Re: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
I haven't looked lately, but a few years ago I couldn't find 1/4" marine
anything in North Carolina. I could get 3/8" within a couple hours drive
(Charlotte or on the coast), but for 1/4" I had to order from CLC. Or
that place in Massachusetts.
Patrick
Pierce Nichols wrote:
anything in North Carolina. I could get 3/8" within a couple hours drive
(Charlotte or on the coast), but for 1/4" I had to order from CLC. Or
that place in Massachusetts.
Patrick
Pierce Nichols wrote:
> We actually do have good meranti and okoume plywood available in the US --
> just not at your local Home Despot. The thing to look for is BS1088 or
> BS6566. Those two grades, in meranti, are sold as Hydrotek and Aquatek,
> respectively, and don't seem to be that hard to find -- I found four within
> a three hour drive of where I live, in the boonies, without trying too hard.
> Allied Veneer in LA sells Aquatek for somewhat less per sheet than MDO in
> comparable thicknesses, and they have 1/4" as well. And they have reasonable
> (not great) prices on Joubert BS1088 Okoume.
>
I once made a tack and tape camper top for my truck. Worked just
fine, though it was pretty basic.
A long time ago, Bernie Wolfard's CSD catalogue (it's defunct now,
but he sold mostly Bolger designs) featured a small RV trailer you
could build at home. The coolest bit was that it also floated and,
as such, it doubled as a houseboat! Or maybe it was a tiny houseboat
that doubled as an RV. Anyway, it was a pretty cool concept.
I still see one in my future . . . .
But, I think another poster had it right when he mentioned that
there are tons of derelict little campers sitting around that could
be had for a song and easily refurbished.
I do like the teardrops, though. Hmm.
I'd be interested to see what you come up with if you move ahead.
Good luck!
Dave Gentry
fine, though it was pretty basic.
A long time ago, Bernie Wolfard's CSD catalogue (it's defunct now,
but he sold mostly Bolger designs) featured a small RV trailer you
could build at home. The coolest bit was that it also floated and,
as such, it doubled as a houseboat! Or maybe it was a tiny houseboat
that doubled as an RV. Anyway, it was a pretty cool concept.
I still see one in my future . . . .
But, I think another poster had it right when he mentioned that
there are tons of derelict little campers sitting around that could
be had for a song and easily refurbished.
I do like the teardrops, though. Hmm.
I'd be interested to see what you come up with if you move ahead.
Good luck!
Dave Gentry
I have a place in Grand Rapids Michigan (about 40 miles from where I live) that sells many grades of marine grade plywood at what seems a good price. I'll consider myself as one of the lucky ones.
Rick
----- Original Message ----
From: Pierce Nichols <rocketgeek@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 9, 2008 12:34:49 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
We actually do have good meranti and okoume plywood available in the US --
just not at your local Home Despot. The thing to look for is BS1088 or
BS6566. Those two grades, in meranti, are sold as Hydrotek and Aquatek,
respectively, and don't seem to be that hard to find -- I found four within
a three hour drive of where I live, in the boonies, without trying too hard.
Allied Veneer in LA sells Aquatek for somewhat less per sheet than MDO in
comparable thicknesses, and they have 1/4" as well. And they have reasonable
(not great) prices on Joubert BS1088 Okoume.
-p
Rick
----- Original Message ----
From: Pierce Nichols <rocketgeek@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, February 9, 2008 12:34:49 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
We actually do have good meranti and okoume plywood available in the US --
just not at your local Home Despot. The thing to look for is BS1088 or
BS6566. Those two grades, in meranti, are sold as Hydrotek and Aquatek,
respectively, and don't seem to be that hard to find -- I found four within
a three hour drive of where I live, in the boonies, without trying too hard.
Allied Veneer in LA sells Aquatek for somewhat less per sheet than MDO in
comparable thicknesses, and they have 1/4" as well. And they have reasonable
(not great) prices on Joubert BS1088 Okoume.
-p
On Feb 8, 2008 7:12 PM, Kenneth Grome <bagacayboatworks@ gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Honestly I would love to ship some of this good ply to the USA so local
> builders could use it, but I really don't see any way to do it on a
> practical basis. There are simply not enough boat builders
> concentrated in specific locations for the required volume, and even if
> there were they would all be buying materials on different schedules
> thus making a one-time bulk shipment impractical.
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
We actually do have good meranti and okoume plywood available in the US --
just not at your local Home Despot. The thing to look for is BS1088 or
BS6566. Those two grades, in meranti, are sold as Hydrotek and Aquatek,
respectively, and don't seem to be that hard to find -- I found four within
a three hour drive of where I live, in the boonies, without trying too hard.
Allied Veneer in LA sells Aquatek for somewhat less per sheet than MDO in
comparable thicknesses, and they have 1/4" as well. And they have reasonable
(not great) prices on Joubert BS1088 Okoume.
-p
just not at your local Home Despot. The thing to look for is BS1088 or
BS6566. Those two grades, in meranti, are sold as Hydrotek and Aquatek,
respectively, and don't seem to be that hard to find -- I found four within
a three hour drive of where I live, in the boonies, without trying too hard.
Allied Veneer in LA sells Aquatek for somewhat less per sheet than MDO in
comparable thicknesses, and they have 1/4" as well. And they have reasonable
(not great) prices on Joubert BS1088 Okoume.
-p
On Feb 8, 2008 7:12 PM, Kenneth Grome <bagacayboatworks@...> wrote:
>
>
> Honestly I would love to ship some of this good ply to the USA so local
> builders could use it, but I really don't see any way to do it on a
> practical basis. There are simply not enough boat builders
> concentrated in specific locations for the required volume, and even if
> there were they would all be buying materials on different schedules
> thus making a one-time bulk shipment impractical.
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Until there is a massive explosion of plywoodAnd with shipping being so high it is very difficult for one particular
> boatbuilders in the US, we simply don't have
> the clout to pursuad our big box stores to
> change their evil ways.
supplier to serve people outside his local area.
Honestly I would love to ship some of this good ply to the USA so local
builders could use it, but I really don't see any way to do it on a
practical basis. There are simply not enough boat builders
concentrated in specific locations for the required volume, and even if
there were they would all be buying materials on different schedules
thus making a one-time bulk shipment impractical.
Chuck from duckworks asked me about this plywood export/import issue one
time, but he's not ready to proceed for a year or more being that he is
expanding his other product lines right now. I don't know anyone else
who might take on such a responsibility in the USA either.
Personally I think Signal MDO is the best material to make plywood boats
from in the USA. It is relatively cheap compared with the alternatives
and it is exceptionally good quality. It's too bad they don't make it
in 1/4 inch, but if they did then people would then be complaining
about their not making it in 1/8 inch.
Ah well, such is life!
:)
Sincerely,
Ken Grome
Bagacay Boatworks
www.bagacayboatworks.com
Ken,
You are absolutely right about the quality of plywood in the US. The problem is that boatbuilders make up about .0001 percent of the market for plywood. The other 99.9999 percent is perfectly happy with the quality of the crappy plywood and they value low price over paying for quality.
IMHO, the best available US domestic plywoof is Signal brand MDO (medium density overlay) plywood. The reason it is so good is that our Highway Departments make road signs out of it they have enough market clout to make very rigid specifications stick. The only downside of MDO is that the minimum thickness is 3/8's inch or about 9mm.
Until there is a massive explosion of plywood boatbuilders in the US, we simply don't have the clout to pursuad our big box stores to change their evil ways.
JohnT
You are absolutely right about the quality of plywood in the US. The problem is that boatbuilders make up about .0001 percent of the market for plywood. The other 99.9999 percent is perfectly happy with the quality of the crappy plywood and they value low price over paying for quality.
IMHO, the best available US domestic plywoof is Signal brand MDO (medium density overlay) plywood. The reason it is so good is that our Highway Departments make road signs out of it they have enough market clout to make very rigid specifications stick. The only downside of MDO is that the minimum thickness is 3/8's inch or about 9mm.
Until there is a massive explosion of plywood boatbuilders in the US, we simply don't have the clout to pursuad our big box stores to change their evil ways.
JohnT
----- Original Message -----
From: Kenneth Grome
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 8:19 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
> Luan Ply SUCKS!
Apparently some of the Lauan ply you guys are getting in the USA sucks,
but the source of this plywood is Southeast Asia where I happen to be
living at the moment, and I can get VERY high quality Lauan plywood
here.
I think the problem you folks are having is that the big box stores buy
the cheapest stuff they can source from this side of the world --
precisely because "the cheap stuff" is exactly what Americans are
demanding these days -- so of course it sucks!
Apparently there are not enough people demanding the high quality Lauan
plywood for suppliers to bother carrying the good stuff.
So ... if you want high quality Lauan plywood in the USA, it is up to
you to DEMAND IT. American suppliers are not stupid, they will always
deliver exactly what their buyers are willing to buy from them.
By the way, in the Philippines the single most sought after boat
building wood is Lauan -- and there are literally millions of fishermen
in this country who survive by taking their Lauan boats out onto the
open ocean every day. These guys are not "playing" in their boats,
they must rely on these vessels for their personal safety as well as
their livelihoods.
This country is comprised of more than 7000 islands and fishermen here
have literally thousands of years of experience and knowledge of boat
building. These guys KNOW what is the best wood species for every part
of their boats ... and when they demand Lauan for their hulls they do
it because Lauan is the best material for the job.
Other places around the world call Lauan by a different name -- Meranti.
It is far stronger and far more rot resistant than Okoume, especially
that junk "Okoume" coming from China these days which is only 10-20%
Okoume in the paper-thin face plies with a thick core ply made of
Poplar.
By the way, Poplar is the cheapest junk wood filler material available
in China. This is probably why it is being used inside a sandwich of
Okoume paper to make what they refer to as "Okoume" plywood. Poplar is
weak and very prone to rot, which in my opinion makes it a terrible
wood for hull construction.
Not only is Okoume inferior to Meranti when used in a boat hull, but
Poplar is about 10 times worse. Meranti is strong and highly rot
resistant, Okoume is weaker and far less rot resistant, and Poplar is
extremely weak and has essentially zero rot resistance.
I would use Meranti any day of the week before I would get suckered into
using that Poplar-cored "Okoume" coming from China. A strong hull that
won't rot is far more important to me that the newest "fad" material
that everyone likes to talk about.
Sorry for the rant, but I just wanted to clear this up a bit. I seem to
be seeing more and more people concluding that it is the Lauan material
itself which is bad. In fact nothing could be further from the
truth ...
Lauan is without a doubt one of the best boat building wood species on
the planet.
Unfortunately some manufacturers are using this high quality wood to
produce a low quality plywood product -- and this is the practice that
I would like to see eliminated.
Sincerely,
Ken Grome
Bagacay Boatworks
www.bagacayboatworks.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Luan Ply SUCKS!Apparently some of the Lauan ply you guys are getting in the USA sucks,
but the source of this plywood is Southeast Asia where I happen to be
living at the moment, and I can get VERY high quality Lauan plywood
here.
I think the problem you folks are having is that the big box stores buy
the cheapest stuff they can source from this side of the world --
precisely because "the cheap stuff" is exactly what Americans are
demanding these days -- so of course it sucks!
Apparently there are not enough people demanding the high quality Lauan
plywood for suppliers to bother carrying the good stuff.
So ... if you want high quality Lauan plywood in the USA, it is up to
you to DEMAND IT. American suppliers are not stupid, they will always
deliver exactly what their buyers are willing to buy from them.
By the way, in the Philippines the single most sought after boat
building wood is Lauan -- and there are literally millions of fishermen
in this country who survive by taking their Lauan boats out onto the
open ocean every day. These guys are not "playing" in their boats,
they must rely on these vessels for their personal safety as well as
their livelihoods.
This country is comprised of more than 7000 islands and fishermen here
have literally thousands of years of experience and knowledge of boat
building. These guys KNOW what is the best wood species for every part
of their boats ... and when they demand Lauan for their hulls they do
it because Lauan is the best material for the job.
Other places around the world call Lauan by a different name -- Meranti.
It is far stronger and far more rot resistant than Okoume, especially
that junk "Okoume" coming from China these days which is only 10-20%
Okoume in the paper-thin face plies with a thick core ply made of
Poplar.
By the way, Poplar is the cheapest junk wood filler material available
in China. This is probably why it is being used inside a sandwich of
Okoume paper to make what they refer to as "Okoume" plywood. Poplar is
weak and very prone to rot, which in my opinion makes it a terrible
wood for hull construction.
Not only is Okoume inferior to Meranti when used in a boat hull, but
Poplar is about 10 times worse. Meranti is strong and highly rot
resistant, Okoume is weaker and far less rot resistant, and Poplar is
extremely weak and has essentially zero rot resistance.
I would use Meranti any day of the week before I would get suckered into
using that Poplar-cored "Okoume" coming from China. A strong hull that
won't rot is far more important to me that the newest "fad" material
that everyone likes to talk about.
Sorry for the rant, but I just wanted to clear this up a bit. I seem to
be seeing more and more people concluding that it is the Lauan material
itself which is bad. In fact nothing could be further from the
truth ...
Lauan is without a doubt one of the best boat building wood species on
the planet.
Unfortunately some manufacturers are using this high quality wood to
produce a low quality plywood product -- and this is the practice that
I would like to see eliminated.
Sincerely,
Ken Grome
Bagacay Boatworks
www.bagacayboatworks.com
Bruce can probably whip out a design in 15 min in Freeship.
HJ
mike weekes wrote:
HJ
mike weekes wrote:
> Hello Group,
>
> I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the style of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan plywood and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice multichine curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a amall bubble type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long - anyone interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your participation ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would mount nicely on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
>
> Mike Weekes
>yellowstone_michael@...
> Osprey, FL
>
>
>
Luan Ply SUCKS! If it is worth the effort, then it is worth the best
materials. TA
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
mike weekes
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 8:28 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
Hello Group,
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the style
of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan plywood
and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice multichine
curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a amall bubble
type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long - anyone
interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your participation
ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would mount nicely
on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_ <mailto:yellowstone_michael%40yahoo.com>michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
materials. TA
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
mike weekes
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 8:28 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
Hello Group,
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the style
of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan plywood
and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice multichine
curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a amall bubble
type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long - anyone
interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your participation
ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would mount nicely
on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_ <mailto:yellowstone_michael%40yahoo.com>michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
There is a Yahoo group for building teardrop campers, all less than 1000
lbs. Try:http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/teardropcampers/
Terrell V. Norris
Keeper of the Zoo
Various Colubrids
Morelia viridis
-----Original Message-----
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
mike weekes
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 11:28 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
Hello Group,
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the
style of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan
plywood and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice
multichine curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a
amall bubble type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long -
anyone interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your
participation ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would
mount nicely on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
lbs. Try:http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/teardropcampers/
Terrell V. Norris
Keeper of the Zoo
Various Colubrids
Morelia viridis
-----Original Message-----
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
mike weekes
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 11:28 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] can a mobil trailer rv home be built from tack and tape
Hello Group,
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the
style of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan
plywood and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice
multichine curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a
amall bubble type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long -
anyone interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your
participation ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would
mount nicely on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hello Group,
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the style of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan plywood and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice multichine curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a amall bubble type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long - anyone interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your participation ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would mount nicely on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am dreaming of designing, developing and building a small rv, in the style of the airstream bambi or the Nissan base camp but with 1/4 in luan plywood and tack and tape vs. aluminum - hey if you can create nice multichine curves surfaces for boats like gypsy, etc - why cant you make a amall bubble type rv of perhaps 8 or 8.5 feet wide by 12 or 16 feet long - anyone interested in collaborating on this idea, I'd welcome your participation ideas, nay sayers too! The upside down boat with a floor would mount nicely on a one-axle 1250 lb capacity trailer just fine!
Mike Weekes
yellowstone_michael@...
Osprey, FL
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]