Re: PHRF rating for Folding Schooner
Hey Will
a couple of questions if yo don't mind:
What did the race committee come up with for a rating?
Did the launching go as planned and do you have pictures?
I plan to launch my folding schooner over the memorial day weekend and am working on a lifting mechanism for the boat on the trailer.
Breaux
a couple of questions if yo don't mind:
What did the race committee come up with for a rating?
Did the launching go as planned and do you have pictures?
I plan to launch my folding schooner over the memorial day weekend and am working on a lifting mechanism for the boat on the trailer.
Breaux
>
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "pvanderwaart" <pvanderwaart@...> wrote:
Photos are here
http://sports.webshots.com/album/548246269VtgyuF
I'll copy part of the original article below if anyone is interested.
Peter
"There is an institution called WAGS (Wednesday Afternoon Gentlemen's Sailing) run by many Yacht Clubs. This particular one was a race of 14 nautical miles around an elongated triangle with a handicap start.
We decided to ambush the race and entered. They asked what kind of boat it was & we replied "a 30 ft trailerable gaff rigged schooner that we had not sailed very much", all true, but not necessarily the whole truth. Stereotyping by the committee (after all a gaff rigged boat can't be fast) resulted in a handicap of +3 minutes.
Start handicaps range from zero for slow trailer-sailers to +45 min for the fastest multihulls. The fleet was 10 assorted multihulls and 25-30 assorted keelboats. A nor'easter at 18 knots was blowing, with a one to 1.2 m swell. When the breeze is NE the course starts with a short 3-4 mile beat and the rest is broad or tight reaching.
Basically it was a great day- initially we were doing 4-6 knots to windward, holding our own but not pointing quite as high as the fleet, using foresail & full main only- we have found that she points better with this rig in stronger breezes but schooners aren't renowned for windward performance. At the windward mark we set the jib and speed picked up to about 9-10 knots on the tight reach to the wing mark- one 35 ft catamaran was starting to run us down, but the rest of the fleet, both mono and multihull, was left well behind. On the broad reach after the gybe, speed picked up to 10 knots average with bursts to 11.5 (all by GPS) and we held the cat off until about a mile from the finish. Their entire crew was standing and saluting and cheering us on.
We crossed the line and promptly lost concentration in the gybe, tangled the mainsheet and capsized 100 metres after the finish. My brother Martin did the opposite of a rat in a treadmill, climbed over the hull, and got to the centreboard without getting wet. The masts were well submerged (say an angle of heel of 120 degrees). Just his weight on the board was enough to stop the roll and start it back upright. I (from long training 30 years ago in our 14 ft skiff) was in the water releasing all sheets and when I saw it start to come back up just rolled back into the cockpit & came up with it- I didn't want it to sail away with no one on board. Martin managed to climb aboard into the aft cockpit (the reverse of his previous manoeuvre and still dry) and we sheeted on the main and put the helm alee to bring her head to wind and reduce the drift. The other two crewmembers swam to the boat from 5 metres away and were hauled aboard. The boat had much less water in it after capsize than before (because of the spray we had had to bail 3-4 times and had 15 cm of water in it at the time of capsize)- proof that side decks and generous buoyancy tanks really do work. Total time for capsize and recovery was less than 3 minutes.
The best bit of the day was the result. We beat the next mono in by 33 minutes- ambush successful - bang goes our handicap for next time".
>I believe that was an article about my FS. You are correct in that she is modified with large buoyancy tanks.
> IIRC, there was a story in MAIB about racing a Folding Schooner. That particular boat had been reinforced and side-decks added, I believe.
>
Photos are here
http://sports.webshots.com/album/548246269VtgyuF
I'll copy part of the original article below if anyone is interested.
Peter
"There is an institution called WAGS (Wednesday Afternoon Gentlemen's Sailing) run by many Yacht Clubs. This particular one was a race of 14 nautical miles around an elongated triangle with a handicap start.
We decided to ambush the race and entered. They asked what kind of boat it was & we replied "a 30 ft trailerable gaff rigged schooner that we had not sailed very much", all true, but not necessarily the whole truth. Stereotyping by the committee (after all a gaff rigged boat can't be fast) resulted in a handicap of +3 minutes.
Start handicaps range from zero for slow trailer-sailers to +45 min for the fastest multihulls. The fleet was 10 assorted multihulls and 25-30 assorted keelboats. A nor'easter at 18 knots was blowing, with a one to 1.2 m swell. When the breeze is NE the course starts with a short 3-4 mile beat and the rest is broad or tight reaching.
Basically it was a great day- initially we were doing 4-6 knots to windward, holding our own but not pointing quite as high as the fleet, using foresail & full main only- we have found that she points better with this rig in stronger breezes but schooners aren't renowned for windward performance. At the windward mark we set the jib and speed picked up to about 9-10 knots on the tight reach to the wing mark- one 35 ft catamaran was starting to run us down, but the rest of the fleet, both mono and multihull, was left well behind. On the broad reach after the gybe, speed picked up to 10 knots average with bursts to 11.5 (all by GPS) and we held the cat off until about a mile from the finish. Their entire crew was standing and saluting and cheering us on.
We crossed the line and promptly lost concentration in the gybe, tangled the mainsheet and capsized 100 metres after the finish. My brother Martin did the opposite of a rat in a treadmill, climbed over the hull, and got to the centreboard without getting wet. The masts were well submerged (say an angle of heel of 120 degrees). Just his weight on the board was enough to stop the roll and start it back upright. I (from long training 30 years ago in our 14 ft skiff) was in the water releasing all sheets and when I saw it start to come back up just rolled back into the cockpit & came up with it- I didn't want it to sail away with no one on board. Martin managed to climb aboard into the aft cockpit (the reverse of his previous manoeuvre and still dry) and we sheeted on the main and put the helm alee to bring her head to wind and reduce the drift. The other two crewmembers swam to the boat from 5 metres away and were hauled aboard. The boat had much less water in it after capsize than before (because of the spray we had had to bail 3-4 times and had 15 cm of water in it at the time of capsize)- proof that side decks and generous buoyancy tanks really do work. Total time for capsize and recovery was less than 3 minutes.
The best bit of the day was the result. We beat the next mono in by 33 minutes- ambush successful - bang goes our handicap for next time".
IIRC, there was a story in MAIB about racing a Folding Schooner. That particular boat had been reinforced and side-decks added, I believe.
As I remember, the first race was in a strongish breeze with a short (compared to the total course length) weather leg. After turning the top mark, they did two long reaches at multihulls speed. By the finish, they had a lot of water in the boat. They won, or otherwise did well, on corrected time, but the rating committee immediately upped their rating so afterward they had zero chance on any course with a normal proportion of windward work.
Typical rating committee thinking.
I don't think it was actual PHRF, but, in truth, I don't remember.
Based on a lifetime total Folding Schooner sailing experience of about 1/2 hour, I can say she's capable of an exhilarating WHOOOOOSH off the wind.
Peter
As I remember, the first race was in a strongish breeze with a short (compared to the total course length) weather leg. After turning the top mark, they did two long reaches at multihulls speed. By the finish, they had a lot of water in the boat. They won, or otherwise did well, on corrected time, but the rating committee immediately upped their rating so afterward they had zero chance on any course with a normal proportion of windward work.
Typical rating committee thinking.
I don't think it was actual PHRF, but, in truth, I don't remember.
Based on a lifetime total Folding Schooner sailing experience of about 1/2 hour, I can say she's capable of an exhilarating WHOOOOOSH off the wind.
Peter
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, White & Laur White <omegacubed@...> wrote:
Glad to hear you're finally getting it wet. I can't help you with a rating and the folding schooner certainly is a difficult boat to rate as the polar diagram is more like a multi.
Send some photos.
Peter
>Hey Will
> Has anyone received a PHRF rating for a Folding Schooner? I intend to race mine (expected launch date April 17 - four more coats of varnish to go) on Charlotte Harbor, Florida, but any PHRF rating will help our race committee until I can get an official West Florida PHRF rating.
>
> Thanks for any help you can give me.
>
> -- Will White
>
Glad to hear you're finally getting it wet. I can't help you with a rating and the folding schooner certainly is a difficult boat to rate as the polar diagram is more like a multi.
Send some photos.
Peter
> Has anyone received a PHRF rating for a Folding Schooner?I have no idea, but please, please, please post back and tell us how it goes. And have fun.
I've raced two or three times on Charlotte Harbor, though not for quite a while. One time I was on a Bermuda 40 that was knocked flat, beam ends, mast horizontal in a gusty northerly just off PGI.
Has anyone received a PHRF rating for a Folding Schooner? I intend to race mine (expected launch date April 17 - four more coats of varnish to go) on Charlotte Harbor, Florida, but any PHRF rating will help our race committee until I can get an official West Florida PHRF rating.
Thanks for any help you can give me.
-- Will White
Thanks for any help you can give me.
-- Will White