Re: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
AS29 and LM2 are too wide for a shipping container. Figure on inside
dimensions of 7' 5" width and height and 39' 4" length for a standard 40
foot container. Some containers give a little more inside room, another inch
or two. High cube containers are an extra foot higher inside. I wish Bolger
would design a container boat.
Fred Schumacher
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Kenneth Barnett <
daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
dimensions of 7' 5" width and height and 39' 4" length for a standard 40
foot container. Some containers give a little more inside room, another inch
or two. High cube containers are an extra foot higher inside. I wish Bolger
would design a container boat.
Fred Schumacher
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 10:29 PM, Kenneth Barnett <
daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
> Mike[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> yes that would be fine
> by the way im in WA. state if your on the east coast it might not work
> although it might ship in a shipping container
>
> ken
>
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Mike
yes that would be fine
by the way im in WA. state if your on the east coast it might not work
although it might ship in a shipping container
ken
yes that would be fine
by the way im in WA. state if your on the east coast it might not work
although it might ship in a shipping container
ken
--- On Wed, 3/18/09, icewater0000 <icewater0000@...> wrote:
From: icewater0000 <icewater0000@...>
Subject: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, March 18, 2009, 8:10 PM
Hi Ken -
I thought that had to be the case, considering the work involved. I may approach you for a quote once I determine exactly what I'm going to do, if that's OK.
- Mike
--- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_ dragon@.. .> wrote:
>
> Hi Mike
> the amount of less than 10k was building the hull for myself (cost of material but no labor)
> I think a AS 29 could be in the water for 15k to 20k,(minus labor)
> I did not have plans to build for someone else, but could give a quote for building one.
>
> Ken
>
>
> --- On Wed, 3/18/09, icewater0000 <icewater0000@ ...> wrote:
>
> From: icewater0000 <icewater0000@ ...>
> Subject: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
> To: bolger@yahoogroups. com
> Date: Wednesday, March 18, 2009, 7:41 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Kenneth -
>
> That $10K would include parts and labor (hypothetically of course)?
>
> Thanks - Mike
>
> --- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_ dragon@ .> wrote:
> >
> > im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> > I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> > less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> > if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
> [...]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hi Ken -
I thought that had to be the case, considering the work involved. I may approach you for a quote once I determine exactly what I'm going to do, if that's OK.
- Mike
I thought that had to be the case, considering the work involved. I may approach you for a quote once I determine exactly what I'm going to do, if that's OK.
- Mike
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Mike
> the amount of less than 10k was building the hull for myself (cost of material but no labor)
> I think a AS 29 could be in the water for 15k to 20k,(minus labor)
> I did not have plans to build for someone else, but could give a quote for building one.
>
> Ken
>
>
> --- On Wed, 3/18/09, icewater0000 <icewater0000@...> wrote:
>
> From: icewater0000 <icewater0000@...>
> Subject: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Wednesday, March 18, 2009, 7:41 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Kenneth -
>
> That $10K would include parts and labor (hypothetically of course)?
>
> Thanks - Mike
>
> --- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_ dragon@ .> wrote:
> >
> > im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> > I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> > less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> > if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
> [...]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
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>
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>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Hi Bob -
A hangar with 3+ of those boats lined up simultaneously should be an awesome sight... how large is that hangar? :-)
Thanks - Mike
A hangar with 3+ of those boats lined up simultaneously should be an awesome sight... how large is that hangar? :-)
Thanks - Mike
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "loosemoosefilmworks" <loosemoosefilmworks@...> wrote:
> Buying all the materials ahead of time and paying cash allows for some serious savings in the cost of materials. With both Loose Moose's I built with other builders so we were able to get some serious pricing for things like plywood, epoxy and other boat stuff. Something I will be doing on the next Loose Moose as I will be building with at least one other person who will also be building the same boat and we are talking to a couple of others as well. Having three identical boats being built in a hanger makes for huge cost savings...Economics of scale is your friend if you can pull it off!
>
> The other thing that makes for a fast build is building it smart...One week you may only build hatches but if you systemize your project it can save hundred of hours/dollars.
>
> But the fact is, building times and building costs have a way of expanding as much as you will let them...The very best way to build a boat well and in a timely manner is simply to set yourself serious goals and be motivated to meet them. My upcoming book (talk about projects that take up time) is as much about project management and mindset as it is about building boats as without the right mindset you don't finish the boat.
>
> By the way...When we lived in France there is a nationwide organization for amateur boatbuilders which you can buy plywood, epoxy,instruments,sails and what have you at deep discount. One of the reasons why in France home built boats are respected and a growth industry while in the USA we are akin to a pariah! Something Bolger folk could be doing as they are through this group one of the more organized group of home builders...Certainly worth looking into I know on LM2 we saved $1500 on plywood alone buying it through the Unite Amateur. That sort of savings across the board can really add up!
>
> Bob
>http://boatbits.blogspot.com
>http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
>
Hi Mike
the amount of less than 10k was building the hull for myself (cost of material but no labor)
I think a AS 29 could be in the water for 15k to 20k,(minus labor)
I did not have plans to build for someone else, but could give a quote for building one.
Ken
the amount of less than 10k was building the hull for myself (cost of material but no labor)
I think a AS 29 could be in the water for 15k to 20k,(minus labor)
I did not have plans to build for someone else, but could give a quote for building one.
Ken
--- On Wed, 3/18/09, icewater0000 <icewater0000@...> wrote:
From: icewater0000 <icewater0000@...>
Subject: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, March 18, 2009, 7:41 PM
Hi Kenneth -
That $10K would include parts and labor (hypothetically of course)?
Thanks - Mike
--- In bolger@yahoogroups. com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_ dragon@.. .> wrote:
>
> im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
[...]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hi Bruce -
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
>
> > I have to jump in here. One thousand hours (for a AS29???)
>
> Actually, I estimated 1,000 manhours *minimum*, double or triple that
> if you add frills, or glossy finish, or need "learning curve" on
> building skills, and/or if you need extra time for "head scratching".
Is there value to glossy finish other than appearance?
> I agree about the 'almost done' illusion. When you are tempted to say
> "90% done" that really means half way done in my experience.
I've found that to be true in other endeavors as well :-)
- Mike
Hi Bob -
I have to admit my initial desire for the AS39 (sorry, using the numbers helps me keep straight which boat I'm talking about :-) ). It seems like a luxury pad on water, and I really like the monolithic BLOCK look. I talked myself down off that ledge for now, though I could easily see that one in my future at some point. I really need to see these boats up close and personal some day so I can judge the relative space between the 29 and 39.
What did your $25K estimate include? How large is your crew, to arrive at the six month build time?
Thanks - Mike
I have to admit my initial desire for the AS39 (sorry, using the numbers helps me keep straight which boat I'm talking about :-) ). It seems like a luxury pad on water, and I really like the monolithic BLOCK look. I talked myself down off that ledge for now, though I could easily see that one in my future at some point. I really need to see these boats up close and personal some day so I can judge the relative space between the 29 and 39.
What did your $25K estimate include? How large is your crew, to arrive at the six month build time?
Thanks - Mike
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "loosemoosefilmworks" <loosemoosefilmworks@...> wrote:
> Kenneth is right on the money in the under 10K and six months numbers on the Loose Moose design (I've never been happy with Bernie's name of AS29 for Loose Moose 2 simply because it is not 39 feet...)
>
> The advanced sharpies are really easy to build and as long as you don't try to make them something they are not, change the plans or do something silly they are both fast and easy to build. Our Jessie Cooper took less than four and a half months and our Loose Moose 2 took six months.
>
> Having spent a few years rehabbing a classic plastic CAL 34 I speak with experience in that it would have been much faster and easier to build a new Loose Moose 2 rather than to fix up an older boat. There is a LOT to be said for starting from scratch! That siad there is still a lot to be said for Classic Plastic but the constraints of working on a boat that is already finished make for a more difficult than building new scenario...
>
> Next year, economy willing, we plan to be building Loose Moose 3 a fortyish foot sharpie and plan on a six month building schedule with a budget of $25,000 ready to go with all bells and whistles.
>
> Bob
>http://boatbits.blogspot.com/
>http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@> wrote:
> >
> > im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> > I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> > less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> > if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
>
Hi Kenneth -
That $10K would include parts and labor (hypothetically of course)?
Thanks - Mike
That $10K would include parts and labor (hypothetically of course)?
Thanks - Mike
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
>
> im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
[...]
Hi Bruce -
That's a pretty detailed estimate - I appreciate it. I'll see if I can find those earlier threads as well.
- Mike
That's a pretty detailed estimate - I appreciate it. I'll see if I can find those earlier threads as well.
- Mike
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
>
> Discussions of building the AS29 are a recurring theme on this group.
>
> See prior discussion threads 7/18/2005, 6/19/2007 and 11/17/2008
>
> Here is a cut and paste of my 2005 estimate of the "piece work" in an
> AS29, with 'quick/dirty' hour estimates, realistically these hour
> could double or triple.
[...]
Thinking about building time on a basic Micro I think we spent about 400 hours. Mine took six weeks from start to finish. It is definitely workboat finish. I had a carpenter friend help me for about three weeks to get the hull built and glassed. I have a good building space so nothing else was being done there during this period. I spent about $3500 for materials, including sails and the keel casting, in 1990.
MylesJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
MylesJ
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bill...You don't build too slow or spend too much. In Boat building there are no iron clad rules on such things. It always takes as much time and money as you have or are willing to give a project.
That said the discussion on how cheaply you can build a good boat is going to focus on the extremes. Our Loose Moose 2 took just under 1500 hours of labor on my part and another 100 hours on my wife's part with in a six month envelope. I did not have more time to devote to the project so I simply had to build it in six months, and as failure was never an option the boat got built!
A huge part of being able to build LM2 so quickly is my being able to work on it full time for the duration of the project, having everything at hand from the start of building (no time robbing trips to buy another sheet of plywood, epoxy or hinges!)which allows you to build momentum.
Momentum is the key to building a boat fast... From my point of view it is also a major factor in building a boat well, as once you get into the swing of things you just work better!
Buying all the materials ahead of time and paying cash allows for some serious savings in the cost of materials. With both Loose Moose's I built with other builders so we were able to get some serious pricing for things like plywood, epoxy and other boat stuff. Something I will be doing on the next Loose Moose as I will be building with at least one other person who will also be building the same boat and we are talking to a couple of others as well. Having three identical boats being built in a hanger makes for huge cost savings...Economics of scale is your friend if you can pull it off!
The other thing that makes for a fast build is building it smart...One week you may only build hatches but if you systemize your project it can save hundred of hours/dollars.
But the fact is, building times and building costs have a way of expanding as much as you will let them...The very best way to build a boat well and in a timely manner is simply to set yourself serious goals and be motivated to meet them. My upcoming book (talk about projects that take up time) is as much about project management and mindset as it is about building boats as without the right mindset you don't finish the boat.
By the way...When we lived in France there is a nationwide organization for amateur boatbuilders which you can buy plywood, epoxy,instruments,sails and what have you at deep discount. One of the reasons why in France home built boats are respected and a growth industry while in the USA we are akin to a pariah! Something Bolger folk could be doing as they are through this group one of the more organized group of home builders...Certainly worth looking into I know on LM2 we saved $1500 on plywood alone buying it through the Unite Amateur. That sort of savings across the board can really add up!
Bob
http://boatbits.blogspot.com
http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
That said the discussion on how cheaply you can build a good boat is going to focus on the extremes. Our Loose Moose 2 took just under 1500 hours of labor on my part and another 100 hours on my wife's part with in a six month envelope. I did not have more time to devote to the project so I simply had to build it in six months, and as failure was never an option the boat got built!
A huge part of being able to build LM2 so quickly is my being able to work on it full time for the duration of the project, having everything at hand from the start of building (no time robbing trips to buy another sheet of plywood, epoxy or hinges!)which allows you to build momentum.
Momentum is the key to building a boat fast... From my point of view it is also a major factor in building a boat well, as once you get into the swing of things you just work better!
Buying all the materials ahead of time and paying cash allows for some serious savings in the cost of materials. With both Loose Moose's I built with other builders so we were able to get some serious pricing for things like plywood, epoxy and other boat stuff. Something I will be doing on the next Loose Moose as I will be building with at least one other person who will also be building the same boat and we are talking to a couple of others as well. Having three identical boats being built in a hanger makes for huge cost savings...Economics of scale is your friend if you can pull it off!
The other thing that makes for a fast build is building it smart...One week you may only build hatches but if you systemize your project it can save hundred of hours/dollars.
But the fact is, building times and building costs have a way of expanding as much as you will let them...The very best way to build a boat well and in a timely manner is simply to set yourself serious goals and be motivated to meet them. My upcoming book (talk about projects that take up time) is as much about project management and mindset as it is about building boats as without the right mindset you don't finish the boat.
By the way...When we lived in France there is a nationwide organization for amateur boatbuilders which you can buy plywood, epoxy,instruments,sails and what have you at deep discount. One of the reasons why in France home built boats are respected and a growth industry while in the USA we are akin to a pariah! Something Bolger folk could be doing as they are through this group one of the more organized group of home builders...Certainly worth looking into I know on LM2 we saved $1500 on plywood alone buying it through the Unite Amateur. That sort of savings across the board can really add up!
Bob
http://boatbits.blogspot.com
http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
> I have to jump in here. One thousand hours (for a AS29???)Actually, I estimated 1,000 manhours *minimum*, double or triple that
if you add frills, or glossy finish, or need "learning curve" on
building skills, and/or if you need extra time for "head scratching".
In other words, I estimated 1,000 hours at "full speed ahead" "no
hesitations" "no regrets" "rough is good enough"...and estimates are
just seasoned guesses.
I agree about the 'almost done' illusion. When you are tempted to say
"90% done" that really means half way done in my experience.
I have to jump in here. One thousand hours and under $10,000 to build an AS 29 (or even an AS 39)? My limited experience building Bolger sharpies involves building my Long Micro in 917 hours, for $10,000. I recall that Dan Gonneau estimated 800 hours and a similar cost for his LM too. I think you could save time by building with MDO and foregoing a nice finish (I spent a lot of time sanding). Save money by sewing your own sails and using an available outboard (I did neither- my sails and OB cost me $3,160). But the cost of hardware, electrical, and and rigging ($3,144) equaled the cost of building the bare hull (the wood cost $1,343, the fiberglass, epoxy, and paint $1,824).
Everyone is different. Perhaps I work significantly slower than others. Even while building my LM I underestimated the time it would take. At 400 hours I was certain I only had 100-200 hours of work left. Wrong! At 600 hours I made the same mistake.
I just want to throw this observation out there. Naysayers may reply with, "you work slow and pay too much."
Bill in Ohio,
Long Micro Pugnacious
Everyone is different. Perhaps I work significantly slower than others. Even while building my LM I underestimated the time it would take. At 400 hours I was certain I only had 100-200 hours of work left. Wrong! At 600 hours I made the same mistake.
I just want to throw this observation out there. Naysayers may reply with, "you work slow and pay too much."
Bill in Ohio,
Long Micro Pugnacious
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
>
> Bob
>
> Would you mind breaking out a budget for this by time and by cost either
> here or on your blog? Since you have the end costs of time and money
> down I suspect that you have already done this.
>
> HJ
>
> loosemoosefilmworks wrote:
> > Kenneth is right on the money in the under 10K and six months numbers on the Loose Moose design (I've never been happy with Bernie's name of AS29 for Loose Moose 2 simply because it is not 39 feet...)
> >
> > The advanced sharpies are really easy to build and as long as you don't try to make them something they are not, change the plans or do something silly they are both fast and easy to build. Our Jessie Cooper took less than four and a half months and our Loose Moose 2 took six months.
> >
> > Having spent a few years rehabbing a classic plastic CAL 34 I speak with experience in that it would have been much faster and easier to build a new Loose Moose 2 rather than to fix up an older boat. There is a LOT to be said for starting from scratch! That siad there is still a lot to be said for Classic Plastic but the constraints of working on a boat that is already finished make for a more difficult than building new scenario...
> >
> > Next year, economy willing, we plan to be building Loose Moose 3 a fortyish foot sharpie and plan on a six month building schedule with a budget of $25,000 ready to go with all bells and whistles.
> >
> > Bob
> >http://boatbits.blogspot.com/
> >http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@> wrote:
> >
> >> im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> >> I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> >> less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> >> if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Those numers look about what I would expect
I my self was looking at about 1000 hours for an AS 29 did not brack it down so well lol
when it comes down to it AS 29s are dead simple to build if I worked on boats like this full
time I could tearn out 2 a year on my own
I my self was looking at about 1000 hours for an AS 29 did not brack it down so well lol
when it comes down to it AS 29s are dead simple to build if I worked on boats like this full
time I could tearn out 2 a year on my own
--- On Mon, 3/16/09, Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
From: Bruce Hallman <bruce@...>
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: "New to group" follow-up
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, March 16, 2009, 2:49 PM
Discussions of building the AS29 are a recurring theme on this group.
See prior discussion threads 7/18/2005, 6/19/2007 and 11/17/2008
Here is a cut and paste of my 2005 estimate of the "piece work" in an
AS29, with 'quick/dirty' hour estimates, realistically these hour
could double or triple.
============ =====AS29 piece list======== ========
Here is my takeoff of estimate of manhours to build an AS-29
=======
1,000 manhours
2 Frame A bottom
2 Frame B bottom
2 Frame C bottom
4 Frame D bottom
4 Frame E bottom
3 Frame F bottom
3 Frame G bottom
8 Chine logs
4 board slot sides
36 Bottom panels
10 Bottom sides
24 Anti-plumphing
8 Flip
4 Frame A
4 Frame B
4 Frame C
4 Frame D
4 Frame E
4 Frame F
4 Frame G
36 Sides
24 'Dagger' Boards
16 Board well sides
48 Transom berths, drawers
8 Galley floor
8 Cabin floor
8 Double berth
16 Aft bookshelf, drawer, ventbox
12 Aft buoyancy boxes
12 Cockpit sole/sides
16 Rudder, tiller
6 Motor mount
6 Boomkin mounts
12 Mizzen tabernacle
16 Bureau, hangers
8 Cabin ladder
36 Starboard galley cabinets
36 Portside icebox/cabinets
16 Drop leaf table
36 Heater, heater bins
36 Forward lockers/shelves
6 Forward vent boxes
24 Forward buoyancy
24 Main tabernacle
40 Hull windows
24 Deck stringers
40 Decking
24 Midship deckhouse sides
12 Midship deckhouse roof
24 Hatch
8 Traveler
12 Cockpit backs & Lexan
40 Tortoise tender
4 Tortoise chocks
24 Forward deckhouse sides
24 Forward hatch
12 Forward deckhouse roof
24 Mainmast
16 Mizzen mast
24 Boom/gaff
4 Mizzen sprit
24 Rigging
16 Steel plate ballast
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Discussions of building the AS29 are a recurring theme on this group.
See prior discussion threads 7/18/2005, 6/19/2007 and 11/17/2008
Here is a cut and paste of my 2005 estimate of the "piece work" in an
AS29, with 'quick/dirty' hour estimates, realistically these hour
could double or triple.
=================AS29 piece list================
Here is my takeoff of estimate of manhours to build an AS-29
=======
1,000 manhours
2 Frame A bottom
2 Frame B bottom
2 Frame C bottom
4 Frame D bottom
4 Frame E bottom
3 Frame F bottom
3 Frame G bottom
8 Chine logs
4 board slot sides
36 Bottom panels
10 Bottom sides
24 Anti-plumphing
8 Flip
4 Frame A
4 Frame B
4 Frame C
4 Frame D
4 Frame E
4 Frame F
4 Frame G
36 Sides
24 'Dagger' Boards
16 Board well sides
48 Transom berths, drawers
8 Galley floor
8 Cabin floor
8 Double berth
16 Aft bookshelf, drawer, ventbox
12 Aft buoyancy boxes
12 Cockpit sole/sides
16 Rudder, tiller
6 Motor mount
6 Boomkin mounts
12 Mizzen tabernacle
16 Bureau, hangers
8 Cabin ladder
36 Starboard galley cabinets
36 Portside icebox/cabinets
16 Drop leaf table
36 Heater, heater bins
36 Forward lockers/shelves
6 Forward vent boxes
24 Forward buoyancy
24 Main tabernacle
40 Hull windows
24 Deck stringers
40 Decking
24 Midship deckhouse sides
12 Midship deckhouse roof
24 Hatch
8 Traveler
12 Cockpit backs & Lexan
40 Tortoise tender
4 Tortoise chocks
24 Forward deckhouse sides
24 Forward hatch
12 Forward deckhouse roof
24 Mainmast
16 Mizzen mast
24 Boom/gaff
4 Mizzen sprit
24 Rigging
16 Steel plate ballast
See prior discussion threads 7/18/2005, 6/19/2007 and 11/17/2008
Here is a cut and paste of my 2005 estimate of the "piece work" in an
AS29, with 'quick/dirty' hour estimates, realistically these hour
could double or triple.
=================AS29 piece list================
Here is my takeoff of estimate of manhours to build an AS-29
=======
1,000 manhours
2 Frame A bottom
2 Frame B bottom
2 Frame C bottom
4 Frame D bottom
4 Frame E bottom
3 Frame F bottom
3 Frame G bottom
8 Chine logs
4 board slot sides
36 Bottom panels
10 Bottom sides
24 Anti-plumphing
8 Flip
4 Frame A
4 Frame B
4 Frame C
4 Frame D
4 Frame E
4 Frame F
4 Frame G
36 Sides
24 'Dagger' Boards
16 Board well sides
48 Transom berths, drawers
8 Galley floor
8 Cabin floor
8 Double berth
16 Aft bookshelf, drawer, ventbox
12 Aft buoyancy boxes
12 Cockpit sole/sides
16 Rudder, tiller
6 Motor mount
6 Boomkin mounts
12 Mizzen tabernacle
16 Bureau, hangers
8 Cabin ladder
36 Starboard galley cabinets
36 Portside icebox/cabinets
16 Drop leaf table
36 Heater, heater bins
36 Forward lockers/shelves
6 Forward vent boxes
24 Forward buoyancy
24 Main tabernacle
40 Hull windows
24 Deck stringers
40 Decking
24 Midship deckhouse sides
12 Midship deckhouse roof
24 Hatch
8 Traveler
12 Cockpit backs & Lexan
40 Tortoise tender
4 Tortoise chocks
24 Forward deckhouse sides
24 Forward hatch
12 Forward deckhouse roof
24 Mainmast
16 Mizzen mast
24 Boom/gaff
4 Mizzen sprit
24 Rigging
16 Steel plate ballast
Bob
Would you mind breaking out a budget for this by time and by cost either
here or on your blog? Since you have the end costs of time and money
down I suspect that you have already done this.
HJ
loosemoosefilmworks wrote:
Would you mind breaking out a budget for this by time and by cost either
here or on your blog? Since you have the end costs of time and money
down I suspect that you have already done this.
HJ
loosemoosefilmworks wrote:
> Kenneth is right on the money in the under 10K and six months numbers on the Loose Moose design (I've never been happy with Bernie's name of AS29 for Loose Moose 2 simply because it is not 39 feet...)
>
> The advanced sharpies are really easy to build and as long as you don't try to make them something they are not, change the plans or do something silly they are both fast and easy to build. Our Jessie Cooper took less than four and a half months and our Loose Moose 2 took six months.
>
> Having spent a few years rehabbing a classic plastic CAL 34 I speak with experience in that it would have been much faster and easier to build a new Loose Moose 2 rather than to fix up an older boat. There is a LOT to be said for starting from scratch! That siad there is still a lot to be said for Classic Plastic but the constraints of working on a boat that is already finished make for a more difficult than building new scenario...
>
> Next year, economy willing, we plan to be building Loose Moose 3 a fortyish foot sharpie and plan on a six month building schedule with a budget of $25,000 ready to go with all bells and whistles.
>
> Bob
>http://boatbits.blogspot.com/
>http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
>
>> im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
>> I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
>> less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
>> if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Kenneth is right on the money in the under 10K and six months numbers on the Loose Moose design (I've never been happy with Bernie's name of AS29 for Loose Moose 2 simply because it is not 39 feet...)
The advanced sharpies are really easy to build and as long as you don't try to make them something they are not, change the plans or do something silly they are both fast and easy to build. Our Jessie Cooper took less than four and a half months and our Loose Moose 2 took six months.
Having spent a few years rehabbing a classic plastic CAL 34 I speak with experience in that it would have been much faster and easier to build a new Loose Moose 2 rather than to fix up an older boat. There is a LOT to be said for starting from scratch! That siad there is still a lot to be said for Classic Plastic but the constraints of working on a boat that is already finished make for a more difficult than building new scenario...
Next year, economy willing, we plan to be building Loose Moose 3 a fortyish foot sharpie and plan on a six month building schedule with a budget of $25,000 ready to go with all bells and whistles.
Bob
http://boatbits.blogspot.com/
http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
The advanced sharpies are really easy to build and as long as you don't try to make them something they are not, change the plans or do something silly they are both fast and easy to build. Our Jessie Cooper took less than four and a half months and our Loose Moose 2 took six months.
Having spent a few years rehabbing a classic plastic CAL 34 I speak with experience in that it would have been much faster and easier to build a new Loose Moose 2 rather than to fix up an older boat. There is a LOT to be said for starting from scratch! That siad there is still a lot to be said for Classic Plastic but the constraints of working on a boat that is already finished make for a more difficult than building new scenario...
Next year, economy willing, we plan to be building Loose Moose 3 a fortyish foot sharpie and plan on a six month building schedule with a budget of $25,000 ready to go with all bells and whistles.
Bob
http://boatbits.blogspot.com/
http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Barnett <daddy_green_dragon@...> wrote:
>
> im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
> I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
> less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
> if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
im an experienced professional boat builder (10 years experience)
I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
I looked at the AS 29 and AS 39 for my own use I think I worked out that it would take
less than $10,000 to build the hull using good ac ply and epoxy and glass
if I started one of these I would plan on having it in the water in 6mo to a year
--- On Sun, 3/15/09, icewater0000 <icewater0000@...> wrote:
From: icewater0000 <icewater0000@...>
Subject: [bolger] "New to group" follow-up
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, March 15, 2009, 6:31 PM
Hello all -
Thanks for the replies I've received so far (Bruce H, Ed H, Doug P, Patrick C, David G, and Dave G). I thought I'd summarize the advice, most (but not all) oriented toward building:
- Learn to sail! Take classes or meet people on the docks.
- Don't overestimate your needs - the relationship between boat length and time/resources required is NOT linear.
- Build a smaller boat first - you will need a dinghy anyway. Try to use techniques that you can transfer to building the larger boat.
- Build a scale model first.
- If time is an issue, consider buying a used boat.
I think time will be an issue for me - for the larger boat, building myself doesn't seem realistic by Summer 2010. I think I will build a dinghy, though - at the very least, that experience should get me some maintenance and repair skills, and a collection of useful tools.
Could I expand the discussion to include the other options and get your thoughts on them? They seem to break out as follows:
- Buy a used AS29:
Are there any? Where would be a good place to look?
- Buy a used boat similar to the AS29:
The things that led me to the AS29 are: livable size, affordable, shallow draft, coastal-capable, simple, flat bottom. And I really like the square boat look (I understand this is not the consensus in the sailing community, though I don't understand why). Bruce H mentioned the Jessie Cooper as an option...
- Have an experienced builder build a new AS29.
How would I find a trustworthy builder? How much could I expect to pay?
Thanks again for your help - your wisdom is much appreciated.
- Mike
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hello all -
Thanks for the replies I've received so far (Bruce H, Ed H, Doug P, Patrick C, David G, and Dave G). I thought I'd summarize the advice, most (but not all) oriented toward building:
- Learn to sail! Take classes or meet people on the docks.
- Don't overestimate your needs - the relationship between boat length and time/resources required is NOT linear.
- Build a smaller boat first - you will need a dinghy anyway. Try to use techniques that you can transfer to building the larger boat.
- Build a scale model first.
- If time is an issue, consider buying a used boat.
I think time will be an issue for me - for the larger boat, building myself doesn't seem realistic by Summer 2010. I think I will build a dinghy, though - at the very least, that experience should get me some maintenance and repair skills, and a collection of useful tools.
Could I expand the discussion to include the other options and get your thoughts on them? They seem to break out as follows:
- Buy a used AS29:
Are there any? Where would be a good place to look?
- Buy a used boat similar to the AS29:
The things that led me to the AS29 are: livable size, affordable, shallow draft, coastal-capable, simple, flat bottom. And I really like the square boat look (I understand this is not the consensus in the sailing community, though I don't understand why). Bruce H mentioned the Jessie Cooper as an option...
- Have an experienced builder build a new AS29.
How would I find a trustworthy builder? How much could I expect to pay?
Thanks again for your help - your wisdom is much appreciated.
- Mike
Thanks for the replies I've received so far (Bruce H, Ed H, Doug P, Patrick C, David G, and Dave G). I thought I'd summarize the advice, most (but not all) oriented toward building:
- Learn to sail! Take classes or meet people on the docks.
- Don't overestimate your needs - the relationship between boat length and time/resources required is NOT linear.
- Build a smaller boat first - you will need a dinghy anyway. Try to use techniques that you can transfer to building the larger boat.
- Build a scale model first.
- If time is an issue, consider buying a used boat.
I think time will be an issue for me - for the larger boat, building myself doesn't seem realistic by Summer 2010. I think I will build a dinghy, though - at the very least, that experience should get me some maintenance and repair skills, and a collection of useful tools.
Could I expand the discussion to include the other options and get your thoughts on them? They seem to break out as follows:
- Buy a used AS29:
Are there any? Where would be a good place to look?
- Buy a used boat similar to the AS29:
The things that led me to the AS29 are: livable size, affordable, shallow draft, coastal-capable, simple, flat bottom. And I really like the square boat look (I understand this is not the consensus in the sailing community, though I don't understand why). Bruce H mentioned the Jessie Cooper as an option...
- Have an experienced builder build a new AS29.
How would I find a trustworthy builder? How much could I expect to pay?
Thanks again for your help - your wisdom is much appreciated.
- Mike