Re: Elegant Punt and Nymph?
My Teal takes the 59sf sail but at the time I had a smaller Pirogue spritsail. I added a boom and it worked fine even without adjusting the mast position. The Elegant Punt was built for a neighbor kid as a rowboat only so I never sailed it. I a nervous about the idea of using the 59sf sail on EP, but I think the Pirogue sail would be good. I don't remember the area but I think it is 30 something. Actually, after looking it up I find it is a gaff sail, but it works fine as a spritsail.
For a heavy adrenalin rush use the 59sf in a brisk wind if you are young and daring enough. On that note go to flicker and check out the Aussie skiff races. They really love the cutting edge.
Jim Michalak's newsletters have a discussion of sail area math if you find that an alternate rig has a different center. It should be at the daggerboard/leeboard center or aft edge, something like that.
On leeboards and rudder, I recommend Michalak's pivoting types rather than the clip on or anything fixed.
Joe T
For a heavy adrenalin rush use the 59sf in a brisk wind if you are young and daring enough. On that note go to flicker and check out the Aussie skiff races. They really love the cutting edge.
Jim Michalak's newsletters have a discussion of sail area math if you find that an alternate rig has a different center. It should be at the daggerboard/leeboard center or aft edge, something like that.
On leeboards and rudder, I recommend Michalak's pivoting types rather than the clip on or anything fixed.
Joe T
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "adventures_in_astrophotography" <jon@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Trevor,
>
> You could certainly put the smaller sail on EP, but you'll probably need to move the mast step and partner slightly to make sure the balance of the rig is the same as with the original sail. A scale drawing is the easiest way to figure out the required changes.
> Jon Kolb
> www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
>
I have 2 Trailex trailers -- an SUT-250 for my kayak and guideboat, and an
SUT-500 for my 350# Nord Vinden sailboat. They work fine at 70+ mph between
Seattle and southern Oregon. I've had no problems, and the hubs remain cool.
SUT-500 for my 350# Nord Vinden sailboat. They work fine at 70+ mph between
Seattle and southern Oregon. I've had no problems, and the hubs remain cool.
----- Original Message -----
From: "adventures_in_astrophotography" <jon@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2009 6:17 AM
How do you like the Trailex? I've been considering the SUT-350-S for my dory
and long Gypsy, but they're very expensive for their size, and I'm uncertain
about those 8" wheels at highway speeds over the long distances we often travel
out here in the west. What has been your experience?
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
For the past five years, I have used the SUT-200-S (125 pounds, 200 pound limit, with a rubbber strap suspension that works fine for a light boat) with my "Surf." I use it in salt water only and have had no corression problems. You can also easily just take it apart and store it if you don't want to use it for a time. (It comes from the factory in a couple of boxes UPS.)
The tire size hasn't been a problem on long trips, and I too worry a lot and check the hub temperature every time I get gas. One advantage of the 8" tires is that the boat is in the water quickly. The only downside of this trailer for me has been that I keep forgetting it is on the back of my car, it's so light and low.
The tire size hasn't been a problem on long trips, and I too worry a lot and check the hub temperature every time I get gas. One advantage of the 8" tires is that the boat is in the water quickly. The only downside of this trailer for me has been that I keep forgetting it is on the back of my car, it's so light and low.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "adventures_in_astrophotography" <jon@...> wrote:
>
> Gregeroy,
>
> ...snip...
> (although I gave up on that a couple of years ago and went to a Trailex 125 pound alumimum trailer for fear of dropping the boat on me or someone else during the process)
> ...snip...
>
> How do you like the Trailex? I've been considering the SUT-350-S for my dory and long Gypsy, but they're very expensive for their size, and I'm uncertain about those 8" wheels at highway speeds over the long distances we often travel out here in the west. What has been your experience?
>
> Jon Kolb
> www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
>
thanks for all the replies, you all have given me some things to think about. i'm hoping to start picking up materials with a week or so. so i've got to make a decision pretty soon.
again, thanks.
trevor
again, thanks.
trevor
Hi Trevor,
Note that you could also build the Rubens Nymph, which is the same as Nymph but with a foot of extra beam, and it uses the 59 sq. ft. sail. Having that sail might come in handy if you later build one of the many other Bolger designs that use the same rig. Perhaps someone in the group can comment on sailing a Rubens Nymph - it must surely be stiffer than a standard Nymph.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
> So the Elegant Punt is really set up more for light weather or sheltered pond/lake sailing? I wonder if it would hurt to build the EP, but use Nymph's 40 sqft. sail? Or maybe a Snark 45 sqft lateen sail? Would it be hard to balance out with the clip-on leeboard?You could certainly put the smaller sail on EP, but you'll probably need to move the mast step and partner slightly to make sure the balance of the rig is the same as with the original sail. A scale drawing is the easiest way to figure out the required changes.
Note that you could also build the Rubens Nymph, which is the same as Nymph but with a foot of extra beam, and it uses the 59 sq. ft. sail. Having that sail might come in handy if you later build one of the many other Bolger designs that use the same rig. Perhaps someone in the group can comment on sailing a Rubens Nymph - it must surely be stiffer than a standard Nymph.
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
Gregeroy,
...snip...
(although I gave up on that a couple of years ago and went to a Trailex 125 pound alumimum trailer for fear of dropping the boat on me or someone else during the process)
...snip...
How do you like the Trailex? I've been considering the SUT-350-S for my dory and long Gypsy, but they're very expensive for their size, and I'm uncertain about those 8" wheels at highway speeds over the long distances we often travel out here in the west. What has been your experience?
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
...snip...
(although I gave up on that a couple of years ago and went to a Trailex 125 pound alumimum trailer for fear of dropping the boat on me or someone else during the process)
...snip...
How do you like the Trailex? I've been considering the SUT-350-S for my dory and long Gypsy, but they're very expensive for their size, and I'm uncertain about those 8" wheels at highway speeds over the long distances we often travel out here in the west. What has been your experience?
Jon Kolb
www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
I have buiilt both E Punt ahd Nymph. what has been said about stability and sail plan is right on. The 40 ft for Nymph is also right on. Don't try to improve on it. Compare hull cross sections. EP has it's bouyancy spread farther to the sides, hence better stability in a calm. However I would prefer Nymph in rougher conditions as the waves would have less effect on the rounder hull shape. And it is important to have that Sprit boom to keep the foot of the sail above your head. Both have a fore and aft seat that puts you pretty high. Don't use a sail with the boom on the foot or you will have to hoiist it too high for stability.
Joe T
Joe T
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
>
> Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
>
> I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
>
> Thanks,
> Trevor
>
I made several posts in the last year about building and sailing my modified Nymph. Do a search in this group to bring them up.
Made mine midway between Nymph and Ruben's Nymph in beam - 4'. I wanted something a bit less tiddly than the narrower Nymph, but thought the Ruben's a bit too wide. Used the smaller Nymph rig (39sq ft). Have been very happy with the results. Moves nicely in light air, and handles a blow (I've had it out in 15 to 20 knots several times). I did have to upgrade the leeboard (which broke off in the maiden, big blow sail), to a bilgeboard, which has worked great. Also went with a kick up rudder borrowed from Gypsy plans (lots of thin water in the North Carolina sounds where we mess about).
Some pics are at:
http://bearinlet.com/simmetry/Zen/index.php?album=boats
We've had a lot of fun with it, and I recommend Nymph in any of its widths. Haven't had occasion to sail an EP, so I'll leave that to others.
Go for it, you'll have fun with any of them!
Neil S.
Made mine midway between Nymph and Ruben's Nymph in beam - 4'. I wanted something a bit less tiddly than the narrower Nymph, but thought the Ruben's a bit too wide. Used the smaller Nymph rig (39sq ft). Have been very happy with the results. Moves nicely in light air, and handles a blow (I've had it out in 15 to 20 knots several times). I did have to upgrade the leeboard (which broke off in the maiden, big blow sail), to a bilgeboard, which has worked great. Also went with a kick up rudder borrowed from Gypsy plans (lots of thin water in the North Carolina sounds where we mess about).
Some pics are at:
http://bearinlet.com/simmetry/Zen/index.php?album=boats
We've had a lot of fun with it, and I recommend Nymph in any of its widths. Haven't had occasion to sail an EP, so I'll leave that to others.
Go for it, you'll have fun with any of them!
Neil S.
My first build was a Nymph, so I can speak to it's handling and building characteristics. Nymph rows very well with one or two aboard, put a couple of oar sockets in so that the rowing position is optimal for the load. I loved to row it in choppy water, the flare from the dual chines makes it like a little tiny dory. However, the trade off was that it was a little tiddly climbing in from the mother ship, particularly in the chop!
It goes together very easily and is a very quick build from Payson's plans and book.
Happy building. Anyone have a trailer for an 18' skiff they want to unload?
David Jost
It goes together very easily and is a very quick build from Payson's plans and book.
Happy building. Anyone have a trailer for an 18' skiff they want to unload?
David Jost
I meant to say if floats high enough to be self rescuing. It is certainly not self-righting.
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_west2001" <greg@...> wrote:
>
> I'd consider building the Surf (or one of the other Bolger 59 sqft sailboats), unless you have storage issues or don't want to spring for the additional couple of sheets of plywood. The Surf is fun to sail, it rows well with one or two people, you can have a second person (or two little people) as passengers, it's self-righting, it only weighs probably 40 pounds more than the Elegant Punt, it (like the Elegant Punt) does not rquire any fiberglassing), it can be cartopped with one of those swing-on trailer loaders (although I gave up on that a couple of years ago and went to a Trailex 125 pound alumimum trailer for fear of dropping the boat on me or someone else during the process), and it is as easy to build as the smaller Elegant Punt (which requires harder bends to the side panels).
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@> wrote:
> >
> > So the Elegant Punt is really set up more for light weather or sheltered pond/lake sailing? I wonder if it would hurt to build the EP, but use Nymph's 40 sqft. sail? Or maybe a Snark 45 sqft lateen sail? Would it be hard to balance out with the clip-on leeboard?
> >
> > Sorry if this seems a bit ignorant, I grew up on boats in Florida, but have never sailed one before (other than a 12 ft Boston Whaler that ran out of gas once and had to be "sailed" a couple miles back to a marina with the bimini top).
> >
> > Trevor
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_west2001" <greg@> wrote:
> > >
> > > It depends on your wind conditions: My Elegant Punt sails great with one adult in a light breeze. Agility and alertness are important attibutes of a dry skipper in the Elegant Punt in a moderate wind. I wouldn't take it out in a hard blow on a bet. (My 15' 6" Surf uses the same sail, and I sail that boat when the wind picks up.)
> > >
> > > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
> > > >
> > > > Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
> > > >
> > > > I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Trevor
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
I'd consider building the Surf (or one of the other Bolger 59 sqft sailboats), unless you have storage issues or don't want to spring for the additional couple of sheets of plywood. The Surf is fun to sail, it rows well with one or two people, you can have a second person (or two little people) as passengers, it's self-righting, it only weighs probably 40 pounds more than the Elegant Punt, it (like the Elegant Punt) does not rquire any fiberglassing), it can be cartopped with one of those swing-on trailer loaders (although I gave up on that a couple of years ago and went to a Trailex 125 pound alumimum trailer for fear of dropping the boat on me or someone else during the process), and it is as easy to build as the smaller Elegant Punt (which requires harder bends to the side panels).
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@...> wrote:
>
> So the Elegant Punt is really set up more for light weather or sheltered pond/lake sailing? I wonder if it would hurt to build the EP, but use Nymph's 40 sqft. sail? Or maybe a Snark 45 sqft lateen sail? Would it be hard to balance out with the clip-on leeboard?
>
> Sorry if this seems a bit ignorant, I grew up on boats in Florida, but have never sailed one before (other than a 12 ft Boston Whaler that ran out of gas once and had to be "sailed" a couple miles back to a marina with the bimini top).
>
> Trevor
>
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_west2001" <greg@> wrote:
> >
> > It depends on your wind conditions: My Elegant Punt sails great with one adult in a light breeze. Agility and alertness are important attibutes of a dry skipper in the Elegant Punt in a moderate wind. I wouldn't take it out in a hard blow on a bet. (My 15' 6" Surf uses the same sail, and I sail that boat when the wind picks up.)
> >
> > --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
> > >
> > > Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
> > >
> > > I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Trevor
> > >
> >
>
So the Elegant Punt is really set up more for light weather or sheltered pond/lake sailing? I wonder if it would hurt to build the EP, but use Nymph's 40 sqft. sail? Or maybe a Snark 45 sqft lateen sail? Would it be hard to balance out with the clip-on leeboard?
Sorry if this seems a bit ignorant, I grew up on boats in Florida, but have never sailed one before (other than a 12 ft Boston Whaler that ran out of gas once and had to be "sailed" a couple miles back to a marina with the bimini top).
Trevor
Sorry if this seems a bit ignorant, I grew up on boats in Florida, but have never sailed one before (other than a 12 ft Boston Whaler that ran out of gas once and had to be "sailed" a couple miles back to a marina with the bimini top).
Trevor
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregory_west2001" <greg@...> wrote:
>
> It depends on your wind conditions: My Elegant Punt sails great with one adult in a light breeze. Agility and alertness are important attibutes of a dry skipper in the Elegant Punt in a moderate wind. I wouldn't take it out in a hard blow on a bet. (My 15' 6" Surf uses the same sail, and I sail that boat when the wind picks up.)
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
> >
> > Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
> >
> > I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Trevor
> >
>
It depends on your wind conditions: My Elegant Punt sails great with one adult in a light breeze. Agility and alertness are important attibutes of a dry skipper in the Elegant Punt in a moderate wind. I wouldn't take it out in a hard blow on a bet. (My 15' 6" Surf uses the same sail, and I sail that boat when the wind picks up.)
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@...> wrote:
>
> Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
>
> Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
>
> I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
>
> Thanks,
> Trevor
>
Hi, first post here, so bear with me on a possible newb questions.
Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
Thanks,
Trevor
Concerning the Bolger Elegant Punt and the Bolger Nymph, the dimensions seem to be pretty close, yet the sailplan for the EP is considerably larger than the Nymph's. Is the flat bottom on the EP that much more stable, in order to justify the 59 sqft. sail? Is the Nymph underpowered at 40 sq ft. or maybe the EP overpowered? Has anyone sailed either? Or put a different sail on either than what the plans call for?
I've read a bunch of posts on here talking about how they both make good tenders, but what about sailing one? I'm thinking of building one as a small cartopper for learning to sail on SW Missouri lakes. I like the ease of build in the EP plans, but the look of the Nymph.
Thanks,
Trevor