger, it is
> hard to choose, it must not be too complicated, I think of the Micro,
> but the lead keel is a challenge for me I guess, I am thinking of the
> Jessie Cooper or the Martha Jane but really don´t know if the are
> to "heavy" for me to build, the Anhinga or the Otter I will be my
> choise, am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will me
> the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight foreward,
> but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
> Cooper.
>
Which Otter? 1, or II?
Don't be put off by the lead keels - there are various ways of doing
it, without too much sweat, as many have found.
Jesse Cooper and Martha Jane are bigger builds than the others you
mention, and of course JC is quite a bigger job than MJ. (Consider the
fit out too.) You haven't mentioned Long Micro which probably gives a
lot more bang for the effort and cost than do either MJ or JC.
I think Anhinga would be the easiest and least complicated to build,
hands down, but there has only been one other built, and so it is
pretty much an unknown quantity in so far as its performance goes.
By the way, what did the Anhinga plans cost?
Graeme
Don't be put off by the lead keels - there are various ways of doing
it, without too much sweat, as many have found.
Jesse Cooper and Martha Jane are bigger builds than the others you
mention, and of course JC is quite a bigger job than MJ. (Consider the
fit out too.) You haven't mentioned Long Micro which probably gives a
lot more bang for the effort and cost than do either MJ or JC.
I think Anhinga would be the easiest and least complicated to build,
hands down, but there has only been one other built, and so it is
pretty much an unknown quantity in so far as its performance goes.
By the way, what did the Anhinga plans cost?
Graeme
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "aquatronclaus" <aquatronboat@...> wrote:
> am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will me
> the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight foreward,
> but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
> Cooper.
>
I have build a Selway Seawolf kayak and a Picup Squared from Michalak
for a couple of years ago, now I want to try something bigger, it is
hard to choose, it must not be too complicated, I think of the Micro,
but the lead keel is a challenge for me I guess, I am thinking of the
Jessie Cooper or the Martha Jane but really don´t know if the are
to "heavy" for me to build, the Anhinga or the Otter I will be my
choise, am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will me
the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight foreward,
but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
Cooper.
for a couple of years ago, now I want to try something bigger, it is
hard to choose, it must not be too complicated, I think of the Micro,
but the lead keel is a challenge for me I guess, I am thinking of the
Jessie Cooper or the Martha Jane but really don´t know if the are
to "heavy" for me to build, the Anhinga or the Otter I will be my
choise, am I right in my thoughts that one of those two boats will me
the easiest boat for me to build? AF3 seems to be straight foreward,
but I need a little more boat, I have all the plans exept Jessie
Cooper.