Re: [bolger] Re: Micro help wanted
I am going to try an attachment of Micro's at the memorial that shows
the rigging you are describing.
HJ
the rigging you are describing.
HJ
On 1/8/2011 5:28 AM, Dave Gentry wrote:
> Hi Rod
> Congrats on your score!
>
> Unlike the marconi/sloop rigs you are familiar with, Micro is rigged with "Leg-o-mutton" sprit sails. They look like the mainsail of a sloop rigged boat, but use sprit booms.
> With these, there are no goosenecks. Rather, the boom is attached to the clew, aft, while the forward end projects beyond the mast - where it hangs from the "snotter." The boom angles upwards from the clew, which gives it self-vanging properties. The bottom of the sail is "loose footed," and the sail can be flattened, somewhat, by increasing the tension on the snotter.
>
> Reefing typically involves attaching the sprit to the new clew position, and allowing the sprit to project much further ahead of the mast. There are other methods.
> There's plenty of information about these rigs - and pics of Micros - on the web.
>
> As for the mizzen, the "boomkin" is what extends aft from under the transom - the end of which is where the mizzen is initially sheeted to. The sheet then runs forward to a cleat. Don't worry that it's all off center . . . .
>
> Good luck!
>
> Dave Gentry
>
> www.GentryCustomBoats.com
>
>
>
>
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "rod_cahill"<rod_cahill@...> wrote:
>> Hi All,
>> I have been given a Micro, in excellent condition for FREE, that;s right, zero dollars. How lucky am I!
>>
>> Question about rigging. All my experience has been with sloop rigs. I am wondering if anybody could email a photo of the fitting of boom etc. The area where a gooseneck would hold the boom to mast on a sloop rig. Also any reefing points. Also, the fitting of mizzen mast to the extention through the transom.
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
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Hi Rod
Congrats on your score!
Unlike the marconi/sloop rigs you are familiar with, Micro is rigged with "Leg-o-mutton" sprit sails. They look like the mainsail of a sloop rigged boat, but use sprit booms.
With these, there are no goosenecks. Rather, the boom is attached to the clew, aft, while the forward end projects beyond the mast - where it hangs from the "snotter." The boom angles upwards from the clew, which gives it self-vanging properties. The bottom of the sail is "loose footed," and the sail can be flattened, somewhat, by increasing the tension on the snotter.
Reefing typically involves attaching the sprit to the new clew position, and allowing the sprit to project much further ahead of the mast. There are other methods.
There's plenty of information about these rigs - and pics of Micros - on the web.
As for the mizzen, the "boomkin" is what extends aft from under the transom - the end of which is where the mizzen is initially sheeted to. The sheet then runs forward to a cleat. Don't worry that it's all off center . . . .
Good luck!
Dave Gentry
www.GentryCustomBoats.com
Congrats on your score!
Unlike the marconi/sloop rigs you are familiar with, Micro is rigged with "Leg-o-mutton" sprit sails. They look like the mainsail of a sloop rigged boat, but use sprit booms.
With these, there are no goosenecks. Rather, the boom is attached to the clew, aft, while the forward end projects beyond the mast - where it hangs from the "snotter." The boom angles upwards from the clew, which gives it self-vanging properties. The bottom of the sail is "loose footed," and the sail can be flattened, somewhat, by increasing the tension on the snotter.
Reefing typically involves attaching the sprit to the new clew position, and allowing the sprit to project much further ahead of the mast. There are other methods.
There's plenty of information about these rigs - and pics of Micros - on the web.
As for the mizzen, the "boomkin" is what extends aft from under the transom - the end of which is where the mizzen is initially sheeted to. The sheet then runs forward to a cleat. Don't worry that it's all off center . . . .
Good luck!
Dave Gentry
www.GentryCustomBoats.com
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "rod_cahill" <rod_cahill@...> wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> I have been given a Micro, in excellent condition for FREE, that;s right, zero dollars. How lucky am I!
>
> Question about rigging. All my experience has been with sloop rigs. I am wondering if anybody could email a photo of the fitting of boom etc. The area where a gooseneck would hold the boom to mast on a sloop rig. Also any reefing points. Also, the fitting of mizzen mast to the extention through the transom.
>
Rod,
I don’t have any pix handy but I’m happy to help you. Are there any reef points in the main and if so are they parallel to the foot or the mast?
Has the rear rail been installed and if so has the hole for the mizzen mast been cut? Has either mast step been installed?
Main boom is just a 2x2 (50x50mm) with a couple of holes in each end and some doweling put through in the rear to provide a place to tie on the main sheet. I did mine with cleats on the back edge of the cabin top for halyard and outhaul and on the back edge of the main deck for mainsheet and mizzen. You will probably want some kind of way to lock the rudder. I use a little device called a Tiller Tamer. You can lock down the tiller, set the mizzen, and Micro will self steer on any kind of a reach.
MylesJ
Hi All,
I have been given a Micro, in excellent condition for FREE, that;s right, zero dollars. How lucky am I!
Question about rigging. All my experience has been with sloop rigs. I am wondering if anybody could email a photo of the fitting of boom etc. The area where a gooseneck would hold the boom to mast on a sloop rig. Also any reefing points. Also, the fitting of mizzen mast to the extention through the transom.
I have been given a Micro, in excellent condition for FREE, that;s right, zero dollars. How lucky am I!
Question about rigging. All my experience has been with sloop rigs. I am wondering if anybody could email a photo of the fitting of boom etc. The area where a gooseneck would hold the boom to mast on a sloop rig. Also any reefing points. Also, the fitting of mizzen mast to the extention through the transom.
Fred -
You are correct, it is all a matter of perspective. I was in Orlando last week and it was cold, but i would have still been working on a boat there. On a trip towards Daytona, we passed many boat manufacturers hard at work (could tell by the telltale polyester resin smell). That just doesn't happen up here unless it is a big firm.
David
You are correct, it is all a matter of perspective. I was in Orlando last week and it was cold, but i would have still been working on a boat there. On a trip towards Daytona, we passed many boat manufacturers hard at work (could tell by the telltale polyester resin smell). That just doesn't happen up here unless it is a big firm.
David
On Sun, Feb 21, 2010 at 9:04 AM, dnjost<davidjost@...>wrote:It's interesting how all weather is relative. My wife is in Miami visiting her brother and down there they're complaining of the cold because it's only 70 degrees. My younger son is spending his first winter in western Mass and he talks of how mild it's been.Got the drain tube in yesterday on the Work Skiff with our first Massachusetts day above 45 degrees in about two months!
Here, at my older son's home in the Twin Cities suburbs, it will be another two months before I can get started on my next boat project, a tunnel stern cabin cruiser derivation based on the box keel version of Sneakeasy. If the concept works out, I'll submit it for Wooden Boat's design contest.
And if I were back home in the boreal part of Northern Minnesota, I wouldn't be able to work with epoxy until June and 45 degrees would be considered a warm night in early summer.
Met a guy yesterday at Barnes and Noble in the boat books section. He wanted to build a sailboat but had no experience. I steered him toward Dynamite Payson's book and he was really taken with Bobcat and plans on building it. Maybe he'll show up on this listserv.
Since there are two Freds on this listserv, I'll sign myself in lower case.
fred s.
Chris Burden is a true post-modernist best know for his sometimes controversial installation works. In one, he crucified himself atop a VW bug and drove around the city.
To keep this posting boat oriented. Got the drain tube in yesterday on the Work Skiff with our first Massachusetts day above 45 degrees in about two months!
David Jost
To keep this posting boat oriented. Got the drain tube in yesterday on the Work Skiff with our first Massachusetts day above 45 degrees in about two months!
David Jost
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger4/files/MICRO%20NAVIGATOR/
Ya know, I just realised there's a bow well from looking at your scans there Nels! I had had the impression she was decked to the mast step. Thought I got that from pics of Bruce', went and looked, but no. Took another look at Roger Keyes' mighty Micro Paloma Blanca with the Nav-ish (proto?) doghouse-deckhouse and noticed that even in the later photos his leeboard guards had not been removed. Ya know, I wonder if Roger could settle that old one about a high aspect board of whatever type assisting an as designed Micro with salient keel to windward?
Graeme
Ya know, I just realised there's a bow well from looking at your scans there Nels! I had had the impression she was decked to the mast step. Thought I got that from pics of Bruce', went and looked, but no. Took another look at Roger Keyes' mighty Micro Paloma Blanca with the Nav-ish (proto?) doghouse-deckhouse and noticed that even in the later photos his leeboard guards had not been removed. Ya know, I wonder if Roger could settle that old one about a high aspect board of whatever type assisting an as designed Micro with salient keel to windward?
Graeme
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "prairiedog2332" <arvent@...> wrote:
>
> I had a copy of the upgrade sheet at one time - it is available for $50
> USD from PCB&F.
Rod
sez -Hi
Miles, I've been told that you are a good Micro reference to go to. If I put in
a Long Micro type tabernacle into the bough transom of my Micro
and keep the standard sail plan will I need to change the keel configuration
and will it put the whole lot out of balance?
Thanks,
Glad to know somebody thinks I’m good for something. I think you would be okay with the keel and maybe need a bigger mizzen. Micro has a lot of lee helm. Learning to work the mizzen is the key here. Micro self steers well. I’d agree that there are some conditions where the rudder plate is a good idea. On a reach in strong winds you could free up the mizzen a bit if you had more rudder authority. A bigger mizzen would also help when you are wing and wing.
I agree with Derek, the mods for the front mounted mast are not appealing to me. That version looks a lot less “shippy”. My inclination is to go with an open bow, add additional drainage in the bow compartment and put in another bulkhead at the current mast position. My mast is solid Douglas fir and so heavier than most others. Being able to do all the mast work easily from the front hatch would be an improvement. I’m still going back and forth between adding the front hatch and going to a Birdwatcher type walk-through. I would have to make something secure enough to dock at a marina and weather tight enough for an Oregon rainy season. I can tell you for sure I’ve never gotten a drop in the cabin with the base design. The tabernacle would make trailer sailing easier. Trailering means I need to keep a towing rig. I’d rather not do that anymore. As a result, I dither.
MylesJ
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Rpd Cahill <rodcahill@...> wrote:
...If I put in a Long Micro type tabernacle into the bough transom of my Micro and keep the standard sail plan will I need to change the keel configuration and will it put the whole lot out of balance?
Hi Rod
I'm not Myles, but I can say that I retrofitted our [non Navigator] Micro with a mainmast tabernacle, keeping the fore and aft sail balance unaltered and it has worked well for us. The hollow wooden mast was retained. The tabernacle was not the one designed by PB&F for the Micro upgrade referred to elsewhere.
cheers
Derek
I had a copy of the upgrade sheet at one time - it is available for $50
USD from PCB&F.
If you are adding the tabernacle as in Long Micro, (Right in the bow.)
- the main changes I recall are to add about a 3" wide end-plate to the
bottom of the rudder blade, and enlarge the area of the mizzen a bit.
How much to enlarge it I can't say, since the upgrade had a broader
lower aspect fully-battened mizzen sail. So if I was going with the
original leg-o'-mutton mizzen I would guess using the same mast height
and a longer boomkin and sprit-boom, to give about 5 more sq.ft. of
area.
But the problem might be that the enlargment might lead to more slatting
when hove too into the wind and that is why battens were added? It
looked quite a bit like a tiny copy of the Chinese gaff main in the
Navigator version. Very complicated looking in my view.
Maybe someone else could add their expertise?
Nels
USD from PCB&F.
If you are adding the tabernacle as in Long Micro, (Right in the bow.)
- the main changes I recall are to add about a 3" wide end-plate to the
bottom of the rudder blade, and enlarge the area of the mizzen a bit.
How much to enlarge it I can't say, since the upgrade had a broader
lower aspect fully-battened mizzen sail. So if I was going with the
original leg-o'-mutton mizzen I would guess using the same mast height
and a longer boomkin and sprit-boom, to give about 5 more sq.ft. of
area.
But the problem might be that the enlargment might lead to more slatting
when hove too into the wind and that is why battens were added? It
looked quite a bit like a tiny copy of the Chinese gaff main in the
Navigator version. Very complicated looking in my view.
Maybe someone else could add their expertise?
Nels
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Rpd Cahill <rodcahill@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Miles, I've been told that you are a good Micro reference to go to.
If I put in a Long Micro type tabernacle into the bough transom of my
Micro and keep the standard sail plan will I need to change the keel
configuration and will it put the whole lot out of balance?
> Thanks,
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Myles J. Swift mswift@...
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, 19 February, 2010 4:28:50 AM
> Subject: [bolger] Re: Micro help wanted
>
>
>
>
> When you need inspiration go here, the Micro as high art.
>
>
http://www.gagosian.com/exhibitions/beverly-hills-1996-07-chris-burden/
>
>
http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-14/entertainment/ca-23938_1_ghost-sh\
ips
>
> MylesJ
>
Hi Miles, I've been told that you are a good Micro reference to go to. If I put in a Long Micro type tabernacle into the bough transom of my Micro and keep the standard sail plan will I need to change the keel configuration and will it put the whole lot out of balance?
Thanks,
Rod
From:Myles J. Swift <mswift@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Fri, 19 February, 2010 4:28:50 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: Micro help wanted
When you need inspiration go here, the Micro as high art.
http://www.gagosian.com/exhibitions/beverly-hills-1996-07-chris-burden/
http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-14/entertainment/ca-23938_1_ghost-ships
MylesJ
When you need inspiration go here, the Micro as high art.
http://www.gagosian.com/exhibitions/beverly-hills-1996-07-chris-burden/
http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-14/entertainment/ca-23938_1_ghost-ships
MylesJ
Rod,
Welcome aboard. Somewhere in one of the (seven?) Yahoo Bolger groups is a schematic drawing of a cut-away Micro. I couldn't find it via a quick Google images search, but it's somewhere lurking in Yahoo. It gives a good perspective of the interior. The main difference between the LM and Micro is that the two berths on Micro run under the bridge-deck. Sorry I cannot be more specific than that- the cut-away/schematic is worth hunting for.
As you approach the stage where you start to assemble the hull, consider making a simple ladder frame to construct on. The frame will make squaring the bulkheads easier, and later you can add small wheels to the frame and move your Micro around. Also, check the square (i.e., measure the diagonal distance) for each frame/side area, and for the overall hull. It's easy to twist the sides in relation to "square" as you tack the whole hull together, it's hard to detect such twist by eyeballing the boat, and you can permanently build in a twist if you aren't careful. Measuring the diagonal distance will prevent a twist.
If I can be of help, drop a line.
Bill, now in Texas
Long Micro Pugnacious
Welcome aboard. Somewhere in one of the (seven?) Yahoo Bolger groups is a schematic drawing of a cut-away Micro. I couldn't find it via a quick Google images search, but it's somewhere lurking in Yahoo. It gives a good perspective of the interior. The main difference between the LM and Micro is that the two berths on Micro run under the bridge-deck. Sorry I cannot be more specific than that- the cut-away/schematic is worth hunting for.
As you approach the stage where you start to assemble the hull, consider making a simple ladder frame to construct on. The frame will make squaring the bulkheads easier, and later you can add small wheels to the frame and move your Micro around. Also, check the square (i.e., measure the diagonal distance) for each frame/side area, and for the overall hull. It's easy to twist the sides in relation to "square" as you tack the whole hull together, it's hard to detect such twist by eyeballing the boat, and you can permanently build in a twist if you aren't careful. Measuring the diagonal distance will prevent a twist.
If I can be of help, drop a line.
Bill, now in Texas
Long Micro Pugnacious
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "rodcahill@..." <rodcahill@...> wrote:
>
> I have only just managed to work out how to drive this forum and loving it. I live in Canberra, Australia, and am in the process of making a Micro. Not having actually seen one in the flesh I was having a little difficulty with what seems to a novice like myself a lack of instructions. I have cut and framed all the bulkheads and sides and nearly ready to start putting things together. Would there be anybody in Sydney, Canberra, or nearby with a completed micro that I could inspect? Is there an easy way of searching for the "Micro only" photos without having to scroll through everything? I would really like some detailed photos of the interior. It's amazing how a few detailed photos can make a lot of instructions look really simple.
>
Hello Rod
Not sure of any Micros down your way although there was at least one on the far south coast until a while ago. There's at least one in Sydney owned by John Mann and he has his boat moored in Woodford Bay near his home on the Lane Cove River. My Micro is perched up at Pindimar on the northern shore of Port Stephens although I'm in Sydney most of the time (without the boat!) There used to be a Micro in Sydney off the sailing club at Balmain but the owner builder, Paul, sold that boat, and I think it went to Queensland.
But let me know off line perhaps if you'd like any photographs of any particular bits and I'll email you photographs if you'd like. I didn't build the boat, by the way, Miles Bore did, in Newcastle, and Miles has recently completed a Michalak Blobster and has posted sailing pics of "Bob" on Lake Macquarie a few weeks ago on Youtube, so have a look. Miles posts on the yahoo michalak
GregF
Not sure of any Micros down your way although there was at least one on the far south coast until a while ago. There's at least one in Sydney owned by John Mann and he has his boat moored in Woodford Bay near his home on the Lane Cove River. My Micro is perched up at Pindimar on the northern shore of Port Stephens although I'm in Sydney most of the time (without the boat!) There used to be a Micro in Sydney off the sailing club at Balmain but the owner builder, Paul, sold that boat, and I think it went to Queensland.
But let me know off line perhaps if you'd like any photographs of any particular bits and I'll email you photographs if you'd like. I didn't build the boat, by the way, Miles Bore did, in Newcastle, and Miles has recently completed a Michalak Blobster and has posted sailing pics of "Bob" on Lake Macquarie a few weeks ago on Youtube, so have a look. Miles posts on the yahoo michalak
GregF
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "rodcahill@..." <rodcahill@...> wrote:
>
> I have only just managed to work out how to drive this forum and loving it. I live in Canberra, Australia, and am in the process of making a Micro. Not having actually seen one in the flesh I was having a little difficulty with what seems to a novice like myself a lack of instructions. I have cut and framed all the bulkheads and sides and nearly ready to start putting things together. Would there be anybody in Sydney, Canberra, or nearby with a completed micro that I could inspect? Is there an easy way of searching for the "Micro only" photos without having to scroll through everything? I would really like some detailed photos of the interior. It's amazing how a few detailed photos can make a lot of instructions look really simple.
>
| Right now, the best I can think of is this video slideshow link. It is a LongMicro but should give you some ideas. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vXqmS-q9Mc Rick --- OnMon, 2/15/10, rodcahill@...<rodcahill@...>wrote: |
I have only just managed to work out how to drive this forum and loving it. I live in Canberra, Australia, and am in the process of making a Micro. Not having actually seen one in the flesh I was having a little difficulty with what seems to a novice like myself a lack of instructions. I have cut and framed all the bulkheads and sides and nearly ready to start putting things together. Would there be anybody in Sydney, Canberra, or nearby with a completed micro that I could inspect? Is there an easy way of searching for the "Micro only" photos without having to scroll through everything? I would really like some detailed photos of the interior. It's amazing how a few detailed photos can make a lot of instructions look really simple.