Re: A Bolger launch?

Not a Bolger design, but John Welsford has a sharpie launch design:

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/piwakawaka/index.htm

and Selway-Fisher offers a couple of plywood designs, Rose and Fanny:

http://www.selway-fisher.com/Steamup20.htm

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
>
Not a launch, but plans include design for solar array and motor/batteries in keel.

http://www.storerboatplans.com/Solarboat/solarboat.html

David

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Greg Kay <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> What I was thinking about personally was something on the general order of
> above-water appearance as the fantail launch posted earlier
> (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092)but of a lighter
> build on an easily-driven lower hull, preferably flat bottom. I'm thinking the
> battery bank should go along the centerline (or possibly even inside a shallow
> box keel?) with the low weight adding maximum stability (allowing for people
> moving around) with minimum draft. It might be possible to extend the cruising
> range by making the shading canopy top dual-purpose; cover the top with solar
> cells to boost the battery charge. Granted, it wouldn't keep up with the
> discharge, but it would slow the rate down a bit while adding minimal weight.
> Just some thoughts...
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...>
> To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 10:33:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?
>
>
> Electric drives are great for small and maybe even big boats and even more
> so in the near future. If you can get or have a golfcart motor I would use
> it. I am not as sure that I would buy a motor and batteries unless just a
> trolling motor and a couple batteries where there is not a lot of money
> involved. It is my understanding that the new batteries will be much higher
> voltage and so will the motors they run. I am not sure that what I am
> saying here is true but maybe just something to think about? I think
> electric is going to very practical for sailboat auxiliaries in the not to
> distant future as long as you spend most nights in a marina where you can
> charge batteries or use the motor very little. If you are going off
> cruising they probably won't work unless you want to listen to a generator
> run all night.
> The future is almost here. Doug
You may want to take a close look at the motor first. A lot of them do not have an output shaft that you can mount a pulley or gear on. Some rely on the trans for even the end plate.
Atached is a pic of a commond motor from one. You could still use it, but you would need part of the trans for the end plate and output shaft and maybe another bearing to support the shaft.
 
Michael Allison
 
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent:Thursday, March 03, 2011 12:31 PM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I'm with you on this Doug. I think I'd definitely rig one of the golf cart motors up for a sail boat auxiliary, at least where a 5-10 hp motor would work. An electric motor is generally rated at continuous output, a mechanical gasoline engine is typically rated at max output -- though I'm not positive about outboards. Typical golf cart motors are rated at 5-8 hp, but that should be continuous running as long as they are adequately cooled. They usually run at 48V (8x6V batteries). 12V deep cycle batteries won't last as long as 6V golf cart batts, but that's when they are drained and charged often. If more than just docking or getting out of the marina (more than 30 minutes) is needed then crank the generator and keep the batts up. Most sail boats have a small generator anyway. Not much difference between the generator running or an outboard as far as noise, though the gen can be placed in an area where the noise is muffled. Solar cells could help with the batteries, especially a trickle charge to keep them up while docked. Don't think I'd try for much more than that. The battery/gen system could double for lighting and such too.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...> wrote:
>
> I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat
> auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most
> nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very
> little. If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless
> you want to listen to a generator run all night.
> The future is almost here. Doug
>

Modify a Sneakeasy hull. Use the box keel but curve the sides of the bow less and make the box deep and wide enough for the batteries placed sideways. Place the motor in the rear section of the box and stick the prop almost straight out the back of the box, sort of tunnel hull. Maybe make a tunnel in the rear of the box. Move the cockpit forward 2-3 feet, and maybe make it 12-18" wider at the widest point back. Would make a nice low speed launch that way.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Greg Kay <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> What I was thinking about personally was something on the general order of
> above-water appearance as the fantail launch posted earlier
> (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092)but of a lighter
> build on an easily-driven lower hull, preferably flat bottom. I'm thinking the
> battery bank should go along the centerline (or possibly even inside a shallow
> box keel?) with the low weight adding maximum stability (allowing for people
> moving around) with minimum draft. It might be possible to extend the cruising
> range by making the shading canopy top dual-purpose; cover the top with solar
> cells to boost the battery charge. Granted, it wouldn't keep up with the
> discharge, but it would slow the rate down a bit while adding minimal weight.
> Just some thoughts...
>

You might want to look up the details on the conversion of the Crater Lake tour boats to electric. It details the research and the numbers on changing over to zero pollution for the launch that takes you out to the Wizard and around the lake. I just took a quick look and did not spot it. It is/was the regular government style of documentation with types of motors, types of batteries, ranges, costs, etc that were researched before doing the conversion.

 

MylesJ

I'm with you on this Doug. I think I'd definitely rig one of the golf cart motors up for a sail boat auxiliary, at least where a 5-10 hp motor would work. An electric motor is generally rated at continuous output, a mechanical gasoline engine is typically rated at max output -- though I'm not positive about outboards. Typical golf cart motors are rated at 5-8 hp, but that should be continuous running as long as they are adequately cooled. They usually run at 48V (8x6V batteries). 12V deep cycle batteries won't last as long as 6V golf cart batts, but that's when they are drained and charged often. If more than just docking or getting out of the marina (more than 30 minutes) is needed then crank the generator and keep the batts up. Most sail boats have a small generator anyway. Not much difference between the generator running or an outboard as far as noise, though the gen can be placed in an area where the noise is muffled. Solar cells could help with the batteries, especially a trickle charge to keep them up while docked. Don't think I'd try for much more than that. The battery/gen system could double for lighting and such too.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...> wrote:
>
> I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat
> auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most
> nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very
> little. If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless
> you want to listen to a generator run all night.
> The future is almost here. Doug
>
I like the short Tn. for what it is. I think a flat bottom makes sense.

IMO using a golf cart as a donor for the drive train is a very good way to go. You need to learn the working RPM of the motor, and plan for a reducer to match your selected propeller. I'd favor motorcycle type chain, or toothed belt and avoid V-belts because of the excessive side loads. You might also find an industrial gear box surplussed out for cheap.

Regarding the hull, in the Bolger choices, I think Bonefish, which could be based on Hawkeye's construction plans would be an excellent hull for the purpose. You only need to "double end" the box keel, also round and kick up the stern for the fan tail effect. Very light (an 18' Hawkeye weighs less than a 14' MicroTrawler) it would easily trailer. The design is very easily driven, and extremely stable for a picnic/evening cruise crowd. The batteries, and the motor will reside cleanly in the box keel and it even allows for a porta-potty in the console. I'd favor a couple of bimini's over the hard dodger.

Don
I put up 5 new pictures of JRTA Guam that may interest you. It is what you might consider a 'sharpie-like equivelant in function to the luxurious launches'. The hull form is Tennessee proportionately shortened to 24', beam remains 6'. We have used it 2 summers now. The boat is perfect for comfort.

Over the winter of '09-10 I changed to roof hoping to make an easy up-down mechanism for trailering, but i could not come up with anything that I liked. My wife likes the boat so much, she has forbidden me from taking it from our home lake so trailering the boat is no longer an issue. She has allowed me to make another slightly smaller launch that i may take when I want to go someplace. (will launch with ice-out)

As you can see, there is plenty of room to relax, the 8hp Yamaha High-thrust is virtually silent being so far back. the hull draws 6" fully loaded with 6 adults and cooler of beverages. We have been asked to lead the July 4th boat parade the last 2 years, a great honor.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
>
That type of construction was exactly what I was thinking of.


From:Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 1:25:02 PM
Subject:Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

Here is a possibility, though it is not a Bolger Launch. I have an Elver sailboat double ended flat bottom and a finely shaped hull above the water.  I talked to a few about a years ago to a fellow who bought one, tore the cabin off of it and put seats down both sides for guests to set in. The seats set facing inward so gest would be facing each other for conversation. The seats also were hull supports to replace the strength that had been given by the cabin.  He had planned an electric motor as well.  The idea was to have a family launch that they could take a couple neighbors and themselves for a Sunday afternoon cruise.
    Go take a look at the boats on the Elver sight by Steve Redmond. Might be able to pick one up for $1000 or so and modify it.  I can envision she would make a handson little cruiser with only about 3" of draft at the bow and a foot at the stern.  Nice for running up on the beach.                                                                                       Doug
                                                                                           

On 03/02/2011 11:03 AM, Greg Kay wrote:

 
What I was thinking about personally was something on the general order of above-water appearance as the fantail launch posted earlier (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092) but of a lighter build on an easily-driven lower hull, preferably flat bottom. I'm thinking the battery bank should go along the centerline (or possibly even inside a shallow box keel?) with the low weight adding maximum stability (allowing for people moving around) with minimum draft. It might be possible to extend the cruising range by making the shading canopy top dual-purpose; cover the top with solar cells to boost the battery charge. Granted, it wouldn't keep up with the discharge, but it would slow the rate down a bit while adding minimal weight.Just some thoughts...


From:Douglas Pollard<dougpol1@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 10:33:32 AM
Subject:Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

Electric drives are great for small and maybe even big boats and even more so in the near future.  If you can get or have a golfcart motor I would use it. I am not as sure that I would buy a motor and batteries unless just a trolling motor and a couple batteries where there is not a lot of money involved.  It is my understanding that the new batteries will be much higher voltage and so will the motors they run.  I am not sure that what I am saying here is true but maybe just something to think about? I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very little.  If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless you want to listen to a generator run all night.
   The future is almost here.             Doug

On 03/02/2011 09:52 AM, Greg Kay wrote:

 
I saw a diagram of one once, hooked up to a shaft with a drive belt. I think Glen-L or Clarkcraft has something about that.


From:f_swygert<farna@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 9:41:22 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell"<sirdarnell@...>wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>






Here is a possibility, though it is not a Bolger Launch. I have an Elver sailboat double ended flat bottom and a finely shaped hull above the water.  I talked to a few about a years ago to a fellow who bought one, tore the cabin off of it and put seats down both sides for guests to set in. The seats set facing inward so gest would be facing each other for conversation. The seats also were hull supports to replace the strength that had been given by the cabin.  He had planned an electric motor as well.  The idea was to have a family launch that they could take a couple neighbors and themselves for a Sunday afternoon cruise.
    Go take a look at the boats on the Elver sight by Steve Redmond. Might be able to pick one up for $1000 or so and modify it.  I can envision she would make a handson little cruiser with only about 3" of draft at the bow and a foot at the stern.  Nice for running up on the beach.                                                                                       Doug
                                                                                           

On 03/02/2011 11:03 AM, Greg Kay wrote:
 
What I was thinking about personally was something on the general order of above-water appearance as the fantail launch posted earlier (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092) but of a lighter build on an easily-driven lower hull, preferably flat bottom. I'm thinking the battery bank should go along the centerline (or possibly even inside a shallow box keel?) with the low weight adding maximum stability (allowing for people moving around) with minimum draft. It might be possible to extend the cruising range by making the shading canopy top dual-purpose; cover the top with solar cells to boost the battery charge. Granted, it wouldn't keep up with the discharge, but it would slow the rate down a bit while adding minimal weight.Just some thoughts...


From:Douglas Pollard<dougpol1@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 10:33:32 AM
Subject:Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

Electric drives are great for small and maybe even big boats and even more so in the near future.  If you can get or have a golfcart motor I would use it. I am not as sure that I would buy a motor and batteries unless just a trolling motor and a couple batteries where there is not a lot of money involved.  It is my understanding that the new batteries will be much higher voltage and so will the motors they run.  I am not sure that what I am saying here is true but maybe just something to think about? I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very little.  If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless you want to listen to a generator run all night.
   The future is almost here.             Doug

On 03/02/2011 09:52 AM, Greg Kay wrote:

 
I saw a diagram of one once, hooked up to a shaft with a drive belt. I think Glen-L or Clarkcraft has something about that.


From:f_swygert<farna@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 9:41:22 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell"<sirdarnell@...>wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>





What I was thinking about personally was something on the general order of above-water appearance as the fantail launch posted earlier (http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092) but of a lighter build on an easily-driven lower hull, preferably flat bottom. I'm thinking the battery bank should go along the centerline (or possibly even inside a shallow box keel?) with the low weight adding maximum stability (allowing for people moving around) with minimum draft. It might be possible to extend the cruising range by making the shading canopy top dual-purpose; cover the top with solar cells to boost the battery charge. Granted, it wouldn't keep up with the discharge, but it would slow the rate down a bit while adding minimal weight.Just some thoughts...


From:Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 10:33:32 AM
Subject:Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

Electric drives are great for small and maybe even big boats and even more so in the near future.  If you can get or have a golfcart motor I would use it. I am not as sure that I would buy a motor and batteries unless just a trolling motor and a couple batteries where there is not a lot of money involved.  It is my understanding that the new batteries will be much higher voltage and so will the motors they run.  I am not sure that what I am saying here is true but maybe just something to think about? I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very little.  If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless you want to listen to a generator run all night.
   The future is almost here.             Doug

On 03/02/2011 09:52 AM, Greg Kay wrote:

 
I saw a diagram of one once, hooked up to a shaft with a drive belt. I think Glen-L or Clarkcraft has something about that.


From:f_swygert<farna@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 9:41:22 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell"<sirdarnell@...>wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>




Electric drives are great for small and maybe even big boats and even more so in the near future.  If you can get or have a golfcart motor I would use it. I am not as sure that I would buy a motor and batteries unless just a trolling motor and a couple batteries where there is not a lot of money involved.  It is my understanding that the new batteries will be much higher voltage and so will the motors they run.  I am not sure that what I am saying here is true but maybe just something to think about? I think electric is going to very practical for sailboat auxiliaries in the not to distant future as long as you spend most nights in a marina where you can charge batteries or use the motor very little.  If you are going off cruising they probably won't work unless you want to listen to a generator run all night.
   The future is almost here.             Doug

On 03/02/2011 09:52 AM, Greg Kay wrote:
 
I saw a diagram of one once, hooked up to a shaft with a drive belt. I think Glen-L or Clarkcraft has something about that.


From:f_swygert<farna@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 9:41:22 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell"<sirdarnell@...>wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>



I saw a diagram of one once, hooked up to a shaft with a drive belt. I think Glen-L or Clarkcraft has something about that.


From:f_swygert <farna@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Wed, March 2, 2011 9:41:22 AM
Subject:[bolger] Re: A Bolger launch?

 

I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell" <sirdarnell@...> wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>


I've got a couple old golf carts that were given to me. I'm wondering if one of those motors would make a good slow cruiser....

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "sirdarnell" <sirdarnell@...> wrote:
>
> Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:
>
>http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092
>
> David
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>
Yes. Plans $75 from the Woodenboat Store:

http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=400-092

David

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
>
Thank you all for the information; I'll check into it.

Lovely. I think Bolger would have been proud.

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "KK7B" <kk7b@...> wrote:
>
> This is not a Bolger design, but here's an elegant modern example of the type, completed this year at Grapeview Point Boatworks. Scroll down for a nice sequence of construction photographs.
>
>http://www.grapeviewpointboatworks.com/zimmer.html
>
> Rick
>
> --- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@> wrote:
> >
> > Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
> >
>
This is not a Bolger design, but here's an elegant modern example of the type, completed this year at Grapeview Point Boatworks. Scroll down for a nice sequence of construction photographs.

http://www.grapeviewpointboatworks.com/zimmer.html

Rick

--- Inbolger@yahoogroups.com, "gregmkay" <gregmkay@...> wrote:
>
> Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?
>
> Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends?

I believe he did, but it's not in any of his books. Possibly somewhere in the MAIB archives.

He did publish a 15' Electric Launch in "Different Boats", and a 44'Lake Launch in "30-Odd Boats", either of which might interest you. I think he would want you to consider Alice which is in BWAOM. It's not the elegant open launch that you're looking for, but it's a boat for a similar purpose.
Did Bolger ever design his own version of some sharpie-like equivalent in function to the luxurious late 19th-early 20th Century electric launches (The ones that were often fan tailed) for leisurely and cruising protected waters with small groups of friends? If he did, do you know where I might find information on it?