Presto-style isometric (was Re: Bolger on sharpies)
Another one from WB#77 July/August 1987, BOATBROKERS, p134:
"35' Bolger Gentleman's Presto Type - flush decked, gaff cat, $125k." (ad for Nantucket brokers)
"35' Bolger Gentleman's Presto Type - flush decked, gaff cat, $125k." (ad for Nantucket brokers)
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <hallman@...> wrote:
> The classic "sharpie"
> in PCB's mind was probably the Commodore Munroe designed boat Presto,
> and PCB did a re-design of Presto for one of the Small Boat Journal
> articles. Here is an isometric:
>
> Presto-style cruiser
>http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Presto-style/
>
> 27 feet long x 7 foot width. Inside ballast made of steel bars in
> concrete. Cat yawl. Carvel planked, or cold molded.
>
Presto is one of those boats that gets me wanting to retire sooner rather than later. A 25 to 30 foot sharpie is at the top of my dream list.
MylesJ
> Might be accomplished with thick wood strip at the chines in a ply boat. Haven't seen it done though.Google about Gary Lepak's 'Bufflehead'. Articles at duckwork, for example. No doubt that boat discussed here as elsewhere. A start:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/message/42064
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "Joe T" <scsbmsjoe@...> wrote:
>
> What distinguishes the Presto type from other sharpies before its time is the well rounded chine. This should reduce or eliminate the problem of chine eddying, as well as the generous length to beam ratio. Learned from guru PB, as well as my own experience with hard chine kayaks mostly.
> Might be accomplished with thick wood strip at the chines in a ply boat. Haven't seen it done though.
>
> Joe T
What distinguishes the Presto type from other sharpies before its time is the well rounded chine. This should reduce or eliminate the problem of chine eddying, as well as the generous length to beam ratio. Learned from guru PB, as well as my own experience with hard chine kayaks mostly.
Might be accomplished with thick wood strip at the chines in a ply boat. Haven't seen it done though.
Joe T
Might be accomplished with thick wood strip at the chines in a ply boat. Haven't seen it done though.
Joe T
--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <hallman@...> wrote:
>
> It is worth mentioning that when PCB speaks of "sharpies" he is not
> thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats. Micro and Old Shoe
> have sharp chines, but they are not sharpied. He is thinking of
> "sharpie" meaning a high length to beam ratio. The classic "sharpie"
> in PCB's mind was probably the Commodore Munroe designed boat Presto,
> and PCB did a re-design of Presto for one of the Small Boat Journal
> articles. Here is an isometric:
>
> Presto-style cruiser
>http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Presto-style/
>
> 27 feet long x 7 foot width. Inside ballast made of steel bars in
> concrete. Cat yawl. Carvel planked, or cold molded.
>
Absolutely. I was trying to make the point that
there seems to be more to the mix in order to be called "sharpie"
in the classical terminology. I have not seen a definition in a
while, but single chine, flat bottom (traditionally planks
straight from chine to chine), and rockerfigure
prominently. A Chesapeake Bay crabber (40' L x 8-10' W V-8 power)
would not qualify because it has a keel and deadrise.
Somewhere in one of his books, I am thinking it's in one of the chapters of "The Folding Schooner" he discusses both what a sharpie is and the concept that it woks best when heeled, thus side and bottom cleave the water with their chine.
I hope I'm not flogging a dead horse here, I am merely trying to support and amplify the differentiation between sharpie as a type and "sharp chined".
V/R
Chris
Somewhere in one of his books, I am thinking it's in one of the chapters of "The Folding Schooner" he discusses both what a sharpie is and the concept that it woks best when heeled, thus side and bottom cleave the water with their chine.
I hope I'm not flogging a dead horse here, I am merely trying to support and amplify the differentiation between sharpie as a type and "sharp chined".
V/R
Chris
On 1/4/2011 3:49 PM, Bruce Hallman wrote:"sharp bowed" applied directly to the designation "sharpie"....length:beam ratio of 6:1Agreed. Long narrow boats, by their very nature, have sharp bows. That is, unless you chop the bow off, as with a bow transom. <grin>
> "sharp bowed" applied directly to the designation "sharpie"....
> length:beam ratio of 6:1Agreed.
Long narrow boats, by their very nature, have sharp bows.
That is, unless you chop the bow off, as with a bow transom. <grin>
PCB's comments in Presto Cruiser chapter carry
the description "sharpbowed" applied directly to the
designation "sharpie". It is implicit that from that discussion
that the term applies to narrow, flat bottomed boats without a lot
of curvature at the stem. I do not know if he stated his
definition, but I feel like I have seen it somewhere. John Gardner
uses it this way, with the added comment that a narrow flat-iron
skiff with rocker is a sharpie. I do recall PCB discussing
length:beamn ratio of 6:1 for larger boats. It is worth noting,
also, that the Advanced Sharpie concept includes the feature that
the shape is an otherwise normally proportioned sharpie with the bow
and stern overhangs truncated.
V/R
Chris
V/R
Chris
On 1/4/2011 12:53 PM, Peter wrote:It is worth mentioning that when PCB speaks of "sharpies" he is not thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats.I would say his world view was plenty wide to include both types. He designed both types, plus plenty of similar boats. However, his remarks on a high bow inducing flow from the bottom to the sides apply to chine boats, including boat sharpies and other flat-bottom skiffs. I think you are right that he didn't consider Micro and Long Micro to be sharpies. They are a little too beamy, plus the keel. Black Skimmer, Skillygallee, and Black Gauntlet are certainly sharpies. ------------------------------------ Bolger rules!!! - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please! - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349 - Unsubscribe:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com- Open discussion:bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.comYahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/<*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/join(Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email:bolger-digest@yahoogroups.combolger-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 9:53 AM, Peter <pvanderwaart@...> wrote:
flatness of a flat-bottom skiff. Different as night and day.
>Certainly. And compare the deep belly of the Micro to the bottom
>
>
> > It is worth mentioning that when PCB speaks of "sharpies" he is not
> > thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats.
>
> I would say his world view was plenty wide to include both types. He designed both types, plus plenty of similar boats. However, his remarks on a high bow inducing flow from the bottom to the sides apply to chine boats, including boat sharpies and other flat-bottom skiffs.
flatness of a flat-bottom skiff. Different as night and day.
> It is worth mentioning that when PCB speaks of "sharpies" he is notI would say his world view was plenty wide to include both types. He designed both types, plus plenty of similar boats. However, his remarks on a high bow inducing flow from the bottom to the sides apply to chine boats, including boat sharpies and other flat-bottom skiffs.
> thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats.
I think you are right that he didn't consider Micro and Long Micro to be sharpies. They are a little too beamy, plus the keel. Black Skimmer, Skillygallee, and Black Gauntlet are certainly sharpies.
It is worth mentioning that when PCB speaks of "sharpies" he is not
thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats. Micro and Old Shoe
have sharp chines, but they are not sharpied. He is thinking of
"sharpie" meaning a high length to beam ratio. The classic "sharpie"
in PCB's mind was probably the Commodore Munroe designed boat Presto,
and PCB did a re-design of Presto for one of the Small Boat Journal
articles. Here is an isometric:
Presto-style cruiser
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Presto-style/
27 feet long x 7 foot width. Inside ballast made of steel bars in
concrete. Cat yawl. Carvel planked, or cold molded.
thinking "sharp chine" like with his box boats. Micro and Old Shoe
have sharp chines, but they are not sharpied. He is thinking of
"sharpie" meaning a high length to beam ratio. The classic "sharpie"
in PCB's mind was probably the Commodore Munroe designed boat Presto,
and PCB did a re-design of Presto for one of the Small Boat Journal
articles. Here is an isometric:
Presto-style cruiser
http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Presto-style/
27 feet long x 7 foot width. Inside ballast made of steel bars in
concrete. Cat yawl. Carvel planked, or cold molded.