Re:Walker (was Bede)
I remember seeing an article about Prince Charles driving a Walker
wingsail. They even let him dock it. Apparently, it had a highly
computerized control system. Very expensive, I should think.
Peter
wingsail. They even let him dock it. Apparently, it had a highly
computerized control system. Very expensive, I should think.
Peter
Jeff,
I think I fairly described the Walker Wingsail program from memory - after
saying "priced at megabucks" I realized that it was more like "half a
megabuck" ten years ago - BUT if he had not received the subsidy, the price
would have been significantly more, especially if amortized over three
units. As you describe, it was a hybrid experience - slow as sailing,
complicated as a multihull, dull as a powerboat... My point was that Walker
and DeLorean would not have gained so much attention on their own, without
subsidies to publicize and inflate their efforts. FWIW, I think the
Wingsail was much more innovative than DeLorean's car, which was a pretty
ordinary collection of vendor assemblies with a stainless steel roof and a
nostalgic touch of the gullwing doors lifted from the Mercedes Benz 300 (now
THERE was a car!).
So there, the boatdesigner wins 'cause I said so.
Don Hodges
I think I fairly described the Walker Wingsail program from memory - after
saying "priced at megabucks" I realized that it was more like "half a
megabuck" ten years ago - BUT if he had not received the subsidy, the price
would have been significantly more, especially if amortized over three
units. As you describe, it was a hybrid experience - slow as sailing,
complicated as a multihull, dull as a powerboat... My point was that Walker
and DeLorean would not have gained so much attention on their own, without
subsidies to publicize and inflate their efforts. FWIW, I think the
Wingsail was much more innovative than DeLorean's car, which was a pretty
ordinary collection of vendor assemblies with a stainless steel roof and a
nostalgic touch of the gullwing doors lifted from the Mercedes Benz 300 (now
THERE was a car!).
So there, the boatdesigner wins 'cause I said so.
Don Hodges
Don,
you are dead right.
The major point is (and what I didnt realise), that price of 280,000
quid must have been subsidised by public money to get the "prod line"
rolling,
and the true price of the three or so produced, when all was added up
, must have been very very high indeed.
It makes a lot more sense for them to cost three times the 280k I stupidly
thought covered all costs, but, I guess that thats what the money is there
for, eh?
This experiment worked in principle, maybe the boat was just too upmarket.
Maybe a 10m instead of 13 would have been viable.
Jeff
you are dead right.
The major point is (and what I didnt realise), that price of 280,000
quid must have been subsidised by public money to get the "prod line"
rolling,
and the true price of the three or so produced, when all was added up
, must have been very very high indeed.
It makes a lot more sense for them to cost three times the 280k I stupidly
thought covered all costs, but, I guess that thats what the money is there
for, eh?
This experiment worked in principle, maybe the boat was just too upmarket.
Maybe a 10m instead of 13 would have been viable.
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: Donald Hodges <dhodges@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2000 2:02 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re:Walker (was Bede)
Jeff,
I think I fairly described the Walker Wingsail program from memory - after
saying "priced at megabucks" I realized that it was more like "half a
megabuck" ten years ago - BUT if he had not received the subsidy, the price
would have been significantly more, especially if amortized over three
units. As you describe, it was a hybrid experience - slow as sailing,
complicated as a multihull, dull as a powerboat... My point was that Walker
and DeLorean would not have gained so much attention on their own, without
subsidies to publicize and inflate their efforts. FWIW, I think the
Wingsail was much more innovative than DeLorean's car, which was a pretty
ordinary collection of vendor assemblies with a stainless steel roof and a
nostalgic touch of the gullwing doors lifted from the Mercedes Benz 300 (now
THERE was a car!).
So there, the boatdesigner wins 'cause I said so.
Don Hodges
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing
- stay on topic
- use punctuation
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
- add some content: send "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
Don.
it did average 10knots England to NY which is terrific in
anyones language.
I dunno if youd describe it as sailing. Apparently you just sat behind
the wheel and pointed it.
If you pointed it into irons it stopped and drifted back till you worked it
out
or started the motor.
The design was based on half an aircraft, with rear wing sans tailplane.
He went officially bust about 2 yrs ago I think.
At 280k quid it was dear but not insanely so cf other unusual 43ft UK
cruisers.
The new 13ton Laurent Giles revamped Classic 43foot cruiser featuring
electric Auxiliary motor
is to be 380k. The 45ft Charlie Walsh Barge designed by Wolstenholme is
280k. All 3 offer
exceptional comfort and convenience.
I think the demise of his factory is a loss to the watercraft scene in
general.
Jeff Gilbert
it did average 10knots England to NY which is terrific in
anyones language.
I dunno if youd describe it as sailing. Apparently you just sat behind
the wheel and pointed it.
If you pointed it into irons it stopped and drifted back till you worked it
out
or started the motor.
The design was based on half an aircraft, with rear wing sans tailplane.
He went officially bust about 2 yrs ago I think.
At 280k quid it was dear but not insanely so cf other unusual 43ft UK
cruisers.
The new 13ton Laurent Giles revamped Classic 43foot cruiser featuring
electric Auxiliary motor
is to be 380k. The 45ft Charlie Walsh Barge designed by Wolstenholme is
280k. All 3 offer
exceptional comfort and convenience.
I think the demise of his factory is a loss to the watercraft scene in
general.
Jeff Gilbert
----- Original Message -----
From: Donald Hodges <dhodges@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2000 9:51 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re:Walker (was Bede)
It was (may still be?) a trimaran with a variable-camber rigid wing sail
which was computer-trimmed and feathered (couldn't be reefed or lowered),
about 48-50 feet long, priced at megabucks. Walker developed and hyped the
thing for years, had a back-cover full page ad in "Multihulls" for years,
and burned several million pounds of UK industrial-incentive cash. I think
he delivered three. I saw the demo at the Miami Boat Show several years ago
after it made a trans-Atlantic crossing to the USA. It was not a fraud,
but it also wasn't a design which could compete in the market sans the
subsidy. Walker was very defensive and litigious about adverse comments,
won a libel judgement in the UK against a magazine (for saying essentially
what I said here - libel is a different concept in the UK).
Don Hodges
----- Original Message -----
From: <freedem@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 10:39 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Jim Bede
> Don
> What was the walker wingsail?
> thanks
> Jeffery
>
> --- Inbolger@egroups.com, "Donald Hodges" <dhodges@w...> wrote:
> > DeLorean was a hustler taking advantage of manufacturing incentives
> in
> > Ireland, sorta like the Walker Wingsail ...
> >
> > Don Hodges
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing
> - stay on topic
> - use punctuation
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - add some content: send "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
>
Bolger rules!!!
- no cursing
- stay on topic
- use punctuation
- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
- add some content: send "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
It was (may still be?) a trimaran with a variable-camber rigid wing sail
which was computer-trimmed and feathered (couldn't be reefed or lowered),
about 48-50 feet long, priced at megabucks. Walker developed and hyped the
thing for years, had a back-cover full page ad in "Multihulls" for years,
and burned several million pounds of UK industrial-incentive cash. I think
he delivered three. I saw the demo at the Miami Boat Show several years ago
after it made a trans-Atlantic crossing to the USA. It was not a fraud,
but it also wasn't a design which could compete in the market sans the
subsidy. Walker was very defensive and litigious about adverse comments,
won a libel judgement in the UK against a magazine (for saying essentially
what I said here - libel is a different concept in the UK).
Don Hodges
which was computer-trimmed and feathered (couldn't be reefed or lowered),
about 48-50 feet long, priced at megabucks. Walker developed and hyped the
thing for years, had a back-cover full page ad in "Multihulls" for years,
and burned several million pounds of UK industrial-incentive cash. I think
he delivered three. I saw the demo at the Miami Boat Show several years ago
after it made a trans-Atlantic crossing to the USA. It was not a fraud,
but it also wasn't a design which could compete in the market sans the
subsidy. Walker was very defensive and litigious about adverse comments,
won a libel judgement in the UK against a magazine (for saying essentially
what I said here - libel is a different concept in the UK).
Don Hodges
----- Original Message -----
From: <freedem@...>
To: <bolger@egroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 10:39 PM
Subject: [bolger] Re: Jim Bede
> Don
> What was the walker wingsail?
> thanks
> Jeffery
>
> --- Inbolger@egroups.com, "Donald Hodges" <dhodges@w...> wrote:
> > DeLorean was a hustler taking advantage of manufacturing incentives
> in
> > Ireland, sorta like the Walker Wingsail ...
> >
> > Don Hodges
>
>
>
>
> Bolger rules!!!
> - no cursing
> - stay on topic
> - use punctuation
> - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
> - add some content: send "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
>