RE: [bolger] Re: Tennessee transom height question
The one data point that directly correlates to the better speed is that the
engine is now turning higher rpms. I did put a stainless steel prop on
her earlier this year, but I suspect that a tune up from a certified
mechanic may also garner additional speed. Currently changing the oil in
the engine every 100 hours, and the grease in the lower unit every 50 hours.
Aside from new spark plugs there is little else for a non mechanic like
myself to do. Getting the boat on the trailer and to a shop just has not
happened yet. If I would quit driving her around perhaps then ..
My wife and I chartered the Mangrove Mistress back in 2003 / 2004. I took
my GPS and she only got 12-13 mph wide open running her 25 hp four stroke
Honda. It was enough for me, I was hooked, at that time she would not sell
the boat but was trying to sell the business and boat with it. If I had to
do it over I would likely install a 25 same as I have, there is a
significant difference between 15 mph and 10mph when traveling 20 miles or
more at one time.
Caloosarat
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Rusk
Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 5:34 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: Tennessee transom height question
Caloosarat,
I have long lusted after a Tennessee. I figure she'd be great here in
the Indian River Lagoon. Early reports had her running 10 mph with 10
hp and close to 15 mph with 15 hp (2-strokes, < 90 lbs). A calm-water
cruise speed of 13-14 mph would be ok by me, 10 mph would not.
I thought I had read somewhere that you were only getting 13 mph wide
open out of EstherMae with that 25 hp motor wide open, and this had
scared me away from the idea. I wanted to attribute her lower speed
to having so much weight aft (25 hp 4-stroke, 15 gal fuel tank,
seating aft of cockpit) and possibly some drag from her afterplanes.
Is my memory of EstherMae's performance faulty? Have you done
anything that could be credited with the speedup?
All of my knowledge of Tennessee is anecdotal and from photos, but it
makes for some great dream fodder. I had hoped to charter Mangrove
Mistress for a day to learn more (she is powered with a 25 hp Honda),
but she was sold a year or so before I was able to return to Key West
and I couldn't find her when I finally got back down there.
Anyway, any light you can shed on EstherMae's performance would be
greatly appreciated.
Bob
--- In bolger@yahoogroups. <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> com, "Chester
Young" <chester@...> wrote:
Behalf Of
engine is now turning higher rpms. I did put a stainless steel prop on
her earlier this year, but I suspect that a tune up from a certified
mechanic may also garner additional speed. Currently changing the oil in
the engine every 100 hours, and the grease in the lower unit every 50 hours.
Aside from new spark plugs there is little else for a non mechanic like
myself to do. Getting the boat on the trailer and to a shop just has not
happened yet. If I would quit driving her around perhaps then ..
My wife and I chartered the Mangrove Mistress back in 2003 / 2004. I took
my GPS and she only got 12-13 mph wide open running her 25 hp four stroke
Honda. It was enough for me, I was hooked, at that time she would not sell
the boat but was trying to sell the business and boat with it. If I had to
do it over I would likely install a 25 same as I have, there is a
significant difference between 15 mph and 10mph when traveling 20 miles or
more at one time.
Caloosarat
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Bob Rusk
Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2008 5:34 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Re: Tennessee transom height question
Caloosarat,
I have long lusted after a Tennessee. I figure she'd be great here in
the Indian River Lagoon. Early reports had her running 10 mph with 10
hp and close to 15 mph with 15 hp (2-strokes, < 90 lbs). A calm-water
cruise speed of 13-14 mph would be ok by me, 10 mph would not.
I thought I had read somewhere that you were only getting 13 mph wide
open out of EstherMae with that 25 hp motor wide open, and this had
scared me away from the idea. I wanted to attribute her lower speed
to having so much weight aft (25 hp 4-stroke, 15 gal fuel tank,
seating aft of cockpit) and possibly some drag from her afterplanes.
Is my memory of EstherMae's performance faulty? Have you done
anything that could be credited with the speedup?
All of my knowledge of Tennessee is anecdotal and from photos, but it
makes for some great dream fodder. I had hoped to charter Mangrove
Mistress for a day to learn more (she is powered with a 25 hp Honda),
but she was sold a year or so before I was able to return to Key West
and I couldn't find her when I finally got back down there.
Anyway, any light you can shed on EstherMae's performance would be
greatly appreciated.
Bob
--- In bolger@yahoogroups. <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> com, "Chester
Young" <chester@...> wrote:
>transom is no
> Sam:
>
>
>
> In the photos section, within the EstherMae folder there are two photos
> relative to your current question.
>
>
>
> Photo 6 shows the transom and a bit of the detail of the outboard style
> mount on EstherMae. It is difficult to tell from the photos but when
> sitting at rest with a four stroke 25hp, and a tank full of gasoline (15
> gallons, 3' forward of the transom) the chine directly at the
> more than half way submerged.my 230
>
>
>
> Photo 7 shows the transom while underway. Keep in mind that I had
> lbs standing on the stern to take this photo so I am adding to theweight in
> the stern considerably. What I see in #7 is that the sterndepresses when
> slightly when underway putting the chine fully underwater.needed.
>
>
>
> Ken has it right when he said to build the transom taller and cut if
>the prop
>
>
> I have never encountered a chop that has even come close to raising
> out of the water, however when taking quartering wakes from a40'-60' boat
> running 20 mph past the EstherMae she has done enough of a broach toput the
> prop out of the water. This has happened at least 5 times in thelast 2 ½
> years over 4,000 miles of running. I view it as my fault for notbeing more
> tuned to the conditions. If that is a vice then it is one of the few ato make
> Tennessee has. Regardless in no case was the broach extreme enough
> me feel as if rolling was imminent. Typically when there is a chopI can
> watch small power boats, from 25' on down hobby horsing through thewaves
> and EstherMae just glides along, pitch is not a motion that a Tennesseebeing back
> engages in. I suspect that this is due to the narrow beam. If you are
> running in conditions that create much pitch you should consider
> at the dock, as the hull is far to light for such weather. Heavyweather
> also demands a speed of no more than 8-9 mph to prevent excessivepounding
> of the bottom, which is throttled back from the 15-18 mph she can doin a
> light chop. I have never been out in anything in excess of 3' and we[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups. <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> com] On
> regularly run around in 2' and less comfortably.
>
>
>
> ~Caloosarat
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From: bolger@yahoogroups. <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> com
Behalf Of
> Sam Glasscockproject. The
> Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 12:02 AM
> To: bolger@yahoogroups. <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> com
> Subject: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
>
>
>
>
> I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee
> plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only comein 20" or
> 25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My questionis, how
> much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her atin the
> displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the
> waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays
> water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom isslightly above
> the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Thanks, Maximo--I'll give it a try.
--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Maximo <grupos@...> wrote:
From: Maximo <grupos@...>
Subject: RE: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, September 1, 2008, 9:42 AM
Sam, on the article page in the photos section, if you switch your "view"
configuration to "large" you could read the article, at least I can :)
Máximo
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sam, on the article page in the photos section, if you switch your "view"
configuration to "large" you could read the article, at least I can :)
Máximo
configuration to "large" you could read the article, at least I can :)
Máximo
Wow!� Somehow, I had managed to miss those pictures entirely.� What a beauty!� The outboard bracket solves my problem--thanks.� I have also never seen the MAIB article posted in the photo--is it posted anywhere in legible form?--I'd love to read it.� Thanks, Sam
--- On Sat, 8/30/08, Chester Young <chester@...> wrote:
From: Chester Young <chester@...>
Subject: RE: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, August 30, 2008, 11:45 AM
Sam:
In the photos section, within the EstherMae folder there are two photos
relative to your current question.
Photo 6 shows the transom and a bit of the detail of the outboard style
mount on EstherMae. It is difficult to tell from the photos but when
sitting at rest with a four stroke 25hp, and a tank full of gasoline (15
gallons, 3� forward of the transom) the chine directly at the transom is no
more than half way submerged.
Photo 7 shows the transom while underway. Keep in mind that I had my 230
lbs standing on the stern to take this photo so I am adding to the weight in
the stern considerably. What I see in #7 is that the stern depresses when
slightly when underway putting the chine fully underwater.
Ken has it right when he said to build the transom taller and cut if needed.
I have never encountered a chop that has even come close to raising the prop
out of the water, however when taking quartering wakes from a 40�-60� boat
running 20 mph past the EstherMae she has done enough of a broach to put the
prop out of the water. This has happened at least 5 times in the last 2 �
years over 4,000 miles of running. I view it as my fault for not being more
tuned to the conditions. If that is a vice then it is one of the few a
Tennessee has. Regardless in no case was the broach extreme enough to make
me feel as if rolling was imminent. Typically when there is a chop I can
watch small power boats, from 25� on down hobby horsing through the waves
and EstherMae just glides along, pitch is not a motion that a Tennessee
engages in. I suspect that this is due to the narrow beam. If you are
running in conditions that create much pitch you should consider being back
at the dock, as the hull is far to light for such weather. Heavy weather
also demands a speed of no more than 8-9 mph to prevent excessive pounding
of the bottom, which is throttled back from the 15-18 mph she can do in a
light chop. I have never been out in anything in excess of 3� and we
regularly run around in 2� and less comfortably.
~Caloosarat
_____
From: bolger@yahoogroups. com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Sam Glasscock
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 12:02 AM
To: bolger@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee project. The
plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only come in 20" or
25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question is, how
much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her at
displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the
waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays in the
water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom is slightly above
the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal
height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Caloosarat,
I have long lusted after a Tennessee. I figure she'd be great here in
the Indian River Lagoon. Early reports had her running 10 mph with 10
hp and close to 15 mph with 15 hp (2-strokes, < 90 lbs). A calm-water
cruise speed of 13-14 mph would be ok by me, 10 mph would not.
I thought I had read somewhere that you were only getting 13 mph wide
open out of EstherMae with that 25 hp motor wide open, and this had
scared me away from the idea. I wanted to attribute her lower speed
to having so much weight aft (25 hp 4-stroke, 15 gal fuel tank,
seating aft of cockpit) and possibly some drag from her afterplanes.
Is my memory of EstherMae's performance faulty? Have you done
anything that could be credited with the speedup?
All of my knowledge of Tennessee is anecdotal and from photos, but it
makes for some great dream fodder. I had hoped to charter Mangrove
Mistress for a day to learn more (she is powered with a 25 hp Honda),
but she was sold a year or so before I was able to return to Key West
and I couldn't find her when I finally got back down there.
Anyway, any light you can shed on EstherMae's performance would be
greatly appreciated.
Bob
I have long lusted after a Tennessee. I figure she'd be great here in
the Indian River Lagoon. Early reports had her running 10 mph with 10
hp and close to 15 mph with 15 hp (2-strokes, < 90 lbs). A calm-water
cruise speed of 13-14 mph would be ok by me, 10 mph would not.
I thought I had read somewhere that you were only getting 13 mph wide
open out of EstherMae with that 25 hp motor wide open, and this had
scared me away from the idea. I wanted to attribute her lower speed
to having so much weight aft (25 hp 4-stroke, 15 gal fuel tank,
seating aft of cockpit) and possibly some drag from her afterplanes.
Is my memory of EstherMae's performance faulty? Have you done
anything that could be credited with the speedup?
All of my knowledge of Tennessee is anecdotal and from photos, but it
makes for some great dream fodder. I had hoped to charter Mangrove
Mistress for a day to learn more (she is powered with a 25 hp Honda),
but she was sold a year or so before I was able to return to Key West
and I couldn't find her when I finally got back down there.
Anyway, any light you can shed on EstherMae's performance would be
greatly appreciated.
Bob
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Chester Young" <chester@...> wrote:
>
> Sam:
>
>
>
> In the photos section, within the EstherMae folder there are two photos
> relative to your current question.
>
>
>
> Photo 6 shows the transom and a bit of the detail of the outboard style
> mount on EstherMae. It is difficult to tell from the photos but when
> sitting at rest with a four stroke 25hp, and a tank full of gasoline (15
> gallons, 3' forward of the transom) the chine directly at the
transom is no
> more than half way submerged.
>
>
>
> Photo 7 shows the transom while underway. Keep in mind that I had
my 230
> lbs standing on the stern to take this photo so I am adding to the
weight in
> the stern considerably. What I see in #7 is that the stern
depresses when
> slightly when underway putting the chine fully underwater.
>
>
>
> Ken has it right when he said to build the transom taller and cut if
needed.
>
>
>
> I have never encountered a chop that has even come close to raising
the prop
> out of the water, however when taking quartering wakes from a
40'-60' boat
> running 20 mph past the EstherMae she has done enough of a broach to
put the
> prop out of the water. This has happened at least 5 times in the
last 2 ½
> years over 4,000 miles of running. I view it as my fault for not
being more
> tuned to the conditions. If that is a vice then it is one of the few a
> Tennessee has. Regardless in no case was the broach extreme enough
to make
> me feel as if rolling was imminent. Typically when there is a chop
I can
> watch small power boats, from 25' on down hobby horsing through the
waves
> and EstherMae just glides along, pitch is not a motion that a Tennessee
> engages in. I suspect that this is due to the narrow beam. If you are
> running in conditions that create much pitch you should consider
being back
> at the dock, as the hull is far to light for such weather. Heavy
weather
> also demands a speed of no more than 8-9 mph to prevent excessive
pounding
> of the bottom, which is throttled back from the 15-18 mph she can do
in a
> light chop. I have never been out in anything in excess of 3' and we
> regularly run around in 2' and less comfortably.
>
>
>
> ~Caloosarat
>
>
>
> _____
>
> From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of
> Sam Glasscock
> Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 12:02 AM
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
>
>
>
>
> I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee
project. The
> plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only come
in 20" or
> 25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question
is, how
> much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her at
> displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the
> waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays
in the
> water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom is
slightly above
> the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal
> height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Sam:
In the photos section, within the EstherMae folder there are two photos
relative to your current question.
Photo 6 shows the transom and a bit of the detail of the outboard style
mount on EstherMae. It is difficult to tell from the photos but when
sitting at rest with a four stroke 25hp, and a tank full of gasoline (15
gallons, 3 forward of the transom) the chine directly at the transom is no
more than half way submerged.
Photo 7 shows the transom while underway. Keep in mind that I had my 230
lbs standing on the stern to take this photo so I am adding to the weight in
the stern considerably. What I see in #7 is that the stern depresses when
slightly when underway putting the chine fully underwater.
Ken has it right when he said to build the transom taller and cut if needed.
I have never encountered a chop that has even come close to raising the prop
out of the water, however when taking quartering wakes from a 40-60 boat
running 20 mph past the EstherMae she has done enough of a broach to put the
prop out of the water. This has happened at least 5 times in the last 2 ½
years over 4,000 miles of running. I view it as my fault for not being more
tuned to the conditions. If that is a vice then it is one of the few a
Tennessee has. Regardless in no case was the broach extreme enough to make
me feel as if rolling was imminent. Typically when there is a chop I can
watch small power boats, from 25 on down hobby horsing through the waves
and EstherMae just glides along, pitch is not a motion that a Tennessee
engages in. I suspect that this is due to the narrow beam. If you are
running in conditions that create much pitch you should consider being back
at the dock, as the hull is far to light for such weather. Heavy weather
also demands a speed of no more than 8-9 mph to prevent excessive pounding
of the bottom, which is throttled back from the 15-18 mph she can do in a
light chop. I have never been out in anything in excess of 3 and we
regularly run around in 2 and less comfortably.
~Caloosarat
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Sam Glasscock
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 12:02 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee project. The
plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only come in 20" or
25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question is, how
much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her at
displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the
waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays in the
water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom is slightly above
the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal
height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
In the photos section, within the EstherMae folder there are two photos
relative to your current question.
Photo 6 shows the transom and a bit of the detail of the outboard style
mount on EstherMae. It is difficult to tell from the photos but when
sitting at rest with a four stroke 25hp, and a tank full of gasoline (15
gallons, 3 forward of the transom) the chine directly at the transom is no
more than half way submerged.
Photo 7 shows the transom while underway. Keep in mind that I had my 230
lbs standing on the stern to take this photo so I am adding to the weight in
the stern considerably. What I see in #7 is that the stern depresses when
slightly when underway putting the chine fully underwater.
Ken has it right when he said to build the transom taller and cut if needed.
I have never encountered a chop that has even come close to raising the prop
out of the water, however when taking quartering wakes from a 40-60 boat
running 20 mph past the EstherMae she has done enough of a broach to put the
prop out of the water. This has happened at least 5 times in the last 2 ½
years over 4,000 miles of running. I view it as my fault for not being more
tuned to the conditions. If that is a vice then it is one of the few a
Tennessee has. Regardless in no case was the broach extreme enough to make
me feel as if rolling was imminent. Typically when there is a chop I can
watch small power boats, from 25 on down hobby horsing through the waves
and EstherMae just glides along, pitch is not a motion that a Tennessee
engages in. I suspect that this is due to the narrow beam. If you are
running in conditions that create much pitch you should consider being back
at the dock, as the hull is far to light for such weather. Heavy weather
also demands a speed of no more than 8-9 mph to prevent excessive pounding
of the bottom, which is throttled back from the 15-18 mph she can do in a
light chop. I have never been out in anything in excess of 3 and we
regularly run around in 2 and less comfortably.
~Caloosarat
_____
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com[mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Sam Glasscock
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 12:02 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [bolger] Tennessee transom height question
I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee project. The
plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only come in 20" or
25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question is, how
much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her at
displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the
waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays in the
water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom is slightly above
the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal
height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ken, that makes sense--It is easier to cut it down than cut it up, for sure. Thanks.
If you're worried that the prop is going to ventilate, just
set it deeper ... but it probably won't unless you're in
some really steep short waves.
You can always cut the transom height down a little bit
later if the prop ventilates more than you want it to,
right?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
If you're worried that the prop is going to ventilate, just
set it deeper ... but it probably won't unless you're in
some really steep short waves.
You can always cut the transom height down a little bit
later if the prop ventilates more than you want it to,
right?
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for mySam, just go 5 inches higher for the 20 inch shaft, or 10
> Tennessee project. The plans show about a 15" transom.
> The Yamaha high-thrusts only come in 20" or 25" shafts.
> It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question is,
> how much.
inches higher for the 25 inch shaft.
> There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I willIf you're worried that the prop is going to ventilate, just
> be running her at displacement speeds, so having the
> cavitation plate no lower than the waterline is not
> imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays in the
> water in a chop.
set it deeper ... but it probably won't unless you're in
some really steep short waves.
You can always cut the transom height down a little bit
later if the prop ventilates more than you want it to,
right?
Sincerely,
Ken Grome
Bagacay Boatworks
www.bagacayboatworks.com
I am starting to look for a high-thrust 9.9 for my Tennessee project. The plans show about a 15" transom. The Yamaha high-thrusts only come in 20" or 25" shafts. It is easy enough to raise the transom. My question is, how much. There is some rocker in the Tennessee, I will be running her at displacement speeds, so having the cavitation plate no lower than the waterline is not imperative, and I want to make sure the prop stays in the water in a chop. I assume the hull bottom at the transom is slightly above the water, lightly loaded. I'd appreciate any advice about the optimal height of the transom to accommodate a 20" shaft motor. Thanks
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> For those Bolgeradoes in the Mid-Atlantic area, the Chesapeake BayDudes, John Harris is an original Bolgerado, and a seriously talented
> Maritime Museum in St. Michaels, MD is having their annual boat
> auction this weekend. If you've never been to one, you've missed an
> experience. Boats traditionally go for miniscule sums, and the
> selection this year is around 70 boats. Seven zero. Seventy.
>
> One of them is a Bolger Oldshoe with spars and sails. The hull needs
> some interior scraping and painting, and a few other TLC touches, but
> she's essentially sound. It's John Harris' old boat, for those of you
> who might remember her.
>
> Details of the auction and the museum offerings can be found at
>http://www.cbmm.org/me_boat_donat.html
> David
and careful boatbuilder! (He is the current owner of Chesapeake Light
Craft.) And a good dude. If you've ever considered an Oldshoe, hie on
down to St. Michaels, turn left before you get to Dick Cheney's house,
and bid on the Oldshoe. I can only wish I lived near St. Michaels!