Re: [bolger] Re: slotted screws verses Philips head.

I first came across the Robertson-head woodscrews when working in Canada some 40 years ago. They have been available here in New Zealand for at least 25 years - I would simply never use any other type, given the choice. They are brilliant. Must be some kind of fancy marketing of Phillips head or slotted screws that has limited the availability of Robertsons in the U.S.
Andrew.
New Zealand.

From:David Baughman <shascho@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Tuesday, 23 October 2012 8:25 AM
Subject:Re: [bolger] Re: slotted screws verses Philips head.

 
I agree with the Robertson enthusiasm.
When I married a lovely Canadian girl 37 years ago
I was delighted and amazed to discover
these simple, useful screws.
Even the tiniest brass screws can be installed with confidence,
and the screw clings to the driver,
simplifying work in one-hand-only areas.
And they are manufactured in standardised sizes
and colour-coded (yellow green and red cover sizes 3 to 10),
making it easy to match screws with appropriate drivers.
I assumed these screws would take over the market
in all of North America,
but the USA seems reluctant to adopt them.
They can be ordered through most any Canadian woodworking outlet.
If you haven't tried them you're in for a treat.
Just be sure to order the drivers or bits as well
or you'll have great screws and no way to use them!

--
"We can easily forgive a child
who is afraid of the dark;
the real tragedy of life
is when men are afraid of the light."
-- Plato


I agree with the Robertson enthusiasm.
When I married a lovely Canadian girl 37 years ago
I was delighted and amazed to discover
these simple, useful screws.
Even the tiniest brass screws can be installed with confidence,
and the screw clings to the driver,
simplifying work in one-hand-only areas.
And they are manufactured in standardised sizes
and colour-coded (yellow green and red cover sizes 3 to 10),
making it easy to match screws with appropriate drivers.
I assumed these screws would take over the market
in all of North America,
but the USA seems reluctant to adopt them.
They can be ordered through most any Canadian woodworking outlet.
If you haven't tried them you're in for a treat.
Just be sure to order the drivers or bits as well
or you'll have great screws and no way to use them!

--
"We can easily forgive a child
who is afraid of the dark;
the real tragedy of life
is when men are afraid of the light."
-- Plato
Robertson is the way to go in my opinion. just match the driver with the screw Paul Happy Adventure
Best overall screws are Robertson head or square. Driver will not slip out of slot an damage wood.

Agreed, I've been using hollow ground screwdrivers for years working on firearms and don't understand why they aren't used everywhere.
 
Jeff


From:John Trussell <jtrussell2@...>
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Sent:Monday, October 22, 2012 11:23 AM
Subject:RE: [bolger] slotted screws verses Philips head.
 
Amen on the hollow ground screw drivers. I’ve had good luck with a Yankee screw driver and a hollow ground blade. New ones are available, but mine came from yard sales. I find a brace and bit screw driver is particular useful when removing screws as you can keep pressure on the head and control torque very precisely.
 
JohnT
 
From:bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto: bolger@yahoogroups.com ]On Behalf OfDouglas Pollard
Sent:Monday, October 22, 2012 12:12 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject:[bolger] slotted screws verses Philips head.
 
 
Here is a post I made on the South Bend lathe group, where one one the
guys was complaining about slotted screws not being any good.
There is an amazing secret about slotted screws. They used to
work fine up until WW2 when the military needed millions of cheap
screwdrivers. Flats on screw drivers for many years were hollow ground
rather than the flats just being tapered. The hollow ground screwdriver
tended to pull itself into the slot while the straight tapered ones
wanting to climb up out of the slot because of the tapered sides. I
made some screw drivers about 20 years ago and the difference is like
night and day. They are all gone now so I guess I need to make some
more. Slotted screws are far better than Phillips head screws If the
screw driver is right. You don't even have to push down on the screw
driver and you never ruin a slot unless you put a wrench on the screw
driver and literally break the screw head. Sometimes it amazes me what
a price we pay in usability for cheaper tools.
When I started to work in the Machine shop my older brother
bought me a set of Grace drivers as a way of encouragement. They got
away from me over the years. I will order a set today. I build a
wooden sailboat now and then and I have a brace and bit for driving
screws. The bit is hollow ground. The screw driver bit is all that is
left of a set of ships carpenter tools my first wife's grandfather gave
me on his death. A guy stole my car in the early 1960's and the toolbox
was in the trunk. The brace and bit was in a bag under the seat so he
missed that. The brace was made from lignum vitae on a steel frame. I
recently gave it to my son to hang on the wall. He said the hell with
that he is going to build a boat.:-)
I just found out that you can buy Gun smithing screw drivers on
line. The make is Grace and the are hardened and hollow ground. I
googled and found it. Doug

I had heard an 'urban legend" that Henry Ford invented/adopted the Phillips screw specifically because the screw could not be over-tightened by his un-trained assembly-line workers... not quite true, but close, according this post:  http://www.marfas.com/phillips.shtml

 

Only the history's wrong: according that article, the concept that only a specific amount of torque, not more, can be transmitted thru that crossed-tip tool, apparently IS correct -- so NO WONDER we curse the type when trying to back-out such screws that have been installed long-enough to get "stuck"...

 

Regards,

Wayne Gilham

who loves, and seeks out, the Robertson square-drive screws -- we see a lot of 'em in Canadian boats up here in the Pacific NW.  Have yet to see a damaged Robertson square-drive "hole" in any screw, even bronze ones...

 

From:bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf OfDouglas Pollard
Sent:Monday, October 22, 2012 9:12 AM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject:[bolger] slotted screws verses Philips head.

 

 

Here is a post I made on the South Bend lathe group, where one one the
guys was complaining about slotted screws not being any good.
There is an amazing secret about slotted screws. They used to
work fine up until WW2 when the military needed millions of cheap
screwdrivers. Flats on screw drivers for many years were hollow ground
rather than the flats just being tapered. The hollow ground screwdriver
tended to pull itself into the slot while the straight tapered ones
wanting to climb up out of the slot because of the tapered sides. I
made some screw drivers about 20 years ago and the difference is like
night and day. They are all gone now so I guess I need to make some
more. Slotted screws are far better than Phillips head screws If the
screw driver is right. You don't even have to push down on the screw
driver and you never ruin a slot unless you put a wrench on the screw
driver and literally break the screw head. Sometimes it amazes me what
a price we pay in usability for cheaper tools.
When I started to work in the Machine shop my older brother
bought me a set of Grace drivers as a way of encouragement. They got
away from me over the years. I will order a set today. I build a
wooden sailboat now and then and I have a brace and bit for driving
screws. The bit is hollow ground. The screw driver bit is all that is
left of a set of ships carpenter tools my first wife's grandfather gave
me on his death. A guy stole my car in the early 1960's and the toolbox
was in the trunk. The brace and bit was in a bag under the seat so he
missed that. The brace was made from lignum vitae on a steel frame. I
recently gave it to my son to hang on the wall. He said the hell with
that he is going to build a boat.:-)
I just found out that you can buy Gun smithing screw drivers on
line. The make is Grace and the are hardened and hollow ground. I
googled and found it. Doug

Amen on the hollow ground screw drivers. I’ve had good luck with a Yankee screw driver and a hollow ground blade. New ones are available, but mine came from yard sales. I find a brace and bit screw driver is particular useful when removing screws as you can keep pressure on the head and control torque very precisely.

 

JohnT

 

From:bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto: bolger@yahoogroups.com ]On Behalf OfDouglas Pollard
Sent:Monday, October 22, 2012 12:12 PM
To:bolger@yahoogroups.com
Subject:[bolger] slotted screws verses Philips head.

 

 

Here is a post I made on the South Bend lathe group, where one one the
guys was complaining about slotted screws not being any good.
There is an amazing secret about slotted screws. They used to
work fine up until WW2 when the military needed millions of cheap
screwdrivers. Flats on screw drivers for many years were hollow ground
rather than the flats just being tapered. The hollow ground screwdriver
tended to pull itself into the slot while the straight tapered ones
wanting to climb up out of the slot because of the tapered sides. I
made some screw drivers about 20 years ago and the difference is like
night and day. They are all gone now so I guess I need to make some
more. Slotted screws are far better than Phillips head screws If the
screw driver is right. You don't even have to push down on the screw
driver and you never ruin a slot unless you put a wrench on the screw
driver and literally break the screw head. Sometimes it amazes me what
a price we pay in usability for cheaper tools.
When I started to work in the Machine shop my older brother
bought me a set of Grace drivers as a way of encouragement. They got
away from me over the years. I will order a set today. I build a
wooden sailboat now and then and I have a brace and bit for driving
screws. The bit is hollow ground. The screw driver bit is all that is
left of a set of ships carpenter tools my first wife's grandfather gave
me on his death. A guy stole my car in the early 1960's and the toolbox
was in the trunk. The brace and bit was in a bag under the seat so he
missed that. The brace was made from lignum vitae on a steel frame. I
recently gave it to my son to hang on the wall. He said the hell with
that he is going to build a boat.:-)
I just found out that you can buy Gun smithing screw drivers on
line. The make is Grace and the are hardened and hollow ground. I
googled and found it. Doug

Here is a post I made on the South Bend lathe group, where one one the
guys was complaining about slotted screws not being any good.
There is an amazing secret about slotted screws. They used to
work fine up until WW2 when the military needed millions of cheap
screwdrivers. Flats on screw drivers for many years were hollow ground
rather than the flats just being tapered. The hollow ground screwdriver
tended to pull itself into the slot while the straight tapered ones
wanting to climb up out of the slot because of the tapered sides. I
made some screw drivers about 20 years ago and the difference is like
night and day. They are all gone now so I guess I need to make some
more. Slotted screws are far better than Phillips head screws If the
screw driver is right. You don't even have to push down on the screw
driver and you never ruin a slot unless you put a wrench on the screw
driver and literally break the screw head. Sometimes it amazes me what
a price we pay in usability for cheaper tools.
When I started to work in the Machine shop my older brother
bought me a set of Grace drivers as a way of encouragement. They got
away from me over the years. I will order a set today. I build a
wooden sailboat now and then and I have a brace and bit for driving
screws. The bit is hollow ground. The screw driver bit is all that is
left of a set of ships carpenter tools my first wife's grandfather gave
me on his death. A guy stole my car in the early 1960's and the toolbox
was in the trunk. The brace and bit was in a bag under the seat so he
missed that. The brace was made from lignum vitae on a steel frame. I
recently gave it to my son to hang on the wall. He said the hell with
that he is going to build a boat.:-)
I just found out that you can buy Gun smithing screw drivers on
line. The make is Grace and the are hardened and hollow ground. I
googled and found it. Doug