[bolger] Re: Teal - #13,14,15 Flipping the Teal!
Before you reorder epoxy, I was in TAP Plastics which I believe is a chain.
They sell epoxy and the price was good. Anybody have experience with their
material?
Rennie
>From: "DGO" <oswald@...>______________________________________________________
>Reply-To:bolger@egroups.com
>To:bolger@...
>Subject: [bolger] Re: Teal - #13,14,15 Flipping the Teal!
>Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:16:06 -0800
>
><< text1.html >>
Get Your Private, Free Email athttp://www.hotmail.com
What are you going to do when she gets on the internet and discovers
this designation?
"dgo" wrote:original article:
snip I was able to convince She Who's Whim IS Law to tell me it looked straight...
In this continuing saga of building the Teal,
Inverted the boat!!!!! It is now sitting upright! Also cut and installed gunwales, and layed out the mast. Down to 3 or 5 oz of expoy...Time to re-order :( After all, I still have to glue in the thwarts, laminate the mast, glue on the decks which cover the flotation areas (between the "temporary" forms and the ends of the boat), glue the shoe, etc...
I was able to convince She Who's Whim IS Law to tell me it looked straight...
It's also time to think about a sail....anyone got pointers to used "generic instant boat" sails? :)
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and not time spent coaching She Who's Whim IS Law..
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 4 hrs | Flipped the boat, glued gunwales | 37.25 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $10 | Expandible safty equipment | $137.00 |
| Tools | 0 | None this session | $20 |
| Grand Total | $239, 37.25 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
In sessions #111 and 12 I glued up the remaining chime log, fit the bottom and glued. President's day was a long session. Another person would have been nice to lift the bottom, but i did manage. Next to check to see that the joints are tight, and to install the shoe and gunwales. Due to a slight mishap I am running tight on epoxy.....it will be interesting to see where it runs out.
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and not time spent building tools..
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 6 hrs | Glued into boat-shape, ripped and beveled chime logs | 33.25 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $10 | Expandible safty equipment | $137.00 |
| Tools | 0 | None this session | $20 |
| Grand Total | $239, 33.25 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
In session #10 I made 24 pvc clampes, and glued up one chime log.
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and not time spent building tools..
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 2 hrs | Glued into boat-shape, ripped and beveled chime logs | 27.25 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $0 | None this session | $127.00 |
| Tools | $5 | PVC pipe and new hack-saw blades | $20 |
| Grand Total | $229, 27.25 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
12th Night is over, the decorations up in the attic again (and out of the boat), and time to get back....
In session #9 I took advantage of a true holiday to get a "full" day of work on the boat. It is nice to have an occaisonal holiday where work was closed, but day-care was not. :}]
Glued the stem and stern, and the bulkheads in place ( the bulkheads are the temporary frames on the plans....I will enclose the extra airspace to help when I dump her). By commiting these joints to epoxy, I have removed any ability to change the twist of the boat. Things line up within 1/8" so I hope it is still OK.
Ripped and beveled the chime logs
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and not time spent vacumming up sawdust..
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 8 hrs | Glued into boat-shape, ripped and beveled chime logs | 25.25 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $0 | None this session | $127.00 |
| Tools | None this session | ||
| Grand Total | $224, 17.25 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
One tip I learned about lining up frames, stem and sternpost at the very end of
that process on Windsprint:
Temporarily attach everything with sheetrock screws. When you're satisfied all
is right with the world, back out the screws a few turns, leaving a gap. Using
a tongue depressor, butter knife or the like, you can get the epoxy/glue in the
joint. Then drive the sheetrock screws back in tight and nail every 2 inches
or so. After nailing, back out the shhetrock screws before everything hardens
up. I found being able to nail without haveing to hold something in tension
made me a far better hammer operator.
The only drawback I can see is that I had to fill two holes per side on the
stem and sternpost, no too big a deal.
Look forward to you progress after new years.
Robert Lundy
Quoting DGO <oswald@...>:
> <html>"dgo" <oswal-@...> wrote: <ahref="http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger">http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger</
> href='http://www.egroups.c
> om/group/bolger/?start=889' target='newWindowForOriginalArticle'>
> original article: </a><BR><P>
> <P>
>
> <!-- Start SafeHtml Version $-->
> In sessions 6,7, and 8 I cut and assembled the sides of the boat,
> finished the rames/bulkheads and glued/nailed the sides to the center
> frame. Unfortunaly I will have to stop work for a while for a few
> reasons. I finally used up the last of the epoxies in the sample kits,
> and I now need the building space to stage seasonal decorations. ( so
> much for a New Year's launch party...where I could blame any leaks on
> the Y2K bug :}] )<P>
>
> As folks might remember, I am replacing the temporary frames on the
> teal plans with permanant bulkheads, and decking over the space to
> provide some floatation. Thus I have had to pay a little more
> attention to the frames than the minimal builder. In these set of
> sessions, I beveled the edges with circular saw and block plane, and
> glued up the frames. The whole thing would have been a lot easier if I
> had let the frames overhang the plywood shape, and beveled and trimmed
> at the same time. <P>
> <br>
> Cutting the sides when pretty sweetly. I used a chalk line to lay out
> the strips, and a new carbide blade to cut. B+D Pirranna....nice blade,
> left no rought edges. Then I clamped the 3 strips together and used a
> block plane to even them out. Laying out the fore and aft portions on
> the plywood was a minor challenge, since the plans seem to assume
> perfectly 2-sided ply, while my sample definatly had a "Good" side.
> Glue up used epoxy and woodscrews, then a flip and fill the gap and
> screwholes..<P>
>
> <br>
> Then came the interesting part...gluing the sides to the center frame.
> So I procrastinated a little bit by cutting the stem and stern posts.
> Finally I got the guts and the time. I pretty much followed the
> directions in the plans, although I wrapped the temporary blocks in wax
> paper to keep them from becoming permantly part of the boat. One sort
> of trick was to line things up then drill a starter hole for the nails.
> Actually, I was surprized how easy it was to remove the ring shank boat
> nails. (which I had to do because I origionally did not leave enough
> room to goop the glue in)<P>
> Eventually everything set, and then came the painfull part....checking
> to see if the joins settled into the correct position or if it had
> "drifted". Well, It looks like one side is about 1/8" forward of where
> it should be. I hope to make that dissapear in the next stages. <P>
> Unfortuantly, There has to be a place to store the boxes for the
> seasonal decorations, and that place is in the boat. Not much will
> happen untill after 12th Night. The next steps are to glue the stems
> and sterns on, pull the ends of the boat together, (inserting the
> frames) and glue the stem/stern and frames in place. It is one of the
> steps where you can absolutly rule out the possibility that the boat
> will ever be fair....<P>
>
>
>
>
> DGO<p>
> <hr>
> And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes
> active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that did not
> seem to come out the right size <p>
>
> <table border="border">
> <tr>
> <th> Item </th>
> <th> This Session</th>
> <th> Descriptions and commentary </th>
> <th> Total to date </th>
>
> </tr>
> <tr>
> <td> Time </td>
> <td> 12.25 hrs </td>
> <td> A lot - see above</td>
> <td> 17.25 hrs </td>
> </tr>
>
> <tr>
> <td>Info </td>
> <td>0</td>
> <td>None this session</td>
> <td>$82 </td>
> </tr>
>
> <tr>
> <td>Materials </td>
> <td>$78</td>
> <td>Ply for the sides of the boat, lumber for chimes and gunwales,
> epoxy and accessories to finish. </td>
> <td>$127.00</td>
> </tr>
>
> <tr>
> <td>Tools</td>
> <td>5</td>
> <td>Chalk line</td>
> <td>$15 </td>
> </tr>
>
> <tr>
> <td>Grand Total</td>
>
> <td>$224, 17.25 hrs </td>
> </tr>
>
>
> </table>
>
> The totals are broken out as:
> <ul>
> <li> Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the
> boat
>
> <li> Cost for:<p>
> <ul>
> <li>Information: Including books, plans, material samples
>
> <li>Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed
> in
> making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
>
> <li>Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <p>
> </ul></ul>
>
>
>
> <p>
>
>
>
>
> <p>
>
>
>
>
> <P>
> </html>
>
>
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> <a href="http://www.egroups.com">www.egroups.com</a> - Simplifying groupRobert N. Lundy
> communications<br>
>
St. Petersburg, Fla.
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In sessions 6,7, and 8 I cut and assembled the sides of the boat, finished the rames/bulkheads and glued/nailed the sides to the center frame. Unfortunaly I will have to stop work for a while for a few reasons. I finally used up the last of the epoxies in the sample kits, and I now need the building space to stage seasonal decorations. ( so much for a New Year's launch party...where I could blame any leaks on the Y2K bug :}] )
As folks might remember, I am replacing the temporary frames on the teal plans with permanant bulkheads, and decking over the space to provide some floatation. Thus I have had to pay a little more attention to the frames than the minimal builder. In these set of sessions, I beveled the edges with circular saw and block plane, and glued up the frames. The whole thing would have been a lot easier if I had let the frames overhang the plywood shape, and beveled and trimmed at the same time.
Cutting the sides when pretty sweetly. I used a chalk line to lay out
the strips, and a new carbide blade to cut. B+D Pirranna....nice blade,
left no rought edges. Then I clamped the 3 strips together and used a
block plane to even them out. Laying out the fore and aft portions on
the plywood was a minor challenge, since the plans seem to assume
perfectly 2-sided ply, while my sample definatly had a "Good" side.
Glue up used epoxy and woodscrews, then a flip and fill the gap and
screwholes..
Then came the interesting part...gluing the sides to the center frame.
So I procrastinated a little bit by cutting the stem and stern posts.
Finally I got the guts and the time. I pretty much followed the
directions in the plans, although I wrapped the temporary blocks in wax
paper to keep them from becoming permantly part of the boat. One sort
of trick was to line things up then drill a starter hole for the nails.
Actually, I was surprized how easy it was to remove the ring shank boat
nails. (which I had to do because I origionally did not leave enough
room to goop the glue in)
Eventually everything set, and then came the painfull part....checking to see if the joins settled into the correct position or if it had "drifted". Well, It looks like one side is about 1/8" forward of where it should be. I hope to make that dissapear in the next stages.
Unfortuantly, There has to be a place to store the boxes for the seasonal decorations, and that place is in the boat. Not much will happen untill after 12th Night. The next steps are to glue the stems and sterns on, pull the ends of the boat together, (inserting the frames) and glue the stem/stern and frames in place. It is one of the steps where you can absolutly rule out the possibility that the boat will ever be fair....
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that did not seem to come out the right size
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 12.25 hrs | A lot - see above | 17.25 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $78 | Ply for the sides of the boat, lumber for chimes and gunwales, epoxy and accessories to finish. | $127.00 |
| Tools | 5 | Chalk line | $15 |
| Grand Total | $224, 17.25 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat. At the end I will back out the cost of "left-overs".
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
Session 4: Epoxy adventures
Re-cut bottom of main frame and glued. Next time use screws to
establish the initial position before nailing. Used System 3 test kit,
3 oz of epoxy. Went OK
sort of slow, but then that's good if you are
dealing with other things. (Like trying to nail into the screw-holes
that you used to dry fit the frame. ) The epoxy came out a little
slippy and slimy, I suppose due to not enough filler. It set well
enough though. Next time use more than 1 tablespoon of wood flour for 3
oz of epoxy, and only spread thickened epoxy on one side. Maybe 2
tblspns or adding 1 tblspn of fiber... I ended up with about 1 foot of
joint glued and 1/2 oz of thichened epoxy left over. I was surprized by
how much 3 oz of epoxy is when thichened.
I used wax paper to keep from glueing the frame to the floor. The epoxy did not stick to the paper, however it did run a little, ( from over-application and under thickening)
Session 5 bulkhead frames
Here is one of the places I am deviating a little from the Teal Plans.
(the other is the rudder- I intend to use a traditional rudder for the
lines instead of that thin, deep, fixed thing in the plans - I really
don't like the look of that unsupported skeg) Instead of temporary
frames fore and aft, I am building permanent bulkheads. I will deck
over the space between the frame and the stem, giveing both a more
traditional look and some floatation. This session I cut the framing
that goes around the plywood for the bulkheads.
Next session
Next session will see dry-fitting the frames, and beveling.
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that did not seem to come out the right size
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 2.5 hrs | Cut bottem of main frame, glue up main frame, cut bulkhead framing | 5 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $2 | Disposible gloves ( there just are not enough of them in the trail kits) | $49 |
| Tools | 0 | None this session | $10 |
| Grand Total | $141, 5 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
throw the lines of the boat off a bit. If nothing else, you will feel
much better about it when it's repaired.
> Chuck Leinweber wrote:--
>
> DGO:
>
> I keep reminding myself that boats are analog rather than digital.
> That half inch will probably never be noticed by you or anyone else.
> Me, I would ignore it and just go on.
>
> Chuck
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:oswald@...
> To:bolger@egroups.com
> Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 10:22 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Starting a Teal - Session #3 - The
> first oops
>
>oswal-@...wrote: original article:
>
> Forward and away!!!
>
> Last night I cut and dry-fit the central frame. Although I
> measured twice, I found that when the central frame came
> together it was 1/2 " too narrow.
>
> I figure my options are:
>
> * Just accept it. After all PCB could have been
> dimensioning to the outside of the skin, not the frame,
> and that accounts for the difference.
> * Cut 2 scraps of the 1/4 plywood skin and glue each in
> the joint to bring it up to spec.
> * Re-Cut the bottem member of the frame
>
> Any Advice?
>
> DGO
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes
> active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that
> did not seem to come out the right size
>
> Item This Descriptions and commentary Total to
> Session date
>
> Time 1 hrs Cut frames, and gussets, 2.5 hrs
> layout lumber
> Info 0 None this session $82
> 1X4 for the frame, dust
> Materials $12 masks, 36 grit disks for the $47
> angle grinder
> Tools 0 None this session $10
>
> Grand Total$139, 2.5
> hrs
> The totals are broken out as:
>
> * Building time - Time spent in the building area with
> parts of the boat
> * Cost for:
>
> o Information: Including books, plans, material
> samples
> o Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or
> are consumed in making the boat
> o Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the
> boat.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
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Beyond!
Boat building projects:http://www.sbecommunications.com/boats/index.htm
----- Original Message -----From:oswald@...Sent:Friday, November 12, 1999 10:22 AMSubject:[bolger] Re: Starting a Teal - Session #3 - The first oopsoswal-@...wrote:original article:Forward and away!!!
Last night I cut and dry-fit the central frame. Although I measured twice, I found that when the central frame came together it was 1/2 " too narrow.
I figure my options are:
- Just accept it. After all PCB could have been dimensioning to the outside of the skin, not the frame, and that accounts for the difference.
- Cut 2 scraps of the 1/4 plywood skin and glue each in the joint to bring it up to spec.
- Re-Cut the bottem member of the frame
Any Advice?DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that did not seem to come out the right sizeThe totals are broken out as:
Item This Session Descriptions and commentary Total to date Time 1 hrs Cut frames, and gussets, layout lumber 2.5 hrs Info 0 None this session $82 Materials $12 1X4 for the frame, dust masks, 36 grit disks for the angle grinder $47 Tools 0 None this session $10 Grand Total $139, 2.5 hrs
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
eGroups.com Home:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
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Forward and away!!!
Last night I cut and dry-fit the central frame. Although I measured twice, I found that when the central frame came together it was 1/2 " too narrow.
I figure my options are:
- Just accept it. After all PCB could have been
dimensioning to the outside of the skin, not the frame, and that
accounts for the difference.
- Cut 2 scraps of the 1/4 plywood skin and glue each in the joint to
bring it up to spec.
- Re-Cut the bottem member of the frame
Any Advice?
DGO
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time includes active shop time, and time spent starring at the parts that did not seem to come out the right size
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 1 hrs | Cut frames, and gussets, layout lumber | 2.5 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $12 | 1X4 for the frame, dust masks, 36 grit disks for the angle grinder | $47 |
| Tools | 0 | None this session | $10 |
| Grand Total | $139, 2.5 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
oswald@... wrote:
Tilt the saw forward, and make serveral plung cuts to do a tight radius. Then smooth it out with the belt sander.
- circular saws make a lot of noise and leave burn marks when trying to make a hard turn.
Last night I cut the frames, and gussets that I had layed out, and layed out the lumber for the central frame
Lessions learned:
- The baby can hear the cicrular saw in his room when I use it in the garage
- A block plane works for cleaning up the wobbles in a cut
- circular saws make a lot of noise and leave burn marks when trying to make a hard turn.
And now for the Accounting - remember that the time only includes active shop time, not what it took to get the baby to go back to sleep after using the circular saw :)
| Item | This Session | Descriptions and commentary | Total to date |
|---|---|---|---|
| Time | 0.75 hrs | Cut frames, and gussets, layout lumber | 1.5 hrs |
| Info | 0 | None this session | $82 |
| Materials | $25 | Boat nails fromhere | $35 |
| Tools | 0 | None this session | $10 |
| Grand Total | $127, 1.5 hrs |
- Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat
- Cost for:
- Information: Including books, plans, material samples
- Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat
- Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat.
Started building a Bolger Teal last night. I will keep a running account of progress untill one of the following conditions is met: 1) Reporting progress interferes with Making Progress 2) It gets too embarassing 3) It gets too boring I intend to buld the Teal almost to plan, leaving in the fore and aft molds, decking them over for (some) floatation. The encased area will have air holes to allow condensation to escape and there will be stoppers for the holes while underway. I will be building the boat to a lumberyard standard, with the exception of using epoxy as a structural adhesive and bronze nails. This is my first boat, and I don't want to sweat beguinner mistakes on highly expensive materials. EAch update will include an accounting of the following elements: Building time - Time spent in the building area with parts of the boat Cost for: Information: Including books, plans, material samples Materials: Things that become part of the boat, or are consumed in making the boat Tools: Tools aquired in the process of making the boat. Last nights Progress: Layed out Fore and aft molds, mid-frame gussets, test billets, and butt straps on 1/4 luan (exterior, but sort of left over from a cabinetry project). Test billets will be used to evaluate the weather resistance of the luan and the paints to be used. Time: .75 hrs Info: $82 (New instant boats, Payson's catalog, model making supplies, teal plans, sample epoxies from RAKA and System 3) Material: $10 Plywood Tools: $10 Rip guide for circular saw.