Re: [bolger] Re: Buy a Lotto Ticket
If somebody can come up with an issue number I can see if it is in my
files.
HJ
jmbell1 wrote:
files.
HJ
jmbell1 wrote:
> There was a lengthy article in MAIB a couple of years ago concerning
> this boat. In it, PCB&F told a tale of woe regarding their
> relationships with the original owner of the boat and the builder. The
> boat was not built to plan, and then subsequently modified without the
> designer's input after the owner was dissatisfied with it's
> performance. Bolger states that the boat is it now exists is no longer
> his design.
>
> The changes included ditching the as designed unstayed dipping lug rig
> to the very expensive in-mast furling ketch rig you now see. Also, the
> boat originally was built with a transom and not the counter stern she
> now sports.
>
> There was something funny about the boat's construction as well. If I
> recall correctly, she has a plywood box keel and carvel planked
> topsides. She was originally built with copper sheathing. Bolger had
> specified that the plywood was to have some kind of stringers let into
> its otherwise totally glass-encapsulated surface to accept the copper
> nails. Builder Story apparently ingored this detail and nailed the
> copper through the fiberglass sheathing, which PCB&F did not approve
> of for obvious reasons.
>
> The project started out with a budget of ~$300,000 which ballooned to
> an estimated ~$900,000 by the time the owner tired pulled the plug.
> Bolger implied that he and owner were no longer on speaking terms and
> the building of this boat poisoned the well of his and Brad Story's
> friendship. IIRC, this was Story's last boat before closing his yard.
>
> This boat has been on the market for a couple of years now with no
> takers, even at a lower advertised price than it is now listed.
>
> I've got that MAIB issue in a box somewhere. If I get time I'll see if
> I can find it and scan it if people are interested.
>
>
>
Need from 2000 on.
HJ
Stefan Probst wrote:
HJ
Stefan Probst wrote:
> --- "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
>
>> And if that same volunteer was to put together an MAIB index for the
>> last five years of issues <smile>!
>>
>
> Probably being ignorant ....
> What about that one?
>http://www.messingaboutinboats.com/archive.html
>
> Cheers,
> Stefan
>
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
> - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
> - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
> - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
> - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
> - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> - Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
--- "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
What about that one?
http://www.messingaboutinboats.com/archive.html
Cheers,
Stefan
>Probably being ignorant ....
> And if that same volunteer was to put together an MAIB index for the
> last five years of issues <smile>!
What about that one?
http://www.messingaboutinboats.com/archive.html
Cheers,
Stefan
>And if that same volunteer was to put together an MAIB index for the
> If somebody can come up with an issue number I can see if it is in my
> files.
>
> HJ
last five years of issues <smile>!
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "jmbell1" <smallboatdesigner@...>
wrote:
#8, one I don't have. It sounds like it was orginally along the idea
of Ataraxia from BWOM. It's too bad these things happen between
designer and customer, but it's the way of the world. I too would
have liked to see that big honking boat plunging along with a big
dipping lug. Though it probably looks pretty good under sail right
now. I stopped buying California Super Lotto tickets because I never
won and the odds are absurd. But if you don't own it, you're not
liable for the slip fees, maintenance, insurance and so forth.
Charles Rouse
wrote:
>I do remember the article, and Reiver II is in Boat Design Quarterly
#8, one I don't have. It sounds like it was orginally along the idea
of Ataraxia from BWOM. It's too bad these things happen between
designer and customer, but it's the way of the world. I too would
have liked to see that big honking boat plunging along with a big
dipping lug. Though it probably looks pretty good under sail right
now. I stopped buying California Super Lotto tickets because I never
won and the odds are absurd. But if you don't own it, you're not
liable for the slip fees, maintenance, insurance and so forth.
Charles Rouse
>handsome
> The MAIB article shows photo of the the completed boat. I believe
> additional length comes mostly from adding the counter stern to the
> original transom. Bolger did say that he'd seen photos of the new
> stern and that he thought whoever designed and built it did a
> job. I agree that it looks better than the dead flat transom itboat
> replaced. Converting from tiller steering to wheel steering was
> probably a worthwhile modification as well. A tiller on heavy 50'
> doesn't seem very practical to me despite the obvious costadvantages.
>not
> The other part of the greater length may be the bowsprit that was
> included in the original design.wanted.
>
> I think the problem was the owner specified a "simple" boat in his
> design brief. Upon delivery of what he asked for, he discovered that
> compromises that made the boat "simple" wasn't really what he
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "adventures_in_astrophotography"
<jon@...> wrote:
additional length comes mostly from adding the counter stern to the
original transom. Bolger did say that he'd seen photos of the new
stern and that he thought whoever designed and built it did a handsome
job. I agree that it looks better than the dead flat transom it
replaced. Converting from tiller steering to wheel steering was
probably a worthwhile modification as well. A tiller on heavy 50' boat
doesn't seem very practical to me despite the obvious cost advantages.
The other part of the greater length may be the bowsprit that was not
included in the original design.
I think the problem was the owner specified a "simple" boat in his
design brief. Upon delivery of what he asked for, he discovered that
compromises that made the boat "simple" wasn't really what he wanted.
<jon@...> wrote:
>The MAIB article shows photo of the the completed boat. I believe
>
>
> The BDQ article describes a boat of 49+', not 61! At the orginal
> length and 14' beam, there was a lot of interior room that could
> make a very comfortable home afloat - one has to wonder how the
> owner decided he needed another 12' and that this wasn't discussed
> during development of the design. The tankage specified in the
> sales information seems small for such a large boat. I don't know
> much about large powerboats, but only 224 gallons of fuel in a twin
> diesel seems like it would make for pretty short range. The
> original dipping lug rig had fully counterweighted mast that pivoted
> through a big slot in the deck. It would have been an interesting
> sight to see that boat sailing under a nearly 1000 sq.ft. lugsail.
>
additional length comes mostly from adding the counter stern to the
original transom. Bolger did say that he'd seen photos of the new
stern and that he thought whoever designed and built it did a handsome
job. I agree that it looks better than the dead flat transom it
replaced. Converting from tiller steering to wheel steering was
probably a worthwhile modification as well. A tiller on heavy 50' boat
doesn't seem very practical to me despite the obvious cost advantages.
The other part of the greater length may be the bowsprit that was not
included in the original design.
I think the problem was the owner specified a "simple" boat in his
design brief. Upon delivery of what he asked for, he discovered that
compromises that made the boat "simple" wasn't really what he wanted.
Hi John,
The original design name is Reiver II, and in addition to the MAIB
article you mention, this boat appears in an old issue of Boat
Design Quarterly, around #10 or so. The amount of modification to
the design by the builder and client is substantial.
The BDQ article describes a boat of 49+', not 61! At the orginal
length and 14' beam, there was a lot of interior room that could
make a very comfortable home afloat - one has to wonder how the
owner decided he needed another 12' and that this wasn't discussed
during development of the design. The tankage specified in the
sales information seems small for such a large boat. I don't know
much about large powerboats, but only 224 gallons of fuel in a twin
diesel seems like it would make for pretty short range. The
original dipping lug rig had fully counterweighted mast that pivoted
through a big slot in the deck. It would have been an interesting
sight to see that boat sailing under a nearly 1000 sq.ft. lugsail.
I also recall something from the MAIB writeup about how the owner
didn't like the rudder arrangement, or was otherwise somehow
unsatisfied by the maneuvering and insisted on modifying it even
after PB&F demonstrated short radius turning capability. I wish I
had saved that copy of MAIB.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
> There was a lengthy article in MAIB a couple of years agoconcerning
> this boat. In it, PCB&F told a tale of woe regarding theirThe
> relationships with the original owner of the boat and the builder.
> boat was not built to plan, and then subsequently modified withoutthe
> designer's input after the owner was dissatisfied with it'slonger
> performance. Bolger states that the boat is it now exists is no
> his design....snip...
The original design name is Reiver II, and in addition to the MAIB
article you mention, this boat appears in an old issue of Boat
Design Quarterly, around #10 or so. The amount of modification to
the design by the builder and client is substantial.
The BDQ article describes a boat of 49+', not 61! At the orginal
length and 14' beam, there was a lot of interior room that could
make a very comfortable home afloat - one has to wonder how the
owner decided he needed another 12' and that this wasn't discussed
during development of the design. The tankage specified in the
sales information seems small for such a large boat. I don't know
much about large powerboats, but only 224 gallons of fuel in a twin
diesel seems like it would make for pretty short range. The
original dipping lug rig had fully counterweighted mast that pivoted
through a big slot in the deck. It would have been an interesting
sight to see that boat sailing under a nearly 1000 sq.ft. lugsail.
I also recall something from the MAIB writeup about how the owner
didn't like the rudder arrangement, or was otherwise somehow
unsatisfied by the maneuvering and insisted on modifying it even
after PB&F demonstrated short radius turning capability. I wish I
had saved that copy of MAIB.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
There was a lengthy article in MAIB a couple of years ago concerning
this boat. In it, PCB&F told a tale of woe regarding their
relationships with the original owner of the boat and the builder. The
boat was not built to plan, and then subsequently modified without the
designer's input after the owner was dissatisfied with it's
performance. Bolger states that the boat is it now exists is no longer
his design.
The changes included ditching the as designed unstayed dipping lug rig
to the very expensive in-mast furling ketch rig you now see. Also, the
boat originally was built with a transom and not the counter stern she
now sports.
There was something funny about the boat's construction as well. If I
recall correctly, she has a plywood box keel and carvel planked
topsides. She was originally built with copper sheathing. Bolger had
specified that the plywood was to have some kind of stringers let into
its otherwise totally glass-encapsulated surface to accept the copper
nails. Builder Story apparently ingored this detail and nailed the
copper through the fiberglass sheathing, which PCB&F did not approve
of for obvious reasons.
The project started out with a budget of ~$300,000 which ballooned to
an estimated ~$900,000 by the time the owner tired pulled the plug.
Bolger implied that he and owner were no longer on speaking terms and
the building of this boat poisoned the well of his and Brad Story's
friendship. IIRC, this was Story's last boat before closing his yard.
This boat has been on the market for a couple of years now with no
takers, even at a lower advertised price than it is now listed.
I've got that MAIB issue in a box somewhere. If I get time I'll see if
I can find it and scan it if people are interested.
this boat. In it, PCB&F told a tale of woe regarding their
relationships with the original owner of the boat and the builder. The
boat was not built to plan, and then subsequently modified without the
designer's input after the owner was dissatisfied with it's
performance. Bolger states that the boat is it now exists is no longer
his design.
The changes included ditching the as designed unstayed dipping lug rig
to the very expensive in-mast furling ketch rig you now see. Also, the
boat originally was built with a transom and not the counter stern she
now sports.
There was something funny about the boat's construction as well. If I
recall correctly, she has a plywood box keel and carvel planked
topsides. She was originally built with copper sheathing. Bolger had
specified that the plywood was to have some kind of stringers let into
its otherwise totally glass-encapsulated surface to accept the copper
nails. Builder Story apparently ingored this detail and nailed the
copper through the fiberglass sheathing, which PCB&F did not approve
of for obvious reasons.
The project started out with a budget of ~$300,000 which ballooned to
an estimated ~$900,000 by the time the owner tired pulled the plug.
Bolger implied that he and owner were no longer on speaking terms and
the building of this boat poisoned the well of his and Brad Story's
friendship. IIRC, this was Story's last boat before closing his yard.
This boat has been on the market for a couple of years now with no
takers, even at a lower advertised price than it is now listed.
I've got that MAIB issue in a box somewhere. If I get time I'll see if
I can find it and scan it if people are interested.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Charles Rouse" <ro43use@...> wrote:
>
> I've never seen this one. Check the
> pictures. Not only has Mr. Bolger
> designed a lot of boats, they
> definitely don't all look alike.
>
>http://tinyurl.com/2l8jz7
>
> Charles Rouse
>
I've never seen this one. Check the
pictures. Not only has Mr. Bolger
designed a lot of boats, they
definitely don't all look alike.
http://tinyurl.com/2l8jz7
Charles Rouse
pictures. Not only has Mr. Bolger
designed a lot of boats, they
definitely don't all look alike.
http://tinyurl.com/2l8jz7
Charles Rouse